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Portuguese PM Response To Downgrade: "We Dot Not Need Any Help"
Of course, he will need not only help, but a bailout, in one week when his bonds are trading a 10%+. In the meantime, let the comedy continue.
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Wait. You mean there's no punchline?
The punchline is that they still have an A- rating
We don't need help. Its manageable, its in no way justified. They have lots of money, lots of German money, but I'm not nervous.
"Deutsche Bank AG Chief Executive Officer Josef Ackermann said that investors’ mistrust of Spain is unjustified and that problems in the banking industry are “manageable,” as Europe’s debt crisis intensified.
The fundamental economic data “in no way justifies the apparent mistrust that exists in the case of Spain, though not only there,” Ackermann said in a statement in response to a request for comment by Bloomberg News. “Spain can deal with its problems by itself.”
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-11-30/ackermann-says-mistrust-of-spai...
Ah. This was the punchline I was looking for
Acki: what bank does he work for? How much Spain exposure do they have? Enuf said.
We don't need help. Its manageable, its in no way justified.
Cock-a-doodle-do, Cock-a-doodle-do.
Only one more denial to go.
Baghdad Bob has found a new career in financial spokesmanship! :>D
Funny, I remember the Irish Scumbag saying the same thing...
Definitely some guys getting nervous.
Crude futures just collapsed.
VGGCF .. LOL'
Robo could you post this ... Nearly 1/3rd of Portugals debt is held by Spain ..Lol'
Italy owes France 511 Billion, Portugal owes France 45 billion, Spain owes France 220 Billion...
http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2010/05/02/weekinreview/02marsh.html
It really doesn't matter who owns what. If even one bond is impaired, the cross default will take down the entire edifice. Which is why we don't bother with these silly tables. The entire liability side of the European bank balance sheet is also the asset side of the European bank balance sheet. That is all one needs to know.
Visualizing data always makes it much scarier. So, silly scary chart.
Then cross defaults cross the ocean into North American markets.....then kaboom!
Its called the " epic event "
Multicross assets collapsing all at same time.
Reset time¡
to restart press any key. there doesn't seem to be any any key!
But ... but ...
Whats the last straw then ? Spain, Bailout 2.0, a run on France ? When will it stop ?
After all of Europe.
After CA, IL, NY and NJ.
Maybe then. If not, QE to Infinity, which is our likely fate anyway. Prepare accordingly. Might not be much time left.
They will kick the can.
The dollar is going to climb, Prepare accordingly.
Head & Shoulders'
That's why they teach accounting. To make people think it's something real.
Man you nailed it. It is Enron all over again.
It's like a tug-o-war, except the rope is wrapped around everyone's necks.
Yes, they are diversified:)
GS market-on-close trade was -0.01 under low of day, huh.
Below 70 is a collapse...below 60 wells start shutting down....Above 80 is just a price correction.
They should have Benny Hill run the ECB.
You are right, he could do much better job than Trichet
Thanks for my new favorite song, I'm deaf since Saturday.
In the memory of a great actor, a moment of silence, please. Thank you
Its such a shame Leslie Nielsen died, he would have been perfect actor to play Trichet.
Bankers' Theme Song: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iwBMVg9L7Q0
7bl notional in eminis trade after cash close, AGAIN - futs down 5 handles.
The Gobment of Portugal does not speak for the Banks.
He is totally out of line !
sarc*
ROTFLMAO!!!!!!!!!
THIS IS COMEDY!
Come on dude, this is...a...
TRAGICOMENDY!
Yes, it is. The question is, how will it end?
Paging Jerry Brown. Governor Brown, please come to your press conference.
Less former. More latter.
"We do not need any help"
"We reject any bailout possibility"
"Speculators who are short on our bonds will go broke"
I remember having seen the exact same words two weeks ago. It was about Ireland.
And 6 months before THAT from GREECE! WHO THE F$%^ DO THEY THINK THEY ARE KIDDING! LMAO!
What dumb pricks!
Play the CDS, make money! It's as easy as that...
Thats strange.
I saw Lehman Brothers, Bear Stearns, Greece and others all say the exact same words.
Contagion. Its science.
They also said the same thing about social security in 2006
It's a script. No improv allowed. It spooks the sheep.
Boy, this is turning into a full blown comedy.
Portugal should go help Ireland NOT pass their budget on Dec 7. Help riot in the streets and let the bondholders have the consequences of their risk.
Remember The Hot Rock w/Redford? "Afghanistan Banana Stand", replaced nowadays by, "we don't need any help".
We are really getting set up for a clusterfuck of epic proportions.
Don't forget Belgium.
Time to pull the plug on the patient.
They won't do it on purpose. Someone has accidentally trip over the power cord and unplug the damm thing.
US$ strong after hours...should be a fun overnight. Tops everywhere...
I do not read any ZH.
I guess more hedge funds are going to throw in the towel on everything tomorrow.
And buy the only thing that is going up:
NFLX
From now on if you are going to post a NFLX chart you better post boobies with it or I'm going to stop being nice to you
this isn't rocket science. the trend is ur friend. if it's in an uptrend, might as well be long, until it stops. the market is smarter than we are.
O yes, the daily netflix chart.
Where is your PCLN chart, Robo? Do you only post left-hand charts?
And boobs...where are the boobs?
Robo must have been scolded by High Command for the full titty peek display yesterday. This is a family friendly environment round here.
Second that, chart+boobies or junk.
Robo, at least some booby girls or a TA indication when NFLX will stop being a triple boner.
Looks just like Blockbuster in it's hayday......I'll leave it at that.
Unfortunately, these "crises" are engineered by liquidationists who want more bailouts. And they will get them, too. Our liquidationists run both ends of this Ponzi scheme. They want $70 trillion.
Guess what? They'll get $70 trillion.
If you want to see the reason, just look at bourgeois underemployment.
The bailouts will stop when that reaches 50%. But NOTHING will stop the bailouts ANYTHING short of that.
That's just the way it is.
Haha!
CNBC reports:
UK GDP revised up
Meanwhile CDS spreads across the EU blow out like a wet fart.
again "what exactly is the non-failure that doesn't cause the need for the bailout that they say they don't need?" is that the right way to ask the quesiton? more to the point "why shouldn't France leave the EU"? They're the primary food distributor for the entire Continent--they gain the most through the collapse of the EU while "everyone else pays." Sounds French to me. Is it "truable" though? Or "shall we simply base our investment approach on what the media tells us what is possible and all that other stuff which is utterly impossible until it actually happens."
I vote for Paris Hilton to be the next ECB president.
"We Dot Not Need Any Help"
with our spelling...
[eye roll]
Holy crap, that's exactly what the Irish said. We don't need any help!!!!!
Since January 2009, I am used to read on ZH : the financial world is going under. ES belongs below 350 and other "occult" stuff. Reality is : ES is at 1180.00, Goldman still exists, EUR is trading still above 1.00 EUR/USD and Jamie Dimon is still running the show at JPM. Who cares about Portugal ? Yawn ! Who the ph...ck is taking S&P and other fraudster rating agencies serious ?
$600 billion QE II is THE STORY.
English is complicated language. The subtleties, vagaries and implied content can be really quite convoluted.
Keep reading. You'll learn a lot.
You are reading ZH for the wrong reasons. Silly Monkey
Not sure a bailout is help..
Portuguese PM = The Black Knight?
Just a flesh wound!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zKhEw7nD9C4
Ooh! You read my mind.
I just posted above with the same thought.
I agree -- but you were first. I'm not worthy!
Can't help but think of Muhammed Saeed al-Sahaf, former information minister for Saddam saying Iraq had repelled US troops, as Marine Corp tanks are rolling by him in the background.
OK. I know I'm a bit slow, but I think I've worked it out. This is a controlled detonation of the worlds finances. They pick a country, the bonds go ballistic, and then a bailout is arranged. What is happening at that point is a transfer of banker failed risk to the public purse. If they tried to do this to the world all at once, it would never work, there would be revolt. So it's one country at a time. The countries where this has worked, so far : the US (several bailouts, it's gonna be milked a few times), Greece, Ireland. Portugal is in the sights now. The rest of the PIIGS will go down at some point. Spain will be a big one when it comes. So will the UK.
The only failure, from the bankers perspective, appears to be Iceland, and they keep working on that one to change it to be in their favour. The problem is that it's so obvious that it's not the fault of the 320,000 or so souls who happen to live there, they don't want any part of it. Democracy is only just working, even though the case is clear. In other countries, the fault is perhaps less obvious, so people swallow it.
Are there any other countries that are likely to take a stand?
Doubtful, Ireland was the firewall. If they swallow it, the rest of the spineless Euros will never resist.
ZIMBABWE...........
One day the market is going to stop believing in the bailouts. When that point occurs, no one knows. The reaction to the Irish BS bailout was not that positive, so my guess it that day will come within a few months. It will be meltdown time then!
Why do I keep hearing, "I did not have sexual relations with that woman..."
Cigars are not sexual organs!!
No, but the fit is good. Nice alternative to rum soaked too!
Hoo-aaah!
/alpacino
Mandy pumping CNBC segment "Road to the Recovery"
Mandy, sweet-tits, there is no recovery.
Marvelous Mammary Mandy
Now, haven't I seen this show somewhere else before? I think they do get bailed out in the end. Sorry if I ruined the suspense for anyone.
THEY ARE FULLY FUNDED THROUGH JUNE!!1111ONE
Somebody mistaken the US bonds for Portugal's. Both the 10 and 30 took a dive right after the close.
I confess I don't quite get the logistics mechanism for collapse if a central bank does the bailout. How does that ever run out of money when it can be printed in any amount desired to replace that which disappeared?
In the entire world, led by the US, the source of all the devastation is destruction of national wealth via avalanche of real estate prices. That wealth disappeared, so central banks are now printing new currency, and that is not dilutive. It's just replacing old currency, not adding new, and this is happening all over the world.
So I don't quite see why the Fed or the ECB can't do this for trillions. Until the erased wealth is re-created, there won't be inflation -- especially since housing is the largest portion of a monthly budget.
The danger is deflation if they do not print, of course. In the US, printing is about to stop because the new Fed Board members taking their seats in January are anti QE.
The US has never stopped printing. Just take a look at the USD chart for the past 20 years.
CrashisOptimistic -> There is a big and terrible difference between value and money.
If you dig a hole of 100 billion in the balance sheet of a bank, and then print 100 billion out of nowhere to fill it, where's the problem?
In appearence, there's no problem.
The truth is: normally, these 100 billion should have been repaid by work (=value) expressed in dollars.
But here, these 100 billion have been repaid by no work (= no value) expressed in dollars.
The result? These 100 billion repaid by a central bank will end up in the pockets of people who will use it - for example - to buy ham at the supermarket. The problem is that while the 10 thin-air-created euros in the pocket of these people will buy 20 slices of ham, the number of pigs in the farms has stayed the same as before the repayment. More money to buy + same supply = inflation. If the 100 billion had been repaid by value (the real economy, i.e. tangible goods and services), the number of pigs would have increased, following the repayment speed of the 100 billion in value.
Monetary creation-based inflation is not something about replacing the wealth that disappeared or creating more than the wealth that disappeared. It's not something about "filling exactly 100% of the money that disappeared = good, no inflation", "filling >100% = bad, inflation".
The very act of creating only one euro out of thin air to replace a hundred of supposedly value-based euros that have disappeared is sufficient to create inflation. The very act of replacing only 10% of what has disappeared is sufficient to create inflation.
We are touching very complex subjects, which are not economic subjects, but monetary ones.
This is why contrary to the FED, the ECB has never practiced - for now - thin air creation to fill the holes in bank sheets. If it there was no problem to do so, the ECB would already be doing it, believe me.
Spot on Ponzi, spot on. The ECB knows the danger and don't want to do it, the US on the other hand knows the danger also but are counting on them being able to keep the sheep cowed and at bay when they cut services and raise taxes via inflation in order to enforce austerity on the people. To pay for the bankers and govt. folly.
No, that's probably wrong. It focuses on printing and replacing destroyed money as an activity that takes place absent work.
Well, the money that accumulated via real estate price rise was similarly an accumulation that took place with no work. The system adjusted to accept that wealth to exist.
All the hogs or whatever that were growing in parallel with the increase in real estate price didn't care about the real estate price. At first. The system adjusted to presume and embrace that wealth as being in existance. That is that. The wealth existed and represented no more concrete a manifestation of value than simply what people were willing and able to pay for something that actually was necessary to society -- housing.
Then, suddenly, the wealth was not in existance. Those prices fell. Contraction in overall GDP took place, and the loss of real estate collateral at banks plus the GDP contraction erased wealth. Period. The wealth existed. Then it didn't. Now the central banks must replace it or people die.
I'm not going to slap anyone about hiding behind claims of it being too complex, because it IS complex. But the guys in these central banks are not stupid. And they almost all have good intentions.
Deflation will kill people. Immediately and literally as treatments for disabled adults get defunded. That will be avoided by good intentioned people in power every single time at the risk of some future uncertain "worse" result. And of course the print-to-replace money will wind up in the pockets of people who will buy ham. That's the reason it's done. Deflation would kill them from starvation if they had no money to buy food..
It doesn't change anything to what I said.
Expect that I should have been more precise.
---------------------------------------------------------
There is a value destruction of 100 billion dollars in home prices.
The FED prints 10 billion dollars.
Result : deflation in homes prices, but inflation elsewhere.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
There is a value destruction of 100 billion dollars in home prices.
The FED prints 100 billion dollars.
Result : no deflation in homes prices, but big inflation elsewhere.
As simple as that.
"But the guys in these central banks are not stupid. And they almost all have good intentions. "
If they had good intentions, they would not have allowed the crisis at first. They perfectly knew what would happen. The same ideology is at work in the FED since 1913, not just 2008.
"Deflation will kill people. Immediately and literally as treatments for disabled adults get defunded."
Inflation in this case is only a mandatory tax on every citizen. But money-printing based inflation can very fastly turn into hyperinflation (in fact, everytime in history, it has ended like this)- and then they will die too.
Can someone create ham out of nowhere? No, it can't be.
Can someone create money to buy ham out of nowhere ? Yes, but the ham cannot be created out of nowhere, so you're gonna have a problem sooner or later. Period. The thinair-created money spent on food will not reflate real estate. The value is gone, forever. And the income/salaries associated gone too, forever. So you have unemployed people, and you can't pay their bills eternally with money printing, year after year, as you will soon exceed the original drop in home values, and it will lead to hyperinflation.
"And of course the print-to-replace money will wind up in the pockets of people who will buy ham. That's the reason it's done. Deflation would kill them from starvation if they had no money to buy food.."
Except that the food prices would go down, just like everything else. Concerning the State and cities defaults, which could kill the disabled, it is foolish to think that printing money to cover the losses would end up in another thing than hyperinflation, as the sums involved are horribly huge, and do not only concern artifical valuation of home prices.
This thread will scroll off. We'll revisit this again.
Thank you professor.
Most of the stories I read here makes me think of this diddy.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oMlqn_Hjyi8
It will be under my tree and has been for awhile!
So is the emergency bailout this Sunday night or next Sunday night?
So is the emergency bailout this Sunday night or next Sunday night?
Why is CNBC ignoring the CDS issue with Italy, and Belgium. WTH?
Cos CNBC is part of the scam, they have just the mandate to be permabullish blinding the real fact that leverage is uncontrolled vs false real estate valutions.
It's like watching the same shitty movie over and over again, but it's 10X worse because it's dubbed in Spannish
And ECB is probably there applying leverage already, just as at this stage in Ireland.
What, Me Worry?
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3458/3196834036_80fed4c010.jpg
"It's only a flesh wound!" -- The Black Knight, stump spurting, as his arm is hacked off (Monty Python).
"We do not need any help!" -- Portuguese Prime Minister, as his country is downgraded.
One Ring to find them,
One Ring to bring them all
and in the darkness bind them.
J. R. R. Tolkien, The Fellowship of the Ring, 1954, chapter 2
British scholar & fantasy novelist (1892 - 1973)
Many years ago, when I first read this, I concluded that there were three rings. I know, I know, I'm an idiot. (See 5:53 here)
Who knew he was referring to the vampire squid and credit default swaps?
I'm just shaking my head...
Little did I ever imagine in my lifetime that things would be coming to this. The whole #uckin system is falling apart.
Wikileaks on the upcoming bank release may be the impetus for something big. Unbelievable.