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In 53-42 Vote, Wisconsin Assembly Gives Final Passage To Bill Stripping Collective Bargaining Rights; Politicians Get Death Threats Over Imminent Austerity
After yesterday the Wisconsin Senate passed the controversial Union Bargaining Bill, using a surprising loophole, resulting in a Union occupation of the Capitol building, the next formality before its enactment has just taken place: the Wisconsin Assembly has just given final passage to the bill, meaning just the signature of Governor Walker is all that is needed at this point, something which will surely happen in the next few hours. And after earlier the Obama administration expressed its disappointment that Wisconsin managed to find this legislative loophole, thereby making the farcical taxpayer funded self-exile of the state democrats all for naught, we are confident the president will be making the teleprompted rounds imminently.
From AP:
Wisconsin lawmakers have voted to strip nearly all collective bargaining rights from the state's public workers in one of the strongest blows to the power of unions in years.
The state's Assembly passed Republican Gov. Scott Walker's explosive proposal 53-42 Thursday. The state's Senate approved it the night before after using a procedural move to bypass its AWOL Democrats.
Walker says he'll sign the legislation as quickly as possible.
The vote brings a swift end to a standoff over union rights that has rocked Wisconsin and the nation. Tens of thousands of protesters have converged on the state's Capitol for weeks of demonstrations.
The implementation of Walker's proposal will be a key victory for Republicans who have targeted unions amid efforts to slash government spending.
In the meantime, as Karl Denningers highlights, social decay is propagating after Wisconsin politicians receive the following death threat:
Please put your things in order because you will be killed and your familes will also be killed due to your actions in the last 8 weeks. Please explain to them that this is because if we get rid of you and your families then it will save the rights of 300,000 people and also be able to close the deficit that you have created. I hope you have a good time in hell. Read below for more information on possible scenarios in which you will die.
WE want to make this perfectly clear. Because of your actions today and in the past couple of weeks I and the group of people that are working with me have decided that we've had enough. We feel that you and the people that support the dictator have to die. We have tried many other ways of dealing with your corruption but you have taken things too far and we will not stand for it any longer. So, this is how it's going to happen: I as well as many others know where you and your family live, it's a matter of public records. We have all planned to assult you by arriving at your house and putting a nice little bullet in your head. However, we decided that we wouldn't leave it there. We also have decided that this may not be enough to send the message to you since you are so "high" on Koch and have decided that you are now going to single handedly make this a dictatorship instead of a demorcratic process. So we have also built several bombs that we have placed in various locations around the areas in which we know that you frequent. This includes, your house, your car, the state capitol, and well I won't tell you all of them because that's just no fun. Since we know that you are not smart enough to figure out why this is happening to you we have decided to make it perfectly clear to you. If you and your goonies feel that it's necessary to strip the rights of 300,000 people and ruin their lives, making them unable to feed, clothe, and provide the necessities to their families and themselves then We Will "get rid of" (in which I mean kill) you. Please understand that this does not include the heroic Rep. Senator that risked everything to go aganist what you and your goonies wanted him to do. We feel that it's worth our lives to do this, because we would be saving the lives of 300,000 people. Please make your peace with God as soon as possible and say goodbye to your loved ones we will not wait any longer. YOU WILL DIE!!!!
Forget Saudi days of rage: you take away some entitlements right here in our own back yard and civil war may soon break out...
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personally I didn't really care for the movie, the Goonies...
Wisconsin's budget is going to be just as F'd as it was before. mark my words...
Maybe so, but sticking it to the unions and government workers is its own reward. A twofer, in fact!
As an added bonus, hopefully there will be a domino effect in other states.
+1 the pols give $$$ to the unions and the unions give $$$ to the pols, rather incestuous!
Ron Paul Warns of "Blood in the Streets" via Monetary Collapse!!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sPQs6ri7Dt0
You ready? It's going to be catastrophic!
I am scared to death!
I am prepared to die for what I believe... defending my honor, my country and my family name!
good f***ing luck! We are all going to need a miracle to beat these guys
i had no idea! except growing up with a father that hated yes, daily hate for:
unions.
fat black woman.
Ya-Hooo! Yippee! Hurray!
Backlash all the fukking way. Well deserved death threats - all because they couldn't shut down the fed and jail some bankstas first!
First things first, coxxukkas!
Kochsukkas
where's billly the bastard and the other fella?
I know the bottom is in for PM's when they show up, I think they work for blythe dubois and come talk to us on their lunch breaks.
You all know about the Comex scam junk right? Well I think we have our own setups. Yeah when these two fucking morons arrive - PM's bounce a hundred.
So back up the bus again my friends.
Did you buy silver to crash JP Morgan? Because I did.
Together we can fight global terrorism!
A bunch of union workers! Think about the death threats (more likely reality) the politicians would have got if they had forced austerity down the banks and MIC's throats.
major victory for the tortured middle-class (of private sectors).
...round one goes to the state.
...betcha it goes the distance tho.
WTAQ.COM News Talk: What You Get With Collective Bargaining | 03.08.11
Strange But True Provisions of Collective Bargaining (in Wisconsin)
Madison—Today Governor Walker’s office released additional examples of how collective bargaining impacts government and how reforming collective bargaining can improve government. The following are some of the items contained in collective bargaining provisions:
Employer must provide bulletin boards to post information about union social and recreational activities. The size and location of the board is subject to collective bargaining. 2. When a local union meets the following conditions are subject to bargaining:
1. lighting,
2. vision care and examinations,
3. noise,
4. chairs,
5. desks,
6. footrests,
7. adjustable terminals and keyboards,
8. work environment design (wall cover, carpet, windows),
9. room temperature,
Starting of vehicles during cold weather is subject to collective bargaining. Paid time off to donate blood.
Earlier today, Governor Walker’s office released some specific examples and new details to show how collective bargaining fiscally impacts government and how reforming collective bargaining can improve government…
A Year’s Worth of Pay for 30 Days of Work
Under the Green Bay School District’s collectively bargained Emeritus Program, teaches can retire and receive a year’s worth of salary for working only 30 days over a three year period... in addition to their already guaranteed pension and health care payouts…
Teachers Receiving Two Pensions
Due to a 1982 provision of their collective bargaining agreement, Milwaukee Public School teachers actually receive two pensions upon retirement instead of one. The contribution to the second pension is equal to 4.2% of a teacher’s salary, with the school district making 100% of the contribution, just like they do for the first pension. This extra benefit costs taxpayers more than $16 million per year…
Almost $10,000 Per Year for Doing Nothing...
In addition to their pension payouts, retired Madison public school teachers receive annual payments of at least $9,884.18 per year for enrolling in the Emeritus Program, which requires ZERO days of work…
No Volunteer Crossing Guards Allowed
A Wausau public employee union filed a grievance to prohibit a local volunteer from serving as a school crossing guard. The 86-year-old lives just two blocks away and serves everyday free of charge…
$6,000 Extra for Carrying a Pager
Some state employees, due to the nature of their positions, are required to carry pagers during off-duty hours in order to respond to emergency situations. Due to the collective bargaining agreements, these employees are compensated an extra five hours of pay each week, whether they are paged or not…this requirement can cost more than $6,000 in additional compensation.
Arbitrator Reinstates Porn-Watching Teacher
A Cedarburg school teacher was reinstated by an arbitrator after being fired for viewing pornography on a school computer. The school district ultimately succeeded in terminating the teacher only after taking the case to the Wisconsin Supreme Court at great cost to the taxpayers…
‘Outstanding First Year Teacher’ Laid Off
Milwaukee Public Schools teacher Megan Sampson was laid off less than one week after being named Outstanding First Year Teacher by the Wisconsin Council of English Teachers. She lost her job because the collective bargaining agreement requires layoffs to be made based on seniority rather than merit.
Union Opposes Cost-Saving Lawn Mowing Program
As a cost cutting measure, Racine County began using county inmates to cut the grass in medians and right-of-ways at no cost to the taxpayers. A county employee union filed a grievance indicating it was the right of government workers to cut the grass, even though it would cost the taxpayers dramatically more
The $150,000 Bus Driver
In 2009, the City of Madison’s highest paid employee was a bus driver who earned $159,258, including $109,892 in overtime, guaranteed by a collective bargaining agreement. In total, seven City of Madison bus drivers made more than $100,000 per year in 2009.
$150,000 Correctional Officers
Correctional Officer collective bargaining agreements allow officers a practice known as “sick leave stacking.” Officers can call in sick for a shift, receiving 8 hours of sick pay, and then are allowed to work the very next shift, earning time-and-a-half for overtime. This results in the officer receiving 2.5 times his or her rate of pay, while still only working 8 hours…
Paid-Time off for Union Activities
In Milwaukee County alone, because the union collectively bargained for paid time off, fourteen employees receive salary and benefits for doing union business. Of the fourteen, three are on full-time release for union business. Milwaukee County spent over $170,000 in salary alone for these employees to only participate in union activities such as collective bargaining.
Surrender of Management Rights
Because of collecting bargaining, unions have included provisions in employee contracts that have a direct fiscal impact such as not allowing management to schedule workers based on operational needs and requiring notice and approval by the union prior to scheduling changes. As County Executive Walker attempted to reduce work hours based on budget pressures and workload requirements by instituting a 35 hour work week to avoid layoffs, which the union opposed. Additionally, government cannot explore privatization of functions that could save taxpayers money.
WEA Trust
Currently many school districts participate in WEA trust because WEAC collectively bargains to get as many school districts across the state to participate in this union run health insurance plan as possible. Union leadership benefits from members participating in this plan. If school districts enrolled in the state employee health plan, it would save school districts up to $68 million per year..
Viagra for Teachers
The Milwaukee Teachers Education Association (MTEA) tried to use a policy established by collective bargaining to obtain health insurance coverage that specifically paid for Viagra. Cost to taxpayers is $786,000 a year.
Unrealistic Overtime Provisions
On a state level, the Department of Corrections allows correctional workers who call in sick to collect overtime if they work a shift on the exact same day. The specific provision that allows this to happen was collectively bargained for in their contract. Cost to taxpayers $4.8 million.
http://www.wtaq.com/blogs/post/jbader/2011/mar/08/what-you-get-collectiv...
So, let me assume you have a point... angling for for a cushy Crossing Guard position?
srv great use of union shill tactics .... if you have nothing substantial to refute the facts try personal attack>
His comment speaks for itself, dumbass. Now let's apply his same comments to those in private industry with equally out-of-whack compensation.
JR, the suit to reinstate the Viagra benefit was dropped today.
The loss of the vote in the Assembly today, and now, the loss of the Viagra... The hits just keep on coming.
Thanks, JR. There is humor and genuine glory in simply stating the facts on the ground. The more the teachers whine, and piss, and moan, the more Joe and Sally worker bees will focus on this. Then,... it gets interesting.
Lame cut-and-paste post is lame.
50 years of collective bargaining in WI, covering hundreds of thousands of policemen, firemen, nurses, teachers, janitors -- regular people, all trying to make a living so they can pay their taxes and deal with inflation -- and a handful of examples proves what?
These hundreds of thousands of people are not the enemy. Why aren't you talking about the billions we're wasting every few months in a quagmire in Afghanistan which is creating terrorists, and sucking American lives and money, not to mention innocent civilians there. Those wasted billions could solve every collective bargaining example you've mentioned, nationally.
And think about it: who's to blame when someone strikes a good bargain? Blame the past Republican and Dem governors, if you will, but don't demonize regular people as the enemy. Otherwise you're playing into the hands of TPTB that want to keep regular people at each other's throats.
ok now that the unions have been decapitated, its time for the 2nd head of the monster.....the banksters
They shouda been FIRST. You see, I don't give a shit who they are. All I know is that there are 6 billion of us vs. a few thousand of them at most.
Heaven forbid this type of verbiage was uttered during the protests of the healthcare law.....OMG
Someone uttered the word "nigger" and it was like every conservative was instantaneously converted to neo-nazis involuntarily.
I want some civil war. I'm sick of this shit.
BTW - Where is Obama calling for peaceful protests and what not? O/T why is that sonofabitch who murdered U.S military personel on U.S soil not indicted Eric Holder?! Is he one of your people too?
The only people who uttered the word "nigger" that day were members congressional black caucus and the media lapdogs
I'm with you on the Civil War. I get Texas.
The reality is that public union members are the only ones with significant money that can be taken. Everyone else is either on food stamps or their mega-bucks are fully invested. Lets see George Soros or Bill Gates try to spend a significant amount on something other than approved charities or political candidates.
When people start to beleave that their no recourse left in the system look out
Just like all the loopholes the Obama administration found to pass all their bills including the Healthcare Bill that never went to the Senate after Scott Brown took their 51st vote away? At least the Walker bill isn't costing Americans 1 Trillion dollars like the unconsitutional healthcare bill that nobody even has a clue what's in it.
To the fine public sector leeches of Wisconsin: you lost, get over it. I think all of the teachers should get a remedial course in US govt. Your buds in the legislature can't run from the state and think they are going to win the fight.
There is a very easy way to view this - it's no different than what's going on in NAfrica and the ME - $/Joule is getting more expensive. I.e., the resource pie is shrinking. What you're witnessing is the scrum over what's left.
Thank you for commenting about where the true problems lie in this world. Too many people with not enough energy for all. Now the fact there isn't enough energy may be more about control of energy than actual supply, but that's a different discussion.
Come kill me you pussies. I will stack you like cordwood out front. Death threats shit.
I'm not sure about WI but in NJ the unions have been raping this state for years. There are no show jobs, with a pension for each job they don't go to. Some people have 5 jobs!!?? NJ The teachers union had the state by the balls and Chris Christy is cleaning up the state union corruption.
NJ pays the highest realestate taxes
NJ pays the most per student
Some of the schools getting the most $ has the worst performance.
When the union has to make cuts they cut the best lowest paid teachers first to show how the state is hurting workers getting paid 35K a year. The union never cuts the top fat cats that are causing all the problems.
I'm not sure about WI but in NJ the unions have been raping this state for years. There are no show jobs, with a pension for each job they don't go to. Some people have 5 jobs!!?? NJ The teachers union had the state by the balls and Chris Christy is cleaning up the state union corruption.
NJ pays the highest realestate taxes
NJ pays the most per student
Some of the schools getting the most $ has the worst performance.
When the union has to make cuts they cut the best lowest paid teachers first to show how the state is hurting workers getting paid 35K a year. The union never cuts the top fat cats that are causing all the problems.
removed
Tee hee hee hee hee...
Why so serious?
Go ahead you thugs,the sooner you start shooting over losing a FEW of your babies, the sooner the Tsunami of non Union people can tear your ass up.
Bring it.
We all have problems, what makes you so damned special,Cro Mags.
What JWinFL, and others, don't realize is that this is the first step in destroying the banksters. By hitting the NEA and SEIU, the election funding for bankster buddies is seriously depleted. You think Schumer gets only personal donations? Soon, real people like Jason Chaffetz can afford to run more often. Then the banks get hauled before real hearings, and all will be right with the world. May the next prez fire the entire US goobermint employment as his/her first act.
It's all about the unions losing power - plain and simple, and they do bankroll the dems and to a lesser extent the rino's that give cover to the banksters. But, the sheeple always fall for the class warfare BS, and that prolly will never change. And certain groups are excellent at moving the focus to others so they don't get scrutinized.
BUFFET TERRORIST Michael Moore spotted heading for Old Country Buffet! LOCK THE DOORS QUICK!!!
Big deal, this absurd law won't survive its first challenge in court. Everyone, on both sides, should take a chill pill.
I believe there is an ancient saying that goes something like: an enemy of my enemy is my friend. Folks, the banksters are our enemies, and , thus, unless you are a bankster, you are my friend.
Austerity means having to pay a few bucks for your cadillac health insurance?
Oh, the humanity!
Why are collective bargaining rights under attack?
Maybe because we aren't a collectivist society? Or are we..........
Indeed.
May your hard-on project you forward.
I agree "we" are not a "collective society".
If I may I presume you mean some sort of socialism or communism.
That however was not my question.
Allow me.
Why is it not possible for workers to decide that this (A or B, or, X or Y) is their collective decision.
Is it not then the prerogative of the elected to accept the decision or reject it.
Is not the dismissal of the "right" of Citizens to assemble the antithesis of Republic?
Or, why is it not possible for those same said workers to be able to opt out of the political fundraising part of the dues which they are forced to pay in order to stay in good stead with said union, whether currently working or not.
If said workers could opt out of the political fundraising part of their 'dues' I believe most would and I also believe then collective bargaining may actually then be to the benefit of the said workers and not the union bosses and political cronies that provide cover for the banksters. No?
"Or, why is it not possible for those same said workers to be able to opt out"
I agree entirely.
Labour Unions are corrupt and are anti-republican (small r).
Labour Unions do not want the freedom of the individual to succeed.
It is against the interests of Labour Unions.
"If said workers could opt out of the political fundraising part of their 'dues' "
All workers should be free to "opt out".
However.
All workers should be free to opt in.
Labour Unions that insist on "political" contributions are nothing more or less than Fascist.
"Matrix is a system" from "Matrix - Woman in the red dress scene"
The lemmings who voted for Hope & Change are now discovering deception. The days of Peggy Joseph's unicorn visions are fading rapidly. Who would of thought??
Even poor Karl Denninger fell for such delusional hopium rhetoric and today he still hates Gold & Silver.
Obama Is Going To Pay For My Gas And Mortgage
Screw those Unions, just like the UAW, they make too much for what they return and keep duds employed. Unions are socialist and elitist! Let the bastards flip hamburgers!
Not much to disagree with there.
However.
I would say.
"Screw those Unions Elite"
Labourers are Citizens.
It is not there fault if they have been lied to.
You and I were also lied to.
death threats sent by who? The FBI?
Socialist state employees are now just cornered rats.
Unions will attempt to appeal to the Supreme Soviet.
Let's face it - Walker should have combined his public union compensation cuts with at least a 1 point increase in taxes on wealthy taxpayers (the beneficiaries of Bernank et al outside of the banks). WI does already have a fairly progressive tax structure vs. other states, but it would have been a much easier sell to a broader part of the population if he would have explicitly shown a sharing of the pain.
Damnit! Another group of people that might actually have to work for awhile.
tekhneek
Yet the country seems to only be hiring for positions in the population control industry. In a eugenic, corporate economy. Other jobs seem to be either outsourced or "uneconomic". I bet there are a great many people in the group that are willing and able to work, but the world economy right now does not need them. How fucked up is that?
This is an Atlas Shrugged–level collapse. Stereotypes and one-liners fail to inspire me.
(All fanboys and Randroids who link to the movie trailer have been and will be continue to be: Junked! -- by me. The Randroid Cult is an incorporated non-profit institution which get paid FRNs to retard and abort the true spirit of Atlas Shrugged. Most people don't know that, but it's true.)
That parenthetical rant has nothing to do with you, tekhneek. But I'm just saying it's not as simple as what you said.
Peace.
PS: You look like Scully. But you're a financial terrorist!
edit: I didn't junk you. Not that you would probably care if I did.
8.9 earthquake outside Tokyo. Looks pretty bad with tsunamis. On every channel.
Wars, rumors of wars, earthquakes in diverse places, monetary system about to collapse. Sounds like a story I once read.
Crazy eah?
Well. Obama and his allies did the same thing to us jamming health care down our throats.
HAHAHAAAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAA
- and this is just the beginning
HAHAHAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c0toN8tsnNk
Do not listen to those who say we have to choose between BIG government >or< BIG business.
That is the old divide and conquer.
Support small, local, direct, human enterprises.
Starve the beasts. The enemies are the elite "in charge of" BIG.
"The enemies are the elite "in charge of" BIG."
Yep.
The funny thing is that many of these union people who thought this or that about politics and probably are republican couldn't see that eventually they would have to take away the punch bowl of entitlements from the unions. I think they should have collective bargaining, but thats not the case. By them getting rid of this, then local and state govt. employeers can change work law and wages at a whim, they won't say it like this but it will be that way. They could add more stuff to teachers work load that may or may not be outside of their old work contract. They could hire more part time workers than full time workers at city or state parks and recreations. Then if they hire new workers full time they could implement a two teir system in whatever benefits they may have (which is always a death knell for unions).
What taking collective bargaining out does is to take away all pretense of unions being able to have a say, they won't.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FcKdaK2MDAs
Your hate has made you all strong.
Now go and kill each other.
We're betting FRNs, Euros, Quatloos, on the outcome.
I get a kick out of the people that need unions to exist. Man, to think I once respected my teachers...now only to find out most (not all) people in academia are there because they couldn't make a life any other way. And the life of today's teacher provides full on health care at no cost and a 100K per year pension for life.
How many people do you know, even executive level positions, that afford the equivallent of 2.0MM in retirement savings? That's what these teachers retire with, highest three years average comp for life...say somewhere around 100K per year. Risk free rate of return on 2.0MM is 80-90K per year. I'm sorry, I'm not feeling guilty for these people having to chip in!
Let's get real people.
Ron Paul To Introduce A Bill That Says The President Can't Impose A NO-Fly Zone Over Libya (Glenn Beck Substitute)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ODuxUeO1u4&feature=feedu
We're talking about a monopoly, not a voluntary association, unions that is. They do their business at gunpoint. Nothing to defend there.
Just because you put a gun to the people's head and instate yourself as the educator of their kids, doesn't mean you're doing god's work or something. It means you're a thug.
It's a group of people who organized to take what's not theirs to take. Groups don't have any more right to steal in unlawful contracts than individuals that make up those groups do.
So the thieves point fingers and say that their opposition is morally decayed. So what. We'll take all the corruption out of the body even if it's a cadaver, it's better than a zombie.
NEWS Off-Topic.
Heard on national radio (ABC or Fox, I can't remember) approx 4.5 hours ago.
JPMorgan/Chase Bank "considering" enacting point-of-service transaction limits on bank debit/credit cards. Limit may be $50 or $100 per purchase transaction. Any single transaction beyond the limit will return a "declined" authorization response.
One of many-to-come creative modern day bank-run hedges?
You're right. As Nathan Martin said today on his blog: "And what happens when legislation is introduced to reel in the bankers. Why the threats flow like flood waters, and the markets tumble, that’s what. The latest threat? How about capping debit cards to $50 per transaction."
Nathan adds: "That’s right, the threat is that if you take away usurious fees from the banks, then they will cap transactions and make life difficult for everyone. They can do this because it is THEY who control the money! YOUR MONEY!
"What the banksters fail to realize is that the money system of the United States belongs to the people, not the private banks. Sadly, the people also largely fail to understand this…"
http://economicedge.blogspot.com/
Question: Did Ireland lower their National Minimum Wage by 1 Euro in order to get bailed out?
if the answer is yes (and I believe it is), you have to be pissed if you're a minimum wage worker and had no mortgage and had really nothing to do with the Irish situation. Let's say you go there just to work summers.
Now you are making 1 euro less just so corporate profits increase, leading to higher corporate taxes (merkel's quid pro quo), so that Ireland can take said taxes and pay.....wait for it.......the international Banks.
Same basic deal in WI and soon coming to a private union and town near you.
http://www.idahostatesman.com/2011/03/02/1548057/boise-county-files-for-...
http://www.counterpunch.org/roberts03102011.html
"as for the good news, there is no fucking good news, so let's rock!"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CJWmx2jP0OE
While I don't want to see anyone get killed by some nutcase(s), please don't tell me that anyone else is actually surprised that this would happen after the Legislature's vote.
We have two problems here. One is that the money in the real economy is running out. The other is that the money itself is deteriorating. The whole public sector and the unions that are representing them here simply don't understand the concept that their "money" is fiat. Without a fiat currency, none of these jobs could exist in their current gargantuan form, maybe not at all. So having fiat money allowed us to have things like public school systems, fire departments, police, etc. Because of this, some might argue that a fiat currency was good for society. But it is inevitable that a fiat currency will be mismanaged. Now that the rubicon has been crossed, unfortunately this is the end of fiat. It is good for those of us who believe in honest money, but an unfortunate dynamic is that the domestic keynesianism and the jobs it supported, will now disintegrate. It is unfortunate that those on the left can't understand these simple concepts. I argue here today that much of the political philosophies of the left wouldn't even be able to exist without fiat currency. People.... Your jobs are based on tax revenues. Tax revenues are going away because of a negative feedback loop caused by the monetization of the debt. Inflation will crush the economy and evaporate all but real money, and those that hold it. Your jobs and way of life will go away unfortunately, and before you point fingers at the right, left, independent, or indifferent, you need to ask yourself... What was my money? What is the money that I am supposedly losing here? Your money isn't real and the money you think you're losing because of this bill was a lie too. Your whole life is an illusion. Before we have any discussions, you need to ask yourself.... What is the money? Once we figure out what the money is, the next question you need to ask is... Where is it going to come from? The fiat scheme was about making promises to you, and now the promises can't be kept! Sure, blame Wall Street and the banks! Blame the Fed. Yes, Walker could have done this differently. But first you need to look at yourself, and how little you understand about the monetary system that surrounds you. You've been lied to, and everything you believe in is a lie. We can't have a discussion until you honestly ask the question.... What is the money? It was fun while it lasted for you. But now your life will change, and change dramtically. This is only the very beginning. This place is one big Greece full of socialists who have another thing coming. Your life and your entitlements will be turned upside down! Learn about money, fools! Learn about history! Learn about fiat!
Damn Arkomen, you rock! Even if you never got properly introduced to a paragraph!
classic, just absolutely brilliant
"People.... Your jobs are based on tax revenues. Tax revenues are going away because of a negative feedback loop caused by the monetization of the debt"
but of course you know that a drowning person will thrash around quite a bit before they expire...they'll try to tax the everlovin' shit out of us
Tim Geithner sucks
Free at last! Free at last! Thank you lord I am free at last.... Yeah!!
Are you Clowns serious? My God Man we're talking Wisconsin people. PROBABLY THE MOST LEVEL HEADED FOLKS ON THE PLANET!!!!!! My God they don't want this attention.
Seriously if Wisconsin folks are up in arms about something, it's probably pretty important.
It's not like Sherman Oaks then ShennnesqueOddity of Freaks raging?
These are Wisconsin people.
Remember who is pissed off.
Cheers and grow a brainstem and trrrrrrryyyyyy to figure out what is right and what is wrong you F'n Retards!
PS NONE OF YOU PEOPLE DESERVE EVEN THE MONEY YOU HAVE. YOU'VE ALLLLLL BEEN WAYYYYYYYY OVERPAID YOUR WHOLE LIVES.
GIVE PEOPLE A FEW BUCKS AND THEY THINK THEY HAVE A CLUE. LOLLLLLLLL
RIGHT.
YOU WILL DIE!!!!
This is also true for the person who wrote this, in fact...
While I really don't like the partisan politics of this whole thing, I do believe that the end of public unions is a good thing. The reason for unionization (poor/unsafe working conditions, unfair labor practices, etc.) made sense as a reaction to bad employers.
I fail to see where the public sector has any of those problems. So the only reason a public union exists is to extort higher wages and benefits from...you got it...the taxpayer. The public sector bureaucrat has little or no incentive to bargain on behalf of the taxpayer since the unions fund much of their campaign. Get rid of the unions and you eliminate a whole level of bureaucracy that feeds off the union worker. Every union worker would get a pay increase by not having dues forcibly deducted from their paycheck.
Invoking the "taxpayer" fallacy does not make the action any more just or correct. The public sector union is a check against the powers of those who buy representatives.
The bad employers still exist, and are multiplying due to the erosion of those protections. For every bad employer, comes out someone who wants to take the good ones down with it.
BULLSHIT ON YOUR TAXPAYER FALLACY.
I am a taxpayer.
I pay the wages of PUBLIC SERVANTS.
They don't deserve benefits I can't afford.
"Just and correct" are subjective. I think the end of public unions is a good thing. BTW, unions "buy" representatives all the time. Most politicians are very sensitive to the "union" vote. Unions were all about working conditions. I don't buy the argument that they are necessary in this day and age in the public sector.
I will support any union AND/OR scab teacher who graduates a single student at the age of 18 or under who understands the U.S. Tax code.
If this pisses anybody off. You are drafted!
The UNIONS ARE THE LAST THING YOU NEED TO WORRY ABOUT YOU IDIOTS.
Seriously, the US GOVT and the FED have done more to ruin this Country than would 100 atomic bombs.
They're the Corruption you need to rise up about.
You're worried about the wrong fight.
You're pissed off about a knife fight when someone has a machine gun and a 50mm sniper rifle.
GROW A BRAIN.
SERIOUSLY MOST OF YOU AREN'T SANE ENOUGH TO BE OUT IN PUBLIC...... EVER!
YOU FOOLS JUST DROOL WHAT THE MASS MEDIA FEEDS YOUR BRAINSTEM.
WAKE UP SCOOTER !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Good God Man- This country is in shambles.
If you had a brain you would be able to grasp the fact that people can oppose thievery by the bankers and unions at the same time. Where were these damned protesters when Geithner was handing out a few trillion to Wall Street? They didn't give a damn because they thought that Obama had their back and their free ride would continue.
LOL @ SPARKY
Mainstream media SUPPORTS government unions. That would be reason #1 why this country and your brainpan is in a shambles.
The public employee unions, the Fed, the bankers, the list is long- but there IS a list.
Envy, thy name is Governor Walker. What Walker has done is nothing that could be considered a part of limited government.
Let's just say I don't have any sympathy for Walker and his supporters. They decided to lie their way to get what they wanted. Slapping on "but, but taxpayer!" does not sanctify his(or Kasich's) position. While it'd be worse for someone to follow through on those threats, Walker and his supporters have not set a good example for themselves.
As Barack Obama put it so eloquently:
WE WON. GET OVER IT
You still don't get my point - if it was about an honest financial discussion, it would stand on its own. It would not take the use of envy, arrogance, nor a banker-level of dishonesty to pass the bill.
Second, Obama is more bumbling about the whole thing than Carter.
Teachers are not "special". They do not deserve any special treatment. Many so-called "teachers" are just fucking terrible. Like politicians, there is something psychologically wrong about people that want to be in positions of power over other human beings for the sake of having control over the way they think and behave.
My sympathies...where did you go to school?
I will get junked for this, but you are right to some degree. Teachers are not special, not any more than any other person filling a wage job. The problem with our education system is not teachers, it is kids who do not give a damn, and the society we have all created which makes them that way.
Manofbliss- there are studies that show that psychopaths gravitate towards positions of power over others.
Chiefly, politicians, law enforcement, petty beaurocrats.
Doesn't mean they all are...
but it sure EXPLAINS a lot. hahaha
Mispost. This time it is for real. with all the veracity of a wisconsin teacher.
If any union AND.OR scab teacher can graduate a single student who understands the tax code (Federal/State) they will get my vote in the next election.
If our teachers fail. All thier students shall be drafted into a war where they are payed in scrit.
I can take Mike Moore in an eating contest.
Here,Here! I don't think you have a chance with Moore though. Keep distance, that has to be a mean eating machine.
Iowahawk does a great breakdown on the stats bending used in school scores. Worth reading...iowahawk.type pad.com
Way too much lefty / righty (union / taxpayer) comments on this post. By doing so, you guys are just having a prison fight for the wardens' pleasure. Lets get back to looking at the root cause, the political and financial elites who neither pay taxes nor belong to unions.
BULLSHIT BUNKERMEATHEAD (apt naming)
More deflection to diffuse & distract.
Public union employees are at WAR against TAXPAYERS & after having WON for decades they are now on the losing side & it's about damn time.
All the other issues will be dealt with JUST LIKE THIS ONE.
So the Dems are bad for backing the unions, but the Repubs are the great union busting saviours? What a joke. No matter which side is in office, the Goldman Sachs alumni continuously occupy the west wing. The elites are at war with everyone who does not have their own helicpoter parked in front of their mansion. Proudly calling yourself a "taxpayer" shows complete ignorance that the tax laws are calculated to oppress the masses while benefiting the elite.
You fuckers really don't want some honest truth-like comment calling out the parasites as the POS losers they are do you?
Well here is where shit ends up when people live on Gov dole:
http://www.vanityfair.com/business/features/2010/10/greeks-bearing-bonds...
A Leech-o-meter= junk comment here.
Every junk comment is from a leech living on the government.. A Leech-o-meter.
Walker's administrative rules change would allow the Department of Health Services, via the overwhelmingly GOP-controlled budget committee, to change state laws unilaterally, skipping the legislative process altogether.
The advantage of this approach to gutting Medicaid is that it avoids the nuisance legislative process that is currently gumming up a similar war on the poor in Texas.
In all Walker's talk about private industry providing health insurance, and trimming back state outlays to health care, one fact that doesn't get answered is exactly what the tens of thousands of people with private industry jobs who are also on state health assistance are to do. The apostrophes in Wisconsin employers like Menard's, Roundy's, McDonald's, Land's End and Kohl's don't ever precede the term "health insurance plan." Those businesses have thousands of employees who are listed on the rolls of BadgerCare. BadgerCare recipients listed as employed at Wal-Mart alone number just shy of 10,000. (is he gonna fuck with walmart?)
But wait! Just who has Walker appointed to head up the newly powerful Department of Health Services? A villain as innocuously named as the term "administrative rule" itself, Dennis Smith. As Capital Times reporter Shawn Doherty points out in a woefully overlooked piece, Smith is a fellow at The Heritage Foundation, the conservative think tank hostile to Medicaid. How hostile? In 2009, Smith himself authored a paper titled "Medicaid Meltdown: Dropping Medicaid Could Save States $1 Trillion," which concludes "failure to leave Medicaid might be viewed as irresponsible on the part of elected state officials."
To review: Walker argues that his bill's benefit cuts are to bring public employees more in line with the realities of the state's private workforce—while acknowledging that one of those realities is that hundreds of thousands of those in the private workforce rely on low income benefit assistance from the state. Meanwhile, the same bill making this argument paves the way to cut—without opposition, debate or legislative due process—those very same benefits.
What Walker really means when he says that Wisconsin is "open for business" is that Wisconsin is "closed for poor people."
Tonight the Governor defended his bill by tweeting a link to a post at The Heritage Foundation.
It just happens that Tina Korbe, the author of that Heritage piece, graduated with a BA in journalism from the University of Arkansas… in 2010.
So, to put that in perspective, when the governor of the entire state of Wisconsin finds time to defend a bill that could severely impact the financial well-being of hundreds of thousands of Wisconsin workers, not to mention instituting the most sweeping changes to the balance of the state's labor relations in 50 years, who does he point to? An 22-year-old (at best) who grew up in Arkansas and graduated with an undergraduate degree in journalism less than a year ago.
http://www.theawl.com/2011/02/burning-down-wisconsin-the-hidden-budget-b...
Gov. Walker the man with the industrial dick.
unions = thousands of little dicks
It is a beautful art. Complacency is your friend.
Short version: more riots coming
You mean temper tantrums by those who have been living off the taxpayers for decades
No, I mean discontent from the masses on all sides because all are getting bent over.
This is so much bigger than politics and the old ways.
Awake from your slumber.
http://twitter.com/TMZ/status/46064975546040320
short Charlie Sheen right now
Apparently, the trolls are real.
Whoever junked us was too late to short CS.
since when does politics have anything to do with the berknatize put?
lol
Exactly.
since when does politics have anything to do with the berknatize put?
since when does politics have anything to do with the berknatize put?
This site is infested with liberal maggots- posters from out of the woodwork threatened no doubt.
Dang! all that hot air out of your ass too?
What does liberal mean again?
http://www.setyourgoalandgo.org/
the heritage foundation's tina korbe, Arkansas jr miss 2006.
Thanks to ZH and the wonderful contributions of the users... I have been able to wake up my community to what is around the corner...
No doubt many do think I am nuts.
I work for the state government. I DON'T CARE IF I LOSE MY FUCKING JOB! got it?
The dollar is going to soon collapse into worthlessness.!!!!! I have attempted to arrange meetings with the members of the so-called "union" but they won't bite. They are rotten core like everyone else, like all you say (no sarcasm)
I want to present to them all the information I have learned from ZH and other financial websites. THEY NEED TO UNDERSTAND all this bitching is for nothing and they will get just that- NOTHING. Especially once the dollar collapses... then absolutely lick of this debate is useless to discuss.
You would be surprised how many of them just don't give a fuck...
I try to pay attention to every possible financial lick of information I can get a hold of... All I know is we have hired a ton of people from the "private- sector".
Just as they are entering STATE EMPLOYMENT... I am activley seeking to leave it.
Fuck them! (Serious). Let it all burn down. YOU ARE HEARING THIS FROM A PUBLIC SECTOR EMPLOYEE.
I want to see the fight in the streets. I will be joining them.
America is an absolute police state with ZERO individual liberty.
Our Founders would be ashamed. THEY TOLD THE BRITISH to FUCK OFF!
I fucking HATE OBAMA and went on record at my community college that he would be a failed President in less than 1 year(even though I predict reelection at this particular point). I was correct as usual.
However something interesting happened, as boring and already known the Wikilinks shit was in total, DID ANYONE CATCH THIS TID BIT?
http://www.montrealgazette.com/news/agreed+give+British+secrets+Russia/4...
Tony Blair+George W Bush were the fascist dictators of the modern age. Just accept that.
Obama, like Marc Faber and Ron Paul state accurately, is a "prostitute corporatist". Sadly, FALL OF THE REPUBLIC did suggest this to be the case (over 8 million views on youtube?)... hello!?!?! Michael Moore? - Where is Alex Jones Oscar? (not a big Jones fan. Cancelled my PP membership when I was 18).
For lite reading, check this out. The Empire is coming down in flames!
This is Soviet Union 2.0 (like Shameful and others suggest on here). Ron Paul always talks about "The Soviet System went bust for financial reasons"...
does any of this look familiar?
http://sfr-21.org/collapse.html
If you still haven't watched it... Watch Fall of the Republic now... after all this shit.
Obama the friend of the Unions? haha! Write that in the history books. Promise you will regret it.
Interesting this movie was released right while the March 2009 lows were coming in. (That is just Tin Foil I thought of now!)
I dare anyone to junk me. (No doubt you all think I am an Infowars or Goldman Sachs troll). My response, "Kill yourself".
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eAaQNACwaLw
Btw, I donated to ZH today. Time for you people to put your money where your mouth is. Enough internet talk. Take back the country already. There is plenty of room to do this rather peacefully! The Founding Fathers were so right! I don't care if they owned slaves, were Christians, Atheists, Deists, Anti-Semities or Women abusers.
TRUTH IS FUCKING TRUTH!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eAaQNACwaLw
that's right. BURN THE JUNK BOTTON OFF!
Fuck everyone last one of you. Pricks. I am sorry middle-age sucks so much. It's tough, I know.
America is finished. It is a failed experiment.
Yes, indeed. "A Republic if you can [fucking] keep it!".
The main reason it's failed is because we're let the joo maggots into our government, finance system and media. It is just as Ben Franklin warned us of at the framing of the Consitution.
BULLSHIT SQUEEKS
Ben Franklin didn't say a damned word about "joos"
now go fuck yourself
Not gonna believe this:
I was at the fucking show where Scott Staap from Creed almost died (Blacked out in a tub of Ice).
luke-warm on that band (really only liked My Own Prison), but he is seriously a mental case! Glad to see he is feeling better, though.
If you say something really really bad, then Skynet will fire up its 40 ZH accounts to junk you 40 times.
Skynet?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6mKRYlCiRfo
(I was fucking THERE^^^! Someone died that night, honorably. NO JOKE!)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e2Xs-pzRyi8 (<<< Real Skynet...)
Heavy fucking metal(s)! Booze! Boyz! Jesus (yes, I am Christian)! and ZH (representing a movement back to core American values!).
Calm down Baby, you're among friends here, mostly.
Just keep on keeping on and you should probably shut your mouth at work. Stack the cash while you can, start a small business down the road.
Honestly? If you spend a lot of time at Infowars, Rense, George Ure, Prison Planet, Alex Jones- you're being kept stirred up and made fearful by a punishing diet of negativity & fear mongering. Back off that sensationalistic crap, go smell some roses, get laid.
Come back renewed, positive, and kick some ass.
See you on the barricades.
"Keep my mouth shut at work?"... BEST REPLY ALLDAY
Here we go...(maybe I can get some truth, finally!)
What can I expect to happen to me tomorrow when I walk into work?
I work at a Hospital in IL. I never stop talking and educating people.
Until I breath my last final breath.
Blank stares, uncomfortable neurotic tics, irrelevant dogmatic retorts, your boss or bosses bringing you into their office... anything but what you seek.
I was lying about that last one. Go for it and be brave. And take what comes. As you intended all along.
edit: I forgot to add: violent attacks.
7.4 quake near Tokyo. A lot of damage, lots of cars floating down the rivers on CNBC World.
Fight Club!
Do not fuck with us.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xWVxI6XZAuE
S&P Correction coming as 55 DMA violated.
http://dawnwires.com/investment-news/sp-500-closes-below-55-dma-for-first-time-since-sept-2010/
Essentially we have politicians that have made promises impossible to keep. Just like the Democrats running from the state to avoid reality, and deflect the blame elsewhere, many politicians are doing the same. They delay and avoid what is inevitable. The list of promises is long and cumulative. The promise of the newer robbing the older. The day of reckoning is here, and the country's majority has said "enough"! That was called the November election. Remember that, as it was a complete rejection of more spending. We as a nation have spent far beyond what we have. And as is symptomatic of our mentality, none want to give up what they have. Just as many want cheap nuclear power, none want it in their back yard. Everyone here believes that there are many highly overpaid "rich" persons in this country that have avoided paying what they should. BUT the reality is that the level of indebtedness of our country on all levels could not be dented with all their money combined. This is where education comes into the picture. One may have a masters degree, and not understand the monetary system without study. When you use government figures this argument holds no water. When real numbers are plugged in resolution is impossible. The debt based currency we have experimented with is toast. It is now only a matter of how and when it plays out. So my question to those that feel they have been wronged by this; When will you step to the plate and join the good fight for our property rights? Your money is your property. Every time more dollars are created the ones created before are worth less. You are robbed of property. Every time interest rates trend lower corporations capital is under pressure and they must find ways to compete under this stress. (move offshore) More unemployed. IF the Democrat party truly had your best interests at heart, they would have these bankers by the throat NOW! It is my firm belief that this money system, that is unconstitutional, is the real issue we all must correct. The politicians of all stripes are next on the list, because they are really not that stupid to not see this. They are all trying to push it off further down the road. The dead end sign is in sight. What will you sacrifice to help out? My view is if you want to help both yourself and end this quickly, you should buy Physical Silver and encourage as many as possible to do the same. If enough people did this it would collapse the money system and restore our rights. Not one shot fired.
Are you serious about this? I hate lying thieving snakes.
Is Silver "Housing 2.0?"?
I respect the market place (everyone wants to make a killing). I am 20 years old. I saved my money, every last cent. Still only have about 12k to my entire name.
I am 40% in Gold & Silver. I am a history buff. I understand no fiat-only currency has ever lasted more than about 30-years in history (even powerful Empires).
If Peter Schiff, Marc Faber, Jim Rogers, Gerald Celente, Bob Chapman and others are correct... Then Gold & Silver will probably be worth a TON!
Understand, I am not good at detecting sarcasm. I have ruined people's days for trying to pull it over me!
TRUTH! Right now!
Oh I get it now Babydoll, you been drinkin' :)
Nope. That would be illegal (already drank around lunch time). Just a beer or two at lunch.
There is no rules against it. My employeer has stated, "As Long as It doesn't affect your work". Go ahead. Rat on me! I dare you. I am ready to be broke, I cannot wait for this thing to collapse all around us!
I am a secretary at a Medical Records office. Work is not that bad. I accept the low salary and the lack of job security.
Hard to find jobs in the private sector right now, as you know.
I don't need to defend myself. I am not a troll. I live to promote what ZH talks about here!
haha, you people disgust me. (junkers)
Probably will find myself deleted off ZH when I log in (like everyday) about 8-9:30 AM.}
Thirsty Thursday here down on campus. At the bar with friends. (ZH via my smartphone)
Good fucking night!
Who invited you to Fight Club again?
"It is my firm belief that this money system, that is unconstitutional, is the real issue we all must correct." -- agNau
Bull's eye! Good rant.
Fire and Ice by Robert Frost
Some say the world will end in fire,
Some say in ice.
From what I've tasted of desire
I hold with those who favor fire.
But if I had to perish twice,
I think I know enough of hate
To say that for destruction ice
Is also great And would suffice
Okay, I'm libertarian and have financially supported candidates such as Ron Pau. But I don't get Walker at all. lCan somebody here explain why raising taxes by 4.6% on those making over $250k was so bad that even Obama declined to do it just two months ago, but that an 8% tax on teachers is just fine and dandy? Really, I'm serious. Can anybody justify this?
I'm all for "sharing the pain", but what pain has anybody in the top 10% shared recently? Stocks have doubled in less than two years and 90% of that gain went to the top 10%. We at the top continue to enjoy the lowest income tax rates in 65 years while the rest of Americans are required to sacrifice. When did this become the American way in tough times?
IMHO, the events in Wisconsin, when juxtaposed with the nashing of teeth just two months ago over raising taxes 4.6% on the wealthiest Americans, almost guarantees a Republican loss in 2012 and a huge tax increase on the wealthiest Americans. And we'll all have Walker to blame.
Having them pay for their own damn benefits is hardly the same as raising taxes.
Any that believe the "Plan" rolled out to insure ALL would not end up taxing ALL is very naive indeed. The wealthy will never be touched as long as this system stands.
zero hedge
check ya wires...bad arse earth quake just hit japn
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CArWivYt208
LMAO! round and round she goes where she'll stop nobody knows, still waiting for ours in cali. not sure if all this activity around the ring of fire is building pressure or releaving it. But it keeps missing us.
crosses just got slaughtered...that and the doomsday oil trade on Saudi unrest...today.
check futures