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Republicans "Call Obama's Bluff" Schedule Vote Next Week For Deficit Cap, Debt Ceiling Raise, Balanced Budget

Tyler Durden's picture




 

Contrary to some expectations that the end of the week would see some resolution in the ongoing Washington soap opera, or at least provide some hope for a weekend meeting, things keep deteriorating after the adversarial language in DC keeps escalating, in what appears set to be an epic Nash Equilibrium showdown. To wit: even Jim DeMint just tweeted that Boehner has just called "Obama's Bluff" confirming that the prevalent of the charade is nothing more than a game of cards. From Bloomberg: "The U.S. House plans a vote next week on a measure that would raise the government’s debt limit by $2.4 trillion, cut spending, cap government expenditures and propose a balanced-budget constitutional amendment, Republican Representatives Sean Duffy and Billy Long said." Per Reuters, "House of Representatives Speaker John Boehner said on Friday that deficit reduction legislation due for a House vote next week is "a solid plan" for moving forward toward an increase in the U.S. debt limit. The legislation, favored by Tea Party-backed lawmakers, would cut and cap federal spending while calling for adoption of a balanced budget amendment. "We're far from the time for a last-ditch effort," Boehner told a news conference at which he criticized Democrats including President Barack Obama for producing no "real plan" with serious spending cuts." If nothing else, this indicates that the Cantor wing in DC continues to usurp power from Boehner, and while this is certainly nothing more than power politics at their best (or worst) the one direct impact of all of this is that the outcome of a US technical default, so dreaded by all, could be the reset switch that was so needed to be pushed after Lehman, yet was merely kicked perpetually into the future: a path that is guaranteed to have a catastrophic ending. Yes, the pain would be acute, but like Iceland, America will survive, and yes: the current status quo will be wiped out. But the country will have a literal and figurative "fresh start." 

Then again, none of this will happen as DC will betray the interests of future generations of America and promptly remember that on a NPV basis, it is the very same status quo that pays the bills...

 

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Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:00 | 1459336 tip e. canoe
tip e. canoe's picture

goddess bless iceland

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:19 | 1459458 Doyle Hargraves
Doyle Hargraves's picture

Amen, they bitch slapped those bankers and threw off their shackles! Makes you realize where the real land of the free is at!

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:48 | 1459666 eureka
eureka's picture

Yeah, just like US Republican A-hole Teapartiers (RAT) bitch slapped Obama.... NOT!

RAT Eric Cantor holds ProShares UltraShort 20+ Year Treasury.

Like oligarch RATs believe in US Treassuries....

HAhahahahahaha - auw my stomach - hahahahahaha - hahahaha, that's FF, Bitchez!

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:31 | 1459907 Doyle Hargraves
Doyle Hargraves's picture

Yeah they don't have the balls to bitch slap anyone, that being said I say let it burn, default on everything and let Schumpeter's law of Creative Destruction take over. Obama, Republicans, Tea Party all those fucks are the in the same party. They have cheap kabuki theatre productions then go behind close doors and drink together laughing at how they fooled all the sheep american people out there with their performances. However, as many have noted in these spaces before and many will after me PMs are the ultimate lie detector. Soon, it will expose all the BS for the world to see. Hope you have some if not, suck it!

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:36 | 1459934 TaxSlave
TaxSlave's picture

Repudiate!

It's not my debt.  And I'm not paying it.

Will you?

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 13:50 | 1460146 Jonas Parker
Jonas Parker's picture
"by eureka
on Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:48
#1459666

RAT Eric Cantor holds ProShares UltraShort 20+ Year Treasury."

 

Other than a "Kaiser Report" video posted over on "Ticker Forum" you can confirm this, can't you???   Didn't think so...

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 14:39 | 1460376 Crashpanic
Crashpanic's picture

It is true. Here are his financial disclosures on opensecrets.

http://pfds.opensecrets.org/N00013131_2010.pdf

However, it is a measly 15k out of a total portfolio of over $5 million that would be hit hard with a real default, so the argument using his short position falls flat.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:26 | 1459517 lolmao500
lolmao500's picture

Godbless the topless.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:34 | 1459568 Marco
Marco's picture

Iceland is not exactly limiting government budget to 18% of GDP now is it though?

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:49 | 1459677 i-dog
i-dog's picture

Obomber's last two budgets were 42% of GDP!!

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:02 | 1459759 Marco
Marco's picture

What do you think Iceland's is?

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:08 | 1459797 OldTrooper
OldTrooper's picture

Uhmm...has there ever been a 'budget'?  I doubt your 42% figure is correct in any event.  Sources please.  Hysterical over-exageration does not help - the truth is ugly enough.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 15:19 | 1460430 i-dog
i-dog's picture

           GDP           Fed Spending
          -----------    ---------------

2009 14,119.0  5,896.2  = 42%

2010 14,508.2  6,063.3  = 42%

What is even worse is that Bush's deficits averaged 2% of GDP, while Obomber's have so far been 10% & 10.7% of GDP!!

Do your own research and provide figures to refute mine ... or STFU!

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 15:58 | 1460681 OldTrooper
OldTrooper's picture

I'm not very good at shutting up.  So, what I found - from an organization that would almost certainly paint the figures in the worst possible light so as to give you the benefit of the doubt - is:

2009  3.576 trillion

2010  3.618 trillion

http://www.heritage.org/research/reports/2010/06/federal-spending-by-the-numbers-2010?utm_source=Chartbook&utm_medium=researchpaper&utm_campaign=budgetchartbook

Now, this is a pretty significant difference.  It seems like your numbers may be for ALL government spending at ALL levels - which I could certainly believe.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:51 | 1459997 Havana White
Havana White's picture

U.S. GDP is $15.2 trillion.  Latest budget is about $3.8 trillion.

Our budget, then, is 25% of GDP.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 23:01 | 1460445 i-dog
i-dog's picture

.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:02 | 1459342 karzai_luver
karzai_luver's picture

the banksters and the Chamber of COnmerce will never allow the pugs

to throw the reset as they know they would be torched and there are still plenty of suckers to loot.

Forget all the WestWing drama series bull.....that boobtube thing was more real

than this kabuki.

 

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:19 | 1459348 lolmao500
lolmao500's picture

Some republicans said that the August 2 deadline is BS and that the government is funded till the end of september.... it's gonna be epic if they let the deadline pass without doing anything.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/07/15/gop-takes-new-tack-in-debt-ta...

Issa added that President Obama is being "intransigent," and he called the Aug. 2 date "arbitrary" and fabricated.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:40 | 1459949 Lord Blankcheck
Lord Blankcheck's picture

I always though SS checks go out on the 1st day of the month? especially electron tranfers

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 13:10 | 1460054 granolageek
granolageek's picture

It's the third of the month. It has been at least since the 70's

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:02 | 1459349 lieutenantjohnchard
lieutenantjohnchard's picture

hat tip michelle malkin: where's the talk that if the debt limit isn't increased the irs will have to shut down?

excellent zinger.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:04 | 1459354 freethinker4now
freethinker4now's picture

Life is a rollercoaster, Washington DC is the BIG show

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:08 | 1459382 Iriestx
Iriestx's picture

What a sad dog and pony show.  It's all just theater.  They're going to up the limit, without any tax increases or spending cuts.  This is just them pretending to pander to their bases and look tough.

 

It's just political theater.  This is all scripted.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:16 | 1459437 JLee2027
JLee2027's picture

To an extent, yes. But with the President not committing to spending cuts and demanding tax increases, heels are digging in.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:26 | 1459518 Iriestx
Iriestx's picture

I contend that this is all as scripted as any "reality" TV show.  The decision on this was made months and months ago.  These are just actors playing their parts as the bank has told them to play it.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:04 | 1459769 eureka
eureka's picture

Will RATs Pay For Betray ? Will Teapartiers rally & roar, demand to cut Fed But? For Real?

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:34 | 1459564 grey7beard
grey7beard's picture

with the President not committing to spending cuts and demanding tax increases

 

I'm concerned about you, JLee.  Your input here doesn't seem based in reality.  Spending cuts are on the table, and have been on the table.  What is off the table, and has been off the table, are tax increases.  What propaganda mill are you getting your information from?

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:16 | 1459839 Uncle Remus
Uncle Remus's picture

What propaganda mill are you getting your information from?

 

Back at ya.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:11 | 1459820 tarsubil
tarsubil's picture

No, people are losing faith in the Republican party. This show is exclusively for them and to keep them on the plantation.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:17 | 1459845 Uncle Remus
Uncle Remus's picture

No, people are losing faith.

 

Fixed it for you.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:43 | 1459965 mayhem_korner
mayhem_korner's picture

Well played, Unc.  x 2.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 14:15 | 1460286 weinerdog43
weinerdog43's picture

Well, yes, if you ignore both the argument and reality.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 14:32 | 1460352 tarsubil
tarsubil's picture

Well, yes, but more Republicans are so they need a win in their column. Depending on how the turd slides, Democrats may be up for a win next.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:18 | 1459450 Mr Kurtz
Mr Kurtz's picture

Absolutely right. Wall Street has spoken and their will be a clean one-sentence bill authorizing an increase in the debt limit. No cuts, no closing of loop holes, no nada. Just a lot of bloviating and theatre to keep the sheeple on both sides pacified until the grand sheering down the road.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:54 | 1459995 monkeyshine
monkeyshine's picture

Some of it is theater, yes, but no it is not scripted. All politics is local, as famous speaker of the house Tip O'Neil said, which is why this is taking so long and being dragged out.  Do you think that Ron Paul's constituents want him to raise the debt limit? Do you think Eric Cantor's constituents want him to raise taxes on those earning over $250,000?  These guys want to be returned to congress next year, so they have to hold fast and dance with those who brung them.  It is in fact Cantor's job as minority leader to count the votes of both dems and gops and it was reported that the flare up between him and potus was that Cantor kept saying there weren't the votes for Obama's compromise. Potus didn't want to hear it. So there it is. We'll see.  I say, forget negotiations, the house should put together the best bill they can pass and send it to the Senate. This needs to get out in the open no more back door rooms it allows them to do the opposite of what potus said today - that they dig in their heels. NO by working in secret rooms they get to negotiate away their so-called principles and we need to know who stands where. What I hate most about politics is when people agree to let things come up for a vote, knowing they will pass, negotiating for themselves the ability to vote no.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 14:24 | 1460322 weinerdog43
weinerdog43's picture

"It is in fact Cantor's job as minority leader to count the votes of both dems and gops and it was reported that the flare up between him and potus was that Cantor kept saying there weren't the votes for Obama's compromise. Potus didn't want to hear it. So there it is."

1st, Cantor isn't minority leader.  That is Nancy Pelosi.  2nd, it's Bohner's job to count.  He is the Speaker.  Your real argument is that Bohner does not have the votes to pass it with the Republics alone.  That is correct.  The reality is that there are serious fractures w/in both caucuses.  All cuts and zero revenue increases guarantee zero Dem votes.  Same holds true the other way around.  The likely outcome is that it will be mutally suckworthy and only kick the can farther down the road. I'm doubtful that making the process more open will make it better.  It was Bismarck that said you shouldn't watch 2 things being made:  sausage and legislation. 

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:10 | 1459395 SilverDoctors
SilverDoctors's picture

Ron Paul survey.
Would you vote for Ron Paul in 2012? If so, when were you converted?
Trying to get a grasp on what percentage of those who plan on voting for Paul in 2012 did not in 2008.
We plan on sharing the info with the Paul campaign, so would appreciate reader input!

http://silverdoctors.blogspot.com/2011/07/ron-paul-survey.html

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:24 | 1459500 JW n FL
JW n FL's picture

and which party will support Ron Paul? the Koch Bro's Party?

A President can DO NOTHING without control of the house and senate and the dummyocrats already showed you that even if a party has control they will do NOTHING! Gridlock! lots of talking about talking and doing nothing but let "We the People" suffer! they dont give a fuck about us!

 

So even if 1 guy does care! he can NOT move the system by himself. FACT!

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:10 | 1459811 eureka
eureka's picture

"We The People" should secede from The Federation.

IF - they want to have a say over their local and national lives.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:15 | 1459833 tarsubil
tarsubil's picture

One thing Ron would be able to do as CIC would be to bring the troops home. That's better than starting another war. He also would be able to put some road blocks up with vetos. Maybe he could get at the Fed somehow too. He wouldn't be able to fix everything but he would be a monkey wrench in the machine. Assuming he isn't a stooge of course.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:51 | 1459996 JW n FL
JW n FL's picture

If Ron Paul does get Elected (which I am not against).. and if Ron Paul after being elected does NOT! go along with the Status Quo.. this is what it looks like.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6xEK16kLHsM

I would assume Obama.. maybe even Bush all had the same conversation with the same people.. do what we want or else! Kennedy was a Billionaire before it was kool! he could not be bought! so they killed him. Ever President since Kennedy has been in-line with the Status Quo.. no matter which Party they belong too! D's and R's both will fall in line with the powers that be, no matter how many dog and pony shows are put on to entertain the ignorant masses.

 

There is NO difference between the Parties. NONE!!

No President will stand against the Powers That Be! and live to see any real changes occur!

"We the People" are fucked until "We the People" take back what is ours to begin with. FACT!

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 13:41 | 1460168 Jonas Parker
Jonas Parker's picture

Vote for Ron Paul to be the next president of the Republic of Texas! Time for us to get out while the gettin's good!

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 14:26 | 1460331 weinerdog43
weinerdog43's picture

Don't let the door hit your ass on the way out.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 14:39 | 1460378 tarsubil
tarsubil's picture

It is stuff like this that makes me like you. Sadly, you are probably right about Paul if he succeeds and isn't a stooge. But his death might just end up being the deto that is able to ignite the apathetic unhappiness of the American people.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 14:55 | 1460429 JW n FL
JW n FL's picture

Kennedy was LOVED and NO! ONE!! did a damn thing for him! Ronnie boy is NO! Kennedy. So as far as him being able to ignite "We the Lazy Ignorant Consumer Masses" I would pray that anything would but I dont see Ronnie making it happen, dead or alive. So we would be down another public personality that cuts across the grain.. it would be a twofer for the AAA Rated Corporate Clans! AGAIN!

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 15:48 | 1460627 tarsubil
tarsubil's picture

It would be a lot harder to trick Paulites than JFK's lovers.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:19 | 1459852 OldTrooper
OldTrooper's picture

I'd take nothing over what these clowns have been doing.  Every time they 'do something' things end up more fucked up than before.  Also, I suspect Ron would pick up the veto pen from time to time - and that would be an improvement in my book. 

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:53 | 1460005 JW n FL
JW n FL's picture

You are talking about more of the same.. you just want to live out your retirement in comfort and let someone Else's kids deal with the problem.. as long as it does not impede your tee time.

 

Let's talk some more and develop a plan that can be implemented later on.. like when I am gone!

 

You Sir are the bedrock of this Nation! Thusly the Nation is as fucked up as it is!

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 14:56 | 1460433 OldTrooper
OldTrooper's picture

What's your problem?  Is it that you can't read or that you can't think?

How would a show-down between Ron Paul, armed with a veto pen, and congress be 'more of the same'?  Which recent president vetoed the patriot act or its extensions?  which recent president vetoed spending bills?  Which recent president has refused to involve us in foreign wars?  Just how would Ron Paul be 'more of the same'?  Which vetoes would be overridden, how much support would Ron get in congress, how successful would he be in slapping down the bureaucracy and would he live long enough to really accomplish much are uncertain.  But you really want to assert that it would be 'more of the same'?

Or there is your idea - let's just complain some more and never develop any plan at all.  That'll solve all our problems in no time at all.

I do not see what my retirement (which hasn't started yet, and likely never will), children (my kids, ages 2 and 13, or anyone else's) and my tee time (not necessary at the local muni course I occasionally play) have to do with the issue at hand other than to indicate you know very little about me and might be better off sticking to the subject.

One man can make a difference.  Ron Paul would not be more of the same.

Are you going to show how I am wrong or just jump to more unfounded, asinine conclusions?

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 15:25 | 1460525 JW n FL
JW n FL's picture

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XY02Qkuc_f8

 

there you go Trooper! your Brethren! being who they swore to be!

Veto Pen! how cute!

maybe Ronnie could Veto the Secret Service standing down? LULZ!!

Modern Day Pinkerton's all want a cushy private security job! FACT!!

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O1m4MGZ1ebU a GREAT! song to help you thru the pain!

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 16:08 | 1460742 OldTrooper
OldTrooper's picture

Wow!  I'm blown away by your insightful arguments and indisputable facts!  /sarc-off

There's really no substance to any of your posts at all.  Pathetic.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:39 | 1459947 KrugmansChauffeur
KrugmansChauffeur's picture

At least they could manage to pass a budget.

 

Oh wait.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:55 | 1460009 monkeyshine
monkeyshine's picture

Congress has been way too deferential to potus be that bush, clinton, bush or obama. Congress needs to get some stones.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 13:07 | 1460045 CrazyCooter
CrazyCooter's picture

I have a one acronym response: CiC.

Regards,

Cooter

P.S. That is Commander in Chief.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:27 | 1459525 pupton
pupton's picture

Man, only one question in the survey isn't going to provide a lot of meaningful data.  I would have voted for him in '08, but he punked out before the Virginia Primary.  Tell him not to bail this time.  It's going to be close and every state is going to count.  Just because Iowa or NH goes the other way doesn't mean the south doesn't like him.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:23 | 1459867 Uncle Remus
Uncle Remus's picture

Fuck Iowa. They've inhaled too much Roundup.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:29 | 1459891 Uncle Remus
Uncle Remus's picture

Dup

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:44 | 1459645 rambler6421
rambler6421's picture

Hellz ya.  Ron Paul all the way.  Peter schiff/ron paul pretty much changed me from a conservative to a Ron Paul conservative.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:11 | 1459396 snowball777
snowball777's picture

So....everything except raise revenues. Still a debt target then, but thanks for the laugh, Dim (Jemint).

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 13:54 | 1460217 V in PA
V in PA's picture

So....everything except steal more money.

 

Fixed it.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:12 | 1459402 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Unbelievable drama. Pounding pulses. WIll they or won't they? Shaft America that is.

Can they or can't they? Sit on their hands with their thumbs up....

ORI

http://aadivaahan.wordpress.com/2011/07/13/dublinmick-shared-this/

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:41 | 1459617 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

All dancing on the head of a pin while Rome burns. There is no money, and its time to pay the fiddler on the roof.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:45 | 1459969 mayhem_korner
mayhem_korner's picture

ORI...

America has long since been shafted.  This is nothing but theater to jockey for who gets the most attention when the meltup goes down.

:D

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:13 | 1459408 johnnymustardseed
johnnymustardseed's picture

Rational thinkers???Republicans drove this bus into the ditch and now they are going to set it on fire???? Wow! I don't think they get it!! Where will they hide from the wrath??? I am prepped and have a Canada escape plan, so sorry that they would prefer to play silly games with real peoples lives. GOOD BYE AMERICA

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:14 | 1459421 JLee2027
JLee2027's picture

Bye. Don't let your dildo hit your ass on the way out the door.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:14 | 1459827 eureka
eureka's picture

Wauw - you're so MACHO. Why don't you join the army, attack Iran and vote to raise the debt ceiling and double PentaGun's budget. War Now. USA USA USA.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:43 | 1459964 Hook Line and S...
Hook Line and Sphincter's picture

JLee, if you haven't had a dildo in your ass don't knock it. You throw out comments that assume most of here actually think that's an insult.

The Bernank been pounding us furiously with it, and some of us have quite enjoyed the act. As long as he's sliding it in, we've got time to scratch in more PM's.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:50 | 1459991 trav7777
trav7777's picture

like...YUCK

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:16 | 1459438 Everybodys All ...
Everybodys All American's picture

Obama had them move to the back of the bus. This is on him now.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:27 | 1459454 Capitalist10
Capitalist10's picture

Don't forget to write.  On second thought, skip it.

And don't go anywhere before you get my fries with that.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:24 | 1459486 Dr. Engali
Dr. Engali's picture

One less retard who believes there is a difference between the two parties in the country. Good luck.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:50 | 1459685 mjv
mjv's picture

It would be interesting to see how the contributions to the CATO Institute have changed since the second Bush term.  When a lot of "Republicans" realized that the GOP was just another bunch of huge government types, but just had not had control of both houses until Bush to allow for the big spending.

Each party of generally full of mass produced ken dolls wearing different suits and haircuts, but all working off of the same programming.  

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:56 | 1459719 Dr. Engali
Dr. Engali's picture

I think that was a shock and a rude awakening for a lot of republicans.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:20 | 1459856 eureka
eureka's picture

Wow - really? You say some Republicans have woken up? I'll be darned. So how many of these "awoken ones" are pro cut PentaGun Butt?

 

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:29 | 1459897 CrashisOptimistic
CrashisOptimistic's picture

I don't quite get your perspective.

The Democrats had full control of both houses of Congress and the presidency for 2.5 years and never ONCE, not even once, passed and signed into law a deficit cutting tax increase.

They also never once, not even once, passed a law to cut Pentagon spending by 50% and defund and remove ALL troops from Iraq and Afghanistan.

They had 2.5 years of opportunity to do all of this and didn't do it.  Why would you support them?

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 13:01 | 1460021 eureka
eureka's picture

I don't. The point however, is that Republican Teapartiers are pushing cuts on all social insurance programs - but no PentaGun cuts. In fact, Republican Secretary of Defense, Gates (who works for the Democratic administration - not for the Republicans), has proposed at least some small cuts of PentaGun, but - Republicans don't want ANY cuts on war.

Hence, the Republicans and Teapartiers are pushing an asymetrical agenda.

"Thinking", is way too big a word for such blatantly corporatist-impirial cocksucking.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 13:31 | 1460137 TheJudge2012
TheJudge2012's picture

Maybe Obama would like to get his azz out of Libya.  NOT! 

Who you kidding, both parties are warmongers

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:43 | 1459959 Larry Darrell
Larry Darrell's picture

It may not be a sea of change, but to answer your question............at least this one.

I was a big republican, raised and indoctrinated by my fathers political leanings.  When the banks got the bailout, I knew something was wrong.

I've been on a quest for more knowledge for a couple of years now, and learned a shit ton more than I learned in 25 years of the system's schooling.

So, I am one of the "awoken ones."  And yes, I would love to see the MIC budget slashed in a big way.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:30 | 1459544 pupton
pupton's picture

"I am prepped and have a Canada escape plan, so sorry that they would prefer to play silly games with real peoples lives. GOOD BYE AMERICA"

You retard pussy!  Get the fuck out!

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:24 | 1459871 eureka
eureka's picture

That's right! Attack now. Fire at will. Don't Think - Just Kill.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:43 | 1459623 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

Bye Johnny, party politics sheep have fun in Canada.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:57 | 1459729 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

Oh, 'Republicrats drove this bus into the ditch! All the while the Demicans were a quite responsible and thrifty bunch'! Johhnu, youre an idiot.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 14:06 | 1460256 Satanic Mechanic
Satanic Mechanic's picture

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:13 | 1459410 TradingJoe
TradingJoe's picture

Bancheros trying to hold S&P at current level until debt is raised then QE3 then... well you know the drill!

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:13 | 1459416 JLee2027
JLee2027's picture

 the current status quo will be wiped out.

 

The return of Self Rule bitches!

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:21 | 1459474 Dr. Richard Head
Dr. Richard Head's picture

That's......that's.......that's anarchy.  /sarc

Could you imagine the propserity that would be allowed to move forward without the middle-class subsidizing these fucktards implanted in Capital Hill and Wall Street?  MMMMMMMmmmmmmmm....smelling the roses.

Don't expect it of course, but I will smell the roses anyway for a moment in reflection on how it could be.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:22 | 1459426 Capitalist10
Capitalist10's picture

One Congressman introduced a bill to reduce the debt ceiling.

Maybe we should compromise and just leave it where it is.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:16 | 1459440 JW n FL
JW n FL's picture

It will Burn.. and like with any burn, the trash and weaker (seedlings too unfortunately) will get destroyed to make room for new growth. The dead provide the fertilizer for growth.

 

The Government means to destroy America.. well the majority middle and / or anyone else that does not have a billion dollar lobby in place.

 

Will the pain be worth the new growth, owned by the top 1%?

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:24 | 1459495 Sudden Debt
Sudden Debt's picture

THEY CAN'T PASS THE DEBT TO THE NEWLY BORN!!!

pass it to the once who will be born in 50 years from now, so we don't have to explain anything to them.

 

 

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:44 | 1459643 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

The last 4 years of printing and monetizing has passed the debt to great great great grandchildren, if not even farther down the line than that.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:17 | 1459844 Things that go bump
Things that go bump's picture

Yes, and if the wheels don't fall off and inflation being what it is, it will look like a piddly sum by that time and they will wonder what all the drama was about.  

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:58 | 1460017 JW n FL
JW n FL's picture
by SheepDog-One
on Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:44
#1459643

 

The last 4 years of printing and monetizing has passed the debt to great great great grandchildren, if not even farther down the line than that.

**************************************************************

 

The last 4 years? You mean 3 years.. Obama does not set the budget for his first year in office. and before that TARP and the other $12 Trillion? was fine?

 

There is no difference between the two parties..

 

Either you are stupid or you can follow links? which is it.. YOU are the Problem! until people like you wake up NOTHING will change..

 

You have been here how long and you still dont fucking get it?

 

This is the reason America will be a Corporate Run Semi Commie Police State. Fucking idiots like this! who refuse the truth!

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 13:38 | 1460162 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

I dont fucking get it? Im the one here saying there is no difference in 10 other posts here fukwad!

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 15:11 | 1460476 OldTrooper
OldTrooper's picture

LOL!  JW reminds me guys that get liquored-up and just want to fight everyone.  He gets online and goes after everyone.  If he can't find a reason he just invents one.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 15:26 | 1460537 JW n FL
JW n FL's picture

shhhhhhhhhhhhh. Family Secrets are Family Secret for a reason! Damn!! it Man!

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:25 | 1459503 Seasmoke
Seasmoke's picture

Default = Freedom

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:40 | 1459583 Doyle Hargraves
Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:26 | 1459509 InconvenientCou...
InconvenientCounterParty's picture

The Bernanke was asked if the Fed would add defaulted bonds to it's balance sheet. He didn't rule it out.

I hadn't previously considered this as the hyper-inflation tipping point but it bears consideration now.

I'm sure all this acute pain for the lower 99% will go well for the GOP. LOL! I will derive personal pleasure the impotent rage and hypocrisy spewing on the comments in this blog. The victims will be running like roaches under the (empty) refrigerator.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:47 | 1459665 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

I like Ron Pauls idea better, declare all FED held bonds as illegal and illegitimate.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:25 | 1459879 Things that go bump
Things that go bump's picture

Odious debt - incurred by our government, but not for our benefit.  

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Odious_debt

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 13:59 | 1459880 Things that go bump
Things that go bump's picture

duplicate

 

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:30 | 1459539 Madcow
Madcow's picture

Any "debt ceiling" is fundamentally at odds with a fiat money system - which, by its very design, must have a continuous and parabolic increase in the debt level in order to function properly. 

Because of the laws of compound interest, the slope of that line must be parabolic. A linear 2-4% growth rate just doesn't work. The curve must - by its very design - plot against a log scale. 

So, the "debt ceiling" debate is a charade.  Either we scrap the fiat money system and start over or come to terms with the ramifications of continuous and parabolic increases in the "debt ceiling."

The markets know that Governments won't be able to have their cake-and-eat-it perpetual motion-machine-anti-gravity-device much longer :(

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:34 | 1459563 pupton
pupton's picture

Maybe it's just me, but it seems rather hypocritical to introduce legislation to raise the debt ceiling by $2.4T and simultaneously press for a balanced budget amendment.  If you have a balanced budget you don't need any more debt, right???

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:48 | 1459667 Marco
Marco's picture

The balanced budget amendment is conveniently two election cycles removed from going into effect ...

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 13:16 | 1460086 Dr Zaius
Dr Zaius's picture

An amendment requires 2/3 vote from both houses of congress and the states. I don't see that happening, but I would like to be wrong.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 13:39 | 1460167 Marco
Marco's picture

It would still not create a balanced budget, because as I said ... that is explicitly delayed in the amendment. For obvious reasons (they want to maintain the status quo, just not to be perceived as doing so).

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:34 | 1459565 treemagnet
treemagnet's picture

I'm gonna lose some weight, maybe 20 lbs......starting next year, maybe.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:46 | 1459974 Larry Darrell
Larry Darrell's picture

.........after I return from an around the world cruise with all those fabulous buffets.

Yes, I will lose 20 lbs next year.  I just need to gain 40 between now and then.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:37 | 1459589 Bob
Bob's picture

That's a nice, even handed summary, Tyler. 

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:39 | 1459603 Shineola
Shineola's picture

"On a long enough time line, the survival rate for all fiat drops to zero."

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:39 | 1459606 carbonmutant
carbonmutant's picture

Do you want to stop the spending or not?

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:51 | 1459693 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

I have no problem stopping the spending, I dont need anything from 3 piece suits in DC, let em all fry.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:42 | 1459618 skipjack
skipjack's picture

I'm disappointed in Demint.  They can have a balanced budget right damn now...as long as the debt limit ceiling is not raised.  Bam...an instant 40+% reduction in Federal spending, THIS year.  They don't need a stupid balanced budget amendment.  Just refuse to take on any more debt, right now.

 

Kabuki theatre...they refuse to use the solution that will actually work in favor of smoke and mirrors.  It tells you exactly that not one politician in DC has any guts to do the right  thing.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:57 | 1459731 FlyPaper
FlyPaper's picture

Yes they could vote for a balanced budget right now, but it would be too fast.  Balanced in 6 years?  Possible.  

 

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:04 | 1459773 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

LOL, 'balanced budget in 6 years' HOW?? In case everyone is drifting off into the ether as is apparently the case, we are a BANKRUPT blown out country with no real manufacturing base! Balance the budget how, by taxing Wall St stock pumping computers? Has this whole country lost its damn mind!

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:30 | 1459902 OldTrooper
OldTrooper's picture

Has this whole country lost its damn mind!

Yeah, pretty much.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:36 | 1459937 Uncle Remus
Uncle Remus's picture

Has this whole country lost its damn mind!

 

Yes and pretty much everything else along with it.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:45 | 1459650 johnnymustardseed
johnnymustardseed's picture

Ha!! I love the junking.. you dumb fuckers who think default would be a good thing are fucking retarded. If the dollar status is lost, imagine trying to say buy gas for your BMW'S. Not going to happen!! No gas at any price. Power plants that rely on coal. Not going to be there . You will have no food in grocery stores. Drugs from pharmacy...not!Junk me all you want, your ingnorance will be your end.

Richard Nixon taking us off the gold standard??? Good idea or bad?

Reagan tax cuts funded by robbing social security?? Good idea or bad?

Bill Clinton signing the republican bill repealing Glas Stegal?? Good idea or bad??

Bush more unfunded tax cuts and two wars?? Good idea or bad??

You really don't have a fucking clue!!!!!

Let me remind my wonderful Republican friends

That's what Cheney meant by "Reagan proved deficits don't matter." For Cheney, Reagan proved there was no political cost to big deficits.

But O'Neill, the treasurer, was talking economics. He worried about more tax cuts on top of the rising deficit, and Bush, briefly, showed some interest, asking if they hadn't already done enough for wealthy taxpayers. Adviser Karl Rove admonished Bush to "stick to principle" ? the principle being that deficits were his due ? and the debate was over.

A month later, Cheney called O'Neill to suggest he announce his wish to retire. "I'm too old to begin telling lies now," said O'Neill, so Cheney fired him.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:51 | 1459680 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

'Republicrat/Demican' dummy. I didnt think there were any so stupid around Zerohedge.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:36 | 1459924 eureka
eureka's picture

All right Sheep - answer one specific question:

Do Republicans want to cut all social insurance programs but not PentaGun?

In case you can't answer the question: Yes, they do.

Consequently, the little hegemon fraction of zerohedge readers, who favor social cuts, but Military Entitlements - all for the sake of their pathetic US Pride, need to shut up about how Republicans and Democrats are always serving the same masters - because in the matter of US Attack-Budgets - they're not.

IF - you are for cutting Fed Butt - but NOT PentaGun - you are a hypocrit - like the Republicans. Fact is US Military and Federal Reserve are the two components of the same oligarch, elite fascist corporate Empire.

Junk away all present nationalist hegemon retards - and be known to the zerohedge world for what you are: oxymoronic, non-thinkers.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:43 | 1459958 OldTrooper
OldTrooper's picture

You may want to pull your head out of your ass and look around a bit.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:58 | 1460019 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

Eureka, youre lost.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 13:07 | 1460046 eureka
eureka's picture

Oh, so maybe you are against US Empire - and I just overlooked it?

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:51 | 1459696 oldmanagain
oldmanagain's picture

Tyler lost all credibility.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:55 | 1459722 Marco
Marco's picture

Nixon taking the US off the gold standard was a gamble which could have worked out ... it allowed the US to keep buying oil with IOUs for decades. If the US had managed to develop some way to become energy independent in the mean time it would have been a huge success.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:38 | 1459944 eureka
eureka's picture

US Empire only knows how to intimidate and how to take. It is a habit.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 13:20 | 1460097 Boxed Merlot
Boxed Merlot's picture

...If the US had managed to develop some way to become energy independent...

 

I thought we did.  You mean the department of energy didn't make us independent?  You mean CAFE standards and title 24 building calcs didn't fix it?  What about all those chinese windmills popping up like mushrooms over our amber waves of grain?

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 13:52 | 1460202 Marco
Marco's picture

That's just fucking around in the margins, merely a vehicle for corruption.

 

If the US really was serious it could have replaced it's entire electricity generation with solar thermal (95% uptime shouldn't be too hard with enough thermal storage, coal/gas can handle the rest, using HVDC for distribution of course). For the cost of one of Bush's expeditions, with currently available technology. (With that kind of massive implementation costs would probably have halfed if not better, but lets just ignore that.) For the cost of both his expeditions I'm sure the US could have found a way to use surplus energy to create synthetic fuel as well.

 

You wouldn't have had to worry about unemployment either with those kinds of public works efforts.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:48 | 1459671 Shineola
Shineola's picture

Foreign Aid is not a debt to be paid.

 

 

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:50 | 1459692 lesterbegood
lesterbegood's picture

+1776

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:51 | 1459697 Shineola
Shineola's picture

Why isn't making WAR the ME "on the table"???

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:53 | 1459708 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

OH well the 5 fronted UN war obviously has to be fully funded by american taxpayers...they have to steal that gold!

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:42 | 1459957 eureka
eureka's picture

UN is a paper mill. Don't blame UN, but the US Impirial Hegemons who use it to rubber-stamp their vicious agendas of world domination - which is costing you your country right about now. US Pride. Woof, Woof, Woof. USA USA USA. Attack everyone!

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:59 | 1460026 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

Yes look at all the wars started under Obama. Hey you want to play that game? Make sure its not looked at thru a monacle.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:52 | 1459703 kito
kito's picture

zh--how do you compare iceland to this country?  iceland wasnt a cesspool of debt ready to crumble. iceland was a relatively healthy country that refused to bail out the stupidity of its banks. america has real fiscal structural problems that would not be addressed merely by a default. iceland absolutely did not face these same structural issues.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:54 | 1459714 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

Well what are your ideas for addressing the insolvency of america.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:05 | 1459774 the grateful un...
the grateful unemployed's picture

the two largest industries the government contracts with, health and defense, would have to agree to accept the revenue we have available. since both industries are 100% dependent on government payment this shouldn't be problem. they could threaten to cut services, we could nationalize either or both industries. the leverage resides with the payee, since there is no 'other' market where they can sell their goods and services. so far the lobbyists have been in control, but what is a lobbyist, a reverse engineered salesman? if Walmart was in charge of buying goods and services for the USG, I guarantee we would be getting the lowest prices all the time.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:08 | 1459799 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

What youre saying is everyone is in store for huge cuts. Agreed!

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:17 | 1459834 kito
kito's picture

this country is fucked for the long term regardless. and the mindset of people in the u.s. is nothing like the icelanders. they are a small cohesive community oriented nation who work for each others benefit. does that sound like the citizens of this country? a huge portion of this country, as everybody here knows, lives their lives based on entitlement. take those entitlements away now, and you are left with a massive population adrift without any self sufficiency. its not just a monetary problem. its a societal problem. yes, we have to take our medicine now, but there literally will have to be a way to rehabilitate millions and millions of people? and how do you do that? there is a strong possiblity a default may just be a quicker way to end this country.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 13:13 | 1460063 Marco
Marco's picture

It's not like Iceland doesn't have unemployment problems ... they just handle them differently, a little more central planning and a little less magical thinking.

 

Just saying self sufficiency and entitlement enough times certainly won't do it ... neither will trying to let them starve to death. Government has to help them find a job, create jobs if necessary. Helping them get out from underwater mortgages so they can move for jobs would help too (fuck moral hazard up the ass, compared to the financial bailouts this is too bloody insignificant). I really doubt the luxury of live on the dole is the predominant reason so many people are unemployed in the US, your system isn't exactly that magnanonimous.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:58 | 1459733 Founders Keeper
Founders Keeper's picture

My goodness. Does anyone here really believe the Debt Ceiling will NOT be raised?

IMO, 99% likelihood of limit being raised before any "deadline."

1% chance the Dems and/or Repubs botch the 99% plan unintentionally.

 

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:00 | 1459751 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

Whatever....then what?

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:19 | 1459855 Marco
Marco's picture

Maintain the status quo for a little longer, the rich get richer, the poor get deeper into debt ... when the poor are finally in debt as deeply as possible, then finally it will be time for the end game ... funnily enough the powers that be want the same end game as the majority of ZH, a deflationary depression and small government with non existent taxes.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:55 | 1460008 Raymond Reason
Raymond Reason's picture

Yes, but you describe the endgame the ZH'rs want.  TPTB want a Soviet Bloc type endgame.  That to me is a bigger question than the inflation / deflation debate. 

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 13:33 | 1460134 Marco
Marco's picture

What will happen in a deflationary depression? Everything and everyone in debt will default ... this will include the overleveraged banks of course, but who are ultimately on the other side of most of that debt? The 0.1%, who won't be in debt ... and who won't default. They will just end up with all the collateral.

 

Will their net value decrease in the collapse? Yes, of course. Will their ownership of land and other natural resources massively increase? Yes, of course. In the anarcho capitalist ZH wet dream with their outright ownership of almost everything they can simply start rentseeking in perpetuity ... while never giving up ownership of the land again. The aristocracy got a whole lot smarter and better at manipulating the peasants since the last time they were in that position.

 

Ultimately there is no difference between a state and a landlord.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:25 | 1459876 the grateful un...
the grateful unemployed's picture

raised or raised on time? does anyone here believe there will no NFL football this year? How do you define a season? If there's a superbowl in Feb? In the meantime they damage the product, and lose a generation of viewers.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 11:59 | 1459743 hettygreen
hettygreen's picture

If the US demonstrates even a scintilla of fiscal probity over the next few days/weeks it will be a game changer (I know, the moon is more likely to crash into the earth). I just cannot see how the treasury bond bull continues if nothing happens other than the same old meaningless rhetoric, uttered by the usual pantheon of 'useful' idiots, full of sound and fury, but signifying nothing. Frankly if the outcome (after the customary head fakes designed so only GS can make money) continues to defy fiscal and monetary rationality, both of which are orbiting in the vicinity of Pluto, then it's pretty safe to say that the ditch (and I'm thinking Grand Canyon here) can be the only final destination for this sordid affair masquerading as an economy. Of course Michelle Bachman will, by necessity, become the next President as an integral part of the whole, surround sound, 3D, ditch trip experience.

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:01 | 1459756 Ying-Yang
Ying-Yang's picture

Red or Blue... Blue or Red the blur looks Purple to me. Both parties are subservient to multinational corporations and investment banks that fund their campaigns.

If I gave you $800,000 would you do me a favor?

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 13:18 | 1460094 granolageek
granolageek's picture

Do I get to keep it, or do I have to spend it on campaign ads?

Fri, 07/15/2011 - 12:02 | 1459762 mkix
mkix's picture

I understand this "Reset" concept, and maybe even the need for one. To me it just seams that cutting government aid expenditures aimed at assisting people that really need it, might not be the "Reset" we really ned. The republican party has made it clear that they have no intension in have the uber-wealthy share any of the pain they want to inflict on the country. I think the "reset" that republicans want is only for the poor, and that isn't going to make the US any nicer to live in. It's really dangerous to have a government taking stuff away from poor people, while letting wealthy people keep all of their stuff. 

Don't get me wrong, the Democrats suck too! Just in completely different way.

Sorry if someone already posted this.

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