This page has been archived and commenting is disabled.

Scotia-Mocatta Sells Out Of 1 Kilo Silver Bars

Tyler Durden's picture




 

It seems that not a day passes by without some major dealer running out of a precious metal in inventory. Last Thursday when we presented the most recent inventory at Scotia Mocatta (alongside the ongoing firesale at the US Mint where incidentally total silver sales in January are now at a fresh all time record 4,724,000 ounces), one of the ten market-making members of the London Bullion Market Association and one of only 5 banks to participate in the London gold fixing, we indicated that of all silver bar related products, the bank only had the 1kg Valcambi silver bar, that was listed 3 weeks ago, in stock. As of today, this object is no longer in inventory even at the unit price of CAD$980.11. Reader S. presents the two logical alternative for what is happening: "This can only conclude two things: 1. They purchased a limited amount (due to low supplies) and was sold off quickly. 2. They purchased a large amount and was sold off due to major purchases." Alternatively, the bank now has the 100 oz silver bar back in stock. We will keep tabs on how long before this also becomes "sold out." Our question is whether the ongoing shortage at most dealers, despite the so-called drubbing in PM prices, is nothing but definitive evidence that just like in stocks, precious metal investors are merely using every drop in prices as nothing more than a chance to "buy the fucking (fisical) dip"?

Compare Scotia-Mocatta eStore inventory as of January 18...

And as of today.

 

- advertisements -

Comment viewing options

Select your preferred way to display the comments and click "Save settings" to activate your changes.
Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:00 | 900711 Turd Ferguson
Turd Ferguson's picture

Yes, by all means, sell all your silver and your silver mining shares. It is in a bubble.

sarc <on>

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:05 | 900717 goldmiddelfinger
goldmiddelfinger's picture

They sold out of bulllion, not shares turdy for the purdy. Will you turd, fight Bernake when he turns off QE?

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:12 | 900751 Quintus
Quintus's picture

'When he turns off QE'? That's funny. The day Ben stops buying $75 billion of treasury debt each month at ludicrous yields I'll step in and buy it myself. Hell, nobody else will.

I think my money's safe though. QE will continue because it must. There's no other way to fund Trillion dollar deficits in perpetuity.

Tue, 01/25/2011 - 01:18 | 901702 Malcolm Tucker
Malcolm Tucker's picture


Algeria might be the next domino to fall because of Bernanke and company. Here are videos of the riots and even the hacking group Anonymous is getting in on the action!

http://fedupmontrealer.blogspot.com/2011/01/algeria-next.html

Tue, 01/25/2011 - 01:20 | 901705 Bob Sponge
Bob Sponge's picture

....until the world abandons the dollar and all the dollars held in foreign banks come back to the US resulting in hyperfuckingcrazyinflation.

Tue, 01/25/2011 - 01:59 | 901752 Campagnolo
Campagnolo's picture

that's why the Turd is right about focus primarily on dollar behavior and fundamentals...in the meantime "they" can manipulate gold and silver all they want..until countries start selling dollars, which, from the chart I can see is happening right now.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:50 | 900883 johnnymustardseed
johnnymustardseed's picture

They will not be able to turn off QE, they are going to have to bail out states and the muni market next.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:22 | 901036 downwiththebanks
downwiththebanks's picture

You mean, of course, paying off the states bailed out creditors.

The people get screwed either way.  

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 22:27 | 901271 satansanus
satansanus's picture

the muni mess was cleaned up quietly already,

not dragged through idiotic ravings of hank paulson and ben bernanke like the stock market crash,

munis will not and did not destroy the economy.

There are invisible elephants who love the USA

Tue, 01/25/2011 - 01:15 | 901697 walküre
walküre's picture

cleaned up?

what are you smoking?

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:11 | 900993 ZEITGEIST
ZEITGEIST's picture

will you go live with Johhny Bravo once you realize what a moron you are ???? Lots of room left in the trailer park....with food stamps to go..yes..the Russians and Chinese are buying...because ????? They believe in the jewelry market..stupidity like yours is hard to come by.......

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:45 | 901131 fiddler_on_the_roof
fiddler_on_the_roof's picture

During 2004 to 2007, even when FED raised rates Gold went up , actually doubled because monetary base was still expanding then.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 23:25 | 901465 I think I need ...
I think I need to buy a gun's picture

yeah and volcker had to raise rates 18 fold finally to tame the lion. Its coming i can feel it. Whether they front run everyone and do it overnight or let the markets take care of business.

Tue, 01/25/2011 - 09:16 | 902133 JonNadler
JonNadler's picture

32 junks for Middlefinger LOL

 

Jamie will not be pleased about this

Tue, 01/25/2011 - 11:05 | 902476 Hephasteus
Hephasteus's picture

33 junks. I think his performance review is going to be problematic.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:13 | 900747 Math Man
Math Man's picture

If you had a business, and the product you were selling was falling in price every day, would you buy more inventory?

I woudn't.  I'd tell people there was a 'shortage' and wait until the price stabalized before restocking.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:25 | 900797 Bigger Dickus
Bigger Dickus's picture

They are hedged. Got it? Hedged!

Their business does not work the way you think.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:56 | 900909 Math Man
Math Man's picture

You mean they've been shorting?

This is an interesting dilema.  Either:

A) PM dealer's are not buying inventory and inventing a 'shortage'

or

B) PM dealer's are manipulating the price lower by shorting

or

C) both

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:04 | 900951 Bigger Dickus
Bigger Dickus's picture

For every kilo of silver in inventory, they are short a kilo in the paper market. Their profit is the spread. It's as simple as that.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 22:39 | 901311 h3m1ngw4y
h3m1ngw4y's picture

i think its futile he doesnt get the idea. lucky he isnt a bullion dealer, he would be long bancrupt leaving a lot of distressed buyers ;-)

i think someone there has done his "math"

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:50 | 900885 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

But the price for delivery of physical is hardly dropping at all, paper silver is though. Numbers on a screen are 1 thing, go in and buy that silver and see what the price really is.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:51 | 901150 GoinFawr
GoinFawr's picture

You'd better not be implying retail is a more realistic price discovery mechanism... Bite your tongue sir!

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:25 | 900800 Spalding_Smailes
Spalding_Smailes's picture

Turd,

 

Stopped by the blog today.

So you now use the heavy hand of censorship if someone brings up your on again off again love affair with charts. Use them only if they support your thesis.

The guy was calling a top using charts geez' ....And you went off on him for posting links to his blog- But you posted your blog link 100 times now on ZH and I bet other " high traffic " blog's -

 

If gold breaks 1,320 its " lights out "... Not much support after that.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:28 | 900808 JLee2027
JLee2027's picture

It's Turd's blog, and his house and rules....is there an issue with this?

My house has rules too...don't come in and shit on the floor that I clean.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:33 | 900830 Spalding_Smailes
Spalding_Smailes's picture

I guess Turd should be happy Tyler does not run ZH like his blog ....

After hundreds of blog spams ............geez'

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:03 | 900949 JLee2027
JLee2027's picture

Oh come on. His house, his rules. What about that don't you understand? You have no say in the matter.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 22:18 | 901241 Idiot Savant
Idiot Savant's picture

Don't worry, Turd is going to banish himself. If gold isn't at $1600.00 by 6/15/11, he will leave ZH forever, never to return.  (his call)

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:37 | 900841 Hephasteus
Hephasteus's picture

Oh im postive it will break 1320 and probably run down to 1288. I mean when you get desperate you gotta go all in. Full retard.

Comex is busted. Just like the other london gold pool that preceded it.

Keep eating nice big lunches. We want a good vomit and piss your pants show.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:04 | 900953 JLee2027
JLee2027's picture

Full crook! I love it.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:52 | 900889 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

Im sure youre right Spalding, its over for PM's, as Russia and China go all-out increasing 10X their purchases. Gee youre real smart.

Tue, 01/25/2011 - 07:34 | 901976 grey7beard
grey7beard's picture

>> If gold breaks 1,320 its " lights out "... Not much support after that.

 

I think most folks without an agenda would acknowledge $1,280 as pretty well establised trend line support.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:55 | 901025 Threeggg
Threeggg's picture

Hey,

With the way they are hitting Gold and Silver tonight you would think options expiry and a delivery month was upon us !!!!

Wait !

Expiry is this Wednesday the 26th of JAN 2011 and the next delivery month is February 2011 !!

Oh, I see why the pressure !!!

LOL

This game is getting old !

Load the truck on Wednesday !!!!

BTFD !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 22:17 | 901193 GoinFawr
GoinFawr's picture

Once again 3G's has it pinned down and squirming.

'They've' done all they can to create a perfect storm:

All the egregious shenanigans with the margin hikes, plus the complete and utter capitulation of the CFTC, add to that a non delivery OP EX... sheesh, I'd wager 'They're' pissed that Au is still over 1200 bitz and bytes of FRN's and silver over 20 of the same.

Business as usual gentlemen.  Not exactly subtle. It'll last just as long as it has every other time too: ie Not very. The only bit of real cleverness 'they've' thrown into the mix this time around is allowing the dollar to take a good *monkey-hammering simultaneously (speaking of bearish looking charts...)which is likely to turn out to be 'their' biggest mistake in a long time.

As we say where I come from on non delivery op ex: C-U-Next-Tuesday

Regards

* smailes'.

Tue, 01/25/2011 - 18:28 | 904226 DeltaFunctionToronto
DeltaFunctionToronto's picture

Well said.

What many are missing by overemphasizing technical levels is that major trend changes are underway in a host of currencies.

This ends one way, and it is far too obvious to those who have been in this market since 2001.

Rule #1: The speculative public always gets fried - both on the way down, and on the way up.

They chase technical charts, and ignore long-term secular trends.

Rule #2: Major moves require major washouts prior to their advent.

Sentiment must play ping-pong to establish that critical imbalance in buyers and sellers to thrust prices higher.

This gold bull market will be regarded as the greatest bull market in history, and thus complacency will likely afford anyone who does not take it seriously a horn through the chest. A very steep, upward sloping horn with 12 000 written all over it.

 

 

Tue, 01/25/2011 - 23:09 | 901448 GoinFawr
GoinFawr's picture

Deja Vu!

Hey Turd,  could this actually be July 29,2010 all over again? Sure looks like it:

http://img62.imageshack.us/i/july292010.jpg/

...only bigger.

Even the USD action synchs up:

http://img262.imageshack.us/f/july292010usdx.jpg/

UPDATE:

Jesse Agrees. Check the charts.
http://jessescrossroadscafe.blogspot.com/2011/01/gold-daily-and-silver-weekly-charts_25.html
"This intermediate gold top and correction bears a striking resemblance to the May - August 2010 top and correction just prior to gold's amazing breakout rally.

I think the next four weeks are going to be quite interesting in a number of dimensions, and through the chill of winter, a portent of Spring is in the air."

Regards

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:07 | 900734 goldmiddelfinger
goldmiddelfinger's picture

Supply is plentiful despite ZH misdirection pump.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:11 | 900748 Tyler Durden
Tyler Durden's picture

Misdirection? Please provide us with your best offer on the Valcambi one kilo bar...

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:17 | 900768 tmosley
tmosley's picture

He's a drive by troll.  He sprays one-liners in every direction against anyone who he disagrees with, but never actually contributes anything.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:19 | 900775 goldmiddelfinger
goldmiddelfinger's picture

Why not stand by what your headline implies?

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:19 | 900779 Tyler Durden
Tyler Durden's picture

"Scotia-Mocatta Sells Out Of 1 Kilo Silver Bars"

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:34 | 900833 schrock
schrock's picture

@goldmiddelfinger

Dude do you realize how stupid you look right now? Just shut up before your whole leg ends up in your mouth.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:51 | 900871 Spalding_Smailes
Spalding_Smailes's picture

 

 

United States Mint American Silver Eagle bullion coins shattered their old annual sales record by nearly 6 million coins. Silver Eagles reached sales of 34,662,500 in 2010, capping their third straight annual gain.

December sales were sluggish — the slowest in 2010, but previous months were mostly on fire and a new annual sales record was already assured following an all-time monthly high of 4.26 million inNovember 2010.

The following table provides US Mint sales figures for each month:

 

" Returning to annual numbers, the chart below highlights how demand for the one-ounce, .999 fine silver coins has jumped since 2008 when annual sales hit 19.58 million from the previous 9.88 million in 2007. The year 2009 held the prior annual record at 28.76 million."

From 10,000 to 40,000    --- Bubble ?

 

http://www.coinnews.net/2011/01/10/silver-eagle-bullion-coins-close-to-n...

 

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:34 | 901087 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

Record sales again this month means a "bubble"? Why is the price dropping then? Please explain the shortages? Your "logic" if it can be called that, is sorely lacking. Amazingly stupid.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 22:58 | 901375 Math Man
Math Man's picture

Record sales mean there are no shortages.

If you don't have the product, how can you sell it?

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 23:10 | 901416 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

Other than waiting weeks or months for those deliveries to show up? Yeah, okay Nadler.

Why is the price dropping with HUGE physical demand? You guys never answer that question.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 23:18 | 901440 Spalding_Smailes
Spalding_Smailes's picture

 


 

Mornings around here are fragrant: We all wake up to smell the coffee brewing. There's something brewing in the gold market, though, that might not be so pleasant.

Lease rates in the London bullion market have risen precipitously. Well, it's not so much that lease rates are rising - they're pretty cheap compared with their year-ago levels - it's more that forward rates are at historic lows.

 

 

Forward rates determine the pricing of bullion transactions in the over-the-counter market. A decline in forward rates implies one of two things: There's either a scarcity of metal available for swap or lease transactions, or there's heavy forward selling.

 

 

So, which is it? Well, we can gather some clues from the COMEX market. The latest Commodity Futures Trading Commission data show commercial accounts engaging in heavy selling and long liquidation. To boot, money managers have built their largest short position since August 2009 (and, if you're a contrarian, small speculators have taken up their strongest long position in a year and a half).

Given all that, the aroma wafting from the gold market seems to be a harbinger of a sell-off. Technically, gold's stalled now. Key support for the February COMEX contract sits at $1,120 after bulls backed off from a test of the halfway point for the contract's December swoon. A close below that level makes the sell-off case.

If February's price closes below the $1,111 level, the December low at $1,075 then becomes the bears' target.

No guarantees, of course, but at that point, bulls will have to consider how much they're in love with a four-figure gold price. How's that smell?

 

http://www.hardassetsinvestor.com/component/content/article/3/1957-gold-...

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 23:26 | 901469 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

Spalding,

Do you have one original thought in that ten cent head of yours, or is it all just cut n paste propaganda? 

Tue, 01/25/2011 - 01:00 | 901674 JLee2027
JLee2027's picture

Why is the price dropping with HUGE physical demand? You guys never answer that question.

The paper price has dropped.  Paper, paper, paper. Let it go to zero, who cares. Hold physical and you win.

Tue, 01/25/2011 - 07:50 | 901984 grey7beard
grey7beard's picture

>> The paper price has dropped.  Paper, paper, paper. Let it go to zero, who cares.

 

I see this sentiment quite often.  I was under the impression when one bought physical the purchase price was determined by the paper price.  If I call Tulving to order gold coins I'm going to get a spot plus price.  There has been no disconnect in paper/physical pricing.

 

 

Tue, 01/25/2011 - 07:59 | 901988 ColonelCooper
ColonelCooper's picture

Wait for it......

Tue, 01/25/2011 - 08:11 | 902002 JLee2027
JLee2027's picture

There has been no disconnect in paper/physical pricing.

You don't remember 2008 do you?

Tue, 01/25/2011 - 11:13 | 902509 grey7beard
grey7beard's picture

>> You don't remember 2008 do you?

 

Actually I do remember 2008.  I thought the discussion was about conditions as of January 2011.  It looks like Tulving has a $18 spread on new 1 oz Eagles.  I see little to no difference in the spread from what is was 6 months or a year ago.

 

 

Tue, 01/25/2011 - 14:00 | 903272 JLee2027
JLee2027's picture

Then check your memory. Physical and paper silver prices separated in 2008. The same could happen here.

 

That was my last response to you, as you seem intentionally obtuse.

Tue, 01/25/2011 - 11:14 | 902514 Dantzler
Dantzler's picture

DATA

Was chatting with a local (PNW) coin/bullion dealer last weekend. Used to be premiums on 100 oz. name brand Ag bars (J-M, Englehard) were $0.30-0.40 per ounce for the retail customer. Now they are $0.75

This dealer said he now has to pay 0.40 - 0.50 over spot wholesale because other large buyers are offering a higher premium to get physical at this level. He has to up his retail premium to make up the difference.

 

Tue, 01/25/2011 - 01:40 | 901732 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

You should already KNOW the answer:  Sales of Paper products are driving the prices of physical commodities down, which is a good thing for those of us buying the physical commodities.  Pay attention, or start taking notes.

Tue, 01/25/2011 - 01:21 | 901703 schrock
schrock's picture

 

@Spalding_Smailes

You assume too much. I don't necessarily disagree with what you are implying about silver being in a bubble. However that is for another debate. My comment to goldmiddelfinger about how stupid he looks was not in reference to any silver shortage debate but in reference to well how stupid he looks. Can he not read a headline. Tylor said nothing of the world having a shortage of silver only that "Scotia-Mocatta Sells Out Of 1 Kilo Silver Bars". You are a troll no doubt!

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:55 | 900905 Freddie
Freddie's picture

Can you imagine all the "swag" Tyler must get from the gold and silver miners? 

He must have a great gig - countin his gold bars and silver ingots by day - being a player with the hot bitchez at night.

He is probably even ban*in that biotch Blythe on the side. <s>

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:06 | 900969 JLee2027
JLee2027's picture

Since we're all guessing, I would guess you are imagining.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:53 | 901157 e_goldstein
e_goldstein's picture

i would guess that he is masturbating.

Tue, 01/25/2011 - 00:59 | 901672 quasimodo
quasimodo's picture

Wow, is this deep thoughts with Jack Handy? Mum should send you back to your room now little Timmy, run along and let the adults post. You can always try yahoo answers if you are sexually curious

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:04 | 900950 Drag Racer
Drag Racer's picture

too late, but I think he is pausing at the crotch...

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:13 | 900997 breezer1
breezer1's picture

SM does not now or 2 years ago intend to make it easy to purchase gold or silver. i tried two years ago and their prices were prohibitive and delivery was sometime down the road. after 45 minutes i cancelled my order and left.

RBC processed my order the next day without a problem with a 3.5% smaller premium. supply with all the dealers right now is on and off and all are buyers at decent prices.

most mine production is leaving canada and there is a physical squeeze globally. it has been all about the physical for a while now. use the paper price to load up if you can. at times like this its important to remember that paper gold and silver has not lost yet , although it is fighting for it's life.

 

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:12 | 900750 JLee2027
JLee2027's picture

Is your name Roger?

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:26 | 900804 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

Goldmiddlefinger the 4th incarnate of a PM troll who has been run off too many times, back with a vengeance to mash any silver or gold buying.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 22:37 | 901308 lawrence1
lawrence1's picture

Yeah, he's an angry, stupid asshole who should be totally ignored so he will go away. If ignored completely, I predict he will go away.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:04 | 900722 Robslob
Robslob's picture

I hit "add to cart" 5 times on that picture and it wouldn't let me buy anything...WTF! Sarc "on"

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:04 | 900723 lieutenantjohnchard
lieutenantjohnchard's picture

still a significant premium on silver coins at auction sites, too. i keep getting outbid even above melt.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:06 | 900729 awgee
awgee's picture

Plenty at Tulving.  Are shortages indicated by the declining price?

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:15 | 900928 Captain Benny
Captain Benny's picture

The price you are quoted is based on spot price.  Spot price is not determined by the willingness of people to buy or sell silver at a negotiated price.  Its in fact a derivation of many factors,  not the least of which is futures price...  I know I'm gonna take a little heat from the crowd for saying that, but its true.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 22:04 | 901194 awgee
awgee's picture

So what?  Bottom line, I can purchase as much silver as I want yesterday, today, and tomorrow and for the last two weeks, I can get it for less almost every day as people yell shortage, shortage.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:07 | 900735 DaBernank
DaBernank's picture

I asked Jamie Dimon and he said I should just buy SLV instead of these heavy, inconvenient coins and bars.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:08 | 900738 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

I am almost done with my decades long precious metals buying program.  I am at 9%, which is enough.

With that, I will bug ZH-ers less to buy, buy, buy...  It would be hypocritical if I am not.  Still, it will be HARD not to ever pick up another oz or two or three...

If gold does go to $55,000, at least I was able to front-run the crowd.

Best of luck everyone, none of our problems (IMO) have been solved.  Diversity and agility will help get us through, although Divine Intervention may No. 1.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:15 | 900762 DaBernank
DaBernank's picture

I was like you, and then I decided to include the value of my house and all of a sudden metals were back to only 5% of my assets, so I kept buying.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 22:10 | 901212 technovelist
technovelist's picture

I'm at 75%, which is about right. Although if I had been at 100% instead, I would have a lot more money right now.

Tue, 01/25/2011 - 09:48 | 902212 JW n FL
JW n FL's picture
by DoChenRollingBearing
on Mon, 01/24/2011 - 19:08
#900738

 

"I am almost done with my decades long precious metals buying program.  I am at 9%"

****************************************************************************

PM's are your total basket of highrisk? you say 9% to me, I think high risk... sorry.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:11 | 900746 JLee2027
JLee2027's picture

APMEX:

 

http://www.apmex.com/Category/518/Silver_Bars_Secondary_Market__New.aspx

 

13 silver items sold out, 18 still in stock.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:55 | 900891 Captain Benny
Captain Benny's picture

Dig deeper my son.  The only 100oz bar they have for immediate delivery is the Johnson Matthey.  They sold more than 37 today.  The Royal Canadian Mint bar just recently went on backorder.  They sold at least 25 of them in the last day even with the month delivery delay.  The 100oz APMEX bar went backorder a little over a week or two ago, but they're selling like hot potatoes for Feb delivery none-the-less.  This screams to me that even APMEX is having a hard time getting enough silver in 100oz bars right now.

I've been buying bars every few weeks from them and have no intention to stop for the duration of the year.... I don't give a rats ass what the paper market says.  I'm buying and holding till the shit hits the fan at JP Morgue and Co.

It takes an idiot to not see the physical silver shortage in the marketplace right now.  Silver demand is about to go through the roof with these price drops....

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:59 | 900925 Hannibal
Hannibal's picture

Hat tip Captain, I am with you on this one.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:23 | 901046 Mark Beck
Mark Beck's picture

Captain,

My PM purchase outlook for the year was formulated, although I had some questions that could not be answered beyond a set accumulation rate. I quess I do not give a rats ass to what "silver paper" says either. But, I was interested to see pricing impact due to the expected Fiscal/FED political/market events.

For example in the foreground there was the debt ceiling debate and its impact, end of QE2 and QE lite. We could see large movements depending upon congressional/FED posturing.

In the background there is the EURO zone and associated default risk and bailout blunders.

In the middle ground is buyer temperment and market participation in bullion relative to paper, and the associated ETF risks (pressures).

When QE3 is announced (the last straw in my FED time horizon), I will then complete divestiture out of USD assets by end of JAN 2012. So I too am on a slow march towards complete exit out of USD/Equity holdings. Now this could change if congress becomes fiscally aware and kills the FED. But, somehow I don't really see this happening.

Mark Beck

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 23:38 | 901482 Ima anal sphincter
Ima anal sphincter's picture

I don't give a rats ass what the paper market says.  I'm buying and holding till the shit hits the fan at JP Morgue and Co.

Same reasoning here. Unlike many posters on ZH, 100+ oz's purchases would be a wet dream for me. All I can do is 1 or 2 Eagles a week. The nearest dealer was $34 today. Add some tax and I'm way over spot. I don't care. I'll be back next week to buy some more.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:01 | 900936 kadriana288
kadriana288's picture

15 still in stock. 3 are pre-orders for the middle of Febuary. They had around 45+ items a week ago. They still have plenty in stock but the selection is getting slim.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:09 | 900983 JLee2027
JLee2027's picture

I stand corrected, thanks guys and Captain.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:21 | 900785 dryam
dryam's picture

Look, Doug Kass said the price of PM's will go down.  The maestro has spoken.  His track record speaks for itself.  There is no shortage of silver/gold no matter what the physical markets say. 

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:29 | 900812 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

LOL, total sarc? You cant be serious on Kass who has been dead wrong about everything for 2 years, in particular his metal calls!

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:23 | 901042 oddjob
oddjob's picture

They stuck the liposuction needle in his brain cavity by mistake.

Tue, 01/25/2011 - 01:47 | 901739 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

Easily done by even the best-trained medical experts, when treating for cranial-rectal inversion! :>D

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:31 | 900827 Flatchestynerdette
Flatchestynerdette's picture

No shortage if you count the moon and a flyby asteroid with these metals in them - then yeah, his track record is spot on. Too bad we have to get out there into space to get the stuff - oh wait, the Chinese are setting up to go to the moon for Helium 3 and gold.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:35 | 900836 ffart
ffart's picture

there's definitely a bigger shortage of gold and silver than there's a shortage of number in computer memory

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:55 | 900896 DosZap
DosZap's picture

Tell that to China, and the PacRims, India, Russia,Vietnam, Malaysia, etc,etc.

Russia announced today they will be adding 100 Tons to their holding per yr, for the next 10yrs.(from local Russian Banks).

As for a shortage, the smelters, and casters, Mfgrs, have had a chance to catch up. Their IS a physical shortage, the ETF's are fooked, if the short squeeze manifests itself, (they cannot make deliveries).

Globally, Silver purchases are apeshit.(not paper).

Yeah, they will go down, but unless a Divine Intervention, (as Do said), the old adage, kicking the can down the road is exactly whats being done.

Where would we have been A WHILE back, if we were not the Reserve Currency?,where would we be if we could not have Benny and Timothy, doing everything croooked under the sun, to keep us afloat even with the advantage WE alone have?.

JPM gets a PASS on the lawsuit, where would we be if they had not done a reach around on the Clown Prince?.

No one else got that PASS..............

We would be screwed.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:23 | 900792 Bigger Dickus
Bigger Dickus's picture

They are hedged. Got it? Hedged!

They don't care whether the price goes up or down.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:26 | 900803 TWORIVER
TWORIVER's picture

I'm sure there will plenty of bars when Silver finds support 23-25.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:30 | 900820 JLee2027
JLee2027's picture

History would say to free up metal and bring sellers into the market you raise the price....dipshit.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:46 | 900873 TWORIVER
TWORIVER's picture

Maybe you are never saw sellling from weak hands (you) to strong hands (the guy that makes you feel dumb the next day), this your first job?

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:11 | 900991 JLee2027
JLee2027's picture

The weak hands are no longer if you've been watching the open interest. I'm in the silver market, have been for most of a decade (coin dealer) and been collecting since the 1970's.

Now, who's the dumbass here?

Tue, 01/25/2011 - 01:39 | 901730 TWORIVER
TWORIVER's picture

I'm thinking it is still you. I guess we will see tomorrow, Silver will be 25 or 28.

Tue, 01/25/2011 - 02:30 | 901786 JLee2027
JLee2027's picture

No, it's you. The paper price doesn't matter, only holding physical matters.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:30 | 900819 AR15AU
AR15AU's picture

Are the ASEs required to use silver mined in the USA just like the AGEs are? Seems like the mint is selling more silver in ASEs than the total monthly US mine output.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:47 | 900875 Captain Benny
Captain Benny's picture

I have never seen anything in writing that says ASEs must be mined in America. I sincerely doubt there is any such legislation for them.... 

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:47 | 900876 tmosley
tmosley's picture

They use US silver first, then they import the rest.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:31 | 900824 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

Let them push down paper, dealers and buyers are paying no attention to 'price' and where are the sellers panic selling into the paper PM rout? Everywhere I see has shortages on physical.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:05 | 900958 DosZap
DosZap's picture

Someone tell me why the ETF's that do not HAVE to furnish Physical, are allowed to stay in business?

No other items I know of can make you buy something, and not have it for delivery if you want Physiccal deliveery.

I know the answer, its in the fine print.

I also know if these dickuses go bankrupt, you have no claim any different than a secured creditor.

So, (A), no physical, (B),bankruptcy, you own nothng tangible, and get in line with the rest of the poor schmucks.

How do you get away doing FRAC reserve Gold and Silver sales?.I thought only the Fed got that right.Oh, wait JPM does OWN SLV.....shit now its clear as mud, at a 100-1.

Why hasn't a Suit been brought against these clowns?.

You take out the ETF's that cannot furnish physical, the prices are OFF this planet...guaranteed.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 22:17 | 901211 knukles
knukles's picture

Uh, sorry but you're in absolutely dead last place along with unsecured creditors if TSHTF.  You be the equity layer and in the GLD and SLV deals... oh just read a prospecti ot two.  If it goes bye bye, you're deader than John Cleese's parrot.

Tue, 01/25/2011 - 01:51 | 901743 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

The words "Caveat Emptor" mean anything to you?  Paper "promises" aren't worth much more than verbal ones!

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:31 | 900825 Whalers
Whalers's picture

A Gold ad on one side of the page of this story and a silver ad on the other side.  Unbiased reporting? 

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:36 | 900837 Tyler Durden
Tyler Durden's picture

For your edification:

Contextual advertising

A contextual advertising system scans the text of a website for keywords and returns advertisements to the webpage based on what the user is viewing.[1] The advertisements may be displayed on the webpage or as pop-up ads.
For example, if the user is viewing a website pertaining to sports and
that website uses contextual advertising, the user may see
advertisements for sports-related companies, such as memorabilia dealers
or ticket sellers. Contextual advertising is also used by search engines to display advertisements on their search results pages based on the keywords in the user's query.

Maybe if you were to go to a post that discusses the future of fiat paper, you would find the ads selling you dollars a little more to your liking?

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:42 | 900857 ForWhomTheTollBuilds
ForWhomTheTollBuilds's picture

People on the interwebs are so clever. 

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:45 | 900869 dark pools of soros
dark pools of soros's picture

oh god... then what does it mean for a story when Cramer is advertised on one side!!!

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:53 | 900893 Tyler Durden
Tyler Durden's picture

AdSense tracks your browser cache and shows ads that you are likely to "enjoy." The google is truly amazing when helping you jump.... to conclusions

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:14 | 901004 JLee2027
JLee2027's picture

If I may...I would say the Tyler is truly amazing as well. Prodigious output.

Ok, end of man crush.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:43 | 901116 Drag Racer
Drag Racer's picture

Without stepping on your toes Tyler, I would like to clarify this a bit. Google, or any other site, can not see your browsers cache. They store one or more cookies on the visitor's computer and will track you from that cookie and your IP address everywhere you go on the Internet that Google can see. They can see you from ads they deliver, Analytics(site metrics tracking), Blogger feeds, widgets, plugins, Google Toolbar, etc. All this data is stored in Google's database and not in your browsers cache for them to track you. Their reach, as far as the number of pages on the net they can track you from, has grown quite large.

 

Try it. Go to a couple sites about gold trading, such as Kitco, and then visit a totally unrelated site showing Google ads and you will see an ad about gold.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:45 | 901124 ShankyS
ShankyS's picture

I like the adds that pop up when you discuss the SEC and porn. Can you please do a daily post on that subject? That is not to hard an ask, LOL.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 23:30 | 901479 HyperLazy
HyperLazy's picture

Sorry, I block ads, scripts, trackers and stat counters. Pages load so much phasta.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 22:14 | 901225 knukles
knukles's picture

Means you been visitin' the same tranny porn sites as the SEC enforcement staff, been looking up way too many anti-depressant and substance abuse sites, ordering too many false third nipples (remember Cramer's painting) and requesting far too frequent updates from the government time clock page.
Deep kimchee, lad. 

Tue, 01/25/2011 - 01:55 | 901746 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

And thus did Knukles render an epiphany unto Dark Pools of Soros! :>D

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:46 | 900872 EscapeKey
EscapeKey's picture

For the sake of paper bugs, try to avoid the use of multi-syllable words in the future.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:58 | 900900 Don Birnam
Don Birnam's picture

+1

<< Maybe if you were to go to a post that discusses the future of fiat paper, you would find the ads selling you dollars a little more to your liking? >>

Crane & Co. advertises on ZH ?

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:58 | 900913 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

Tyler, that disturbs me a bit as this morning I saw the 'Plenty'o'Fish' online dating ad...that means at 6 AM zerohedgers are looking for a side order of chicken of the sea?

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:44 | 901122 breezer1
breezer1's picture

CRTC will get you ads for manlove and shemales.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 22:11 | 901216 Dr. Porkchop
Dr. Porkchop's picture

Yeah, it's totally creepy sometimes, the same ads follow you around from site to site. You don't know how sick of this stupid Groupon ad I was a while ago! Then I installed No Script.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:21 | 901035 yellowbr
yellowbr's picture

lol you are pretty new to the internet, aren't you?

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 22:16 | 901231 knukles
knukles's picture

++

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:35 | 900835 Manny
Manny's picture

I am all for PMs.

But gotta wonder how much of this shortage is demand based and because most metal is priced based on spot how much is based on the fact that with prices now down dealers might be holding back on stock they bought at a higher price just a few weeks ago.

Thoughts ?

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:03 | 900943 Al Gorerhythm
Al Gorerhythm's picture

You have to be nuts to buy silver and gold at any price. There is an infinite supply of them and a never-ending growth in the economy and house prices. Who needs gold when the economy is back showing vigorous green shoots and unemployment will be the lowest in years. The dollar will rebound this year making gold defunct and new currencies will be deployed full to the brim with value. All currencies that are showing signs of a loss of value will simply be shredded and the new ones will fill their place, renewing confidence in paper money. 

Greece and Ireland will be the leaders of nations in economic renewal, their banking problems erased and order restored in inter-bank security. Lending will be restored to borrowers at competitive rates but not before central banks around the world issue cash to all borrowers to pay off their existing debts.

Problems in the financial world will be resolved by Barry's say so, ordering the Rothschilds and the fed to surrender their gold into the vaults of the US Treasury. Barry will also demand that the Fed will write off all government debt as an act of National Security.

All's good.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:13 | 901000 DosZap
DosZap's picture

Al,

Hows that 12 Step workin for ya?

Tue, 01/25/2011 - 08:35 | 902042 Al Gorerhythm
Al Gorerhythm's picture

They said I am completely rational now and good to go with my new condo construction company based in Detroit. I'm looking for partners with venture capital. Returns expected to be about 20% per year. Franchises available.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:47 | 901135 breezer1
breezer1's picture

i have some farm land in yuma you might be interested in.

Tue, 01/25/2011 - 01:57 | 901748 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

Looks like Doszap and Breezer have broken sarcasm detectors! :>D

Tue, 01/25/2011 - 05:45 | 901910 gravitas
gravitas's picture

With the overwhelming obviousness of Al's post, I'd say they've never learned to read them in the first place (though perhaps we're not registering their sarcasm either... oh my head hurts).

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:42 | 900856 Bigger Dickus
Bigger Dickus's picture

Tyler, stop pumping silver. It is plentiful everywhere I look.

Say it with me: "silver has it an intermediate top. It will be a major resistance for the next two years. TRIPLE TOP for crying out loud."

 

Lemmings who are long paper silver will be crushed and some will blame it on you while you short the paper.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:51 | 900881 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Apparently, most Americans think only of America.  The shortages are in Europe and the UK, not America.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:30 | 901061 DosZap
DosZap's picture

TM,

Bing-Go!!,if you see this read my post.............the rest of the globe is sucking Silver up as fast as they can get it.

Also, China did not stop exporting it because they had a shortage totally, they saw no reason to Export it,when it sells for a LOT more over there.

 

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:37 | 901096 Bigger Dickus
Bigger Dickus's picture

Not true. Do your homework.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:55 | 901163 JonNadler
JonNadler's picture

what homework is that?

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:59 | 900924 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

Not plentiful everywhere I look...at a coin show this weekend there was maybe $10,000 worth in the whole place. And most of it was collector coins, very thin on and rounds or bars.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:41 | 901110 Hephasteus
Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:49 | 901143 breezer1
breezer1's picture

i like koolaid too.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:44 | 900864 asdasmos
Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:48 | 900877 6 String
6 String's picture

The silver market is really the epitome of all that is wrong with every exchange: rigged and fucked.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:55 | 901165 e_goldstein
e_goldstein's picture

shortages are the joy in the kommand ekonomy in the nation formally known as amerika.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:54 | 900898 saulysw
saulysw's picture

I bought some silver yesterday, so clearly the top is in. It immediately lost over $1.

You know what, and it's strange, but I don't care.

Tue, 01/25/2011 - 05:53 | 901920 gravitas
gravitas's picture

saulysw said: "strange, but I don't care"

 

... a symptom of many who possess physical... Call it 'weighted apathy'.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:55 | 900902 Hannibal
Hannibal's picture

The divergence of paper PM spot price and physical delivered PM will occur,

not if, but when.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:47 | 901137 walküre
walküre's picture

4 to 6 weeks max.

Tue, 01/25/2011 - 03:20 | 901814 RmcAZ
RmcAZ's picture

Based on?

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:58 | 900915 commoninvestor
commoninvestor's picture

I suspect that the physical silver shortages are caused by industrial buyers for use in electronics components. That explains why they aren't bothered by declining price (something which average Joe investor afraid of).

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:33 | 901079 DosZap
DosZap's picture

If your afraid its going down, you should not OWN it.

Same for Gold.

Trade paper if your speculating.Thats why its screwed with.

Tue, 01/25/2011 - 06:09 | 901925 gravitas
gravitas's picture

DosZap said: "If your afraid its going down, you should not OWN it"

 

on point.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 20:59 | 900927 XRAYD
XRAYD's picture

 

The bipartisan panel appointed by Congress to investigate the financial crisis has concluded that several financial industry figures appear to have broken the law and has referred multiple cases to state or federal authorities for potential prosecution, according to two sources directly involved in the deliberations.

The sources, who spoke on condition they not be named, declined to identify the people implicated or the names of their institutions. But they characterized the panel's decision to make referrals to prosecutors as a significant escalation in the government's response to the financial crisis. The panel plans to release its final report in Washington on Thursday morning.

 

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/01/24/financial-crisis-commissi_2_n_813415.html

 

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:01 | 900934 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

Unless top dawgs in the FED, Treasury, and a lot of senators are named, Im not impressed.

Do NOT follow this link or you will be banned from the site!