Second Silver Margin Hike In One Week... Is Now Priced In

Tyler Durden's picture

As vaguely rumored earlier, and largely anticipated, the CME instituted another margin hike, presumably for a broad swath of commodities but apparently focusing on one particularly: silver, this time 10%. This is on top of the 9% margin hike from Monday. If anyone was wondering the reason for silver's swoon earlier (and subsequent jump) was, now it's clear. By now it is becoming rather clear that all the CME does is provide ever better reasons to BTFD. As always, we continue to hold our breath until there is a comparable maring hike for the ES. We may soon run out of oxygen.

cme 4.28

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mynhair's picture

Margin this, assholes!  (upraised middle finger)

Half life is down to what,  2 hours?

Turd Ferguson's picture

If that. They might as well go to 100% now and get it over with.

mynhair's picture

No shit.  This is beyond ridiculous, Turd.

nope-1004's picture

Dip or no dip, I keep buying.  I don't really care anymore about these day-to-day gyrations.  The news coming out of this criminal syndicate and Benocide answering questions in tongues gives me ZERO confidence in this circus act.  As I acquire more fiat savings, I transfer it to silver.  Done and done.

C y'all on the other side.



mynhair's picture

As no pawn shops are open this time of nite, I hope you mean you keep buying miners.

apartofthings's picture

Agreed, price is no object, I buy when I go to the dealer, if price is up, fine. I pay that price.

And yes physical only -- stocks only if you want to speculate, by which I mean gamble, and there's nothing wrong with that if you're prepared to lose all your money.

Problem Is's picture

The Joy of Physical Silver -- <TING><TING>

Ratscam's picture

There is a financial product called JBSICA in Switzerland which is backed by 30kg bars of silver. The fund has a size of 600 Mio. USD. Out of curiousity I yesterday demanded physical delivery just to find out that I was the first person doing so.

Their gold fund roughly 1.8 bn USD only saw 8 redemptions of 12.5kg gold bars.

This seriously worries me!


Urban Redneck's picture

Why would anyone pay the higher redemption fees to Julius Baer on 1000 oz bars now?  It is  cheaper to pull 1000 oz silver bars from the Comex, while they still have them.  You go to Baer to collect physical or fiat profits once the Comex busts and the value of physical Ag soars.  I hold both the Ag-CHF and Au-USD funds, and I sleep fine at night. 

Ratscam's picture

When the Comex goes bust how easy do you think it is to get to any physical silver!

Careful, if you hold JB CHF AU they represent 12.5kg gold bars! No physical delivery unless your shares match roughly CHF 540K!

MGMT fee is 0.5% p.a. A bank vault costs you 100 chifs p.a. instead of the 2'700 MGMT fee

Silver I agree is a crazy idea, physical gold however I keep at various vaults, this is still the cheapest and safest method.


Urban Redneck's picture

The Baer prospectus is pretty straight forward, and I asked several friends at Baer if I was missing anything in my reading of it.  If Comex goes bust my holdings won't match exactly but as the fund has the physical- the paper should retain most of its value and there would probably be secondary market in small lot aggregation for the remainders.  The JB management fee is larger than I pay for rental of my bank boxes and safe insurance riders, but it's significantly less than what I would pay for Sprott or CFC paper, and it's simpler and cheaper than trading physical from my core PM position.  Plus, if the TSHF and I'm in Brazil or the US instead of Switzerland, it is a lot easier to get hold of a bank wire than a safe deposit box in Zurich.  

Ratscam's picture

Update! Because JBSICA is USD/CHF hedged I pay no redemption fees and VAT (which I can deduct ;). I should be getting 1024 ounces on Tuesday. So far it looks that it will take 4 days! (during normal times) to get a hand on my silver.

Canucklehead's picture

Did you ever hear of the phrase "Banking Holiday"?  Do you know what FDR did when he took office? 

I hope you have the customer relations number for your Ag-CHF and Au-USD funds.  It would be important to be on a first name basis with those people as your plan calls for split second execution of your sell order moments before 4 or 5 other guys phone them with the same request.

If the Comex is about to go bust you should expect a banking holiday.  Why would the powers that be spend all your hard earned tax money in propping up the market, only to have it go down the toilet "when" the Comex goes bust.

Think of Julius Baer redemption fees as an insurance premium.

longorshort's picture

Interesting, what is the minimum delivery size and costs with them.  Is their rules as screwed up as COMEX on sellback rules?

Ratscam's picture

delivery size of JBSICA is +/- 1000 ounces, due to ounce differences of the silver bars.

In gold and platinum standard bars are 12.5kg.

In Switzerland you pay 8% VAT on white metals, gold none.

Hugh G Rection's picture

It's not gambling when you piggyback Turd's option plays ;-)

Montgomery Burns's picture

I guess you've never been to Las Vegas.

Texas Gunslinger's picture

Can someone explain to me what a margin hike is, and why this is relevant to the silver eagles I bought last month? Can I assume that margin means "profit margin" and those people who sell silver are now allowed to make more money?



narapoiddyslexia's picture

You're the troll tmosley branded, aren't you? Go fuck yourself.

topcallingtroll's picture

Give him a break. He is buying silver.
He is on your side. Treat your allies with more respect.

tmosley's picture

No, he isn't.  He's a caricature.  He has branded himself as the sole arbiter of God on Earth, and has denounced anyone who disagrees with his religobabble as a homosexual liberal blah blah blah.

And this was while talking to Col. Cooper.

Texas Gunslinger's picture

Who the hell are YOU?  WTF is "marapoiddyslexia"? If you've got it, perhaps you should put some creame on it. 

Why is everyone so damn rude and arrogant around here?

I don't know as much about economics, commodity trading or Wall Street as you guys, and I openly admit that.  I was referred to this site by my coin dealer, who told me this was the best information source on the internet - so I joined. I'm just here to learn, and you guys continually sling insults at me.

There was absolutely nothing in my post that was inflamatory, anti-silver or troll-like.  

Sorry if my questions aren't as brilliant as all you guys. Sorry I didn't get a chance to go to Harvard like everyone here. 

Tough crowd around here.  Maybe I should just act like I know everything. 


Hephasteus's picture

Go fucking run through a sandblaster and jump in a vat of lemons and then roll around in salt and pepper spray.

Texas Gunslinger's picture

What the hell is Hephasteus? Why do you guys pick such large words for your avatar?  Maybe I should get a dictionary, find the largest, most bizzare word I can and hide behind it so everyone thinks I'm smart. Will you guys accept me then?

What is wrong with you people, and why are you so rude?


Big Corked Boots's picture

You serve as a prime example of why New Yorkers dislike Texans.

Texas Gunslinger's picture

Well, I can tell you that my friends in Texas have absolutely no problem with New Yorkers. Great city, great people.  

It's a shame that you are so full of hatred to say something so rude about your fellow countrymen. You hate me because I live in a different state than you?  Pathetic. 


jm's picture

Just ignore it and do your best to hang in.  ZH needs decent people.  It's to your credit that you ask for help.

Everybody is wrong at times in their lives, so just ignore the crap.



Burnbright's picture

Well Tex, I don't know what you said to get everyone so hot and tempered but a margin hike by the CME increases the cost of purchasing a silver contract for 5000 ounces of silver. See silver contracts are bought on margin, so they pay a much smaller fraction than the actual cost of 5000 ounces of silver, and the margin hike has to be covered if you own a contract. If you can't cover it I imagine you have to sell before it takes effect. I think currently its roughly a little over 12k to buy a 5000 ounce contract, this doesn't mean you can have it delivered for that price, just that you can trade the contract for that price, if you want delivery you have to have the rest of the cash in an account you purchased the contract with at options experation which is why you can usually see a right before as the shorts try to drive out the weak hands from collecting delivery.

cowdiddly's picture

Just ignore the assholes and never compromise your principles my friend.

Dangertime's picture

That's the creed of the libtards TG......They do nothing but project.

The claim your guilt of a crime right before they commit the same heinous act.

akak's picture

The troll giveth (dissention, dishonesty, division and diversion), and the troll taketh away (peaceful and honest, rational discourse).

Canucklehead's picture

Tex, this website is everything in tmosley's life.  It's important to him (and others like him) to be seen as the "big dogs" even though they really don't know anything other than slogans.  If you want to see what I mean, pull up a few articles and search for tmosley (in your browser).  Within a few minutes you will get the flavor of the man.

The short answer is you ignore tmosley and his ilk.  It's a free world out there and unfortunately personal circumstances cause many people to be rude.

Keep asking your questions and use google at times to find answers.  The truly knowledgeable people here will answer you eventually.

DraginDickHedge's picture

You are a total shit for brains no good idiot.  Gee, now I sound like you, but my IQ is twice yours as your's can't be above 70...Get a life and stop these vile posts!  You typify the national view of NY City, for sure.  Rude, self absorbed hate-mongers. 

strannick's picture






And why everyone despises NYers.

terryg999's picture

Futures Commodities ( Gold, Silver, corn, wheat....  ) are bought on margin.  The set margin is the amount of money you have to have in your trading account to buy one contract of that commodity.

The margin for silver was raised $14513 per contract.  A contract of silver is 5000 ounces.

So, if you $14513 in your trading account you can buy one contract of silver ( buy in the hopes that the price of silver will rise - you can also sell if you feel the price of silver will fall ).  If the price of silver goes up $1 and you decide to sell to take profits you make $5000 and you now have $19513 in your trading account - less commissions.

Simplified, but basically it.


/fuck all these other assholes!



tarsubil's picture

Do I have this right? You need $14513 to buy a roughly $250,000 contract of 5000 oz of siver? That's roughly 6% and you are leveraged 1 to 16 roughly?

Hulk's picture

"What is wrong with you people, and why are you so rude?:

We were un-loved in our youth...

A Nanny Moose's picture

I call it post traumatic verbal stress disorder. It sets in after continually engaging trolls/astro turf-bots for so long in the anonymity of the cybersphere "battlefield" that one becomes numb to the feelings of others, and is only capable of a digital 1000 yard stare.

ncdirtdigger's picture

Investopedia is a decent source for learning about margins and commodity trading accounts.

DavidPierre's picture


jezuus h christ loves you!

EscapeKey's picture

Nah, just keep the religious argument to yourself, and stick to financials while you're here. Go elsewhere for your religious debates.

Texas Gunslinger's picture

Good advice!

I will never instigate a religious conversation ever again around here. Now I understand that it's one of the rules, and I simply didn't know it because I'm new. I absolutely regret that whole discussion, and if I could take it back I would. On the other hand, though, I will not allow someone to slander Jesus Christ.  I just can't let that go. 

Don't swear at Jesus, and I promise never to bring it up again.

So...that topic is done.

Let's move forward... 


akak's picture

TG, I don't want to expand on anything extraneous here, but in the other thread today I at first took you for just a purposely antagonistic troll, then as somebody just feeding us a line for laughs --- but if neither are truly the case, then I want to apologize for my harshness towards you.

WonderDawg's picture

That's called "contempt prior to investigation". You seem to make a habit of it, akak.


akak's picture

Speaking of actual antagonizing trolls ....

WonderDawg's picture

Thanks for making my point.

I'm not sure exactly what constitutes a "troll", but if it means popping off about shit you don't know about, I'd say that makes you one.

By the way, care to discuss the nature of the monetary system again? You do any reading up on it yet, or you still confused?


akak's picture

Buzz off, you clueless idiotic troll.

Go pick fights with others vastly more knowledgeable than yourself elsewhere. Intellectual gnats like you are not worth the time or effort.


PS: Thanks for taking a big steaming dump on a sincere and honest gesture of reconciliation on my part towards TexasGunslinger over an earlier misunderstanding ---in which you were, curiously, in no way involved.  I am sure that your action in that regard does not go unnoticed by others here as well.