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The Unwind Begins: Eurogroup President Juncker Redirects From A Broke Europe By Throwing US And Japan Under The Insolvency Bus: "The Debt Level Of The USA Is Disastrous"

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Sat, 06/11/2011 - 14:36 | 1361428 Quixotic_Not
Quixotic_Not's picture

Good cop, bad cop...agent provocateurism at its finest!

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 15:21 | 1361512 Hedgetard55
Hedgetard55's picture

Actually, Juncker makes a saliant point. We suck big time.

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 16:05 | 1361627 Id fight Gandhi
Id fight Gandhi's picture

Yeah, it's the short bus too.

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 16:49 | 1361718 ratso
ratso's picture

Actually Juncker is deflecting attention from the structural crisis in Euroland just as the articel says.

Hmm - How much will it cost to save the banks that are holding Greek and Portuguese Bonds if they default which they will??

The answer 1.5 trillion+ euros for Greece and about 1.5 trillion+ euros for Portugal.  That will leave the ECB or EU with about 3 trillion euros (or 4.3 trillion USD) more debt than Juncker is making believe they have now.  

Juncker, the Joker, is nose deep in his own doo doo.

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 18:54 | 1361888 knowless
Sat, 06/11/2011 - 20:03 | 1362003 Ahmeexnal
Ahmeexnal's picture

It's like 3 sad fucks about to face the executioner.  All three are getting their heads chopped off one right after the other. No question about that. Yet the first one having his head fitted above the basket starts squealing: "DON'T KILL ME FIRST, KILL *HIM* FIRST!" while pointing at another of the walking dead trio.

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 20:17 | 1362026 dust to dust
dust to dust's picture

 Is that what they do is Squeal when they are asked the TRUTH? Then squeal loud so we can hear the TRUTH.   

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 20:30 | 1362045 Ahmeexnal
Ahmeexnal's picture

But the ages old adage holds:  "To the squeals of a pig, the ears of a butcher."

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 22:02 | 1362167 jeff montanye
jeff montanye's picture

if it's a soft, voluntary restructuring, then the unwind has begin.

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 22:01 | 1362169 jeff montanye
jeff montanye's picture

thank you zh.

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 19:23 | 1361940 macholatte
macholatte's picture

Actually Juncker is deflecting attention from the structural crisis in Euroland just as the article says.


and admitting that he is an imbecile not worthy of his paycheck. It doesn't get any more obvious than this:

"The real problem is that no one can explain well why the euro zone is in the epicenter of a global financial challenge...

isn't it HIS JOB to know this stuff? So he's saying that he and all his sociopath brainiac buddies are clueless. Maybe Tyler can send him a complementary membership to ZH.

Or did I miss something?


Sun, 06/12/2011 - 01:21 | 1362472 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

That's Euro-speak for "Nobody saw this coming".

Sun, 06/12/2011 - 10:31 | 1362910 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

But really Macho, anyone who knows anything much, knows that it's all a game, London/Vatican/DC.
The rest is just distraction. Not worth anger or any wasteful emotion.
That is the structure in place. Three legs. Religion, Military (Pentagram is the epicenter of DC) and of course finance.
The Big Apple, it's just a karmic hell-center. Doing other people's dirty work.

They can engineer a soft landing tomorrow, but sadly we know that is not in the plans.


Sat, 06/11/2011 - 19:28 | 1361950 kaiten
kaiten's picture

3 trillion EUR for Greece and Portugal? Dont be fool. Their entire debt is few hundred billions.

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 20:55 | 1362078 ViewfromUnderth...
ViewfromUndertheBridge's picture


Sat, 06/11/2011 - 20:58 | 1362093 boiltherich
boiltherich's picture

Funny how nobody has mentioned Ireland yet, nor the other fiscally financial basket cases of Spain and Italy, which though they have not yet been bailed upon are in just as bad a shape as any others, they just got creative with the accounting when it was clear that nations in the group were being forced to take bailouts that amounted to debt slavery for their citizens.

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 21:56 | 1362164 ratso
ratso's picture

Kaiten - The calculation is based on the domino effect of defaulting weak euro bonds and how much will be needed to recapitalize the banks and sovereign funds that hold the bonds.      

It would have clearer if I spelled out all the numbers more accurately. 

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 16:31 | 1361688 Quinvarius
Quinvarius's picture

I agree.  I see a lot of pro-dollar hype lately from Rogers, Taylor, CNBS ect.  They all seem to assume the banks will have trouble getting money for some reason and we will have another liquidity crisis like in 2008.  I don't see how that is going to happen with the Fed still in free money money for banks mode. This dollar bounce is just a hyped up trade complete with a sudden influx of anti-Euro propaganda, like every other one.  A weak stock market does not equal a strong dollar or a liquidity crisis.  But then again, all of FOREX is just meaningless rigged manipulation.  The Dollar could go to parity with Euro and bread will still cost $50 a loaf while no one in Europe would accept dollars.  

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 18:54 | 1361898 oogs66
oogs66's picture

yeah, but he is happy to take IMF money to help fix Europe, and the U.S. is by far the largest contributor to the IMF.  does that mean we shouldn't give any more money to IMF for their European operations?

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 21:53 | 1362158 steve from virginia
steve from virginia's picture

There wouldn't be a Europanic if liquidity wasn't a problem.

There are a 'lot' of reserves in finance institutions but not nearly enough capital: not enough reserves when measured against the amount of deficient assets, either.

Of all the actions taken since the Lehman crash, the one that mattered was 'extend- pretend'. Sheets actually balanced for a minute, and liquidity flooded back into markets.

EU's version of extend-pretend has been fully engaged since before the crisis, like all the other props it's not working any more. There are too many bad assets, more are turning bad every day and the point where deleveraging is relatively painless is long since passed.

Now, bank runs and yields rising everywhere but Germany. Liquidity is gone and there is not 'Extend-Pretend 2.0' to call upon!

Even w/ the new bail the Greeks will default. If the current government calls for a referendum, it's game over. ECB will have to buy up all the bad debt or else. Why? B/c the entire world's finance is in danger of a credit freeze, as in 2008.

The Fed will expand its balance sheet you watch. QE is for the Eurodudes and dudettes via swap lines and dollar repos by way of 'lending facilities'. Bernanke will have to do it or  half the banks in the US will fail.

Treasury guarantees will be back like poufy dresses. We are condemned to repeat errors until we learn not to do so.

Best to let weak institutions fail and wipe out stakeholders. Start from scratch w/ new capital and management. Anything else is a waste of time ...



Sun, 06/12/2011 - 05:30 | 1362631 oldman
oldman's picture

"We are condemned to repeat errors until we learn not to do so."

This assumes living intelligence, but it seems more realistic thus written:


We are condemned to repeat errors.

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 14:41 | 1361431 Ahmeexnal
Ahmeexnal's picture

Juncker is an asswipe.

Gates will pull out of Libya and let the "enlightened democracies of europe" to fight Mr. Q bye themselves....and Mr. Q will beat the living shit out of europe.

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 14:43 | 1361435 Neoisolationist
Neoisolationist's picture

You may be right. And this would very much harm what the NWO true believers want.

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 14:47 | 1361441 Confused
Confused's picture

Come on now. This is simply to save face. It would seem Americans are less than happy with our involvement there, and this is just a political move. 

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 15:45 | 1361587 redguard
redguard's picture

Turkey's part of NATO. They have to fracture the alliance before the Turks get dragged into the Mideast conflagration.

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 21:02 | 1362102 boiltherich
boiltherich's picture

Are the Turks still considered a full participating member?  After they denied access to airspace for the northern prong of the attack on Saddam one would think they would have been quietly handed their hats, technically still members but only in name. 

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 15:22 | 1361516 walküre
walküre's picture

Lybia didn't bother Europe before the CIA inflamed the revolt.

Lybia's massive and easy accessible (as in cheap) oil reserves in the desert can be traded in Euros for decades to come.

That is what Lybia is about, you fool.

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 15:30 | 1361537 Ahmeexnal
Ahmeexnal's picture


The european colonalist powers carved up a map of Africa just like they did in the Berlin Conference in the late 1800's. 

Why use euros to buy Libyan oil if you can just steal it....and make Libyans pay for their "liberation"?

That's what Libya is about, you ignorant imperialist fool.

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 15:39 | 1361577 walküre
walküre's picture

You speak of stealing oil and call me the ignorant imperialist fool?

US has been on an imperialist rampage since 1913, the inception of the Fed.

Nato might as well get abolished and let the chips fall where they may.


Sat, 06/11/2011 - 15:50 | 1361600 Alea Iacta Est
Alea Iacta Est's picture

And Europe has been on an imperialist rampage since the FOURTEEN HUNDREDS.


Do you have a point?  Or are you already playing the Juncker card in this thread?


lol, that didn't take long.



Sat, 06/11/2011 - 19:40 | 1361960 kaiten
kaiten's picture

Your country is the result of that imperialist rampage, as you call it,. If you dont like the results of that imperialism, you can give your country back to native indiands. Problem solved. But they are taking it back anyway, so who cares, doesnt it?

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 21:04 | 1362107 Alea Iacta Est
Alea Iacta Est's picture

They are taking it back?  lol....ok.

Are you referring to the mexican immigrants?  They are no more taking it back than the muslim immigration wave from north africa is "taking over europe".  Futhermore, they are no more "native" to North America than the Europeans were.

And I never criticiqued the Europeans for being imperialist, I merely pointed out that European imperialism FAR precedes the American variety.  If you were capable of understanding the context of my response to the previous poster, you would see that.

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 21:11 | 1362113 Alea Iacta Est
Alea Iacta Est's picture

As a clarification, the mexicans are not native to the continental united states.  The idea that they are taking back their own land is silly.  The imperialist mexico of the 1800's colonized some southern regions, they certainly were not native to those areas.

Sun, 06/12/2011 - 07:34 | 1362716 kaiten
kaiten's picture

US will be sooner part of Latin America than Europe part of Maghreb, I´d say.

Sun, 06/12/2011 - 11:43 | 1363006 Ahmeexnal
Ahmeexnal's picture

Well, that pretty much describes what you are: a redneck trailertrash racist.

Go back to your extrawide lazyboy 4000 and keep watching "dancing with the stars", while you wear your KKK grandmaster outfit.


Sun, 06/12/2011 - 12:45 | 1363087 kaiten
kaiten's picture

Talking demographic trends is racist? Mhmmm, I think you have an issue with Census Bureau, then.

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 21:45 | 1362154 Blano
Blano's picture

Just curious.....which third world shithole do you live in??

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 23:53 | 1362323 Al Gorerhythm
Al Gorerhythm's picture

The USA?

Sun, 06/12/2011 - 07:32 | 1362718 kaiten
kaiten's picture

What´s your point, dude?

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 16:14 | 1361648 RollOver
RollOver's picture

Aren't the guys behind the Fed the same ones as those who invented colonialism?

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 16:34 | 1361694 I_ate_the_crow
I_ate_the_crow's picture

"Whoever controls the volume of money in any country is absolute master of all industry and commerce...and when you realize that the entire system is very easily controlled, one way or another, by a few powerful men at the top, you will not have to be told how periods of inflation and depression originate"

- 1881, President Garfield (As quoted by Bill Still in the Secret of Oz).

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 20:05 | 1362008 Ahmeexnal
Ahmeexnal's picture

Behind the Fed lurks the church of Rome.

"In god we trust"

Seems like god is about to have trust revoked by every single human being on this planet.

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 21:07 | 1362106 boiltherich
boiltherich's picture

Russia would LOVE that.  (the end of NATO that is)

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 14:38 | 1361432 THE DORK OF CORK
THE DORK OF CORK's picture

Because so much of our debt is private you dumb shit.

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 14:50 | 1361447 JW n FL
JW n FL's picture

I knew I should not have let you barrow that 5 bucks! damn it! I always end up getting screwed..


why when its "We the People" always getting fucked over in retail.. is it described as transitory? always is a longer period of time than transitory insinuates!


Fucking Hair Cuts!


Never buy wine by the glass!

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 15:01 | 1361467 topcallingtroll
topcallingtroll's picture


Are you sure you know how much debt is hidden in spain and portugal, just waiting to surprise you at the worst time?

Private debt can be rated wrong and perform just as badly as public debt. Pick your poison.

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 16:07 | 1361633 THE DORK OF CORK
THE DORK OF CORK's picture

What is leverage ?

Leverage in this monetory system is the ratio of tax raising powers (goverment money) vs private credit.

If you knew anything about EMU /  Euro you would realise that goverment debt has barely moved in the euro area in 15 years. (with the exception of the shadow bank bailout over the last few years)

Its not the % of goverment debt relative to GDP that is important as this is a false metric (wealthy subjects can reduce consumption dramatically if they so wish)

Its the ratio of goverment debt relative to private credit and since EMU this has gone ballistic in the euro area.

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 18:39 | 1361872 eureka
eureka's picture

Spot on. And, even more relevant: gov debt to to gov revenue.

US fed/state/muni revenue is nose-diving.

US crumbles within 12 months.

Watch and see.

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 22:00 | 1362056 Things that go bump
Things that go bump's picture

Crumbles into autonomous regional areas that go off on their own and leave that bunch in New York and DC to cannibalize themselves?

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