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Millions of Evangelical Christians Want to Start WWIII to Speed the "Second Coming" ... and Atheist Neocons are Using Religion
MILLIONS OF EVANGELICAL CHRISTIANS WANT TO START WORLD WAR III ... TO SPEED UP THE SECOND COMING
The Founding Fathers weren't particularly anti-Islam.
But millions of Americans believe that Christ will not come again until Israel wipes out its competitors and there is widespread war in the Middle East. Some of these folks want to start a huge fire of war and death and destruction, so that Jesus comes quickly.
According to French President Chirac, Bush told him that the Iraq war was needed to bring on the apocalypse:
In Genesis and Ezekiel Gog and Magog are forces of the Apocalypse who are prophesied to come out of the north and destroy Israel unless stopped. The Book of Revelation took up the Old Testament prophesy:
“And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison, And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.”
Bush believed the time had now come for that battle, telling Chirac:
“This confrontation is willed by God, who wants to use this conflict to erase his people’s enemies before a New Age begins”…
There can be little doubt now that President Bush’s reason for launching the war in Iraq was, for him, fundamentally religious. He was driven by his belief that the attack on Saddam’s Iraq was the fulfilment of a Biblical prophesy in which he had been chosen to serve as the instrument of the Lord.
And British Prime Minister Tony Blair long-time mentor, advisor and confidante said:
“Tony’s Christian faith is part of him, down to his cotton socks. He believed strongly at the time, that intervention in Kosovo, Sierra Leone – Iraq too – was all part of the Christian battle; good should triumph over evil, making lives better.”
Mr Burton, who was often described as Mr Blair’s mentor, says that his religion gave him a “total belief in what’s right and what’s wrong”, leading him to see the so-called War on Terror as “a moral cause”…
Anti-war campaigners criticised remarks Mr Blair made in 2006, suggesting that the decision to go to war in Iraq would ultimately be judged by God.
Bill Moyers reports that the organization Christians United for Israel - led by highly-influential Pastor John C. Hagee - is a universal call to all Christians to help factions in Israel fund the Jewish settlements, throw out all the Palestinians and lobby for a pre-emptive invasion of Iran. All to bring Russia into a war against us causing World War III followed by Armageddon, the Second Coming and The Rapture. See this and this.
This all revolves around what is called Dispensationalism. So popular is Dispensationalism that Tim LaHaye's Left Behind series has sold 65 million copies. Dispensationalists include the following mega-pastors and their churches:
They are supported by politicians such as:
- Texas Senator John Cronyn
- Former House Minority Whip Roy Blunt
- Former House Majority Leader Tom DeLay
- And others
Dr. Timothy Webber - an evangelical Christian who has served as a teacher of church history and the history of American religion at Denver Seminary and Southern Baptist Theological Seminary in Louisville, Vice-President at Northern Baptist Theological Seminary in Lombard, IL, and President of Memphis Theological Seminary in Tennessee - notes:
In a recent Time/CNN poll, more than one-third of Americans said that since the terrorist attacks of 9/11, they have been thinking more about how current events might be leading to the end of the world.
While only 36 percent of all Americans believe that the Bible is God's Word and should be taken literally, 59 percent say they believe that events predicted in the Book of Revelation will come to pass. Almost one out of four Americans believes that 9/11 was predicted in the Bible, and nearly one in five believes that he or she will live long enough to see the end of the world. Even more significant for this study, over one-third of those Americans who support Israel report that they do so because they believe the Bible teaches that the Jews must possess their own country in the Holy Land before Jesus can return.
Millions of Americans believe that the Bible predicts the future and that we are living in the last days. Their beliefs are rooted in dispensationalism, a particular way of understanding the Bible's prophetic passages, especially those in Daniel and Ezekiel in the Old Testament and the Book of Revelation in the New Testament. They make up about one-third of America's 40 or 50 million evangelical Christians and believe that the nation of Israel will play a central role in the unfolding of end-times events. In the last part of the 20th century, dispensationalist evangelicals become Israel's best friends-an alliance that has made a serious geopolitical difference.
***
Starting in the 1970s, dispensationalists broke into the popular culture with runaway best-sellers, and a well-networked political campaign to promote and protect the interests of Israel. Since the mid-1990s, tens of millions of people who have never seen a prophetic chart or listened to a sermon on the second coming have read one or more novels in the Left Behind series, which has become the most effective disseminator of dispensationalist ideas ever.
***
During the early 1980s the Israeli Ministry of Tourism recruited evangelical religious leaders for free "familiarization" tours. In time, hundreds of evangelical pastors got free trips to the Holy Land. The purpose of such promotional tours was to enable people of even limited influence to experience Israel for themselves and be shown how they might bring their own tour group to Israel. The Ministry of Tourism was interested in more than tourist dollars: here was a way of building a solid corps of non-Jewish supporters for Israel in the United States by bringing large numbers of evangelicals to hear and see Israel's story for themselves. The strategy caught on.
***
Shortly after the Six-Day War, elements within the Israeli government saw the potential power of the evangelical subculture and began to mobilize it as a base of support that could influence American foreign policy. The Israeli government sent Yona Malachy of its Department of Religious Affairs to the United States to study American fundamentalism and its potential as an ally of Israel. Malachy was warmly received by fundamentalists and was able to influence some of them to issue strong pro-Israeli manifestos. By the mid-1980s, there was a discernible shift in the Israeli political strategy. The American Israel Public Affairs Committee (AIPAC), the Jewish state's major lobbying group in Washington, D.C., started re-aligning itself with the American political right-wing, including Christian conservatives. Israel's timing was perfect. It began working seriously with American dispensationalists at the precise moment that American fundamentalists and evangelicals were discovering their political voice.
***
Probably the largest pro-Israel organization of its kind is the National Unity Coalition for Israel, which was founded by a Jewish woman who learned how to get dispensationalist support. NUCI opposes "the establishment of a Palestinian state within the borders of Israel."
***
In their commitment to keep Israel strong and moving in directions prophesied by the Bible, dispensationalists are supporting some of the most dangerous elements in Israeli society. They do so because such political and religious elements seem to conform to dispensationalist beliefs about what is coming next for Israel. By lending their support-both financial and spiritual-to such groups, dispensationalists are helping the future they envision come to pass.
***
Dispensationalists believe that the Temple is coming too; and their convictions have led them to support the aims and actions of what most Israelis believe are the most dangerous right-wing elements in their society, people whose views make any compromise necessary for lasting peace impossible. Such sentiments do not matter to the believers in Bible prophecy, for whom the outcome of the quarrelsome issue of the Temple Mount has already been determined by God.
Since the end of the Six-Day War, then, dispensationalists have increasingly moved from observers to participant-observers. They have acted consistently with their convictions about the coming Last Days in ways that make their prophecies appear to be self-fulfilling.
***
As Paul Boyer has pointed out, dispensationalism has effectively conditioned millions of Americans to be somewhat passive about the future and provided them with lenses through which to understand world events. Thanks to the sometimes changing perspectives of their Bible teachers, dispensationalists are certain that trouble in the Middle East is inevitable, that nations will war against nations, and that the time is coming when millions of people will die as a result of nuclear war, the persecution of Antichrist, or as a result of divine judgment. Striving for peace in the Middle East is a hopeless pursuit with no chance of success.
***
For the dispensational community, the future is determined. The Bible's prophecies are being fulfilled with amazing accuracy and rapidity. They do not believe that the Road Map will-or should-succeed. According to the prophetic texts, partitioning is not in Israel's future, even if the creation of a Palestinian state is the best chance for peace in the region. Peace is nowhere prophesied for the Middle East, until Jesus comes and brings it himself. The worse thing that the United States, the European Union, Russia, and the United Nations can do is force Israel to give up land for a peace that will never materialize this side of the second coming. Anyone who pushes for peace in such a manner is ignoring or defying God's plan for the end of the age.
***
It seems clear that dispensationalism is on a roll, that its followers feel they are riding the wave of history into the shore of God's final plan. Why should they climb back into the stands when being on the field of play is so much more fun and apparently so beneficial to the game's outcome? As [one dispensationalist group's] advertisement read, "Don't just read about prophecy when you can be part of it."
ATHEIST WAR HAWKS MANIPULATE BELIEVERS TO BEAT THE DRUMS OF WAR
Leo Strauss is the father of the Neo-Conservative movement, including many leaders of the current administration.
Indeed, many of the main neocon players - including Paul Wolfowitz, Richard Perle, Stephen Cambone, Elliot Abrams, and Adam Shulsky - were students of Strauss at the University of Chicago, where he taught for many years.
The people pushing for war against Iran are the same neocons who pushed for war against Iraq. See this and this. (They planned both wars at least 20 years ago.) For example, Shulsky was the director of the Office of Special Plans - the Pentagon unit responsible for selling false intelligence regarding Iraq’s weapons of mass. He is now a member of the equivalent organization targeting Iran: the Iranian Directorate.
Strauss, born in Germany, was an admirer of Nazi philosophers and of Machiavelli. Strauss believed that a stable political order required an external threat and that if an external threat did not exist, one should be manufactured. Specifically, Strauss thought that:
A political order can be stable only if it is united by an external threat . . . . Following Machiavelli, he maintained that if no external threat exists then one has to be manufactured
(the quote is by one of Strauss' main biographers).
Indeed, Stauss used the analogy of Gulliver's Travels to show what a Neocon-run society would look like:
"When Lilliput [the town] was on fire, Gulliver urinated over the city, including the palace. In so doing, he saved all of Lilliput from catastrophe, but the Lilliputians were outraged and appalled by such a show of disrespect." (this quote also from the same biographer)
Moreover, Strauss said:
Only a great fool would call the new political science diabolic . . . Nevertheless one may say of it that it fiddles while Rome burns. It is excused by two facts: it does not know that it fiddles, and it does not know that Rome burns.
So Strauss seems to have advocated governments letting terrorizing catastrophes happen on one's own soil to one's own people -- of "pissing" on one's own people, to use his Gulliver's travel analogy. And he advocates that government's should pretend that they did not know about such acts of mayhem: to intentionally "not know" that Rome is burning. He advocates messing with one's own people in order to save them from some "catastophe" (perhaps to justify military efforts to monopolize middle eastern oil to keep it away from our real threat -- an increasingly-powerful China?).
What does this have to do with religion?
Strauss taught that religion should be used as a way to manipulate people to achieve the aims of the leaders. But that the leaders themselves need not believe in religion.
As Wikipedia notes:
In the late 1990s Irving Kristol and other writers in neoconservative magazines began touting anti-Darwinist views, in support of intelligent design. Since these neoconservatives were largely of secular backgrounds, a few commentators have speculated that this – along with support for religion generally – may have been a case of a "noble lie", intended to protect public morality, or even tactical politics, to attract religious supporters.
So is it any surprise that the folks who planned war against Iraq and Iran at least 20 years ago are pushing religious disinformation to stir up the evangelical community?
Conservative Christians were the biggest backers of the Iraq war. And the Neocons are catering to them to try to back them into war with Iran, as well.
I've recently seen a swarm of spam claiming that all Muslims are evil, that they want to take over the world and establish a Muslim caliphate, and that they want to nuke Iran. They misquote Muslims and use false statements to try to stir up religious hatred.
They are simply promoting the Straussian playbook: stir up religious sentiment - even if you are personally an atheist - to create and demonize an "enemy", so as to promote war ...
NOT A PROBLEM WITH A PARTICULAR RELIGION ... BUT OF IMMATURITY
Most Americans confuse Zionism and Judaism. But many devout Jews are against Zionism, and Zionists can be Christian.
And as I've repeatedly noted, fundamentalist Jews, Christians, Muslims and Hindus are all very much alike, and often willing to use violence to spread their ideology ... while more spiritually mature Jews, Christians, Muslims and Hindus are all much more tolerant and peaceful than their evangelical brothers:
As Christian writer and psychiatrist M. Scott Peck explained, there are different stages of spiritual maturity. Fundamentalism – whether it be Muslim, Christian, Jewish or Hindu fundamentalism – is an immature stage of development. There are peaceful, contemplative Muslim sects – think the poet Rumi the poet and Sufis – and violent sects, just as there are contemplative Christian orders and violent Christian groups (and peaceful and violent atheists).
While there are certainly some Arab terrorists, Islam cannot be blamed for their barbaric murderous actions, just as Christianity cannot be blamed for the Norwegian Christian terrorist - Anders Behring Breivik's actions. University of Chicago professor Robert A. Pape – who specializes in international security affairs – points out:
Extensive research into the causes of suicide terrorism proves Islam isn’t to blame — the root of the problem is foreign military occupations.
The 9/11 hijackers used cocaine and drank alcohol, slept with prostitutes and attended strip clubs … but they did not worship at any mosque. See this, this, this, this, this, this, this, and this. So they were not really Muslims.
And even atheists like Stalin can be terrorists, or at least genocidal maniacs.
Indeed, all religions teach compassion, love and the Golden Rule. Likewise, atheism teaches respect for the individual, the most good for the most people, and helping everyone reach their human potential.
Some within each philosophy follow these teachings, and others want to kill everyone who doesn't agree with them. The issue is not really the label of this religion or that, but of maturity and true spirituality and compassion.
Postscript 1: Neoliberals and Neoconservatives are very similar in many ways. And because Neocons are not conservative, nothing in this post is meant to criticize conservatism.
Postscript 2: Most evangelicals are not dispensationalists, and so do not want to bring on armageddon.
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How many Gods?
Since when do numbers matter when the ISSUE is the result?
I "hate" idiocy. And I "hate" power (and all that it does). That's ALL I need to say.
But, again... the facts as noted in the article ARE facts. The title doesn't say ALL Evangelicals. If you're an "Evangelical" then maybe you better start working on those who are straying from YOUR flock?
Bullshit.
I have never met a single Christian in my entire life who was eager for the apocalypse.
I'm not a church goer, but I am glad to live with them.
Ask yourself a simple question, it's 2 o'clock AM and you're walking down an alley and four men walk out of a door in front of you, they're holding bibles, are you more afraid or less afraid when you notice the bibles?
Are they wearing a jacket and a tie?
Depends on whether I'm an atheist and whether they're ardent followers of Pat Robertson or John Hagee.
More afraid. What the hell are they doing at 2am that requires bibles?
Yellowhoard:
My comments:
I think that George Washington was talking about an entirely different subject than you are. I think that even George Washington agrees to the fact that followers of John Hagee and Jerry Falwell are less prone to commit crimes than the average American citizen. But it is also more likely that a follower of John Hagee or Jerry Falwell thinks that is justified to nuke Iran if you compare him to the average Catholic.
Neither, but I'm not a paranoid profiling freak.
ask yourself this:
it's 3 pm and they put their right hand on the bible and swear to uphold the constitution.
are you more afraid or less?
I am afraid we'll have less of the constitution to uphold.
What color are they? Are they wearing sheets?
Any color.
And I've NEVER seen the assholes wearing sheets. Yeah, it happened a few generations ago... but not in my lifetime.... and I'm not especially young.
A "few" generations? Not even a fraction of ONE, if, that is, you go by what the term "generation" was originally established as/to mean.
From http://www.khouse.org/articles/2002/438/ (image: http://www.khouse.org/images/artpics/chart_of_declining_longevit.gif), it was 930 years.
Don't holler at me, I'm only the messenger...
Chuck Missler, eh? Smart dude, but some of his material is interesting and some of it is utter lunacy. Some of it is very on point with the topics being discussed in this article, and not all of it in a good way.
In today's world of metrics, a generation = 25 years.
Of course, but the trolls don't care. It's about hurting people who disagree with their enlightened doctrines.
perhaps they skipped your house for a reason.
They mistook it for your house?
Annoyed. They want to confront my sins and I'm late for an orgy.
Just sayin'
Most of the time I favor quality, but now and then, there's a lot to be said for quantity, or as the late, great John Updike once said of gold, "I love the muchness of it."
george wash. congrats on joining the forces of demogogic misreprestation and deceit. im sure bill graham would be interested to learn hes yearning for ww3. obama or romney could use a man of your abilities on the campaign trail
Isn't it a little early to be posting drunk?
Its never to early to post drunk. Just bring your bible. Thumping it is optional.
Truth hurts, live with it!
http://baltimore.indymedia.org/newswire/display/15882/index.php
Another fucking power monger. That people continually need to look up to others is a sign of weakness (and often provides cover for them taking responsibility of their own actions).
Hold the flag, spout the "Word" and people will defend others for ANY crime.
Gott mit uns?
how would u know if truth hurts
well,
we better just get this jesus fellow to get off his hiney and so some peace-envoying cause i'm tired of paying $17,353,498 for a litre of gasoline.
Liar, Liar, CNN on fire…
Ahh, the sins of omission and dishonest wordsmithery used by the Time/CNN pollsters when they reported that “While only 36 percent of all Americans believe that the Bible is God's Word and should be taken literally, 59 percent say they believe that events predicted in the Book of Revelation will come to pass. The truth is:
“More than three-quarters of Americans believe the Bible is literally the word of God or inspired by the word of God, according to a trio of Gallup surveys, with 19 percent saying the Good Book is a compendium of myth and legend..”
Here’s the rest of the truth, reported by figures that haven’t changed much since 1991 in Polls: Most believe Bible as God’s word | The Washington Times | 05/29/07
“The three surveys found that an average 31 percent of the respondents said that “the Bible is absolutely accurate and should be taken literally word for word,” according to Frank Newport, editor in chief of the Gallup Poll.
“Forty-seven percent said the Bible was “the inspired word of God,” and 19 percent said it was a book of ancient fables, history and “moral precepts” recorded by man…
“Beliefs vary among religious groups. Among non-Catholic Christians, 45 percent take the Bible literally, while 46 percent say it’s inspired by God. The figure is 40 percent and 48 percent, respectively, among Protestants, and 21 percent and 61 percent among Catholics…”
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2007/may/29/20070529-111815-7952r/
'Another century of readers--and spirit itself will stink.' --Nietzsche
Although I'm a little tired of these 'Bible societies' I found this article to hit upon something that actually isn't confronted enough and that is the total bankruptcy of clergy and religion within major metro areas in the States.
I get the sense you were offended by this article.
No, exactly the opposite. I think George is addressing America’s most pressing current problem - the rush to war and the propagandizing of patriots.
The serious mistake being made here by these propagandized Christians is their confusion between the Israelites of the Bible and the modern, belligerent political state of Israel. It would be wrong to identify Christian clergy as the problem in that it’s only a few church leaders who are working in tandem, not with religious Jews, but with Likud Talmudic Jews who see these propagandized Christians as an important influence on American foreign policy.
George is to be commended on his extensive research here; it's very helpful. The one thing I continue to worry about, however, is the misuse by the media of two key words: evangelical and fundamentalist. I believe evangelical refers to the teachings of the Christian religion and the sharing with others. Fundamentalism is simply believing in the truth of the Gospels. Unfortunately, the media would use both of these terms to identify believers as radicals. The propagandized Christians, IMO, do not fit these definitions. They cease to be fundamentalists or evangelicals when they interpret the Bible as advising a missile attack on Iran, and simply become idiots.
Also, George could have listed Rick Santorum in his list of dispensationalists. Where Newt Gingrich is an explosion-waiting-to-happen, Santorum is a measured, carefully-controlled robot with the controls in the hands of American Zionists.
Santorum is NOT a dispensationalist. He's serious Catholic. The two are incompatable.
He is certainly willing to rub elbows with the dispensationalists though:
You can see Santorum at Hagee's 2007 event in this video at about 6:16:
http://youtu.be/mjMRgT5o-Ig
Rick's looking pretty compatible there to me...
I thought Santorum was some sort of frothy mixture.
I'm no fan of Santorum, but honestly, I think that joke's getting old and wasn't terribly funny to begin with.
that Santorum is seriously being considered as a political figure, hoping to represent amrka - no really, THAT joke's just begun, and it's both HILARIOUS and frightening.
define it however you will.
Glad you cleared that up. Strange how there is no way of avoiding the political scene now. Everything is political now in the States, that is to say everything is economic. From now on all friendship is political, for gain, domination. An unsustainable life meets an ugly reality and too many want to press the panic button.
Not to be ironical, but America needs to evolve; allow itself to evolve or at least admit some responsibility for its own future. Introspection doesn't sell very well in the States, not when there are so many enemies out there.
People love to be scared. For whatever reason, they are attracted to things that scare them. Witness the plethora of theme parks and scary movies and bungee jumps. I think the dynamic involved is the relief that comes from having faced (insert favorite horror) and survived - a testament that life is not so bad after all.
Politics exploits this fundamental human condition. Look at the bad that could and will happen if you don't vote for me. Come to daddy and I will make your world safe from (insert favorite horror).
What politican would ever get elected by telling folks that all is well and they only need him to babysit the government and do nothing?
.
I agree with what you're saying here - but I would add "religion" to the sentence, "politics and religion" - these are the two main artificial constructs that most minds labour under. . .
religion enforces the dualist, hierarchical thinking - most righteous to least pyramid, most favoured to loved least, "spiritually pure" male sullied by "defiled" female (aka "sex"), etc. - and from this basis, politics and the parasites that seek office just expand on the psychosis - it's what people know, and they're too pacified and fearful to know anything else, for the most part. as you say, anyone offering to play the role of "daddy" is seen as someone else offering to take responsibility for their lives, and they will gladly hand that over for any promises that sooth their minds.
add to the fact that amrka is crawling with religious folks "called" to proselytise their mind-tripping, and for every one called there are many to follow - you can't MOVE for all the little houses converted to "churches" let alone the HUGE mega-churches seen off every freeway - someone is frequenting these stadiums, yes?
While on one level, I sympathize with your argument, it is also one of scads on this blog that arrogantly assume, after all is said, that religious people are étant donné stupid. This is like an axiom of geometry for many and has become orthodoxy. It doesn't even need to be stated since all are agreed on this a priori. By definition, anyone who has certain religious beliefs, particularly what used to be called Christian beliefs that embraced Catholics and Protestants alike, but now is only used to designate the only the most closed-minded fundamentalist or evangelical, is considered to be at least one sandwich short of a picnic. You disparagingly refer to "mind-tripping", particularly in refering to the meretricious manifestations of religious belief, as if they represent the whole spectrum of Christian religious belief, although I have no doubt that you would stay clear of criticizing what has become a cliché and parody, the Dalai Lama. You probably take refuge in the fact that it is a free country and one can say what he/she likes about anything, as if that absolves you from the need for absolution.
Ever met a closed-minded evolutionist whose conception of physical reality is rooted in Lagrangian determinism?
I can only speak for myself, and I will say that having been raised in one of the more cultist "christian" faiths, which I left behind as soon as I was of legal age to escape the family ties to it - the majority of proselytising faiths have an overwhelming majority of follower-mentalities as members, characterised as either minds who are content to be "filled" with a storyline that is comforting to their behaviours, or minds who like groups of similars for company. . . interspersed with minds that love to be placed in authority positions, revered by others based on the benefits their belief system bestows, and not so much for their "works" in the world, inherent worth in other words.
many are "nice folks" and relatively harmless, although that is also debatable - the harm to "others" by continually voting in "their beliefs" is tangible and real to some on the receiving end of the "righteous" thinkers.
I've no strong opinions about the Dalai Lama, he is doing the work he feels called to do, and if he's taking an anti-war and hatred stance, I'm with him there. I don't do religion of any type, I source my own truths in a non-dual philosophy that so far has allowed me to stay outside the ring of boxing ideas, although it IS my nature to argue.
probably not.
I think I understand where you are coming from: that religion in your experience was basically indoctrination, and certainly it is abused that way. In effect, that would appear to be how you experienced it--having seemingly well-intentioned (or not) people essentially cramming it down your throat--not a whole lot different from political propaganda. It doesn't help that such people are usually ignorant and bigoted.
However, there are many who find the person of Jesus so mysterious and attractive that they end up becoming devoted to him all their lives, although they may fall away due to social pressures and a need to prove their intellectual bona fides. Where does their idea of Jesus come from? It arises spontaneously in the heart. This, to me is a great mystery, but it has nothing to do with indoctrination or being forced. In fact, someone who might, left to themselves, experience this bond may be driven away from that due to being revolted by all the intellectual straitjacketing and the disgusting spectacle of most so-called religious people. There are also parents who have a visceral hatred for religious faith and mystical experience who will not allow a child, who would otherwise naturally wonder about God and find themselves attracted to the mystery of Jesus, to have that experience. They will take extreme prophylactic measures to avoid religious contamination. On the other hand, they may be quite open to Buhhdhism, where there is no risk of forming that bond.
Atheists have everything figured out. They "know" that if a child is attracted to Jesus, some nefarious person, one way or another, has corrupted and subverted that child. They know that the only thing that counts is the physical brain, and that all mystical states are due either to psychology or to meddling with the electric energy fields of the brain and nothing more.
Then there are those who have done something evil who then build an intellectual scaffolding around their evil deed to make it seem not only justifiable, but desirable.
I understand what you are saying, although I would frame it differently,
it is my opinion that people who have this spontaneous arising from the heart - and THEN name it JESUS - have a pre-scripted reality. . . which is the function of written language, perpetuating the storyline over time.
I have known this realisation, this feeling you describe, but I didn't name it "Jesus" because I'd already been familiarised with the concept of "him" and what I felt was not "that". . .
it is in the naming of things that we fix their meaning, and language limits, that is it's function - to isolate each "thing" in order to describe it - the "intellectual scaffolding" words seem appropriate here.
it is my opinon that the "mystical states" are available to anyone, but in the describing of these states to others, common languaging reduces them to common ideas. . . a true mystic has a relationship only to that which is felt within, and this is specific to each. . . religion is organised around common ideas, ideas held in common, and this has nothing to do with the Oneness of mystics.
my own perspective, of course.
This is an old thread now, and you probably won't get this. If you do get this, I suspect some sort of synchronicity or time independent quantum fluctuation in the Bose-Einstein condensate is at work ;) I too have difficulty with the Father, because my own father was very authoritarian. To this day, I cannot get over my hatred for hierarchy in the workplace and I mistrust people over me. Isn't this the way it works? We are scarred by our childhood experience. Yet Jesus' relationship with his father is different from the relationship I had with my father. I happened to be in a bookstore and I picked up a book by a famous French nun who recently died--unfortunately, her name does not come to me at this moment (she worked with poor children in Cairo)--and she was writing about how she could not help loving a God the Father who suffers and is open and vulnerable, just like we are. The fact that "he" is male--maybe that ceases to have any real meaning and is just a relic of the past. I cannot abide male authority figures, due to my own past. I take encouragement from what this Bonne Soeur says. I have the impression that Jesus and Mary and the whole heavenly host suffer grievously at our cruelty and mistreatment of others. They do this voluntarily--both Jesus and Mary were and are human and haven't shed their humanity. I must be loyal to my own experience and so I believe implicitly that Jesus was speaking the truth when he said, "I am the way, the truth, and the life." It's not that I know this, it's that I keep discovering it. I love the Catholic Church, the Rosary, the Stations of the Cross. So many people misunderstand the interiority of the Catholic faith and focus on the negatives--pedophile priests, the Vatican Bank, the Inquisition, the support of the Nazis, although I'm not sure about this last. What about the hedge churches in Ireland during the Plantation Era, what about the great saints and more recent saints like Padre Pio? Or Cuban prisoners calling out the name of Jesus just before they are mowed down by a firing squad? Are these things reprehensible?
I also love mathematics and physics and there is some cognitive dissonance in all of this, but I accept that. I keep up with your posts because I'll never forget your March 2011 prediction, and I believe you are somehow wired-in to a sort of super-reality though I know not the "cast" of that reality.
ooh, love this!
and your post is rich with information, background into your choices and what keeps your flame burning, appreciate your sharing.
the French nun, I believe this is Soeur Emmanuelle? I'm not familiar with her writings, but I very much like her description in the article I found, "Known for her straight-talk and quick repartee" - as well as her charitable works.
http://tvnz.co.nz/content/2217793/4042040.xhtml
anyhow, from all that you've written here, I would say you are drawn to a more contemplative life, as am I - this being more about observing than participating, at least on the long timeline. . . the rebellion against the Father archetype, for me at least, is a sign of the times - you also mention my "March 2011 prediction" - so I'm guessing you'll not mind if I use astrological archetypes here?
there is a confronting of the "authority over" archetype (Capricorn), which is Father in the family, law enforcement in the community, government in the nationstate, and military between nationstates - all of these things en-Force rules and laws. religion, which is patriarcal in nature, falls in here too - all of these are under pressure to evolve (the planet Pluto archetype), or expire (death). the polarity embodies more compassion, awareness, understanding, nurture - so, Mother in the family, personal responsibility for actions and more involvement in community, the desire for less government, and less power over people's lives - but in order to realise this, people need to develop discipline, be aware of their impact on others, etc.
I'd say you are more drawn to the compassionate, mystic aspects of organised religion, less about the punitive - it's my opinion that the rules, the structures, the rituals of religion are needed until the empathy is awakened, at which time a more direct relationship with the heart of a belief takes precedent - the priests, etc. are the intermediaries between "god" and the individual - for the mystic, the relationship is "god within" as one. . . like Souer Emmanuelle? she was merely the compassion and charity of "god" in action, yes? while she had her own unique personality, her life was service to her ideal, she embodied her beliefs. . . there was no need for any authority over, she handled her life in accordance with her heart.
which is where humanity needs to evolve to, in my opinion - emphasising the intellect over the heart has brought us "progress" but has also favoured a sociopath archetype that clamours to control, irrespective of the needs of others, compassion is mocked as weak, etc. - sadly, there will be much suffering to come, but this is always present in the world, and many amrkns have escaped having to experience this directly, instead "outsourcing" it to other nations via a military force that secures the needs of "average" citizens - now they are coming to see the overgrowth of power that has been extended to far corners of the world, and rather karmically is stretching its tentacles into the "homeland" - I'll just say amrka was "born on the 4th of July" which makes it a "cancer" archetype country - "mom, apple pie, have-a-nice-day, disney-ish" and this current Pluto in the opposite sign of Capricorn will "oppose" or threaten that image to evolve or die - Pluto has a 248 year cycle, so this brings us to the "birth" of amrka in years, it's significant as an archetype when applied to the amrkn "birth"chart.
and this upcoming month of March, packed full of challenges globally - as was last year, only more so. . . I've no "predictions" beyond the knowledge that this year will be an historical game-changer, with the full moon over 7-8 March being very tense (coincides with Purim, so may involve first strikes), and March 20 vernal equinox is followed by a new moon that I doubt will pass without dramatic impact, somewhere in the world . . the latter half of June will also be important - the bottom line here is old structures, beliefs, boundaries - all are under the sudden changes of uranus in aries in a tense aspect to pluto in capricorn - no way are things to remain the same, we all feel it, yes?
*gah* I'm glad this thread is "cold" - otherwise I'd feel guilty, ha! one last thing - your love of math & physics, I think these are compatible with a mind that seeks to know the whole by investigating the parts - Fritjof Capra, among others, comes to mind - and the rituals of Roman Catholic churches are full of representations of truths, abstracted for contemplation - you make sense to me! follow your heart.
http://www.theosociety.org/pasadena/sunrise/47-97-8/sc-imo.htm
(a Capra review link - check the quote at the bottom, nice)
People are looking for anyone who will give them answers about what life means, because they think that someone else can tell them what is right for them. Organized religion has exploited that human condition far worse than politics ever could. "You'll only get to heaven if you believe in our God! And it's a sin to even set a foot in another religion's house or worship!"
(I escaped Catholicism right after First Communion.)
Very well said.
Pennsylvania voters threw Santorum out of office for good reason. Nobody there buys into his "working class guy" bullshit. The guy is a twit and a moron.
he looks ever so nice and a pair of safe hands in his preppy sweaters though.
Fascinating reading.
It's impossible for someone programmed with a religious meme to see the world as it is. I won't waste time debating the next world but I truely have symapthy for this affliction.
Islam is an existential, mortal threat to every living thing in this world and time is running out. Once the Islamic threat is neutralized, Christians can turn their attention to killing each other and destroying what's left. One thing at a time.
Some of the funniest comments here are the ones trying to apply 'logic' to people's 'beliefs'.
what total bullshit.
zerohedge needs to scrub this shit clean from its servers.