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Mike Krieger's Latest Interview With Max Keiser
Just because it is appropriate that the two guys who came up with the "Crash JPM, Buy Silver" meme should get some exposure tonight. In this edition of Press TV's On the Edge with Max Keiser, Max, as
usual, highlights the bad conditions the US economy is in. He says the
fall of the dollar is imminent and ties the latest events in the Middle
East to the US economic policies. His guest, Zero Hedge regular Michael Krieger, believes
that the unrest will spill over to the US as the world economy is
"co-centric." He further elaborates on the competition between the US
and the giant China which is taking over the rest of the world and is
expected to turn the next superpower. Enjoy the show.
Part 1:
Part 2:
Part 3:
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Fuck off! And I mean that in the most sincere way, asshat.
My comment still stands, China has been around for a LONG time. FACT.
Correction: China has far MORE people to deal with expectations.
"China has been around for a LONG time."
So has most of the Earth, all of it, in fact. While I disagree with his tone, are you intentionally missing his point that China has not been politically stable for any extended period in the last 100+ years?
Before you respond, consider that the Cultural Revolution was a major effort to solidify direct control by Mao ... and that it failed in its goal to impose a common midset across a myriad of ethnic groups and cultures. Even the incorporation of "capitalism" has caused as many problems as it has solved.
If you see China as homogeneous and harmonious, then more people available to deal with expectations might help. Since it isn't, and people have proved themselves willing to die rather than starve, how does having more people help in terms of dealing with expectations?
barliman
'(the Iraq war was fought for the same strategic goal - deny China influence over the Middle East by establishing a democracy).'
Yes, and isn't that working out well?
To be honest I don't think that the US expected to 'establish a democracy' in Iraq.
I do believe that we are in Iraq to prevent China from replacing the US Military as the protector of the major OPEC oil producers... After all, this guaranteed military protection by Eisenhower was the reason that the major oil producers agreed to accept only dollars for their oil.
"the Iraq war was fought for the same strategic goal - deny China influence over the Middle East by establishing a democracy"
I'd also like to comment on this...
The war was fought to keep control over oil and oil pipeline routes. The "democracy" bit was just a marketing campaign.
Putin has tremendous support in Russia, nothing will move him.
As for the paper tiger showing up at the border, I believe that was already staged in Georgia; even the neo-con warriors didn't feel like rubbing shoulders...so Ruskies are a no go.
Bernanke is trying hard to destabilize the Chinese with his monetary war but he could lose it very easily, Chinese nationalism will prevail over any attempt by the West.
I don't think anyone should bank on major political unrest in China, if it is a policy, it's suicidal.
The reference to Putin's sex life was sarcasm. He would use any revelations as part of his "badass motherfucker" image.
Georgia was kabuki theater. America was never going to do anything because Putin would announce that the major pipelines into Europe would be shut down until he got his way.
The Russian economy will not support an extended engagement with China. The Chinese goverment does not value "the lives of the people" as particularly precious. If they lost a million men in a conventional engagement with Russia, it would be beneficial to the male:female ratio problem they have, spur their "internal" consumption and possibly bring them more natural resources. Russia on the other hand has suffered from a diminishing population and a "mafia" economy. Russia loses a conventional war with China.
I have said in other posts I expect Bernanke to eventually be held in the same contempt as Hitler and Stalin. We have been engaged in economic warfare as our first choice option for 20+ years. Ben Bernanke is the Dr. Strangelove of our time. He has taken American fiscal policy down the "nuclear" warfare route because he believes we will have "acceptable losses" (i.e. dollar devaluation and eventual loss of sole reserve currency status).
Just as it was idiocy to believe a nuclear war can be contained, it is idiocy not to realize that tyrants with nuclear weapons will not be contained to only an economic battlefield.
barliman
"We have been engaged in economic warfare as our first choice option for 20+ years."
I think that it's been a LOT longer than that. Current round started with Bretton Woods II. I can't believe that anyone with an IQ over 10 could believe that an un-backed currency wouldn't turn out any way other than how it's now going. The rest of the world COULD dump the dollar and go with something that's backed, meaning, they can't really bitch if they continue to play in this (knowingly rigged) game.
'The Chinese goverment does not value "the lives of the people" as particularly precious.'
Human nature is the same in all cultures. An Asian individual fears death as much as an African individual or a European individual.
The fear of death will be reflected in how any regime conducts itself. No regime will commit to killing of it's own citizens without first carrying out a great deal of nationalistic reasoning...propaganda, iows.
Your line of debate seems to take for granted that wars are predictable. They seldom are. For instance, If Hitler had not abandoned Russia as an ally in WW2, and had Hitler not attacked Russia in the massive operation Barbarosa, and Russia had instead continued to fight on the side of the Axis Powers, WW2 might have continued much, much longer than it did. If you do not believe this I suggest you read Shirer's 'The Rise And Fall Of The Third Reich'.
'Russia loses a conventional war with China.'
Pure conjecture... Russia will not lose a conventional war with China because neither side would win. What ever side was losing the conventional conflict would almost certainly turn to nuclear weapons, rather than surrender.
'We have been engaged in economic warfare as our first choice option for 20+ years.'
Economic warfare never ends. Only military warfare is sporadic.
I agree that the course that Ben is on, probably not of his sole choosing, is insanity...but insanity is the norm in most of human affairs and through out human history. Is Ben any crazier than Hjalmar Schacht, Hitlers minister of finance? The US Banks that were helping to finance Nazi Germany, before and during WW2, learned a lot from Hjalmar.
I've read some of your responses to others so I'll carry this one more step in the hope you will start to reach beyond what is directly stated, not place your implications over the top of another person's statement and think about this place as not a blog or debate. This is not about how many posts you can make, it is about self realization.
I know, you think I am being arrogant.
Not my intention. So ...
I am not engaged in a line of debate. Wars are depressingly predictable. Study history and find me a "surprising" war. With regard to WWII and your if's - they didn't happen. Reach beyond Shirer's work and into the information he didn't have available then but you do now. No, I am not going to tell where to find the answers, if you go and find them for yourself, provided you leave preconceived ideas behind, you will learn more than just additional detail about the war.
Russia loses a conventional war with China. Not conjecture. I am inclined to invisibility so I am not going to run through how the scenarios play out and then debate them. My comments on what China gains from a conventional war gambit should be enough for you if you go and research the male:female ratio in China and its societal hazards; relative size and strength of the two economies; the ability of a good size war to serve as economic stimulus and suppress dissent - and then THINK sbout it rather than replying to me - China will not escalate rather than lose because they still win if the lose on "points" (i.e. lose the battles). Russia will not escalate because the second they launch an attack on China, the U.S. will respond with a major nuclear attack on them. We had these things on hair triggers for 40+ years and didn't use them because they are NOT containable. Russia loses a conventional war with the Chinese even if they win on "points" - because they do not have the logistics to effectively engage on a border of that distance away and their economy is "mafia" based - a "mafia" structure undermines an effective military.
Military warfare is not sporadic. Go find a period of worldwide peace over 50 years in length in the last 500.
Economic warfare became the "first choice option" post 1989. Prior to that the mindset was that diplomacy and containment would endure. After 1989, we effectively said, "Screw the diplomacy. They will do what we want or we will bankrupt them."
Insanity is counter survival. It has not been the norm and stating that it is no more valuable than peddling "Hope & Change".
Ok, all done. Go learn. Stop repeating things you agree with or that some history professor told you. Maybe read the book "Ender's Game". Oh, and spend less time posting on blogs and more time thinking things through.
barliman
Events generally possess the odd quality of becoming surprisingly easy to predict once they have happened.
Precisely what Taleb's 'Black Swan' pointed out but Barliman does not understand.
'The Rise And Fall Of The Third Reich' WAS WRITTEN by Shirer in real time. He was a reporter in Berlin and visited Moscow during the run up to WW2.
I would much rather read accounts written in real time than those of revisionist historians after the fact... another point lost on Barliman.
Notice that Barliman did not approach the subject of human nature again. He can not justify his comments regarding how the Chinese will willingly sacrafice their citizens without first stirring them up with nationalistic fervor... no regime would attempt to do so, including the US.
Taleb's "Black Swan" was not about war but unforeseen events (Lehman brothers, the 1918 Influenza pandemic, etc) that arise quickly and alter the course of events. Interesting book but his conjectures are not without flaws.
History written in real time isn't history, it's autobiography. History (spare me your insights about how it is written by the revisionists) is best written after the players have left the stage and the disruptions of war have played themselves out over a generation or two.
I did address "human nature", you just HAD to respond at your first chance and couldn't take the minute or two to read my comments further down ....
...... which wouldn't have mattered because when you did, rather than address the Chinese goverments "human nature" displayed during the Cultural Revolution or Tianemen Square you used your "Spin" setting and tried to divert attention to what you see as the failings of the U.S. government with regard to "human nature" - but didn't use the most glaringly obvious one.
I was wrong. There is no hope that you will reach for greater levels of understanding. Your attitude, "I know what I know and I know I am right." is an anchor dragging your intellect down.
barliman
In the spring of 1980 I was briefed on why Nicaragua and Costa Rica were going to be a greater area of interest in the coming decade than Afghanistan. I was also made aware of our "Blue Light" team ... but only because I "stumbled" across them.
Any decent intelligence force can give you a pretty good preview of the future. It isn't shared with the public because they don't have the need to know. They don't need to know because telling them what is known effectively destroys most of your ability to gather information.
barliman
'I know, you think I am being arrogant'
I not only know that you are arrogant, I know you are ignorant of history.
'This is not about how many posts you can make, it is about self realization.'
Who died and left you in charge of deciding what this forum is about? It is not about 'self realization'... If you believe that you should be posting on a self-help forum...one where help is on offer for those with egos larger than their IQs.
'No, I am not going to tell where to find the answers'
Because your knowledge of history is minimal.
'Reach beyond Shirer's work'
Shirer's work is recognized as the best ever written on the subject. I have read a great deal more re WW2 and have yet to find anything approaching Shirer's work. History happens to be my hobby.
'Russia loses a conventional war with China. Not conjecture.'
You're right, it is not conjecture, it's pure baloney...for the reasons that I pointed out in my post above.
'Military warfare is not sporadic.'
Read the bible which is another work of history and some fiction. Remember 'there will always be wars and rumors of wars'? Well, it is correct. Military conflicts ARE sporadic. Economic warfare IS continuous. To argue this point is to be assinine.
'Insanity is counter survival. It has not been the norm and stating that it is no more valuable than peddling "Hope & Change".'
I can't make heads or tails of this comment. Perhaps you need to reword it or just throw it out of your comments... It makes no sense grammatically.
'Oh, and spend less time posting on blogs and more time thinking things through.'
I have been 'thinking things through' for the majority of my sixty seven years on this orb. I believe that your arrogance is on display in this comment. When you have no ground to stand on you, like most trolls, carry out personal attacks, direct demeaning comments toward your adversary in debate, and generally display your ignorance to all.
You need to do some serious study of history for it is linked at the hip to macro economics. If you don't understand one, and you don't, you cannot possibly understand the other.
SW - you are one of the distractions.
There are people on this board you would be fawning over (I wouldn't be one of them) if you knew their personal histories - which is why the blog is anonymous.
You want to debate but won't follow the rules of a debating forum that require you to respond to the points raised. Instead, in the worst American political manner, you select words out of context as a means of launching into a diatribe of your beliefs. If I wanted that sort of shite, I would watch Fox News or MSNBC.
barliman
"The fear of death will be reflected in how any regime conducts itself. No regime will commit to killing of it's own citizens without first carrying out a great deal of nationalistic reasoning...propaganda, iows."
Oh, and on this point - go study the Cultural Revolution and the estimates of how many millions of people died during it. Then move on to Tianemen Square and the repsect they showed for the lives of the people.
Were you serious?
barliman
'Oh, and on this point - go study the Cultural Revolution and the estimates of how many millions of people died during it.'
The cultural revolution in the US was called the Civil War, Kent State and countless occasions where many were killed in attempts to orgainze labor to attain a living wage and minimally safe working conditions.
'Then move on to Tianemen Square and the repsect they showed for the lives of the people.'
We have had several 'Tianemen Square' events in the US... I will point out just one; The Bonus Army...The veterans were in DC to collect bonuses from their WW1 service. Instead, they were shot and beaten and driven from their own capitol.
"On July 28, U.S. Attorney General William D. Mitchell ordered the veterans removed from all government property. Washington police met with resistance, shots were fired and two veterans were wounded and later died. President Herbert Hoover then ordered the army to clear the veterans' campsite. Army Chief of Staff General Douglas MacArthur commanded the infantry and cavalry supported by six tanks. The Bonus Army marchers with their wives and children were driven out, and their shelters and belongings burned."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bonus_Army
...and, yes I am serious as a heart attack. You know nothing of history or you would not continue with this rediculous line of reasoning that suggests that human nature differs from one culture to another. It does not! Can you get that through your thick head? Apparently not...
You are so soaked with nationalist fervor that you cannot see that you have been brain washed...a not uncommon ailment in any country. Without nationalism these clowns in DC and on Wall St could not exist. Do you comprehend that? What are those traveling to the ME now to participate in a war really fighting for? The perpetuation of the norm! More bonuses for bankers? More kick backs for pols? More privitization of profits and socialization of losses? Is this what you want to wave a flag for? Is this what you want your kids to fight for? I doubt it.
And about your claim that wars are predictable let us examine the invasion of Iraq. It was stated by the neo cons that the war in Iraq would cost less than 80 million dollars and that the Iraqis would welcome the US with open arms. How did that turn out? Gen Shensenki was fired for stating that 80 Million dollars was a rediculously low ball estimate... Turns out he was right. How many billions of dollars have been spent to date on that war?
Was the length, cost in dollars and lives, and outcomes predictable in the Korean War? The Viet Nam War? Name one war where the length, cost, and outcome were predicted correctly prior to the first shot being fired. All of your observations are in hindsight, all the historians you prefer write in hindsight, which is by definition revisionist history.
Perhaps you should go away and think this over very carefully...for you don't know what you are talking about at this point in time.
Interestingly enough, conservatives have never viewed me as a conservative; liberals have claimed
I am a conservative, libertarian, nationalist, etc.
My response for two decades has been, "If you believe there is a dime's worth of difference between the two political parties, you are deluding yourself."
You read through polarized glasses and see what you want to see. You "want to debate but won't follow the rules of a debating forum that require you to respond to the points raised. Instead, in the worst American political manner, you select words out of context as a means of launching into a diatribe of your beliefs. If I wanted that sort of shite, I would watch Fox News or MSNBC." (quoting my post above in case you missed it with your selective reading)
Worst of all you make statements of what someone has stated that are patently false. Stating that wars are predictable, "We are going to end up in a war" does not lead to my endoresement of any other person's specific prediction regarding that war when it comes to pass.
You are a "Harry Wanger" but without the unintended humor.
(Or are you so new here you think I am calling you a name?)
barliman
My bet is that China invades Siberia. Russian population is declining and Chinese population is already mass immigrating into the area. Siberia holds vast quantities of untapped resources and it is unlikely the Russians would use nukes to defend it... and even if they did China could "eat" the losses for the collective good of the nation.
Is China not supposed to have a food problem?
China will keep buying arable land around the world.
No mention of the real deal going on... the conversion of otherwise worthless Quadrillion's of USD belonging to the rothschild's etc to hard assets via the forced indebtedness of the US people via the printing presses.....via the Fed.
Interesting you should say that, I thought I was noticing that tend myself. Significant decrease in the banks balance sheet of government notes, treasures etc. But I am not sure if the logic works all the way to the end, ie the sovereign defaults but the banks walk away fairly unscathed.
I'm not into the ad hominen thing, but I have to ask: When did these guys have their anti-fiat conversion? How much money did they make off the Ancien Regime before they saw the light?
Krieger seems sincere, but awfully naive. There is all this talk of The Elites. Like he just finally realized that Ayn Rand was a fraud, and now he's into Howard Zinn.
It might be hard to see it from inside the capitalist bubble, but if you mange other people's money, you are part of The Elite - at least insofar as the revolutionaries will be concerned. You produce nothing. You grow nothing. You guard nothing. You contribute nothing.
Get this straight: If The Revolution comes to the United States, the last thing that will be produced is a "capitalist renaissance."
Can't really find fault with what you're saying. But... when the System is the only thing really going you're kind of at it's mercy; that is, unless you step away from it, which is not an easy thing to do.
The one sure thing that will happen is an erosion of power, all centers of power will be reduced.
Yup - I think a general levelling into a multi-polar deal is in the works. And it might not be a bad thing - but it is going to be rough in the short-term (meaning the next fifteen or twenty years).
I think it's a good thing that the recently clueless have begun to tune-in. On the other hand, you have to watch out for the recently converted: more-Catholic-than-the-Pope, and whathaveyou.
It's going to be a big eyeopener for the "chosen people," that's for sure! Much of the rest of the world is quite familiar with "rough times."
The only way that things are going to turn out to be positive is if we all quit BS-ing ourselves and realize that perpetual growth on a finite planet is the real "enemy."
it will be a power struggle... between good and evil... and good will win over the evil...
just kidding the dumbass masses will follow whoever puts on the best dog and pony show.
LOL +++++. Excellent observation.
When the masses get really bored and hungry the gov will no doubt form another AEF... American Expeditionary Force... To travel to a foreign land... and kill some folks they don't know.
Since the US will be broke I suggest that the new AEF will travel by trucks to the nearest 'enemy encampment'...
Watch out Mexico and Canada!
Yes, the expression known as "the elite" is rather ambiguous and subjective, I agree. I was actually surprised that the term was used during the interview.
The "herd mentality" attempts to convince the masses that such concepts are found within the realm of conspiracy, and consequently must be disparaged and ridiculed. This is just another form of cognitive dissonance, IMO.
Does that mean that these so-called "elite" do not exist?
+++
The Roof!
The Roof!
The Roof is on FIRE!!!
We dont need no water, let the Mother Fucker Burn!
Burn MotherFucker! Burn!!
Wonderful!!! Thanks Max!! Thanks Mike!!!
Wisc Gov revealing 2 things that struck with me in his press conference:
1) Stimulus money rec'd from Feds by the admin that proceeded him when to fill the cash flow problems of the state funding not to any construction or building, i.e. stimulus.
2) Collective bargaining by the teachers union requires the state to purchase HC from a union provider at a substantial premium sites saving of 67MM if collective bargaining didn't require.
...what a revelation!
A liitle ditty about Haarps,coutesy the beachboys good vibrations....
We, we love the greenbacks that we print,
And the way the people love to spend,
we hear the sound of gunfire
On the wind that lifts the sound through the air
They're pickin' up Haarps vibrations
That's giving them stupefaction
They're pickin' up haarps vibrations
(Oom bop bop haarps vibrations)
It's sending out stupefaction
(Oom bop bop stupefaction)
Haarps haarps haarps haarps vibrations
(Oom bop bop)
It's giving them stupefaction
(Oom bop bop excitations)
Haarps haarps haarps haarps vibrations
(Oom bop bop)
It's sending out stupefaction
(Oom bop bop stupefaction)
Close our eyes
It's somehow closer now
Softly smile, we know we must be cruel
When we look into their eyes
They go into our controlled world
They're pickin' up Haarps vibrations
it's sending out stupefaction
They're pickin' up good vibrations
(Oom bop bop good vibrations)
it's sending out stupefaction
(Oom bop bop stupefaction)
Haarps haarps haarps vibrations
(Oom bop bop)
It's sending out stupefaction
(Oom bop bop stupefaction )
Haarps,haarps,haarps haarps vibrations
(Oom bop bop)
It's sending out stupefaction
(Oom bop bop stupefaction )
(Ahhhhhhh)
(Ah my my what stupefaction )
They don't know where but Haarps sends them there
(Ah my my what stupefaction )
(Ah my my what stupefaction )
(Ah my my what)
Gotta keep those controllin' good vibrations
A happenin' to them
Gotta keep those controllin' good vibrations
A happenin' to them
Gotta keep those controllin' good vibrations
A happenin'
Ahhhhhhhh
Haarps haarps haarps haarps vibrations
(Oom bop bop)
(They're pickin' up Haarps vibrations)
It's sending out stupefaction
(Oom bop bop)
(stupefaction )
Haarps haarps haarps haarps vibrations
(Oom bop bop)
It's na na . . .
Another possibility that looms large: what happens when those Iranian gunships move into the Mediterranean and train their cannons at Tel Aviv?
Anyone with a pulse over the past 50 years knows that unrest in the Arab nations eventually finds an outlet in the land formerly known as Palestine.
Why would the Iranians do something so colossally stupid?
Answer: They wouldn't.
Of course, this doesn't preclude the probability that the IDF will attempt multiple provocations in an effort to establish a pretext for the declaration of preemptive war against the Islamic Republic of Iran.
The [ U.S. Government has removed this comment ] , and then, the Sun stood still.
+24/7/365 Nice.
I don't think that the 'gunship' points toward Israel ... I think it just wanders around the Mediterranean posturing like a rooster in heat ... pretty cheap way to pump up oil prices ... strut, strut ... pump, pump
Yeah, that's probably more like it. However, since we're on the topic, for homework, I'd like everyone to find a map of the middle east prior to 1948 and see how it looked. Should give some perspective. Then read about David Ben-Gurion.
British colony ... 1948 overthrow of British rule by zionists and establishment of first western democracy (socialist) in the Middle east
That people still call the theocratico-racial-military-colonial state now occupying Palestine a "western democracy" beggars belief.
No hope for you, Bear.
<<occupying Palestine>>
There has never been a governing nation state named Palestine in recorded history. That's a fact.
But speaking of theocratico (islamic and allied with hitler during WWII) racial (jews must be exterminated) Military (rockets for all) colonial (Saudi and lately iran puppets) occupying Israel and callking itself Palestine, the yes it begars belief if you are pretending that is democracy.
But dont let facts get in your way.
"I think you'll see that in six months". i'm only 30, but this kreiger guy is talking with the cocky certainty of a 20 year old goldman sachs trader. never make six month exact predictions on the commodities markets. if you were making the prediction, i'd assume you're just talking your book and being a douche.
There have been plenty of 6 month or longer calls on gold and silver here so it is entirely possible to make such calls with accuracy IMO
Krieger’s call that we’ll see the unrest really start to hit the US in about six months is a reasonable forecast. He’s calling for $150 - $200 bbl oil coming in about three months which is realistic. I like Krieger. He recognizes that there is a big production decline in petroleum but he clearly doesn’t understand that Big Oil is totally rigged including the huge reserves being withheld in Alaska and especially Gull Island. Lindsey Williams made the call for $150-200 oil last October based not on technical data but insider info. The Middle East is flaring up just as Williams was also told it would four months ago. I’m a little surprised a guy with as much savvy as Max doesn’t seem to understand world oil reserves are totally rigged. As the monster Kissinger stated last week referring the the ME turmoil - "This is merely the first scene in the first Act..."
Max and Mike, may the force be with you guys.
i dont think oil can even achieve the 147 pricepoint it hit in '08
reason being is it will create demand destruction at increasingly lower price levels as our economy perishes
what we will see is '08 repeated to a slightly lesser degree...all commodities will fall back in price and you will see an ever diminshing sine wave in terms of pricing
kind of like a ball bouncing, until it comes to rest at which point we get complete collapse
unless we get WW3 first,or global revolution
with 5 US carriers at the mouth of the suez, this wont be it (ww3) because the iranian warships will know better than to sail thru the canal with our heavy presence
however globalrev is looking better by the day...clif high has been getting these developements right for years at hph w/shape reports...hit oct 7 '08 crash to the day and just about everything since then
not much time left, get your G's
gold,garden,grocerys,etc
Max is great with the exception of his global warming religious views. It kind of negates his credibility.
yeah, that and claiming to be all for freedom and democracy while reporting from Russia and Iran.
W E L C O M E to C O L O R adø†
The way things have been going I am starting to think something like Planet X is looming out there, the government knows, and there is nothing to be done. Why do I think that? Because it is very difficult to see anyone really winning the game they are playing if they expect the game to go on for infinity. It is almost like the Elite see the finish line, and are just playing it out. Hope I'm wrong.