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These People Are All CRAZY ... (Aren't They?)
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"There is video of firefighters and police telling people to stand back because the building is going to be brought down, is going to be blown up. So at the very least there should be an independent investigation as to how these people knew in advance that WTC7 was going to collapse."
5 seconds of reading this and I find it is nearly all fallacy.
Let's go:
1) Firefighters and Police say something, it must be true.
This is Appeal to Authority - thus your entire post is now garbage, nonsense, illogical.
2) All humans under stress have inaccurate perceptions of the events as they happen. Police and Firemen, too. This causes them to observe things that are not happening, to incorrectly assume causes, to not assess things dispassionately. It is much more likely they were terrified, and grasping at any cause to tell people to motivate them to get the hell away.
Also, the tower was VISIBLY leaning for quite a while above impact point and some could see this and would, correctly, conclude that it might fall.
3) I have seen your videos and they SAY that 'It's going to come down'. This is an expression of *fear*, not of knowledge or of hope, or planning.
4) Then you conclude, incorrectly, that this proves they knew in advance, and thus there must be an investigation of why and how they knew.
===
(1) Is in any list of logical fallacies, often in the first few. Appeal to Authority is a very VERY common logical mis-step. This, alone, makes your point non-factual.
(2) This is well noted and known in a variety of research journals and is common knowledge. It is why the Police and Lawyers take statements repeatedly to collect evidence for crimes. Folks simply don't recall stressful, life threatening events correctly.
(3) This is typical Truther/CT bias. You hear someone posit "Christ, it's gonna come down!" and you interpret this as fact and proof that the person who spoke knows this, planned it, etc. This is just insanity upon your part, a gap in intellect so vast as to be un-brookable.
(4) This is a logical conclusion, but it is based upon 3 illogical premises so it is irrelevant and wrong.
What a bunch of specious arguments, Monsieur Arnaquer. You must have gained your prowess in argument form arguing with your wife--or maybe you are the wife. I'm sure your jaw has a lot of muscular strength.
pure wackoism
Not so sure -- BUT -- this is opening an issue that would ripe America apart if found to be true ... much like the outstanding issue of JFK's death.
Pretty distuburbing when you ask --why would someone do this ...and think they can get away with it.
First of all let me confess my ignorance of the details of this video. As I type we are 20 August 2011. That happened on 9/11/2001: ten years ago.
This is the first time I am seeing the video of WTC7 building! Isn't that amazing. We saw those two other buildings go down. To my knowledge the third building, this one, got little coverage in Europe. Seeing this video is an eye opener. All the spiel I've heard here for the last few months on ZH now made crystal clear. As David Pierre says, we cannot be accessories after we know the facts. TY GW for showing me in pictoral form what a thousand, a million words, could not convey.
Mind boggling these films. As the lady said ..."The smoking gun was seeing the whole structure collapse in symmetry". No other commentary required. I'm totally on board now.
This is potential criminal evidence that equals, surpasses, a certain event which occurred on November 22, 1963 in Dallas.
Once you've tasted blood once, it becomes a recurrent habit...JFK, RFK, MLK...9/11, the list gets longer and longer. "Lucifer" is a convenient misnomer that has been used since civilization began...So this type of power play is alas, old hat, and endemic of human nature as inconised by the sons of the House of Atreus. I prefer mythical pseudo historical reference to mythical, dogmatic, creationist reference.
WTC7 was an unstable building to begin with. An organization that I worked for in the 80's did engineering and wind tunnel tests of the whole area. The engineers were shocked with WTC7 and suggested you never enter.
Beware. The Fire of Truth will consume you.
Name the "organization".
piss off
Your avatar is saying something different.
A 747 is 60 tonnes of aluminium. The superstructure of the WTC buildings was steel, coated with rust; iron oxide. That alone gives you thermite. All you need is enough heat to melt the aluminium and kick off the reaction, queue 40 tonnes of jet fuel. Then temperatures will hit ~3000K.
So I am not convinced about talk of thermite in the dust. WTC7, no idea.
Maybe so but no plane hit WC7. And it still fell straight down. Straight!!!
1) The aluminum skin of an airplane is NOT the same as aluminum powder.
2) You're forgetting about the solid steel columns that made up the core backbone of the towers.
NO plane crash, or resulting fires could have weakened 50 million tons of core structure to the point of total collapse. The principles that govern heat conductivity alone confirm that.
GTFO, you establishment hack.
Not convinced? You apparently are not aware of the peer-reviewed scientific analysis of the 'red chips' found through all the samples of WTC dust. The fragments are no accidental mix, they are unexploded chips of a high tech military explosive, only invented a little before 911 and available only to US & Israeli military.
Here's some reading on the topic:
http://www.mccmedia.com/pipermail/brin-l/Week-of-Mon-20060703/037039.html
Physics Prof Finds Thermate in WTC Physical Samples
http://www.fourwinds10.com/siterun_data/government/fraud/911_attack/news...
WTC Towers Brought Down by 'Active Thermitic Material'
(Good pic of the molten steel cascade)
http://stopthelie.com/the_evidence_is_in.html
Professor Steven Jones presenting his X-ray spectrometry evidence from samples taken at the WTC site. They dramatically show a PERFECT MATCH for the highly specialized compound "thermate" (used for cutting through steel) found in the WTC debris. (And no, thermate was NOT used during the clean up operation...this stuff was in the building, and ignited, prior to collapse.) If you're new to this information, you might want to check out "Molten Metal" and "Fire Initiated Collapse - Primary Arguments Against"
http://www.fourwinds10.com/siterun_data/government/fraud/911_attack/news...
Active Thermitic Material Discovered in Dust from the 9/11 World Trade Center Catastrophe
http://www.bentham-open.org/pages/content.php?TOCPJ/2009/00000002/000000...
http://www.bentham-open.org/pages/gen.php?file=7TOCPJ.pdf&PHPSESSID=4f62... (pdf)
(This is the 'beyond question' peer-reviewed paper, analyzing the 'red chips' of high-tech nano-thermite found in all the WTC dust samples. MUST READ. One of the very few 'absolute proofs' 911 was an inside job.)
20091024
http://world911truth.org/top-10-connections-between-nist-and-nanothermite/
http://www.journalof911studies.com/volume/2008/Ryan_NIST_and_Nano-1.pdf
The Top Ten Connections Between NIST And Nano-Thermites
by Kevin R. Ryan
http://www.fourwinds10.com/siterun_data/government/fraud/911_attack/news...
http://www.bollyn.com/index.php#article_11240
Who Put Super-Thermite in the Twin Towers?
Christopher Bollyn
July 20, 2009
http://www.bollyn.com/911#article_11253
Recipe for Making Super Thermite
http://www.bollyn.com/public/Making_Super_Thermite.pdf
Paper: Enhancing the Rate of Energy Release from NanoEnergetic Materials by Electrostatically Enhanced Assembly.
By Soo H. Kim and Michael R. Zachariah.
http://engforum.pravda.ru/showthread.php?t=276753
New photos and yet more proof that no giant airliner crashed into the Pentagon on 911
(My discussion of the 'steel burns' theory, from page 11 -
http://engforum.pravda.ru/showthread.php?t=276753&page=11
http://whatreallyhappened.com/WRHARTICLES/thermite.htm
Thermite and the WTC Collapses
Following the World Trade Center collapses thermal hot spots with temperatures in excess of 700°C existed deep within the wreckage of the buildings. These temperatures were sustained for a long period of time.
http://engforum.pravda.ru/showthread.php?p=3084248#post3084248
9/11 — Who Put Thermite in the World Trade Center?
by Christopher Bollyn 18 January 2007
(article about half way down in an otherwise stupid timewaster thread. Good pics.)
http://911research.wtc7.net/essays/thermite/blasting_scenario.html
"Hypothetical Blasting Scenario" which describes a possible methodology for implanting nano-thermite explosives without notice.
20100922
http://engforum.pravda.ru/showthread.php?296026-A-danish-scientist-Niels...(-english-subtitles
A danish scientist Niels Harrit, on nano-thermite in the WTC dust ( english subtitles
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8_tf25lx_3o&feature=player_embedded
20101003
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SlbdJjyhW2c&feature=feedrec
Molten Iron. Can you say THERMATE!
More good shots of the molten metal falling
20110308
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5d5iIoCiI8g
9/11 Experiments: The Great Thermate Debate
(Lots of fun blowing shit up in a back yard. Very convincing too.)
"These People Are All CRAZY...aren't they?"
Appeal to Authority Fallacy.
Whether someone is 'an expert' an Engineer, Scientist or Architect is irrelevant.
Whether they are an 'Expert' is irrelevant.
Either their argument must be logical and sound or it fails.
I have yet to read one paragraph of Truther 'proof', seen one webpage, read one argument, watched one video that does not engage in a logical fallacy within 30 seconds of reading.
It's tragic - all of you do not even know what this is:
1/2 m v2, or what it means or why it applies here.
Nor this:
MGH
or the amount of joules (you don't know that, either) required to melt one pound of steel, or the real time free-fall from 1300 feet is in seconds and the delta of WTC 1/2, or the mass of one floor of WTC 1, or that WTC7 was damaged, twisted on its superstructure and had settled 1/2 of one storey long before it fell, or any of a hundred other details.
I had an open mind, read all of your 'proof', watched the WTC videos about 200 times and then concluded it happened as widely accepted.
All of you lack the intelligence and observational abilites to see reality accurately. Never seen one of you string two math equations together in cogency wrt 'proving' your WTC theories.
The best you can do is write:
"Clearly something is wrong if a building collapses..."
Because you simply don't understand the forces at work, so it seems magical to you, and you are in Denial so you construct a Belief System (Truther-ism), aka A Religion (Conspiracy Theory) to explain that which you do not know nor understand.
To explain that which you Fear.
You are so terrified that you must create CT, because if the world really is as random as it is, that is a terrifying thought to you.
Here's some of those math figures you requested LeraC. It should help explain that which you fear.......the truth.
http://911research.wtc7.net/mirrors/guardian2/wtc/how-hot.htm
One minute to find the flaw. 30 minutes to disprove.
The errant assumptions include:
-That the jet fuel was the only source of heat and fire fuel
-That the only thing that burned was the jet fuel
-That the temperature needed to be raised to a point to melt steel, etc.
-Conflation of Heat and Temperature (they are not the same)
-Lack of knowledge about metals weakening at temperatures and heats far below melting point. Especially whilst under load of 10 or 20 storeys above them.
In here, of course, are your assumptions that you believe that the jet fuel had to reach a given temperature (wrong), that temperature had to melt steel (wrong) and this *melted* steel resulted in the collapse (wrong). Even if the calcs on said page were correct as to the estimation of maximum temperature, your other flaws doom the argument.
After about an hour the damage on several floors to the attachment points that held the floor to the central concrete pillar had begun to give way. Sure, the exterior tubing spaced 22inches held up, so did the floors, however each 1-acre floor was 'clipped' to the central concrete elevator and maintenance core by metal not as rugged as the support beams. The floors were all 'sprung' out from each core attachment to the outside tube. This design made WTC1/2 extremely vulnerable to this sort of attack.
If this had been done to the ESB, no collapse would have occurred.
The OP at your cite misses so many things. Such as the fires below causing extended damage to the floors above, that the full wings as he claims would eventually disgorge their fuel and that said fuel would burn, that the burning point of jet fuel is not the limiting factor in the temperature of a fire. That the planes caused structural damage that weakened the building and that fires caused this damage to increase.
His post of a test done on an 8 storey steel frame building designed entirely differently than the WTC1/2. Thus his cite is irrelevant and cannot be used to compare to WTC1/2.
House fires routinely reach 650 C for 20 or 30 minutes. Such extended temperatures, after a jet impact, with a 20 storey load above, are more than enough to weaken, not melt, weaken steel.
Do you know the design of WTC1/2, and the Standard Oil Tower in Chicago, differ from standard steel box girder construction?
Because reading your comments and your cite, neither of you seem aware of this fact.
The supports to the concrete core failed, the ones that attached the floor to the service core, they bent over time, this tilt to the building could be seen on video, and all it took was one floor to weaken, not melt, weaken; this causes one floor (and the rest of the building above it) to settle down one floor to the next. This simple act exceeds the design capability of the structure, and then it collapses as we saw.
This can be seen on several videos as one corner of one building slowly sinks down and the exterior bends or bows out. The building falls one storey, and after that the building was doomed to collapse due to the laws of physics. That the building fell straight down was due to the 'tube in a tube' design - basically the buildings exterior of 22" wide columns acted as a massive funnel and all energy was directed downwards.
Also the moment of inertia of such a large structure is such that it 'falling over' is not possible as so much inertial force was directed straight down that the building tipped a few degrees, fell one floor, then began to collapse more or less straight down as the downward moment of inertia caused the building to fall straight down.
I could do this all day, and in fact I have done this many times over the past 10 years, but I think you can see my point.
Or not. All CT Truthers lack the ability to recognize when they have been proven wrong.
Hardly proof. All you are doing is making a bunch of counterclaims that nobody except a team of experts could confirm or deny. As lay persons, we pretty much have to go with our gut as to which experts to believe. We also must appeal to authority figures since we are not experts. That's why experts exist and why courts use expert witnesses--because the judges and the jury are not experts. Frankly, the things you allege sound like a lot of mush to me, but then I'm not an expert. But basically you are asking us to disbelieve our eyes concerning building 7, which certainly "looks" like a standard issue demolition, which puts the burden of proof on you. So which expert does one go with? Jurys have to decide this regularly; the juror who is the most articulate at expressing his reservations about a given expert and why he believes another expert is to be trusted is the one that carries the day. I don't find your arguments against appealing to authority convincing, and your structural arguments have the ring of having been constructed from whole cloth and not the ring of an expert in building construction. For instance, you say that there is a difference in construction in the Standard Oil building in Chicago and the World Trade center towers. So what? Does knowing that bit of trivia make you some kind of expert? Your final sentence "All CT Truthers lack the ability to recognize when they have been proven wrong" gives away your whole game. You haven't proven anything at all. You've made counterclaims. You must be some kind of a former ambulance chasing lawyer who now works for the feds.
I would be quite happy to believe you if you were reasonable, but you are so obviously a tool that you should be fired from your job for incompetence. Bad job!
There are about 20 flaws in the standard CT poster, the ones you see on the comment threads here.
You just engaged in another one.
Namely that you are incapable of debating on your own.
You toss up hundred's of pages of links where someone else proves a point that you, frankly, don't understand.
Ask yourself why you cannot debate the point, here, now, with me, using your own education and intellect.
Also, again, Appeal to Authority. One that you guys live and die by.
I will waste my time and re-read your 'proof'.
I will time myself to the first error I find. Experience shows that this is measured in 30 second increments.
There is video of firefighters and police telling people to stand back because the building is going to be brought down, is going to be blown up. So at the very least there should be an independent investigation as to how these people knew in advance that WTC7 was going to collapse.
There is video of a NIST spokesman explicitly saying that there was no evidence of molten steel and yet there is both video evidence of molten steel and video interview evidence from the public, firefighters, construction workers and police talking about rivers of molten steel. So either NIST were unaware of this important evidence, which would suggest their investigation is fatally flawed, or someone is lying. This should be cause enough for an independent investigation.
WTC7 collapsed supposedly because of office fires. Think about that. Even if that were true, and it's utterly preposterous, but even if it were is it likely that the fires would cause the entire building's structure to fail uniformly so it collapses vertically? Isn't a partial collapse on one side or perhaps even a horizontal collapse (falling over) more like what you would expect?
If independent analysis of the dust from the area found traces of thermite don't you think the NIST team also found the same? They said they never looked for explosive traces but I find it impossible to believe that they didn't examine the dust. And if they didn't examine it then their investigation and report was fatallay flawed. If they did look and didn't find it, or didn't report it, then their investigation was fatally flawed or dishonest.
To call this random and a conspiracy theory is simply hiding behind name-calling and is intellectually dishonest.
If it's one thing we know it's that official reports and the party line are always wrong, if not outright intentionally deceitful. ZH offers an independent view on world/financial events exposing the rot of the official story. So perhaps 1500+ independent architects, structural and chemical engineers, demolition experts and others from the scientific community ought to be listened to.
Psychologists would say the opposite: That you are so terrified of either seeking or finding the truth that you suffer from "normalcy bias".
Keep drinking the Kool-aid.
Building 7...it shouldn't have fallen...it DID drop like a controlled demolition. Please explain building 7.
"I have yet to read one paragraph of Truther 'proof', seen one webpage, read one argument, watched one video that does not engage in a logical fallacy within 30 seconds of reading."
Hmmmm give yourself one more opportunity to read the statements and evidence presented by ae911truth.org. Come back to the Fight Club and debate the statements. I would really like to know what you know to counter the work of 1,537 architects and engineers.
Who knows you may know something they don't... just saying.
i was suspicious of the day it happend when i saw the BBC announce wtf7 just fell when it was still standing and i knew about the prior history of staged events which made me a non-believer in the official story... i really don't what happend that day i'm assuming i never will but trusting cheney rumsfeld wolfowitz and the rest of the neocons i can't do it
the most amazing thing about 9/11 is their expectation of getting away with it and then getting away with it. the world is doomed if people are willing to goto these lengths for greed and power.
As much as like conspiracy theory, here is what I think being the best explaination.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&v=_kSq663m0G8
No steel frame building has ever collapsed from fire before or after 9/11. There have been multiple high rise fires over the years and guess what - the frame of the building remained even after burning for hours. In addition there are witnesses who saw the lobby of the WTC 7 blown out before the other two towers fell. Then there is the matter of WTC falling, for a period anyway, at freefall speed. That can only happen if all the support beams are knocked out in advance.
The building was wired for demolition just like the other WTC buildings. And guess who just acquired the lease on the Sear's Tower in Chicago - our old friend Larry Silverstein. And guess who is mayor of Chicago - that son of an Irgun terrorist - Rahm Emanuel.
The problem with that is if it was weakened by falling debris then the point of weakness would fall first instead it fell symetrically. In order for that to happen it has to be weakened symetrically, but the falling debris only weakened one corner.
Was the SEC one of the occupants of WTC7?
Yes, along with the IRS and the Secret Service.
that explains everything
Seeing the video of WTC7 coming down is what got me started in disbelieving the official story. Now, the fact that 911 was a false flag/inside job is crystal clear to me. What really upsets me is that it took so long for me to see the sham for what it is. I like to think I am smarter than I am.
Realizing that 911 was an inside job has been one of the most influential events in my life, and I am not the same person anymore. The good part is my eyes are open now: I see the media and politicians for the scumbag whores for Israel they are. The bad part is my entire family is still asleep, and I just can't relate to their mental framework anymore.
Man if I didn't know better I would say I wrote what you just posted.
Not Israel. Lucifer.
The evidence is all around you. Look at the UN headquarters. It's a mock-up of an unfinished Tower of Babel. Founded by Nimrod and his whore mother. Babylon is alive and well. The US is the Beast, which received a grievous head wound, yet was miraculously healed, 'and all the world wondered at the power of the Beast.'
Wake up. The Revelation isn't some Biblical fairy tale that happens in some nebulous future. The Revelation is the PREWRITTEN history of EVERYTHING that would occur between the ascent and the Day of the LORD.
We're coming ever closer to that day.
Yes, they're all crazy.
Who had the capability? Who was demonized? Who benefited from this tragedy? Of course I have no proof, but from the course of events that followed I'd say Israel, Big Oil, the military industrial complex and the Central Banks that would help in "Nation Building". The Patriot Act, The seemingly never-ending War on Terror and nation "hopping"(WAR).
The media (BBC) announced the WTC7 collapse before it actually happened. So you see, the media was involved as well. The media is not suspected much because they "entertain" us but they can also influence us with their reporting or ignoring of events. So its not so simple. What organization encompasses all these elements?
B I L D E R B E R G E R !
Who lost? We, the people of all nations. We are thrown into war with each other while the elite sit back and laugh at all those stupid little fools that will never figure it out!! JEWS HATE ARABS HATE AMERICANS HATE JEWS HATE MOSLEMS... blah blah...nothing's changed. Our young men and women die in combat and a few years later an oil company arrives. And a central bank too. They get the spoils of war and we get heartache and continued hatred toward the "other guy". Which we dutifully pass on to our children. Will we ever understand who the real enemy is? I think we are catching on. But of course I wish it happened yesterday.
"Will we ever understand who the real enemy is? I think we are catching on. But of course I wish it happened yesterday."
People everywhere are catching on. Better late than never as more and more people are being touched by actions towards globalization sponsored by the Elites. It truely is a global example of yin-yang.
Don't fall for republican vs democrat, that is a sideshow and distraction like the games at the Coliseum of Rome. I believe the true struggle is globalism vs sovereignty. At the top are the richest families in the world who are stockholders of private central banks, followed by multinational corporations followed by minions of politicians and civil servants. Alas, we are the MOB.
Historians often comment on mob rule as a factor in the rise of Rome and its maintenance, as the city of Rome itself was large—between 100,000 and 250,000 citizens—while the aristocracy and even military was very small by comparison to the citizenry. With weapons also being crude, a military force did not exist that could have dealt with a revolt from the larger populace. There was a constant need to keep people fed, distracted, and in awe of the power of the state. Those who could do this, ruled not only Rome, but the whole of the Roman Empire.
Lapses in this control often led to loss of power, or even the loss of heads, of officials—most notably in the reign of Commodus when Cleander unwisely used the Praetorian Guard against a mob which had come to call for his head.
TerraHertz:
Thx for the comments. WTC7 was obvious the first time I saw it but I still had a big WTF about how it went down.
Your explanation about the failed airplane hit (or some such mechanism) is a good one. Yeah, they F'd it up on D-Day and were sitting on a building wired to blow with no false cover. Must of been quite a moment for them when the WTC7 "attack" went sideways and they were left holding.
Thank god for the (ongoing) power of mass media to control the minds of the public. They did Goebbels proud that day and ever since.
Vainamoinen
I don't know how many of you saw this interview of Aaron Russo before he died. He was friends with Nick Rockefeller who told him all about the events that have transpired over the past ten years includnig the 'incident' that would set things off.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7nD7dbkkBIA
The same people who brought you the financial collapse brought you 9/11. It's as simple as that.
I have never been a "truther" I bought into the official story for a while. I thought truthers were wacked out, and I simply could not believe our own government could do something like this. But after seeing what has been going on lately in the world ,and how it all comes together to bring our country to it's knees, it made me take a second look. I'm still not certain what the truth is but the evidence sure is compelling. My dilemma now is figuring out how to get my wife , in her black and white world, to rethink things.
The problem with 911 'conspiracy theories', is that all the proofs all three buildings fell in controlled demolitions are fairly cerebral. The nano-thermite fragments in the dust, proven in a dry scientific paper. The investigations revealing who manufactured that material, their connections to the US govt/mil conspirators, and how the buildings were accessed in the months and weeks before 911 to place the charges - these are not 'gut feeling' proofs for most people. Neither are any of the other proven aspects - Silverstein and his miracle of insurance contract foresight, the 'fell at freefall' detail, the FBI disappearing all aircraft parts and their serial numbers (because those were the wrong planes), and so on.
But recently, one ABSOLUTE PROOF of controlled demolition has emerged. I defy anyone to review this, and still believe, in their heart, that BinLaden and his Keystone hijackers (who never got on the planes) had anything to do with 911.
Here it is. It is one video among hundreds recently pried by Freedom of Information lawsuit from the grasp of NIST (aka the 911-coverup crew.) For background see the article:
http://911blogger.com/news/2010-08-31/international-center-911-studies-s...
International Center for 9/11 Studies Secures Release of Thousands of Photos and Videos from NIST
That article links to several videos, and the points made in the text regarding them are all valid. However the 911Blogger writer has overlooked something extremely significant in one video titled "Visible Explosions at WTC". This one:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZMlMqGwGwGc
never mind the faintly visible explosions leading the collapse zone. Important yes, but they draw the eye away from the killer detail, which is also easy to miss if you don't deliberately look for it. However once you see it, you can never unsee it. And if you believed the government lies before, your world will change. Welcome to the horror show.
It has been mentioned elsewhere on the net that molten steel poured from the building before collapse. There are a few photos and shaky videos around of this molten metal cascade. However there has never before been any very clear video of the entire cascade of steel, from its start till the building collapse, showing the full context.
This is the video which does that. Here's a captioned still I made from it:
[IMG]http://everist.org/archives/conspiracy/911_WTC/molten_steel_fall.png[/IMG]
911 was an Israeli/US inside job, by the likes of Cheney, Chertoff, Silverstein, Guiliani... heck, these guys: http://www.whodidit.org/cocon.html
Bush was the front man, the 'too stupid to possibly have done this' guy. Too stupid indeed - he badly misplayed the schoolroom script, and three times later Freudian-slipped the truth- that he'd seen the FIRST plane impact on 'TV'. Which he had, live in his limo parked outside the school just before going into the school. There have been other reports of that same video feed being seen live in US military bases.
There's too much to cover, years of incriminating revelations of truth, competing with years of obvious well-poisoning efforts by the disinformationists desperately trying to hold back the growing public awareness.
I like to focus on the really indisputable evidence of US govt/media/zionist guilt.
The fall of building 7, along with the pre-anouncement by the BBC is pretty good, but this video of the cascading molten steel is far better. A real punch to the gut, for anyone who still believes the government lies.
Such a small thing in the overall picture, that 'waterfall' of falling molten steel. So small in the video, it's easy to miss. But UTTERLY damning once you see it. Many tons of white hot liquid steel, cascading from the corner of WTC1 over the two minutes immediately prior to the beginning of collapse right there. No wonder the NIST suppressed that video (and all the rest) for many years, and only gave it up when kicked repeatedly in the teeth with FOI lawsuits.
It's beyond me how that video can be public now, and mass arrests have not begun.
Oh yeah, I keep forgetting. Total breakdown of the rule of law.
Having reviewed this and more of the footage, I am unconvinced that the explanations provided are the only possible explanation.
However, in terms of actual physical data, the Thermite is something that has not been explained. In and of itself this is the one thing that implies that some steel somewhere during the disaster was subject to Thermite reactions. This seems beyond dispute. The molten steel certainly needs an explanation also as steel melts at > 2400 degrees F (depending on the steel).
Those 2 issues leave me wishing we had them resolved...
Occam's razor:
1) the ground is wet because it rained.
2) the ground is wet because a previously unknown race of space aliens descended upon the Earth around 4am this morning to take environmental samples, however, not being acclimated to this planets gravity their bodies (which like ours are 99% water) exploded and made the ground wet.
1) WT7 was a controlled demolition
2) WT7 fell down of it's own accord because it was the only skyscraper ever designed to have multiple single-point vulnerabilities for failure intentionally built into it's architecture. WTC7, incidentally, housed SEC files relating to numerous Wall Street investigations, as well as other federal investigative files. All the files for 3k or so SEC cases were destroyed, including those classified as confidential and (wouldn't you know it) files connecting Citigroup to the World Com scandal were lost.
thermite dog collars for all elected officials! in washington dc!!
you are allowed 3 accidents in your life after the 3rd collar you burn off of them.. you need to have a reason.. I didnt say a good reason.. just a reason.
yes! Jdub i like it!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X3KV4fLSNoU
Regarding Building 7.
It’s certainly clear that WTC7 didn’t go as planned, and that it had been pre-rigged with demolition charges. As for what the original plan was, why it went wrong, and how the conspirators adapted to the stuff-up, that’s probably only going to become clear once certain people (eg Silverstein, Giuliani, etc) are ‘debriefed’ in a witness stand. Or maybe just standing on a box, Abu Ghraib style. Their idea, after all.
Many people (myself included) think Flight 93 was intended to impact WTC7 early in the day, but something went wrong. Perhaps the remote autopilot system screwed up? Or (if they were actually still alive at the time) the crew and passengers managed to reset the autopilot back to normal operation and regain control – in which case the conspirators *had* to shoot down the plane so there’d be no one alive to talk about planes that didn’t respond to cockpit controls.
Or maybe the long unplanned delay in Flight 93’s takeoff was decided would over-stretch public credulity regarding Air Force non-response time? And so the plane was shot down/crashed.
Perhaps the damage to the front of WTC7 from falling WTC tower debris broke something to do with the correct firing of the WTC7 demolition charges, so when they first ‘pulled’ it, only a few of the charges blew? Leaving the building standing, till the wires or whatever could be fixed?
All have the same end result – WTC7 sitting there, rigged with explosives but still standing. Small internal fires setting off further random demolition charges, with very embarrassing bangs now and then.
Must have caused a great deal of dismay and confusion among the conspirators. If firefighters were allowed into the building they’d find the remaining charges, and that would be *very* difficult to cover up. Then extra complications developed, such as Michael Hess discovered to be in the building. Maybe he was on the ‘not expendable’ list so they had to hold? Also Silverstein had the issue of whether he’d get his planned insurance payout if the building was ‘pulled’, as opposed to being hit by a ‘terror attack’ of its own. You know, it’s very likely someone somewhere has recordings of Silverstein’s phone calls to the insurers that morning. Hello Echelon? Are you there? Of course you are.
So in the midst of the chaos, they decide to bring the thing down anyway. Took them a long time to reach a decision, and if the BBC’s pre-announcment of the collapse by half an hour is anything to go by, even when they decided to do it there were still more stuff-ups regarding the timing.
Overall, the obvious screw-ups surrounding building seven’s last hours should provide a very fruitful thread to start pulling on, once a *real* formal investigation begins.
BBC's pre-announcement? Do you have evidence for that?
It sounds a bit like that blowing up of several apartment complexes in Moscow several years ago. That was blamed on the Chechen's. But a reporter had spoken to someone in the Duma who accidently said there were four buildings that went down rather than three. The fourth was discovered later. It never exploded and was full of explosives in the basement. (My memory is rusty on this, there may have been a different number of buildings). When you read about Litvenenko and how he was poisened by polonium, you begin to suspect Putin in many so-called conspiracy theories. These things would be funny if they weren't so tragic. Anyway, any ordinary American would be prepared to believe that about Putin, I'm sure.
What is so bad about accountability? Everything bad that happens is because of lack of accountability. I believe ALL state secrets should be divulged. Those secret keepers have shown themselves to be acting against our interests as citizens. Let's start first with Extra-terrestrials as a sort of trial balloon. (Now that I just nuked my own credibility :)
Does the U.S. have any crediblity left, on anything?
You don't need to be a chef to know lousy cooking.