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National Academies of Sciences: FBI Failed to Prove Anthrax Claims
As I pointed out last year:
Vaccine expert Dr. Meryl Nass shreds the FBI's case against Bruce Ivins:
Federal Bureau of Invention: CASE CLOSED (and Ivins did it)
But
FBI's report, documents and accompanying information (only pertaining
to Ivins, not to the rest of the investigation) were released on Friday
afternoon... which means the FBI anticipated doubt and ridicule. And
the National Academies of Science (NAS) is several months away from
issuing its $879,550 report on the microbial forensics, suggesting a)
asking NAS to investigate the FBI's science was just a charade to
placate Congress, and/or b) NAS' investigation might be uncovering
things the FBI would prefer to bury, so FBI decided to preempt the NAS
panel's report.Indeed, both Lawrence Livermore National Labs and Sandia National Labs have already discredited the FBI's claims.
Back to Nass's article:
Here are today's reports from the Justice Department, AP, Washington Post and NY Times. The WaPo article ends,
The
FBI's handling of the investigation has been criticized by Ivins's
colleagues and by independent analysts who have pointed out multiple
gaps, including a lack of hair, fiber other physical evidence directly
linking Ivins to the anthrax letters. [Note by Washington's Blog:
Indeed, handwriting analysis failed to link Ivins
to the anthrax letters.] But despite long delays and false leads,
Justice officials Friday expressed satisfaction with the outcome.
The evidence "established that Dr. Ivins, alone, mailed the anthrax letters," the Justice summary stated.
Actually, the 96 page FBI report is predicated on the assumption
that the anthrax letters attack was carried out by a "lone nut." The
FBI report fails to entertain the possibility that the letters attack
could have involved more than one actor. The FBI admits that about 400
people may have had access to Ivins' RMR-1029 anthrax preparation, but
asserts all were "ruled out" as lone perpetrators. FBI never tried to
rule any out as part of a conspiracy, however.
That is only the first of many holes in FBI's case. Here is a sampling of some more.
***
The
letter spores contained a Bacillus subtilis contaminant, and silicon
to enhance dispersal. FBI has never found the Bacillus subtilis strain
at USAMRIID, and it has never acknowledged finding silicon there,
either. If the letters anthrax was made at USAMRIID, at least small
amounts of both would be there.***
FBI says that only a
small number of labs had Ames anthrax, including only 3 foreign labs.
Yet a quick Pub Med search of papers published between 1999 and 2004
revealed Ames anthrax was studied in at least Italy, France, the UK,
Israel and South Korea as well as the US. By failing to identify all
labs with access to Ames, the FBI managed to exclude potential domestic
and foreign perpetrators.***
FBI claims that "drying
anthrax is expressly forbidden by various treaties," therefore it would
have to be performed clandestinely. Actually, the US government
sponsored several programs that dried anthrax spores [Note by
Washington's Blog: government labs in Utah and Ohio
worked with dried anthrax]. Drying spores is not explicitly prohibited
by the Biological Weapons Convention, though many would like it to be.***
Does the FBI stand for the Federal Bureau of Invention?
Indeed, a minute's reflection will show how silly the FBI's claims are.
As I wrote in 2008:
The chief biological inspector for the U.N. Special Commission from 1994 to 1998 - who describes himself as one of the "four or five people in the whole country" who could make the type of anthrax used in the 2001 attacks - noted in testimony to Congress:
"I
have maintained from the first descriptions of the material contained
in the Daschle letter that the quality appeared to be such that it
could be produced only by some group that was involved with a current
or former state program
in recent years. The level of knowledge, expertise, and experience
required and the types of special equipment required to make such
quality product takes time and experimentation to develop. Further, the
nature of the finished dried product is such that safety
equipment and facilities must be used to protect the individuals
involved and to shield their clandestine activity from discovery."Similarly, a manufacturer of specialized anthrax equipment said:
"You
would need [a] chemist who is familiar with colloidal [fumed] silica,
and a material science person to put it all together, and then some
mechanical engineers to make this work . . . probably some containment
people, if you don't want to kill anybody. You need half a dozen, I
think, really smart people."The U.N. biologist mentioned above also said that the equipment to make such high-tech anthrax does not exist at Fort Detrick, where Ivins worked.
People who work at Fort Detrick have confirmed this. In other words, a
lone scientist couldn't have done it without the support of a whole
government laboratory. And Fort Detrick was not one such potential
laboratory.A former director of the bacteriology division at Ft. Detrick said the anthrax sent to Daschle was "so concentrated and so consistent and so clean that I would assert that Bruce could not have done that part".
I also noted in 2008:
According to the FBI, Ivins made the killer anthrax in his lab at Fort Detrick all by himself in something like 12 hours ...
Is that plausible?
Well, one of the handful of people who actually can produce the kind of high-tech weaponized anthrax used in the attacks said:
"In
my opinion, there are maybe four or five people in the whole country
who might be able to make this stuff, and I'm one of them," said Richard
O. Spertzel, chief biological inspector for the U.N. Special
Commission from 1994 to 1998. "And even with a good lab and staff to help run it, it might take me a year to come up with a product as good."In
addition, scientists at Ft. Detrick say that no one there had the
equipment or knowledge to make weaponized anthrax of the type used in
the letters ....If it would take one of the handful of people
who have the know-how and a good lab with staff a year, and if no one at
Ivins’ lab knew how to do it, how could Ivins have made it all by
himself in 12 hours without the proper equipment?
National Academies of Sciences Slams the FBI
In December, the FBI tried to get the National Academies of Science to delay their anthrax report, because it was not flattering to the Bureau.
But
the final National Academies of Sciences report has just been released,
and confirms much of what Nass and I have been saying for years: the
FBI's case against Ivins doesn't hold up.
As Raw Story reports today:
An
independent panel of scientists has determined that the FBI did not
have enough scientific evidence to produce a conviction in the case of
the 2001 anthrax attacks that killed five people.
The National Academies of Sciences released a review
Tuesday of the science used in the investigation. The $1.1 million
report, which was commissioned by the FBI, concluded that the man
accused in the case, Bruce Ivins, could have carried out the attacks,
but the science alone did not prove it.
***
The report released Tuesday questioned the link between a flask of anthrax found in Ivins' office and the letters.
"The
scientific link between the letter material and flask number RMR-1029
is not as conclusive as stated in the DOJ Investigative Summary," the
report said.
The panel added that another explanation for the link "was not rigorously explored" by the FBI.
"This
shows what we've been saying all along: that it was all supposition
based on conjecture based on guesswork, without any proof whatsoever,"
Paul Kemp, a lawyer who represented Ivins, told The Washington Post.
"The
FBI has long maintained that while science played a significant role,
it was the totality of the investigative process that determined the
outcome of the anthrax case," the Justice Department and the FBI said
in a joint statement. "Although there have been great strides in
forensic science over the years, rarely does science alone solve an
investigation."
The Rest of the Case Is Not So Hot, Either
Congressman Holt has previously pointed out that the FBI's entire case was based upon flimsy, circumstantial evidence. Today, Holt said:
It would take a credulous person to believe the circumstantial evidence
that the FBI used to draw its conclusions with such certainty. The FBI
has not proven to me that this is an open and shut case.
The FBI has made a number of ridiculous claims, and when it was pointed out that the FBI's timeline made no sense, the Bureau simply changed it without explanation.
As Dr. Nass has previously pointed out:
Drs.
Perry Mikesell, Ayaad Assaad and Stephen Hatfill were 3 earlier
suspects. All had circumstantial evidence linking them to the case. In
Hatfill's case, especially, are hints he could have been "set up."
Greendale, the return address on the letters, was a suburb of Harare,
Zimbabwe where Hatfill attended medical school. Hatfill wrote an
unpublished book about a biowarfare attack that bears some resemblance
to the anthrax case. So the fact that abundant circumstantial evidence
links Ivins to the case might be a reflection that he too was "set up"
as a potential suspect, before the letters were sent.
***
FBI
fails to provide any discussion of why no autopsy was performed, nor
why, with Ivins under 24/7 surveillance from the house next door, with
even his garbage being combed through, the FBI failed to notice that he
overdosed and went into a coma. Nor is there any discussion of why the
FBI didn't immediately identify tylenol as the overdose substance, and
notify the hospital, so that a well-known antidote for tylenol
toxicity could be given (N-acetyl cysteine, or alternatively
glutathione). These omissions support the suggestion that Ivins'
suicide was a convenience for the FBI. It enabled them to conclude the
anthrax case, in the absence of evidence that would satisfy the courts.
***
The
FBI's alleged motive is bogus. In 2001, Bioport's anthrax vaccine
could not be (legally) relicensed due to potency failures, and its
impending demise provided room for Ivins' newer anthrax vaccines to
fill the gap. Ivins had nothing to do with developing Bioport's
vaccine, although in addition to his duties working on newer vaccines,
he was charged with assisting Bioport to get through licensure.
***
The
FBI report claims the anthrax letters envelopes were sold in
Frederick, Md. Later it admits that millions of indistinguishable
envelopes were made, with sales in Maryland and Virginia.
***
FBI
emphasizes Ivins' access to a photocopy machine, but fails to mention
it was not the machine from which the notes that accompanied the spores
were printed.***
FBI asserts that Bioport and USAMRIID
were nearly out of anthrax vaccine, to the point researchers might not
have enough to vaccinate themselves. FBI further asserts this would end
all anthrax research, derailing Ivins' career. In fact, USAMRIID has
developed many dozens of vaccines (including those for anthrax) that
were never licensed, but have been used by researchers to vaccinate
themselves. There would be no vaccine shortage for researchers.***
Ivins
certainly had mental problems. But that does not explain why the FBI
accompanied Ivins' therapist, Ms. Duley (herself under charges for
multiple DUIs) and assisted her to apply for a peace order against him.
Nor does it explain why Duley then went into hiding, never to be heard
from again.***
FBI obtained a voluntary collection of
anthrax samples. Is that the way to conduct a multiple murder
investigation: ask the scientists to supply you with the evidence to
convict them? There is no report that spores were seized from anyone
but Ivins, about 6 years after the attacks. This is a huge hole in the
FBI's "scientific" methodology.
***
FBI claims it
investigated Bioport and others who had a financial motive for the
letters attack, and ruled them out. However, FBI provides not a shred
of evidence from such an investigation.FBI gave this report its best
shot. The report sounds good. It includes some new evidence. It
certainly makes Ivins out to be a crazed, scary and pathetic figure. If
you haven't followed this story intently, you may be convinced of his
guilt.
In fact, the "totality of the investigative process" proves that the case against Ivins is incredibly weak. As Dr. Nass writes today:
There is no getting away from the NAS report conclusions, as reported worldwide: the science does not support FBI's claims that Ivins was the anthrax perpetrator.
See articles from the AFP, NPR, AP, Science, and a later WP article.
The FBI responded that their case was based on a totality of the evidence, not just the science. But
when the rest of the FBI's evidence is examined, one finds only smoke.
There has been no physical evidence tying Ivins to the case. The
totality of the FBI case against Ivins rests on colorful and sometimes
exaggerated personal quirks and odd habits. The FBI has presented no
convincing evidence that Ivins had the means, a motive, or the
oppportunity to commit the letters crime.
And yet - in a bizarre, Soviet-style move - the White House threatened to veto the intelligence budget unless everyone accepted the FBI frame up of Ivins.
Why?
Why would the government be so adamant about pushing the FBI version of events?
Remember
that when Congress was originally asked to pass the Patriot Act in late
2001, the anthrax attacks which occurred only weeks earlier were
falsely blamed on spooky Arabs as a way to scare Congress members into
approving the bill. Specifically:
- The FBI was actually told to blame Anthrax scare on Al Qaeda by White House officials
- High-level government insiders pointed towards Iraq as the source of the anthrax, even though there was absolutely no reason to think that the anthrax had come from Iraq
Indeed, many people have questioned whether or not the anthrax was intentionally sent to scare people. For example:
- The anthrax letters attempt to link 9/11 and the anthrax attack and pretend to be from radical Muslims and be anti-America and anti-Israel
- Would Arab terrorists have targeted only Congress men who were likely to oppose the Patriot Act
and other tyrannical measures? Would they have gotten that specific
in their targeting? In order to terrorize America as a whole,
wouldn't real Arab terrorists have sent anthrax to the Congressional
leaders of both parties, regardless of their political postures
towards particular legislation? Shouldn't it have been obvious to
the FBI that the killer was pro-tyranny, rather than being simply
Anti-American? The "war on terror" and Iraq war were largely based on the claim that Saddam and Muslim extremists were behind the anthrax attacks (and see this and this)
- Senator Patrick Leahy said:
And
I think there are people within our government -- certainly from the
source of it -- who know where it came from. [Taps the table to let
that settle in] And these people may not have had anything to do with
it, but they certainly know where it came from.
- The FBI gave its consent in October, 2001 for the remaining samples of the Ames anthrax strain to be destroyed,
thereby permanently destroying crucial "genetic clues valuable to
the criminal inquiry". Why would the FBI allow the Ames samples to
be destroyed, other than to prevent fingers from being pointed
toward the real killer, someone who worked for the U.S. government
and had access to U.S. bioweapons?
- The American
bioweapons expert who actually drafted the current bioweapons law (the
Biological Weapons Anti-Terrorism Act of 1989), who holds a doctorate
of law magna cum laude and a Ph.D. in political science, both from
Harvard University, and teaches international law at the University of
Illinois at Champaign-Urbana, served on the Board of Directors of Amnesty International (1988-92) and represented Bosnia-Herzegovina at the World Court, and who "advised the FBI in its initial investigation of the anthrax letters", is convinced
that the anthrax attacks that killed five people were perpetrated and
covered up by criminal elements of the U.S. government. The motive: to
foment a police state by killing off and intimidating opposition to
post-9/11 legislation such as the Patriot Act and the later Military
Commissions Act. He has said:
Senators Tom Daschle and
Patrick Leahy were holding it up because they realized what this would
lead to. The first draft of the PATRIOT Act would have suspended the
writ of habeas corpus [which protects citizens from unlawful
imprisonment and guarantees due process of law]. Then all of a sudden,
out of nowhere, come these anthrax attacks.
Whether or not the anthrax was actually mailed as a false flag attack, it is clear that it was conveniently used to drum up fear when fear was needed to sell certain political agendas.
- advertisements -
Well done, GW.
Say ... is this the same FBI that buried reports from the field about suspicious arab types taking flying lessons in big jets circa 2000.
why...yes
In 99 I got naturally occurring anthrax. About a 100mm to one shot. Lucky me. Bad stuff. A month in ICU. Lost a third of my weight, all of my hair and most of my memory. Damn near died.
Three years later the stuff GW is talking about happens. I had had blood tests. So the boys at the FBI came to ask about how it was that I show up positive. They were nice enough about it. Big fellows they were. At first they didn't buy into the idea that I got it from contact with a dead racoon. Go figure....
The flatfoots "must get their man", even if it is the wrong man, or a woman, or...
I'd rather be a hammer than a nail,
I'd rather be Michael then Mikail,
I'd rather be a winner than than some canibal's dinner,
I'd rather be a killer than a feeler,
I'd rather be a alive than deprived.
I'm not a pussy, like some liberal's wussy,
It's the survival of the fittest, the death of the frailist,
That's what it's all about, that's who has the clout.
O.K., so when does open season on bankers and politicians begin?
It strikes me that this fiasco has Dickhead Cheney pecker tracks all over it.
Great work George,
mmmhmm
interesting story i have that relates to this in an odd way
during 1st gulf war i was 1 CAV 312th MI
one of my jobs was administering the anthrax vaccine to our soldiers
odd thing happened when i got to vaccinating those at the top of the MI food chain....
complete refusal to accept vaccine
women claimed pregnancy...all of them
males also refused....gunshot ,confusion(at TOC location as i remember)
odd day indeed
vaccine happens to be a two part vaccine
what i was giving was not a two part vaccine
1 part only
i administered this to about 525 soldiers
prolly not relevant, but interesting imho
All bullshit. lies and propaganda it's how things get done. DUH
George i like most of your writings but the evidence suggests the fbi was right this time. Granted there are 200 people who had access to the same bottle, but that is not the only evidence. Not everything in the world is a result of government conspiracies.
What is the evidence, exactly, that the FBI was right?
"...fear was needed to sell certain political agendas."
Also needed to sell mounds of pills.
reminds me a little of Richard Jewell.
Blame someone and try them in the media. Destroy their lives. After the story fades to black issue a "well maybe not"
The FBI seems to like to play pin the tail on the suspect in the media.
Too bad Ivins will never have his day in court. Of course everyone will just remember him as a weird sex perv.
How much circumstantial evidence is required before a real investigation is undertaken.
(Largely rhetorical statement... :)
I still think Rumsfelds "$2.3 trillion missing at the Pentagon" news release buried on 9/10 (the day before 9/11...) just goes to show you how smug these sociopaths are.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xU4GdHLUHwU
It was over 3 trillion 2000-1.1T , 2001-2.3T.
$3 trillion?.... Great just great.
(You almost had to know they'd understate the number.)
The anthrax fiasco has always been high on the list of evidence of inside action and cover up. It's really quite disgusting and demonstrates the fake difference between either party that the absence of any limit to any means to justify our rising energy ends.
1946:
The United States of America grants immunity to prosecution to Shiro Ishii, head of Japan’s notorious Unit 731 Program, and other major Japanese war criminals who, according to the U.S. Justice Department, "conducted inhumane and frequently lethal pseudo-medical experiments on thousands of captured American prisoners and civilians, including live dissections”.
Compared to Ishii, the much better known Joseph Mengele, also rescued from prosecution by the U.S., is a bumbling amateur.
Experiments were conducted by Ishii and his co-conspirators on Chinese and Korean prisoners at Ping Fung in occupied northern China, included infecting people with bubonic plague (via infected rats), anthrax, typhus, typhoid (put into wells), cholera (given to children on infected rice cakes) and glanders, which causes flesh to rot and fall off.
The victims were then dissected while still alive. Ishii and his accomplices referred to their victims as "maruta" or "logs" since they were nothing but objects to be experimented with.
It is estimated that over 250,000 people died in China as result of Japanese biological warfare during World War Two. Over 30,000 died when infected rats were released after the war ended.
Ishii and the others provide the U.S. military with the results of their experiments to be used in the U.S. biological warfare program and they are then free to walk off into the sunset leaving the U.S. government to apply their results of their hard work.
There are reports that Ishii lectured and worked at the U.S. Army's biological warfare laboratories at Fort Detrick, Maryland.
Other unprosecuted mass murderers and war criminals in Unit 731 become pillars of American controlled post-war Japan. One becomes the governor of Tokyo, another becomes president of the Japanese Medical Association
1951:
FBI Director J. Edna Hoover attempts to block the formation of the Kefauver Committee which is intended to investigate organized crime in the U.S.
Hoover repeatedly tells committee members that he knows nothing about the Mafia.
In fact, Hoover and his lover, FBI Assistant Director Clyde Tolson, are long time associates and frequent guests of leading American Mafiosi and receive lucrative "tips" on fixed horse races from their gangster friends.
Heavily censored documents in Senator Kefauver's FBI file will show that Hoover collected material on the senator, clearly for the purpose of blackmail or smearing him. Hoover refuses to provide FBI protection to Committee witnesses, even after two are murdered.
Even when the Kefauver Committee determines, despite J. Edna's protests, that the Mafia does exist and is doing big business in the U.S., Hoover, predictably, does nothing.
A high-ranking Nazi scientist, Kurt Blome, whose specialty in the old country was injecting plague vaccines into concentration camp inmates, gets a chance to slip back into the old rubber gloves and have a bit more fun when he is hired to work on chemical and biological warfare for the U.S. Army Chemical Corps.
All in ze cause of freedom, of course.
They also got flocks of plague contamined fleas dropped on the chinese country in an attempt to inoculate plague, sorry, according to the US propaganda, in an attempt to inoculate against plague.
The banner of freedom, justice and truth flies high thanks to the US.
The mafia had the goods on Hoover (pics of him in homosexual acts ). So they worked together, mafia were used for the dirty work. Plausible deniability.
Fraud artist, criminal, conspicuous non-combatant and and homosexual transvestite cum FBI Director J. Edna Hoover hires cute little Clydie Tolson as an FBI agent-in-training.
Within a year, J. Edna is insisting that her new squeeze be included on White House invitation lists.
By 1930, Clydie is miraculously promoted all the way from agent-in-training to Assistant Director of the FBI, J. Edna's right hand man, as it were. Tolson will remain in that position and be the gay-bashing Hoover's lover until J. Edna's long overdue death in 1972.
Although Hoover's homosexuality is well-known in certain circles, his much propagandized and completely fictitious public persona is dead butch and, as part of the cover up and because he is a nasty old queen, Hoover persecutes homosexuals and other "sex deviates" relentlessly.
J. Edna makes rather ironic public statements about hunting for "sex deviates in government service" and orders FBI agents to "penetrate" homosexual rights groups across the U.S., collecting the names of members, photographing demonstrations and recording speeches.
The FBI's criminal spying on American citizens attempting to practice their theoretical rights of free speech and freedom of assembly will go on for at least twenty three years.
Hoover repeatedly uses homosexuality, real or fictitious, as a smear tactic against those who dare to speak out against his endless abuse of power or in order to discredit people of whom he disapproves.
In addition, the threat of exposure for real or imagined homosexuality is a powerful blackmail tool in Hoover's arsenal although doubtless there are other things in his arsenal.
Hoover will misuse his position as FBI Director for half a century to persecute, oppress and blackmail homosexuals and to blackmail heterosexuals with the threat of being smeared as homosexual.
Among Hoover's victims-to-be are Franklin Roosevelt's Undersecretary of State, Sumner Welles, who will be entrapped in an engineered homosexual liaison and forced to resign.
Hoover will also use the homosexual smear tactic in attempts to discredit Martin Luther King, Adlai Stevenson and three of Richard "Tricky Dick" Nixon's gang of criminal thugs, for whom it is hard to feel sorry.
But the darkest side to Hoover's hidden homosexuality and predilection for wearing ladies' clothing is that it lays him wide open, no pun intended, to blackmail. The Mafia, CIA Director, Nazi shyster and Rockefeller minion Allen Dulles and others are quick to take advantage.
A photograph of the Director of the Federal Bureau of Investigation performing fellatio on the Assistant Director of the FBI allegedly ends up in the hands of Mafia kingpin Meyer Lanksy.
Possession of the photo ensures complete freedom of operation for the Mafia in the United States during almost forty years of Hoover's tenure. Hoover will repeatedly stymie and block investigations into the mob and claim that the Mafia simply does not exist.
"No one who is a sex deviatewill ever be appointed to the FBI." J. Edna Hoover
Homosexual transvestite and FBI Director "I regret to say that we of the FBI
are powerless to act
in cases of oral-genital intimacy
unless it has, in some way,
obstructed interstate commerce." J. Edna Hoover
Homosexual transvestite and FBI Director
"J. Edna gave great Hoover." Clydie Tolson
J. Edna's main squeeze and Assistant FBI Director
"That old cocksucker...."Richard "Tricky Dick" Nixon
( This might have been just about the only thing Tricky Dick ever said which wasn't a lie.)
excellent. what is really fucked up is when you look at who got 'hoax anthrax', 'weak anthrax', and 'military grade weaponized anthrax'...
this is a good treatment by ryan dawson of the 9/11 > anthrax > gulf war tango... low budget, well researched, and makes you want to look away:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CGDJtyxlLmQ&feature=player_embedded
Thanks GW good read.
Ditto. The only info that I've seen on this has been from the MSM. The same ones who didn't see any missle launch off of LA.
GW - Thanks again. Great article.
While you're accepting story suggestions, What about the missle over LA? Who fired it? From where? Why the disinformation?
I still say it was the roof off a meth lab.
Still waiting on an Iranian Revolution post...just sayin ;-)
was thinking the same as I was relocating frozen water today.
Yes, fair enough. I almost posted one when the Iranian government thugs killed a protester. If you have an interesting story "angle", I'd like to hear it.
"Iranian tyrants are tyrants just like the Egyptian tyrants" isn't catchy enough :)
Well...before we leave Egypt, there is this closely held story, until today for some reason;
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2011/02/15/60minutes/main20032070.shtml?tag=exclsv
Now Iran...permission to protest?...WTF? And Barry/Hillary are about a year and a half late to lend moral support I would say;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dRKDGniyWLw&feature=player_embedded
Those gunshots being heard are people dying;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Tp7hes1CwY&feature=player_embedded
As Youtube & Google are intertwined with "others" I leave it in your capable hands to decipher our "democracy" as it stands flagged today...and always, never forget, Neda.
http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Basiji+sniper&aq=f
Edit; You asked ;-)
moral WHAT?
- Ned
Perish the thought!
Why...what about all those lovely shades of gray they are so enamored with?
Cattle futures?...I can't recall. Oh!...why here it is...right here on the nightstand, it was hiding in plain sight all this time. Silly me.
Norman?...Norman Hsu? Is that you Norman? ;-)
I often wonder what it takes to sit in a church, have your kids baptized there, even be married there, and never hear a word being said.
I guess all that is required is to vote present and say I do...LOL.
@Nmewn - The problem is, none of your interesting "angles" implicates the US Military, GW Bush, Dick Cheney, the CIA, the FBI, or BP.
People dying in order to form a representative form of government in and of itself is not news worthy of GW's drivel unless it can some way be used to impugn the USA.
Now, if you were to come up with a "false flag" angle .....
Also Nmewn I forgot to suggest that you should link to Al Jazeera at least once and accuse someone of being a shill. Those two things will give you cedibility.... facts, not so much.
;-)
I'm sure BI has never thought of this little conspiracy.
That I'm just a plant to get GW's hit count up...whoops...I'm such a butterfinger...LOL.
Iran is surrounded and in the NeoCon cross-hairs. Yes/No? We pay to have buses and mosques full of people blown up in Iran.
That fact has never been disputed, indeed US officials have repeatedly confirmed that the government has secretly encouraged and advised Jundallah as it fights the Iranian government. But Rigi insisted the US ties went well beyond encouragement.
http://news.antiwar.com/2009/08/25/top-jundallah-figure-says-us-ordered-...
http://english.aljazeera.net/news/middleeast/2010/07/201071518824599686....
Everywhere in the world authorities apply constraints during a state of emergency. Look at NOLA during Katrina.
Listening to Hillary go on about hypocrisy in your clip makes me want to barf.
Why not get on topic and tell us how you feel about the hypocrisy of the USGov hectoring the world on WMD when it looks like some elements of the US Gov have been spreading Anthrax via the US mail?
You look more and more like a government shill everyday nmewn. What's your story?
And yes, shooting any unarmed civilian from a roof top sucks. Just ask MLK or the numerous IDF victims of same.
"Iran is surrounded and in the NeoCon cross-hairs. Yes/No?"
No. Have you even looked at a map of Iran and the country's along it's borders? These are "neo-con" country's?
"We pay to have buses and mosques full of people blown up in Iran."
A friggin drug smuggling ex-Taliban is hardly a threat to MyMoodImInAjihad is it?...really?...you serious?
"Everywhere in the world authorities apply constraints during a state of emergency."
Ummm...not everywhere in the world do "authorities" shoot college kids protesting for more freedom & not being allowed to kiss in public...or wear their hair down (apparently women wearing their hair down is really hot to Iranian men & against the law, go figger)...or have a counter view to the state...you might want to rephrase that a smidge there BI, your call ;-)
"Listening to Hillary go on about hypocrisy in your clip makes me want to barf."
Damn, we agree on something...I detect a slight disturbance in the force...LOL.
"Why not get on topic and tell us how you feel about the hypocrisy of..."
I've always found it unusual when something is worded this way...I'm talking to you. But, to answer your question truthfully, I was not interested in it. At the bottom of it you will find government incompetence and coverup...same as it ever was...that's the only conspiracy I can see. There are more effective ways to kill off a population, like progressivism.
"You look more and more like a government shill everyday nmewn."
The last refuge of a scoundrel...tell me again where I ever defended government?...I'll wait.
"What's your story?"
What's yours?
"And yes, shooting any unarmed civilian from a roof top sucks."
Again we agree...one of us is going to have to reevaluate our world views.
"Just ask MLK or the numerous IDF victims of same."
Or Sirhan Sirhan (a beloved Palestinian) killing RFK or Saddam paying suicide bomber families off for them to walk into restaurants and kill innocents...I'm sure you have a point here...somewhere.
BTW Sirhan Sirhan was a christian not a muslim. I know you didn't say he was but everybody will assume that he was being from that region.
He was a lot of things...even dabbling in the occult.
He was also an anti-semite.
Ironic considering that RFK and JFK were no friends of the Jews or more accurately Zionists.
Iran IS surrounded by Neocon countries, in the sense that it borders both Iraq and Afghanistan, both invaded and occupied by the neo-con country in chief.
Iran has what...six-seven countries on it's border? You say two is enough to surround?
What ever else Afghanistan is, I would say it's not "neo-con"...whatever that pretends to be, day to day, hour to hour.
Iraq had an election (I seem to recall purple fingers) so I suppose "neo-con" means democratic?
Now, if you want to see a country surrounded with it's back to the sea look a little further west...there, on the coast of the Med ;-)
Thanks! I'll write somthing up later ...
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