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Rep. Steny Hoyer (D) Called A Liar, Shouted Down For Presenting Misleading Economic Data
The American people are becoming more educated... and more angry...
In other news, Obama's healthcare plan appropriately compared to Erie Canal, set to flush cash out of pockets of majority.
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You know you spell now, not know. And you do know you are dumb a$$ and no once cares if you come or go right?
LOL vicelord WTF?
Gone where? Does "vicelord" have some crack to sell to school children before pimping his mom for dice money?
Listen You, and all you fucking idiots commenting here who just don't get it. The people represented in that video are no different than you or I. They are pissed the fuck off, and they want fucking answers. And they are confronting their turd representative and letting him know in no uncertain terms that they are not buying his shit anymore.
Sure, you may disagree with them ideologically, or you may disdain their politics, or even their way of life. FINE. So be it. But don't confuse their ideology with the senitment, which is the same as yours. Exactly the same. I.E. you are pissed off at the lying, cheating, philandering, bank-bail-outing politicians, and so are they. YOU ARE ALL ON THE SAME SIDE. You just happen to have pissy little minor insignificant-in-the-greater-scheme-of-things differences of little consequence to the real matter at hand, which is the enslavement of the American people for the politicial and corporate elite.
So stop abiding with this fucking left/right, Democrat/Republican, liberal/conservative divide that DOES NOT EXIST. It's all in your fucking head, hammered in place by a lapdog media over the past 20 years that exists simply to make you fear and dislike The Other, so that you can be effectively DIVIDED AND CONQUERED.
Or does that please you? Does it please you that you have acted like the perfect little pawn in this game of Sic The American People on Themselves While We Rape and Loot the Wealth and Resources of This Land? Stop being a fucking pawn already. Be a Bishop, or a Rook, or a fucking Castle. Be a god damn King or Queen, even if only in your own deluded mind, but don't be a fucking pawn anymore, because that role has already been filled by millions of Americans and that is why we are in the desperate straights that we are.
These people are facing down their "elected" leader. What are you doing? Pissing at them on the internet behind the saftey of ephemeral pixels. Meanwhile, they are there fighting for YOUR rights as well.
Do ya get it now?
WAKE THE FUCK UP.
I am Chumbawamba.
Repubs are once again laughing their asses off after setting up a shout down using scare tactics...and getting these people to act against their own self interest. Note the age of the participants...they're already on public health care but clearly don't know it! Repubs lost and are unsurprisingly poor losers plus their tactics are becoming more slimy and desperate.
This stuff is way out on the fringe. MSM has a knack for focusing on minutiae and missing the profound changes that are occurring not only in the economy, but in the country as a whole.
I just want the same health care Dick Cheney gets.
The Steve Austin treatment?
The quality of the commenters to this blog is definitely not up to this blog's non-political content.
It's strange, but not surprising, that incredibly economically-sophisticated individuals would be politically retarded.
But if Tyler wants to stay influential, he'll stay the fuck out of politics qua politics, because the more he goes there, the more foolish he sounds. Stick to the Street, buddy.
Uh, isn't it a bit politically retarded to call somebody politically retarded? I guess your post was self-referential.
Love the irony. Hope that's what you were going for.
Ad hominem and guilt-by-association are such sophisticated arguments that lead to the type of high-level discourse you claim to want. (Et tu, vicelord.)
Can you please enlighten us with your definition of "politically retarded?"
After all, aren't those words synonyms?
I personally support people who go and yell at their politicians.
At this point, dialogue has been shown not to work.
Everyone e-mailed their congressmen over TARP, it didn't make the slightest difference.
Better to show you are on to them, fed up, and not going to take it any more.
Removing Obama from office, whether through crying about his birth certificate or by criticizing 'his' policies, is the biggest step forward, in terms of citizen power, that this country has seen since the early 70s.
Get Ron Paul in there, and we will see if he is paid off, if so, we will have to remove him as well.
But this crony capitalism and road to infinite bureaucracy (fascism) has to stop!
THANK YOU. Someone who actually gets it. Do we have another?
I am Chumbawamba.
There are several post here today by people who "get it"
Why don't you read their posts?
what struck me more than anything from the video was how this sack of shit CONgressman totally talked down and down to his constituents.....his contempt could not have been greater than if he mooned his audience....the man is out of touch...i hope his district throws this piece of crap out of office....in fact they would do well to launch a recall....
'If Tyler wants to stay influential'
Sounds like a threat, or the start of a defamation campaign.
Hmm, being defamed, evidence you are on the right track, the most well-known way to attack someone's argument? In this case, I believe the argument was in favor of not listening to politician's bullshit, and calling them on it.
It doesn't mean ZH takes a specific position specifically agreeing with 100% of what the guy in the video says///
this is a pretty small disturbance in the force. stay tuned. it will get better.
rr
Imagine if this fellow really knew the full extent of the lying and favoritism shown to the favored few?
Of Barofsky's $25 trillion or so of aid and support in this crisis, upwards of 99% of it has been directed toward the exact people who caused the crisis, the banks and IB's and financial firms.
The rest of America got a mild tax rebate and Crumbs for the Clueless, aka Cash for Clunkers (Wow! $3 billion! Let me see, three billion divided by twenty five trillion equals....)
And what if he knew that Goldman Sachs got $56.7 billion in direct aid, not to mention the ZIRP and legal Fed frontrunning in the MBS/Treasury/CP market that helps GS earn $100 million a day and dole out $772,000 per employee while this poor lout might get canned? (again, 3 billion divided by 56.7 billion for one company)
Too bad that someone who has the ear of the people does not drill this reality into the public day in and day out, on TV, the internet, newspapers, radio---wherever Americans get their information---relentlessly.
TD, you have an audience, but it's too small and you are anonymous. Ron Paul speaks too slowly and too softly. Dylan Ratigan is on MSNBC (enough said). What America needs is someone with the eyeballs of an American Idol finalist and the oratory skill of MLK.
Don't see it happening, but wouldn't it be nice?
All you have do is listen to the protesters at the Town Hall meetings to realize that they don't have a clue. Are they angry yes, but sadly they are not educated. Why they are stooges for the insurance industry is a mystery.
I for one applaud ZH for posting this video clip.
I applaud the people in the video for standing up to their congresspeople and voicing their opinions.
What I see is a group of people wanting their voices heard and moreover, a call for help for leadership in their(our)struggle to gain back their lives, freedoms and desires of what this country was and should be. Maybe even a calling from the "pen is mightier than the sword" crowd (scratch pen...insert keyboard) to get out from behind their desks and bring their educated (scratch educated...inset well thought out) views out with these brave people.
Personally, I need about 500k persons views on whether my hard earned money is in a safe bank or I should move it elsewhere.
They're teabaggers (and you know what teabagging is right?) for Mithras' sake!
Politicians all deserve to be yelled at but by edumacated people, not by total moroons who consistently vote against their own best interests (ie, poor folk who vote for the GOP).
You seem to be an elitist who is purported for helping the little guy. I guess that's what your education got you - you can pretend to be for the common folk while disdaining and raping them (economically and socially). Fwiw, I hate both parties but if I had to choose (and I'm VERY glad I don't), I'd vote D, so don't try to claim I'm some Rethug sheep.
Ad hominem and guilt-by-association (the two forms of argument you are using here) are losing arguments. You don't make them if you have real points.
What's a moroon?
Your comments are so uninformed I don't know where to begin. Suffice it to say you are the moron.
A "moroon" is similar to the "moran" also posted on many such "protesters" signs (teabaggers are a very literate bunch). Edumacated out the yingyang on their bibles and GOP mailers.
Applauding these "morans" is like applauding some dice roller in Vegas for being a "genius" for rolling a pair of 7s. Like being happy that your broken clock is right twice a day.
It would be more meaningful (the protesters) if they weren't the same old shrill dolts that also carry signs comparing Obama to Hitler while also calling him a communist or socialist! Let's get one thing straight here - these people are angry simply because the Dems are currently in control rather than their GOPer champions. They are angry NOT because they actually understand any of this. They merely respond to dog whistles from their GOP/reichwing handlers.
They're morons (happy?). Get a truly informed and articulate person in there who can be angry and actually address factual issues rather than nonsense. Someone who isn't angry and yelling simply because the suit standing before them is a D rather than an R.
It isn't that they are Dems, it's because of the completely reckless spending and they have had enough. Stimulus, enormous budget increases, potential cap and trade costs, CFC, bailouts, etc. and now spending on healthcare which will cost much more than the estimates.
It's unsustainable and these people get it. I guess you don't so you call them names.
Bush's war spending, tax giveaways to the rich, and TARP giveaways weren't? Not to mention the housing and credit bubble on his watch that cost the American people trillions of lost wealth.
Where was the anger then?
Yeah, like voting Democrat has really helped all those poor black folk over the last 30 years.
They're teabaggers (and you know what teabagging is right?) for Mithras' sake!
Politicians all deserve to be yelled at but by edumacated people, not by total moroons who consistently vote against their own best interests (ie, poor folk who vote for the GOP).
then you should go back to school and get your edumucation and learn that it is spelled education
your sick
Mithras' sake
what don't you know¿
Urban Dictionary: edumacatedOk, now Hoyer may be (is) a liar but the protestors are "teabaggers", a decrepit and totally disreputable bunch of partisans from "the other side of the aisle".
Liar Hoyer may be but it isn't very convincing evidence coming from the hopelessly moronic and homeschooled (with a bible!) crowd.
Hi Speaker Pelosi,
What a dumb post. You forgot to mention the swastikas they were wearing.
Let's discredit their claims and call them names because we don't agree with them. Your part of the problem.
If you vote for ANY incumbent, you are the problem. No exceptions.
Ahmen! VOTE THEM ALL OUT!!!!!!!!!
And vote in candidates NOT supported by the R or D machines. No exceptions. Or else you're just as likely to get someone worse as someone better.
echo that! +10
Tyler,
It would never cross my mind to argue with you about trading and markets. You're the expert, I'm the student.
But when it comes to health care, you are way out of your domain of expertise, and it shows. It's downright painful to tell you the truth.
I happen to know a lot about health care; first as a physician (now retired from clinical practice) and as a policy wonk on public health and health care systems. I've worked in Europe, Canada and the US, so no one will lecture me about comparative health care systems delivery.
It is also plainly obvious that you chose to disregard the origins of this fake grassroots (it's called astroturfing). Just go to recessrally.com and take a look at the sponsors of these "spontaneous movements" of "average citizens".
Come on! Do for these what you did with GS and other excellent pieces you wrote. Use your investigative skills and ask yourself THE question: Cui bono?
If you do not have the time to do so, someone was kind enough to do the legwork, which can be seen here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tl91YF1d3Kg
You will then see the video you posted in an entirely different light.
So mister policy wonk, can we ask the cui bono question about you? How do YOU benefit in all this?
No one can lecture you in comparative health care systems delivery? With a line like that you show that you're as much of a physician as Ben Stein is an economist.
Are you serious Mr. Policy Wonk? I thought the youtube link would be an unbiased report with facts. It's Rachel Maddow on MSNBC (like CNBC it's GE TV).
Don't fall for GE TV they have an agenda. I think Tyler has laid that out rather well over the last two months.
Honestly, is this the best you can do? This is the second or third post citing Rachel Maddow as some unbiased reporter. Remember it's GE TV shilling for the Obama administration.
Let me get this straight:
This is GE, and GE schills for Obama. Guess this why they gave clear instructions to their journalists to tone down any critic of the necessity to go to war in Iraq...whatever.
But...this is GE, ergo, nothing they say can be factual.
Ergo, anything they say MUST be interpreted as tilting for Obama.
1st Lt Spock would be proud.
GE owns CNBC.... no Obama shills there.
GE only shills for itself.
LOL!
Proof that it is easy to get carried away in the heat of the discussion.No one who does not have a proven expertise, that is. Of course, there are people who know more, (duh! I had to learn somewhere like everyone else) but most certainly not the kind of people you see on this video. Quite a few of them don't even know that the Medicare they use is a governement-run program, yet they scream "Get the governement out of my medicare." Sorry man, but I fail to see where are these citizens who are "becoming more educated."
How do I benefit? You mean financially? Let me surprise you here: Not at all.
Don't you have things for which you feel passionetely about? Health care is one of those things for me. Seeing people dying needlessly will do that to someone.
Comparing me to Ben Stein was a deliberate insult. Completely uncalled for. Is that why you post anonymously? To exercise your free speech rights to insult people? Does the word civility ring any bell?
Actually I'm still waiting for my login to be approved. I applaud you for your altruistic leanings. I have to say that I have not seen any educating coming from the proponents side though. If these people are misinformed, then shouldn't they be given proper information instead of being called horrible names? Do the congressmen and senators have anything but talking points? Where is their demonstration of knowledge when somebody questions them about a section of the bill and they just refuse to answer? Not all of the protesters are screaming yahoos.
If you can be so informed upon the virtues of changing the health care delivery system then why can't the people who are trying to force the change be so as well?
Every doctor/policy wonk I've ever met, and I work at Harvard Med so I've met hundreds, has no common sense when it comes to running their own medical practice - most of them work at teaching hospitals because running their own practice profitably is far too difficult. NONE of them should even BE policy wonks if they CAN'T run their own practice.
No love for the Daily Bail huh, Tyler? We posted this clip this morning...our missions dovetail, and I try to give you credit if I find something here and use on our site. I know from teh videos you post that you peruse our site...just a shout out occasionally would be nice...
I wrote some supportive stuff about you guys during the DK bullshit as well. We did 340,000 uniques in July, down from 560,000 in June so your site and ours are leading the anti-corruption, anti-capture charge. Our Quantcast ranking is top 6,000 and I believe you are getting up there near us as well.
I wonder 200 years from now what present-day's "Let them eat cake" soundbite will live on forever.
Where were these faux patriots when the bailouts were gifted to the banks with a big fat smooch from Hanky "Panky" Paulson? Way to spend my money Hanky! Where were these chickenhawks when the neocons wanted to turn Iraq into a taxpayer-funded, military-industrial lollapalooza? Where were these Foxaganda puppets when Bush was running up the American Credit Card? Rest my f0cking case.
Summary of your "case":
(Asserted without any evidence or proof, although even if true it's irrelevant:) These guys didn't protest A and they should have. (Implied, again without any proof, although even if true, it's irrelevant: "These guys supported A".) These guys didn't protest B and they should have. (ditto parenthetical comments.) Therefore, their protest of C is not credible.
Add some ad hominem. Hope the jury buys it.
Great case. I think you should settle quickly and not bother arguing that in court.
So you actually saw all of the Bush protesters. Perhaps you have footage of the R's in Congress yelling about what Bush's programs would cost.
I have been asking the same question and since none of their programs have paid for themselves I say REPEAL THEM NOW.
Let's start with Bush's tax cuts on the rich, his no bid contracts to Haliburton, his expensive deregulation, his wars, and his giveaways to big Pharma in Medicare part D.
All of which have cost the taxpayer plenty, while redistributing the wealth of the people to the already wealthy.
Actually, as I recall, there were plenty of people protesting TARP.
Unfortunately, Obama was not one of them. He had a seat at the table when the details were being ironed out, and he kept his mouth shut. He totally missed HIS opportunity to stop TARP if he thought it was such a bad idea.
I guess that makes him a :faux patriot: by your definition.
Maybe, instead of voting for him, you should have expressed your displeasure about TARP so he would have actually done something to stop it.
Man, arguing on the interwebs is no fun at all when people know what a logical fallacy is, or when they have gotten used to all kinds of diversionary tactics...
Oh misinformation, how much i have learnt from thee.
Obama doesn't have a health care plan. He has some ideas. That does not make a plan. The idea that the House can come up with a plan is ludicrous. Any plan will be over a thousand pages and be filled with so much crap nobody will know what they just voted for.
Correction: The House will be given a plan by the lobbyists. As long as it does not degrade their way of obtaining healthcare, our so called representatives will approve it without reading it (although they wouldn't be able to understand it if they tried).
I think the real question is why Steny Hoyer was speaking to an audience of approximately 8 people.
Anarchy in the UK, Anyone?
Get pissed.
Destroy.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQkActP-isE
Let me tell YOU the facts Congressman:
YOU WORK FOR THE PEOPLE, not the other way around.
Your patronizing attitude is incredible.
Even more incredible is your absolute pathetic grasp of the facts.
Is it just me, or has Obama already become a LAME DUCK President?
It's got to be a record?
Just some passing thoughts.
I consider the Tea Party folks a leading indicator. Despite the sponsorship issue, I would suggest that the Tea Party folks have four resources:
1) ideals - it might be possible that they are not violent right now because they still believe in the system. That faith gives them energy and - believe it or not - patience right now
2) guns - lots of them - which gives them tremendous confidence. It's a friendly kinda' place - 'cause thar ain't no bad shots in this town...
3) kids - which they are more than willing to kill for if they feel that their pacifistic efforts to enforce their basic rights and civil liberties have failed (the point of no return)
4) finally, they have each other - all across America and around the entire world. Which means that they can mobilise in a heart-beat. Keep in mind - the Tea Party movement did not even exist in February of this year!
The Tea Party is a very visible form of protest which might be indicative of other groups organising in myriad forms right now in the USA. It could quite possibly be a critical situation. If one group declares a tax revolt (or other aggressive action) - well - it is not inconceivable that all other groups will jump on that band wagon real quick. Today's protesters aren't hippies with flowers and beads.
I would suggest that the statement made in the blog post "getting angry and better informed" is quite accurate. I would add - better organised and better funded.
For reasons of my own, I remain optimistic that a feasible solution exists to America's problems. May the American government come up with a brilliant idea that can quickly stop this silly Depression in the USA!
Thanks to ZH and the commenters today!
Namke von Federlein
It's kinda sad that Bama has turned out to be such a liar. Look at all the broken promises so far:
1. Immigration reform = won't touch that one.
2. End "don't ask don't tell" = too risky now.
3. Balancce the budget in ten years = LOL
4. Won't raise taxes on 95% of Americans = new trial ballons every week on ways to raise taxes.
5. Save or create jobs = only at Goldman and JPMorgan, thank you.
6. Reform Patriot Act abuses = Bush, part deux.
7. Diplomatic solution with Iranian Dictator = he don't want to talk (Israel will handle that one).
8. Allow Bankruptcy Court to modify mortgages on primary residences = yawn, didn't lift a finger, Jamie D said he don't like that idea.
9. Negotiate health care reform in public on C-SPAN = negotiate in smoked filled room.
10. Support repeal of Defense of Marriage Act = went to court and took the opposite position.
11. Pay-As-You-Go Budget rules = RFLMAO
12. create Cap and Trade = Trying very hard but Goldman needs to do the heavy lifting in Congress.
13. "I'll put in place common sense regulations and rules of the road I've been calling for since March - rules that will keep our market free, fair, and honest; rules that will restore accountability and responsibility in our boardrooms." = awaiting recommendations from Goldman on new rules to improve fair and honest markets.
Bottom line = 1 termer ala Jimmy C
But he did keep his promise to get the kids a nice puppy, as noted by Mr. Stoyer's constituent.
Folks, lets not get caught up in the shrill voices on either side. The visitors from the left side of the spectrum have a point, the point being that there is a larger lobby behind these movements.
That is not to say that the mostly middle age to elderly people attending the events have a prime motive of wanting big insurance to prosper. No, most likely these people most are signed up to right wing e-mail groups which provide them with times and places to confront their local representative. Many of these people just mindlessly parrot what they hear on Fox or Hannity, it's true.
Is it manufactured? Sure. To be sure, this isn't people looking through the newspaper as individuals and saying, "hey, I'm going to that townhall event next Tuesday to give my congressman a piece of my mind!" No, they are receiving this information from lobbyists whether they realize it or not.
Here's the thing, I fail to see the difference of people who are signed up with ACORN, Moveon.org, etc., whose organizations are equally controlled by lobbyists. In fact some of the same lobbyists. These organizations form protests and similar things by mass e-mailing as well.
However, I will say this, I do believe the electorate is cut into thirds. One-third is to the left, another third to the right, and the last but not least third smack dab in the center. The extreme left or right are deeply informed in their ideology and care very little for their opponents view point. From there its a blended spectrum towards the center. The people in the very center are probably the least informed. They see a candidate with a nice smile, who also appears presidential, and they vote for him. Unfortunately, it is these people who decide our elections.
In general the gut reaction of most Americans (sorry liberals, this is true) is center right. Obama campaigned only slightly to the left of McCain. He used ambiguous messages of hope and change without ever laying out clearly what he hoped to change. Thus, the man was a walking Rorschach test; the people in the center projected what they wanted to see upon him. The extreme left was going to vote for him no matter what, and the right was going to vote against him. Unfortunately, you must be a political chameleon to win over the centrist vote, and consequently win the whole she-bang!
I'll grant you that the majority part of the American electorate is ill informed. We've been conditioned since birth to think in bumper sticker logic, and to speak in sound bytes. Most "joe six-packers" are just worried about everyday things, and don't have enough time to get caught up in the details.
However, I think many Americans sense something isn't right about the way things have been running for years. They want a change, but they don't really know what change they want. So, when they see a politician who campaigns on hope and change, and then acts like every other politician that's been in office for the past 200 and some odd years, they start to get fed up. Everybody has limits.
Now, what most of the American public doesn't realize is that the once great America, supposed "leader of the world", is potentially over. The only thing that's preventing our collapse is that of all the nations that have the potential to become the next super-power, we are the one, ironically, that is doing the least bad among them. So, for now, we are still the reserve currency for the world, who, for the most part still believes we have the most stable system. Until the USD collapses, and it will, we're still the big dogs. Whether it's next week or 10 yrs from now remains to be seen.
When that happens all hell will break loose, and the division of republican and democrat will be meaningless. Tether yourself to no party, to no man or woman, and no cult of personality, but bind your conscience to ideas, the ideas of our nation's founding. Hopefully we will survive the coming tsunami.
The difference is the quantity of lies that are told via the right's lobbying groups, in an effort to maintain control of the health care profits by scaring senior citizens and other uneducated citizens into a frenzy
Check out CEO Rick Scott, former head of Solantic and current Head of Conservatives for Patient Rights.
Biggest Medical Fraud EVER by a company.
This is who these people are rallying with.
"I wonder 200 years from now what present-day's "Let them eat cake" soundbite will live on forever."
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ZyAd_rJAx4