This page has been archived and commenting is disabled.

Ohio AG Cordray To Sue GMAC Mortgage And Ally Financial, May Sue Chase And BofA

Tyler Durden's picture




 

06Oct10 RTRS-OHIO AG CORDRAY SAYS TO SUE GMAC MORTGAGE AND ALLY FINANCIAL
06Oct10 RTRS-OHIO AG CORDRAY SAYS THERE MAY BE MORE LAWSUITS
06Oct10 RTRS-OHIO AG CORDRAY SAYS SUIT ALLEGES GMAC'S ACTIONS MAY VIOLATE OHIO'S CONSUMER LAWS BY USING FALSE AFFADAVITS AND OTHER DOCUMENTS

06Oct10 RTRS-OHIO AG CORDRAY SAYS ASKING FOR PRELIMINARY INJUNCTION AGAINST FORECLOSURES
06Oct10 RTRS-OHIO AG CORDRAY SAYS SENT LETTERS TO CHASE, BANK OF AMERICA, WELLS FARGO, AND CITI
06Oct10 RTRS-OHIO AG CORDRAY SAYS GROUNDS TO BELIEVE THAT CHASE AND BANK OF AMERICA ALSO DID "ROBO-SIGNING"
06Oct10 RTRS-OHIO AG CORDRAY SAYS ASKING FOR MEETINGS WITH CITIBANK

Can you spell billions in "one time" perpetually recurring legal fees? What were those EPS once again?

 

- advertisements -

Comment viewing options

Select your preferred way to display the comments and click "Save settings" to activate your changes.
Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:01 | 630213 Spalding_Smailes
Spalding_Smailes's picture

Lawsuit Bitchez!

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:15 | 630256 Fish Gone Bad
Fish Gone Bad's picture

+1!

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:16 | 630262 Cognitive Dissonance
Cognitive Dissonance's picture

Gray, soon to be black, swan?

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:36 | 630341 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

Cooked goose more like. And just in time for fall harvest festivals!

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:37 | 630348 carbonmutant
carbonmutant's picture

You sound European... In Ameria we do Turkeys... :)

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:46 | 630382 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

Well we're dealing with real turkeys here, so it all works.

I live in the Bay Area, California. Therefore I am automatically French. It's something in the water, changes your DNA or something. I'm still adjusting.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:48 | 630398 carbonmutant
carbonmutant's picture

Damn, you're local. I though I recognized the behaviour pattern.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:51 | 630409 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

Really? Dammit, if it's that obvious then it means I need to increase my meds.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:59 | 630438 carbonmutant
carbonmutant's picture

LOL, I do note that Arnie's says it's okay grow your own...

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 17:32 | 630521 downrodeo
downrodeo's picture

woah,

i just lost my balance.

it seems that the governator and i agree about something

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 19:12 | 630718 Spalding_Smailes
Spalding_Smailes's picture

Video            AG~Cordray on bloomberg t.v...

http://www.bloomberg.com/video/63535930/

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 19:54 | 630809 Careless Whisper
Careless Whisper's picture

ooooooooooooohhh, a scary lawsuit. i bet those bankers are shakin' in their john lobb oxfords.

hey, all you over paid district attorneys --- how about criminal charges when someone breaks the law? or are you on the take too?

http://us.estore.johnlobb.com/philip-ii-32.html

 

 

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:55 | 630422 weld1
weld1's picture

there is a bill already passed the senate i think ...one of those corrupt bodies...anyhow it is on obama's desk waiting to b signed that would allow documents to b legally notorized by electronic means...this is the first step to help these banksters get on with their stealing

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 17:09 | 630459 Bob
Bob's picture

Presenting the whole business as no more than "robo-signing" allows the authorities to appear to do something meaningful.  But look at this clown in Ohio--he's sending letters and scheduling sit-downs.  What a joke. 

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 17:39 | 630535 ghostfaceinvestah
ghostfaceinvestah's picture

The bill would have to amend the Constitution because these issues fall under State law.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:01 | 630214 NOTW777
NOTW777's picture

just wait for the civil class actions to start.  obama can expect huge campaign cont. from the trial attys for 2012

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:35 | 630340 carbonmutant
carbonmutant's picture

Actually, the banks need to protect themselves from the filing of Discovery procedures on all prior foreclosures...

Because the unwind could be as bad as everything TARP tried to prevent.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:39 | 630354 NOTW777
NOTW777's picture

i'm sure they can gum things up in discovery. delay, delay, sorry judge, we are looking for them.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:02 | 630215 NOTW777
NOTW777's picture

explain to me again why GM or GMAC still exist.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:08 | 630234 reading
reading's picture

Because we paid for them to...

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:09 | 630237 snowball777
snowball777's picture

because if we don't save them, the economy will be destr...oh...shit.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:23 | 630240 Clark_Griswold ...
Clark_Griswold Hedge Mnger's picture

Because the Bond holders were so kind and generous and decided to just give up their legal rights as a gesture of good will, share the wealth as it were....

                   ... Yes We Can

                     ... Yes You Will

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:39 | 630356 NOTW777
NOTW777's picture

excellent clark

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:48 | 630403 rebeltraders
rebeltraders's picture

+1

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:17 | 630267 Cognitive Dissonance
Cognitive Dissonance's picture

explain to me again why GM or GMAC still exist.

Corvette.

Um mm.......on second thought, never mind.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 17:21 | 630495 class of 68
class of 68's picture

CD, I have a 67 coupe elkhardt blue, black leather interior with head-rests.

327-350hp 4 speed. The car as art.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 19:47 | 630589 Cognitive Dissonance
Cognitive Dissonance's picture

I also thought of the Vette from my much younger years. Then I rethought.

So your Vette's only 43 years old. I think we're responding to someone above who's talking about the GM and GMAC of today.

Got anything newer? :>)

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 19:59 | 630777 kathy.chamberli...
kathy.chamberlin@gmail.com's picture

67 were the next best coolest vette's after the 65. the side grill design, three, made the 65 vette aesthetics the sexiest. just my opinion. but your cool cause you still have it. of course i sold mine back in the eighties. i got pictures of my vette when i sanded it down to get an in house paint job. but can't post them. i took a lot of time to cover the windshields and wheels. a lot of work that fiberglass.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 19:58 | 630778 kathy.chamberli...
kathy.chamberlin@gmail.com's picture

double

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:22 | 630283 Rodent Freikorps
Rodent Freikorps's picture

All dictators want their very own car company. It is a status thing.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:27 | 630299 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

That would be funny shit if it wasn't true. I want out now ...

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:37 | 630349 NOTW777
NOTW777's picture

LOL. +100

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:47 | 630386 Mitchman
Mitchman's picture

Your tax dollars at work!

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:05 | 630221 centerline
centerline's picture

Shields are weakening.  Hull breach imminent.  Evasive manuevers!  lololololol

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:32 | 630327 Clark_Griswold ...
Clark_Griswold Hedge Mnger's picture

Mr. Scott, I need more money,

   Mr. Spock, enough with the Vulcan grip already

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:06 | 630223 themosmitsos
themosmitsos's picture

GUARANTEE you the *PLAINTIFF'S* attorneys are in on this, as NOTHING they'd like more than hundreds of thousands of foreclosure cases, than to have to FIGHT to try eaaaach and every one of them!

ps: Obama's a fucking scumbag laywer

right?

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 17:14 | 630470 Lucky Guesst
Lucky Guesst's picture

Eerrr kinda. Michelle Obama's licence to practice law was put on COURT ORDERED INACTIVE STATUS in order to avoid a hearing to have her disbarred for insurance fraud. The firm she worked for was Sidley Austin. Bill Ayers wife, Bernardine Dohrn worked at Sidley Austin too but her criminal record prevented her from being admitted to either the New York or Illinois bar..... I believe Michelle's next job was the assistant to Chicago's Mayor Daley! No joke.

 

 

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 17:25 | 630502 Lucky Guesst
Lucky Guesst's picture

Next she was founding Executive Director at Public Allies in Chicago. President Clinton named Public Allies a model for national service and First Lady Hilary Clinton hosted a Rose Garden reception for Public Allies at the White House.

Gee, I wonder why Rahm picked Chicago?

http://www.publicallies.org/site/c.liKUL3PNLvF/b.3960231/

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 18:38 | 630648 pyite
pyite's picture

> NOTHING they'd like more than hundreds of thousands of foreclosure cases

In Kentucky it is looking like a big RICO class action suit.  More to follow of course.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:08 | 630231 Clark_Griswold ...
Clark_Griswold Hedge Mnger's picture

Just in time for budget shortfalls.

<cough- shakedown- cough cough>

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:14 | 630249 economessed
economessed's picture

<cough:::wheeeze:::::cough>  ...tobacco settlement deja vu.  Use 1st year settlement income to fund some corner of the budget, and then sell off the entire settlement annuity to balance the budget in year 2, just in time for a new administration to arrive in year 3. 

Rinse and repeat, female dogs.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:19 | 630270 Clark_Griswold ...
Clark_Griswold Hedge Mnger's picture

year 4: fuck it all up again X 4

Year 5: see year 4 and magnify....

continue until further notice.

 

AMEN

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:29 | 630307 Dr. No
Dr. No's picture

I have posted this before.  I will even speculate further:  The progressives will condem foreclosures and turn them into low income hosuing.  It will be a save america type policy.  May even get some cute acronym.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:48 | 630401 mrcmmm
mrcmmm's picture

I disagree.  If anything, the lobbying power of the lenders will result in a political "solution" attempting to retroactively validate all of the fraudulent practices.  The alternative is a tidal wave of litigation from all sides that will cause the epic fail that TARP, etc. attempted to prevent.  It is not just lawyers for homeowners seeking to escape foreclosure.  It's the state pension funds that invested in the RMBS that, if they had any value left before, now will have none.  And it's the state tax authorities and IRS who will sue the trusts underlying the RMBS because the failure to properly convey the loans into the trusts blows up their tax exempt status.  I think this is just like the initial subprime meltdown, in that first TPTB kept repeating that it was "contained" and "not a large problem," and day after day they were proved more and more wrong.  This is starting out with exactly the same lingo.  Which means in another year or two we will all be looking back and going, "Holy crap.....how did we not see this coming?"

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 17:00 | 630440 Dr. No
Dr. No's picture

You bring up good point that power of banks and pension funds lobbying power and I see a political solution as well.  My opinion is we will see condeming of foreclosed properties with a negotiated price (agreed to with note holder).  Condeming is not free and some federal program will be instituted to funnel cash to cities with large foreclosure inventory (and low income voting district).  This cash will buy the foreclosed houses and they will then be turned into gov housing.  The banks will be compensated and able to wash their hands of the whole thing.  Most likely the cash will be raised by promoting a TARP tax on the banks and this money will be used to buy the properties.  IF not a tarp tax, perhaps politicos will say TARP made money, lets use it for the new repurchase program.  Worked for the FED.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 17:15 | 630478 economessed
economessed's picture

mrcmmm, is it a stretch then to conclude it would also be advantageous to pass legislation legalizing all non-violent crime that has taken place?  After all, the costs to our legal system, (courts, police, lawyers, penitentiaries, etc.) are staggering, and we can hardly afford to investigate, arrest, adjudicate, incarcerate and rehabilitate non-violent offenders any more.  Besides, non-violent crime is so widespread, it's not like we can actually hold people accountable for what they've done.  Legalization is a true solution to past criminal consequences.  Forgive and forget.  Life goes on.

<gritty sarc>

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 17:20 | 630492 economessed
economessed's picture

mrcmmm,  I guess what you're observing/expecting is that we abandon the rule of law out of convenience, no?

That's the termination of democracy as we knew it.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 19:32 | 630749 unum mountaineer
unum mountaineer's picture

democracy...good one

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 20:05 | 630827 kathy.chamberli...
kathy.chamberlin@gmail.com's picture

Liberty, bitchez.

GOT coin?

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 18:11 | 630592 Citxmech
Citxmech's picture

Witness the amnesty laws in some places for violent offences where dictators have been ousted. 

Whenever there is a legitimate danger that the courts may become gridlocked because of a massive wave of complex litigation, you could see accomodating legislation passed to "solve" the problem. 

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 17:03 | 630430 hedgeless_horseman
hedgeless_horseman's picture

The progressives will condem foreclosures and turn them into low income hosuing. 

Instead of poor majority paying mortgages to banks the rich minority pay taxes to government which then pays a portion to the banks. 

OPP for votes.  Nothing new here.

 

 

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:24 | 630291 Rodent Freikorps
Rodent Freikorps's picture

Thanks for bringing me back to reality. I had a brief flash of hope some courts where not corrupt. Silly of me, really.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:14 | 630233 Bob
Bob's picture

This robo-signing is a pretty lame theory to be going on (it invites slap on wrist and do over, imo).  Not that it shouldn't be pursued, of course. 

Check this out for how to do one right--it should result in serious damage beyond a mere moratorium:

http://stopforeclosurefraud.com/2010/05/10/tennessee-vs-mers-mortgage-el...

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:17 | 630264 Rusty Shorts
Rusty Shorts's picture

Thanks for the link Bob

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 17:30 | 630515 MsCreant
MsCreant's picture

Bob,

Wow. That is so cool. Thanks for posting. [Clicks heels, skips happily away down the street].

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 17:57 | 630574 Bob
Bob's picture

Hey, remember me when . . .

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:11 | 630243 JimRogers
JimRogers's picture

FAZ4LIFE Bitchez!!

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:15 | 630258 Bob
Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:17 | 630263 John McCloy
John McCloy's picture

Yup in prepared to go down with that ship that is how confident I am in the system collapsing.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:20 | 630277 Cognitive Dissonance
Cognitive Dissonance's picture

Of course, the Ad Sense ad placement algos have now placed Ally ads here on this thread.

The Internet advertising Gods really do have a wonderful sense of humor.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:46 | 630387 Gene Parmesan
Gene Parmesan's picture

I think the TV gods do as well. I was sitting in the cafeteria this afternoon staring at some financial piece (of crap) CNN was running on the TV when their full screen graphic froze. The headline that was there was "Things That Are Right With the Economy" but it was just blank space below. Some picture was stuck trying to exit stage right, but there was nothing but black pixels where they had intended to parade out some rainbow/unicorn nonsense. Priceless.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 17:59 | 630572 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

They say God abandoned the world. It's not true. God became an engineer and has been quietly fucking with things ever since. Watch what she does with banking. Gonna unmake that entire thing, she is. That girl never could abide abstraction-for-the-sake-of-being-cute. And abstract greed even less.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 21:22 | 630967 thefatasswilly
thefatasswilly's picture

Which God are you talking about? Jehovah, or Satan?

Thu, 10/07/2010 - 01:28 | 631408 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

What? Those aren't the same diety? Man, who knew.

I'm talking about Black Tara. It takes a lot of "get thee down" to unmake the world.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:19 | 630269 JLee2027
JLee2027's picture

 

"alleges may violate" is not very strong language from a state AG.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:26 | 630298 bob_dabolina
bob_dabolina's picture

"I'm gona chop off their pinkys, stick it up their ass pull it out, and shove it down their throat"

Would that be better?

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:31 | 630319 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

Much worse actually. If that were the full and entire penalty there would be bankers lined up around the block eager to confess and take their medicine just as described, before you changed your mind and say decided to toss their candy asses in jail. I'm not even kidding. Losing a finger and being physically violated with it would be a cakewalk for the greedy.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 17:33 | 630522 MsCreant
MsCreant's picture

They might like it coug, they might really like it. 

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 18:03 | 630549 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

They might go back to the end of the line for another. Ten fingers, after all. And if there were real money in it, they'd bring Grandma and some orphans.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:19 | 630274 deadparrot
deadparrot's picture

Talk about blood in the water. This is bigger than the big tobacco litigation.

I still remember the day I resigned from Countrywide and told my koolaid-drinking boss that in a year or two, the only one who will be making money in real estate will be lawyers.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:24 | 630279 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

Maybe the States have stumbled on a new revenue stream. This should be really interesting.

And if they can do it with the Financials, not much to stop them going after all those other scofflaws who've been protected to now by money and influence.

Winding down the long oligarch's all-U-can-pilfer buffet and suddenly all your influence don't amount to shit broth'a. Sucks to be stuck on the inside with your head still in the trough when the wheels finally came of, didn't it? Now trot off and join the rest of the piggies waiting for the merciful knife.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:31 | 630324 JLee2027
JLee2027's picture

The states will never see this money. Exxon held up things for decades after the oil spill in Alaska. That's what lawyers can do. By that time, the banks will be gone, and we'll have a new currency - old debts will be erased.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:40 | 630358 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

They don't ever have to see it. They can spend it in advance. At the very least several layers of government have a new justification for existing when budgets are in the red.

We have companies whose sole purpose is to own patents, and whose only revenue stream is ongoing litigation or the threat of it. Now take that to the sovereign level and you get the picture.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:21 | 630280 Fish Gone Bad
Fish Gone Bad's picture

This is really just too funny.  If bank is going after a home that is not in default, then that is actually a crime.  If the bank is going after a home that is in default, but is not theirs, that is still called theft, just from another bank.

 

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:28 | 630305 Wynn
Wynn's picture

Our so called leaders have abandoned the rule of law because they are afraid.
As the cowards have now taken the low road, no one is safe.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:33 | 630330 Cognitive Dissonance
Cognitive Dissonance's picture

I agree.

They never ever took the high road. Their strategy is to feed off those of us who try to remain on the high road and not swim with the sharks.

Yum, fresh meat swimming up there. That's it in a nut shell. They have one rule.

(1). There are no rules.

We have many rules, including respect others who respect the rules. So all they need to do is pretend to follow the rules and we're just chum in the water to them.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:30 | 630311 carbonmutant
carbonmutant's picture

If you were a bank what would you be lobbying for now?

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:31 | 630320 svendthrift
svendthrift's picture

The FBI to find a nice group of pissed off whites in Montana to infiltrate and encourage.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:32 | 630328 Rodent Freikorps
Rodent Freikorps's picture

Debtor's prisons.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:48 | 630399 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

Winner

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:35 | 630339 Spalding_Smailes
Spalding_Smailes's picture

A Pardon.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 17:14 | 630471 carbonmutant
carbonmutant's picture

I would think that one of the things they would be lobbying for would be the right to seize property prior to getting court approval, as long as that approval was granted within say 30 days...

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 17:48 | 630553 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

See, that's where debtor's prisons come back into the picture -- you'd need a place to quickly park all the homeowners.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 18:40 | 630633 carbonmutant
carbonmutant's picture

Well I realize that may have been a bit tactical and one needs to plan for the larger picture...

It appears that FEMA and Hailburton have a plan...

http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bill=h111-645

http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/february2006/010206detentioncamps.h...

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:37 | 630313 svendthrift
svendthrift's picture

Obama will screw us on this somehow. The big boys will win.

 

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:49 | 630377 NOTW777
NOTW777's picture

for sure.  he already pumped billions of tax dollars into GM.  do you like those ally commercials with the pedohile and obama warranties? the unions do.

now many of his supporters can live in their homes for free and wait for a settlement pay-out indirectly funded with more tax dollars.

obtain liar loan from fraud savings and loan.  borrower defaults on loan. bank sells and securitizes the sh*t loan over and over.  ben willingly helps them avoid any accounting and rewards them with cash infusion and free $ so them can play POMO and show up at auctions.  now, they will sue the bank and guess who will pay.  all the fraudsters win.  taxpayer and country lose.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:53 | 630417 svendthrift
svendthrift's picture

Yes. It seems to be going smashingly well for them now. Though I wonder. It will end. When will it end? How will it end? What will come next? How bad will life get in this country? Obviously what is going on can't go on for ever.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 20:18 | 630853 kathy.chamberli...
kathy.chamberlin@gmail.com's picture

do you like those ally commercials with the pedophile.

yeah, what is up with using all the very young children as the prayed upon. never thought of this until your inclusion of pedophile in association with Ally bank. subliminal of some sorts. these are truly sick twisted creators of marketing. jeeze drawn in by young children using that dick gay homo pedophiliac small man in those commercials. sick society selling a bank offering almost ø interest, using young attractive children, boys and girls. ZH is good, real good.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 20:24 | 630862 kathy.chamberli...
kathy.chamberlin@gmail.com's picture

double old slow computer

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:37 | 630346 treemagnet
treemagnet's picture

Doesn't Wells Fargo get to come to the party?

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:43 | 630366 Spalding_Smailes
Spalding_Smailes's picture

First Moody, now its Wells Fargo, and his bail out of GS. I think its safe to say Buffett is a piece of fucking garbage.

Thu, 10/07/2010 - 00:03 | 631298 free
free's picture

 

Good question.  Wells Fargo, CitiMortgage, HSBC (and one other I do not recall) are all probably trying to get their foreclosures through as fast as they can - while their competators are down - and before a moratorium shuts them all down.

Oh, wait, CitiMortgage is owned by the .gov - how is that going to work out?

 

 

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:38 | 630352 ZackAttack
ZackAttack's picture

The Three Laws of Robo-signing

  1. A robo-signer may not injure a banker or, through inaction, allow a banker to come to harm.
  2. A robo-signer must obey any orders given to it by bankers, except where such orders would conflict with the First Law.
  3. A robo-signer must protect its own existence as long as such protection does not conflict with the First or Second Law.
Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:46 | 630381 Spalding_Smailes
Spalding_Smailes's picture

Wait till they spin the yarn that this was all lazy lower level schmucks. Just a few missing papers, nothing to see here ...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rSjK2Oqrgic

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:50 | 630404 Bob
Bob's picture

Problem with going at the problem as "robo-signing"  is that it results in maybe a few million in fines, some fired notaries and frantic "in-service" refresher trainings, a few low-mid management heads rolling and . . . that's about it. 

Fight the little lies like your life depends upon it . . . while the BIG lies go untouched. 

Pansy ass AG's and their Dog and Pony show. 

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 22:39 | 631126 Sig
Sig's picture

Asimov.  Nice.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:41 | 630362 tom
tom's picture

Looks like a great opportunity for more hidden federal support to the most disfunctional states, like the state pension fund suits against AIG. Look for GMAC to settle.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:46 | 630380 Ned Zeppelin
Ned Zeppelin's picture

I enjoy this particular subject quite a bit, and at the risk of repeating myself from other posts, point out the "Shitstorm Coming" aspects of this whole "Fraudulent Foreclosure" problem.

First, hat tip to those who say they do not understand what the fuss is all about - if you stop paying your mortgage, you should be foreclosed against and thrown out of your home, the house sold, the lender having exercised its normal and customary remedies and life goes on.  I don't think that is the problem, although from the shallow treatment given the subject matter by the MSM, you might conclude this fuss is nothing more than a lot of noise orchestrated by ACLU-do-gooder liberal commie Obama lovin' lawyers using the law and our sacred Constitution to help a bunch of deadbeats live rent free for life, and even better get a quitclaim deed without paying the principal and interest on their legal and proper debt.

Or, you might go a little deeper, and conclude that the problem is about mortgage foreclosure mills at the big banks "cutting corners" and "swearing oaths" to documents they have not really read - the implication being that the documents themselves are correct, but that the process is somehow defective. Partly true, but that's not the big problem.

Here's the big problem:

In defending the foreclosures the lawyers went deeper down the rabbit hole, to trace ownership of the notes and mortgages in question.  What they found were defects in the formation of the mortgage backed securities, trusts really, such that the trusts did not own the note or the mortgage in question. And for a myriad of tax and other legal reasons, the problem cannot be fixed.

From Naked Capitalism:

"The admission by GMAC that it produced improper affidavits, followed by suspension of foreclosures by GMAC, Chase, and Bank of America in 23 judicial foreclosures states, is the tip of the iceberg of widespread foreclosure abuses. Yet comparatively few members of the media have asked the right question: why would servicers and law firms engage in fraudulent activity on such a widespread basis?

The ugly answer, as we have detailed long form in earlier posts . .  is just as the front end of the mortgage securitization pipeline broke down, with originators increasingly simply pumping any deal through in the interest of pulling out fees, the same behavior spread to the back end.

Evidence is mounting that the various parties responsible for getting the notes (the borrower IOU into the securitization trust, failed to perform a series of tasks that were clearly set forth in the governing contract, the pooling and servicing agreement. These procedures were designed to thread a path through a complex thicket of multiple legal considerations (state real estate statutes, federal securities law, trust law, IRS provisions, to name a few). The failure to do it right means any retrospective fixes run afoul of multiple boundary conditions. Thus to industry participants, fraud, bizarrely, looks to be less bad than admitting to their colossal failures to respect contractual obligations and legal requirements."

What this means is that not only are the foreclosures invalid but, far worse, it shines a spotlight on the fact that the MBSs in question don't own anything.  So not only do you discount the value of a particular tranche of MBS based on your particular view as to the risk allotted to that tranche, but you also have to consider the fact that the MBS tranches, ALL OF THEM, have nothing in them at all.  The due diligence required to figure this out, whether a particular MBS is "safe" or not, would be colossal, if not impossible.  So today, every single MBS may be completely worthless - well, that's not true, it is worth something, since there are a huge pile of lawsuits lurking there and someone will recover something from somebody after the lawyers feast and the bankruptcies conclude, but that is a small percentage.

If one foreclosure, in one MBS, turns out to not be feasible due to an ownership/chain of title/assignment issue, to me it means it is extremely likely the entire MBS is defective. And if one MBS is questionable for that reason, they are all questionable. Value plummets as marketability becomes a problem. Collateral calls, usefulness as margin security, need I go on?

That is the problem.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:54 | 630419 mrcmmm
mrcmmm's picture

I'll go on:  Suits by the investors in the MBS tranches, i.e., STATE PENSION FUNDS.  Mark my word, this is Tobacco II.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 23:35 | 631250 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

I'm bettin' that US States are just the tip of the iceberg here, remember that Foreign countries/entities also bought the CDO tranches, CDO^2s, etc.

While all the fightin's going on, that would be a good time for the PIIGS to skate out from under their debts too!

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 17:10 | 630461 Mitchman
Mitchman's picture

It goes beyond that:  a) was the sale of the mortgage to the MBS trust a valid sale?; b) what exactly did the MBS trust buy? Is the mortgage allegedly in the pool, the actual mortgage that was sold?  c) was the security interest of the mortgage perfected under state law?  d) does the trust have a perfected security interest in the mortgage pool if the actual mortgage isn't the mortgage listed under the indenture...

And so on...

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 17:13 | 630469 ZackAttack
ZackAttack's picture

Doesn't REMIC law require the originator to buy the mortgage back from the trust if fraud during origination is proven?

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 21:55 | 631021 Ned Zeppelin
Ned Zeppelin's picture

Perhaps, assuming the originator is still around, and then there's that problem of available funds to buy it back, and what is it worth at that point, a non-securitized, messed up mortgage with hair all over it. 

I'm telling you - this is big. 

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 17:38 | 630532 Everyman
Everyman's picture

CORRECT Ned.  However I do not believe it stops where youput it.

 

If one foreclosure, in one MBS, turns out to not be feasible due to an ownership/chain of title/assignment issue, to me it means it is extremely likely the entire MBS is defective. And if one MBS is questionable for that reason, they are all questionable.

 

These MBS had to be put together in 90 days in REMICs for taxpurposes.  With the "slicing and dicing" they "took apart" thses MBS, and "tranched" these POSs in different MBS.  SO NOBODY KNOWS what is in ANY MBS or even if the own what was once in the "empty box".  I am sure you have been following Karl Denniger. 

The next step is the "investors" can hold claim against the MBS creators for "INVESTMENT and SECURITIES FRAUD".

 

My questin still remains:

 

WHERE THE HELL IS THE SEC???  They need to be invistagating this thing with ALL MBS, CDO, and CDS that deal with Real Estate.  Then the IRS gets their bit.

 

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 21:56 | 631022 Ned Zeppelin
Ned Zeppelin's picture

Definite hat tip to Denninger, although Naked Capitalism and others are all over this. 

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 17:43 | 630543 MsCreant
MsCreant's picture

Thanks Ned. That was tight.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 21:23 | 630970 Hephasteus
Hephasteus's picture

Tight and explains the fed's bloating balance sheet. Should end up in the 6 trillion range.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 21:53 | 631018 Ned Zeppelin
Ned Zeppelin's picture

My first head nod from Ms.Creant.

<blush>

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 18:16 | 630597 Cognitive Dissonance
Cognitive Dissonance's picture

 So today, every single MBS may be completely worthless -

So is this why the Fed bought all that mortgage paper? Na, that couldn't be the reason. They were just trying to revive the housing market like they said, right? Right? RIGHT?

Please, someone tell me I'm right. <crickets chirping>

Oh oh.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 22:01 | 631041 Ned Zeppelin
Ned Zeppelin's picture

In fairness to Ben, they bought the MBSs when the biggest worry was that a certain percentage of the MBS mortgage assets would go bad.  I don't think the knowledge that they were defective in their formation was yet known, but I'll concede it would not have stopped them.  

Now these truly are TOXIC assets. Where's a Goldman For Life traitor like Hank Paulson when you him?

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 19:17 | 630723 Citxmech
Citxmech's picture

And don't forget who owns all of this crap - and that it is all insured...

hoo boy!  =O

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 23:28 | 631236 Cathartes Aura
Cathartes Aura's picture

brilliant post, thank you for taking the time to expand on what it "means" and where it goes, Ned.

If it keeps on raining levee's going to break
If it keeps on raining levee's going to break
When the levee breaks have no place to stay

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wCvUynhYRY&feature=related

/salute!

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:47 | 630388 skohiu
skohiu's picture

Fedgov will just declare every mortgage and McMansion title null and void, take over all previous loans and MBS (something he is already in the process of doing) and re-issue brand new titles

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 17:06 | 630452 JLee2027
JLee2027's picture

Property issues are state law, not Fed.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 21:52 | 631017 Ned Zeppelin
Ned Zeppelin's picture

REMIC and tax law is federal and that is where the big problem lies.  This is beyind the simple niceties of foreclosure law. These suckers don't even own the note or mortgage- that is the problem

Thu, 10/07/2010 - 09:27 | 631938 skohiu
skohiu's picture

State law until it's not.  Where have you been the last few years?  The previous unthinkable is the new normal.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 18:27 | 630618 moneymutt
moneymutt's picture

any federal govt pre-emption will end up at the Supreme Court, SCOTUS always sides with big business, but this will not happen overnight, so what happens in the 2-3 years before SCOTUS saves banksters

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 21:58 | 631030 Ned Zeppelin
Ned Zeppelin's picture

Next, are any of you aware of a bill that the banks tried to slip in requiring every state to honor and and not question or open a notarization from another state? Even if the state is full of lying thieving fraudsters? I emailed the White House to protest the bill. These banks are SCARED of this.  They will need specialized national legislation to cure this. 

Thu, 10/07/2010 - 01:53 | 631446 Hephasteus
Hephasteus's picture

And they will need it ratified by enough states. Or maybe not. Worked for income tax.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:48 | 630396 superman07
superman07's picture

Professional politician looking for some palm grease. nothing will come of this. election hype nothing more.

 

look at the guys list of supporters.

21st Century Democrats
Ohio AFL-CIO
AFSCME
Baptist Ministerial Alliance
Buckeye Firearms Association
Carpenters Local 200
Cleveland Stonewall Democrats
Coalition of Women Voters (Canton, OH)
Equality OhioInternational Union of Operating Engineers Local 18
Ironworkers District Council of Southern Ohio and Vicinity
Laborers International Union Local 265
Laborers International Union Local 480
Laborers District Council of Ohio
Lima Building and Construction Trades Council
NARAL Pro-choice Ohio
Ohio Civil Service Employees Association
Ohio Democratic Party
Ohio Education Association
Ohio Federation of Teachers
Ohio Conference of Teamsters
Ohio League of Conservation Voters
Ohio Society of Certified Public Accountants (CPAs)
Ohio State Building and Construction Trades Council
Ohio and Vicinity Regional Council of Carpenters
Outlook Media (Columbus)
Planned Parenthood Affiliates of Ohio
Plumbers and Pipefitters Local 50
Sheet Metal Workers Local 24
Shelby Area Democratic Club
Tri-County AFL-CIO (Akron, OH)
United Auto Workers
United Food and Commercial Workers Local 880
United Transportation Union
Western Reserve Building and Construction Trades Council

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:50 | 630406 NOTW777
NOTW777's picture

LOL how many members of those contributing orgs have GMAC loans?

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:58 | 630431 Bob
Bob's picture

How loose is your grip to imagine that working class people will be rooting for the banksters?

Oh, I missed it: Unions=Evil. 

Gotta remember that. 

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 20:34 | 630884 kathy.chamberli...
kathy.chamberlin@gmail.com's picture

o  H I  o

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 22:53 | 631169 Sig
Sig's picture

I think part of Ned's point is that it isn't Bank of America vs. deadbeat homeowner - let he with the largest campaign contribution win.  It's B of A vs. any number of large institutional MBS holders in a fight to the death.  The asshats in DC may be in a real pickle since both hands are feeding them.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 16:54 | 630423 shushup
shushup's picture

The banks are yet again in for some serious trouble. Makes you wonder how the DOW held up today.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 17:04 | 630449 Idiot Savant
Idiot Savant's picture

I'll be impressed when an AG has the balls to invite Fannie and Freddie to the party! I guarantee they were robo-signing along with everyone else.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 17:40 | 630540 ghostfaceinvestah
ghostfaceinvestah's picture

Fannie and Freddie don't service loans, they just guarantee that the taxpayers will eat the losses.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 17:50 | 630546 Catullus
Catullus's picture

>I will donate $10 for a hilarious dubbed over ally commercial. Make it happen.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 17:50 | 630557 bugs_
bugs_'s picture

What about Wells Fargo?

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 18:01 | 630584 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

They also suck too.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 18:17 | 630600 Cognitive Dissonance
Cognitive Dissonance's picture

cougar,

Please don't hold back. Tell us how you really feel about them.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 20:37 | 630893 kathy.chamberli...
kathy.chamberlin@gmail.com's picture

they really really suck, due.

cheetah

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 18:35 | 630635 mynhair
mynhair's picture

The AG is going for $25K fine on each robo-signature.  Cough up, GM, errr, taxpayers!

http://news.firedoglake.com/2010/10/06/ohio-attorney-general-sues-gmac-s...

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 19:05 | 630703 Rodent Freikorps
Rodent Freikorps's picture

Strangely enough, I am growing quite fond of the raging incompetence of most federal agencies. Can't think why.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 21:05 | 630943 Buck Johnson
Buck Johnson's picture

This is going to be real nasty, Tyler was right about this 2 weeks ago.  The banks thought that real life economy should work just like the electronic derivatives and such they trade and sell in.  They didn't see the local and state laws to protect people would cut in if they didn't do their homework.  No amount of Federal protection can get them out of this one.  How do you write a law or bill that gets rid of decades if not a century of housing law, or even law in general. 

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 23:41 | 631262 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

Um, "What is FIVE CENTURIES of common law?"  I'll take out-n-out Fraud for $1000, Mr Trebek!

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 22:04 | 631046 Ned Zeppelin
Ned Zeppelin's picture

READ THIS REUTERS ARTICLE IT'S ABOUT THE LEGISLATION. 

 

AS A PA RESIDENT IT IS NOW CONFIRMED THAT SENATOR CASEY IS RAT SCUM. 

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 23:44 | 631270 Cathartes Aura
Cathartes Aura's picture


After languishing for months in the Senate Judiciary Committee, the bill passed the Senate with lightning speed and with hardly any public awareness of the bill's existence on September 27, the day before the Senate recessed for midterm election campaign.

The bill's approval involved invocation of a special procedure. Democratic Senator Robert Casey, shepherding last-minute legislation on behalf of the Senate leadership, had the bill taken away from the Senate Judiciary committee, which hadn't acted on it.

The full Senate then immediately passed the bill without debate, by unanimous consent.

beyond farce.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 22:02 | 631033 Fearless Rick
Fearless Rick's picture

+7,000,000 foreclosures and kudos to Ned.

Bingo, bang bongo on all points. And, I should point out that some of the lawsuits mentioned after his comment are already underway and some have won outright. There is precedent in Kansas and a certain Judge Arthur Schack is legendary for tossing plaintiffs on issues of standing.

I've been following this whole mortgage charade since 2006 and I never thought it would get as deep and ugly as this, but here we are.

I have to say, between QE2 a potential TARP2 and this mortgage mess, we'll be lucky to survive as a nation over the next five years.

Best to all.

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 23:20 | 631220 laughing_swordfish
laughing_swordfish's picture

I can see it now -

Class Action lawsuits in all 23 "judicial procedure" states on behalf of foreclosed homeowners, thus tying up the process of eviction and onward sale for years, if not decades;

More class action lawsuits in the "non-judicial" states, which are even more dependent on a "perfected chain of title" for foreclosures/evictions to have legal effect;

Yet more class-action lawsuits on behalf of the RMBS holders, who now have paper that isn't just toxic, but entirely worthless.

Bottom Line: This is the Lawyers Full Employment Into Perpetuity Act, coming to a state and locality near you.

 

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 23:48 | 631272 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

Bottom Line: This is the Lawyers Full Employment Into Perpetuity Act, coming to a state and locality near you.

And the Decepticrats, Obamatron, even the Republicons will do nothing to stop it;  in all probability, the Senate/Congress will resign en-masse (sp) in order to pursue a more "lucrative" career in bankster litigation "going forward!"

Anyone thinking they'll stand in front the vast herd of stampeding Lawyers on this one is completely delusional!

Wed, 10/06/2010 - 23:48 | 631273 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

Bottom Line: This is the Lawyers Full Employment Into Perpetuity Act, coming to a state and locality near you.

And the Decepticrats, Obamatron, even the Republicons will do nothing to stop it;  in all probability, the Senate/Congress will resign en-masse (sp) in order to pursue a more "lucrative" career in bankster litigation "going forward!"

Anyone thinking they'll stand in front of the vast herd of stampeding Lawyers on this one is completely delusional!

Thu, 10/07/2010 - 05:55 | 631611 gwar5
gwar5's picture

Looking like rain out there.

Thu, 10/07/2010 - 05:57 | 631616 gwar5
gwar5's picture

Looking like rain out there.

Do NOT follow this link or you will be banned from the site!