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Tell Me, Which Asset Class Would YOU Rather Own?
Occasionally
I see an article written by some Guru claiming that Gold has no real investment
value. They usually use points such as the fact that Gold has no cash flow or
you can’t use Gold to buy goods or whatever.
All of this
stuff is outright moronic. Sure Gold doesn’t have cash flow… but then again
Gold also:
§ Doesn’t
engage in accounting fraud.
§ Doesn’t
miss quarterly earnings.
§ Isn’t
affected by Obama’s health care.
§ Doesn’t
lie about its real balance sheet problems.
§ Doesn’t
lose market share due to stupid management practices.
§ Doesn’t
perform stupid mergers or acquisitions.
§ Doesn’t
waste money on buybacks.
§ Doesn’t
lose profit margins to rising commodity costs.
§ Doesn’t
go out of business.
§ Doesn’t
have custodial risk (if you keep your bullion yourself).
§ Doesn’t
pay itself ridiculous salaries and bonuses rather than increasing shareholder
returns.
§ Doesn’t
require a bailout or stimulus to stay in business.
§ Doesn’t
commit insider trading or use Government policies to keep itself a billionaire.
§ Isn’t
impacted by a slow down in the economy or consumer spending.
On top of
this, when you buy Gold you:
§ Don’t
get front-run by High Frequency Trading Programs.
§ Don’t
get front-run by its in-house trading team.
§ Aren’t
buying something that can be printed/ devalued.
§ Aren’t
supporting the Big Banks.
As for the
“you can’t buy assets with Gold” argument, this is a stupid double standard.
You can’t buy food or anything else with stocks or bonds either. True, right
now you can’t buy food or services with Gold. But will it always remain that
way? Who knows? Are you NOT supposed to invest in something because you can’t
take it to the supermarket?
Bottomline:
Gold offers MANY advantages that neither stocks nor bonds can hold a candle to,
especially in today’s environment of rampant fraud and corruption.
This is not
to say I completely against owning stocks. Some companies are truly incredible
investment opportunities. But blanket statements regarding entire asset class
based on one or two random rules is simply idiotic. Especially when you’re
talking about an asset that has risen over 400% in the last ten years.
How much
have stocks or bonds rallied during that time?
Good
Investing!
Graham Summers
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Yes we'll be on QE24 before that idiot Benny Boy ever gives up but suspect Congress will cut him and the Fed before he gets there
And while I'm ranting, WHY IN THE FUCK DO YOU THINK THE CHINESE WENT FROM EXPORTING GOLD AND SILVER, TO BECOME THE LARGEST IMPORTER?! Simple truth, because all of you fucking sheeple just don't get IT!
I think you're amongst friends here, no need to get spittle on your monitor.
I've been a dealer for about 20 years and have seen the market in good and bad days/years. I also don't see any need for paranoia about Uncle Sam's goons coming after any one's holdings. The warning signs will be clear and early. Rest easy, accumulate physical, make some popcorn, grab a cold one, and watch the show.
"I also don't see any need for paranoia about Uncle Sam's goons coming after any one's holdings."
to do so would require door-to-door searches
but there's a little challenge to that strategy here in America
300 million citizens - 400 million guns
you do the math
As a coin collector/dealer, I've been buying GOLD AND SILVER for about 9 years. First on Ebay(where I've sold all kinds of precious metals, coins, coal scrip, etc). I found Apmex and have been buying gold and silver bullion for years now. I've made a bundle and don't own ANY stocks after selling out my 401k in 2005, and you guessed it, bought more gold and silver. To ALL of you naysayers, I bet I've beaten the fucking hell out of you in profits AND value! Like the article states="WHAT THE FUCK IS IN YOUR WALLET AFTER 10 YEARS"??? assholes..........
Because you have bought online, the gov't knows exactly what you own. Are you going to leave the country before they come and take it?
Buy small quanity gold/silver from local coin dealer pay w/FRN. and have a nice day.
Sales taxes (if your State levies them) are a real drag on the spot premium. Find a good out of State dealer and do business with him.
Which is why some of us go directly to their favorite local dealer, such as NW Territorial Mint, and buy silver or gold with cash. They love cash. It doesn't bounce.
They have no reason to believe that I'm NOT Mr. and Mrs. John Smith of George, Washington, since I would never lie to my metals broker. So that's the extent of the paper trail.
I window shop online, then make a day of driving to their storefront, in the short office tower next to the I-5 exit in Federal Way, WA to get the real stuff. Sometimes the price goes up during my drive, but usually it does the traditional afternoon dip.
We pay about 5% vigorish over spot and wander out with shiny, clinky silver and gold.
No postal insurance trail either, just a nice, clean get away, like in an old Western movie.
Besides, I always SELL mine within days of purchasing it. I don't want it just sitting around collecting value.
No, really!
Sales tax is a bitch, huh? So basically you're paying anywhere from 10-15% over spot by buying local.
"Sales tax is a bitch, huh?"
no tax in CA on purchases over $1000
Actually, there's no sales tax on bullion purchases in WA. NWT Mint and independent coin dealers lobbied hard to defeat that in the last round of tax grabs.
Sorry, go gloat over something else while the glow is still warm.
good luck for them with that. i live in one of "those" states. they come for the people's gold and silver here, they better come armed.
and i think it will take only one or two open safe deposit boxes or ransacking of houses to become clear it isn't worth it.
same story here....and I love APMEX. they are great.
I'm with James Turk who says gold is NOT an investment, has no investment value, but money that holds its purchasing power and you want to ride the boom bust cycle with it and at the end of the bust get out of gold and exchange it into wealth creating assets.
"ride the boom bust cycle with it and at the end of the bust get out of gold and exchange it into wealth creating assets"
yep, we'll be swapping our silver and gold for rental real estate at 10x rents after real estate crashes, govt bonds paying 15%+ interest rates once the bond market manipulation fails, stocks paying 6-8% dividends after the stock market crashes, etc
and people like the trolls on this thread will still be poor and pathetic, wondering how they missed the best bull market of their lifetimes
Like the bling and the feel in my hand. Not least the consoling effect it gives knowing that Helicopter Ben is going to print FRN till doomsday comes.
Believe me it won't be too far off into the future. Tunesia, Egypt, Algeria can be used as your crystal ball to have a peek at what's coming to America.
its closer than we think. the dollar tried to bounce over the 78 handle this afternoon and couldn't do it.
its getting scary out there.
and excuse me, but...what makes you have any confidence whatsoever in Ben's ability to manage the economy?
we have 1/6 of our population eating courtesy of food stamps now.
we have unemployment in the range of 20% (real stats, not government spun idiocy)
and Bennie Boy thinks if he keeps the stock market flying....all these hungry and unemployed folks will believe everything is REALLY OKAY and getting better....
hello? we are now in the ozone layer...
Gold also has no inherent economic value (besides a few rare uses in chip technology and its use for bling) - it's a boring, stable element that does not react much with anything. It's like sand, except that it's rarer.
So yes, if you bought gold at the top a month ago you have to worry whether the gold bubble will continue or not - as there's no real productive activity that would maintain its continued high price.
Its use as a metric of fear is valid - but then again as pure fear trades VIX options are better.
Here's a few inconvenient 'gold investment' facts:
http://seekingalpha.com/article/167512-gold-s-real-inflation-adjusted-hi...
If you bought gold at the top in the 1979-1980 gold bubble then you might have bought gold for $7150 in today's dollars.
Today you'd be 30+ years waiting and an initial investment of 1 million dollars [in today's dollars] would be worth only 188K dollars - a 75% drawdown (!).
So 'investing' in gold is not without risks and you might have to wait 30 years or more to even break even.
But if you have nerves of steel and impeccable health and a life expectation of 100 years then sure, go for it - who needs that money.
Gold = Shit
Graham = Asshole
Have a Nice Day!
Hold for 30 years? Golly gosh that's a long time.
Would you consider 300 years a long time? Or is it just that your little pea brain can't grasp the significance of next week?
The latest trade, the latest algo, the latest dip.
Clearly you are about 30-40 years old, never held anything more than a week, never understood how anyone could buy gold, silver, palladium or platinum.
Well since you were born after Nixon let me tell ya. Without gold politicians have partied like pigging bastards, bankrupted all citizens and their children, committed fraud of untold proportions and almost assuredly destroyed our financial world.
So my family has held gold for 300 years. It is the store of our wealth and when it plummets we back up the fucking bus. My brothers and I bought thousands of ounces of silver this month.a hundred ounce of gold.
Why you ask?
You see - we trade in profits from our paper trades and put them into something of value.
When you are stuck next winter with 50000 USD and can't buy a loaf of bread. You will need to take a picture of you throwing them into your fireplace for heat.
That way you'll have your fame, as the guy in Weimar US who heated his house with toilet paper just like the pciiture of the lady in Weimar Germany.
If you had seen that picture that would have stopped you from even responding.
It is a stark reminder that polticians, bankers, and the elites want to fuck us over. And yes I am an elite becuase I and my brothers have solid wealth unencumbered by lies, deceit, and larceny as my grandfather says.
We are tuaght at a young age it's value. I understand now why my forebearers were so religious about it. If you haven't been through wars and inflationary spirals you have no construct.
Get some for your family's sake. Even if you are too proud to admit you missed the trade with your ADHD attitude. Do it for your kids.
More Critical T...
You're missing the underlying transtion out of the gold standard 1972, the 17% interest rates in 79-80, and the fact that since then the markets have been pumped by debt spending, great society programs, entitltment promises that will never be paid, overvaluation of real estate, parasitization of manufacturing and skilled labor overseas while importing cheap labor and putting millions upon millions of citizens on food stamps and welfare.
Not to mention the bailouts, TARP, TALF, POMO, QE Squared, and the rescinding of the rule of law across the strata of society.
Ooops.
The site you linked to illustrates the drop in the value of gold and it was primarily due to the FANTASY value of equities; Enron, dot coms, real estate bubble, speculative leveraging, etc. The return of gold is the return of reality.
A vix ETF or stock portfolio won't buy you a can of beans, a candle, or some company when things really go south; but Ben and Timmy and the boys on Wall Street need accolytes like you.
repost deleted
***cough***
strawman
***cough***
@morecriticalwanking. The "if you'd bought gold in 1980" trope is tired and nonsensical. The same can be said of buying oil at $147 or shares of PanAm airlines you bought in 1985. Idiot, I wish I could junk you twice.
Why would it be a nonsensical question to ask?
That there were folks in the past who lost 75% (or more) of their invested money simply by going long gold seems very much relevant to me, as a reply to an article that lists the numerous virtues of investing in gold ... :-)
You know, knowing all the facts, as inconvenient as they may be.
platinum is better than gold, especially for the optimists.
http://covert2.wordpress.com
+ $1800 for optimists...
You've just rivaled HarryWanger for dumbest comments of the year award with your flawed logic.. not to mention your propensity to say the same thing over and over again.. and be wrong about it without shame..
I wish just one person in this thread went so far to actually try to prove me wrong :-)
But no, I only got insults, junks and hollow, vague claims that I'm somehow, in some universe, wrong.
Which is generally the sign of me being right, it's just that you find the truth very inconvenient.
"I wish just one person in this thread went so far to actually try to prove me wrong"
you haven't said anything yet that requires dis-proving
posing a hypothetical case of someone who bought the 1981 high in gold is just that, a hypothetical case - any number of posters responded with the point that you could make the same hypothetical case about any asset category - I posted the case of a relative holding a $110/share stock all the way down to $5/share without selling
effective investing requires research and analysis - when to buy and when to sell - if you were actually interested in learning about gold there is tons of info available about when it will make sense to sell (when real interest rates become positive, when govt bonds are paying 15%+ interest, when stocks are paying 6-8% dividends, when rental real estate can be purchased for 10x rents, etc) - people who held gold for 30 years got what they deserved for being uneducated investors
you obviously aren't interested in learning - you just want to run your mouth about something that you know essentially nothing about
done
Why would it be hypothetical? Price only moves if someone engages in a transaction: someone buys and another sells.
I also dispute the 'any asset category' claim: can you cite any such drawdown for TIPS?
Thirdly, if you read the article we are replying to (I did) you will see how it avoids any mention of risk of losing a ton of money. That is not something you risk when you invest in US treasuries.
Losing money? How excatly?
You average down you average up you average sideways
You just keep converting toilet ass wipe as you profit from the imaginary stocks profits you think you made off the little white webpage search engine that really doesn't exist.
It's all a fucking dream man, take the pill and go down the rabitt hole
wake UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
"Gold also has no inherent economic value"
The only known substance that can stabalize the monetary system has no economic value...
i know, that's why Bennie Boy hates it, and CNBC works so hard to tell everyone its a "risky" investment.
funny, its done wonder perserving my wealth.
Guys, I wish I knew what could 'stabalize' and succeed at 'perserving' your spelling. Managing to finish primary school perhaps?
MTC I enjoy reading your "gold baiting posts" but could you please not comment about other folks spelling mistakes, it's bad form....... It makes you look petty...
By way of example, Reggie makes lots of grammer mistakes in his articles but that does not diminish the content.... nor does it imply that he is ignorant of the subject matter.
Hm, you are right, my reply was pretty petty - the comments I replied to were not abusive, I just disagreed with them.
My apologies to Blindweb and unwashedmass.
Comparing 1979 with 2008 is nonsense.
Who does not see the difference shut up, please.
All the time, the same moronic talking.
You might be surprised:
http://tinyurl.com/4hgurzo
Ha ha, you kook. Always with the worst case.
Yeah, when trading it pays to apply critical thinking and to consider everything, especially the worst case :-)
dude, i feel your pain. what are you holding? treasuries?
or worse, TIPS and munis?
time to head for the fire exits.
Nope.
Nope.
x2
ooooooooooooo, worse yet....you posted a vote of confidence in Bennie Boy and you've got gold and silver shorts....
yikes. i can certainly feel your pain. its only gonna get worse over the next couple of days as we explore the depths of USD .77.......
i feel for you, man.
Nope.
Going short gold was a tempting opportunity a month ago but I passed on it - there were better trades.
I generally don't go strategically short on silver, or any other productive commodity. You can never know when demand explodes or supply shrinks due to some unexpected bottleneck.
I just wanted to contribute my share of fact telling to those who consider gold as an investment. It's not an investment it's speculation, so it might pay - or not.
That's it for today in terms of free trading advice :)
To: Morecritical...
You don't buy gold to make money, you buy gold because you HAVE money.
So I must assume, you have no real amount of money worth protecting!