We Cannot Separate Economics and Politics. And Those Who Speak Out Against Bad Policy Are Helping the Economy ... And Our Individual Investments

→ Washington’s Blog

Some people criticize the injection of politics into economic discussions.

But economic historians tell us that economists used to
understand and accept that economics is wholly interrelated with
politics, and that politics affects our economy. They note that modern
economists have artificially tried to somehow separate the two, like
Descartes tried to separate the mind from the body.

Indeed, the father of modern economics - Adam Smith - talked a lot about politics in relation to economics.

If
mainstream ("neoclassical") economists think that politics is an
irrelevant and separate topic, it may be because they are using wholly discredited models or that "it is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends upon his not understanding it."

In the real world, political decisions
determine who gets bailed out and who doesn't, who stays afloat and
who goes under, who gets rewarded and who gets prosecuted (and if
prosecuted, who gets hit hard and who gets off with a slap on the wrist
... or a slap on the back). As such, it should be obvious that we
cannot discuss our economy or even investing decisions without
addressing politics.

Another example of the intersection of politics and the economy is
military policy. America's military policy is directly connected with
the economy, and is indirectly connected with our individual
investments.

Specifically:

1. War is bad for the economy. The multi-trillion dollar price tag for the wars in Iraq and elsewhere are bankrupting our country. Moreover, war always causes inflation, and thus decreases the value of our money.
2. We were lied into war
3. The lies are continuing
4. The state of emergency we've been living under for the past 10 years has interfered with the free markets.  Political decisions
   determine who gets bailed out and who doesn't, who stays afloat and who
   goes under, who gets rewarded and who gets prosecuted (and if
   prosecuted, who gets hit hard and who gets off with a slap on the wrist
   ... or a slap on the back)
5. It is much harder to make investment decisions when we are not in a free market
6. Therefore, if enough of us speak out against the ongoing lies,
   we may have some chance of helping the economy and reinstating some
   semblance of a free market ... which would help increase the value of
   our money, and make investing simpler

As I noted last November, the lack of trust by the American people in the government's military decisions is harming the economy:

Trust in Government is Necessary for a Stable Economy

A 2005 letter in premier scientific journal Nature reviewed the research on trust and economics:

Trust ... plays a key role in economic exchange and politics. In the absence of trust among trading partners, market transactions break down.
In the absence of trust in a country's institutions and leaders,
political legitimacy breaks down. Much recent evidence indicates that
trust contributes to economic, political and social success.

Forbes wrote
an article in 2006 entitled "The Economics of Trust". The article
summarizes the importance of trust in creating a healthy economy:

Imagine
going to the corner store to buy a carton of milk, only to find that
the refrigerator is locked. When you've persuaded the shopkeeper to
retrieve the milk, you then end up arguing over whether you're going to
hand the money over first, or whether he is going to hand over the
milk. Finally you manage to arrange an elaborate simultaneous exchange.
A little taste of life in a world without trust--now imagine trying
to arrange a mortgage.

Being able to trust people might seem
like a pleasant luxury, but economists are starting to believe that
it's rather more important than that. Trust is about more than whether
you can leave your house unlocked; it is responsible for the
difference between the richest countries and the poorest.

"If
you take a broad enough definition of trust, then it would explain
basically all the difference between the per capita income of the
United States and Somalia," ventures Steve Knack, a senior economist
at the World Bank who has been studying the economics of trust for
over a decade. That suggests that trust is worth $12.4 trillion
dollars a year to the U.S., which, in case you are wondering, is 99.5%
of this country's income. ***

Above all, trust enables people to do business with each other. Doing business is what creates wealth. ***

Economists
distinguish between the personal, informal trust that comes from
being friendly with your neighbors and the impersonal,
institutionalized trust that lets you give your credit card number out
over the Internet.

Similarly, market psychologists Richard L. Peterson M.D. and Frank Murtha, PhD noted:

Trust is the oil in the engine of capitalism, without it, the engine seizes up.

Confidence is like the gasoline, without it the machine won't move.

Trust
is gone: there is no longer trust between counterparties in the
financial system. Furthermore, confidence is at a low. Investors have
lost their confidence in the ability of shares to provide decent returns
(since they haven't).

Two professors of finance pointed out:

The
drop in trust, we believe, is a major factor behind the deteriorating
economic conditions. To demonstrate its importance, we launched the
Chicago Booth/Kellogg School Financial Trust Index. Our first set of
data—based on interviews conducted at the end of December 2008—shows
that between September and December, 52 percent of Americans lost trust
in the banks. Similarly, 65 percent lost trust in the stock market. A
BBB/Gallup poll that surveyed a similar sample of Americans last April
confirms this dramatic drop. At that time, 42 percent of Americans
trusted financial institutions, versus 34 percent in our survey today,
while 53 percent said they trusted U.S. companies, versus just 12
percent today.

As trust declines, so does Americans’ willingness
to invest their money in the financial system. Our data show that
trust in the stock market affects people’s intention to buy stocks,
even after accounting for expectations of future stock-market
performance. Similarly, a person’s trust in banks predicts the
likelihood that he will make a run on his bank in a moment of crisis:
25 percent of those who don’t trust banks withdrew their deposits and
stored them as cash last fall, compared with only 3 percent of those
who said they still trusted the banks. Thus, trust in financial
institutions is a key factor for the smooth functioning of capital
markets and, by extension, the economy. Changes in trust matter.

They quote a Nobel laureate economist on the subject:

“Virtually
every commercial transaction has within itself an element of trust,”
writes economist Kenneth Arrow, a Nobel laureate. When we deposit
money in a bank, we trust that it’s safe. When a company orders goods,
it trusts its counterpart to deliver them in good faith. Trust
facilitates transactions because it saves the costs of monitoring and
screening; it is an essential lubricant that greases the wheels of the
economic system.

And a distinguished international group
of economists (Giancarlo Corsetti, Michael P. Devereux, Luigi Guiso,
John Hassler, Gilles Saint-Paul, Hans-Werner Sinn, Jan-Egbert Sturm
and Xavier Vives) wrote:

Public distrust of bankers and financial markets has risen dramatically with the financial crisis. This column argues that this loss
of trust in the financial system played a critical role in the
collapse of economic activity that followed. To undo the damage,
financial regulation needs to focus on restoring that trust.

They noted:

Trust
is crucial in many transactions and certainly in those involving
financial exchanges. The massive drop in trust associated with this
crisis will therefore have important implications for the future of
financial markets. Data show that in the late 1970s, the percentage of
people who reported having full trust in banks, brokers, mutual funds
or the stock market was around 40%; it had sunk to around 30% just
before the crisis hit, and collapsed to barely 5% afterwards. It is
now even lower than the trust people have in other people (randomly
selected of course).

Time Magazine pointed out:

Traditionally, gold has been a store of value when citizens do not trust their government politically or economically.

In other words, the government's political actions affect investments, such as gold, and thus the broader economy.

Trust Is At An All-Time Low

Unfortunately, the public's trust in government as a whole (and see this and this), the justice system, bankers, and the corporate media are at all-time lows.

Why?

Partly because the government has been repeatedly caught lying.

The
government repeatedly said about the subprime crisis, banking crisis,
debt crisis, mortgage crisis, and other economic crises:

• "It's contained"

• "We've got it under control"

and

• "We're going to fix it"

It wasn't, and they didn't ... and so people have lost trust in the government.

But it's not just the economy. The government also got caught making false claims that:

• Iraq had weapons of mass destruction, had a hand in 9/11 (and see this) and carried out the the anthrax attacks

• 9/11 wasn't foreseeable

• That the government doesn't spy on Americans (it did even before 9/11), Americans don't torture, etc.

It
is basic human nature that - if you catch someone lying about one
topic - you will tend to doubt the truth of what he is saying in other areas as well.

So
Americans' loss of trust in the government's political actions have
also undermined their trust in the government's statements and actions
in the economic field.

But there's another important reason for
Americans' lack of trust in our government and our economy: the failure
to prosecute the criminals.

Prosecuting the Criminals and Launching REAL Investigations Is Necessary to Restore Trust

One of the leading business schools in America - the Wharton School of Business - has written an essay
on the psychological causes and solutions to the economic crisis.
Wharton points out that restoring trust is the key to recovery, and that
trust cannot be restored until wrongdoers are held accountable:

According to David M. Sachs, a training and supervision analyst at the Psychoanalytic Center of Philadelphia, the
crisis today is not one of confidence, but one of trust. "Abusive
financial practices were unchecked by personal moral controls that
prohibit individual criminal behavior, as in the case of [Bernard]
Madoff, and by complex financial manipulations, as in the case of AIG."
The public, expecting to be protected from such abuse, has suffered a
trauma of loss similar to that after 9/11.
"Normal expectations of what is safe and dependable were abruptly
shattered," Sachs noted. "As is typical of post-traumatic states,
planning for the future could not be based on old assumptions about
what is safe and what is dangerous. A radical reversal of how to be
gratified occurred."

People
now feel more gratified saving money than spending it, Sachs suggested.
They have trouble trusting promises from the government because they
feel the government has let them down.

He framed his argument
with a fictional patient named Betty Q. Public, a librarian with two
teenage children and a husband, John, who had recently lost his job.
"She felt betrayed because she and her husband had invested
conservatively and were double-crossed by dishonest, greedy businessmen,
and now she distrusted the government that had failed to protect them
from corporate dishonesty. Not only that, but she had little trust in
things turning around soon enough to enable her and her husband to
accomplish their previous goals.

"By no means a sophisticated
economist, she knew ... that some people had become fantastically
wealthy by misusing other people's money -- hers included," Sachs said.
"In short, John and Betty had done everything right and were being
punished, while the dishonest people were going unpunished."

Helping
an individual recover from a traumatic experience provides a useful
analogy for understanding how to help the economy recover from its own
traumatic experience, Sachs pointed out. The public will need to "hold the perpetrators of the economic disaster responsible and take what actions they can to prevent them from harming the economy again." In addition, the public will have to see proof that government and business leaders can behave responsibly before they will trust them again, he argued.

Note that Sachs urges "hold[ing] the perpetrators of the economic disaster responsible." In other words, just "looking forward" and promising to do things differently isn't enough.

Economists such as William Black and James Galbraith and Nobel prize winning economists Joseph Stiglitz and George Akerlof agree.

Indeed, polls show that:

• Americans want investigations into torture and wireless wiretapping

• Most Americans believe that the Iraq war was a mistake. At least half of all Americans wanted Congress to impeach President Bush if he lied about the Iraq war

• Hundreds of millions of Americans think that there was a cover up about 9/11, and want a thorough investigation

• Americans want those who committed financial fraud to be prosecuted

Remember, distrust in the political actions of government officials undermines the economy as
well. Therefore, the economy will not recover until the economic
criminals are prosecuted, and there are real investigations into 9/11
(even the 9/11 Commissioners themselves think there should be more
investigation: see this and this), the Iraq war, torture, spying on Americans and other government failures.

So
people who criticize the government's lies, and call for the
prosecutions of those who made the misstatements, are actually working
towards stabilizing our economy, and making our investment decisions a little easier.

Comments

[nmewn]

Take care out there...seeya round the next bend.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KUwjNBjqR-c

[Miles Kendig]

Before this slips by the moment...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0pejkQMNxdg

As your wife knows all to well, we interveine for the me & we.  For without a dynamic micro there can be no macro, dynamic or otherwise.   Just as intervening in the macro is essential for the me & we.  For without a dynamic macro there cannot be genuine, self sustaining micro activity, beyond anarchy.  The crux of interdependency.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E9g9IkQ6_2A

See ya then, my brotha nmewn, as we all consider ourselves among the fortunate.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gb_OL1q3Dkg

[nmewn]

You are a man of many interests, friend Miles.

"The question remains; Is if it's entirely possible for self enforcement to be effective?  So far it doesn't looking promising."

No it is not looking promising (the anarchist way). I would hazard a guess that fully half would go batshit crazy, settling old scores, indulging their innermost base desires, all the while saying to themselves...just this once, then I'll stop...but it's self perpetuating...they will now have to defend their actions against those they wronged...now they have a score to settle, their own desire to fulfill.

"I suppose this could be called one mans answer to how does one define loyalty to competing institutions.  Without the rule of law there can be no rule."

That's a fact.

I've lived on both sides of this...the law...with varying degrees of success...LOL. I've come to the notion that living outside it forever (I was a lot younger) you can develop too many enemies to combat alone and there will always be someone more cunning or bigger or badder or more crazy than yourself...always. Or you could just be off your game for a day...not much upside, especially when you claw yousellf to the top.

The Libertine...great flick.

Watched it on cable a few months back...my take on it was unbridled liberty can lead to debauchery that will have a price that must be paid...I empathized with Wilmott in many ways on a personal level...while I could never bring myself to intervene with someone who chose that path...I was fortunate my girlfriend (now my wife) intervened with me.

Love is also a powerful motivational force...I have no idea what this has to do with movies or law but there it is...LOL.

"Mark Twain is noted for his ability to understand and employ the power of voice.  Combine that with the Bedouin observation regarding camels & tents and you’ll get some real dynamic intellectual alchemy almost every time."

Mark Twain was very good at what he did, so is a camel, both worth their weight in gold when needed.

Richard Pryor...oh man...tiny feets...I almost pissed my pants the first time I heard that bit.

Posner & Baseline...yeah, Gutenberg's press was supposed to enlighten, not hide knowledge & wisdom. But if it's annotated, it can be found?

Yes, professions...all professions enjoy showing off to one another, glasses hanging on the bridge of the nose, volumes of paper thrown in their wake, trying to set up their own pecking order amongst each other, I don't think it's done out of malice, but can appear so to the layman who they derive their income from...a valid point on obscuring what should not be obscure, to be sure.

So does the Miles Kendig come from Hopscotch?...just curious.

[Miles Kendig]

Yes, it is.

Love has a sort of power, true life partnership & the mutual appreciated appreciation that goes with it combine to create  a nearly impregnable, unstoppable force.  I suspect you have found the foundations of both.  If so then you are most fortunate indeed.  (I'm still holding out for Isobel to finally find me, perhaps reviewing a wine list.  Most definitely NOT at Citi looking for a pen)  A Valentines salute to you both.  Regardless of the power aspects, all love is simply beautiful for those caught up within it.

Upon reflection, beyond the score settling, bloodletting and nike responses is a simple fact.  Much of the premise of civilization is built upon the concept that to whom much is accumulated much is expected.  These expectations are not simply limited to amassing, but also encompass stewardship.  This aspect of stewardship cannot be outsourced to the sovereign, but is essential to a sovereign remaining so.  As one who can be considered a member of some of these circles (due to old ties, rebel ties and not my pocketbook) it is simply tragic beyond expression how that process has been subverted for an AMEX black and the power to enjoy lunch as one pleases rather than simply enjoying little league, perhaps sponsoring a team and running an occasional cook out, at home.

A hui kakou malama pono

[nmewn]

"(I'm still holding out for Isobel to finally find me, perhaps reviewing a wine list.  Most definitely NOT at Citi looking for a pen)"

Sometimes the most cherished things are found in places you would never expect...perhaps in places you are not prone to frequent...she's out there, be yourself, she'll find you.

Your last paragraph is spot on..."For everyone to whom much is given, of him shall much be required."

All we can do is our best everyday on these nets, through the passing of knowledge, laughter and comradery...in our real world outside is where we will see the affect.

"A hui kakou malama pono"

Until then my friend Miles.

[Miles Kendig]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eY3gnwg7I8I

Pax

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4s0nzsU1Wg

Country don't mean dumb - Stuart Redman

And you are sooo right when you address the mergence of the digital & IRL landscapes.  Catch as catch can and here is to timely observation and proper consideration as the hunt teaches its inexorable lessons to those that care to pick them up.

A toast, to remaining true to the self, and what each of us represent, in total. The real genesis of respect and mutual appreciated appreciation that are the foundations of human exploration.  Cross cultural or otherwise.

Until then, old friend.

I got a smack in the eye and took refuge in sport.  And what a sport.  Egad!  No wonder I gave up fox hunting these past few winters to hunt other game  //  Nothing is so bad as something which is not so bad - The Scarlet Pimpernel [Remix]

[nmewn]

"Country don't mean dumb - Stuart Redman"

No, it "don't" ;-)

I have met many (and I'm sure you have too) that even though they can't articulate what they perceive, they know intuitively what it is...and all would be wise to perceive what they don't articulate...I speak of all nationalities & races of "country folk" here.

One of the things that drew me to ZH was the search for honesty & justice...the hunt we all share. Reading the articles and comments I knew I would find like minded people who still believed in the basic goodness of humanity, from all walks of life. I've found many disillusioned, who I try to cheer. I've found many who are angry, who I try to calm. I have found overflowing insight & knowledge and can only offer my half full cup in return as it is all I have.

"A toast, to remaining true to the self, and what each of us represent, in total."

I lift my glass to you, in mutual respect and admiration for the things you have done and what you will do in the future, I am proud to call you my friend.

Take care Miles.

[Miles Kendig]

Thank you.  It is a great pleasure to be considered such by you while I know you fully appreciate that the respect, admiration, confidence & friendship is likewise returned in full.  There are few things better in human interaction than mutual appreciated appreciation borne from dynamic alchemy over time.

I am still amazed at how diverse the range of brilliant observation is here at ZH, from the absurdly dynamic to dynamically absurd.  This thing called fight club is simply stupendous and this turn down thread brings this fact into sharp relief once more.  I am honored to have had this opportunity.  A real & rare pleasure indeed as another bit of maturation is realized.  If this is half full then .. wow.

Best as always to you & yours

And just 'cause, gotta give the h/t to a long running foundational simmer

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CPAR2zSV84I

[nmewn]

The range of knowledge & experience on ZH is unsurpassed. I think Tyler is doing a great service...the free exchange of information, ideas, thought, opinion is what we as a nation are at it's core IMHO.

As ZH is international (web based) we get all kinds of info, opinion flowing through here...some can be discarded outright by me as illogic or non-factual on it's face...others make me pause, re-consider or test what I "think" I know in the crucible that is the ZH comment section. 

That's where the "old souls" have a place to step in and speak...just truth, that is all that's required...well, sometimes I get...animated ;-)  

Be well...and as they say in my neck of the woods...keep it tween the ditches & in yo britches...LOL.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_BjiRKBC05c

[Miles Kendig]

Before I dash off .. Thinking on your old souls and animated observation a bit I am reminded that often there are reasons beyond the immediately observable horizon for things working like they do in human affairs.  Yes, there is some hugely dynamic action going on around here.  However, this is fight club for a reason as well and sometimes we do what we do regardless of the potential short, medium or long term consequences.  Call it dna, predisposition, operative circumstances or whatever.  The real deal is that proper responding, investigation, enforcement, mediation and/or adjudication usually lead to conclusions that serve the best interests of society and those involved.  The backwards, forwards & spinnin' aspects understood for what they are.

Cheers!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7k8Qs4A9Z3I

[nmewn]

"The real deal is that proper responding, investigation, enforcement, mediation and/or adjudication usually lead to conclusions that serve the best interests of society and those involved.  The backwards, forwards & spinnin' aspects understood for what they are."

Indeed.

Perhaps it's just me but I note a general lack of historical wisdom in the younger posters & many of the older ones. As if nothing has transpired over the course of human history that does not correlate with what we encounter in the here & now, the present. It's as if these events we discuss popped up out of the ether over night with no connection whatsoever to the past.

Maybe I'm a masochist or a dreamer to think what I bring to fight club can change anything or give anyone else pause to reflect on themselves and their impact on society via their thoughts and deeds.

Besides, a little metaphorical bloodletting never hurt anyone ;-)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5gHiR1xeOSs

[Miles Kendig]

Oh ya, enjoy a bit of reflection on the concepts of shit just popping up without historical context and what it means to practice vs coming to play.  Like Jimmy says; "You can't bull shit the audience, you can try, but sooner or later ya gotta play".  Plus a nice expression of what expression is in the real of the moment

Cheers to it

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LmXxtsT2_QI

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hw3oAL64wXE

[nmewn]

"Oh ya, enjoy a bit of reflection on the concepts of shit just popping up without historical context and what it means to practice vs coming to play.  Like Jimmy says; "You can't bull shit the audience, you can try, but sooner or later ya gotta play".

LOL...dats a fact.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BIvka3SSv9Y

[Miles Kendig]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rUQT4hykPd0

Cheers to being able to discern the nugs from the chaff and in using the tools.

Friggin' awesome when recess drives production.  Especially in those that detest recess

Take care.  I'm out

[Miles Kendig]

Besides, a little metaphorical bloodletting never hurt anyone ;-)

Indeed.  Cat..meet..yarn......Again....:D 

As we two have rounded the discussion from spinning the forward way back and ourselves while we appreciate how we spend our time, and respect (that mutual appreciated appreciation and the wisdom that is borne from it) the time spent by others before us (and right back to representing, in total).  As it is capitalism in the pure that emerges from all of this, without central planing even, that seems to feed this Sunday in a weekday world action that is so irresistible from whichever perspective we view it. 

The kicker now is that the ability to identify, nurture, produce, gather, trade, appreciate & recycle these bits of wisdom has been truly democratized through the advent and continuing maturation of the digital landscape and how we chose to being that forth into the IRL world (and vis a vis).  Again, wholly different potentiality is now metastasizing this cross pollination effect within human endeavour encompassing these various elements (and may provide a better clue of what led me to finance to begin with ;). 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E9g9IkQ6_2A

Back to the development of processes to not only discover these nugs, but to understand more about them through both active & passive observation and/or engagement.  As we appreciate, both influence systems, however miniscule the initial expenditure of the energies of time and appreciation.  Potential & kinetic, its all energy pal as what is really starting to blow my mind is how that flap of a set of wings really does provide the catalyst to that hurricane sometime later. 

Thank you for bringing Layne into this convo.  I was more right in some of my adolescent ramblings than I appreciated.  Back to the road to and from Paper Street

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l9jX1KAKp78

With ageing comes an appreciation that paper may have been a typo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SSd0pJSKzNY

Have a terrific weekend livin' it in the real my friend nmewn and we'll catch as catch can

[Miles Kendig]

Animated, like a junk or two just lets ya know you, or another is getting rubbed the right way as the process of peeling and regrowth is, or should be, a never ending part of our human experience.

Take care, and yes, I'll continue to keep that deflection rod right next to my divining one  ;)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vyqgjCKm9nQ

And a big h/t to Tyler.  This whole process and its supporting structure are a pure stroke of brilliance

[Miles Kendig]

.

[Miles Kendig]

My impression is that the one with the biggest gun usually sets the legal, economic & political policy agenda (prints the book).  Which also helps to explain why the big gun is always the last to know of the biggest impending changes and why "fairness" has little to do with it once lawful plunder becomes the rule of the day to meet the needs of predation. 

I am just beginning to get schooled in the texture of options, commodities and what I call the cross pollination effects in our markets & society.  Hella dynamic.  Like you, I am attempting to get a drift of valuation absent the implications of fiat.  I am a ways away from being on solid enough footing to deeply engage as of yet.

As to fiat, there is a reason folks like Krugman, Koo & Mishkin say principal doesn't matter with sovereign debt.  It enables them to pretend they can print without consequence.  My view is that there are always limits, conditions & consequences, realized or not.  To bad those hoes are real false advertisers as their game sooooo changes from courtship to partnership .....  Must be why they like getting used like this by the big gun

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2bPQAWZFZlM

Until I see you again old friend .. time to swing with Ginger.  Pax

[nmewn]

Thanks for the point to down here...Ginger and I are sharing one eye now ;-)

"My impression is that the one with the biggest gun usually sets the legal, economic & political policy agenda (prints the book).  Which also helps to explain why the big gun is always the last to know of the biggest impending changes and why "fairness" has little to do with it once lawful plunder becomes the rule of the day to meet the needs of predation."

It's no impression, it's reality. And they are always the last to figure it out because they are so disconnected from the reality of their decisions.

"Like you, I am attempting to get a drift of valuation absent the implications of fiat."

Always willing to learn myself. Time is always an issue with me however...evenings are about all the free time I have to catch up on events, learn & entertainment...and squire nmewn begins baseball soon, so the evenings will be gone as well...priority will always be family with me. Whatever I can pick up outside of that is all I could add to your search...but as I come across I will share.

"As to fiat, there is a reason folks like Krugman, Koo & Mishkin say principal doesn't matter with sovereign debt.  It enables them to pretend they can print without consequence.  My view is that there are always limits, conditions & consequences, realized or not."

Every action has a consequence...pride, ego, jealousy,envy will cloud judgement in even the best of men...the weaker ones like you describe here, begin to think of themselves as something other than mortal...often a rueful miscalculation.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9mcDkmxA548&feature=related

SeeYa my brother.

[Miles Kendig]

 ended up thinking the only eye that was working was the one staring out at me from that Wild Turkey sitting on the shelf.

I hear you on time.  Been there, done that, got the t-shirt.  Amazed at what its like from the inside of a situation where my time is all my own after a professional life that always imposed itself upon family dynamics.  Priorities speak with great clarity as time, and how we chose to spend it is an unalterable window into each of us...  Little league, like sleep overs, pup n park, boys or spending a quality hour or two at Ulta. 

I have rarely looked at law as a driver of fairness, but of continuity, and the stability that should be derived from that.  The foundation of legal precedent in judicial systems and how the struggle to prevent lawful plunder is both supported and undermined by this process. 

Meanwhile have a twofer, with my compliments.  See yaz when I see yaz.  As ya can.  This is pure gravy

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BNDXh7bbqlk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L03yjo9ArrM

Pax homeslice and yes, Ginger makes a terrific wing gal pal

[nmewn]

"ended up thinking the only eye that was working was the one staring out at me from that Wild Turkey sitting on the shelf."

Heh...drinking beer tonight...I'm a professional, I don't attend the meetings ;-)

Speaking of professions...yes, it is time consuming. I consider it another thing we are robbed of.

It was not enough for the father to remove himself from the home for extended periods of time in order to provide for a stable, comfortable home and enviroment to raise a family...no, it is now required that the mother work outside the home, leaving the children to be raised by "others"...strangers.

I can't tell you how often I have had to correct (read re-educate) mine when we are all together.

Even simple things like going out to lunch today and picking up some furniture are enjoyable because we are separated so often.

"I have rarely looked at law as a driver of fairness, but of continuity, and the stability that should be derived from that.  The foundation of legal precedent in judicial systems and how the struggle to prevent lawful plunder is both supported and undermined by this process."

The stories I could tell Miles...volumes.

It is better than having bodies hanging from tree's everywhere but sometimes to the casual observer, it doesn't seem to be much better.

It is set up to make it extremely difficult to prosecute successfully at trial...long run this is a good thing in my estimation...now if we could just a few more charges filed for obvious malfeasance/fiduciary complaints. I think this is the issue right now...the lack of enforcement not necessarily the law itself...it's there, just no charges are brought...and we know why.

They would burn as if trying to stand on Marbles & Lava...Santana ;-)

http://www.metacafe.com/watch/yt-P_tgfWBHdig/carlos_santana_buddy_miles_live_marbles_lava/

Take care.

[Miles Kendig]

greed it's mostly an enforcement issue (with a fair helping of knowledge base).  An issue that will only compound with the crimp forthcoming to federal, state & local budgets.  We are rapidly approaching the point when vast portions of society will conclude there is no justice as the words of Justice Brandeis echo down through time.  In this I have observed that the professions of law & finance are entering their very own My Lai moment as society loses so much respect for these institutions that its members are spat upon by the society they are part of and serve.  As you note, the distinction between enforcement and adjudication within the broad frame of justice is lost on those who don't know the difference.  In this I suspect that the profession of law will have to clean its own house just as the Army had to. 

I hear you loud & clear on the dynamics of family life.  There has been a conscious decision that necessary productivity gains to maintain competitiveness required the integration of women into the work force.  I am sure the long running imbalances in renumeration were not absent during these considerations as were the realities that parents were being removed from the process of parenting as much as possible without the benefits of a more structured system like the UK's.  This is a subject that transcends nearly all demos, from prison/ghetto life to the highest reaches of society.  Most especially the hard professions.  Like you I am enthused to spend time with my kids and am thankful for every moment I enjoy parenting.

Yes, it's a Harp kinda night.  Like ale.  Thanks for the considered convo, great tune and more.

BAA

Speaking of marbles, lava and self enforcement .. Enjoy a timely laugh and I'll be seeing ya.  Take care

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yg300Xbc0AE

See ya at the beer store, hope there aren't many misunderstandings ...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jOgLc15x9fw

[nmewn]

"In this I have observed that the professions of law & finance are entering their very own My Lai moment as society loses so much respect for these institutions that its members are spat upon by the society they are part of and serve."

I think so too.

Maybe I try too hard to reinforce the concept that there is a chance to avoid the collapse of law and along with it, order...that get's real messy, that's why I can never be a true anarchist. All the stuff about going Galt would never be my way at the societal level. Finance, yes, absolutely. They have a very short window of "skimmig opportunity" on over night salary deposits then it's gone into the ether ;-)

On the financial "industry", as it's completely infiltrated by the I-banks, a return to Glass-Steagall would do much to restrain these nutcases again. This would have to happen in the arena of politics which is captured by Wall Street & others.

Whores & pimps...and interchangable on that wording.

I have long held that most of what is wrong with the country itself emanates from the NE part of the country as you will see below. My bias perhaps and there are good people there like Ned who live there, but folks like him are few and far between.

Am I judgemental?...yes. We make judgement's everyday...down to what we will wear and where we will eat. I find no contradictions in it.

Jerry Clower...LOL...there's one I have'nt heard in awhile...and no, there are no misunderstandings between you and I or my Southern heritage...I'm quite proud of it actually and use the bumpkin rube angle to my advantage whenever possible...it put's the feckless elitist snobs who troll through here at a disadvantage in my estimation...I have fun with it...because if it all goes to shit tomorrow they will need people like us, we, of course, would not need people like them ;-)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5NbTpssTGRI

Take care.

[nmewn]

LOL...nice mixing of metaphors.

You gave me quite a bit to chew on with your last.

I can honestly say I have nothing much to add to your interpretation of the subornation of law...natural or otherwise, as all law flows from the concept of equality. The reason no one has gone to jail is because everything was done by "the book" as it is now written...fairness is not written anywhere in it, it seems.

On this point;

"Now, you'll get little from me in the way of argument (tons of discourse tho) regarding further examination of what are genuine (hard) assets vs what is simply an expression of a notional asset premised upon the considered capacity of this notional item to carry debt."

We agree, without sound money it is impossible for the average joe to truly save & create his own wealth. Faith has been crushed, so it seems unworkable. My practice is to trade silver for gold around this ratio, low 40's to 1. Do you have a preferred measure of value? 

I ask because I don't follow the option "bull ring" and only trade outside of stepping in to remove a scalp here & there in stocks...there is little discussion of when to "swap" and I don't see governments the world over giving up their love of fiat backed by nothing but hope/faith & air.

Any opinions here would be appreciated, if any.

"...which I view as an important contributing factor in fostering and enabling its creators and gamers the freedom of maneuver enjoyed thus far."

It's always nice to know you have a limitless supply...which of course, is what Glass-Steagall was all about...removing commercial banking from the protection of the "one" with the biggest gun.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vabnZ9-ex7o

Until your next...

[Miles Kendig]

While I decide between the baked goose or Alaska .. and consider the wine menu with your value observations in mind .. I think I'll have dessert first while I consider, life is uncertain, old friend.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VL4HSCwk1fg

[nmewn]

I was wondering if that was going to double post...my first!...LOL...I'm no longer a virgin and with no edit feature (protection), I'm a new dad ;-)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KUwjNBjqR-c

[Miles Kendig]

;) 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-uzIUOY4E0g

And so ya know, I am a worse trader than Jim Rogers, so I stick to macro & micro textural forecasting.  My value assessments most always run on a different axis than one employed by pure traders. 

Value seems to be tied, closely, to two other neat concepts.  Those being wants & needs and how we assess this concept of "value" to them. 

PS  The time stamp will be of great assistance in determining if I am in an editing kinda mood.  If you would prefer we can continue this via anon mail.  I can be reached via my twitter avi at gmail

Look down thread for my follow up

[nmewn]

"Thank goodness this isn't Craigs List eh?"

LOL...no doubt.

That was interesting (7 & 5)...pleasant.

I'm mostly a macro...it's gotten so completely stupid.

If you just watch the biggest losers on a weekly basis you can take your pick of the litter...the HFT models will do it all for you.

Let's try an experiment...let's watch NOK Monday (got creamed today) if it falls another .50 or so and planes out I would say (hypothetically) buy it...set your stops (again, hypo) at your risk level. I believe they will dry hump this thing back to 10.20 easy.

Don't hate on me if I sometimes take advantage of what I see as a risk/reward proposition playing their stupid game...I think I get more enjoyment out of the risk than the reward because I really don't need the money.

A sickness?...or seeking something?...hard to say, been mulling this thought for awhile...ten years now ;-)

Anyways...I thourghly enjoyed this Miles...the Jameson is kickin in pretty hard here.

Seems many of us are tied to the whipping post.

SeeYa

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OLIX4oNE1qI

[Miles Kendig]

Here's to NOK NUK Monday's  :)  Cheers

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CIaHrU8Hetk

[nmewn]

;-)

[Miles Kendig]

A tremendous contribution to human civilization from the rollin' raver community ;)

And yes, risk/reward.  We both seem to have a marvelously shared perspective on situation and how it impacts our quest for fun, travel & adventure.  Both funny & not so about how it's all not just an adventure, but a job, regardless of the requirements of predation.  Please head slap me if I'm off base here, but it seems we pursue these things, mostly perhaps, from a position that the act of catching the game is unnecessary to survival while what we glean from the hunt sure as hell is.

Cheers

[nmewn]

"Please head slap me if I'm off base here, but it seems we pursue these things, mostly perhaps, from a position that the act of catching the game is unnecessary to survival while what we glean from the hunt sure as hell is."

Exactly on point.

It is refreshing to find a kindred spirit who understands as much about himself as he does about what happens around him.

Faults, bias and all...and Lord knows I have those as well...LOL.

[Miles Kendig]

ty and likewise.  I have my brothas & sistas, you among them champ, to thank for their guidance, patience & perseverance with me as I peeled the layers of my onion to get here.  Welcome to the human condition I suppose. I'll pontificate that it's our individual dynamic, faults & all, and how we interact with others (even for those of us that don't generally play well with others) that creates the conditions for dynamic human alchemy in all its guises to form and perpetuate.

Here's to sharing a hearty LOOOL with yaz along with a bit of mutually appreciated appreciation. 

Well placed confidence indeed.

[nmewn]

"Welcome to the human condition I suppose. I'll pontificate that it's our individual dynamic, faults & all, and how we interact with others (even for those of us that don't generally play well with others) that creates the conditions for dynamic human alchemy in all its guises to form and perpetuate."

I have found (what I highlighted in bold above) is a good device to find the true nature of an individual...don't let my secret out ;-)

SeeYa

[Miles Kendig]

:) 

Looks like we use the same Snap-On tool cart on occasion.  I suppose the differing dynamic may be when and how the torque wrench attachment gets employed.  Back to the dynamics of cultural understanding.

And no worries on point on snitching off.  As you so ably point out, folks tend to snitch themselves off far better than anyone else ever could.  The real is in discovering the dynamics of the hunt and in how many of us employ a catch & release strategy, the occasional scalp excepted of course.

Pax

[Miles Kendig]

.

[Miles Kendig]

Sure am ready to spin Ginger  heh

[Shell Game]

Bob, very well said.  Agree, we are going to get what we fully deserve and it's not going to be pretty.

[Freddie]

GW is an Obama shill. ZH is becoming Huff Po with this crap.  William Banzai rocks.

[Hephasteus]

Flag as fucking rediculous.

[Confused]

ZH is becoming Huff Po because of TROLLS like you who spew nonsense. 

[snowball777]

Some other points of rust in trust:

- TARP

- A healthcare bill that pissed of both sides in order to reward the insurance industry

- Citizens United decision

- TSA rubdowns

Great work, GW. We can't drive these points home enough.

[umop episdn]

Why play in the economic sandbox when the big kids can do whatever they want, and what lax supervision remains is focused upon those not financially endowed?

When power has no conscience, and greed has no limit, the killing has no end.

[Cognitive Dissonance]

Some people criticize the injection of politics into economic discussions.

Never question the economic priests nor sully them by implying they might be politically, financially or ideologically motivated. And on your way out of the temple, please place a substantial donation in the IRS box under penalty of death. After all, we have a "voluntary" donation system.

[johnQpublic]

He framed his argument with a fictional patient named Betty Q. Public, a librarian with two teenage children and a husband, John, who had recently lost his job

you said you werent going to use what my wife said....

+1000 for the article

i have certainly lost the meager trust i had in our system

trusting our govt not to spy on us, well that loss is why i have no cell phone anymore

its why i buy PM's

food storage

garden/seeds

guns

disaster cabin

in fact it is a motivating factor in all my decisions these days

i doubt that trust can be restored

[Cleve Meater]

"I doubt trust can be restored..."

Trust CAN'T be restored.  It's the end game... The complete breakdown of a sclerotic, antiquated, rotten system.  It served its purpose but it's outlived its usefulness. It's the way of the universe... Ying and yang; creation and destruction; expansion and contraction.  We're in the yang/destruction/contraction phase.  No sense in bemoaning it, it's simply the birth/life/death cycle on a global scale.  Nothing can be done about it and the patient can't be saved.  You can only prepare for what comes next -- the birth of a new, next "system."

The parallels to the fall of the Roman Empire are legion -- "bread and circuses", expansionist imperial wars, devaluation of the currency, hedonistic/narcissistic political leadership (Berlusconi as the modern Caligula equivalent?)... And the most obvious - coliseum theatrics (e.g. the Stupid Bowl):

Even our enjoyment of this pasttime has now been thoroughly corrupted... Was anyone else here appalled at the spectacle?  I swear to Christ it gets exponentially more wretch-inducing every year. 6 hours or more of unwatchable garbage... A gluttonous and masturbatory spackling all over our national canvas of everything that is unauthentic and unimportant...Crappy music, Hollywood stars, advertising, marketing, patriotism, and sport all intertwined together in some filthy orgiastic marketing frenzy.  Can't we just watch a fucking football game?!?!  

Here's how you know it's over:  When TPTB decide that millions of viewers need a pre-game schooling in the Declaration of Independence from Joe Gibbs on the deck of a warship so we're all reminded how "free" we are, we're fucked six ways to Sunday.

It's the death of a system folks... There's no saving it and trust can't be restored.

[Freddie]

GW hero Obama's was the final nail in America's coffin. Stupid little libs.

[Confused]

TROLL