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Out Come The Big Gunz: Interactive Brokers Advises Traders Of Yet Unknown, But Certainly Scary, Silver Margin Increase
If you don't know what to hike your silver margin to, just tell your clients cryptically you will hike it to some number (very high if possible) and leave it at that. Best to just leave them guessing.
To NYMEX,NYSELIFFE traders:
Wed May 4 10:50:37 2011 EST
Margin Increase: Silver Derivatives
In light of the recent unprecedented volatility in silver markets, the exchanges that offer trading in silver derivative contracts are increasing the margin requirements on these products. In an effort to adequately address the inherent risk resulting from this volatility, we are increasing margin requirements on silver derivative contracts to a level exceeding that which the exchanges are implementing.
You will be notified as more information becomes available.Please monitor and manage your risk accordingly.
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Just go to 'cash and carry.'
Problem solved for the people, big problem for those alleging they have silver available.
Spot on, take the leverage away from the Morgue.
BTFD~~
Friday is the day I plan on executing a sizeable, sizeable in comparrison to my meager but nominally rising wages, purchase of physical.
May the dip be with you.
In the name of the silver, the gold, and honest money. Amen.
Still not involved, still right. Damn, was I ever. SLV @38.8, wow!
You are like a batter that never swings the bat, claiming that you are better than those who do because you never miss the ball. Except you have missed EVERY ball.
Boy, you are definitely desperate... FWIW, I traded in Crude and made good money through the volatility. But that is not the point, the point is that Silver bubble can burst, I called it and I was right.
at 20 roundtrip, it is almost 60% of its current price. Stop telling people to buy (physical/ETF/Futures.) and hope. It is a long term investment, pick your spots! Sell sometimes! and buy sometimes! (Come to think of it, like anything else.)
Just like housing bubble in 1995-2005, crude in 2008, all bubble can burst. Trade accordingly.
Good luck.
By your logic, you should quit your job to avoid rising gas prices.
I don't get this... please explain.
You claim to have done a great job by sitting at home for the last two weeks because you wouldn't have made any money, while ignoring the fact that you also sat out the previous ten years of gains. Maybe it hasn't paid to go in to work for the last few weeks, but that is no excuse for sitting at home for the last ten years watching daytime television.
Ten years of gain, can be gotten by the last 4 weeks's round trip. Hence it is better to pop bubbles. Day time television is not much fun, watching you sweat is pretty cool though.
If you feel good yesterday, you should feel even better today!
Tmosley, do you work for Glencore?
Your post doesn't even make any sense.
I'm done talking to a brick in the wall.
The silver bubble has not burst. This is a correction artificially induced by excessive margin hikes and intervention selling. The fundamentals have only strengthened and the timeline is shortening. Silver will be making new highs by this summer. You say you trade crude, good job. Silver goes up 10% I make 40%. Silver goes down 20% in a week and I make 10%.
You want to see how a pro trades silver checkout http://slv.collective2.com
Sounds great but my pension has just been shat on. I know we are all bullish here but maybe too much. I should have taken more notice of Math Man. Lesson learned.
If you had done that, you would have been out at $34.
Seriously I know that you know your stuff, but I got caned by getting carried away. I take full responsibility for it but noobs like me have finally learned the powers we are up against.
Hold physical with no leverage, and you will be fine. Trade volatility (by buying long dated out of the money puts and calls), and you will probably be fine. Short paper instruments while being long physical and you probably will be fine. The last two strategies are riskier, but there are more rewards.
Don't use any form of leverage that leaves you with unlimited liability.
Those are the three winning strategies that are available going forward.
Thanks, I am more than comfortable with my physical. I am just gutted because I was going to cash my SLV and buy defensive stocks after the SP and FTSE went down but I left it too late to cash.
Your pension? Err........ i'm sorry but, i personally really would never secure a high percentage of my pension in silver. The reason is that for a pension, you want reliability and robustness... something rocksolid. Silver is great for high potential midterm (multiple years) gains, but silver is always volatile, just alone already because it is so undervalued.... where gold has a long history of playing the "universal currency" role, silver is open to rapid short- and midterm fluctuations.
I personally would for very-long-term investments not go over a percentage of 20% in silver. Why even do that anyways? With the gold/silver ratio being so far away from each other, and the high potential of silver, investing just a fraction of all in silver gets you the best of both worlds: If it works, then you win high, if not then you lose low.
Don't understand me wrong, i do consider silver very useful and interesting, but i do so precisely because it's value has not clearly established itself yet.... so, it's something very interesting for the next few years, but for super-longterm stuff, it seems to me that gold would be a better candidate.
Highlights from Eric Sprott's interview on his PSLV sale, as suspected it was partial arbitrage to physical and some reinvestment into silver equities.
http://goldandsilverlinings.com/?p=885
Paralysis of Analysis. My brother’s got it too. I started “looking at pitches” @ $12 and didn’t “connect” ‘till $29. I Sure missed a lot of “RBI’s”.
If I understand you correctly, [and please accept my apologies if I'm wrong] what you mean is, you screwed the pooch by not buying silver when you should have, when it was below $20/oz. I sold my paper SLV at 47.17, and it paid for all my physical, plus the taxes.
Given the ever-worsening situation of the dollar, and the fact that neither of the fiscal plans presented by the DC limpdicks stops the increase in the deficit, it would seem reasonable to conclude that this drop in the price of silver will make demand for physical silver far greater than before, because while an increase in the price did not seem to lower demand, a drop in the price will surely increase it.
There might not be much to go around, but I pray to God they screw the price back down to $25/oz. I'll join a church and pray to Jeebus every day if that happens. After I buy a ton of silver, that is.
My point was pretty simple. ZH celebrated when it went from 40 to 49 in 5 trading days. And then says that it is all odd that it went back to 39. (in almost 3 days.)
If you traded well, during this time, good for you.
But ZH and most of the silve bugs are definitely biased and not looking at the truth.
It was a bubble, period. And now, who knows... maybe it is time to buy, but tmosley need to fess up that he was wrong.
That's all. Good luck!
I might agree that this was a technical correction if the rules had remained constant in the silver market but they have not.
This is a manufactured silver sell off by the commodities exchanges which have changed the rules of silver investing. The leverage possible has been cut significant;y meaning that many players who had bought all the silver they could now had to sell to increase their margin requirements.
That creates a feedback loop as the price drops with sales. Very convenient if you happento be 80% of the short market in a booming commodity don't you think?
So where we are now is in a fall to seek the sustainable price level witht he available capital in the market. We'll find that soon then the run up will really get going again until the next margin increase and again and again until you can only buy silver with cash, which is where we will be anyways.
I still prefer gold because it is the real monetary metal but I have quite a bit of physical silver as well since at my average price of < $14 I'm happy. If we get much more downward movement I'll probably load up another 1000oz or so of silver. Only problem is it takes up so much room.
Agreed on the manufactured point (of course it is as it has so often). But I'm wondering why no one seems to tying in the bin Laden factor... clearly the bankers were tipped off at 6:00pm Sunday... they've gone all in, and have finally initiated the massive sell off they've been trying to manufacture since Jan 1... yet more Crimex BS.
tmosely doesn't trade paper, and I didn't see him advise anyone to buy paper, at 49 or any other price.
He buys and holds physical and says he won't sell it for $$$ anytime soon. He doesn't seem to care much if anyone takes that "advice" or not.
Personally, I trade paper which I'm trying to exchange for land. I heeded the "advice" of some of the people here (actually came to my own conclusion) and sold it at 49. I'm trying to scale back in here around 40.
At some point buying the stuff using credit cards makes sense...
& $25/oz sure looks like it.
Sounds about right....and congrats on your SLV maneuvers....
...but I think you spelled Geezus incorrectly....somethin' to think about before you Goa joinin'
no sweat, i bought silver at 10$ anounce, hehehe...
Highly highly suspicious this entire sudden drop. Eerily reminiscent of 2008 only this time no 'fundamentals' i.e. susposed flight to liquidity issues that were named as the reasons given back then.. ahem.. (we'll see how the courts end up ruling on the 30+ lawsuits against JPM for alternative reasons)
This entire sharp drop should be the front and center focus of the CFTC. In light of all the revelations we now know about including Bart Chilton coming forward, ongoing lawsuits, ongoing 3rd CFTC investigation, constant margin hikes singeling out specifically Silver, massive drops in Silver inventory at the Comex, and everything in between! This move ought to get at least a statement from the regulators...?
I emailed the CFTC and asked if they were going to investigate the obvious manipulation of the silver market. Crickets.
The email address is here - http://www.cftc.gov/Contact/index.htm
The more they distort the price of silver through paper contracts, the wider the spread between paper silver and physical, and the more widespread the shortages.
Check out the prices: tulving.com offering to BUY silver at as much as $3.50 OVER spot. APMEX is asking $6.49 over spot for 2010 silver eagles. Tulving not even taking orders for silver eagles.
>>Tulving not even taking orders for silver eagles.
They have monster boxes, pre 2011, at $2.69 over spot.
"As more information becomes available"
Whoa now... Aren't they strongly implying the decision has been made, but that due to logistics they were unable to secure those details? As opposed to, you know, just making shit up as they go along?
Seriously, we all know COMEX will default. What is the alternative, banning silver ownership? Good luck on that one, it will instantly vaporize faith in the US dollar, as silver will only be available on the black market.
Hello! There is an international market out there. Can not kill a market if you ban something in Amerika.
So many people disregard elementary logic.
Now that the War on Terror is effectively defunct the US has effectively declared the War on Silver.
Criminy, they are using EVERY trick in the book to drive it down.
The more they activate margin increases, the closer the derivates come to being priced at spot of silver.
Now realising that silver is hedged 100 times actuall stocks...
means that if the system breaks, we might see silver trading at X100. So todays price action 3900$ per ounce.
They now ask 20% on something that actually represents 1% of all available silver.
Nuts? I think so.
And available silver keeps going down so we'll be able to add a extra factor to that number real soon.
The more margin increases, the deeper in the shit they get.
But if margins go up to 50% nobody will be able to buy those so you'll get a massive oversupply of paper silver and it will indeed go below 1$. 1 cent is also very well possible.
And at what price do miners say: FUCK THIS! I'M NOT SELLING YOU MY SILVER!
And the industry goes: NEVER MIND THE COMEX! I'LL GIVE YOU WHATEVER YOU WANT SO MY PRODUCTION CAN KEEP GOING!
And because of that, silver will never go below 10$ because that would activate other triggers. 10=0
Now this brings us a bit closer to the derivative bomb we where all discussing in 2008. The only way to defuse derivatives IS TO BRING MARGINS DOWN!! NOT UP!!! DOWN!!!
So this may be the first bomb to explode. So soon we'll all be terrorists and we'll all meet in Guantanamo.
I'll be the one wearing a rose on my jacket.
Are you listening to yourself? Keep dreaming.
Precisely my thoughts: as precious metals are IMO more an insurance than an investment, having paperPMs is not the point: When the Schiff, ahm the sh1t hits the fan, you need the physical.
I saw this a bit ago. Hoping it works, I'd love to buy some physical cheaper. Afraid that if I don't get to Tulving in the next few days they'll run out of product!
Me too, the bigger dip the better, I sold a sizeable amount when silver passed $40 on the way up, buying it back at $25 would be awesome.
Me three. My coin dealers got 2 monster boxes of sealed 2008 SAE's. I thought maybe waiting till next week but with the price action today I'm tempted to buy.
That would include myself, the post from last thursday I was wondering if I should trade my silver for gold while it was at 31 to 1 and I did. I had purchased most of the silver in the 25-30 range. I was getting an ounce of gold for right around 950. I did trade at 33 to 1 and now it sits at close to 39 to 1. I'm still weary of the dollar and would never take some FRN's. So I cashed in with gold cause silver was on a rocket and it let me get gold under a thousand an ounce. I will probably trade it back for silver at 45 to 1 or something similiar to ride the rocket again.
>> Afraid that if I don't get to Tulving in the next few days they'll run out of product!
His web sit says 450,000 ounces in stock. I don't think you need to worry.
"Volatility" in silver means silver has gone up huge
"Volatility" in the Dow means it is down 250+ pts
Such a joke, BTFD in silver and sleep tight
Do you even know what volatility is?
Sounds like he has a precise, functional understanding. Maybe you should recheck your thesauras
MethMan doesn't have a thesaurus --- but he sure has thesoreass.
Volatility does NOT equal risk
Risk = the permanent loss of capital, not a number.
Huh? What?
"Risk is the potential that a chosen action or activity (including the choice of inaction) will lead to a loss (an undesirable outcome)."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Risk
Some insist that risk and return are always positively correlated; the greater the risk, the greater the return. This is, in fact, a basic tenet of the capital-asset-pricing model taught in nearly all business schools, yet it is not always true. Others mistakenly equate risk with volatility, emphasizing the "risk" of security price fluctuations while ignoring the risk of make overpriced, ill-conceived, or poorly managed investments.
Seth Klarman
Margin of Safety
Prospectively, perceived risk and potential return are highly and positively correlated. That's how capital is allocated, whether it's done with high-test quantitative financial tools or not. The issues are whether the perceived risk is consistent with actual risk, and whether the potential returns are commensurate with the risk. Neither of those things is knowable at decision time - only in hindsight.
Volatility is one measure of risk that one may choose (or not) to include in an overall risk assessment. You don't have to use it, and it of course doesn't back-test perfectly, even if you can sift out all of the non-parametric elements (like manipulation).
But risk is simply the potential that the world turns out differently than current expectations. Get that straight and the rest just might come to you...
It's all straight to me. Again, your thoughts on and definition of volatility center around EMH. With a long investment horizon, I care nothing about inter-day and other short-term moves in prices. If I buy an asset at $10, I could care less if it drops to $5 on its way to $20. That's why valuation matters and price paid matters. It can offset the negative impacts from a world that turns out differently than current expectations. Hence there is a lot more "risk" when you overpay. See ya.
No, you could NOT care less. Otherwise, you imply that you do in fact care.
Repeat after me:
"I could NOT care less"
"I could NOT care less"
"I could NOT care less"
"I could NOT care less"
PS: If you decide to not take my advice, and don't use the grammatically and logically proper phrase, I couldn't care less.
OK - you're just a moron I guess trying to change what I've stated.
Anyone that says there is a lot more "risk" when you overpay has nothing to offer here.
I didn't try and change anything that you stated. I simply disagree with your premise and definition of risk. Dismissing what you pay in assessing risk seems moronic to me and I'm guessing other value investors would share that view. Buying assets at attractive valuations can offset any number of flaws in your investment thesis (macro or micro). If you think such an idea has nothing to offer and is contrary to your definition of "risk" then so be it. Welcome to Zero Hedge.
Where, tell me, did I dismiss price paid as an element of risk? Is it next to the place where I defined volatility? I did neither, knucklehead.
You are trying to fashion yourself as all-knowing, and inserting words into my comments that aren't there. That is what I refer to as a "hack."
Go back and READ what I wrote to see what I said, and how you are arguing with what I didn't say, hack.
Ad hominem attacks are usually desperate attempts to distract from the discussion at hand. Regardless, I'll be sure to tell everyone on Zero Hedge the your the smartest new kid in school and the go-to guy when it comes to issues surroundng volatility.
You sad, sad sack. You can't deal with someone mincing your brittle little thought process so you go on a junk-fest. Knock yourself out.
You clearly have an overly inflated opinion of yourself and your "ideas". Very convoluted statements and dogmatic thinking for the most part. Suffice it say, I can safely include you in the group of irrelevant posters on ZH.
Congratulations - you're the first!
Unknown to you, the anonymity of this format is doing you a lot of good right now.
You better be sharper in your posts than what you showed here.
I'll leave it to you to troll for accolades and other forms of positive reinforcement. I have explored this topic ad nauseum in both academic settings (business school, CFA program) and at work (investment banking, asset management) over the last 25 years. I'm totally confident in the validity of my thought process when it comes to evaluating and assessing investment risk. Thanks for the "lecture", but I'll pass and let you try it on someone else.
You've probably come across some of my work, then. Most who have rigorous price evolution and game theory backgrounds have.
Stop wasting your time trying to project your own self-doubts onto me. It's not working and it won't get any better.
Why don't you post your relevant work on ZH if it's really that groundbreaking?
Did it really take you all that time to think up a reply?
My work is already out in the public space, and continues to be challenged & debated. But it has survived a very long time and, more importantly, has been advanced by others. If you pay attention - something that seems like a ginormous challenge for you - you might get some insights from the hundreds of posters here and elsewhere that are well steeped in this stuff.
You're a valuation jockey - I'm guessing trained in some McKinsey, Carnegie Mellon, or NYU framework. All good starting stuff but doesn't scratch the surface of the more important events that the world has been trying to fit into funky distributions like fractals, jump-diffusion, y-balls and a bunch of other, less known frames.
You need to get past your fences and get into the behavior aspects of markets if your going to be useful to yourself.
Good luck.
Your definitions belie your handle.
Risk is uncertainty of future outcomes. Volatility is a quantification of uncertainty - a measure of risk.
Probability is uncertainity of future outcomes. Your definition of risk is for those that buy into VaR, EMH, MPT, etc. which has too many flaws for me. Short-term volatility is largely irrelevant to an unlevered investor and in fact can create great opportunities for a well thought out investment thesis.
Your reading stuff into what I've stated. Probability can be absence of information - like the probability of an unborn child being a boy or a girl. There is no probability there, but the outcome is percieved as probabilistic to the unknowing.
Risk is uncertainty - nothing more, and nothing less. Probability is injected, be it empirically or subjectively, to rationalize decisions in the absence of knowability. What matters is not the probability, but whether or not you can tolerate the outcomes of your decision(s).
In theory, short-term volatility doesn't matter to an unlevered investor (which I am). But investors don't know whether it matters or not until their holdings are tested. So risk in the end is about tolerance for outcomes. If you don't know your tolerances in advance, you are likely to find them out. That leads to decision-making under duress.
Happy hunting, but don't pretend you have a better grasp on this stuff than you do.
Please let markets trade fairly, without moving the goalposts.
They just don't want to see anyone get hurt...really.
which being interpreted means
don't fight the Fed
bitchez
The fed will loose this one. It's only a matter of time.
But, like with gold in the past, couldn't they just confiscate all our gold and silver?
If you agree to give it to them, they certainly can... They could also politely ask us all to report to our local detention center FEMA shelter in the future. Still mulling over what my response might be.
Confiscation would be the last thing they would do. They need fiat, as that is where there power is. Confiscation would crash the system overnight as it would be a de facto validation of the value of gold and silver. And they cannot speak of that out loud.
Their power is in issuing debt notes at interest.
pods
But, like with gold in the past, couldn't they just confiscate all our gold and silver?
No.
Very few were stupid enough to actually turn over any pms. The law was about grabbing (stealing) the easy pickings stored at banks (and funds like modern day Sprott) and then increasing its value to the government (from $20 to $35 bucks an oz)
This only worked because Americas savings at the time were in precious metals due to the gold/silver standard of the FUCKING CONSTITUTION YOU FUCKING COCKSUCKERS. sorry I digress
Today Americas savings are where?
401K, IRA, stock brokerage accounts, pension funds, social security "trustfund".....
The fed will loose this one. It's only a matter of time.
well I agree they will lose the war
but they sure as hell are winning THIS battle:)
a printing machine is a powerful weapon
These margin increases are intended 'shake the tree' and scoop up what physical silver falls out.
Keep a tight grip people.
It is no coincidence that AMPEX was just desperately seeking physical around the same time this coordinated attack was implemented.
No problem. Let them play in the sand box. It is being drained of its (Silver and Gold) sand on a daily basis. We are seeing the death throes of the system, that's all. Next stop is Delirium Tremens.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delirium_tremens
I like it!!!!!!
The DT's ? Birnam and same are old friends.
http://stuffnobodycaresabout.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/Portraits-Ra...
The market is their sand box. You are all invited to come a play, but bring your own toys and don't be surprised when we take the toys away.
Physical possession is the only way for you to keep your toys safe.
I've been watching Apmex pricing since 2009 and never seen the current elevated price pattern of both buy and sell over spot. This happening at the very same time of FALLING spot price and rising market margins looks very fishy. Since I'm not a trader, just a holder, and continuing just that. A little nervous yes, but it's better than a $fiat or a stock any day.
It also happened in 2008. But the COMEX wasn't having the clear and obvious problems it is having now.
It is no coincidence that AMPEX was just desperately seeking physical around the same time this coordinated attack was implemented.
there is some confusion about this
APMEX wanted silver & gold American Eagles in particular because they were out and the next shipment was not due until mid May; it was NOT about a general shortage of pms- they had plenty of various stock on hand
another thing that has been misquoted is Jim Rogers statement recently:
he did NOT say silver was in a bubble
what he SAID was that IF silver was at $100 an oz and the dollar was not crashing then it could be in a bubble and you should consider selling
since silver only reached $50 and the dollar WAS crashing into 72 then CLEARLY JR was not calling for a pm crash
another thing JR said that got cut out of most repetitions of that segment was DON'T SELL YOUR SILVER
Eagles are the buyers choice, particularly for the PM newbie, and thus they are in demand and carry the highest premium. This was the signal of PM froth and the perfect time to beat it down. There was and is no doubt that Silver had one hell of a run over the last 6 months and particularly the last 2. As far as I'm concerned the 'correction' is welcome for those of us who hold physical and wish to add to their holdings. This is simply shaking out the weak hands.
Absolutely, I agree with you.
If we are in paper gold, we should have covered.
If we are holding physical gold we should stand pat.
So far, the cost of sleeping well at night has been about $70 a gold eagle. Best money I ever spent.
Just because fiat has to depreciate doesn't mean Uncle Ben, GS, and the Boyz are going to let you sit on a pile of THEIR MONEY and not try to take it away. The death of fiat can wait, there's money to be made in panic. I bet they drive it down $300. I don't care, I will make back any losses by buying the dips.
Looks like a organized silver beat down.... Suppression will only be temporary....
-
Why not take it at face value?
Seems IB is doing the prudent thing to me.
-
I agree, as an ex regional ngr. at a large broker/dealer those that buy/trade on mgn don't ever expect a margin call and always expect their investment to "come back in a day or two" well with futures a day or two can mean losing their house. Remember, a $1 move in the SI is a $5000 move per contract, down $9 is a $45k loss brokers cannot risk a client not paying, and for those of us who are long, getting the marginal traders out can only be good medium to long term
I THINK INTERACTIVE BROKERS IS GIVING REASONABLE ADVISE.
I DO NOT THINK THEY ARE PART OF A CONSPIRACY.
I SPENT 2 HOURS TALKING TO MY COIN DEALER YESTERDAY, AND HE SAID THAT SOMETIMES PRICE GOES DOWN. AT FIRST, I WAS PISSED! BUT THEN I REALIZED THAT IT PROBABLY IS TRUE. NOT EVERYTHING IS A CONSPIRACY!
Epic troll needs to turn off his caps lock again.
I know it's cruise control for cool, but still.
Friend, it is all a conspiracy. From the smallest pump and dump on a microstock to this "recovery bull market" it's all a game, not an auction. People forgot that just because the currency is going under, it doesn't mean there aren't massive forces out there sharing inside information and conspiring to screw anyone who believes in anything. That's why gold is dropping. That's the way it is, that's the way it always has been
Contrary opinions are fine, and the right of any free thinking man.
All caps is not.
Please stop being an ass. Thank you.
Sorry about the caps lock, again. When I log on, my password is all capitalized, so I am forgetting to turn off the cap lock.
Again, my apologies.
And it takes two people to point that out before you realize it?
so how do you manage to do your captcha without looking at what you wrote?
Sounds like BS to me Tex...
I'd like to....but for some reason I can't pry my eyeballs away from your avatar
The Texas flag brings all sorts of emotions to me, too.
It symbolizes independence, American grit, integrity, toughness, patriotism, and basically all the characteristics that make Texas the most "American" state in our union.
We are the only state in the union that could launch an attack on the rest of the country, and probably win. That won't happen, though, so don't worry because behind our tough exterior, we are just down-to-earth, good 'ol boys looking for no harm.
Don't mess with Texas!
for me it looks like somebody wanted to draw a flag and ran out of crayons to fill in the big white spot...
And what does the white represent? Empty space? Just plain nothing? Or was the designer to drunk to finish it?
I also see a blue rectangle and a red one that looks like it fell on its back... I'm sure it represents something...
Why didn't they draw a horse into it?
And why is there a Jew star into that blue rectangle?
Sorry for the confusion.
My comments were referencing the "Jigglin Titties" in the above avatar
I'm glad you're proud of your flag....let's hope you won't have to consider flying it upside down.
Doesn't constantly raising the margin requirements create volatility rather than stability?
This is becoming outright comical.
Just stay off of margin and you will be ok. Do not let the scum scare you out of your long term positions in gold, silver.
Hey aren't these the guys that charge a service fee on un-invested funds i.e., a cash balance?
It does appear to be a coordinated attack. Of course the brokerages would be involved since they feed from the same trough and take orders from the same master.
They don't even need to be willing partners. Just remind reluctant houses of the havoc a full balls-to-walls SEC compliance review would turn up if the SEC wanted to find something and suddenly margins are being increased in the dreaded PM sector.
But Trav says silver was "grossly overbought" and that's why it went down. Without a doubt, that is NOT the reason why silver has gone down.
Andrew McGuire gave the SEC and CFTC all the evidence they needed on a platter, much like Markopolis did with Madoff. They have done nothing because it would blow JPM and the other crooked bullion banks totally out of the water.
Well, if you think about it, paper silver is always 'over-bought'. After all, it is just...PAPER SILVER! /sarc
How many margin hikes is that now between all the exchanges? I have lost count, I think it is the 7th or the 8th. Ah well.
Have no idea when but when silver reverses it will be like an unstoppable freight train coming right at you.
Somewhere between $25 and $30.
In your dreams.
Keep buying silver bums.
As long as I keep seeing obnoxious posts from those like thunder dome...am very comfortable with all my holdings. Shows how much class some have with posts.
Sounds like Crimex cupboards are bare...
#winning
Meanwhile, AAPL is still pinned at or near lifetime highs.
Why trade SLV when you can invest in a much more safe item like Apple which has none of the risks surrounding QE3, inflation/deflation, currency gyrations, etc.?
GMCR has gone from $10 to $76 without any of the shakeouts and murderous attacks like SLV.
Great advice. Buy at the lifetime high. What could possibly go wrong?
Your gift for hindsight trades is matched and surpassed only by your glorious grasp of the obvious.
So tell us Robo...what's your prediction for yesterdays weather in your neighborhood?
I dont 'trade SLV', I just keep buying the crappy bags of dimes the dealer doesnt want because all buyers want shiny new 1 oz in plastic seals. BTFD, bitchez's.
BTW your crAAPL just flash crashed 7%.
Sheep : question 4 u : lets say down the road shtf , usd goes bye-bye, and pm's are being 'accepted'(black market scenario) for 'barter' .... would u anticipate any problem w/ 'acceptability' of junk silver vs. ase or maples or vs. silver bars/rounds ? ?
tsx500: my take is that junk silver will be more valuable because it's already broken down for those day to day exchanges.
I tried to get my hands on some but in Australia the smallest seems to be one ounce and it's overpriced. So I jsut buy the bars but if junk silver was available I would buy a few bags and espeically for the shtf scenario.
thanx Banjo for the reply. i'm in the market at or a little below the current spot price of $40 but the local coin shops want $4 - $4.50 over spot for ase's ($4 over for Can. Maples) and i just can't 'justify' paying that % commission (10%plus) when junk coins can be had for maybe 1% premium over spot. i just keep thinking about the 'usability'/'tradeability' of the different forms of Ag down the road if things really get goofy in USSA.
Not pumping NFLX any more, momo? I wonder why...
Gird thy loins kids, and BTFD
Much more fun to gird someone else's but okay.
I don't suppose any of the trolls and haters out there have noticed that every single major move down in silver since the peak has happened hours before the announcement of a margin increase?
I suppose that is too much to ask, since all you faggots have an agenda, and understanding ain't on it.
You're starting to sound desperate.
It stinks.
Like I told you the other day. Enjoy your sheering, embrace it in it's totality.
Listen to this desperation:
$49 by Friday right?
Was I desperate back in February when I said the same thing?
Fri, 02/04/2011 - 08:35 | tmosley (Total Score:1)
The paper price is fake. The sooner it breaks down toward zero (among infinite volatility), the sooner the current system ends due to metal default, and "gold bugs" take over the financial system as physical premiums head toward infinite.
http://argo.zerohedge.org/article/morning-gold-fixing-bernanke-“catast...
Everywhere I've looked I can get physical silver for just over spot (like always) The places I've looked all have inventory.
Stop being so maniacal.
You want to share with us where you get it for just over spot, or where inventory doesn't show a future shiping date. Funny how available and on hand are two very different things.
Listen.
You and tmosely are the only two idiots who are watching silver TANK and are convinced that the price is actually going UP.
Do you see the sickness?-
Last time I am doing this:
What the fuck does this link say? Buy it.
I'll help you $1.99 (normal) over spot. IN STOCK. BUY BUY BUY
http://www.apmex.com/Product/61800/100_oz_Johnson_Matthey_Silver_Bar_999_Fine_Canada.aspx
Uhh, that isn't the normal price. The premium is up 33% since YESTERDAY.
But you wouldn't know anything abut that, because you are a walking pile of confirmation bias.
Credit Card & Bank Wire Orders Ship In (1-3) Business Days!
Only 13 left.
Ohhhhhh now it's 12
LOL !
Two dollars over spot is not just over spot. Besides that fact it is a 100 oz bar you dolt. Premiums on 100z and up is always peanuts compared to 1oz coins which is what I was fucking talking about. Face it you can't find coins that cheap, try buying even the simple rounds under 100oz (cause srsly you think people have 4 grand in their back pocket) and you will pay around a $3 dollar premium easily. You keep ignoring the fact that Spot =/= actual silver price.
Yes silver is down, we are well aware, but you cant get it for under $42 dollars even though spot hit $39 unless you are buying 500+ ounces.
Uhh, I said that in FEBRUARY, dude.
But you're kind of dumb, so I'll let it slide this time.
Premiums on silver products have doubled to sextupled in that time frame.
Sounds like I was right.
The price of silver has not, I repeat, has not fallen almost 30% in 3 days, it has in fact gone UP!
I'm so smart, I'm tmosely and I'm predicting $49 silver on Friday.
I didn't say it hasn't fallen. You are putting words in my mouth.
I said prices are diverging, and I predicted such months ago.
Anyone holding physical silver is doing fine.
If only you could have predicted silver would actually plummet to the $30's, you may have enabled people to get more ounces of silver for their dollar.
Ding, ding, ding!
Any trader who listened to what I said would have bought far out of the money puts and and calls and made a fortune much greater than your one sided ultra leveraged crap, having made huge amounts of money on the way up and the way down. Remember, I said that in FEBRUARY.
Also interesting--silver lease rates are rising. See if you can figure out what that means.
Dangertime: Short term predictions can go anyway. Depending on what your long term view is will influence your comfort with owning silver at todays price, $5, $20, $50 or beyond.
If in 4 weeks silver is at $55 what predictions count? What if in 4 weeks silver is $5 and people take your advice to buy at $30? Seriously who can pick tops and bottoms. I saw a great video by Don Harrold on technicals of silver and how it was going to retrace and it went on to move from the high 39's to nearly 50.
A few things:
If you were dumb enough to put most of your accumulated capital into the market over a short period especially after a 140%-160% rise in 12 months. You get the Darwin award for investing.
Investing is not a one shot affair this pullback for someone without large amounts of capital is great for some accumulation.
This correction is great for a long term silver bull market. Look at gold over the last ten years lots of corrections.
Personally I am so happy I hope paper longs are getting BURNED HARD!! Hahahaha AND after this it will be the shorts turn to get SMOKED :-)
Soak it up trading parasites.
Predictions count when you can turn them into profits. I have closed out my puts for a very nice gain, therefore, they count. Especially if I turn them around and re-invest them for more gains.
Apparently I am a better technician than Don Harrold.
Fine here is a prediction, I just traded my Gold in for silver. Gold was at 1510 and silver at 39.13 when I pulled the trigger. Silver to gold ratio was right above 38, but being that premiums are what they are I got a ratio of about 35. I predict by June that I will have made out with that trade and that more than likely both metals will be up above their current trading range, or at least the cost of purchasing the coins will be greater by June than they are today.
I put my money where my mouth is.
I'm thinking the ratio is a "lock" for 20:1
If you believe gold will reach 2k in fiat pricing whilst the US dinar is still staving off the flatlining....then perhaps you may consider silver reaching 100 dinars at this same point in time. Recently, the GSR made some strong moves lower and gave us a taste of what the landscape may be like when Joe Six Pack Bag '0' Doughnuts starts to get "priced" outta having the necessary fiats to come into #79. There's a reason it's called poor man's gold. #47 will suffer the vicious volatility....but at the end of the day...a large portion of the American consumer is "tapped out"....and cash poor....
....When the 'Herd' makes their move to institute the real bubble in PM's....they'll be buying silver and gold...but at a factor of 3 to 1 respectively...and the ratio will gravitate to older/historical settings.
(At least that's what I'm betting on. I'll be trading for some gold also...but forcing myself to be alittle more patient)
When your investments are imaginary and just random troll lies on the interwebs, what do you hedge? the ability to claim you called something ROFLMAO :D
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by Dangertime
on Mon, 04/25/2011 - 10:35
Forgiven, the peak is in for this run. We will see $50 again but not likely for another year. You still have time to sell and restock with even more this summer.
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by Dangertime
on Fri, 04/29/2011 - 08:20
#1219786
Silver will break $50 next week and march possibly even to $60.
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Dangertime: most of us are small timers wanting to be "players" quit your posturing to me it looks pathetic. BUT some people might be really impressed and like it.
I could come on here and make all sorts of claims to having made real or phantom trades and no one would know.
Confer with your friends and associates they have a better chance of know what is real or not.
Most shit I read on line about people trading in and out / this and that is pure bunk. Unless I can see trade orders and an associated bank account showing your are honest to goodness up I don't buy it.
I don't care if you *buy it*.
The timing of my posts regarding my positions should be more than enough of a clue for those of you who call such things "impossible".
Opening Bell on the morning after Asia hit $49, I posted that I heavily added to my October 33, 37, and 40 puts.
Today I posted that I sold them. Go back and check the % increase, you will find it matches up pretty well with what I claim.
Or, go back in your hole and claim the world is flat, if that makes you happy then so be it.
Dangertime: I think you got sucked into the bull market and I reckon you lost alot of money.
If you made serioulsy good cash you wouldn't be here blogging about your pathetic top and bottom calls.
If you have made money is probably on the back of mandates that you exeucte. So you're a order taking spectator talking like you're a player.
The world in fact the universe is flat. Don't take my word for it though, you might want to do some research first.
Snake Eyes, Dangertime :-)
@dangertime
-monday silver hits 50, you call top and its over, it hits 49.50.
-friday you give in to the humiliation, call 50 this week, maybe 60, silver dips again
-now you try to pretend you didnt say what you said, but sorry, wrong 100% of the time. make another call.
Lastly, all you do is "post" as you put it(pun intended), because as proven ad infinitum, you dont actually hold any investments.