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Unconfirmed Rumor Of British Airways Flight With Twin Engine Shutdown Diverted For Landing To Ostende, Belgium (Update: It Appears It Is A World Airways MD-11)
A (totally unconfirmed so far) rumor has surfaced on the Professional Pilot Rumor Network that a British Airways 747 flight has suffered a twin engine failure over north UK, and was forced to divert for an emergency landing in Ostende, Belgium.
From the forum:
(unconfirmed) 747 diversion with two engines shut down?
Just
heard that in the north of the uk a BA 747 has had a twin engine shut
down, and diverted? From a mil source, but no further info, can anyone
confirm or deny?Further details, landed in Ostend with engine damage....I cannot reveal sources for fear of reprisals in my line of work, but a
747 has definatly landed with engine damage in Ostend.... As said, the
original post was the first rumblings, all info since had come from a
very well placed source. Unsure on other details but it has impacted
where I work, flying seems to have been halted again.
We will keep you updated as this rumor is either confirmed or denied. Of course, should this prove true, the implications for further airspace shutdowns will be severe.
Update: It appears that the airline in question is World Airways and the plane is a cargo MD-11:
It should be noted that the World Airways MD-11 came from further
afield, unloaded freight at Maastricht and then positioned at
relatively low level (probably somewhere between FL160 and FL220) to
Ostend (about 25 mins flying).
Business Insider picks up on this thread and posts an email exchange with the CEO:
"We won't have answer on damage until the engines are inspected," World Airways spokesman Steve Forsyth tells us by email. "We have to take this precaution."Forsyth says he was "advised of no engine shutdown."
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Harry Wanger would report this a positive economic developement.
GE just sold two more jet engines. Buy, buy, buy.
Broken Windows for everyone.
Maybe we could just re-price tickets assuming engines are disposable after each flight?
Actually, if it's a proper BA flight, I think it would be Rolls Royce. BA flies with style...
No, actually, if it's true, I would find it disturbing and irresponsible if they are continuing flights in what would appear to be unsafe conditions.
As I said in the other thread, the key today is /ES and SPX. A close below 1200 on both and we could see a retreat regardless of positive/negative news.
Wow, I'm shocked, you could actually be human......LOL.
He's been to acting school. He can fake it.
I love HarryWagner's posts. Although he goes against everything I stand for with his positive spin, he has been right. The DOW goes up. When HarryWagner starts to sell, it is over.
False alarm. Check here:
http://www.nieuwsblad.be/article/detail.aspx?articleid=DMF20100421_084
Google translation from Dutch:
BRUSSELS - There is no damage to the engines of the aircraft from the U.S. airline World Airways, which landed Tuesday in Ostend with ashes on the engines. This follows from the first results of research on the apparatus.
The aircraft was flown Tuesday from Maastricht and after inspection was grounded because the inspectors had found volcanic ash on the engines. There were special today experts from Swiss Air was flown for further tests on the device.
The results suggest comfortable. "There are indeed found debris of volcanic origin, but there is no damage to the engines. The first results of the study I just orally, "says Pauwels in January, spokesman for State Secretary for Mobility Etienne Schouppe (CD & V).
Buy more solars! Oh wait, I think that's someone else.
I think Harry Wanger should change his avatar to that picture of George Bush standing in front of the "Mission Accomplished" banner.
Hairy Wanker would indeed report this as a positive.
Nothing moves by air these days. All ship and rail. Along with the pending Greek default, this should be great for the bullish case.
Illness and foreign invaders (of the vegitative kind) move just fine by air.
Buy GE. They will need the engines fixed. lol
P&W still have there view on operating in Volcanic ash.
While P&WC acknowledges that the Local Regulatory Authority has the final determination of whether flight operation is to be conducted, we want to inform you, our customers, of potential hazards.
P&WC does not recommend operation in conditions where volcanic ash is present.
http://www.pwc.ca/en/service-support/engine-operation-in-volcanic-ash
The Germans are reputed to have some of the best glider pilots in the world - I think I will book my next flight with Lufthansa
Don't modern planes have the glide characteristics of anvils?
Winged anvils.
Nein,
Das anvil nicht exploden on impact.
On the contrary I believe they have good glide characteristics - but the process of lining them up to a appropriate runway/motorway can be a little tricky has their stall/sink speed is a bit higher then your average glider.
Airliners have very good glide ratios - but best gliding speed tends to be pretty quick in the range of 250-300ktias. I'm sure it would be a wild ride to glide one.
Your thinking about the military....low bidder effect.
747 glide path = delta y/delta x = empty set: no division by zero.
Yes, anvils with a 10-1 glide ratio...
http://www.gcmap.com/faq/etops
Actually a 747 has a glide ratio of 15:1 to 17:1 depending on the model. This is pretty good; a Cessna is about 10:1. There was a famous incident in Canada (the Gimli glider) that depended on a glide to reach the airport safely (and it so happens the pilot was an avid glider flyer).
The only flying anvil I'm aware of is the F-4 Phantom, which is 1 mile per 10,000 feet of altitude, which translates to 0.5:1. I think they say the 1 mile per 10K to make people think it's better.
I asked an A-7 Corsair pilot what he would do if his engine flamed out. He said "bail out becouse the Corsair had a glide path of a rock".
Two engines shut down and then diverted for an emergency landing? At least it wasn't a 737...
Engine replacement cost $5M-$10M, the egalitarian precepts of the EU, priceless. Like hopeless Greek debts, the ash doesn't matter, Brussels has spoken.
Amazed no one has blamed all of this on Al Queda.
They shouldn't be flying in that crap either way.
Engineers need to come up with a condom-shaped air filter for these jet engines. Problem solved!
Or they could just go back to piston propeller planes. Any DC-3's left around?
profits before anything else yet again
Apparently it was World Airways freight plane. It landed with ash but no damage found so far.
...apart from two engines not operating, and the stains on the cockpit seats.
very funny
Why are they even flying in this? It is incredibly dangerous and can shut down engines immediately. If one of these planes drops of of the skys a lawsuit would put these companies out of business overnight for taking such risks. I would not allow any of my family members to fly
WHAT VOLCANIC DUST DOES TO AIRCRAFT:
http://williambanzai7.blogspot.com/2010/04/why-cant-planes-fly-through-v...
Talk to any aircraft mechanic, pilot, or engineer and they'll tell you that flying through volcanic ash is one of the worst things for a jet engine. Clog the bypass, send the engine into an overheat condition, and voila engine fire! or outright failure.
These airline execs are so far removed from the understanding of aircraft that they would likely think Bernoulli for a type of Italian pastry.
+10 Even if they get away with it, this was a piss poor decision. Finnish and Belgie fighter problems proved the stuff was there, and would fry the engines.
Pilot's First Rule: Lose not thine airspeed, lest the ground rise up and smite thee!
What about glide factor?
It's not like they're flying helicopters, where an engine shutdown equals a descent straight down.
As long as you're over land just glide the plane down, like the space shuttle, which has no engine at all on descent.
P.S. I am not a pilot, just a skeptic.
AIG will pay for them.
This is over. See last post here:
http://www.pprune.org/rumours-news/412863-unconfirmed-747-diversion-two-...
"Ok i will clear all the confusion up,it was an MD11 frieghter from Maastricht to Ostende at FL150,when we landed we found evidence of something whether it was ash or just plain old dust we shall know when the engines(3of) are boroscoped which is happening as i type.No drama,some people know how to make a mountain out of a mole hill.But as engineers we had to err on the side of safety and follow the maintenance manual to the letter as always.I think World have done the right thing and followed the procedures,now if the boroscope does find something then alot of airlines are going to be looking for a new engine(s)."
time to invest in the folks that build airplane engines. LOL
That would be the logical thing to do. But what will really happen is GS will advocate long positions then buy short, issue a recall on the revolving, sink the engine manufacturers, make a cool billion and you and all the other logicians are left wondering how Obamanation lets this shit go on.
Dow 36000 - Here. We. Come.
On another note - Humanity's hubris comes back to bite it in the ass.
False rumor is false.
Someone got confused by a report of an MD-11 freighter landing last night at Ostend.
Ash was seen in the engines during an inspection but the engines ran fine.
Not only that, there is also another plane from boekarest to brussels missing.
All air traffic has just been suspended. It's all over the radio here in Belgium.
Nothing on twitter about this (searched for "air traffic") - if they ground everything again I'd expect independent confirmation pretty quick.
Wow! Someone else who uses twitter to confirm rumors.
If I notice gmail isn't working, I search that on twitter too. If it's gmail and not me, you'll see it right away. (In between the tweets of people pooping.)
I want blood I tell you!!!
The plane landed. But all the in brussels, there are quite a few cancelled flights again
http://www.brusselsairport.be/nl/flightinfo/arrivals/index.html
A United Airlines jet made an emergency landing in Portugal.
Ria Novosti: "Passenger jet from Washington to Moscow makes emergency landing in Azores"
http://bit.ly/bQwNzX
Here is a google translated account from a Belgium paper featuring the acct of a Belgian guy on the plane:
http://bit.ly/btIujb
World Airlines?
Are you kidding me?
As a pilot, my biggest fear would be the unknown element of "fuel burn + ash." Flight planning calculations depend on the pilot knowing the amount of fuel needed to make a destination using the known burn rate of the engines at a given airspeed. With engine efficiency decreased to an unknown degree due to the addition of ash, the idea of flying long distances over water would not be particularly attractive to me. Since I watch the fuel burn in flight I would know that I need to select a more efficient set of rpm/manifold pressures to make my destination airport and I can always land at Podunk Airstrip and get avgas if needed. I can live with a longer flight if I get there. I would imagine that the 200+ people passengers expecting to catch connecting flights would not be amused and there aren't a whole lot of emergency refueling stops in the North Atlantic.