SocGen Tries To Make Sense Of The Complete Chaos That Is Europe Ahead Of The Greek Vote Of Confidence, Fails

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Mon, 06/20/2011 - 19:24 | 1386829 chump666
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It's going to be historic, with the PIIGS in succession wanting to all default, there is the contagion.

ANd the US markets have completely lost the plot = major bulltrap

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 20:51 | 1387195 narapoiddyslexia
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Sudden Debt, where are you? This is your bailiwick, dude.

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 21:23 | 1387314 Broomer
Broomer's picture

Sudden Debt is from Belgium, right? Probably he had a heart stroke after reading this.

Or he is too busy selling everything he has and using the proceedings to buy PMs.

Tue, 06/21/2011 - 01:14 | 1387970 topcallingtroll
topcallingtroll's picture

Sudden debt is from belgium but i always see him posting in late mornings in america like he is keeping an american schedule.

That boy sometimes sounds more american than my new york friends.

Tue, 06/21/2011 - 06:33 | 1388267 Yen Cross
Yen Cross's picture

 Got ya game on? Time to trade!    Yen

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 19:28 | 1386832 OrdellRobbie
OrdellRobbie's picture

And EUR goes to 1.55

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 19:33 | 1386857 CompassionateFascist
CompassionateFascist's picture

Euro/dollar are port and starboard of the same ship foundering in an ocean of debt. It lists one way, it lists the other, as the increasingly frantic passengers rush from one side to the other. Which side will take water & go under first no one knows, nor does it matter for the ultimate outcome: the ship sinks.

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 19:39 | 1386885 magpie
magpie's picture

or the trilateral lean-to of the three drunkards Yen, Dollar and Euro.

Tue, 06/21/2011 - 06:30 | 1388268 Yen Cross
Yen Cross's picture

 You to ya Barkie little bird! Money doesn't sleep!

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 19:43 | 1386891 SumSUN
SumSUN's picture

+ 1 oz. Ag.

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 19:41 | 1386900 zen0
zen0's picture

The solution is to make both sides as close to even as possible. Dollar Euro parity, coming to  a forex cafe near you.

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 20:48 | 1387175 Long-John-Silver
Long-John-Silver's picture

The deck chair arrangement must be perfect in order to have the proper effect on the passengers. When does the band appear playing Nearer my God to thee?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pj-1b1Yvep8

 

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 21:02 | 1387243 MisterMousePotato
MisterMousePotato's picture

That is to metaphor what haiku is to poetry. Well done.

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 21:47 | 1387387 AbbeBrel
AbbeBrel's picture

+1 venti mille lire!

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 19:25 | 1386837 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

LOL...i read it, anyway...

Tue, 06/21/2011 - 06:35 | 1388270 Yen Cross
Yen Cross's picture

  Wake up!   (yen~

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 19:34 | 1386849 skepticCarl
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It's the old cliche:  When you owe the bank a little bit, it's your problem.  When you owe the bank a lot, it's the Bank's problem.  Greece owes just about everybody a lot, and Greece will set the terms.  If the Banks (ECB et al) don't like it, Greece will tell them to stand in line to receive their new Drachma's along with the rest of its creditors.

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 19:48 | 1386916 I am a Man I am...
I am a Man I am Forty's picture

yeh, it's pretty funny really, you got all the politicians and bankers posturing and saying a bunch of nothing....painfully, slowly realizing the can to kick down the road has left town, and then you got Greece over there, the turnip, saying fuck off.

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 19:35 | 1386866 zippy_uk
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The only bloke to get anything organised in Europe was from Austria - and it ended badly.

Other than that, all other European politician lead solutions end in abject failure, so Greece is toast, the EURO is toast and Europe is toast.

Enjoy the farce while it lasts.

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 19:43 | 1386887 Franken_Stein
Franken_Stein's picture

 

That's a gross overstatement.

Just because a monetary system fails, doesn't mean that everything is lost.

Or that this is the end of the world.

 

No one got killed.

No infrastructure destroyed.

 

It's just some numbers on some bank accounts, and some pricing signs.

 

This is not the first time we saw a currency reform in world history,

and certainly not the last.

 

So what.

 

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 19:55 | 1386944 zippy_uk
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I doubt many Argentinians thought that when their currency collapsed in 2001, protesting out of hunger...

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 20:40 | 1387155 topcallingtroll
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That's not true

There was an earlier guy from Corsica.  He organized perhaps a bigger portion of europe than that jewboy from Austria

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 20:57 | 1387200 narapoiddyslexia
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And before that there was Charlemagne. And Julius Julius Caesar did a bang up job. And there were all those popes. Never worked.

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 20:56 | 1387218 narapoiddyslexia
narapoiddyslexia's picture

The latency is terrible. Is it my ISP, or is someone messing with ZH?

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 20:59 | 1387203 narapoiddyslexia
narapoiddyslexia's picture

duplex

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 20:59 | 1387204 narapoiddyslexia
narapoiddyslexia's picture

duplex

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 20:59 | 1387205 narapoiddyslexia
narapoiddyslexia's picture

duplex

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 19:41 | 1386897 ike
ike's picture

>>If anyone has a clear idea what is going in Europe, you are smarter than us<<

 

I am not smarter than you but Bismarck is. A 150 yr ago he said:

It is easy to build a tower in air, but very difficult to tear it appart.

That is exactly what is going on in Europe


Mon, 06/20/2011 - 19:49 | 1386919 Stuck on Zero
Stuck on Zero's picture

The end will come not because the people revolt against the Illuminati but because the Illuminati starts to come unglued.

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 20:26 | 1387080 eureka
eureka's picture

Only if the people are sheeple incapable of motivating and organizing themselves; i.e. only if democracy doesn't work because people are too stupid to participate in it - well, let's see, where do people participate n democracy? 

US presidential election voter participation: Ca. 40%.

EU national parliamentary elections voter participation: ca. 90%.

So where, in this world, are the passive, disengaged, led and corralled sheeple concentrated?

 

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 22:13 | 1387478 riley martini
riley martini's picture

 Like the Greeks that are out in the street some of us are past the voting scams. When the Fascist have taken over and you lose every election you stop wasting the trip to the poll .

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 22:30 | 1387535 Guy Fawkes Mulder
Guy Fawkes Mulder's picture

Max Keiser giving a speech to the crowds in Greece!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rq4aHM73CtI

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 19:48 | 1386928 scratch_and_sniff
scratch_and_sniff's picture

Its like euro quantum physics, if you think you understand it, then you really dont understand it.

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 19:58 | 1386954 ddtuttle
ddtuttle's picture

When you think about it, Europe's problems have always stemmed from some idiot trying to "unify" it.  Usually, he uses lots of force and kills a lot of people in an attempt to "organize" what is inherently chaotic.  Napoleon and Hitler are obvious examples.  But you can go back to war after war where some idiot king thought he could conquer europe and convert it into a superior country ruled by him.  And all these guys had some measure of good intentions.  That this has been tried so many times and has never worked should be a clue.

It matters not that this time it's bunch of recycled hyper-socialist bureaucrats trying the same idiotic stunt  The result will be the same for the exact same reasons.

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 20:35 | 1387116 eureka
eureka's picture

Is there anything worse than provincial HomeLand US citizens feeling smug and superior to places they do not understand, have never visited and therefore can only spout mindless cliches about?

It may make you feel great to say "stupid" three times back to back, but it isn't very informative. Instead, try to make a case for the superior character of US social cohesion and democratic participation in US political and social economic processes. Your theory, should you have one or be able to manufacture one, will be swiftly tested in the next 12 months.

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 20:41 | 1387146 dolph9
dolph9's picture

The United States is still one country, whereas "Europe" is not. 

It would be like trying to organize all of North America and the Caribbean under one currency, and then wondering why little Haiti or Cuba is resulting in all of these problems.

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 21:05 | 1387240 Lednbrass
Lednbrass's picture

I would say the US is actually multiple nations held together by a common language, currency and force. There is little common feeling and in general the regions want vastly different things out of life and government. We arent a people- its more of a very dysfunctional family made up of Billy Yank, Johnny Reb, the Marlboro Man and Suzy Moonbeam.

If and when the currency and/or economy unravels the political structure will also.  I dont see the south sticking around for long, it is to the US what the Ukraine was to the USSR.

Tue, 06/21/2011 - 03:05 | 1388135 bakken
bakken's picture

What was the UKRAINE to the USSR???  A metaphor?  Seriously, if the South wants to go, I wouldn't fight and I don't know many guys up here (ND) who would either, and I hope they take Florida and Texas with them, fine with me.(Run on sentence, sorry).  We'll be eating sugar beets and winter wheat but we'll have oil.

California?  SELL IT TO THE CHINESE!

Tue, 06/21/2011 - 09:44 | 1388707 falak pema
falak pema's picture

Resolution to the PIGS problem is very simple : example Greece.

Today, Monday,  at midnight Greece officially leaves the the Euro and creates the NEW Drachma. It is devalued 40% to the EURO relative the OLD Drachma rate. On this basis the banks issue a unilateral voluntary "hair cut" signed at 10 am Tuesday morning, with a 50% write down of Greek debt. ie : The banks take a knock of around 175 Billions Euros with a new payment extended schedule offered.

On Tuesday, mid-day Greece officially re-joins the EUro group again. Its assets and liabilities are now revalued in the New Drachma rate. Greece now has less debt and is a darn side competitve.

Rinse and repeat for Portugal and Ireland. Problem solved and German and French banks are much leaner but the sovereign debt is over. 

ECB issues bonds from then on based on a common fiscal policy of all EU members. No more national bond issues. Voilà my recipe made from Greek honey and rich olives. 

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 22:09 | 1387460 riley martini
riley martini's picture

 Exactly right eureka Napoleon was the greatest champion for what we in the USA consider Freedom and Liberty in the history of the planet . Napoleon was the success of the Citizen as a share holder in their Government , while the Brits bowed to their king. Napoleon was determined to spread Liberty around the World even if he had to kill some of the ones they were trying to free.

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 22:36 | 1387557 Hacksaw
Hacksaw's picture

Is there anything worse than provincial HomeLand US citizens feeling smug and superior to places they do not understand, have never visited and therefore can only spout mindless cliches about?

To answer your question, yes, the European little penis syndrom is worse.

Tue, 06/21/2011 - 00:30 | 1387874 eureka
eureka's picture

You have it wrong; it is the guy with all the guns who has the small penis - that's why he needs all the guns. Psyc 101. Happy studying.

Tue, 06/21/2011 - 06:09 | 1388252 Rynak
Rynak's picture

This may be true NOW. But 10 years ago, europe was an immature bootlicker of the USA, with an inferiority-complex. Heck, the whole EU and EMU thingy was promoted with the message of europe no longer consisting of small nations, but instead being a bid bad block, like the USA, russia, etc. Now, they may have enough confidence (and resentment towards the USA), to no longer feel inferior for such stupid reasons, but back then they did.

Tue, 06/21/2011 - 06:08 | 1388250 Rynak
Rynak's picture

Fully agree. Europe consists simply of too different cultures and economies. And why should this be a problem that needs to be "fixed"? There is no need to make all europe same. All that may be useful and desireable, is to have an efficient way for those nations to discuss and cooperate on mutual interests, and with mutual consent. Perhaps also the ability to launch projects in which multiple nations (not necessarily all of them) participate. But not as a "top-down hierachy", but instead those nations cooperating with mutual consent.

We don't need europe without borders.... we just need an efficient way to cooperate and coordinate with mutual consent.

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 21:04 | 1387233 vamoose1
vamoose1's picture

i bow    im  not  worthy

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 20:00 | 1386968 richard in norway
richard in norway's picture

i still can't understand why greece must leave the euro if they default

 

will Illinois leave the dollar zone when they default

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 19:58 | 1386977 magpie
magpie's picture

or leave the eurozone without defaulting

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 20:10 | 1387035 BlackSea
BlackSea's picture

No, but maybe they can join the Euro

Mon, 06/20/2011 - 20:27 | 1387084 Spastica Rex
Spastica Rex's picture

I hear the gyros in Greece are great.

Tue, 06/21/2011 - 04:14 | 1388201 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

i still can't understand why greece must leave the euro if they default

 

will Illinois leave the dollar zone when they default

 

Quite simple actually. Europeans are trying US recipes, they are on the same path as the US was in the 1800s, how they built their so called melting pot.

So if you understand gangs, you understand the following with ease.

The Euro currency is sold as a protection. With outside threats put in the lime light. Yet one other threat and one very actual is the Euro threat itself.

Being part  of the Euro currency protects from the Euro itself.

If Greece defaults and stays in the Euro, they will keep being protected from the Euro threat.

Once out of the Euro, they will have to face the Euro threat and Europeans will use Greece as an example of what happens when you leave the Eurozone.

"If you let the gang down, the gang lets you down. Better stick with us if you dont want to fear us."

If you understand the gangs, you understand US citizenism.

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