This page has been archived and commenting is disabled.

Latest Fukushima Headlines

Tyler Durden's picture




 

The latest in the tragic story that just gets weirder by the minute.

  • TEPCO's mishandling of info on nuclear crisis 'unacceptable': Edano
  • Partial meltdown of fuel rods believed to be temporary: Edano
  • Radioactive water from No. 2 reactor due to partial meltdown: Edano
  • Contaminated water due to condensed steam, not reactor crack: Edano

And our personal favorite:

  • Locals within 20-km evacuation zone asked not to return for now

As this whole farce has gone beyond the surreal, we are now actively waiting for a cartoon Mr. Burns to show up at any ongoing press conference and announce that Springfield Nuclear Power Plant has LBOed Fukushima with Discount Window financing, at a #Ref! EV/EBITDA considering 9501.JP will not see any positive cash flow for millennia, and is appointing Mr. Sparkle (aka Homer Simpson) chief safety inspector.

Source: Kyodo

 

- advertisements -

Comment viewing options

Select your preferred way to display the comments and click "Save settings" to activate your changes.
Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:12 | 1107395 Rhone_Ranger
Rhone_Ranger's picture

Even Homer wouldn't touch this....Who's next?

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:32 | 1107462 Ras Bongo
Mon, 03/28/2011 - 08:00 | 1108070 Chumbadumba
Chumbadumba's picture

Fuck you, commie!!

LOLOL!!

I AM CHUMBADUMBA!

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:56 | 1107524 homersimpson
homersimpson's picture

I get an unlimited supply of donuts and Duff Beer if I work overtime at the nuclear plant?!?! COUNT ME IN!!!

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 00:32 | 1107599 Pool Shark
Pool Shark's picture

 

Way to go "fishbulb"

 

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 00:36 | 1107609 Mr. Mandelbrot
Mr. Mandelbrot's picture

"Kar?shi (????), which can be translated literally from Japanese as "death from overwork", is occupational sudden death."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kar?shi

Chernobyl - 650,000 "Liquidators" needed to clean it up

Fukushima/Onagawa - Only 50 "Karoshis" needed to clean it up?!


Mon, 03/28/2011 - 00:40 | 1107617 Mr. Mandelbrot
Mr. Mandelbrot's picture

The "?" in the word should be an "o."  What a fitting name for the unfortunate heroes so bravely (blindly?) working to subdue the mighty subatomic particles . . .

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 06:44 | 1107958 ColonelCooper
ColonelCooper's picture

Because Fukushima is only .00000762% as bad of a disaster when compared to Chernobyl. 

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 09:00 | 1108237 SteveOoooo
SteveOoooo's picture

Cite your sources.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 09:18 | 1108276 ColonelCooper
ColonelCooper's picture

Apologies.  I would have thought the ridiculousness of the number achieved when figuring the number of plant workers as a proportion would have made it unnecessary to use this: </sarcasm>

 

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 09:52 | 1108384 SteveOoooo
SteveOoooo's picture

I forgot the little winky thingy... ;-)

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 12:22 | 1109014 glenlloyd
glenlloyd's picture

Chernobyl reactor was running when the explosion(s) occurred, which is worse than the incident in Japan. How much worse it is will have to wait until this is over.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 01:13 | 1107678 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

URGENT: Radioactive water at No. 2 reactor due to partial meltdown: Edano

TOKYO, March 28, Kyodo
The government believes highly radioactive water detected at the No. 2 reactor of the Fukushima Daiichi nuclear power plant is due to a partial meltdown of fuel rods there, its top spokesman said Monday.

http://english.kyodonews.jp/news/2011/03/81431.html

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 02:15 | 1107764 trav7777
trav7777's picture

is there like anybody left around here who didn't already know as of at least a week ago that we had melted fuel rods?

And if discharge water has zirconium in it, that's as good a fingerprint as you're gonna get

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 02:41 | 1107790 Yen Cross
Yen Cross's picture

I'm cunfused? The guy with bullet holes was my friend?  Can I count on you?

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 08:20 | 1108116 Judge Judy Scheinlok
Judge Judy Scheinlok's picture

I think you meant; "I'm cuntfuzed?", right Alice?

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 04:04 | 1107872 Hoezit
Hoezit's picture

Is there a quick chemical test to check for zirconium or zirconium dioxide?

 By the way I still find your zap sign offensive every time I look at it, I guess that is part of its intention.

 

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 06:46 | 1107961 ColonelCooper
ColonelCooper's picture

If that actually offends you, you must be a real treat at parties.

Junked for being hypersensitive to life.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 08:55 | 1108225 SteveOoooo
SteveOoooo's picture

Junked for excessive junking.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 09:41 | 1108354 ColonelCooper
ColonelCooper's picture

By the way, New Guy: I didn't junk you. 

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 10:27 | 1108476 malikai
malikai's picture

No, but I just did.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 05:11 | 1107906 MSimon
MSimon's picture

I131 is even better. And I134? Well let us just say:

Tokyo we have a problem.

 

http://powerandcontrol.blogspot.com/2011/03/worst-case-scenario.html

 

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 05:38 | 1107922 Chumbadumba
Chumbadumba's picture

Trav trav, you racist piece of shit, shouldn't you be worried about debunking any claims that anything whatsoever is out of the ordinary near the reactor, or are you flip-flopping again (as is your racial genetic heritage)???

LOLOLOLOL!!

I AM CHUMBADUMBA!!

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 08:48 | 1108184 Matt
Matt's picture

Is there any risk of the control rods melting or otherwise failing to work anymore? What kind of temperatures can they hold up to?

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 03:07 | 1107812 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

Partial meltdown of fuel rods believed to be temporary: Edano

WTF??  Are the fuel rods gonna somehow UNMELT themselves??  Quick, thread the film backwards thru the projector!

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 04:21 | 1107877 TerraHertz
TerraHertz's picture

Probably they meant their admission the rods are partially melted is believed to be temporary.

So next week they will either deny the rods melted at all, or admit they are not partially melted, but are in fact totally melted.

 

It's hard to parody insane liars. There's no way to beat them at their game.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 10:10 | 1108426 Urban Roman
Urban Roman's picture

Sure it's temporary. Everything is temporary, the fuel rods will be in some other state later on.

Such as a gas. Or perhaps another sort of solid.

Or, in a Japanese science fiction film, they just might reassemble themselves and get back into zirconium tubes, which reconstitute themselves from the smoke they made when they burned up last week.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 11:41 | 1108829 Crumbles
Crumbles's picture

Or perhaps another sort of solid.

AEROSOL - a colloidal suspension of a solid in air.   As in capable of flying around the planet for a looong time - if a lot of the melted fuel rods should become a glob of mercury-like fissile atoms at 2,000 degrees C, what's to prevent explosive atomization turning tons of fuel rods into an aerosol ??

We're maybe so - catastrophic word of your choice - is this TEOTWAWKI ?????????

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 04:50 | 1107896 Arch Duke Ferdinand
Arch Duke Ferdinand's picture

SO WHERE IN THE WORLD IS IT SAFE?

tia

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 05:30 | 1107917 Popo
Popo's picture

Wall Street

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 06:02 | 1107941 msamour
msamour's picture

I would say New York near ground zero. They won't attack there twice in 10 years. /sarc off

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:14 | 1107399 steveo
steveo's picture

Fukushima story is a great time to bust out the "Ellipse of Doom"

Long Term S&P "Egg" aka Ellipse of Doom
This submitted by a reader.   Wow.
The incredible Egg.

http://oahutrading.blogspot.com/2011/03/long-term-s-egg-aka-ellipse-of-d...

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:25 | 1107442 Goldtoothchimp09
Goldtoothchimp09's picture

Hello fellow waver!  Yes, it is absolutely fascinating to watch social moods play out in realtime in one of the most fascinating times in history!  I am continually shocked by the complacency shown by my fellow humans - huge understatement!!

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 04:59 | 1107902 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

troll alert! keep yer eyes on this gold chimp!

"fascinated by social moods playing in realtime and shocked (!) by other's complacency"!

if he doesn't get to something Real on his next post, hospitalize him!

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 06:47 | 1107962 ColonelCooper
ColonelCooper's picture

Exclamation point much?

Junked for over enthusiasm.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 08:51 | 1108197 Urban Roman
Urban Roman's picture

Temporarily junked for being attitude police.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 09:20 | 1108284 ColonelCooper
ColonelCooper's picture

Good lord, we all seem to have woken up on the wrong side of the bed and donned our "literal" caps this morning.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 19:42 | 1110721 Urban Roman
Urban Roman's picture

It was because I woke up puking radioactive water this morning.

It's possibly partially temporary.

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:13 | 1107400 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

I am amazed at the overall incompetence of how TEPCO and the .gov of Japan are mishandling this.  Although they have had a sloppy safety record, mostly minor in the past.

Poor Japan, may God be with them their hour of need.

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:21 | 1107414 TheGreatPonzi
TheGreatPonzi's picture

 

Why be amazed? 

A new Chernobyl would mean the evacuation of nearly a third of Japan, and thus a systemic financial shock which would bring down the whole ultra-leveraged Ponzi. 

The important thing for the Japanese government is to be able to continue to refinance itself at low rates, not that some peasants may suffer from radiation poisoning. 

The Fukushima disaster will continue to be played down, and we'll learn the truth 10 years later. Wash, rinse, repeat.

 

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:36 | 1107481 Cistercian
Cistercian's picture

 Not to be outdone by the liars in Japan, EPA's RADNET used to have click-able count/radiation data.Now, instead of any data they simply say that the radiation is thousands of times lower than any conservative cause for concern.

  So, they scrubbed the data and substituted a reassuring statement.

 THE FUCKING BASTARDS!!!!Thanks for your tender concern .gov.

 This is ominous...and worthy of it's own story Tyler.

  When they are trying to be reassuring is when blind panic is more helpful....

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:51 | 1107513 TaxSlave
TaxSlave's picture

EPA are global warmers.  Data will be chosen to fit the model, or obscured.

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:54 | 1107521 majia
majia's picture

I called the regional EPA office in San Francisco on Friday to complain about the change in the webpage I had book-marked. I was very frustrated also. The regional official was upset too, as he hadn't been appraised and he promised to convey concerns.

Magically the original page is up again

https://cdxnode64.epa.gov/radnet-public/monitorView.do

I don't know whether it will again disappear or not. The EPA official recommended checking with any local or state public health (not federal) agencies for reliable data.

I'm still monitoring the Enviro-Reporter's data in LA, since I'm in AZ

http://www.enviroreporter.com/2011/03/enviroreporter-coms-radiation-station/

However, the EPA data have shown more fluctuations--especially in beta counts--than the Enviro-Reporter's monitor.

My concern is really that radiation would get into the fresh produce in CA and AZ. I have no idea how valid that concern is but the film The Battle for Chernobyl and the current estimates of radiation releases from Fukushima make me worried...

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 00:08 | 1107553 damage
damage's picture

No offense... but are you an idiot?

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 00:44 | 1107630 tmosley
tmosley's picture

No offense, but shut the fuck up.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 02:15 | 1107767 trav7777
trav7777's picture

you shut the fuck up.

Let the experts talk.  That means "not you."

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 06:26 | 1107949 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

Elitism is good, especially when the experts have proven their unproficiency.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 07:07 | 1107976 snowball777
snowball777's picture

Egalitarianism is good, especially when the non-experts have proven they haven't a clue what they're talking about.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 08:59 | 1108232 Bicycle Repairman
Bicycle Repairman's picture

Ah yes.  No one should speak except the experts.  From now on I am going to begin my posts with: 'I am a nuclear power worker' or 'I am a Naval nuke'.  Then you should all read glassy-eyed while I spew out pro-nuke trivia or propaganda.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 05:31 | 1107915 geekgrrl
geekgrrl's picture

Majia expresses what seems to me to be legitimate concerns. I am concerned as well.

Ad hominem attacks don't exactly constitute a counter-argument, so what is your point? That radiation is good for us? I see radioactive shills making that point on blog comments related to the Fukushima nuclear disaster on many diffent sites, and it is clear that the nuclear industry has recognized the real threat to it's continued existence, and has pulled-out all the stops to sway public opinion, here and many other places.

Get this: You are done.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 12:29 | 1109038 RichardP
RichardP's picture

Done how?  We haven't built any new nuke plants in a long time.  Done, as in, they will close the existing plants?

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 07:06 | 1107975 snowball777
snowball777's picture

https://cdxnode64.epa.gov/radnet-public/showMap.do

Fixed Monitor Location: CA: SAN FRANCISCO
Measurement Start Date/Time: 03/28/2011 09:11:51 AM
Measurement End Date/Time: 03/28/2011 10:11:59 AM
Beta Gross Count Rate (CPM): 16
Gamma Energy Range 2 Gross(CPM): 1922
Gamma Energy Range 3 Gross(CPM): 1243
Gamma Energy Range 4 Gross(CPM): 379
Gamma Energy Range 5 Gross(CPM): 201
Gamma Energy Range 6 Gross(CPM): 133
Gamma Energy Range 7 Gross(CPM): 157
Gamma Energy Range 8 Gross(CPM): 98
Gamma Energy Range 9 Gross(CPM): 28
Gamma Energy Range 10 Gross(CPM): 37

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:56 | 1107530 CD
CD's picture

Yup, see my comment on a previous thread.

The interactive map supposedly showing the radiation meters at various US facilities functions, but I have NOT been able to pull up reading graphs from ANY of the monitoring stations. With any browser. All I see is the heartwarmingly reassuring statement:

"To-date, levels recorded at this monitor have been thousands of times below any conservative level of concern."

That's really great - but then why not show the readings from the past few weeks, so we can all see if and how they have changed. Anyone have any luck acquiring this data from here or another source? I recognize that dangerous or even alarming levels of radiation in any form are unlikely to materialize Stateside soon, but it would be nice to see the numbers - if only to infer the rate of change at the origin.

 

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 00:04 | 1107543 TaxSlave
TaxSlave's picture

... I have NOT been able to pull up reading graphs from ANY of the monitoring stations.

Same mindset as TEPCO/Japanese gov't.

In the absence of believable, non-fudged data, the only reasonable speculation is that the contamination is a lot worse than they want you to believe.

Same as TEPCO.  They've 'accidentally' been telegraphing the real situation all along.  Core melts, breached containment. 

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 00:48 | 1107634 Milton Waddams
Milton Waddams's picture

They've 'accidentally' been telegraphing the real situation all along. Core melts, breached containment.

I think it is more "Darwinian" than accidental. Those with the intelligence / means to do so read between the lines and GTFO, or at least remove themselves from any imminent danger, those that do not are compelled, with propaganda encouragement, to carry on as usual.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 01:54 | 1107735 TaxSlave
TaxSlave's picture

I think it is more "Darwinian" than accidental.

Heh.  I actually typed in that same thought using the exact term, then deleted it before posting.

As always, the Authorities speak in code.  They aren't as stupid as they appear to be.  That would be impossible.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 05:52 | 1107933 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture


good for you, tax slave! we know you wouldn't want to be as "stupid" as  "authorities" who aren't really styooopid, because they "speak in code".

they are NOT "speaking in code", asswipe, they are fuking LYING about the life-threatening ENORMITY of the amount and kinds of radiation being released into the ocean, the winds, and the now-doomed nation of Japan.  as one lie after another get totally and near-instantly debunked, they rely on trolls like you to re-establish some modicum of credulity for them.

you got yer chance to show yer ass,  "Tax Slave"!  now get it the fuk outa here, and don't come back while i'm around, you moronic douchebag!

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 08:54 | 1108220 TaxSlave
TaxSlave's picture

Don't blame me if you didn't hear "Iodine", "Zirconium", "Hydrogen", "Cesium", and "neutron beam" in among the disinfo.  Blowhard.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 00:10 | 1107555 Cistercian
Cistercian's picture

 Whenever access to public information is withheld, it is a bad sign.They don't want people to know how bad it is or what is really going on.I saw elevated beta here in Asheville,NC on Saturday the 19th.Nothing like it since then.

  +on you for noticing too.I have a simple counter, boy I wish I had more elaborate equipment now...that way I could check the Gamma and Beta energy levels and actually know what materials are involved.Like Iodine 131...I could do something about that.The Cesium and Strontium....not so much.I don't even want to think about Plutonium in the plume...too depressing.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 00:17 | 1107581 CD
CD's picture

EDIT: The graphs are back up on the RadNet site.

The Beta counts are presented on a graph with data between 0-100 CPM (for most sites depending on location of sensor, Nevada seems to get a lot more 'background' radiation - but so does Washington), and graph max. of 1000. Nothing significant visible (to me) in terms of correlation to events on the ground at Dai-ichi, though I note Hawaii data seems to be missing (or just 0 throughout the past month). Gamma counts are presented on logarithmic scale, making it difficult to infer the magnitude of changes (if any).

Data is missing for weeks on many of the inland monitoring sites, and some (like Montana & Utah) say:

"This Radnet monitor is either updating data or experiencing technical difficulties. We are aware of the error, and will post the most up-to-date information as soon as it is available."

 

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 00:28 | 1107594 Cistercian
Cistercian's picture

 They still won't come up for me.It was nicer before they changed the site.And before they changed it, the comedy was how many stations were not online.They were down for maintenance or "calibration".

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 00:35 | 1107606 CD
CD's picture

[Sigh] And you are STILL expecting relevant/timely/accurate information from the government on issues of importance? I had you pegged as somewhat more cynical... ;-]

Nevertheless, try this one:

http://www.epa.gov/radiation/rert/radnet-data-map.html

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 00:41 | 1107614 Cistercian
Cistercian's picture

 Yes, I am more cynical.The numbers now are probably computer generated based on old data...hee hee.

  I trust the .gov as far as I can throw an M1 Abrams tank...IE: not at all!

 Thanks for the link.

 And no, none of the charts show up!I have angered the Agents of the matrix.The fact I have a decent Geiger counter was probably enough.Being a ZH regular just assures bad results!!!!

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 00:56 | 1107653 CD
CD's picture

This quote seems to sum it up quite well:

Regrettably, we don't have a concrete schedule at the moment to enable us to say in how many months or years (the crisis will be over)," TEPCO vice-president Sakae Muto said in the latest of round-the-clock briefings the company holds.

[Emphasis mine]

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/03/28/japan-idUSL3E7ES03620110328?pageNumber=2

 

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 00:59 | 1107660 Cistercian
Cistercian's picture

 Regrettably,yes, my friend.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 05:05 | 1107904 Yes We Can. But...
Yes We Can. But Lets Not.'s picture

a 'concrete' schedule...heh...good to see they are planning ahead, for a change.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 08:18 | 1108105 surfsup
surfsup's picture

"This Radnet monitor is either updating data or experiencing technical difficulties. We are aware of the error, and will post the most up-to-date information as soon as it is available."

And when equities drop 200 the same thing happens with the feeds... hmmm...

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 08:31 | 1108139 Judge Judy Scheinlok
Judge Judy Scheinlok's picture

Please do not lift the blindfold off the sheeple.

Let them be, their bliss needs nourishment.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 00:14 | 1107568 JLee2027
JLee2027's picture

A new Chernobyl

I don't think that can be hidden. The Soviets failed with Chernobyl to hide it. Radiation detectors in other countries are a bitch

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 05:11 | 1107905 geekgrrl
geekgrrl's picture

+1 Sv/hr

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 07:44 | 1108028 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

thus a systemic financial shock which would bring down the whole ultra-leveraged Ponzi. 

 

Or not. If a part of Japan goes offline and that the news on global growth are reported as good, just as a continuity of what is going on, it could tear the veil of illusion on economics.

A too big pill to swallow for most.

 

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 00:38 | 1107611 Popo
Popo's picture

Denial is the first stage of dying.

Acceptance is the last.

 

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 02:43 | 1107792 Yen Cross
Yen Cross's picture

You HURT. We all die my friend. I Feel for you.

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:15 | 1107403 Yen Cross
Yen Cross's picture

Thanks.

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:18 | 1107409 Rusty Shorts
Rusty Shorts's picture

 - you still in Burma?

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:29 | 1107438 Yen Cross
Yen Cross's picture

Hong Kong from Majulah. Hope you had a good weekend.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 01:28 | 1107671 i-dog
i-dog's picture

Are you still flight-simming around Asia? You'll get joystick fatigue!

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 03:16 | 1107820 Yen Cross
Yen Cross's picture

Yep Snoopy. Can Lucy blow my thoughts?

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:31 | 1107408 PhattyBuoy
PhattyBuoy's picture

Regarding Sv measurement

They managed to divulge a 0.3 Sv in the turbine facility - a separate building! Nice ... "calculated obfuscation" ...

I want to know the reading in near to the torus, or pump room/s near core.

Not the values in another building !

The people have been working in the pump room this week running power ... so why can they not get a reading right there?

Its pretty obvious they are withholding data.

 

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:48 | 1107506 steve from virginia
steve from virginia's picture

 

The staff probably cannot approach the torus areas in any of the reactors. Too hot.

I suspect all three reactors have already melted down more or less completely.

It seems the reactors are critical which means the control rods have no effect on the chain reactions. Fuel is 'blobs' in undisclosed locations.

four down, fifty more reactors to go ...

 

sad, really, Japan was a nice country before the industrialists fucked it up.

 

 

 

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:56 | 1107523 tmosley
tmosley's picture

It was NOT the industrialists!  The blame for this rests solely on the Japanese government, who overregulated to the point that they were forced to rely on this ancient, shitty design.  Japan SHOULD be using pebble bed reactors in all of its cities, and have breeder reactors in the most remote areas available.

Light water reactors are literally the most primitive reactor design on the face of the earth.  They work well for the ships and subs they were designed for, but not when parked on the surface where pumps must be used to cool them.

Hell, the floors could have been retrofitted with tungsten to put to rest any possibility of disastrous meltdown, or had that shit in the reactor itself.

Like I have said on many occasions, blaming nuclear power in general for this accident is like blaming the automobile industry for unsafe cars in Cuba.  OF COURSE THEY ARE UNSAFE, they are 50+ years old!  

Sigh.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 00:06 | 1107548 TaxSlave
TaxSlave's picture

And so far what they've been able to accomplish is like trying to put out an engine fire by spraying a garden hose on the hood.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 00:45 | 1107625 serotonindumptruck
serotonindumptruck's picture

The best way to extinguish a class B (petroleum-based) fire is with a heavy detergent-laden agent. In other words, grab a bottle of dishwashing detergent and work up a good lather in a contained water source, and then spray/pour it over the fire.

Good luck. This method doesn't always work as intended.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 03:44 | 1107854 MSimon
MSimon's picture

I helped put out a Class B fire with just water and a spray nozzle.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 00:33 | 1107602 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

tmos, actually Americann (corps and gov) have an iron-fist control on Japan since WWII, the blame lies with them. Even the famed Japanese Manufacturing methods (especially quality control) were taught to them by Demings (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/W._Edwards_Deming), it's not something they caem up with on their own.

Everyone has to acknnowledge that japan has been nothign more than a thinly disguised American Protectorate. Nothing. Even their culture reeks of American Culturalism. They were taken down, plain and simple.

ORI

http://aadivaahan.wordpress.com

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 09:49 | 1108378 rwe2late
rwe2late's picture

agreed

The Japanese have been supporting the dollar and US consumerism for some time.

And being riddled with US military bases is no longer enough.

Of late, the US has been pressuring Japan to dump its Constitution, officially approve the stationing of nuclear weapons, rearm for offensive warfare, and join in the US-led global policing by establishing Japanese overseas military bases (first one in Africa).

http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=18869

 

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 12:58 | 1109183 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Interesting rwe2. And thanks for the link. Very interesting.

ORI

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 00:32 | 1107603 Jim in MN
Jim in MN's picture

Just for the record: This meme is not true.

Corporate culture leads to safety issues 99% of the time.  Many nuclear operators have shitty, shitty attitudes, as exemplified by the smug superiority of many posts on these boards.  Engineers are myopic by inclination and training, so much so that most don't even know the issues that ultimately lead the 'perfect designs' to catastrophe.  Mainly greed, laziness and complacency/stupidity.

It Can't Happen Here is the most dangerous phrase in the nuclear industry.  It's The Regulators' Fault is a very close second. 

Companies that claim absolute safety should simply be banned from this industry.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 00:52 | 1107641 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Just for the record, there is a difference between "industrialists", who are heroic individuals that bring you everything that you have, and "corporations" which are sociopathic organizations created and maintained by the government.

I'm not sure I would caste aspersions at an entire type of professional.  Any engineer will tell you that moving parts are points for failure.  The more moving parts, the more likely something will go wrong.  Pebble bed reactors are so safe precisely because they require no moving parts (ie cooling systems/control rod insertion) to keep from melting down.  This is like running a slow cooker in a concrete room vs having a bonfire in your living room while spraying the walls and roof with water to stop them from catching fire.

Yes, a perfect design IS possible.  It is achieved not when there is nothing left to add, but when there is nothing left to take away.  That process was frozen by regulation, and we got stuck with a highly polished turd.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 02:01 | 1107745 TaxSlave
TaxSlave's picture

Well said.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 06:09 | 1107943 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

 

just for the record, "tmosley" and "Tax Slave" are BOTH moronic shitforbrained asswipes.  just lQQk at this drivel!  you guys go back to wherever you learned this bullshit and just tell them it wouldn't pass muster, here, ok?

being "innocuously deflective of every single bit of real understanding" is not new here.  you are either retarded or seriously mentally ill.  take yer fuking pick, and GET LOST!

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 02:23 | 1107773 trav7777
trav7777's picture

Might wanna read up on the AVR accident.

Nothing is totally safe.  PBMR have their own failure modes.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 03:21 | 1107827 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

So, I'll put you down as "NOT a fan of Govt efficiency", then.  :>D

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 07:14 | 1107981 snowball777
snowball777's picture

Pebble bed reactors are so safe precisely because they require no moving parts

It was the moving parts you called out here that actually worked, in this disaster.

Do tectonic plates count as "moving parts"? Why wouldn't they affect a PB too?

Yes, a perfect design IS possible.

EPIC FAIL in comprehension.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 02:44 | 1107793 Pondmaster
Pondmaster's picture

"Many nuclear operators have shitty, shitty attitudes, as exemplified by the smug superiority of many posts on these boards. "

 

As we say in the coal fired plants " No Nukes" . The smug arrogance of nuclear operators is an affront to those of normal intelligence . 

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 04:29 | 1107884 malikai
malikai's picture

Meanwhile the coal plants fill up the skies with thorium, uranium, and radium.

"No nukes"

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 07:00 | 1107973 ColonelCooper
ColonelCooper's picture

To each their own. [paycheck]

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 03:49 | 1107860 MSimon
MSimon's picture

Engineers are myopic by inclination and training, so much so that most don't even know the issues that ultimately lead the 'perfect designs' to catastrophe.

 

You have never worked in aerospace my friend. If things were as dire as you paint them you would never step on an airplane. Or take an elevator in a high rise.

 

And may I add you know NOTHING about the training of engineers.

 

Physicists dream of Nobel prizes, engineers dream of mishaps.” Hendrik Tennekes

 

Well the good ones anyway.

 

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 06:31 | 1107953 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

Catastrophes have an exceptional dimension.

They are a distinct break from common days routine.

An air catastrophe can only be exceptional, not the normality.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 07:12 | 1107980 ColonelCooper
ColonelCooper's picture

"Engineers are myopic by inclination and training, so much so that most don't even know the issues that ultimately lead the 'perfect designs' to catastrophe."

I will say this:  As someone whose job is building things and completing projects designed and overseen by engineers, it would benefit the world immensely if some actual hands on experience were a prerequisite.

Engineers by nature seem to collectively think that ten gallons of shit will fit into a five gallon pail.  They also seem to enjoy conference calls where you have to explain to them OVER and OVER again that you now have five gallons of shit laying on the ground. 

Then they will try to tell you that it's your fault because you couldn't keep your shit in a pile.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 09:10 | 1108263 Bicycle Repairman
Bicycle Repairman's picture

Well worth repeating:

"Corporate culture leads to safety issues 99% of the time.  Many nuclear operators have shitty, shitty attitudes, as exemplified by the smug superiority of many posts on these boards.  Engineers are myopic by inclination and training, so much so that most don't even know the issues that ultimately lead the 'perfect designs' to catastrophe.  Mainly greed, laziness and complacency/stupidity."

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 02:20 | 1107771 trav7777
trav7777's picture

quick question:  if I leave who the hell are you going to have to parrot shit from?

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 03:38 | 1107849 MSimon
MSimon's picture

It seems the reactors are critical

 

Yep.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 00:04 | 1107545 avonaltendorf
avonaltendorf's picture

@PhattyBouy

On the previous thread I promised I would look into the measurement question. What I found is that no one has entered #2 reactor basement/torus. Initial electrical work was done at an external transformer and main panel. When nothing worked, they decided to string cables to the main circulating pump located in the turbine hall. That's where they measured high radiation and bugged out.

plans to use regular power to restart the cooling system hit a roadblock when it turned out that cables had to be laid through turbine buildings flooded with the contaminated water.

"The problem is that right now nobody can reach the turbine houses where key electrical work must be done," Nishiyama said. "There is a possibility that we may have to give up on that plan."

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 00:23 | 1107588 Jim in MN
Jim in MN's picture

Operation Extension Cord RIP.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 09:14 | 1108266 Bicycle Repairman
Bicycle Repairman's picture

Operation Extension Cord mission accomplished.  It provided cover for a few news cycles.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 01:13 | 1107651 PhattyBuoy
PhattyBuoy's picture

avon - nice scoop.

"that no one has entered #2 reactor basement/torus"

So 2 weeks+ later, this location is so FUBAR that they cannot get near it ...

Someone please convince me that #2 is not completely melted into drywell / torus area.

They have measured near here I am sure, but it broke their gauges.

 

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 06:55 | 1107964 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

 

dude:  there are over 4,000 Tons of radioactive waste and fuel at this site, very nearly all of which contains some amount of freaking plutonium of some kind or another. 

i think we'll get the truth inductively from the info here: Plutonium in troubled reactors, spent fuel pools

and here: Plutonium Production - Nuclear Weapons

if you have other info that will stand scrutiny here, please advise and post it, ok?  if you don't, please read these two links for 5-10 minutes and try to digest the info.  then you will have "the big picture" and you will stop sweating "the small stuff" which is never-ending disinfo from Tepco & it's pols and allies, even when they appear to disagree with the fuking disinfo.  tyler is pretty much required to report this shit.  if you haven't yet come to understand why he is framing it as he is, while practically freaking, full-time, over it, please reconsider the "big picture" which will lead to sharing the understanding that that there is no individual "instance" of a "specific problem" that means fuking diddly squat compoared to the knowledge of the amount of radioactive materials at the site, the condition of the place, and the "apparent inability" of the japanese leadership to give it's people these facts, which may include the "news" that it is humanly impossible to do anything until "later".  at which point the people will be almost surely sicker than dogs. 

i know! slewie & tyler and a dozen others or more, here, are not competent "authorities" to understand the situ.  so just read the shit we are going with, see if it "makes sense" and think for yourself, if you can.

for example the "reason" there is 3000+++ TONS of waste there is b/c they have never removed ANY of it for over 40 years. why not?  b/c it woulda affected their "bottom line" negatively, AND virtually no one has questioned the safe and sane "operation" except a few who were deflected and ignored almost exactly like the guy who tried to tell the SEC about Bernie Madoff. 

this is CITY HALL, friend, and you don't fight it here, you don't fight it in japan, or anywhere else, really, b/c you can not win with a fair assessment and honest play in a crooked game. 

all i am asking of you is to peruse a coupla my "sources" and weigh them for yourself.  10 minutes. after that, you wanna go back to the fuking donut in #2 and fantasize about the fuking condition of the "guages", no one will be able to stand in your way, then, either.

all i am saying is that i sincerely believe and hope that if you take these 10 minutes, you will no longer react to every single piece of bullshit put out by Tepco, or US Sec. of Energy Chu, or ann coulter, either.  once you get the picture, here, the non-stop disinformation will no longer have any meaning for you, either. 

this isn't facebook OR yahoo, Phatty. 

try it.

see what happens ok?

t.y.  peace.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 00:11 | 1107546 avonaltendorf
avonaltendorf's picture

dup

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:19 | 1107415 foghorn longhorn
foghorn longhorn's picture

At what point does gross incompetence become Plan B?

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 02:45 | 1107795 TheMerryPrankster
TheMerryPrankster's picture

In Washington D.C., gross incompetence is Plan A, also plans B,C,D and E.

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:19 | 1107419 Plumplechook
Plumplechook's picture

New spike in radioactive iodine in seawater - 1,150 times legal limit near seawater outlets from reactors 5 and 6  - (aren't these the reactors in 'cold shutdown' that we are not supposed to be worried about anymore?).

http://www.straitstimes.com/BreakingNews/Asia/Story/STIStory_650201.html

 

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 00:09 | 1107562 knukles
knukles's picture

That's a lie. 
Barry said it'd never get here.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 03:25 | 1107832 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

Can't wait to hear Obamatron explain how US involvement in Libya is Bush's fault, on TV tonight.

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:18 | 1107423 jkruffin
jkruffin's picture

It's absolutely time to be long the dollar, a big move up is coming............a BIG move!!!!!!!!

Long USD/JPY

Short EUR/USD

Short SPY

These are the trades to be in as the big money tries to escape bit by bit from the risk.

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:28 | 1107454 Yen Cross
Yen Cross's picture

I like that eur/usd call!

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 00:55 | 1107642 Mr Lennon Hendrix
Mr Lennon Hendrix's picture

Dollar starting the week off...weak.  But I will admit, the news is in its favor with Ireland et al and Japan looking at unsustainable debt levels...at least until the debt ceiling is breached, or raised, if there is a difference between the two.

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:20 | 1107424 Wolf in the Wilds
Wolf in the Wilds's picture

Condensed steam!?!  Which planet does he think the people of Japan come from?  Tepco is clearly lying and the government is in cahoots to prevent the truth from leaking out, in the process putting ordinary Japanese citizens at risk.  None of what Tepco and Edano is saying matches the data collected from independent sources.  Something is wrong, and the situation is clearly more serious than what Tepco or the government are admitting.  Eventually the truth will come out but by then, a lot of Japanese will have suffered radiation poisoning.  God help them.

 

 

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 05:31 | 1107910 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

i thought the EPA site had been outsourced to Tepco!  6 sites with gamma data, 130 "fixed" but with no readings! our goobermint @ work!

this site Plutonium in troubled reactors, spent fuel pools

claims 3400 tons of spent fuel, all containing plutonium of some kind(s) or other, and 877 tons of fuel in the reactor cores, some, maybe all of which contains plutonium, at lower leves, except for #3 where they used fuel with plutonium in it before it went into the reactor!

when tyler sez: this whole farce has gone beyond the surreal, i gotta say that subtle editorial understatement is a heluva lot more welcome than the obvious "scientific" understatements of the dangers coming from japan, and literally hundereds, perhaps thousands of other "authoritative" venues, many of which send their trolls here, on a regular basis to get hospitalized.  leo kovalikis has his own piece up, tonight, after having his head ripped off and his neck shit down by yers truly and 2-3 others on this site, earlier. in fairness to leo, he was discussing the "genius of keynes" and he read a book or two about Lord JMK, too!  everything he said about his Lord Keynes fantasies and his personal "values" was ruthlessly and competently deconstructed and freaking demolished.  everything, to the best of my knowledge.  12 hours later, he's baaaack!  with this passive-aggressive "fun" challenge.

now he's goinw/ "Alright all you Zero Hedge bears, time to weigh in on my latest comment (sarcasm ON)..."  go fuk yerself leo, you archetypal shitforbrained moron of a FED whore, you are finished, here.

sincerely,

slewie the pi-rat

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:23 | 1107429 Heroic Couplet
Heroic Couplet's picture

We need to know Tepco's head count. We saw the picture of the "lens" and subsequent smoke 1. How many Tepco employers on the payroll, and their job titles, the day of. 2. How many in the building when the "lens" was produced? 3 How many now known cases of dead? amd dying of radiation exposure? 4. How many now alive and healthy? You can't have technology advanced to the point it's advanced and not be able to account for the Tepco employees day by day.Should be easy to quantify and take a nose count. Who can read license plate numbers? I think the US and Great Britain.

And yes, I know from first hand account that the premier Japanese tradition is "saving face."

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:40 | 1107489 Rusty Shorts
Rusty Shorts's picture

Where is the Fukushima tsunami footage?

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:24 | 1107436 Shameful
Shameful's picture

I believe them when they say the partial meltdown is temporary. They are just buttering us for the money shot, full meltdown. You can't just ram that news home, you have to ease it in, like a gentleman.

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:32 | 1107459 tmosley
tmosley's picture

The meltdown IS temporary.  It will melt up with everything else as soon as they get QE3 going!

No problem!

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:35 | 1107467 Mr. Mandelbrot
Mr. Mandelbrot's picture

+1 sievert/hr

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:38 | 1107483 knukles
knukles's picture

Like uh, partially pregnant, partially limbless, partially dead. 
Partial. 

Which part of partial do we all not understand?  The impartial part?.  The dangling of the participle part?  The part that departs, the departure?  The departure form reality?

God help us all, for we cannot even get close ourselves. 

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:27 | 1107450 DarthVaderMentor
DarthVaderMentor's picture

Meltdown can't be temporary. You're either melted down (maybe partially) or not. If it's partial, then how do they know? What parts aren't melted down? This has got to be a translation error or propaganda.

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:52 | 1107516 JohnnyCrash
JohnnyCrash's picture

Yeah but "partial" can be temporary...

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:34 | 1107456 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture
  • Partial meltdown of fuel rods believed to be temporary: Edano

 

So the core rods are like popsicles, that can be re-constituted in original form after melting down?

Who knew.

As to other events in Japan, the list of factories to be idled (and workers laid off, presumably) due to the Tri-Crisis in Japan is growing exponentionally.

Anyone who thinks that there is NOT a real risk that Japan's woes, with Japan being the 3rd largest economy and largest exporting economy in the world, won't potentially usher in global economic contraction this year, with much of the world being in extremely weak shape as is, please pass me the bowl.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 00:00 | 1107533 Mr. Mandelbrot
Mr. Mandelbrot's picture

Makes me go hmmmmmm . . .

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 00:08 | 1107561 PhattyBuoy
PhattyBuoy's picture

Triple-dip or is it Quadruple-dip?

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 00:32 | 1107598 Antarctico
Antarctico's picture

...please pass me the bowl.

Considering how much pot is grown in CA, I wonder how soon before the new glow-in-the-dark weed becomes available. 

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 02:47 | 1107796 Yen Cross
Yen Cross's picture

I own some anadarko.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 06:19 | 1107948 Golden monkey
Golden monkey's picture

Weed is an effective cancer cure, just like radiations.

I have a feeling I will get more of both soon, so I should be OK.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 02:30 | 1107780 Mentaliusanything
Mentaliusanything's picture

@Truth In Sunshine,

We have been collecting what information is available on "shortages"

Out side of food exports - not an insubstantial amount -Sony 9 of 25 plants Idles. Toyota Toshiba, panansonic.......... all have a HUGE problem. loss of supply estimated for Motor vehicle 600,000 units.

Smart phones, computers, carparts, tool makers, electrical, lighting, Hospital equipment and supplies(MRI cats, utla sound stainless rep parts) Tv's camcorders, memory chips....it just goes on and on

It has moved outside of Japan at an alarming rate and you will find its causing plant shut downs in The US and Germany and it will spread to other suppliers who CAN SUPPLY but are on stop order because one part brings the whole damn chain to a stop.

This will be known as the 4th Disaster and  tremors will hit home in no more than a month.

What is angering me is they are all reported as periferal news items lost in importance and no one has added up the combined effects on a JIT free trade industrial Giants.

Your the first one who has dared wisper of the coming destruction to World trade = employment and profits

Tyler hade better find a bit of this to chew on - Its tasty shit

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 02:38 | 1107785 CD
Mon, 03/28/2011 - 02:48 | 1107797 Mentaliusanything
Mentaliusanything's picture

Thanks CD just knew I should have taken foot out of mouth before posting

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 09:19 | 1108289 Bicycle Repairman
Bicycle Repairman's picture

"Partial meltdown of fuel rods believed to be temporary"

When going from normal to full meltdown, the system will enter a partial meltdown phase.  That phase is temporary.  Just remember where the system is headed.

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:30 | 1107458 High Plains Drifter
High Plains Drifter's picture

don't come back for now?  try , don't ever come back.........

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:30 | 1107460 Jim in MN
Jim in MN's picture

See, you grasp the molten fuel rod, see, and kind of just roll it between your palms, see, like so...all good. 

Now pay up.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 04:27 | 1107882 geekgrrl
geekgrrl's picture

Thanks for the comic relief. :-)

Nuclear proponents are clearly insane. Salespeople of the big lie. Yea, just roll it up between your palms... LOL!!!

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 04:38 | 1107889 malikai
malikai's picture

I see we have another volunteer for turning the lights, heat, and air conditioning off. Enjoy your summer.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 05:46 | 1107929 Miles Kendig
Miles Kendig's picture

That has already happened thanks to the nuc fucktards and their paid fo hos

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 07:25 | 1107989 snowball777
snowball777's picture

You're gonna want to leave that AC on...it'll give you a longer lead time when you go to collect the corpses before they start to putrify.

 

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 09:24 | 1108297 Bicycle Repairman
Bicycle Repairman's picture

Oh I see.  If we shut down nuclear power, it's back to the 19th century is it?

 

LOL.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 09:49 | 1108369 Jim in MN
Jim in MN's picture

They're just teakettles.  65%+ energy wasted.  Boiling water.

But I don't feel like having a big argument about it....

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:32 | 1107461 Kina
Kina's picture

I believe them when they say the partial meltdown is temporary. They are just buttering us for the money shot, full meltdown. You can't just ram that news home, you have to ease it in, like a gentleman.

 

Yes of course the partial meltdown is only temporary on the path to a full meltdown. So they could be telling the truth in a peverse sort of way.

 

So I assume they are planning how to bury this turd in the sand pit and walk away whistling.

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:39 | 1107484 Mr. Mandelbrot
Mr. Mandelbrot's picture

This is their modus operandi.  Instead of clearly informing the public that fission reactions have restarted, they tell us that they have detected 13 instances of neutron beams . . .

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:43 | 1107494 knukles
knukles's picture

And told the children to pray so as to forestal panic.
Really.
They did. 

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:55 | 1107520 TaxSlave
TaxSlave's picture

They released a cartoon teaching the kids it's all about pooping diapers.

Do NOT follow this link or you will be banned from the site!