Pentagon Papers' Daniel Ellsberg And Other Ex-Intelligence Officers "See Plusses In WikiLeaks" Disclosures

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Wed, 12/08/2010 - 13:41 | 789230 Gimp
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Cyber warfare..bring it on bitchez and welcome to the 21st century.

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 13:43 | 789235 Tense INDIAN
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Tyler ...dont u wanna post this from ur Favourite Gonzalo Lira :

 

 

http://gonzalolira.blogspot.com/2010/12/case-of-wikileaks-part-ithe-hackers.html

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 14:12 | 789327 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

One point of clarification: WikiLeaks are NOT hackers.

Hacking is actually illegal in many instances. Especially if it involves unauthorized entry into systems.

WikiLeaks is journalism. People hand them stuff and they post it. How the original holder came to possess the material is largely irrelevant and in no case makes WikiLeaks a bunch of hackers.

If WikiLeaks are hackers, then Tyler Durden is a hacker. Follow me?

Please spread this distinction into other fora, it is actually extremely important.

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 14:19 | 789353 Mr Lennon Hendrix
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+1

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 15:01 | 789490 Thanatos
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Lira hits it on the head with that article.

I am waiting to see his conclusions in Part 2 of the Article.

ZH's Reporting on this issue is surprising to me, they seem to be following the same script that the MSM is following with respect to WL.

That is not what I expected from ZH, but not earth shattering.

I kinda expected this crowd to run the opposite direction from the MSM herd, there are a few that go against the grain, but by no means a majority of the posters in these WL articles. Maybe MANY of the ZH folks are not even reading the WL stuff and only the idiots like me are in here.

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 15:51 | 789695 Rula Lenska
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"Maybe MANY of the ZH folks are not even reading the WL stuff..."

Nailhead, meet hammer.  I would add that it's not limited to just the ZH "folk"; sadly most "discussions" of import these days are merely regurgitations of others' comments/speculations/gossip, creating an endless echo chamber of empty rhetoric.  Very little of what is said relates in any meaningful way to the actual substance of the issue at hand.

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 14:21 | 789357 YHC-FTSE
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+1

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 14:44 | 789415 DaveyJones
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Wikileaks are not hackers and it's our government who has leaked information to deliberately endanger property and personnel

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 14:58 | 789473 Pegasus Muse
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I wonder who is behind the cyberterrorist attacks against Wikileaks that shut their site down.  I wonder who coerced who in order to shut down mirror sites in Europe?  I wonder what government conspired with Great Britian to falsely detain Asange on trumpted up "rape" charges by a known intelligence operative now hiding in Isreal?   I wonder ....

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 14:48 | 789439 xenophobe51
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Absolutely correct. WikiLeaks are NOT hackers.

 

Julian Assange was a hacker when he was a 16-year-old boy (under the name 'Mendax'). It was his passionate hobby and he got in trouble for it.

 

From WikiPedia:

"Assange wrote down the early rules of the subculture: 'Don’t damage computer systems you break into (including crashing them); don’t change the information in those systems (except for altering logs to cover your tracks); and share information'...

"Assange later commented, 'It's a bit annoying, actually. Because I cowrote a book about [being a hacker], there are documentaries about that, people talk about that a lot. They can cut and paste. But that was 20 years ago. It's very annoying to see modern day articles calling me a computer hacker. I'm not ashamed of it, I'm quite proud of it. But I understand the reason they suggest I'm a computer hacker now. There's a very specific reason.'"

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julian_assange

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 15:16 | 789564 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

I was a hacker. Now I'm an instructor, fiction writer and I work in a network security firm.

Fortunately I am not famous and I am not a threat to our criminal overlord class. At the moment.

You had a point but I'm not sure what it was.

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 15:38 | 789655 xenophobe51
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Just pointing out that Mr. Assange once had a harmless hobby that TPTB use to unfairly discredit the WikiLeaks organization with.

 

Julian.Assange() != WikiLeaks();

if var.Julian.Assange.currentAge == 16 {

    Julian.Assange() = 'hacker';

}else{

    Julian.Assange() != 'hacker';

}

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 22:34 | 791232 DaveyJones
DaveyJones's picture

....yet

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 15:07 | 789520 Thanatos
Thanatos's picture

Hackers:

People who like to understand how the systems they use (or are used by) work.

People who like to "modify" anything to improve it's perfromance or adapt it to better suit their purpose(s).

People who like to create solutions to problems.

Crackers:

Safe Crackers

Password Crackers

Encryption Crackers

 

Wikileaks "Helper Hackers":

Script Kiddies using canned DDOS apps gleaned from other Kiddies at 4chan.

They are 14 years old and have never had an original thought in their life.

EOT

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 13:47 | 789240 SheepDog-One
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But how can you just shoot down innocent websites??

Its EASY man! Just dont lead em so much.

YouTube - Get Some!

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 13:46 | 789244 Flounder
Flounder's picture

"[to the Wicked Witch of the West] Ha, ha, ha! Rubbish! You have no power here. Now begone — before someone drops a house on you, too!"

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 14:11 | 789251 hugovanderbubble
hugovanderbubble's picture

Estimated Tyler:

 

which banks do u humble think are the TWO wikileaked ones?

Maybe BAC and C?

C and JPM?

JPM and GS?

JPM & HSBC...?

regards

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 14:15 | 789339 cougar_w
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By January, it will be more than two.

Hence the delay in the release; "Send us your dirt and you get in on the blow up and get some cover too."

Nice little tactic.

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 13:52 | 789261 Mr Lennon Hendrix
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Brilliant article, but I will wait to judge Assange by whatever Bank docs he releases.

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 13:53 | 789262 jimgcpa
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The US is no worse than any country in the world.  All governments are evil.  

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 14:03 | 789285 karzai_luver
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Sorry , When Cuba or France hits my block with a Jdam I may give you some run,now,Nope.

The only thing worse than a gvt that oppresses its own is one that feels it knows what is best for others who have no say in the elites who rule them.

If all gvts are evil then we should at the least not prop up other gvts,right?

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 14:02 | 789293 Mr Lennon Hendrix
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Federal governments are now fascist (and have been for a long while), and these corporate sponsored entities are evil by nature due to their selfish behavior.  There is zero benefit for the people of the earth to be used and abused by these entities.  The only thing that keeps people continuing this paradigm, in my opinion, is sadistic and masochistic behavior. 

The TSA workers who follow the new standards of procedure is an example of sadism.  The income tax is an example of masochism, because the Federal Income Tax is illegal and it strips workers of their living wage.  Too bad few people read Sartre.

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 14:07 | 789309 cougar_w
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Word

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 14:36 | 789396 Amish Hacker
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L'enfer est les autres...

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 14:12 | 789277 iDealMeat
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Anyone else hear that massive sucking sound? It's terabytes of traffic leaving MSM sites in search of truth.. All that missed ad revenue is gonna hurt..

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 13:59 | 789286 Bigger Dickus
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THE DOUBLE TOP IN SILVER IS IN!

Expect this to be the intermediate top in euro terms for the next 4 months.

 

The short squeeze to $300 will have to wait.

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 14:10 | 789289 Dr. Acula
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"people should be outraged that their government has transformed a nation... into a backwater that revels in its criminality, cover-ups, injustices and hypocrisies."

But this is inevitable. Governments - i.e. organizations that depend on revenues obtained through threat of violence against innocent people - are inherently criminal. And it is impossible for government to redeem itself by spending the stolen money on the fictitious "public good": there is no means to compare or to sum the subjective valuations of different people.

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 15:10 | 789540 xenophobe51
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Indeed. And look how far down the rabbit hole it goes: http://blogs.houstonpress.com/hairballs/2010/12/wikileaks_texas_company_...

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 15:40 | 789663 Dr. Acula
Dr. Acula's picture

I know your linked-to-story is meant to be shocking, but it didn't work on me. Neither child labor nor pimps nor prostitution necessarily involves victimization. See chapters 1, 2, and 32 here: http://mises.org/books/defending.pdf

There is no clear victim in the story other than the taxpayers - who were victimized at the time the tax funds were collected under duress.

 

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 14:00 | 789290 lsbumblebee
Wed, 12/08/2010 - 14:03 | 789295 jkruffin
jkruffin's picture
"It's not the war information that worries the US, it's the information about the big banks.

This excerpt tells it all.

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 14:07 | 789306 karzai_luver
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The banks would be nothing if the murderous actions that are still concealed would be rubbed in the faces of the consumers.

Of course they would need to be awake and wishing to know.

THAT will not be allowed.

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 14:06 | 789300 cougar_w
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If democracy in America can be torn from the grasp of the neoFascist oligarch corporatocracy, we can thank a foreigner for it.

I am an American and we totally suck at democracy.

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 14:12 | 789331 Dr. Acula
Dr. Acula's picture

What makes you think democracy will magically solve the problems? Is it not part of the problem?

http://mises.org/daily/4871

 

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 14:20 | 789355 cougar_w
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Democracy has problems yes, but it beats the alternatives. Nor does it have to solve problems magically, that fallacy is what allows people to sit back and let the oligarchs take over. The big problem with democracy is you cannot force people to pay attention and give a damn. Greed takes over fairly quickly, since money is its own reward. We're seeing now that democracy probably cannot survive greed, just as others have foretold. That if true would be an interesting lesson learned.

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 14:23 | 789366 IrishSamurai
IrishSamurai's picture

Democracy cannot survive because ...

"A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship. The average age of the world's greatest civilizations has been 200 years." - Alexis de Tocqueville

More a desire of a refutation of TINSTAAFL than greed ...

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 14:35 | 789393 cougar_w
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Oh that's right, I forgot. Greed is good.

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 14:39 | 789403 IrishSamurai
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Have fun on the yellow brick road with Dorothy ...

Obvious troll is obvious.

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 15:09 | 789530 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

I've been around here far too long to be a mere troll. I'm an agent provocateur.

 

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 14:25 | 789370 Dr. Acula
Dr. Acula's picture

"Democracy has problems yes, but it beats the alternatives."

Where is your proof? Note that parroting platitudes learned in collectivist child concentration camps doesn't qualify as proof.

Democracy does excel at providing people with security; specifically, securing people in ovens.

 

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 14:34 | 789391 cougar_w
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Transparently absurd. Enjoy your private nightmare.

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 16:20 | 789805 ronin12
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All good until you got to the ovens part.

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 14:18 | 789351 IrishSamurai
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Good thing we suck at democracy ... the U.S. is representative Republic ...

http://www.1215.org/lawnotes/lawnotes/repvsdem.htm

 

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 14:23 | 789365 cougar_w
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Details details.

I'm claiming prior art; I'm not the only one calls it that.

Maybe we're getting closer to becoming a true democracy and that's the real problem. Maybe in fact that is the cause of all the panic from the top. Their control ... slipping away ...

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 14:27 | 789377 IrishSamurai
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Maybe we're getting closer to becoming a true democracy and that's the real problem.

Spot on.  We're becoming a nation ruled by the mob ignorance ... explains our previous and current figureheads (W and O) ... as well as folks like Charlie Rangel getting elected to 20 consecutive Congressional terms ...

Only way to fix this problem is to get back to what the founders intended ... government is a part-time job, pays jack, and term limits (forced retirement when voluntary retirement is no longer desired) ...

Problem is that our populace is too stupid to understand the benefits of these changes and they'll never happen.

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 14:36 | 789397 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

You had me worried there for a moment. But now I see you do indeed get it.

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 15:08 | 789525 LFMayor
LFMayor's picture

+1  and you did it without making fun of Kids Kohna.  I had to put that in.

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 16:21 | 789808 ronin12
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I would say we are ruled by the corporate oligarchy that is enabled by mob ignorance.

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 15:03 | 789499 LFMayor
LFMayor's picture

We're a constitutional republic... a representative democracy.  This flight to true democracy is exactly how the upper echelon leeches have gamed the system, edging towards the "one pulse, one vote" while buying votes from the numerous lower echelon leeches with free cheese, 99+ weeks of funemployment and vans for the youth "Kids Kohna" activity centers.

Governments are just as susceptible to Pournelle's Iron Law and the next bureaocracy... even the finest eventually merely exist to sustain and expand themselves.

And then there's something about washing the feet of the tree of liberty with Keystone Light...  you know what I mean.

Wed, 12/08/2010 - 14:07 | 789310 chet
chet's picture

Tyler, all these posts about Wall Street are really just getting in the way of your breathless Julian Ass-Hinge ticker.  Why not just switch your format over completely?

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