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US Citizen Killed During Gaza Flotilla Raid
It is one thing for a country to attack a boat somewhere out of sight (and soon out of mind, as the collective American memory fades after 24 hours, whether it is geopolitical, or 1,000 point Dow crashes) in which the people killed are foreigners: the administration can talk up its teleprompter game which achieves nothing, but gives the impression of action (very much the same as what is happening in the Gulf), until people, sick of the spectacle, desire to move on. However, when a US citizen has been shot and killed during an armed incident in international waters, well, then talking ain't gonna cut it. It appears this is precisely what happened during the Gaza flotilla raid: "The U.S. confirmed that an American citizen, identified as 19-year-old FurkanDogan, was killed by multiple gunshots during the Israeli raid on a flotilla carrying activists attempting to run a blockade of the Gaza Strip ." To quote Marcus from Bad Boys: "Shit just got real."
From Bloomberg:
The Mavi Marmara was carrying 581 passengers, about 300 of them Turkish and the remainder from about 30 other countries including Greece, the U.K. and Algeria, Turkish Deputy Prime Minister Bulent Arinc said on May 31. Arinc accused Israel of “piracy” for boarding the vessels in international waters.
Dogan was born in Troy, New York, according to State Department spokesman Philip J. Crowley. The Dogan family now has his body, which is en route to their hometown in Turkey for burial, Crowley said.
A second American was injured on the ships and a third in a subsequent protest, according to Clinton. The U.S. is looking into what had happened to the Americans involved, she said.
“Protecting the welfare of American citizens is a fundamental responsibility of our government and one that we take very seriously,” Clinton said. “We are in constant contact with the Israeli government attempting to obtain more information.”
Clinton said this week that the situation in the Gaza Strip is “unsustainable and unacceptable” and that “ultimately the solution to this must be found in an agreement on a two-state solution negotiated” between Israel and the Palestinians.
The flotilla raid and the uproar surrounding it haven’t affected talks between Palestinians and Israelis, Crowley said. U.S. Middle East envoy George Mitchell, speaking in Bethlehem, said there should be a renewed focus on the talks.
From a purely diplomatic perspective, the continued attempts by the Obama administration to play down international outrage, when none other than an American citizen has been killed, will look very suspect to the international community, and risks the spillover and redirection of global anger, currently aimed at Israel, straight at the US.
In other news, AP provides advance notice of a Larry King interview with President Obama on this topic:
President Barack Obama is calling the deadly Israeli raid on an aid flotilla bound for the Gaza Strip "tragic" and says the loss of life that resulted was unnecessary. Obama stopped short of condemning the actions of Israeli forces, saying that the U.S. wants to wait for an investigation.
Obama says he believes Israel should agree to such an investigation because the incident isn't good for their long-term security."
Obama spoke in an interview with CNN's Larry King airing Thursday night.
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He's looking like a thin reed and I'm afraid maybe he's hiding something about Rahm's visit to Israel during the planning stages of this event. Either someone got rolled or someone rolled himself. Obama better get his SHIT together.
Unlike that bitch ass Obama which by the way like Germany and Japan needs to go ahead and resign, cause he aint nothin but a bitch ass puppet. This shit hits homes. Isreal is Pyschotic, I notice their collective punishment can relate with the all forgiving christians here in the Americas though.
Zionism = the new face of Fascism
Ask any Military brass, this war has created more killers than it has killed. Then ask em why they are affraid to send the troops back home.
But then, as A native, ask me why I don't want them back. Murderers are murderers, there is no going back. What a mess.
Zionism = Islamism = Fascism.
I've never actually met anybody who approves of any of the above - atheists, jews, muslims, christians.
Maybe I choose my friends not to be idiots. Maybe the press peddles dogshit, and no politician in the West has the guts to do anything. It's one or the other.
Yea, how many Islamist we got got in these forums, you living on myths man.
Zionism = Islamism = Fascism.
One of these is not like the other.
Think harder....
Hey - you said it. Thanks for not holding out on me. I retract my above comment!
I think everyone is missing the big picture. Israel got murdered the fuck up during WWII. Not out in the open. In hidden camps by hidden groups doing things so horrible the world couldn't even believe it once they found out.
That kind of fucking history will put you in a very bad postion. Everyone who demands Israel be wiped off the face of the map is playing into that hand.
Hatred is manageble and somewhat defensible. But secret emnity is a bitch to deal with.
Until you fuckers get off your ass and tear this fucking banking system down that does shit in secret day after day month after month year after year. NOBODY is safe.
And I also think Israel needs to know for sure that we are not going to let them stuff those peope in an internment camp (gaza strip) and starve them to fucking death. Because if they successfully pull that off they won't ever feel safe again.
Couldn't agree more. Unfortunately they have very powerful lobbyists.
Good points up and down. Your last paragraph is spot on. They're creating their own monsters behind those walls. It's resembles almost a death wish. I don't get it. But, I think there's some serious psychology going on, perhaps historical transference being among the biggest.
http://www.gtr5.com/
On June 8, 1967, US Navy intelligence ship USS Liberty was suddenly and brutally attacked on the high seas in international waters by the air and naval forces of Israel. The Israeli forces attacked with full knowledge that this was an American ship and lied about it. Survivors have been forbidden for 40 years to tell their story under oath to the American public. The USS Liberty Memorial web site tells their story and is dedicated to the memory of the 34 brave men who died.
The Attack
After surveilling USS Liberty for more than nine hours with almost hourly aircraft overflights and radar tracking, the air and naval forces of Israel attacked our ship in international waters without warning. USS Liberty was identified as a US naval ship by Israeli reconnaissance aircraft nine hours before the attack and continuously tracked by Israeli radar and aircraft thereafter. Sailing in international waters at less than five knots, with no offensive armament, our ship was not a military threat to anyone.
The Israeli forces attacked without warning and without attempting to contact us. Thirty four Americans were killed in the attack and another 174 were wounded. The ship, a $40-million dollar state-of-the-art signals intelligence platform, was later declared unsalvageable and sold for scrap.
The Cover Up
Despite a near-universal consensus that the Israeli attack was made with full knowledge that USS Liberty was a US Navy ship, the Johnson administration began an immediate cover-up of this fact. Though administration officers continued individually to characterize the attack as deliberate, the Johnson administration never sought the prosecution of the guilty parties or otherwise attempted to seek justice for the victims. They concealed and altered evidence in their effort to downplay the attack. Though they never formally accepted the Israeli explanation that it was an accident, they never pressed for a full investigation either. They simply allowed those responsible literally to get away with murder.
In an ongoing effort to reveal the truth about the attack, the USS Liberty Veterans Association has filed with the Secretary of the Army in the manner prescribed by law a detailed, fully documented Report of War Crimes describing the circumstances of the attack on our ship and evidence that it was a crime under international law. In accordance with international law and treaties, the United States is obligated to investigate the allegations. So far, the United States has declined even to acknowledge that the report has been filed. The full text of the report can be found at http://www.gtr5.com/evidence/warcrimes.pdf
USS Liberty is some weird shit. But why did it happen?
Why where the Israeli forces safe to kill an American on this current "peace" convoy?
This isn't meant rhetorically. There's not one country on earth that would be so "relaxed" about the killing of its citizens.
Feel safe?
a holocaust in the 1940's
apparently justifies endless holocaust(s)
on others for at least 10000 years ???,
the song and dance about the 1940's
justifying anything & everything is
getting a little stale ,
question ? , is the " chosen people "
just another way to say
"THE MASTER RACE " ????
IS IT NOT TIME TO END
" THE FOREVER WARS " ???????
Master race in the US it seems....
I read that once Teddy Roosevelt was asked if he believed if the protocols of the elders of zion were real or fake. He replied that he didn't know but his observations gave him no reason to believe they were fake.
Then why do they always need money
and all you flaked out
"CHRISTIAN ZIONISTS " , need to
leave the cult and return to
actual Christianity.
http://www.truthtellers.org/
Och I'm off to bed. Israelis can kill Americans with impunity now.
You all lost your country a long, long time ago.
Sleep tight ;)
Nah. The FBI just put a few Israeli's in jail. One for selling nuclear material to AQ Khan. The other for stealing some small time papers and I'm sure you know the other handful. The country is in American's hands. It's just that the politicians on both sides USE the hell out of one another and they both con each other. Jane Harmon was never going to kill that investigation, I just think she was lying to the Israeli so they'd pull for her for chair on intel. Yet, she wasn't appointed. WHY? Because they were BOTH LYING to each other about the power that they wielded. The rest of these Aipac guys got chased out of the pentagon by Franks and the FBI. They were pulling the same same as every other think tank in the pentagon trying to fund some corporate mini-CIA off the border of Iran for their dream war. If you ask who's responsible after it succeeds, it will be 10 think tanks, 5 corporations, yada, yada. They're all wheeling and dealing. Elders of zion? Hardly. More like the business roundtable of All The Above. Israel always thinks we're one month away from dumping them. That's why the constant frenzy. We might as well give them a one time deal. Dump the nukes, two states on 67, and mutual defense NATO protection. Problem is, they'll think it's a "trap".
ADL, the mainspring of the bill,
ENDA'S REAL INTENTION By Rev. Ted Pike25 May 10
Perhaps thousands of callers have now urged 13 undecided senators to vote against the Employment Non-Discrimination Act. Our anger is fueled by ENDA's potential to allow transgender male employees not only into women’s restrooms but also showers and dressing rooms in businesses of more than 15 employees. Every public school and college in America has at least that many employees, along with male and female shower facilities used by students and staff.
Yet Peter Sprigg, senior fellow of Family Research Council, says in the Washington Times that under ENDA naked transgenders can’t invade school locker rooms. “ENDA carves out an exception for shared shower and dressing facilities in which being seen unclothed is unavoidable.” As a result, Christian/conservative groups now pull back from claiming ENDA will allow transitioning men into women's showers. What is the truth? Here again is Section 8, paragraph 3 of ENDA.
This intentionally confusing section says the government will not honor any complaint by, for example, transgender males who claim they are being excluded from women's shower facilities—as long as the employer provides such men with "adequate" (non-shower and dressing room) facilities.
But if ENDA is passed, such restriction will infuriate many "transitioning" males. It deprives them of fully enjoying their new-found female privileges. If after working out, a transgender “female” at a college or gym is denied the necessity to shower with members of his new sex, such exclusion will be considered discrimination—an excellent basis for a federal lawsuit. If ENDA is passed in its present form, it will generate a profusion of lawsuits by aggrieved transsexuals.
ENDA itself is in transition. The first stage is passage of unworkable legislation that discriminates against the right of a transitioning male employee to full and adequate use of female shower facilities. For ENDA to guarantee equality, the above section must be rewritten to become an "equal showering" amendment.
Bridgette P. LaVictoire, writing in lesbian website LezGetReal.com, reflects awareness in the homosexuality community of ENDA's discrimination: “The largest stumbling block has been regarding transgender protections. Unfortunately, in order to get those protections in the bill, they were forced to include a rather discriminatory portion about not allowing a person to use the bathrooms correct to their gender presentation. This opens the door to a great deal of abuses and problems unless there is also a provision that requires businesses to have a unisex bathroom.”
ENDA’s discrimination centers on public showers and dressing rooms, not bathrooms as LaVictoire confusingly asserts. And this discrimination cannot be ended by unisex facilities, as she ambiguously contends—whether a single-occupant, unisex bathroom/shower, or a communal unisex facility for male and female transgenders.
There is only one thing that transgender activists will accept: full rights to enter dressing rooms and showers of their new sex. Only this confirms that they are regarded by society as truly equal and accepted. Anything less says: “You are still not male or female enough to be admitted into the confidence of those you now consider your own. You can’t boldly say, ‘I am a man,’ or ‘I am a woman,’ in all areas of society and receive respect and dignity for who you are. Transsexuals are still 'have nots,' isolated by the sexual apartheid of government, business, and society."
Already, even before ENDA enshrines anti-transgender discrimination into law, transgenders are proving litigious. In Pennsylvania, a transgender "woman" is winning a discrimination lawsuit against her former employer, brought before the Pennsylvania Human Rights Commission. She was hired as "James" but was transitioning to "Kate Lynn." Her employer required her to use a unisex single-occupancy bathroom until she could medically document her "anatomically appropriate" gender. This wasn't enough for "Kate Lynn," who complained about having to walk five minutes from her work location to the unisex facility. A preoperative male-to-female transsexual is also currently suing Macy's for being ejected from the women's restroom.
Masters of Deception
Confused? That's exactly what homosexual activists Barney Frank and Chai Feldblum, writers of ENDA, intend. Both are highly articulate communicators. Yet in crafting the transgender provision of ENDA, they purposely made it so nearly incomprehensible that members of Congress and the public will give up trying to decipher it. Instead, we accept the simplistic summary of the bill provided by the very deceivers who confused us in the first place! Their streamlined explanations to Congress and the media, of course, do not mention the possibility of men in women's showers or even restrooms. Congress votes not for the actual bill but a misrepresentation.
In all this, ENDA ignores the possibility that the civil rights of children, teens and college students might be violated by intrusion of lechers into their showers. As Attorney General Eric Holder revealed in his Senate Judiciary hate bill hearing, the Anti-Defamation League’s "anti-hate" laws are not about protecting the white, Christian, heterosexual majority - only small minorities whom liberals consider historic "victims" of Christian civilization. (Watch the NPN video "Holder Admits: No Equality Under Hate Bill.")
Of course, ADL, the mainspring of the bill, doesn't truly care about the civil rights of transgenders. ENDA is a means to an incredibly evil end. ADL wants ENDA to force showering between all students and sexual deviants because only then can this legislation reach its fullest potential to destroy sexual/gender clarity and morality in the next generation. Jewish ADL and its religiously Orthodox leader, Abe Foxman, have one goal: tearing down the structure and values of Christian civilization so that on its ruins a Judaic one-world order may be established by Israel’s false messiah, Anti-Christ. Foxman says he keenly anticipates appearance of this messiah. Orthodox Jews believe their messiah will rule the world from Jerusalem. (See, "ADL's Foxman: Man of Faith?") Few things are more corrosive to nations than homosexuality, destroying basic definitions and protections for “male” and “female.” That’s why ADL pushes sodomy so hard in every level of society.
Don't think that under ENDA your children will have any protection from sexual predators in the public school system. Under ADL's hate laws, devotees of 547 sexual deviancies, or paraphilias, have all the special rights. Under ENDA, they are the state-supported predators. Your children are their prey. (Watch the NPN video "Stop the Pedophile Protecting Hate Bill!")
TAKE ACTION! It is vital that we continue to boldly describe ENDA as leading to allowance of "transitioning" male employees into women's restrooms and showers. Call the 13 undecided U.S. Senators listed at Truthtellers.org's Action Page. Did you call last week? Call again toll free at 877-851-6437.
And don't you dare call them "patient". Why do you think they have been firing rockets? They have been bottled up to die in a damn ghetto! No food, water, electricity, or fuel is allowed in! You would think the Israelis would have some form of empathy. But they don't! They just want to kill, kill, kill anyone that isn't jewish and opposes the will of their mighty and infallible leaders. Disgusting.
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AHA! The alternate universes theory is correct after all!
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by Village Idioton Thu, 06/03/2010 - 19:10
#393458
Personally, I am glad that Tyler clarified his position, and, I admit that i have been enlightened by stories like this. I actually thought that a Jew bastard by the name of "Iceberg" sunk the titanic. (drum roll)
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Yah. Goldberg, Iceberg, what's the diff?
(you the same village idiot from Vox Popoli, VI?)
If so, nice to see ya.
Stand by, Zen0, I'll respond.
Furkan idiot
Arafat Health Update.
The murdering Nobel Prize winner is still declared dead. Gold not located.
honestly, i cannot believe the comments i have read in this epic thread. I am shocked by the level of racism, hatred, and pure xenophobia exhibited and expressed by
Not a single one of you has any idea what happened on that boat. The only things you DO know are this: 1) every person involved with or in the blockade runners were warned repeatedly by Israel to not proceed. 2) the people on the ship were armed, therefore, NOT "peaceful/humanitarian activists". 3) everyone on the ships was there by choice.
so, with those three points in mind, this boy's death was a consequence of HIS OWN FREELY CHOSEN ACTIONS.
The Israel/Palestine situation is an unwinnable argument. Its like debating what happens when an unstoppable force meets an immovable object. THERE IS NO ANSWER.
What saddens me most is to see here the amount of energy put into insanity and hatred instead of ANYthing productive.
Based on what I have seen here, i do not believe there is even a glimmer of hope left for this country.
The hope for America is expelling Jews from all public offices and eliminating them from our banking and legal systems.
I think you qualify as the ZH in house nazi.
I second that observation. Can we now call a vote?
Israel was 100% at fault. They know it. They just cant digest what it means to admit it. With power comes responsibility. You can't be an irresponsible nuclear nation. Israel just jumped the shark. Every single publication in Israel with any circulation is doing a gut check. They know what this means. This proves their leaders aren't acting cool and nuclear. To hang in the nuclear club, you can't go in frenzies. It looks bad. Blaming boat people for swinging make-shift weapons at the nuclear power makes the rest of we nuke boys wince. You see, we don't do that. We know that rings hallow. That's not cool. When you're nuke, you either take that boat clean, or you kill the prop and tow it to port. Not to mention NOT doing that kills and it's immoral. It kind of like the NYFRB complaining you tricked them on the other side of a bid for your own foreclosed house. Maybe you did, but who gives a shit. It's your house and they're the NYFRB. Haartz and JP are embarrassed that they let Bibi and his bruisers embarrass the country. Next question is: can the "smart" ones in Israel quit wringing their hands while forking over the power to the Likud
on Thu, 06/03/2010 - 19:00
#393407
I think everyone is missing the big picture. Israel got murdered the fuck up during WWII. Not out in the open. In hidden camps by hidden groups doing things so horrible the world couldn't even believe it once they found out.
That kind of fucking history will put you in a very bad postion. Everyone who demands Israel be wiped off the face of the map is playing into that hand.
Until you fuckers get off your ass and tear this fucking banking system down that does shit in secret day after day month after month year after year. NOBODY is safe.
And I also think Israel needs to know for sure that we are not going to let them stuff those peope in an internment camp (gaza strip) and starve them to fucking death. Because if they successfully pull that off they won't ever feel safe again.
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I presume you feel the same about the Egyptian blockade of Gaza as well?
You know Egypt, the country that gets at least as much or more aid from the U.S. than Israel does?
"I presume you feel the same about the Egyptian blockade of Gaza as well?
You know Egypt, the country that gets at least as much or more aid from the U.S. than Israel does?"
You mean the country that supplies them goods through a tunnel probably by delivering money to them for a cut, selling them stuff for a cut at a high price. Let's see who were the first people to enslave the jews? I think it was ding ding ding Egypt. Are they trying to heal the situation by doing equally horrible things to the palestines just to show that it wasn't personal?
Blockading is not about keeping a "terrible" group of people from hurting other people. It's about taking a group of people who's actions have been judged "bad" by the greater sanctimonious whole and feeling legitimized for doing horrible things to them for profit or in the name of punishment.
I live in oklahoma and we had a bombing here that a long time ago we vowed to never forget. So they showed a bunch of crap about it on TV for a few days. They never mentioned the bomb analysis questions of how they were able to knock out support beams deep in the building with the original bomb only able to present 25 psi worth of stress on it.
We live in a world transformed by plastic explosives that are 10 times more powerful than gunpowder bombs. Where peoples only experience with explosions is constantly distorted by hollywood.
There's just too much kabuki theater crap going on and people can't even get a clue till it gets so desperate that it turns into jumping the shark moments.
This blockading everybody. Censoring the internet by australia and china and staged crap has just gone too far. Throwing people in prison just so they can learn gang violence and racism, based only on arbitrary color, with no pathway clue or idea of how to deal with a behavior or rectify it because NOBODY GIVES A SHIT. The people who punish simply want a get out of judgement card to be abusive. They don't really give a crap who they abuse, they only give a crap about making the abused a small fraction of the world so they don't garner too much fight back and resistance. And characterizing things with armies of idiot psychologists and psychiatrists. There's too many people here that think about nothing but making people thier bitch, and turning the strong into chickens so they can fuck em.
It's simply various forms of direct, indirect, passive aggressive, and mind fucking abuse. Cooking in a million pots with a hundred different recipes.
The soullessness and stupidity of those who think nothing of the deaths of aid-carrying fellow humans boggles the mind, especially when they claim that the aid is going to terrorists. Consider this (from Juan Cole's superb blog):
The first fallacy is to identify all the people of Gaza with the Hamas party-militia, dismissing them all as “terrorists.” But over half of the 1.5 million people of Gaza is children, who can hardly be terrorists. And if Palestine Authority elections had been held in both the West Bank and Gaza this spring, likely Fatah (which recognizes Israel and has agreed to peace talks) would win, not Hamas, according to a recent Angus Reid poll. (The news is even worse for Hamas: nearly a third of Palestinians want to throw in the towel and seek Israeli citizenship. Oh, yeah, Palestinian nationalism is such a threat to Israel; geez, this is like a third of Americans in the 1950s announcing that what they really wanted was Soviet citizenship).
So collectively punishing all the people of Gaza, as Israel does, is just wrong. It necessitates half-starving little children, since they are so much of the population. And the Israeli perpetrators of the blockade assume that they are punishing Gaza supporters of Hamas when it is clear that a majority of Palestinians would not vote for Hamas at this point.
Step right up and let the government caracature artists draw you a picture so you can see what is going on.
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_HJWpwI-em3U/SQapSjTAtnI/AAAAAAAABcg/6bx5PSqmvy...
"And the Israeli perpetrators of the blockade assume ..."
What do the Egyptian perpetrators of the blockade assume? Why do most of the comments here seem to assume that Israel alone is responsible for the blockade?
Well I think most people here are smart enough to know that blockade means EVERYONE or else it's not a BLOCKADE. It's more of a trade breakdown.
I'd call Juan Cole a friend. He's very dedicated and very informed. I was happy to see the unsinkable Max Kaiser and Stacy linking to his site the day it happened. They're on the right side. There is a right side. And that side isn't "against Israel" , it's for justice and against the ABUSE OF POWER.
Which is what I HOPE Zero Hedge STILL stands for after it's Tanya Harding slip up.
Marla gave an interview about what she actually meant with that post:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2uHSv1asFvU
What an old hag - I'd like to know what Israel has on Iran on advanced technological bla-bla, especially if they were under the boycott Iran is (not to mention without the US spy rings).
Explain the slip up.
I could hardly know unless I knew the author. Perhaps the author is Israeli Likud.
Based on what I have seen here, i do not believe there is even a glimmer of hope left for this country.
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It is interesting how people view things. Based on what I have seen here gives me a slight glimmer of hope for the country. People can actually speak their mind without having to resort to fisticuffs or gun battles. How is this a bad thing?
Did someone's feelings get hurt along the way?
OOOh! Poor baby!
Just because someone disagrees with you doesn't mean they don't like you. Hell, they don't even know you, how can they dis-like you?
deleted
Goodnight all, I really enjoyed this fight club, got kicked in the groin, scratched in the face, got a black eye and I'm missing a few teeth. At the same time I hope I got in a few jabs and a sucker punch or two.
Keep up the good fight, the Tyler Durden Fight Club Fight.
And the Israeli perpetrators of the blockade assume that they are punishing Gaza supporters of Hamas when it is clear that a majority of Palestinians would not vote for Hamas at this point.
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And the next election is scheduled for.............?
Good question. Whoever made that statement is rather fucking ridiculous considering that the last most observed and sanctioned election in the M.E. = Hamas victory. Oh well, that what happens when you spread democracy. I think they'd prefer to have them like the blacks were in the South, say around the 1950-60's. Demure and doing what they want. However, if Hamas losses an election after being coerced to vote for another party with deprivation of food and medicine, how is THAT election result more "legitimate".
There is no logic in the M.E. If you apply logic to these statements, you're sooner to get sick. That's why so many academics in the M.E. are losing their minds and investing in pfizer
It's a blockade. He was on a boat running it. The folks on the boat stabbed and beat with iron bars the Israeli's who landed on the ship. If you're going to put yourself in that situation, stuff happens.
This is an existential threat to Israel. If they cannot keep rockets, rocket shooters, and other instruments of destruction out of Gaza, another Holocaust is coming. Even the Egyptians know what a time bomb the Palestinians are. Their blockade of Gaza is as strict as Israel's (except when they open things for political purposes for a couple of days) for good reason.
Or, another solution: perhaps the Europeans can offer the Jews sanctuary when they have to leave Israel, die, or use nukes as a result of most European countries support of policies (such as this stupid flotilla) that lead to Holocaust II, The Return of the Monsters. Oh wait, there aren't many Jews left in Europe for a reason. There won't be in Israel either.
I do not understand how otherwise decent people can ignore that the world is gradually getting itself ready to countenance the slaughter more millions of Jews and to feel OK about it because it's the the Jew's fault somehow that they are surrounded by people who live to kill them. Ironically, it's the same ruling class that created Israel in the 40's that is now getting ready to off them. If the Jews would only lie down and let their neighbors slaughter them, it would make life so much easier for our ruling class today.
You just made my above point. Pulling this post apart bit by bit is child's work. If you're going to make an argument like that, at least make it challenging. Your argument was dead in the international waters by the second sentence.
You may hate them but Israeli Jews will fight to the death for their right to live, and their country. Given that Israel is so small you can barely see it on a map of the World, it's hard to make the case that Israel is out take over the Mideast.
As an American, I spend more of my time worrying about Muslims infiltrating all the Western Democracies, taking advantage of our freedom of religion and association (which their home countries do not have), and becoming vampire squids on our countries, with the goal of converting the Christian nations to Muslim nations.
How about their balls in building a 13 story Mosque a few hundred feet from the World Trade Center Site, and planning to dedicate such mosque on 9-11-11. Hows that for a Muslim Invasion. I wouldn't spend too much time worrying about the Jews, I'd spend more time brushing up on Arabic and ordering your Burkas and prayer rugs.
Convert to Islam or die.
Here, we can't even get past the first sentence without another logical fallacy. 'You may hate them but Israeli Jews will fight to the death for their right to live, and their country.'
Or you can not hate them Israeli Jews and recognize they're actually not fighting for their "country" anymore. Rather their fighting to expand their country and build condos for big political donors who are making bank and returning that in kind to the party in power. And given that you can hardly see Israel on the map, imagine how small Gaza is!
i notice four people flagged this as junk but no one bothered to try to refute.
This is typical; people are hypocritical when it comes to jews defending themselves.
Anyway, the points instant karma makes are very real and we ignore them at our own peril.
There are bigger dangers coming to america than bernake and hyperinflation. he is right about that
Get a grip guys. If an American pilot got shot down over North Vietnam, he needed to give an authenticator number over the radio or we were not coming to pick him up (I was a SAR helo pilot). Why did he need an authenticator number? Because American citizens who had defected to the enemy would try to lure us into traps by pretending to be downed aviators. Not very many of them, but enough. Did I care if those Americans got killed? Nope.
Ok, I quit. IMHO, it started out harmless enough - rough in the middle - and a little dark at the end. I've seen worse here, but it was a fair fight - no holds barred. And probably no winners. Peace.
I'll just leave this right here...
Please elaborate.
THIS IS THE "IT" STORY, in my opinion. Hang onto your hats, Americans.....
_____________
Here's your best witness for the criminal indictments against Israel for BEATINGS and TORTURE, state action, to obtain false testimony....
American Paul Larudee, 64 years old
__________________
"When on land, Larudee was taken to the processing area, but refused to cooperate with authorities, who wanted him to say that he entered the country illegally. "This happened at 18 miles at sea, which is well beyond their own territorial waters, or anyone's territorial waters," he said. "We were in international waters. We weren't violating anyone's sovereignty or breaking any rules that we knew of, even by their standards."
More beating ensued. Larudee, who again let his body go limp, said he was carried by nylon restraints, which were placed on his arms and legs. They cut into his skin, causing more contusions and deep pain. He was carried into an ambulance and taken to a hospital, but wasn't treated. He said he believes he was taken there because the Israeli soldiers didn't want the media to see his black eye, pronated joints, bruised jaw and body contusions."
WOW. You've got to be kidding me. Are we learning about the real nature of this country?
Wait. It DOESN'T END THERE? NO.....
"On the third day, the captain of Larudee's boat, a Greek national who was sharing the same prison cell, met with the representative from his embassy. The Greek embassy official helped arrange for Laurudee to leave Israel for Greece. After arriving at the airport for his flight, Larudee was told that Israeli authorities wouldn't permit him to go directly to Athens. Instead, they insisted that he fly first to Istanbul, then sign a release. Larudee refused to cooperate and was once again subjected to a beating by Israeli soldiers.
"But this time they did it in front of 30 to 40 other prisoners, who had seen similar things," he said. "They went nuts."
An all-out brawl began and some prisoners were badly beaten, Larudee said."
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What's even worse for Israel, is this guy has a face ready for prime time TV.
http://www.salon.com/news/israel_flotilla_attack/index.html?story=/news/feature/2010/06/03/paul_larudee_flotilla_account
+1
He's been there before (2008).
...16.07.08) The Peter B. Collins Show. Among the guests is Dr. Paul Larudee from the Free Gaza Movement who talks about the Free Gaza boat trip from Cyprus to Gaza in August. Larudee is a former Ford Foundation supervisor in Lebanon, a Fulbright-Hays lecturer to Lebanon, and a former contracted US government advisor to Saudi Arabia. He participates in Palestinian nonviolent resistance with the International Solidarity Movement....
http://www.freegaza.org/en/home/56-news/306-paul-larudee-on-peter-b-coll...
Game Over. An american citizen tortured by Israeli soldiers. And he is ready to tell the world everything. Live on TV.
Game over for Israel.
Here is another Paul Larudee article from 2006
http://www.israellycool.com/2006/06/06/the-loathsome-paul-larudee/
Now, if there's an American out there who can abide by this, no matter what your political persuasion, first, you've probably never left the country and second, I don't wanna know you.
Jews have fought the same people throughout the span of history..lost some, won many.
Today western supporters of arabic tribes are deranged useful idiots- (multiple examples posted on this thread)
Israel should have disabled every ship that crossed the embargo line..but world Image seems to rule over legitimate military use of force..extend and pretend as applied to Conflict.
the problem with gaza is that it is a small historical city state. its not a viable country and cannot be part of a muslim palestine because it is not contiguous with the west bank. if israel does not blockade it hamas and iran will go full tilt at their stated desire to genocide the jewish people. if israel does blockade it they get labeled as the oppressors. Its no win for israel. nobody is starving in gaza, anyway. I know a guy from school with family there and he says the place is soaking in aid already. these blockade runners are using aid as a prop; they are just trying to get the blockade ended. israel is the objective, not giving aid. personally I would like to see egypt annex gaza. then your so called palestinean problem just dissapears. sure, egypt is a brutal muslim state that genocides the copts but at least they are not hammas. it would be better for everybody than keeping up this charade that there is this thing called a palestinean people. read mark twain's book inncocents abroad; there is a very detailed account of palestine in the early 19th century and guess what, there were very few muslims there.
shocking video of starving gazans
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FCRJrdCowMc
thanks obama for 400 million dollars more aid just last week