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Ron Paul Calls For An End To America's Welfare State, Choice To Opt Out Of Social Security

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Mon, 11/08/2010 - 14:29 | 708811 HelluvaEngineer
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Imagine if 15% of your salary went into gold and silver instead.

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 14:38 | 708851 Sudden Debt
Sudden Debt's picture

actually, it's a bit higher then that for me this last year :)

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 15:12 | 709017 Herd Redirectio...
Herd Redirection Committee's picture

There are so many things that have to come to an end, and so little time!  Social Security, the Fed, drawn out overseas military engagements,  hasn't it become abundantly clear this our 'video game moment':  "Game over, man"  if there ever was one.

So clearly, what is needed is a complete reset.  Back to basics.  Back to the Constitution, and we work our way from there.  Tax and legal system are both ridiculously overcomplex.


Mon, 11/08/2010 - 15:27 | 709074 Sudden Debt
Sudden Debt's picture

there are 2 ways to reset it all:

1. just press the right top button for 3 seconds and then slide the red bar to the right.

wait 10 seconds and press the right top button again for 3 seconds.

2. slide on top where the clock is located from right to left to right to left.

a small menu will appear and then you press: "respring"


or you can just wait untill the batteries run dry. That would be the third option...

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 15:38 | 709114 knukles
knukles's picture

Or call the dude in India that got your information technology job when it got outsourced.

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 21:46 | 710267 i-dog
i-dog's picture

a) The dude in India needs to eat too! You want to sell him computers and aircraft, why can't he sell you his labour to help pay for them?

b) You also need to address the causes of the outsourcing (high taxes, excessive benefits, excessive regulation, job underperformance, inability to fill certain positions).

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 15:38 | 709113 Rasna
Rasna's picture



What distinguishes Nazism from generic fascism is its obsession with racial theories of superiority, and some would say, its roots in the socialist theory of proletarian revolution.

Fascism and Nazism as ideologies involve, to varying degrees, some of the following hallmarks:

*** Nationalism and super-patriotism with a sense of historic mission.

*** Aggressive militarism even to the extent of glorifying war as good for the national or individual spirit.

*** Use of violence or threats of violence to impose views on others (fascism and Nazism both employed street violence and state violence at different moments in their development).

*** Authoritarian reliance on a leader or elite not constitutionally responsible to an electorate.

*** Cult of personality around a charismatic leader.

*** Reaction against the values of Modernism, usually with emotional attacks against both liberalism and communism.

*** Exhortations for the homogeneous masses of common folk (Volkish in German, Populist in the U.S.) to join voluntarily in a heroic mission_often metaphysical and romanticized in character.

*** Dehumanization and scapegoating of the enemy_seeing the enemy as an inferior or subhuman force, perhaps involved in a conspiracy that justifies eradicating them.

*** The self image of being a superior form of social organization beyond socialism, capitalism and democracy.

*** Elements of national socialist ideological roots, for example, ostensible support for the industrial working class or farmers; but ultimately, the forging of an alliance with an elite sector of society.

*** Abandonment of any consistent ideology in a drive for state power.

It is vitally important to understand that fascism and Nazism are not biologically or culturally determinant. Fascism does not attach to the gene structure of any specific group or nationality. Nazism was not the ultimate expression of the German people. Fascism did not end with World War II.


Source (somewhat dated): http://www.remember.org/hist.root.what.html

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 15:57 | 709206 ZakuKommander
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I presume you don't mean the original Constitution that permitted slavery and didn't permit women to vote.  Or should we treat it like the Bible, and select only those parts that agree with one's personal opinions.

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 16:05 | 709243 goldsaver
goldsaver's picture

You do know that the Constitution includes the amendments that were voted for and ratified right?

Of course, you may prefer the "Living Constitution" that means whatever you might feel it means when you get up in the morning.

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 16:24 | 709319 ZakuKommander
ZakuKommander's picture

See my use of the word "original."  

The Constitution means more than the document, and amendments. For example, it means Supreme Court decisions interpreting it as well.  Which change over time, as American has changed from a largely agrarian to a largely industrial to a largely service-oriented and financial country.  It also means Realpolitik, which is "what happens in real life."  

Both left and right play with Constitutional interpretation like Christians play with the Bible.  Talking about the "sacredness" or "correctness" of one's own vision of a limited amount of words is naive.

I trust you realize that.

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 17:31 | 709602 goldsaver
goldsaver's picture

The Constitution means more than the document, and amendments. For example, it means Supreme Court decisions interpreting it as well.

No, it doesn't. The Constitution is a contract between the states. A contract that has a stated modification clause (amendments). That would be like your bank saying that your mortgage means whatever they interpret it to mean as they wish.

Which change over time, as American has changed from a largely agrarian to a largely industrial to a largely service-oriented and financial country.  It also means Realpolitik, which is "what happens in real life."

If it did, it would be meaningless. It would be like a police officer stopping you and saying, "Yes I know the sign says 45 MPH but in my opinion based on the demographics of this area, you should have been going 25MPH so here is a $100 dollar fine". Nowhere in the Constitution is anyone given the authority to re-write it on the fly based on Realpolitik.

Both left and right play with Constitutional interpretation like Christians play with the Bible.  

as you are doing now. Billy did it too does not make an argument.

Talking about the "sacredness" or "correctness" of one's own vision of a limited amount of words is naive.

Don't call yourself naive man, misinformed maybe, but not naive. Or are you claiming that you are not using your own vision of the correctness of the limited amount of words in the Constitution to make your point.

A contract that can be modified at will without the consent of the parties involved and outside of the clauses of the contract is not a contract, is toilet paper. The same contract that created these United States also defines the functions and limits of the powers given to them. Saying that it must adapt to Realpolitik and interpretation on the fly is idiotic in the extreme. Lets say that the wicked witch of the west, Speaker Pelosi, decided that Realpolitik dictates that she remains speaker forever because the Constitution must reflect our changing environment. Or if shrub would have decided to order a draft by executive order, bypassing congress, for the good of the current common defense, would you have been so amenable to a living constitution? How is that different than the federal government writing a health care bill mandating individuals to purchase a product outside of the powers given to them by the Constitution?

You are correct that the Constitution must adapt to changes in the country. Even Jefferson spoke of the need to change laws as needed. But, there is a specific modification clause in the contract. It is the amendment process. It is specifically intended to be difficult to do in order to refrain the power of the federal government from precisely what you advocate, unchecked power.

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 17:55 | 709687 GoldSilverDoc
GoldSilverDoc's picture


I don't remember signing any "constitution contract".

In fact, I don't remember signing any contract at all.   So, I guess it doesn't apply to me. Come to think of it, all the guys that agreed to it in the first place are dead.  So I guess it doesn't apply, really, to anybody.



Mon, 11/08/2010 - 18:07 | 709729 goldsaver
goldsaver's picture

I never said you signed it. The constitution is a contract between the States, not between individuals. The individuals are represented in this contract by the State delegates that are either elected or appointed (the Constitution is silent as to the method) at the state level.

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 19:33 | 709934 nmewn
nmewn's picture

"Both left and right play with Constitutional interpretation like Muslims play with the Quran."

There...fixed it for you...no charge this time.


Mon, 11/08/2010 - 20:13 | 709941 nmewn
nmewn's picture


Mon, 11/08/2010 - 20:39 | 710080 A Nanny Moose
A Nanny Moose's picture

The Constitution is a check on the nature of humans in positions of power, not just a set of rules of governance. It matters not, how primitive or modern a society is. The power structures willl never change.

We might still be agragrian if we weren't so busy building a better mouse trap with which to destroy ourselves every 70 years, or so.

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 22:03 | 710304 i-dog
i-dog's picture

"You do know that the Constitution includes the amendments that were voted for and ratified right?"

OK. So your plan is to wind the clock back to May 7th, 1992 (date of ratification of 27th Amendment) and take a mulligan from there?

Sounds like a great plan ... what could possibly go wrong?!!

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 16:32 | 709348 trav7777
trav7777's picture

why should women vote?  They can't pick out what to fuckin wear or what type of food they'd prefer you bought them tonight, so why should I trust their voting?

we don't need more irrational voters.

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 16:48 | 709422 ZakuKommander
ZakuKommander's picture

But we can't pick out women, so there.

Best Courtroom toilet graffiti evah:

"Next time I'll just find a woman who hates me and buy her a house."

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 14:43 | 708879 66Sexy
66Sexy's picture

ring ring.

Ben Bernake's aide picks up phone. "just a minute..."

Bernake: "yeah ill take it." ... "Hello?"

conference call: bla bla bla from various institutional bankers, rambling about how the world is flocking to gold and the NWO is in jepoardy....

Bernake: "Dont worry. we'll get the price down. we just transferred each of you 10,000,000,000 in brand spankin' new QE funds to start entering those short positions and ETF's. buy 'em from the offshore accounts... and keep it QUIET..."

to be continued...

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 15:04 | 708982 BigJim
BigJim's picture

Yes, I've wondered how much QE has been quietly diverted to cover the short positions of the bullion banks so they can carry on.

I think only a physical squeeze will end this manipulation.

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 15:12 | 709015 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

Oh I have NO doubt tons of QE is going right to PM puts, no question about it!

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 14:32 | 708823 unwashedmass
unwashedmass's picture

\yeah... but... yeah but....who will pay for the wars then?

if we don't steal the funding from the SS fund, who will pay for the empire?

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 14:54 | 708936 doolittlegeorge
doolittlegeorge's picture

right now "it appears to be Greece, Ireland and Portugal."  That's interesting.  "They happen to be really small, too."

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 14:32 | 708830 flaunt
flaunt's picture

I'm tired of begging for the mafia to let me live my life in piece and to stop taking my property against my will.  I just want them to all go away.



Mon, 11/08/2010 - 14:33 | 708831 flaunt
flaunt's picture

peace too

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 14:40 | 708870 OnTheWaterfront
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Mon, 11/08/2010 - 15:00 | 708897 hedgeless_horseman
hedgeless_horseman's picture

Where's the option to opt out of Ron Paul?

He is in India spending more money that we don't have, some of which he has already promised those poor souls in Haiti, but has yet to deliver.  However, I am sure he will get around to it.  Something about the teleprompters not working on generator power, etc.

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 14:46 | 708903 Mr Lennon Hendrix
Mr Lennon Hendrix's picture

All those things will happen in time.  But first, we get out of Af/Pak, and stop the ponzi.

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 15:02 | 708974 Ragnarok
Ragnarok's picture

Are you paid to sit around and post this absolute drivel?  Agitator?

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 15:05 | 708980 Crummy
Crummy's picture

How does it help the poor and unfortunate to hide the cost of their care off of the books in some sham trust fund?

How does it help the poor and unfortunate to print money until the value drops to the point that what little they have buys that much less?

How does it help the poor and unfortunate to create giant pools of cash that not only rob consumers of their bargaining power but drive up prices on the very thing they were intended to offset the cost of?

How does it help the poor and unfortunate to be such an obvious troll...


Mon, 11/08/2010 - 15:13 | 709024 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

Sittin on my GOLD, and bullets and beans....Obama pig!

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 15:27 | 709076 traderjoe
traderjoe's picture

I don't usually feed trolls, but...

1. How do all of the bank bailouts under Bush AND Obama reduce the pay gap? Don't the bank bailouts favor the rich bondholders at the cost of the ordinary taxpayer? Why are the banks being allowed to make such huge bonuses? Where's your dear leader on that?

2. How does the increased presence in the Afghanistan help the oil from ruining the earth? How about the obvious complicity between the dear leader and BP in the Gulf spill cover-up?

3. How does the FDA food safety bill help smaller farmers in their attempt to compete against the mega-corporate farmers?

4. How does a system that is based upon constant inflation help the marginal over time? How can they store the value of their labor? Oh, it forces them to deal with the 'money-changers' and chase returns to beat inflation.

A properly structured hard-money currency can actually feature stable or declining prices over time - which REWARDS savers, middle-class, and labors to be able to save and maintain purchasing power over time. It also <could> move us away from a culture of commercialism and consumption, which is clearly impacting the Earth and depleting resources. 

None of your arguments hold the slightest bit of water, and are essentially strawman/trolling for a reaction. I repeat my question from another thread - are you getting paid by the post?

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 22:13 | 710327 i-dog
i-dog's picture

"How about the obvious complicity between the dear leader and BP in the Gulf spill cover-up?"

I'm curious, tm ... in another thread you said you can't accept the truth about a 9-11 cover-up because there is no "absolute proof" the government was involved, yet here you throw out a belief in a conspiracy between Obama and BP of "the Gulf spill cover-up" without referring to any absolute proof! Do you have "proof" of a conspiracy between Obama and BP? Help me here!

Tue, 11/09/2010 - 02:39 | 710835 traderjoe
traderjoe's picture

i-dog - I think you might have me confused with someone else. I do believe the goobermint was involved in 9.11. The videos of WTC 7 are enough for me - www.buildingwhat.org. 

With BP, the initial flow estimates were deeply flawed, just for example. The 100 yard (or whatever) line for reporters, the EPA allowing Corexit, hiding its impacts, etc., etc. 

Tue, 11/09/2010 - 03:53 | 711075 i-dog
i-dog's picture

Oooops ... really sorry about that!! It was intended for 'tmosely'. I obviously wasn't concentrating when I read your name. Humble apologies!

I also agree with you on the GOM spill ... though I'm not in the camp (yet) of those who believe it was a deliberate spill to poison food/people -- whereas it's obvious to any who look that 9-11 was a very deliberate inside job.

Tue, 11/09/2010 - 13:28 | 712172 traderjoe
traderjoe's picture

No worries at all. I knew the conversation you were referring to...

Agreed on your second part.


Mon, 11/08/2010 - 16:17 | 709290 Astute Investor
Astute Investor's picture

I did not recognize this poster so I clicked on the name.  I received the cryptic message: YOU ARE NOT AUTHORIZED TO ACCESS THIS PAGE.

Is Obama2012 really Obama?  Maybe an operative of the military-industrial complex? Or simply a bot?

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 16:34 | 709359 trav7777
trav7777's picture

I'm sure it's REALLY Obama

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 18:40 | 709818 Astute Investor
Astute Investor's picture

A sense of humor is a terrible thing to waste....

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 18:47 | 709833 Marla And Me
Marla And Me's picture

He's already been banned?  Wow, that didn't take very long...  on for less than two weeks and the paid for shill is out?  That or Tyler willingly accepts and nurtures paid trolls...  Velobabe and Chumbawumba were similarly capped, although Kathy Chamberlain is still with us...  There is definitely some weird stuff that goes on with the comments section that Tyler never addresses...

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 21:08 | 710163 Hulk
Hulk's picture

Only the shadow really knows...

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 14:47 | 708904 homersimpson
homersimpson's picture

Um.. vote liberal

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 16:09 | 709258 goldsaver
goldsaver's picture

Um.. vote libertarian ... There, I fixed it for you

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 17:20 | 709566 homersimpson
homersimpson's picture

Well - he asked how to opt out of Ron Paul.. Therefore, vote liberal.

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 14:57 | 708950 doolittlegeorge
doolittlegeorge's picture

no shit.  From "end the Fed" to "end Social Security."  Say WHAT?  Talk about "co-opted."  "I hate it--but i still need money for my consituents!"  So now "Bennie's your best friend"?  And what's that story about your son having girls "bow before the mighty Megatron" or something.  Is that some 'economic thing'?

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 15:15 | 709034 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

Well to be fair Doolittlegeorge, Ron Paul did his 'END THE FED' speech already just this morning on CNBC! Review earlier ZH story with video. Actually what he said is the FED will just implode soon. End the FED, end SS, end ALL this BS!

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 16:57 | 709469 TuesdayBen
TuesdayBen's picture

On ballots, last week, here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:TX14_109.gif

Mon, 11/08/2010 - 14:36 | 708846 hedgeless_horseman
hedgeless_horseman's picture

A new killer product; we're all saved!  Something totally unnecessary, that just recently was free, now costs hundreds of dollars! 

Borrow and spend, bitches!!!


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