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RICO Suit Filed Against HSBC And JPMorgan For Silver Market Manipulation

Tyler Durden's picture





 

If JPM and HSBC hoped that the lawsuits filed a week ago by Brian Beatty and Peter Laskari, which we discussed previously, were going to be the end of their public exposure with regard to possible silver market manipulation, they are about to be disappointed. Today, in a separate lawsuit filed by Carl Loeb in the Southern District of New York, a new light on precious manipulation by the duo was shone, this time involving allegations of breach of the Racketeering Influenced and Corrupt Organizations (RICO) Act. And with the CFTC itself admitting of ongoing manipulation in the silver market, it appears this issue is not going to go away quietly any time soon. Per Steve Berman, co-counsel of plaintiff law firm Hagens Berman Sobol Shapiro: "The practice of naked short selling has long been a serious issue on Wall Street. What we know about the scope and intent of JP Morgan and HSBC's actions
in this short-selling scheme dwarfs any other similar attempt to
manipulate a commodities market.
" As this case is also seeking class action status for the class, readers who wish to join this particular case may apply to do so at the following link. Plaintiffs are seeking that the court enjoin JP Morgan and HSBC from continuing their alleged
conspiracy and manipulation of the silver futures and options contracts
market.

More from PRNewswire:

According to the complaint, JP Morgan amassed a sizeable short position in silver futures and options in part through its March 2008 acquisition of investment bank Bear Stearns. By August 2008, JP Morgan and London-based HSBC controlled more than 85 percent of the commercial net short position in silver futures contracts.

The suit alleges that, starting in early 2008, the two banks began manipulating the silver futures market by accumulating unusually large "short" positions and then secretly coordinating enormous sales of silver futures contracts on the Commodity Exchange, which is known as "COMEX" and is part of the New York Mercantile Exchange.

According to the lawsuit, JP Morgan and HSBC used a variety of methods to coordinate their manipulation of the market for silver futures contracts, signaling when to flood the COMEX market with short positions, which caused the price of silver futures and options contracts to crash.

The suit describes two "crash" events that were set in motion by JP Morgan and HSBC, one in March 2008, and the other in February 2010, after defendants had amassed large short positions.  In the wake of both events, the suit alleges, COMEX silver futures prices collapsed.

"We believe that JP Morgan and HSBC's scheme was carefully conceived and coordinated to maximize their profits at the expense of innocent investors who believed that they were trading in a market free from manipulation," Berman said.

What is more interesting, is that the man who has achieved something a cult standing in the PM community, whistleblower Andrew Maguire, is also involved.

The complaint also contains allegations that in September 2008, the U.S. Commodity Futures Trading Commission launched an investigation that would eventually consider allegations made by a London-based independent metals trader named Andrew Maguire that the silver futures market was being manipulated.

The complaint alleges that Maguire disclosed to the CFTC on Feb. 3, 2010 that he received a signal from the two banks of their intent to drive down the prices of silver futures two days later, on Feb. 5, 2010. Maguire's information was correct and the price of silver dropped dramatically between Feb. 3, 2010 and Feb. 5, 2010.

In addition, the lawsuit states that both JP Morgan and HSBC still maintain highly concentrated holdings in short positions in silver futures and options, giving both banks the ability to continue manipulating the price of silver.

Plaintiffs' attorneys have asked the court to certify the case as a class action and enjoin JP Morgan and HSBC from continuing their alleged conspiracy and manipulation of the silver futures and options contracts market.

Attorneys also ask the court to award damages and attorneys' fees to the class.

Here is Hagens Berman internal statement on the case:

JP Morgan Chase & Co. (NYSE: JPM) and HSBC Securities Inc. (NYSE: HBC) face charges of manipulating the market for silver futures and options in violation of federal commodities and racketeering laws, according to a lawsuit filed in the U.S. District Court for the Southern District of New York.

The suit – which alleges violation of the Commodity Exchange Act and the Racketeering Influenced and Corrupt Organizations (RICO) Act – alleges that the two banks colluded to manipulate the market for silver futures starting in the first half of 2008 by amassing huge short positions in silver futures contracts they had no intent to fill, but did so to force silver prices down to their benefit.

According to the lawsuit, JP Morgan and HSBC used a variety of methods to coordinate their manipulation of the market for silver futures contracts, signaling when to flood the COMEX market with short positions, which caused the price of silver futures and options contracts to crash.

In addition, the lawsuit states that both JP Morgan and HSBC still maintain highly concentrated holdings in short positions in silver futures and options, giving both banks the ability to continue manipulating the price of silver.

Plaintiffs’ attorneys have asked the court to certify the case as a class action and enjoin JP Morgan and HSBC from continuing their alleged conspiracy and manipulation of the silver futures and options contracts market. Attorneys also ask the court to award damages and attorneys’ fees to the class.

If you have information you believe is important to the case, please contact Hagens Berman at 206-623-7292 or by e-mail at JPMorgan@hbsslaw.com.

We hope that the two firms' alleged highly illegal ongoing manipulation and intervention activities in the Precious Metal market will finally be curbed as a result of what is now sure to be a very public outcry exposing their practices.

 

 


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Wed, 11/03/2010 - 17:45 | Link to Comment JimRogers
JimRogers's picture

RICO BITCHEZ!!!!!!

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 17:47 | Link to Comment NoLongerABagHolder
NoLongerABagHolder's picture

Check this flash crash pattern out - we could be close:

http://seekingalpha.com/instablog/475264-tim-ayles/107599-the-dow-is-rep...

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 20:19 | Link to Comment DocLogo
Wed, 11/03/2010 - 22:52 | Link to Comment MilleniumJane
MilleniumJane's picture

R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-RICOO-O-O-O-O-O-O-O-O-O-O-O-O-O-O!!!!!!!!

'Bout effin' time!

 

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 17:47 | Link to Comment Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

Nice. I'd love to see JPM burnt to the ground.

RICO Act Bitchez...

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:00 | Link to Comment Rainman
Rainman's picture

You were yanking on the rod for a long time to get this fish into the boat, TD. KUDOS !!

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:17 | Link to Comment Gold...Bitches
Gold...Bitches's picture

Sorry, but no.  The kudos go to GATA who has been on the case for a decade - they did all the heavy lifting.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:27 | Link to Comment Rainman
Rainman's picture

....confuse is me. Thee charges against these playerz arise from a period a little over 2 years ago.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:40 | Link to Comment Gold...Bitches
Gold...Bitches's picture

Granted, the specific companies were not specifically known until a couple years ago with the take down of Bear and congressional testimony by CFTC naming bear as the former huge short, but GATA has been all over the manipulation angle of the precious metal markets for a decade.

And people like Adrian Douglas over there have been pounding away for years on the LBMA, Fed, and the fraud.

and check this out (Dec 11, 2000): http://www.gata.org/node/4225

from the above link "Besides the BIS, the defendants include: Alan Greenspan, chairman of the Federal Reserve Board; William J. McDonough, president of the Federal Reserve Bank of New York; Lawrence H. Summers, secretary of the Treasury Department; and J.P. Morgan & Co. Inc.,

Chase Manhattan Corp., Citigroup Inc., Goldman Sachs Group Inc., and Deutsche Bank AG."

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 19:11 | Link to Comment Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

I have been friends with Bill Murphy and Chris Powell for over ten years. I met them at the Vancouver Resource Conferences (Cambridge House) and they helped me understand this issue, and got my family invested into the PM sector. We were all called "conspiracy nuts" back then. Not so much now.

LMAO.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 21:01 | Link to Comment dehdhed
dehdhed's picture

10 years ago silver was about 4 bucks an ounce.  i'm not sure how the prosecution would do if they claim that for 10 years they've manipulated the market with shorts all the way to 25 bucks an ounce.

i'm with ya tho, i'm a silver bull for years but i don't think i could join the class action as i wouldn't be able to prove damages.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 19:15 | Link to Comment Rainman
Rainman's picture

There are spec corners going on in ALL commodities....not just PM markets. Enron famously bought up the CA electricity futures market....the first really big time swindle following the passage of the Commodity Futures Modernization Act 2000, which was just a legal cover for the U.S. domestic commodity playerz. Oil went into the game the summer of 08.....topping at $140 bbl. The off exchange, unregulated naked trading ensures cornering manipulations by non end users.....sure as night turns to day.

If this plays out like the 70's, the spec playerz will work oil ,silver, gold, coffee, and sugar in that order.......or maybe something else with high demand and capable of supply constriction .

If they could make cable TV a commodity, they'd play that too. 

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 19:36 | Link to Comment DavidPierre
DavidPierre's picture

There is no excuse for "Blatant Ignorance"!

#697432

 

My naked plug for...

Le Metropole is a 'Cafe prive'. Membership is $299.00 per year. So that you may visit, sample our fare and decide if our Cafe appeals to your taste, we would like to extend to you a "two week free get acquainted membership".

http://www.lemetropolecafe.com/guests.cfm

Bon Appetit!
Bill Murphy
Le Patron

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 19:35 | Link to Comment Scout Itout
Scout Itout's picture

Although GATA has done good work in the case for gold, It is Ted Butler who's done the heavy lifting in the case of silver! Just sayin!

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 22:01 | Link to Comment Gold...Bitches
Gold...Bitches's picture

yes, definitely include Butler in there as well for the silver.

Thu, 11/04/2010 - 23:25 | Link to Comment Rahm
Rahm's picture

Your name FTW!

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 20:04 | Link to Comment DosZap
DosZap's picture

Amen!!.

 THEY GATA GO!.....Uh, Bue,Bye, JPM-immy.

RICO Suave, at last a case that merits it's use....................not on protesters at clinics.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 19:05 | Link to Comment Cistercian
Cistercian's picture

 Re:JPM burnt to the ground...pitchforks and torches bitches!

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 17:47 | Link to Comment Bill Lumbergh
Bill Lumbergh's picture

Can we call Jeff Christian to the stand so he can discuss his 100:1 leverage comment again.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 22:27 | Link to Comment JLee2027
JLee2027's picture

LOL

Thu, 11/04/2010 - 04:11 | Link to Comment akak
akak's picture

Oh, you mean Jeffrey "Foot in Mouth" Christian?  Boy, talk about digging one's own grave --- that guy was even using heavy machinery for the job!  And just as well ---- that disingenuous, lying snake Christian is just as bad in his own bankster-apologist way as Jon "Gold is in a Bubble --- but NOT a Bull Market!" Nadler.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 17:48 | Link to Comment -Michelle-
-Michelle-'s picture

1.  There's no way in hell I'd sign up for this case.  It would be like painting a target on myself.

2.  If I get one of those little cards in the mail asking me to opt in on this, I am going to be quite perturbed.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 17:53 | Link to Comment Confused
Confused's picture

That was the first thing that went through my head as well. 

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 17:56 | Link to Comment Turd Ferguson
Turd Ferguson's picture

Screw that. I just signed up.

Not backing down.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:18 | Link to Comment Kaiser Sousa
Kaiser Sousa's picture

TF -

thanks for man'n up...

suckers step aside & bend over....

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 19:02 | Link to Comment Bob
Bob's picture

+1 Hell yeah.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 19:05 | Link to Comment Anton LaVey
Anton LaVey's picture

Two thumbs up.

Too bad I never bought any futures or options, only metal silver bullion, I'd join up as well.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:08 | Link to Comment BigJim
BigJim's picture

Not sure I follow you - target for what? (genuine question)

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:13 | Link to Comment LeBalance
LeBalance's picture

Predator Drone, uh, I mean...Candy Gram!

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:38 | Link to Comment BigJim
BigJim's picture

Seriously?

I mean, I can see them intimidating or even 'taking out' the lawyers and lead instigators, but everyone in a class-action suit?

The more of us that sign up, the harder it would be... I'm in.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 19:34 | Link to Comment defender
defender's picture

The hardcore gold bugs and silver bugs expect the govt. to declare holding gold and silver illegal and then confiscating the shiny stuff to pay off their creditors.  I think that after the card in the mail they are expecting the men in black to follow with a "donation" bag.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 20:46 | Link to Comment New_Meat
New_Meat's picture

How can the hardcore believe that? ;-)

After all, the Supreme Court hasn't had its attempt to be packed (yet).  Just some pesky suit vs. Chief Roberts.

- Ned

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 19:33 | Link to Comment Cathartes Aura
Cathartes Aura's picture

genuine lol LeBalance, thanks. . .

"Candy Gram for Mongo!"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fUxR965b4LU

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 19:53 | Link to Comment Clark_Griswold ...
Clark_Griswold Hedge Mnger's picture

Unicef....

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 20:19 | Link to Comment Shakey
Shakey's picture

+1

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 21:05 | Link to Comment Iam_Silverman
Iam_Silverman's picture

"I mean...Candy Gram!"

Sent FedEx, from Yemen, I suppose?

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 17:50 | Link to Comment DUNTHAT
DUNTHAT's picture

The FED not named as a co-conspirator??

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 20:57 | Link to Comment doolittlegeorge
doolittlegeorge's picture

more like "the prime suspect."  It has the added value of being true of course.  How would you like to be BB expaining to "The Prez" that, "yo, bro.  we're hittin' all our numbers.  We're just SMOKIN' this joint.  Know what i mean?"

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 17:51 | Link to Comment TheMonetaryRed
TheMonetaryRed's picture

So you're gonna end bank "manipulation" of the gold and silver markets, huh?

Okay.

Welcome to the world of "unintended consequences".

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:05 | Link to Comment faustian bargain
faustian bargain's picture

BS. The world is unintended consequences. Our whole past century has been an '(un)intended consequence' of fiat monetary policy.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:20 | Link to Comment Gold...Bitches
Gold...Bitches's picture

bankster posting?

Cuz, the unintended consequences of endless printing of fiat is far more preferable?  Or are you arguing there are none for endless printing of paper?  If so, I would counter your argument with a Voltaire and his quote on fiat...

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 19:16 | Link to Comment Anton LaVey
Anton LaVey's picture

What "unintended consequences"?

Sure, CDS storm and all that. End of the [financial] world as we know it, yadda, yadda, yadda. Poverty, Crisis, Deflation, Famine and all the horsemen of the Apocalypse riding through Wall Street, etc. So what? This was coming anyway: good riddance.

Let me be clear: I want to see bankers either jump through the window from the 60th floor, or be marched off to Sing-Sing or any other MaxSecurity Federal prison for multiple consecutive life sentences without a possibility of parole. Or both: let them jump first, then let the FBI haul whatever is left to the prison to be used as manure for the flower beds.

In other words, I want these people stopped before they f*ck up the entire world again by speculating on foodstuff, oil, commodities, and everything else that can be speculated on.

"Unintended Consequences"? Au contraire, mon bon ami: these are absolutely INTENDED consequences. If this is the only way democracy and the rule of law are re-established, let all the banks burn down to the ground. So be it, I say

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 20:16 | Link to Comment TheMonetaryRed
TheMonetaryRed's picture

Yeah, okay junkers. Have it your own way.

Just don't say I didn't warn ya!

All I know is that when you're holding an asset that's at an all-time record price, it's often not the best time to mess with some of the biggest sources of liquidity in that marketplace.

You think the banks need to manipulate silver downwards?

Silver?

Well, it's a theory.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 21:38 | Link to Comment RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

Ok, goddamit, you bitch about nothing being done.  Now something gets done and you bitch anyway.  You got a cob up yer butt?

Silver?

Yeah, silver.  Al Capone went down for tax evasion.

Tax evasion?

Yeah, it's what they could pin on his raggedy ass.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 22:36 | Link to Comment Fred Hayek
Fred Hayek's picture

Yup.  If they can only send Dimon and others away on charges of aggravated jaywalking, I wouldn't care, so long as they send them away to pound me in the ass prison.

Thu, 11/04/2010 - 04:25 | Link to Comment TheMonetaryRed
TheMonetaryRed's picture

Whatever, guys.

I'm not saying that traders don't manipulate metals markets. Of course they do. People in the metals business have long had a reputation for being colluding, frontrunning, client-robbing, check-kiting scumbags.

Do these traders manipulate the market DOWNWARDS??? Well, not in my experience. These guys would do anything to make a buck, certainly, but the long bull trend in metals has been awfully good to them.

I admit that I don't understand all these GATA claims and whatnot and very frankly I don't try to. To me, the metals market looks the same as it always did, except worse: scumbag traders and hucksters skimming off of retail longs.

But, whatever, Goild to $1700, certainly. I'm a buyer of DGP.

Silver? It's just too small a market with too many rats. Still, you throw those rats out, a lot of money goes with them.

Thu, 11/04/2010 - 02:07 | Link to Comment Johnny Dangereaux
Johnny Dangereaux's picture

MonetaryHEAD trolling again.....

"Hold the pickles, hold the lettuce, 50 bux in time for Christmas"  That's right Have it my way bitch.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 20:58 | Link to Comment doolittlegeorge
doolittlegeorge's picture

only on the downside.  What did Huggy Bear say to Starsky about his "ride"?  "U be movin' up in my book now, man."

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 21:34 | Link to Comment Cojones
Cojones's picture

Wouldn't that be " I know people who know people who rob people?"

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 17:51 | Link to Comment Strider52
Strider52's picture

Good thing I loaded up 2 months ago..Dang, I'm good...

Thu, 11/04/2010 - 01:03 | Link to Comment agrotera
agrotera's picture

I was thinking the same thing--thankx for the laugh!!! 

And, with our current system running banana republic style, the issue at hand should be about as serious as this video!  But, of course, i hope my I am all wrong!

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 17:52 | Link to Comment max2205
max2205's picture

I'll pass. I am net short silver. Got one for gld??

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:00 | Link to Comment Fabio
Fabio's picture

PLEASE CHECK THIS OUT!

Did somebody just try to buy the British government?

http://www.antipope.org/charlie/blog-static/2010/11/conspiracy-theories.html

It is no fake! Check the OFFICIAL BRITISH PARLIAMENT LOG:

http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/ld201011/ldhansrd/text/101101-0003.htm#10110215000101

All the best from Germany

Fabio

Bavaria-for-Ron-Paul.blogspot.com

 

 

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:28 | Link to Comment cossack55
cossack55's picture

Again, I will refer you to the Black Eagle Trust.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 19:20 | Link to Comment desgust
desgust's picture

Would you please expand on that?

I've always wondered why nobody touches Yamashita, White Lilly...

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 19:26 | Link to Comment tip e. canoe
tip e. canoe's picture

blue horseshoe loves black eagle

Thu, 11/04/2010 - 00:54 | Link to Comment StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

Those Injuns need to get a room! :>D

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:33 | Link to Comment LongSoupLine
LongSoupLine's picture

Wait. a. minute.

Lots of money...check.

From a "religious" source...check.

Doing "God's work"?

IT'S GOLDMAN!!

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:34 | Link to Comment BigJim
BigJim's picture

Whoa. Check it out, people - that is some truly tripped out shit. And in Hansard!

"...these people said at the meeting with him that they were still effectively on the gold standard from back in the 1920s and that their entire currency holdings throughout the world, which were very large, were backed by bullion. My noble friend Lord Strathclyde came back and said to me that he had an analyst working on it and that this had to be stuff and nonsense. He said that they had come up with a figure for the amount of bullion that would be needed to cover their currency reserves, as claimed, which would be more than the entire value of bullion that had ever been mined in the history of the world."

I could well believe the Vatican has unbelievable quantities of bullion - I'll bet they got a lot more from the New World plunderfest than is currently realised. But why would they want to help out the economies of the world like that? That would mean converting a lot of their bullion into currency... what would that do to the recognition of the monetary status of gold?

The world is a truly strange place.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 19:03 | Link to Comment BigJim
BigJim's picture

Hmmm... according to the ft

   http://ftalphaville.ft.com/blog/2010/11/03/392971/the-parliamentary-foundation-x-files/

it's probably a hoax going by the name of the OITC. Interesting it should have got so far within the upper echelons of the UK government, though.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 19:29 | Link to Comment Fabio
Fabio's picture

The Guardian says it best:

"But if it is madness, it is madness that has reached the highest levels of government."

 

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2010/nov/03/strange-case-lord-james-foundation-x

 

Check out the MG Rover trail. Both Baron James and OITC were involved in 2005, according to Wikipedia.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 20:19 | Link to Comment moofph
moofph's picture

...i'll correct the guardian on their behalf to save them some time and money:

"It is madness that has reached the highest levels of government (and the lowest levels of humanity)."

there is no going back now...boys and girls, if you possess paper silver, then i'll take the liberty to laugh at you now for i will only have pity for you later...LOL!

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 21:16 | Link to Comment UncleFester
UncleFester's picture

Resonates with the FOFOA thread, no.  What's up or down anymore, Plato's cave indeed.

Thu, 11/04/2010 - 12:51 | Link to Comment Fabio
Thu, 11/04/2010 - 21:59 | Link to Comment UncleFester
UncleFester's picture

Maybe the BCCI?

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 19:46 | Link to Comment Bob
Bob's picture

Interesting stuff.  I found this in the comment section:

Will, I am as baffled by this whole thing as everyone else, but my two minor contributions are:

a. the sums are very likely to be in normal billions - a thousand million. The entire UK economy is less than $3 trillion. I've never come across anyone in Britain using "billion" to mean anything but a thousand million, rather fortunately.

b. It may or may not speak to Lord James' sanity that his last noteworthy appearance was during a debate on immigration on 21 October, in which he referred to an obscene song about Hermann Goering trying to have sex with a kangaroo.
http://www.theyworkforyou.com/lords/?id=2010-10-21a.903.2&s=speaker%3A13880#g923.0

A named Lord shrugged it off as his very weird sense of humor. 

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 20:02 | Link to Comment THE DORK OF CORK
THE DORK OF CORK's picture

A weird sense of Humour - is that grounds to be sectioned now ?

 

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 20:05 | Link to Comment Bob
Bob's picture

Hey, a crazy inbred nobleman is considered eccentric. 

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 20:23 | Link to Comment THE DORK OF CORK
THE DORK OF CORK's picture

I guess the Prozac nation is considered normal now.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 20:37 | Link to Comment Bob
Bob's picture

Yo, I thought you were an Irishman, man.

Just saying the story here is pretty damn, damn weird.  But please feel free to kick in some relevant facts!

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 21:08 | Link to Comment THE DORK OF CORK
THE DORK OF CORK's picture

Ireland's society is much more complex then what some people imagine - we have divided loyalties and conflicting emotions about Britain.

Nothing is as it seems.

P.S. this could be evidence of a concerted effort to reindustrialise Britain - it did make stuff at one stage.

The FOFOA thesis of the monetory flow phenomenon could be upon us with a change of polarity and direction of Industry with serious negative ramifications for the mercantile states.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 20:20 | Link to Comment tip e. canoe
tip e. canoe's picture

"what would that do to the recognition of the monetary status of gold?"

depends on how much they got more than is currently realized.  agreed, that's some seriously shiny tinfoil, the quantum weirdness level just went up a notch.   can't wait for jim willie's next installment.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 22:30 | Link to Comment JLee2027
JLee2027's picture

can't wait for jim willie's next installment.

No more waiting: 


Silver Breaks Out From Price Manipulation, The Gains Will be Breath Taking

http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article24009.html

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:01 | Link to Comment financeguru500
financeguru500's picture

You guys forget,

For reference, when Goldman got caught in scandel, their stocks actually went up as the resolution wasn't too bad of a fine. Expect the same to happen to these 2 companies.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:02 | Link to Comment TideFighter
TideFighter's picture

Then RICO came home and said, "Lucy, you got some 'splainin to do!"

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:02 | Link to Comment Idiot Savant
Idiot Savant's picture

Plaintiffs’ attorneys have asked the court to certify the case as a class action and enjoin JP Morgan and HSBC from continuing their alleged conspiracy and manipulation of the silver futures and options contracts market. Attorneys also ask the court to award damages and attorneys’ fees to the class.

As in most class actions, the attorneys will walk away with hundreds of millions, while the little guys get a fucking coupon.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:14 | Link to Comment Rainman
Rainman's picture

Right on target. I'm stupidly part of 3 .....2 resolved, I gots zero . Third will be zero too. No coupons. I'll take your coupon if you don't want it.

BTW, this is how the lawyers cover the larger interests, including their own........bigger hogs eat up and the little piggies go to the bacon house without a whimper. 

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 20:51 | Link to Comment New_Meat
New_Meat's picture

Is that why I should be worried about Rusty's "smoke" house? - Ned

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:04 | Link to Comment Spalding_Smailes
Spalding_Smailes's picture

Someone neeeeeeeeeeeeds moneeey ...

- Bank of America is offering its 34.5 million shares of BlackRock.

New York, November 3, 2010 – BlackRock, Inc. (NYSE:BLK) today announced the commencement of a secondary offering of 42 million shares of its common stock, 34.5 million shares are being offered by Bank of America Corporation ...

http://ftalphaville.ft.com/blog/2010/11/03/393391/further-further-readin...

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 20:15 | Link to Comment Bob
Bob's picture

My, isn't that interesting.  PNC is kicking in the remaining 7.5M .

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:04 | Link to Comment Kaiser Sousa
Kaiser Sousa's picture

From: Andrew Maguire
To: Ramirez, Eliud [CFTC]
Cc: BChilton [CFTC]
Sent: Wednesday, February 03, 2010 3:18 PM
Subject: Re: Silver today

Dear Mr. Ramirez,

Thanks for your response.

Thought it may be helpful to your investigation if I gave you the heads up for a manipulative event signaled for Friday, 5th Feb. The non-farm payrolls number will be announced at 8.30 ET. There will be one of two scenarios occurring, and both will result in silver (and gold) being taken down with a wave of short selling designed to take out obvious support levels and trip stops below. While I will no doubt be able to profit from this upcoming trade, it is an example of just how easy it is to manipulate a market if a concentrated position is allowed by a very small group of traders.

I sent you a slide of a couple of past examples of just how this will play out.

Scenario 1. The news is bad (employment is worse). This will have a bullish effect on gold and silver as the U.S. dollar weakens and the precious metals draw bids, spiking them higher. This will be sold into within a very short time (1-5 mins) with thousands of new short contracts being added, overcoming any new bids and spiking the precious metals down hard, targeting key technical support levels.

Scenario 2. The news is good (employment is better than expected). This will result in a massive short position being instigated almost immediately with no move up. This will not initially be liquidation of long positions but will result in stops being triggered, again targeting key support levels.

Both scenarios will spell an attempt by the two main short holders to illegally drive the market down and reap very large profits. Locals such as myself will be "invited" on board, which will further add downward pressure.

The question I would expect you might ask is: Who is behind the sudden selling and is it the entity/entities holding a concentrated position? How is it possible for me to know what will occur days before it will happen?

Only if a market is manipulated could this possibly occur.

I would ask you watch the "market depth" live as this event occurs and tag who instigates the move. This would surly help you to pose questions to the parties involved.

This kind of "not-for-profit selling" will end badly and risks the integrity of the COMEX and OTC markets.

I am aware that physical buyers in large size are awaiting this event to scoop up as much "discounted" gold and silver as possible. These are sophisticated entities, mainly foreign, who know how to play the short sellers and turn this paper gold into real delivered physical.

Given that the OTC market (where a lot of the selling occurs) runs on a fractional reserve basis and is not backed up by 1-1 physical gold, this leveraged short selling, where ownership of each ounce of gold has multi claims, poses a very large risk.

I leave this with you, but if you need anything from me that might help you in your investigation I would be pleased to help.

Kind regards,
Andrew T. Maguire

http://gata.org/node/8466

fuck all bankers...........bitchez

 

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:27 | Link to Comment Kaiser Sousa
Kaiser Sousa's picture

fascinating...junked by an admirer of bankers or perhaps somone who takes exception with the evidence but lacks the courage 2 challenge what is documented...carry on

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:05 | Link to Comment umop episdn
umop episdn's picture

I wonder how long 'they' can drag this out. Maybe we'll get a verdict before it is obvious that all our banks belong to the IMF.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:06 | Link to Comment Kaiser Sousa
Kaiser Sousa's picture

From: Andrew Maguire
To: Ramirez, Eliud [CFTC]
Sent: Friday, February 05, 2010 2:11 PM
Subject: Fw: Silver today

If you get this in a timely manner, with silver at 15.330 post data, I would suggest you look at who is adding short contracts in the silver contract while gold still rises after NFP data. It is undoubtedly the concentrated short who has "walked silver down" since Wednesday, putting large blocks in the way of bids. This is clear manipulation as the long holders who have been liquidated are matched by new short selling as open interest is rising during the decline.

There should be no reason for this to be occurring other than controlling silver's rise. There is an intent to drive silver through the 15 level stops before buying them back after flushing out the long holders.

Regards,
Andrew

http://gata.org/node/8466

die bankers die...

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:08 | Link to Comment buzzsaw99
buzzsaw99's picture

when RICO meets too-big-to-jail I know which one will win.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:08 | Link to Comment tony bonn
tony bonn's picture

"We hope that the two firms' alleged highly illegal ongoing manipulation and intervention activities in the Precious Metal market will finally be curbed"

how about ended in toto? but alas we are dealing with sociopathic criminals so a total end might be too much to expect even if not too much to ask.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:14 | Link to Comment Kaiser Sousa
Kaiser Sousa's picture

From: Andrew Maguire
Sent: Tuesday, February 09, 2010 8:24 AM
To: Ramirez, Eliud [CFTC]
Cc: Gensler, Gary; Chilton, Bart [CFTC]
Subject: Fw: Silver today

Dear Mr. Ramirez,

I hadn't received any acknowledgement from you regarding the series of e-mails sent by me last week warning you of the planned market manipulation that would occur in silver and gold a full two days prior to the non-farm payrolls data release.

My objective was to give you something in advance to watch, log, and follow up in your market manipulation investigation.

You will note that the huge footprints left by the two concentrated large shorts were obvious and easily identifiable. You have the data.

The signals I identified ahead of the intended short selling event were clear.

The "live" action I sent you 41 minutes after the trigger event predicting the next imminent move also played out within minutes and exactly as I outlined.

Surely you must at least be somewhat mystified that a market move could be forecast with such accuracy if it was free trading.

All you have to do is identify the large seller and if it is the concentrated short shown in the bank participation report, bring them to task for market manipulation.

I have honored my commitment to assist you and keep any information we discuss private,however if you are going to ignore my information I will deem that commitment to have expired.

All I ask is that you acknowledge receipt of my information. The rest I leave in your good hands.

Respectfully yours,

Andrew T. Maguire

http://gata.org/node/8466

succesful prosecution even if it goes to trial really doesnt matter anymore...confidence n the integrity of all markets and more importantly the debt coupon dollar has been destroyed...the only 2 forms of real money r going to do exactly what they r supposed...assume there rightfull roles n what to know has been a monetary banker scam....

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:21 | Link to Comment Kaiser Sousa
Kaiser Sousa's picture

whoever junked have the balls at least to explain ur objections.

thouh it wont matter...hater

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:52 | Link to Comment oldmanagain
oldmanagain's picture

If you don't like or understand how commodity futures markets operate, just don't trade them.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:59 | Link to Comment Kaiser Sousa
Kaiser Sousa's picture

first i dont trade them cause i have real metal...but indulge me...bestow upon me ur superior knowledge of how manipulated, fraudulent makets such as commodities work oh believer n paper proxies of wealth and savings....

step the fuck on man...

 

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 22:39 | Link to Comment centerline
centerline's picture

step up please.  make a case.  show some effort.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 19:27 | Link to Comment fiftybagger
fiftybagger's picture

I think you were junked by Jon Nadler, Paul Krugman, and Jamie Dimon....

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 22:14 | Link to Comment A_MacLaren
A_MacLaren's picture

Don't forget Larry Summers.  He of Gibson's Paradox and the Gold Standard imfame.

http://www.gata.org/files/gibson.pdf

Silver is but Gibson's Girl: http://content.artofmanliness.com/uploads/2008/08/gibson.jpg

 

 

 

 

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:15 | Link to Comment John McCloy
John McCloy's picture

RICO?

You mean the banks act like Cosa Nostra in suits?

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:15 | Link to Comment kdervin
kdervin's picture

Did you see that they've got a lawsuit against NCAA and Ticketmaster - nice!

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:16 | Link to Comment Gloomy
Gloomy's picture
Sprott Silver trust raises $575 million in IPO* Over-allotment exercised in full
Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:33 | Link to Comment geminiRX
geminiRX's picture

I got a piece of that IPO

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 23:30 | Link to Comment CitizenPete
CitizenPete's picture

Who were the market makers?

 

update:

"The syndicate of underwriters was led by Morgan Stanley and RBC Capital Markets in both countries. The Canadian syndicate included TD Securities, Canaccord Genuity, National Bank Financial, BMO Capital Markets, HSBC Securities (Canada), GMP Securities, Wellington West Capital Markets, and Mackie Research Capital."

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:17 | Link to Comment ReallySparky
ReallySparky's picture

All I can say is Happy, Happy, Happy girl! 

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:21 | Link to Comment DavidPierre
DavidPierre's picture

Blatant Fraud

The election was certainly a display of how pissed off the populace is. The "turnout to throw out" incumbents was unprecedented and now... gridlock. The turnout unfortunately was mostly older voters as the under 30's just didn't show up. What a shame because it is their future that is being ruined and yet they sit silent. Hopefully the House of Representatives will do what they should have for the last 20 years which is forget about appropriations and start investigations into EVERYTHING!

This is too great a task and one can only hope that the massive frauds will come to light but it will not until the system comes apart at the seams. Then and only then will there be lynch mobs of tea baggers.

No one could have been as stupid as US leaders unless they were purposely trying to create harm.

Speaking of fraud, has anyone noticed the Gold and Silver markets today? The Dollar up a whopping 5 ticks and Gold down $27 with Silver off .88 cents.

Could this be any more obvious?

Knock the snot out of the metals before an obviously bullish announcement of purposeful Dollar debasement for the 100th time in 10+ years to "dig themselves out of a hole". The CFTC are "investigating" the Silver market and have been for 2 years. 

A suggestion to these goat heads?

PULL TODAY's TRADE TICKETS!

Today is all the proof needed to see who the CRIMINALS are. If you sit idle and look the other way YOU are also criminals and just as involved as anyone else.

 

No real trader nor long term holder of Gold or Silver would EVER trade them as they were today BEFORE a Fed announcement, NO ONE unless they wanted the price of the metals DOWN, PERIOD END OF STORY!

How blatant, fraudulent and illegal does the trading need to get before the CFTC does their jobs?

The new Congress should start investigating the CFTC and their obvious looking the other way from institutional and systemic fraud as the first order of business.

These CFTC commissioners are getting paid tax Dollars as salary and should be held accountable (Mr. Chilton excluded) for actually doing their jobs. If they do not do something VERY fast and just, they can, should and will be included as perpetrators of the metal fraud when it blows up ... as it surely will!

The cake is already baked at this point and no matter what is thrown at the metal's markets, Mother Nature will win out when all is said and done.

Whacked out tin foiled hat, Gold bugs have already won the war! 

It is not over yet, but we have won. Just sit back and watch, nothing more. The outcome, the endgame could not be more obvious. Common sense ... that when EVERYTHING is a fraud ... seek out what is real.

Is there anything at all more real than Gold or Silver when it comes to "money"?

 

The bottom line now is whether or not yesterday's vote gets heard in Washington. Continue down the road of Unconstitutional actions or go back to following the Constitution as every elected official has sworn on the Bible to do?

Go back to the rule of law or continue with fraud everywhere and get yours while you can at any expense. 

 Nothing will change until Mother Nature destroys the entire fraudulent system from top to bottom. In other words, "business as usual", read FRAUD, will be completely uncovered by the laws of nature. The only remaining question is whether the fraudsters are held accountable by "the laws of man" or in this case U.S. law!

 

No matter what happens DO NOT throw anything Gold or Silver overboard. The fraud rats are cornered, they are out of options and ammunition. The Dollar is being purposely debased and will continue to be until foreigners refuse to accept them anymore.  Understand this concept ... nothing more!  Protect yourself and family while getting rich in the meantime.

Via LeMetropoleCafe !

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:56 | Link to Comment oldmanagain
oldmanagain's picture

Blatant ignorance.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 19:09 | Link to Comment DavidPierre
DavidPierre's picture

Thank you oldmanagain
for defining, for all ZH readers, the level of your intellectual development: ...

"Blatant ignorance."

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 20:59 | Link to Comment New_Meat
New_Meat's picture

Well, John Kerry told us all last week that we are a bunch of "know-nothings."  Does that count?

- Ned

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 22:42 | Link to Comment centerline
centerline's picture

Step up oldman.  Make a case.  We (most of us at least) really want to know what you have to offer.  Seriously.  Otherwise, please return to posting over at the yahoo finance pages.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 23:27 | Link to Comment CitizenPete
CitizenPete's picture

LMFAO +100

 

or Cramer Blog

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 20:18 | Link to Comment cognitive asini...
cognitive asininity ad hominem's picture

directly on point and you've been junked twice as i post this?  the truth, apparently, hurts.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:23 | Link to Comment buzzsaw99
buzzsaw99's picture

Uncle RICO: Back in '82 I used to be able to throw a pigskin a quarter mile.

 

JPM: I own the federal reserve and the usa government.

 

Uncle RICO: Do you know anything about time travel?

 

JPM: Yes.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 20:25 | Link to Comment Problem Is
Problem Is's picture

Napoleon: "Because my uncle Rico's an IDIOT."

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:23 | Link to Comment eigenvalue
eigenvalue's picture

Somebody said silver would break $30 within 18 days. But I really don't see such prospect. Look at how the cartel attacked silver today.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:30 | Link to Comment Cdad
Cdad's picture

That's right, serf.  JP wants you buyin' Ebay...so hack out that sweet precious and buy paper crap so that Uncle Ben can do it to ya...again.

 

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:35 | Link to Comment Rainman
Rainman's picture

Took a swipe at gold too. Might be time to strengthen positions soon. Overjoyed. 

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 19:19 | Link to Comment Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

James Turk said that the other day. The man has stuck his neck out, but he's been right on gold/silver for ten years now, so I'll cut him some slack if it doesn't get to $30 that fast. Same with JimSinclair and his wager of 1M for Jan 2011 gold @ $1650. Now there's a man with conviction and balls.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:24 | Link to Comment israhole
israhole's picture

Good thing they own the judges too!

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:31 | Link to Comment buzzsaw99
buzzsaw99's picture

It'll never get that far. They own the fbi, doj, and sec.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:33 | Link to Comment cossack55
cossack55's picture

I thought the Porn Industry owned the SEC.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:52 | Link to Comment buzzsaw99
buzzsaw99's picture

Jamie does Mary S. and What the Squid Saw

Hiding the Salami Off the Sheets

Ben Dover and Take it Like a Mensch

Banksters Love Cox Long Time

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 20:21 | Link to Comment cognitive asini...
cognitive asininity ad hominem's picture

sheila bairs all

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 22:28 | Link to Comment RiffRaff
RiffRaff's picture

Oh, ew...

Obligatory Parn title:

Bernanke Panky with Big Gay Al

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 21:22 | Link to Comment espirit
espirit's picture

I thought the Porn Industry owned the SEC.

Nah, the SEC uses their own product.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:45 | Link to Comment Vagabond
Vagabond's picture

Atleast silver will go up as a consolation prize.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:42 | Link to Comment cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

RICO is hard core, they could have announced an intent to seek a fine only, maybe gone after some flunky. Methinks Obama was holding onto that one until after elections. JPM might skate, but not without some bloodshed.

Looks the 2012 campaign is so on.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 21:02 | Link to Comment New_Meat
New_Meat's picture

public shakedown

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:46 | Link to Comment Cheesy Bastard
Cheesy Bastard's picture

His name was Rico, he wore a diamond

He was escorted to his chair, he saw Lola dancin there....

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 18:58 | Link to Comment Kina
Kina's picture

How blatant, fraudulent and illegal does the trading need to get before the CFTC does their jobs?

 

There has to be colusion between the manipulating banks and the CFTC as such massive manipulation of Silver and Gold cannot occur unless the criminals know the Watchdog give the go-ahead and acknowledge they will allow it without comment or prosecution. And we know there was at least one judge who made the promise to never find against a manipulator.

 

The manipulation is so obvious that the whole world knows about it. And the whole world knows that the CFTC is there to allow cirminal manipulation to occur. It is only in recent times we have seen cracks in the edifice, embolding some in the center to come out and state a few truths.

 

Maybe there should be a few crimanl prosecutions occuring of CFTC and bank manipulators, especially those in charge of silver and gold manipulation.

 

I will bring the tar and feathers just in  case the courts wont do their job.


Wed, 11/03/2010 - 19:49 | Link to Comment Clint Liquor
Clint Liquor's picture

I heard rumors that a war was brewing between the JPM who is aligned with the FED and Goldman who owns the CFTC, Treasury and the SEC. This was going around when Goldman was accused of colluding with John Paulsen to defraud their clients with CDOs.

Could this be a true? Or is just it just my wet-dream that these pricks would destroy each other?

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 21:25 | Link to Comment espirit
espirit's picture

With the 800 lb. gorillas picking up peanuts off the floor of the cage, sooner or later they're going to bump heads.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 22:31 | Link to Comment RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

You have an extraneous "n" in your name. 

Just thought I'd point that out.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 22:56 | Link to Comment CitizenPete
CitizenPete's picture

"... that these pricks would destroy each other?"  Would probably be more like a 69 session, in the "don't ask - Don't tell tradition.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 19:27 | Link to Comment plocequ1
plocequ1's picture

Ok, Now what?

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 22:54 | Link to Comment CitizenPete
CitizenPete's picture

If you have or had silver stock, mining stock, ETFs, Funds, Trusts, Physical allocated silver, private held and believe you can prove that you have experienced any realized (or un-realized) loss do to the manipulation of silver prices the sign on to the case action suit. 

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 19:28 | Link to Comment JimboJammer
JimboJammer's picture

Silver  should  be  $  125. / oz.  right  now ....

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 19:59 | Link to Comment f16hoser
f16hoser's picture

Wait, I'm not finished buying physical.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 20:11 | Link to Comment financial illiterate
financial illiterate's picture

As an outsider looking in it would be nice to believe there is still something that's incorruptible about America. That the white collar crooks can be held accountable.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 22:37 | Link to Comment JLee2027
JLee2027's picture

The Founding Fathers never gave a damn what an outsider looking into America thought. They only cared about God, America, and the rights of the citizens of this country. That's what made us great. We ain't Europe.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 20:13 | Link to Comment Problem Is
Problem Is's picture

"If you have information you believe is important to the case..."

YES I do...
Jamie Dimon is a smug ass dick...

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 20:31 | Link to Comment Bob
Bob's picture

When the Top Dick, FBI Director Mueller, is your kept man you have nothing to worry about. 

Mueller is clearly Public Bitch Number One. 

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 20:20 | Link to Comment yabyum
yabyum's picture

Swine,I've bought the PM for years, and talked to you @ mish....we won!

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 20:48 | Link to Comment Buttcathead
Buttcathead's picture

I bet naked shorting of etf's like SDS QID TZA and FAZ is more highly profitable than naked silver.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 20:53 | Link to Comment JimboJammer
JimboJammer's picture

the  Zero  Hedge  group  is  up  on  this  subject..

there  is  290 +   million  americans  who  don't  care  about  this..

plus  the  95 %  of  the  rest  of  the  world ..

They  are  into  football ,  american  idol ,  Vampires...

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 21:05 | Link to Comment doolittlegeorge
doolittlegeorge's picture

is that picture legal?

Thu, 11/04/2010 - 01:12 | Link to Comment StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

In Thailand, lots of things are legal. :(

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 21:19 | Link to Comment JohnG
JohnG's picture

A picture is worth.....sometimes a million words:

 

http://kingworldnews.com/kingworldnews/KWN_DailyWeb/Entries/2010/11/3_Ja...

 

TAKE THAT JPM!

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 21:36 | Link to Comment JonNadler
JonNadler's picture

But, but.... Jamie, you promised this would never happen, you promised!

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 21:41 | Link to Comment robertocarlos
robertocarlos's picture

I'm afraid it's the big house for those boys.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 21:47 | Link to Comment JonNadler
JonNadler's picture

oh please don't say that, if they go, I go too, AHHHHHH

 

IS anybody familiar with witness protection programs?

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 22:14 | Link to Comment Kaiser Sousa
Kaiser Sousa's picture

when the same pattern unfolds day after day, month after month...there is no way it can b unless the market movements r being interfered with...

once again, the beat down occurs after resistance levels r breached n asian trading and then the metals r attacked n London & NY especially on "counterfieting to the moon day"...

now look again at what is happening in asia after todays farce...

http://finviz.com/futures.ashx

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 22:36 | Link to Comment RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

The gold/silver ratio definitely needs some adjustment.

Wed, 11/03/2010 - 22:36 | Link to Comment bobert
bobert's picture

The only time I've seen RICO applied successfully was against some hapless

pro-lifers in Portland. Persecuted them real good!!! Ruined their lives. It was sad.

The real gangsters are unaffected by RICO. It's like"throwing them in the briar patch."

Do NOT follow this link or you will be banned from the site!