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Minnesota Joins New Jersey In Insolvency, Shuts Down, Harbinger Of Debt Ceiling Negotiation Outcome?

Tyler Durden's picture


Two down. 48 to go until Meredith Whitney is proven correct beyond a reasonable doubt. After New Jersey was forced to reach out to JP Morgan for an emergency bridge loan a few days ago, it is Minnesota's turn. From ABC: "Minnesota's government has shut down, ahead of the holiday weekend, for the second time in six years after state leaders failed to find common ground on resolving a $5 billion budget deficit. Thousands of state workers will be laid off, state parks will be shuttered, the issuance of fishing licenses will be halted and the Minneapolis zoo will be closed. Road projects will also grind to a standstill just as people hit the road for the holiday. A midnight deadline passed without an agreement as talks between Democratic Gov. Mark Dayton and top Republicans unraveled over Dayton's proposal to impose taxes on the state's top earners, a move on which top GOP officials have refused to budge...Some programs that will continue unabated include critical services including the State Patrol, prisons, disaster response and federally funded health, welfare and food stamp programs." Granted this is not a first: "Only four other states -- Michigan, New Jersey, Pennsylvania and Tennessee -- have had shutdowns in the past decade, some lasting mere hours. Minnesota's government partially shut down under then-Gov. Tim Pawlenty in 2005 over a budget fallout." However, if NJ is any indication, as predicted, expect ever more states to bypass the municipal route of funding, and appeal directly to commercial banks. Which will generously provide as much Fed-generated one and exchange for 80% LTV collateral of course.


A midnight deadline passed without an agreement as talks between Democratic Gov. Mark Dayton and top Republicans unraveled over Dayton's proposal to impose taxes on the state's top earners, a move on which top GOP officials have refused to budge.

"It's significant that this shutdown will begin on the Fourth of July weekend," Dayton said in a news conference late Thursday night. "On that date we celebrate our independence. It also reminds us there are causes and struggles worth fighting for."

Dayton said he has been clear with state GOP leaders for several months that that he is unwilling to agree on anything other than a total budget approach.

GOP leaders said the two sides were closer than Dayton is leading on, and have criticized his refusal to call a special session to pass a "lights on" budget bill, which would maintain safety funding at current levels to keep government running. GOP leaders have said that the bill is a two-page document that is ready to be passed, according to Minneapolis- St. Paul ABC News affiliate KSTP.

"I think the governor's insistence that we pass a full budget is not going to be of much comfort to Minnesotans who are going to see delays on the highways because construction projects stop," Senate Majority Leader Amy Koch said. "It's not going to comfort people who can't use our state parks, or who can't get a driver's license."

If the Minnesota impasse is any indication of the future of the debt ceiling debate, in which republican don't actually fold like a cheap suit, get your VIX, MOVE and popcorn calls ready in late July.


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Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:39 | 1418236 pan-the-ist
pan-the-ist's picture

Government shutdown will probably save the state some money.  My heart goes out to all the 612ers who won't get to go to a state park on the fourth, and all of the parasitic business that make their living on the tourism from those parks.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:50 | 1418275 TheTmfreak
TheTmfreak's picture

Parasitic business? That is such a ridiculous statement. Considering the consumers that purchase from those business do so voluntarily, and WANT to purchase the goods, that is a complete and total nonsensical argument.

You might as well call ALL business parasitic at this point. Hell all trade and barter must be parasitic then.

The fact that people WANT to go camping and engage in business transactions but cannot because the government won't let them use "state" property (what happened to it being owned by public?) is the part that is ridiculous. Just because they close down doesn't mean that the parks should "close."

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:51 | 1418283 pan-the-ist
pan-the-ist's picture

Do you hail from the 612 area code?

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:52 | 1418290 TheTmfreak
TheTmfreak's picture


Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:57 | 1418311 pan-the-ist
pan-the-ist's picture

I was trolling, I'd like to be doing that in a boat, but since the government shut down, I have to do it here instead.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:02 | 1418355 SoNH80
SoNH80's picture

What's the deal in Minnesota?  Here in the East, it's known as a liberal state, but one that's well-run (sort of Hubert Humphrey tradition), lacking in the Mass./N.J./R.I./N.Y./Md./Pa.-style corruption.  Is that still accurate?  How's the economy doing out there?  I know that some quality companies like General Mills and 3M are based there....

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:06 | 1418370 fuu
fuu's picture

Target, Best Buy, Super Valu, and Mayo as well.


It all went down hill after the wrestler was elected.



Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:31 | 1418430 Pegasus Muse
Pegasus Muse's picture

No, Jesse V. was fine.  The cruel joke is that comedian they elected to play US senator.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:41 | 1418470 weinerdog43
weinerdog43's picture

"...elected to play US Representative." 

She is indeed a clown.  Fixed it for ya.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 12:01 | 1419132 Freddie
Freddie's picture

LOL!  Ob*ma's cock boys are here. 

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:43 | 1418506 Calmyourself
Calmyourself's picture

Jesse was not fine..  Dropped car tab costs and then voted like a fricking money drunk lib for four years..

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:33 | 1418454 tarsubil
tarsubil's picture

Nah, Jesse was the best option between Skippy and northeast slimeball. Not saying much but still. He certainly is better than uber loser Pawlenty and nutjob Dayton.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:38 | 1418480 Agent 440
Agent 440's picture

Jesse rocked.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:43 | 1418505 spanish inquisition
spanish inquisition's picture

The wrestler did a good job. Republicans and Democrats linked arms and agreed on everything to eliminate the viable threat of a third party, then continued on their partisan ways.

Once in charge, T-Paw accounting shifted the state into bankruptcy, that is the State governor way to print money. Every position he took was calculated to appeal on a national basis gearing up for his presidential run.

I think it is funny that the Republicans who are so set on not spending are the ones crying that a lights on bill was not passed. I don't agree with everything Dayton is doing, but he is actually managing the state and we haven't seen that in a while.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:49 | 1418519 Calmyourself
Calmyourself's picture

You best get the boys i nred to smack your head against the wall, "managing" the state are you serious?

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 10:07 | 1418615 spanish inquisition
spanish inquisition's picture


Fri, 07/01/2011 - 10:55 | 1418852 Agent 440
Agent 440's picture

 +1 : )

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 11:17 | 1418917 Calmyourself
Calmyourself's picture

612 fools..  Wait till Dayton gets scared and runs away like he did as a Senator maybe he can "manage" somewhere else..

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:12 | 1418374 pan-the-ist
pan-the-ist's picture

MNs strength was always it's natural resources, while we weren't Venesula with oil, we had trees, fertile land, and iron ore.  It was easy for the socialism here because they could take the wealth out of the ground.

Today, instead of extracting wealth (they can't because it's scarce), they tax it from workers to give to farmers to grow corn which is further subsidesed and made into ethanol, Shelly Bachmann style.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 10:57 | 1418870 Agent 440
Agent 440's picture


I suspect that the Federal subsidies for ethanhol are net gain for Minnessota, so you should probably consider puckering up and kissing Shelly Bachmann's ass for buying you're dying Parasitic-Industrial complex a little more time.



Fri, 07/01/2011 - 11:21 | 1418975 pan-the-ist
pan-the-ist's picture

It's a net gain for the socialist farmers and Shelly supporters, but not for MN.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:15 | 1418382 hedgeless_horseman
hedgeless_horseman's picture

What's the deal in Minnesota?

"All the women are strong, all the men are good looking, and all the children are above average."


Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:30 | 1418438 Agent P
Agent P's picture

"Where the introverts stare at their shoes, and the extroverts stare at your shoes."

   - Tim Bedore

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:30 | 1418439 tarsubil
tarsubil's picture

GK is the most pretentious smarmy guy on the radio. None of his stuff is funny. The twits laugh because they think that makes them cultured and smart.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:40 | 1418466 hedgeless_horseman
hedgeless_horseman's picture

Pretentious, smarmy, democrats that think they are cultured and smart?  In Minnesota?

Maybe people like him because he is one of the most handsome people on the radio.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:46 | 1418524 Calmyourself
Calmyourself's picture

State is full of them sooner or later we will push them into Iowa or WI.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 17:35 | 1420273 MisterMousePotato
MisterMousePotato's picture

I beg to disagree. A Young Lutheran's Guide to the Orchestra is actually pretty funny.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:36 | 1418467 Agent 440
Agent 440's picture

Uh-huh. Most of those companies have outsourced or moved. It is fair to describe the businesses there as 'parasitic' since most of those still in the state only remain for the priveleged concessions the state has made to keep from losing all private employers. Especially if those employers have the requisiste political access to the union machine. My guess is the public employees will win this one and those not 'Willing To Pay For A Better Minnesota' will continue to file out the state.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 10:08 | 1418623 pan-the-ist
pan-the-ist's picture

Blah Blah Blah. Good riddance. Take Shelly and the socialist farmers with you.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 10:20 | 1418693 Agent 440
Agent 440's picture

Sorry Comrade. Regular programming will resume now:



Fri, 07/01/2011 - 10:38 | 1418797 SoNH80
SoNH80's picture

Obviously, Wisconsin isn't a huge destination for Minn. migrants.  Where do they go?  Iowa?-- I have an Iowan friend, she's always raving about how solid the Iowa economy is.  Or Florida, Texas, those other semi-tropical states?

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 11:56 | 1419129 Freddie
Freddie's picture

It is filled with islamic Somalis now.  They also elected Al Franken or he actually stole the recount.  looks like the Repubs in MN have some stones.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:39 | 1418469 Calmyourself
Calmyourself's picture

I would like to troll you down Hennepin perhaps with a #10 treble hook..  I just hope no one phones in a rabid bunny rabbit warning as Dayton will pack up, close his office and run away..  When do you think Mr. Dayton will move his assets instate so he can be taxed properly?  statists in MN even though heavily enabled by our sycophant media will not be able to turn this debate no matter how many sob stories they self generate.  Dayton threw Bre'r rabbit in the briar patch on this one..    He will regret this when he loses the messaging war..  So you know the Republicans offered to raise the budget in this Biennial budget, Dayton will not budge too bad, so sad.   We will see if $34 billion is big enough for 5 million people..



Fri, 07/01/2011 - 10:10 | 1418635 pan-the-ist
pan-the-ist's picture

Dayton wants to balance the budget and the others (like Pawlenty) want to kick the can. 

It's that simple.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 10:24 | 1418713 Agent P
Agent P's picture

You guys need to take a page out of our (Illinois) playbook, and pass a budget that's bigger than you can afford, then just drag your feet on paying your bills and run up a multi-billion dollar backlog.  Then, shove a huge tax increase down everyone's throat, only to discover you still don't have enough money to pay your bills. 

Illinois, a shining example for all to follow (off a cliff).


Fri, 07/01/2011 - 11:19 | 1418924 Calmyourself
Calmyourself's picture

Bullshit your a liar..  it is balanced as it sits, he will not sign it..

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 11:22 | 1418979 pan-the-ist
pan-the-ist's picture

You mean "You're."

Kick. The. Can.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 11:52 | 1419081 Calmyourself
Calmyourself's picture

Wow, thanks for the grammar lesson, what a mensch..  Now if you could move onto typing lessons.  Pan your wrong and you know it, but if I am wrong lets agree on a solution all Minnesotans can agree upon.  Our budget moving forward is the last two years actual state revenue we borrow not a penny..


How is that sport, no more can kicking starting right now..

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 13:23 | 1419448 pan-the-ist
pan-the-ist's picture

Accounting tricks and kicking the can make it look like you're balancing, but you're not.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 14:30 | 1419685 Calmyourself
Calmyourself's picture

Gee Pan like every time I rub your nose in it you forget to answer the question..  Lets stop kicking the can see the post above... But you don't like that do you, Holy Government would stop growing..  You want that can kicked, you need that can kicked dont you..

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 16:11 | 1420056 fuu
fuu's picture

He is the can.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 17:20 | 1420249 pan-the-ist
pan-the-ist's picture

That's fine, can we agree that if revenue falls short then we raise taxes? Didn't think so.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 12:03 | 1419140 Freddie
Freddie's picture

Is this POS Dayton still a shareholder in Target?  Target was created out of the old Dayton Hudson. 

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 14:32 | 1419689 Calmyourself
Calmyourself's picture

Yes, he is very wealthy and he holds his wealth in out of state trusts that are not taxed in MN..  POS hypocrite, standard MN liberal just like Pan above...

Sat, 07/02/2011 - 11:50 | 1421197 pan-the-ist
pan-the-ist's picture

Just another 612er upset because the Republican short term lights on farce didn't pass and he had to change his plans and stay home.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:57 | 1418562 bankrupt JPM bu...
bankrupt JPM buy silver's picture

Ontario will there soon.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 11:22 | 1418956 Moe Howard
Moe Howard's picture

Why are they locking out the public from the parks?

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 12:29 | 1419231 spanish inquisition
spanish inquisition's picture

It is the old (closing the) statue of liberty play.

No one to monitor campgrounds. A judge is determining what are concidered essential services.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:43 | 1418238 Bob
Bob's picture

Already got the channel set and the snacks ready!  Anybody who thinks the Publicons are not "serious" about tax cuts for the rich and austerity for everybody else must have been asleep for the past 10 years.  "Privatization" will be the name of the game from here on out . . . sound familiar?

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:51 | 1418284 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

LOL, people actually STILL believe its a 'demican republicrat' cute. No wonder the world banksters who own them all  have such an easy time plundering.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:07 | 1418373 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Well SD1, if that duality split worked so well, imagine a hydra headed colossus like the Church.... and people go on believing in divisions and separations and fight about things that hardly matter with words that need not be said...

All our institutions are vehicles of divisiveness. ALL.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:39 | 1418464 tarsubil
tarsubil's picture

Real deep man. I dig it.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 10:07 | 1418617 Misery Index
Misery Index's picture


Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:00 | 1418332 nodhannum
nodhannum's picture

Things must have gotten boring over at, huh...Bob?

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:03 | 1418347 Bob
Bob's picture

They've all got their heads up their asses trying to find The One they thought they voted for!

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:05 | 1418353 j0nx
j0nx's picture

Uh huh, because the demoncrats are so much better. Keep flinging that partisan poo around.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:15 | 1418396 Bob
Bob's picture

Perhaps you should take your fight to Tyler then . . . my comment was in direct reply to his own reference to the illusory two-party drama.  See above.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 10:35 | 1418769 Silver Shield
Silver Shield's picture

How the Bankers Own the World and then Some...

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:34 | 1418241 Internet Tough Guy
Internet Tough Guy's picture

It's a libertarian dream; no burdensome Orwellian government out there staffing state parks or repairing roads. Now if they just stop food inspections and public health vaccinations we will finally be free.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:48 | 1418266 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

Mmmm yea yummy mercury and monkey puss vaccinations, and all for FREE? Wow we live in Nirvana!

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:56 | 1418309 Internet Tough Guy
Internet Tough Guy's picture

Enjoy your e coli salad with a side of whooping cough.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:03 | 1418358 TheTmfreak
TheTmfreak's picture

If you knew who you bought your food from, wouldn't be a concern!

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:14 | 1418391 hedgeless_horseman
hedgeless_horseman's picture

...or grow your own, food that is.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 10:03 | 1418599 TheTmfreak
TheTmfreak's picture

It might be reasonable for people to grow some to supplement what they eat, but i'm not going to advocate that everyone should quit doing what they do to become a full time farmer / homesteader.

Although, I am putting myself in a position that I will be doing just that.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 10:27 | 1418708 hedgeless_horseman
hedgeless_horseman's picture

I advocate getting 90%+ of one's food from within 50 miles, and 10%+ from within 500 yards. 

It is doable.  Our family has exceeded these goals for each of the past three years.

A typical carrot has to travel 1838 miles to reach your dinner table.  Mine travel less than 100 yards, and they taste better.


Fri, 07/01/2011 - 17:40 | 1420281 MisterMousePotato
MisterMousePotato's picture

Take a look at Square Foot Gardening by Mel Barthalomew.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:09 | 1418365 Central Bankster
Central Bankster's picture

The EU has the tightest food code regulation and just had an outbreak of e-coli which they cannot even find the source.  How does that mesh with your fascist ideology?

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:15 | 1418397 Internet Tough Guy
Internet Tough Guy's picture

How many outbreaks does food inspection prevent? If you think it's fascist that you don't have to fear getting polio you should live in an iron lung.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:47 | 1418529 tarsubil
tarsubil's picture

Have you ever worked in the food industry or in the government related to food safety? I have. I'll answer your first question. Zero. Which is the same number of successful responses to food outbreaks. What the government has been successful at is throwing away good produce to make it look like they are doing something. A couple of examples, the last spinach contamination they threw a huge amount away, and it turned out that all of the contaminated spinach had already been consumed and the stuff they threw away was good. Oh, but better safe than sorry, right? No, better nothing at all than horribly inefficient big government control. How about the cookie dough contamination? There was a lot of solid proof (checked sick people's dough, checked saved samples of lots, all negative) that it wasn't contaminated and there was ridiculous proof (two sick people mentioned eating raw cookie dough) that there was. Didn't matter. We have to look like we are doing something so throw the cookie dough out. But don't let these facts get in the way. You love serfdom so much have at it.

Using polio as example of good government is stupid. Vaccines were originally developed without government help and there is no reason why vaccines can't be a matter of personal choice and bought privately. Or are you saying that we wouldn't be able to get vaccines without big government? If you are, then, well, that has already been proven.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 10:14 | 1418661 fiftybagger
fiftybagger's picture

Excellent, another moron dispatched!

The Bitcoin Channel

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 11:32 | 1419003 Moe Howard
Moe Howard's picture

I was involved in perishable commodities from about 1970 to 1981 or so. As for fresh fruits and vegetables, the Federal Government only inspected when a financially interested party paid the fee for the inspection, or when making purchases for the government, such as for the Army. I had limited experience with meat, but my understanding was the USDA inspectors on site were paid for by the meat packers themselves.

Government, by helping the big corporations get bigger and stopping small operators from competing, cause these giant outbreaks. If you had ten thousand meat packers distributing hamburger, and one ends up with e coli, much smaller effect on the public. With three or four giant meat packers, the outbreaks are gigantic with many victims.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 10:27 | 1418692 Rynak
Rynak's picture

Speaking of regulation in generalizations is stupid. What's it with people's short-term memory apparently consisting of one singel cell?

Current safety regulation stuff does probably prevent a lot of things...... and at the same time incredibly little, relative to the involved buerocracy, costs and unnecessary complications. (And yes, i've had the "pleasure" to see regulators in action (though, not food related). Some of the stuff they complained about made sense, other stuff was incredibly stupid and just "the rules for the sake of the rules, even if it's counterproductive to the goal")

How you do stuff matters. As it is now, we have shitty regulation, shitty capitalism, shitty communism, shitty libertarianism/individualism, shitty fascism/collectivism and on top of that shitty socialism.....

It's actually like heaven for ideologues...... everyone can argue against everything, because everything is crap.... just make sure to immunise your choosen ideology, by appealing to "my team has never ever truly been implemented".

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 10:34 | 1418766 Chump
Chump's picture

This is the best, most succinct summary of our plight that I have ever read.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:27 | 1418414 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

Theres no e coli in my garden.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:33 | 1418443 hedgeless_horseman
hedgeless_horseman's picture

E. coli normally lives inside your intestines, where it helps your body break down and digest the food you eat. If there is manure, then there is probably E. coli in your garden.  However, it is mostly the harmless strains, and you wash your vegetables before eating them.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 10:08 | 1418624 TheTmfreak
TheTmfreak's picture

Depends. If you're applying straight manure thats reasonable, however manure used in compost has significantly less ecoli (the bad kind) and alot of other pathogens in general.

Washing your vegetables won't prevent ecoli (sickness) if the vegetables were grown with pathogens in the soil.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 10:31 | 1418728 hedgeless_horseman
hedgeless_horseman's picture

Washing does prevent E. Coli illness.  The high bacteria count is from the manure residue on the surface of the vegetable, such as a spinach leaf, not inside them.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:58 | 1418591 Calmyourself
Calmyourself's picture

Right they save me from that on a daily basis..  I know the county food inspectors, they stamp meat..  This is not " The Jungle" those days are over but in your fevered imagination all business is out to lower quality and force people to buy their products.  Oh wait, thats Government, D or R, no matter..

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:52 | 1418288 Chump
Chump's picture

Indeed.  Incidentally, do you have the figures showing what percentage of the state budget is spent on parks, road resurfacing, food inspections, and public health vaccinations?  It would be interesting to see if those items are the primary burdens, or if you're just a damned strawman-slaying idiot.

Buying into your special brand of bullshit encourages more useless state officials and "leaders" to lay off people performing actual services first, purely as a scare tactic, instead of getting rid of the bloated middle-management bureaucracy.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:03 | 1418360 Central Bankster
Central Bankster's picture



The guy is too braindead to understand how badly you just destroyed his pathetic trolling.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:09 | 1418377 Gert_B_Frobe
Gert_B_Frobe's picture


Just like Oblahblah (Richard) and his think of the children!

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:25 | 1418419 docj
docj's picture

Well said. +1

Just like at the local level - whenever school funding needs to get cut it's always "The Band" or "The Volleyball Team" and never "The Deputy Assistant 3rd-Grade Curriculum Coordinator".

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:32 | 1418452 pan-the-ist
pan-the-ist's picture


Fri, 07/01/2011 - 10:12 | 1418653 Misery Index
Misery Index's picture


Fri, 07/01/2011 - 11:04 | 1418885 hedgeless_horseman
hedgeless_horseman's picture


Fri, 07/01/2011 - 11:37 | 1419019 Moe Howard
Moe Howard's picture


Fri, 07/01/2011 - 11:54 | 1419113 DOT
DOT's picture

Came back to say, Exactly.


From a local (former) newspaper:

Andreal Davis is the assistant director for equity and family involvement for the Madison Metropolitan School District.
"My division is comprised of nine people. We have instructional resource teachers for Latino family involvement and Hmong community liaison work, Indian education (funded through federal money), two teachers for cultural relevance as well as four minority service coordinators stationed at our four traditional high schools. Our work spans issues of equity, of cultural relevance and family involvement."


disclosure: Wi still owes Mn millions !


Fri, 07/01/2011 - 16:23 | 1420096 Protonrick
Protonrick's picture

And Special Ed.

Note how predators go for the weak and defenseless.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:52 | 1418308 Raymond Reason
Raymond Reason's picture

I'll take freedom.  You can move to Venezuela. 

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:04 | 1418362 TheTmfreak
TheTmfreak's picture

They've been doing amazing lately with their 20+% inflation.

But they raise the minimum wage every year so the little guy can have more of continually becoming worthless money.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:35 | 1418242 Corn1945
Corn1945's picture

The Democrats absolutely refuse to cut spending. Take a look at NJ. The Democrats immediately spend any additional revenue as soon as it comes in.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:36 | 1418245 pan-the-ist
pan-the-ist's picture

Completely false.  In this case, the republican controlled senate and house won't allow tax increases.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:38 | 1418251 Corn1945
Corn1945's picture

Ummmm....You just proved my point. The Democrats refuse to cut spending and demand more of someone else's money.

We tax successful individuals and business, they stare in wonder when no jobs materialize.

You deserve to have your job outsourced to China.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:43 | 1418260 trampstamp
trampstamp's picture

Help me understand. Have we not for the last 20 years or so taxed the rich less, but still have high unemployment? I'm confused.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:48 | 1418269 Internet Tough Guy
Internet Tough Guy's picture

GE pays no taxes at all and just look at all the jobs they created in the last decade in America. lulz.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:52 | 1418306 Chump
Chump's picture

No corporations pay taxes; you do it for them.  Well done and congrats.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:00 | 1418327 Raymond Reason
Raymond Reason's picture

All US c-corps pay a double tax.  First for the corp, then the shareholders. 

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:49 | 1418537 Sig Sauer
Sig Sauer's picture

BS! most US corps have legions of people working to ensure they pay little to no taxes.  direct and indirect lobbying of Congress, complicated foreign subsidiary structures and transfer pricing arrangements, complicated inter-company lending arrangements, etc.   

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:54 | 1418549 Bobbyrib
Bobbyrib's picture

As a shareholder of a corporation I guess individual limitations on political donations don't apply to me since I am PART of the corporation. As a shareholder you are not part of the corporation (unless you are an excecutive or on the board of directors), you are the victim of the stock market ponzi scheme.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:10 | 1418367 TheTmfreak
TheTmfreak's picture

Been trying to explain this forever.

Taxes do harm business/corporations however. While they may not pay them (by passing them on), eventually the prices of goods will reduce the number of consumers (unless they can out innovate costs to tax increases) to the point where they no longer are profitable.

Its fact that taxes hurts everyone but government. Really that simple.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:23 | 1418405 Raymond Reason
Raymond Reason's picture


Fri, 07/01/2011 - 10:05 | 1418632 tarsubil
tarsubil's picture

GE will continue to pay no taxes under Democrats or Republicans, with or without tax increases. The tax code is designed to protect corporations like GE from competition. You know, the little guy. The guy you're supposedly pulling for. Funny how your results are always the opposite. Almost like you're full of it or something.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:46 | 1418280 Corn1945
Corn1945's picture

The "rich" you have a problem with are Wall Street criminals. Instead of the class warfare bullshit, you should be demanding criminal prosecutions for rich people who have committed felonies.

The tax and regulation burden on entrepreneurs has never been higher. We want to encourge peope to start business and create jobs. That's why this country was successful at one point.

Concentrate on rich criminals, not rich success stories.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:51 | 1418297 pan-the-ist
pan-the-ist's picture

That's bullshit.  This country has always been successful because of bubbles caused by huge amounts of natural resources, from beaverhats, to iron, to forests, to fertile land.  Now that resources are scarce or cheaper elsewhere the economy is faltering.  Nice try though.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:53 | 1418313 Corn1945
Corn1945's picture

People like you are destroying this country. You sicken and sadden me at the same time. You refuse to allow this country to compete on the world's stage. You refuse to fix the failing education system. And you refuse to cut the government down to a manageable size.

You deserve to have your children's future shipped to China. They deserve it more than you do. Enjoy the foodstamps.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:07 | 1418359 pan-the-ist
pan-the-ist's picture

I wan't to hear what your model for education is.  Please elaborate.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:12 | 1418384 Raymond Reason
Raymond Reason's picture

Eastern European children start school two years later than ours.  And by the age of 17 they are vastly more educated than ours.  Also...US undergraduate degrees mean nothing on the world stage.  It is our graduate degrees that are coveted, and that is because they are subsidized by major US corporations and tailored for employment with such, world-wide.   

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:23 | 1418413 pan-the-ist
pan-the-ist's picture

That's great - we can setup our education system like eastern Europe.  Please tell me more details. Are they private schools? Do their teachers work for they state? Do they have pensions?  Do they pray to God every morning right after they salute the flag? I'm curious...

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:58 | 1418570 Bobbyrib
Bobbyrib's picture

Eastern Europe is included in the emerging markets aren't they? (sarcasm) Perhaps if you have any children you can send them to Eastern Europe to have them educated. Any day now, those countries will rise up and become super powers.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 11:13 | 1418905 trav7777
trav7777's picture

And by the age of 17 they are vastly more educated than ours.

This is a misleading statement.  Subtract out blacks and hispanics and you find what remains are among the top performers in the world.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:20 | 1418409 Bob
Bob's picture

Refuse to allow this country to compete on the world's stage?  I believe it's being relegated to the developing world's slums that most Americans object to "competing" on.

So hard to understand? 

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:44 | 1418489 earnulf
earnulf's picture

"Refuse to allow this country to compete on the world's stage."   Sorry Corn, but in order to compete, one has to be willing to compete.   American workers, when compared to other countries, are paid more per hour than they are paid per day.   Exactly how are companies supposed to compete when foreign competitors can produce the exact same item, package it, ship it to the US and have a item cost that is still 50% of the same item made here?   The US has massive regulation that drives up the cost of everything while foreign counties have little or no regulation.   We are at a competitive disadvantage and labor makes up more than 50% of the cost of anything produced in the states.

"You refuse to fix the failing education system."   Maybe where you are, but here in small town america there is still pride in education and the only problems we have are with having to retain shoddy teachers because of union rules that prohibt firing them.     Parents still get involved (not all, but enough) in education in small towns.   Of course if you are invoking higher education then it's cost (which leaves people owing hundreds of thousand of dollars for that BA or BS) and tenure which again, prohibits "educators" from being fired.

"You refuse to cut the government down to a manageable size".   And that would include cuts where exactly?   Mandatory spending was 2.1 of the 2.2 Trillion in revenue for the last year.   Discretionary spending was the other 1.6 Trillion.    And Defense spending is a "discretionary" spending item (600 billion worth)

Our children deserve a future without a debt that saddles them with $47,000 the moment they are born and adds 4,000 dollars a year to that total.   But spending cuts alone are not going to slow this monster down (notice I said slow down, not reverse it).    You could raise taxes by 30% and cut spending by 30% and you would get close to "balancing the budget"

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 10:00 | 1418601 tarsubil
tarsubil's picture

Is this a joke?

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 11:11 | 1418908 trav7777
trav7777's picture

there's nothing wrong with our education system.

There is something wrong with a large percentage of our students.  If you subtract out a couple of demographics, you find a school system working just fine for the remainder (a majority)

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:10 | 1418369 Raymond Reason
Raymond Reason's picture

Forests continue to grow, and farmland remains fertile if it is managed well.  We have the resources to be well-fed and happy.  It is Power that brings scarcity. 

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:53 | 1418305 Bob
Bob's picture

The problem with prosecutions may be that the "rich" aren't pushing for them.  If they want to distinguish themselves from the real criminals, it's time for them to start screaming the right thing.  

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:06 | 1418357 nodhannum
nodhannum's picture

Alot of people are into the envy game when it comes to entrepreneurs.  The banksters and there fellow travelers (can you guys at Fannie Mae here me) should be prosecuted.  That having been said, what this country needs is thousands mor Steve Jobs and Bill Gates to battle it out.  They pay their fair share by employing people...who then pay taxwes from real production.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:14 | 1418379 Central Bankster
Central Bankster's picture

Yes and there are more cellphones then there were 20 years ago, so clearly we can conclude high cell phone use = high unemployment.  Idiot.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 12:38 | 1419260 karzai_luver
karzai_luver's picture

actually your cell phone v unemployment is probably true.

try thinking just a little next time.



Fri, 07/01/2011 - 15:02 | 1419764 Central Bankster
Central Bankster's picture

Try going to school so you can learn the difference between correlation and causation.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 12:07 | 1419155 Freddie
Freddie's picture

We had an unemployment avg of 5% under Bush.  Obama's avg is over 9%.  If we use real number closer to 15%.  And no I did not love Bush.  2006 Dem Congress fvvkked things up. 

Looks like the Ob*ma c*ck boys have shown up this morning here.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:43 | 1418262 pan-the-ist
pan-the-ist's picture

The democrats in this case are going along with cuts.  It's been shown that the wealthy don't spend money and that Reaganomics is a farce, and in any case small business cant afford health insurance for their employees.  If you were born on 3rd and thought you hit a home run, congratulations.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:52 | 1418289 johnnymustardseed
johnnymustardseed's picture

You are wrong corn dog, Democrats are willing to cut spending. Typical Republican lie!!! This is Pawlenty's deficit. He kicked the can down the road and then quit before it would hurt his hope of being president.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:54 | 1418319 Chump
Chump's picture

So what spending cuts are being proposed, and how do they affect the deficit?  I would truly like to know and my Google Fu is weak.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 10:04 | 1418619 Calmyourself
Calmyourself's picture

None he is lying the budget was increased 4 billion.  Dayto is holding it up as he does not wan tthe tort reform and no new taxes..  Refute that liar, 4 BILLION INCREASE!!

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 10:22 | 1418722 Agent 440
Agent 440's picture

YES! Democrats cut. They are willing to cut. The unions are always willing to lay off or reduce programs as long as the net spending increases. PAY MORE FOR EVEN LESS could be the DNC motto.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 10:02 | 1418614 Calmyourself
Calmyourself's picture

Your not too bright or a liar..  Since 1961 except for one year, our biannual budget increases in MN have been 20%, check the figures, I'll wait.


We have like all of Government a spending problem.  I run into people every day from Detroit or Chicago who come to MN for the social bennies..

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 10:31 | 1418742 Agent 440
Agent 440's picture

Ahhh... but you're paying attention to the prices... not the services... You're one of those rabid radical right wingers who thinks because they're paying more, they should get more.


Yes, I've known people who've moved to Michigan for the no-income medical benefits to get one procedure done, and then moved to Washington state in order to take advantage of the no-income medical programs to get a different procedure done not covered by Michigan. But I'm told that this has nothing to do with the cost of health care.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 11:21 | 1418945 Calmyourself
Calmyourself's picture

Ha, nice sarcasm..  Liberals hate sarcasm..

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:40 | 1418254 Bugman82
Bugman82's picture

The Republicans can't win this fight.  The Democrat strategy of class warfare is too effective.  Human beings love to place blame on anyone but themselves.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:45 | 1418272 Bob
Bob's picture

Au contrare--they win until they don't.  Look at Greece.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:42 | 1418255 buzzsaw99
buzzsaw99's picture

All the maggot's wildest dreams are coming true. Thanks Owebama.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:42 | 1418259 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

Gee I really dont see what the problem is, cant they just hand over more free money blank checks? It works SO well and all.


Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:49 | 1418271 pan-the-ist
pan-the-ist's picture

Or kick the can down the road another 8 years like they did under Pawlenty...

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:53 | 1418293 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

No more can kicking, the New World Order is right at the door. Dont get sucked into the politics puppet show, the die is cast.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:43 | 1418264 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

Great opportunity for Minnesota- why do they need a government anyway? People might like the shutdown so much, they decide to extend it to all aspects of government- even the police power.

Go Gophers!

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:48 | 1418267 rodocostarica
rodocostarica's picture

Oh no. I cant buy a fishing license? Maybe it doesnt matter since there wont be any DNA guys out checking for em.

My guess hardly anyone will notice this shutdown except slugs.




Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:46 | 1418279 pan-the-ist
pan-the-ist's picture

Actually, the DNR conservation officers will be working.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:50 | 1418282 Internet Tough Guy
Internet Tough Guy's picture

And if you are flying down the freeway at 70 and smash your axle on a giant pothole you will taste the freedom.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:52 | 1418304 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

Yes, because ONLY government can repair roads and they do it so quickly! Since government is so good at everything, we should put them in control of EVERYTHING. Why grow food if the government will do it better? Why produce goods, the government is much preferred.  

Only the government is capable of providing "public goods", because it is staffed with "people". People who are somehow different from civilian people. They're super humans.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:59 | 1418317 Internet Tough Guy
Internet Tough Guy's picture

Get out there with your road grader and fix the freeway, libertarian dude. No one is stopping you. Of course, you won't be paid. That's too oppressive.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 08:57 | 1418336 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

Aw, can't address the deficit in your argument? What's the matter? Lost the ability to think for yourself slave? 

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:28 | 1418416 Sophist Economicus
Sophist Economicus's picture

Got my IH clamshell, Kubota track-hoe and other equipment from my farm ready to go.   Get me the permits tpo fix ANY road - will do it quicker than any of these union drios that DO NOT own their own equipment, State facists that bought their equipment off the backs of others, etc.


Go in ITG, get me my clearances, I'll take 1/3 of what the state pays the current goons...

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 09:48 | 1418508 weinerdog43
weinerdog43's picture

And when your slipshod repair fails and causes an accident involving injuries, I'm sure you've got millions in coverage to address the inevitable lawsuits?

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 10:08 | 1418657 DOT
DOT's picture

Tort reform now !

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 10:21 | 1418699 tarsubil
tarsubil's picture

Yeah, cause we all know the government doesn't oversee shoddy repairs. I mean, just look at Pennsylvania. Oh wait, they did okay shoddy repairs on a massive scale due to the inherent corruption of central control. Gee, you oligarch lapdogs need to go back to your superiors for better arguments.

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 11:34 | 1419011 Thisson
Thisson's picture

See also Boston Mass.'s "Big Dig"

Fri, 07/01/2011 - 10:30 | 1418743 Founders Keeper
Founders Keeper's picture

[And when your slipshod repair fails and causes an accident...]---weinerdog43

Oh yes, I'm sure he would purposely jeopardize his business income, his home, food for his family, property, and his reputation for what you assume.

By your logic, only government work is trustworthy. It that what you're hanging your hat on? The government? Good luck with that.

I'll hang my hat on the American spirit.


Fri, 07/01/2011 - 10:15 | 1418690 Founders Keeper
Founders Keeper's picture

[Get me the permits tpo fix ANY road - will do it quicker than any of these union drios...]---Sophist Economicus


THAT's the spirit!  That's what I'm talkin' 'bout---the American spirit.

"I'll do it. Give me an opportunity. Any opportunity. I'll do the job. Will do it better, faster, and cheaper."

(Government is the problem, not the solution.)


Fri, 07/01/2011 - 10:47 | 1418830 hedgeless_horseman
hedgeless_horseman's picture

Get me the permits tpo fix ANY road - will do it quicker than any of these union drios...Will do it better, faster, and cheaper.---Sophist Economicus

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