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Obama To Veto H.R. 3808
As we expected, and suggested last night, Obama would not enact H.R. 3808 for fear of the populist fallout that would follow. Indeed, Dow Jones has just confirmed that Obama will "Pocket Veto" the notarization bill, eliminating the last possible roadblock for a tsunami of legal action against mortgage servicers.
From Dow Jones:
President Barack Obama won't sign into law an overlooked piece of legislation that critics say would make it easier for banks and others to process foreclosure proceedings without human signatures, a person familiar with the matter said.
Obama hasn't yet issued a veto during his presidency. In this instance, he will send the bill back to Congress using a process known as a "pocket veto."
His decision comes amid growing complaints from lawmakers that the administration and regulators haven't done enough to intervene in a scandal tied to thousands of foreclosures that critics argue were processed with improper documentation.
Ally Bank, Bank of America Corp. (BAC), and J.P. Morgan Chase & Co. (JPM) have halted foreclosures in 23 states in recent weeks to review how many documents tied to these foreclosures might have been filed improperly. A central issue is the practice of "robo" signing, when documents are signed quickly by computers or people who don't review the documents.
The bill in question passed the Senate on Sept. 27 by unanimous consent. The House passed the bill by "voice vote" in April. Many bills that aren't considered controversial pass this way, with members of both parties essentially letting it move through Congress without debate.
The bill is called the Interstate Recognition of Notarizations Act of 2009 and it was authored by Rep. Robert Aderholt (R., Ala.). A spokesman for Aderholt didn't immediately return a call for comment.
The bill was cosponsored by Reps. Bruce Braley (D., Iowa), Michael Castle (R., Del.), and Artur Davis (D., Ala.).
The bill would require state and federal courts to "recognize any notarization made by a notary public" licensed in any state. This would include electronic signatures. The bill would have been a big win for businesses who complained it was too easy for people to challenge notarized documents in court when notaries were licensed in different states.
"This legislation will help businesses around the nation by eliminating the confusion which arises when states refuse to acknowledge the integrity of documents notarized out-of-state,"
Aderholt said when the bill passed the Senate. "This bill offers a common-sense solution to a problem that is more widespread than is generally recognized."It is unclear how the bill might have affected the current foreclosure scandal, but liberal groups have insisted in recent days that Obama veto it. A spokesman for Aderholt said: "Contrary to some blogs and reports, there is absolutely no connection whatsoever between Congressman Aderholt's legislation and the recent foreclosure documentation problems."
Ohio Secretary of State Jennifer Brunner said Tuesday if the bill became law it would make it harder for consumers to challenge foreclosures.
The bill raised difficult policy decisions for government officials. Some argue it should be easier for banks and others to process documents electronically to help reduce the backlog of foreclosures and help the housing market. But there have also been questions about the loan-servicing and foreclosure-processing industry, which is loosely regulated and now faces accusations of fraud.
h/t London Dude Trader
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One pocket has the veto while the other pocket holds the checkbook he'll be writing a fat check to the banks with. It's all just fiat anyway. QE2 will be officially named the "Homeowners Protection and Foreclosure Act" and $1 trillion will again go to the banks.
Get ready. We're on the threshold of the greatest debt collapse ever seen in the long history of debt. $8 trillion in mortgage debt is set to evaporate into a cloud of repudiation. After that, I have no idea what happens. The mind boggles.
I read all the creepy news and then go out and buy some more canned food. Last night was ten 15 ounce cans of abalone for $2.99 each. The world can fall into a ditch and I will certainly eat well.
I don't think it is physically possible to lay up enough canned foods against the event of the world falling into a ditch. But I get it -- it feels better to have done something, even if it is just a token.
FishGoneBad laying up abalone though -- I just don't see how that can ever work out ;)
Yep and it will all be wrapped up nice in pretty in accounting rules. I went through the mechanics of it down below in the thread.
Repeat after me... After the election.
The crap the lame ducks will do will make Blago blush. The ever so slightly revised bill will then be signed, camouflaged by the shit storm..., but you know the rest.
++
The absolutely apauling thing about the bill was the basic process. bank procedure violates the law. Rather than change procedure to conform to the law bank gets law changed. Think about that. It was cheaper and easier to change the law than to change procedure. How cheap and easy is that?
THE LAWS DON'T APPLY TO BANKSTERS. NOW GET BACK TO WORK!!!
Moderator, major glitch, please delete multi-post-gasm.
wow. impressive. lol..
See what happens when ya stop lovin' Lucy like ya used to
Flash post...HFP algo going nuts
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I think you made your point!
Grab me quck--the room's spinning!
Damn, that's either an alien abduction or stuxnet.
WOW JM, 80 or so junks! You beat my record!
The Party of NO except this????? Seriously, there needs to be a lot more digging into this one.
The entire gridlocked US Congress passes this on a unanimous voice vote.
No, the pocket veto should not be allowed to erase this event; what was the leadership of both parties being told, and telling their troops?
Don't let Obama erase the tape!
The stench, its enormousness groweth by the hour....maybe we need to get a Nader/Green Party up to meet the Tea Party on the steps of the Capitol and do a little home cookin. But, who would finance such an enormous undertaking? On the left I mean. The right's taken care of.
You had me after the first post.
A new Zero Hedge world record of 45 duplicate posts.
Bravo. Is that an itchy trigger finger or are you just happy to see me?
Jim in MN=RoboPosting
Clearly a mistake was made. If we are completely intolerant of mistakes, how did we end up living in this shitball society we find ourselves in? I even make a little joke about it below.
So there is a tolerant bone in that weird body! Congrats.
I preferred the prolapsed colon.
He's a HFP high frequency poster...they have those flash glitches that occur occasionally.
Sombitch. Figure out the system fella.
Makes me want to go reply to them all with "." just so they can't be edited!
That's a raccoon for ya. What they can't eat or turn into a toy, they break. Among my favorite animals.
I put squirrel food out for a raccoon that frequents our cottonwood tree. Watching that little critter eat is entertainment of the finest order!
Not so nice sometimes...
Shotgun posting is THE NEW ALL-CAPS.
Thanks Jim Thanks Jim Thanks Jim Thanks Jim Thanks Jim Thanks Jim etc. etc.
Thanks Jim.
This will be back slightly altered for his signature after the elections.
Credit the internet community for exposing this. Our congress and senate work for the banks. I will not capitalize the names out of disrespect.
VOTE OUT ALL INCUMBENTS UNTIL WE HAVE LAWS THAT FORBID LOBBYING AND CORPORATE POLITICAL CONTRIBUTIONS FROM ANY SOURCE !!!!!!
THIS WILL TAKE 4 OR 5 ELECTION CYCLES TO ACCOMPLISH. WE ARE TALKING 10 YEARS SO STAY VIGILANT IF YOU WANT A COUNTRY THAT IS FIT TO LIVE IN.
Wow, ok I don't think I can get past the duplicates...but I get that you obviously needed to get a message through.
I will say I find it hilarious as someone noted above. That they passed a bill with ease regarding the validity of legal documents (notarizing) with no vote record and it gets vetoed with no signature. The irony is quite amazing...
Between this and Lou Dobbs employing undocumented workers to do his landscaping and take care of his million dollar horses I am not sure which one is better...(and no I am not advocating The Nation...that's just where I saw this article...)
http://www.thenation.com/article/155209/lou-dobbs-american-hypocrite
Didn't Lou Dobbs come back from the dead? I thought the rock rolled away from the entrance of his grave.
+45
Could you repeat that please slowly so I can understand
YOU WORK FOR CONGRESS. CONGRESS DOES NOT WORK FOR YOU!!!
YOU WORK FOR CONGRESS. CONGRESS DOES NOT WORK FOR YOU!!!
ROBO-signing gone mad.
Ahh yes, beautiful accounting gimmick, see now that the road is clearing to start litigation and tie up foreclosures the banks can immediately make an ASC 450 (prior FAS 5) adjustment calculation to project contingent losses and book those against income immediately to justify TARP 2. As soon as they get paid, legislation will come out to bypass the legality issue of the foreclosures and the contingent losses will be updated in the following quarter and the banks will never actually suffer a loss. I wish I was this damn smart!
Also the timing is fantastic, Q3 is over, bank bonuses are being accrued as we speak and will be paid out before Q4 ends which is when they will book the contingent loss allowing the lame duck end of year congressional session to pass TARP2 and the remaining incumbents and new representatives to blame the lame ducks for pushing it through.....pure fucking genius.
You are so 100% correct I could kill you.
Sorry. It just makes me really pissy. Maybe the Chinese will do us a favor and invade and save our sacred democracy before it is forever gone.
Oh you lovely south bay Cougar, I though you knew the Chinese military is much more constrained by the coolies and those that write their checks than ours is...
And still kicking is kickin' it today with this right on the money observation.
Pure evil. I think I am going to hell for just reading it. Which means you are probably right on - or at least a stone's throw from the direction we are heading with this one.
The fact that I can think that way makes me pretty sure I'm destined for the firey pits, I just assumed that would be after I die not actually here on this earth, looks like I was wrong again.
On to the next non-news story...
So Obama DOESN'T want notarizations to be recognized across all 57 states.
Way to focus in on the big picture Mr. Merc Wannabe
Give the President kudos to this. Maybe, he is probably just posturing before elections, but at least he did the right thing this time. I would rather that he do the right thing and win votes than do the wrong thing and somehow bury the issue with his oratory skills.
"Maybe, he is probably just posturing before elections ?"
He is. Obama is an OWNED COMMODITY
That's the point I made 45 post ago. We only
get the right thing done every 2 and 4 years.
All these people should rot in Hell!!!!!!!!!
Well, there is a lot of frustration and disgust about the bailout. Make no mistake about it, and both democrats and GOP are going to pay at the polls. Winning against this entrenched rot and fat cat bankers of the system is going to take time.
People here want him to just wake up one day and declare, enough is enough.* all assets are henceforth marked to market * all theives are jailed * no bailouts ever and it goes into the constitituion * a dollar is lent if it is backed by a dollar of capital going forward. But it is naive to expect that to happen overnight but at least we must celebrate small victories.
Agreed.
4 to 5 general election cycles or 10 years until these pieces of filth understand that lobbying and corporate political contributions (from all sources, properly disclosed under penalty of 20 fucking years in prison for failure to do so) is what it will take to make this country a fit place to live and raise a family again.
I just wish we had that long :(
I don't believe there is a solution via the system. The system has to fail first. Something better could arise from the ashes. Something even worse could arise as well. But there is no possibility of change until after epic fail.
Who is "him"? If you mean Obama then you are allowing him to be judge, jury, and titular executioner. Our system doesn't work that way. If he were to make such proclamations can you imagine the outrage? Even a policy position on his part would be met with angry mobs with torches and pitchforks -- as would be appropriate. It's this thinking that He can fix anything and is to blame for everything. One man can do a lot of good or evil in the position of President but one would be a fool to attempt a complete governmental takeover.
That is assuming you meant "him" to be Obama, or any other person occupying the office.
Lets circle back once we see the actual pocket veto shall we?
Is that tomorrow? Day 10? Congress officially adjourns then...this seems like a tight squeeze.
November 3rd sounds about right.
A quick lesson for everyone...only hit the "Save" button once...
Is congress officially adjourned? Because if it isn't...Saturday it automatically becomes law. Pocket veto's only work when congress is officially adjourned.
Congress was adjourned, like, last Thursday or Friday. We're safe, for now.
Official adjournment is 8 October...
On Sept. 29 the House of Representatives voted to adjourn and will leave town after finishing up some last-minute business. The news thought they would be done on the night of the 29th. Is the House still in session?
Barack Obama walks into the White House and is confronted by Michelle.
Barack: Hi, what's up?
Michelle: Ah, you tell me. I can see what's up (as she stares at his crotch).
Barack: Oh, that.
Michelle: Is that a rocket in your pocket or are you happy to see me?
Barack: Actually, I've got a veto in my pocket.
Michelle: Oh, that damn pocket veto!
She's much more interested in his lingual ability anyways.
Cunning.
All technicalities aside and considered, if this becomes law there needs to be mass protests nationwide. Those can be risky because large crowds are unpredictable.
What's wrong with this bill? I think notarizations should be valid across state boundaries. All this veto does is give lawyers an incentive to sue, non-paying mortgage holders a gift of delay in foreclosure and an additional cost to the taxpayers because due process is being held up on a technicality. Why do we have to make things harder?
Real notarizations SHOULD be legal across state boundaries. That means nothing when it comes to these fraudulent factory notarizations of fictional documentation.
Here's some light reading:
http://bit.ly/coM8mK
As I've said before:
People, just how MANY times do you have to see shit like this before you realize that the ENTIRE governing structure of this country is bought and paid for?
And this "pocket veto" wasn't a "reaction" to "populist" pressure - the banksters actually got OUTBID on this one by an even sleazier group - the Professional Plaintiff's Bar.
You don't have to be a genius to realize that this entire mortgage/foreclosure processing mess will fully employ the entire legal profession of the U.S. for a generation or more.
How I know this - one of our principal investors in DKM is a very succesful (and hugely wealthy) retired RE litigator, who is being drafted to come back out of retirement to participate. Right now, he is preparing to recommission his law practice as he already has clients lined up outside the door.
He said the pressure to jump back in (and the money) was too much to resist.
KrvtKpt. laughing swordfish
DKM Trading
It's a loooong way down this particular rabbit hole.
We'll know if this is anything if Biden gets sent to Scranton to crank up the populism in the name of supporting PA-10
So with MBS, somehow they figure out how to send the payer's mortgage payment to someone, so why is that up to four entities, in some cases, think they own a house and are trying to foreclose on it. Whoever is getting the money should have one entity representing their interests, and it should be that entity that is trying to foreclose, they might not have proper title, but at least they are the ones losing money when no one pays on debt and can at least attempt to claim the asset, the house, securing it.
So when they sliced and diced mortgages, they had to come up with some means to slice and dice the income stream from the mortgage payments, one would think that would be fairly well-recorded. And even tho the income streams went to diverse places, would not just one be assigned to each mortgage. Now the entity managing the mortgage may not have right to foreclose given record-keeping mess, but they should still know who would have gotten the loan payments when they were being made or proceeds from foreclosure if it is lucky enough to make it thru courts.
But in some cases, four entities think the asset, the house is theirs. This makes me think that given the absolute sausage they made of these tranches of rotten mortgages they picked up off the butchers floor provided easy pickings for some folks to "create" mortgages from thin air and sell them twice, three times, four times.
Were these four parties trying to foreclose previously each getting a little bit of money from the mortgage, or did three of them never see any loan payments. They had to track the loan payments and send them to right people, so why can't the track the claimed right to the house?
I am the buyer. You loaned me the money. RR is the bank middleman, collecting money from me and sending it to you. This goes on for ten years. You love your income stream. Suddenly, I am unemployed and can't pay my mortgage. RR stops sending you money. After 6 months of this, you decide to foreclose on me. In the process of this foreclosure action you discover that RR was so busy ten years ago that he forgot to record the sale and transfer the mortgage into your name. The bottom line is that you have a legal claim to nothing, even though you have been receiving a payment stream for ten years.
Would you be upset in such a situation? Would you seek legal satisfaction in such a situation? RR knew who you were. He knew where you were (since you were receiving payments from him). Hopefully you see that locating the "owner" of the mortage is not the problem here.
This scenario is the case in some foreclosure situations. The foreclosure moratorium is designed to give the parties involved time to figure out just how many mortgages this scenario applies to. It will take time, personnel, lawyers, and money to work through all mortgages to see if this scenario applies.
Only the owner of the mortgage, or his agent, can foreclose. When there is no legal proof of who the owner is (or when there is no legal proof that you indeed are the owner, even though you have been receiving payments), foreclosure cannot be initiated. This is not about squatters (they are only a consequence of the problem). This is about protection of property rights.
Hmmm, funny Richard how you shmoozed right past this bit -
... easy pickings for some folks to "create" mortgages from thin air and sell them twice, three times, four times.
This undoubtedly is what went on. There's a similar problem in equity markets with the irreconcilable FTDs.
There is no fix. Only collapse and start over.
Bringin It - I was responding specifically to the question posed in the last sentence of the post directly above mine. I was not attempting to address all of the many parts to this issue.
You are right. Anything called The Interstate Recognition of Notarizations Act was intended from the outset to slip under 7 kinds of radar. If they had intended this to get any attention they would have instead called it The Defense of Mortgage Title Act and touted at as homeowner relief.
So, they got caught this time. Fuckers. They'll try again in about 6 weeks with The Playground Maintenance Consolidation Act.
I said he'd sign this one due to pressure from banks -- sign! sign! sign! Contrarian indicator.
After the media picked up on the story today from some trouble making site called ZH, Malkin's site was calling for pitchforks and it was too much for 'Bamster
A pocket veto is a veto but a pussy version of it.
Instead of standing for something with a veto and forcing the House to re-examine the legislation, he's going to pocket veto it ending discussion.
Then after November it will reappear in another form...
Notary Veto, Bitchez!
This is probably covered in the comments, but he will not be "pocket vetoing" it, but rather sending it back to the House as a full-on veto. Not "cowardly" at all, as it pushes it back to this worthless Congress to get them to actually look at it this time.
I see that the Republicans have already decided this is just another example of "anti-business" Obama. Of course, they're welcome to go piss up a pole.
Simple answer:
If your In, your OUT, repeat as necessary every Election
.
Let me try this again:
Please read:
http://www.thedailybell.com/1425/IMF-Article-Predicts-New-World-Order.html
I read it, and I thank you for posting it Ein Stein.
thought I'd make my way through the thread before commenting, in case the subject was being discussed - having arrived "here" I realise there's little point, beyond thanking you again.
best wishes.
I can only hope the voters of Vermont send the scumbag senator to harvest maple syrup were we may get luck and he will be eaten by a rare carnivorous moose.
You never know, it could happen
I was hoping that Osatan would have vetoed it. You know, get the ball rolling towards the inevitable a bit faster.
The COCK-SLOBBING PUSSIES in the House and Senate (INCLUDING THE REPUBLICANS) passed this save-the-banks-again-with-my-tax-dollars bill by VOICE vote.
Ergo NO RECORDS ON HOW THEY VOTED on this.
http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bill.xpd?bill=h111-3808
Apr 27, 2010: This bill passed in the House of Representatives by voice vote. A record of each representative’s position was not kept.
Sep 27, 2010: This bill passed in the Senate by Unanimous Consent. A record of each senator’s position was not kept.