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Guest Post: Insignificant Significance Of The “47%” Videos

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Submitted by Ben Tanosborn

Insignificant Significance Of The “47%” Videos

What needless uproar; what absurd battle of wits among clueless pundits lacking the most rudimentary knowledge of both logic and arithmetic; what a sad picture of blatant ignorance of the true makeup of America’s electorate; what an embarrassing moment for anyone who believes in democracy… or a reasonable facsimile thereof.

Even the most influential and loquacious pundits-journalists, on both Democrat and Republican sides, should be caricatured with profiles of extreme ignorance.  Among them, front and center, Peggy Noonan, a conservative commentator for the Wall Street Journal, who just upgraded, or is it downgraded, her criticism of the Romney camp from incompetent to rolling calamity.  But she is not alone; experts from the right and from the left fall prey to the same medicine man of old; the charlatan sporting the name tag: Numerical Misinterpreter.  We know him well, yet we let him fool us with his deceiving preacher’s verbosity, and circus antics, time and time again.

Ok, so Mitt Romney was caught on video dismissing the lion’s share of the hoi polloi, those who take from the government’s coffers instead of helping to fill them.  A number was thrown identifying, some would say badmouthing, 47 percent of the electorate as moochers, by implication if not name; a questionable number perhaps but, for our intent and purposes, inconsequential.  It could be 45, or perhaps 50, but it matters little or not at all; so we’ll take 47, as the chosen prime number.

It isn’t much of a secret that preppy Mitt and his cohorts in the money-influence circles view with animus that 80 percent of Americans below the Knight (1%) and Squire (19%) ranks, those who might be considered either poor or part of the fast-disappearing middle class; an antipathy which turns into disdain when it comes to that lowest 47 percent.  But that arch-conservative moneyed group, one we have been referring to as the Thug-elite, also knows, and knows very well, that it needs to enlist some of those hoi polloi to either vote for the masters, the holders of most wealth and power, or to not vote at all.  No, Mitt Romney committed one lapsus linguae, a faux pas of sorts for sure, but nothing so serious that will cost him many votes, certainly not the election as so many liberal talking heads would make their followers believe.

After the financial debacle caused by a thieving and uncontrolled Thug-elite (banksters, Wall Street, moneyed interests), helped in part by a society ready to be courted by its very own ugly greed, this time in real estate, one would think the electorate would have economics as the prime, if not the sole focus when casting a ballot in this next presidential election.  And that would entail castigating politicians, or parties, who could be justly blamed for such debacle and for embracing globalization without a viable plan for those Americans who would be left behind without living-wage jobs; while rewarding politicians, or parties, who offer a reasonable way out, not just of the present mess we are in, but of the impending uglier mess which looms in the horizon.  But that would be taxing reality in a nation which has failed to charge Wall Street criminals, for the most part Republicans; in a nation where Bill Clinton, the godfather of American globalization, continues to be held in high esteem by a clueless Democrat party.

The old saying that Americans vote their pocketbooks may hold true in part and at specific times, but given today’s socioeconomic makeup, it is a myth.  A far more accurate, if unsavory, saying would be: Americans vote their prejudices.  And that’s why Romney’s gaffe doesn’t write off that bottom of the economic barrel 47 percent.  Yes, those 47-ers may have poverty as their common denominator, but a third or more of them will be voting their religious prejudice (still claiming Obama is a Muslim); or their racial prejudice (hate for blacks); or simply their prejudice-of-choice (abortion, homosexuality, etc.); or simply their ignorance.  No, we can be certain that the cost to Romney in voters will be insignificant.

The only issues which are truly significant for a candidate to the presidency this time around are: (1) the ability to obtain plenty of money – at whatever cost – in order to saturate the airwaves with half-truths and lies; (2) the commitment to a military budget as large as that of the rest of the world combined; (3) a strong, unequivocal anti-Muslim predisposition; (4) the pledge of total commitment to Israel in every action it takes, right or wrong, specifically involving Palestine and Iran; and, (5) the promise that the mythical American Dream is alive and well, that jobs will appear and multiply as loaves and fishes did in the accounts of the Bible’s New Testament.

And come this next election, the most believable, or least disliked, of the two lying candidates will become president of the United States of America… to our detriment, and that of the world.

 

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Sat, 09/22/2012 - 13:55 | 2820544 LMAOLORI
LMAOLORI's picture

 

 

"But that would be taxing reality in a nation which has failed to charge Wall Street criminals, for the most part Republicans;"

If you want to be viewed as a serious author you should get your facts straight.

Financial Fraud Conviction Scorecard:

 

CONVICTED: Bush 1300+, Clinton 1000+, Obama 0.0 (+/-)

Oh and race baiting 101 to top it off.  Is that you obama???

 

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 14:09 | 2820591 blunderdog
blunderdog's picture

That headline isn't any more true today than it was yesterday, when I pointed out it's worth checking the footnotes.  I'm forced to conclude you're officially a liar.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 14:22 | 2820609 LMAOLORI
LMAOLORI's picture

 

 You can't handle the truth blunder wrong

 

Financial Fraud Conviction Scorecard:

Bush: 1300+, Clinton: 1000+, Obama: 0.0 (+/-)

Meanwhile, not a word of complaint from a single Democrat in Congress, which is especially infuriating given the broad bi-partisan agreement among voters that criminal bankers need to do time.  Too concerned with keeping up appearances and the next election cycle, neither side of the false left-right paradigm of American politics is capable of exposing its own filthwhen it comes to legitimate scandal, and this DOJ non-prosecution madness involving Goldman Sachs certainly qualifies as sordid.

Unfortunately, since it appears to the mainstream media that this is a partisan issue, and Obama is the anointed one, this story will get zero coverage.

---

DOJ Corruption Report via The Daily Caller

Excerpt:

“When we think of cronyism and the problems of cronyism and crony capitalism, we think in terms of economic loss and gain,” Schweizer said in a phone interview.  “What we’re showing here is that cronyism is now permeating our justice system.  So, it’s not just a question of dollars and cents, it’s a question of whether you’re going to face legal jeopardy or not on what you’re doing.”

“The issue of a revolving door — people who go in and out of, for instance, the Department of Energy who go work for energy companies then come back to the Department of Energy — is always there,” Schweizer added.  “But, we’re not used to associating the top leadership of the Justice Department with the revolving door.  And, I think that’s what makes this so troubling — because you can’t trust them.  All their financial interests are tied up with these large firms that do an enormous amount of business with Wall Street.”

In the report, GAI details how the George W. Bush and Bill Clinton administrations both actually took down financial criminals — unlike the Obama administration.  Between 2002 and 2008, for instance, GAI points out how a Bush administration task force “obtained over 1,300 corporate fraud convictions, including those of over 130 corporate vice presidents and over 200 CEOs and corporate presidents.”

Clinton’s DOJ prosecuted over 1,800 S&L (savings and loans) executives, senior officials, and directors, and over 1,000 of them were sent to jail,” GAI adds.

But, despite having “promised more of the same,” especially in the wake of the 2008 financial crisis, the Obama administration’s DOJ has not brought criminal charges against a single major Wall Street executive.

The Bush and Clinton administrations’ track records on prosecuting white-collar crime, and the Obama administration’s failure to do so, Schweizer said, is “evidence that this has less to do with some sort of partisan or philosophical issue.”

---

Here's a blurb on Bush Sr. directly from the GAI report:

William Black, an associate professor of economics and law at the University of Missouri, Kansas City, and former financial regulator who tackled the S&L crisis in the 1980s, noticed a difference in priorities between the federal government’s responses to the two crises.Black, a Democrat, notes the difference in priorities between the current administration and that of President H.W. Bush. He explains, “The first President Bush’s orders were to get the most prominent, nastiest frauds, and put their heads on pikes as a demonstration that there’s a new sheriff in town.” Black and other federal regulators handled the S&L crisis by securing a 90 percent conviction rate on over a thousand prosecutions.  Black bemoans the lack of “serious investigation of any of the large financial entities by the Justice Department, which includes the FBI.”

 

Read the full report on DOJ corruption...

via http://dailybail.com/home/convicted-bush-1300-clinton-1000-obama-00.html

more at link like this

 

Five Senior Goldman Sachs Execs Gave $130K To 'Obama Victory Fund' WHILE Eric Holder Was Deciding Whether To File Criminal Charges

and there is also this

Nearing end of term, Obama’s snared no big Wall Street fish

http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2012/09/20/v-print/169183/nearing-end-of-term-obamas-snared.html

 

Department of Broken Promises: Obama Closes Door on NAFTA Renegotiation

http://www.blackagendareport.com/?q=content/department-broken-promises-obama-closes-door-nafta-renegotiation

 

 

 

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 14:57 | 2820706 blunderdog
blunderdog's picture

It doesn't matter how many times you copy the links.  Your "headline" is a LIE.  The SOURCE for the information quoted in the article proves it.

It's one thing if I'd gone and looked up other sources--then you could quibble about the accuracy, or whatever.  But when the SOURCE of your article's information contains data that refutes the claim, you may as well give it up and go home.  Whoever wrote the Daily Bail article is a liar.  I assumed you just weren't smart enough or motivated enough to learn this for yourself, so I pointed it out for you.

Now, despite knowing that the statistics quoted don't match the statistics from the source, you STILL pretend your article is accurate.  It's kinda pathetic.

Footnote 6 from the "Justice Inaction" report once again, in case there's anyone out there who hasn't snapped to your game yet: http://trac.syr.edu/tracreports/crim/267/

The greatest thing going for the tabloids is they know their readers will never bother CHECKING anything.  Congrats on proving them correct, dumbass.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 15:19 | 2820740 Bring the Gold
Bring the Gold's picture

.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 15:36 | 2820785 dudebum
dudebum's picture

Funny that LMAOLORI didn't respond to that link....

Sun, 09/23/2012 - 03:03 | 2821569 scaleindependent
scaleindependent's picture

 

 

   Lmaolori, I  would appreciate your retort to blunderdog's comment : "Footnote 6 from the "Justice Inaction" report once again, in case there's anyone out there who hasn't snapped to your game yet: http://trac.syr.edu/tracreports/crim/267/"

 

 

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 15:16 | 2820753 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

Why are you posting this on different threads? What's your agenda?

Defending the Bush and Clinton administrations? LOL.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 16:10 | 2820824 blunderdog
blunderdog's picture

Maybe he works for the Daily Bail's ad-traffic department and they're trying to meet a delivery SLA?

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 14:23 | 2820624 AldousHuxley
AldousHuxley's picture

When Indian-Americans, Mexican-Americans, chinese-Americans, African-Americans, Russian-Americans, Brazilian-Americans, Canadian-Americans, Swedish-Americans, Australian-Americans.....basically all recent immigrants who came to America for a better future realize that their relatives back in the home country are getting richer faster, then that's when middle class collapses and America is left with

  • top 1%
  • ghetto ungovernable welfare class
  • lazy 3-10th generation proud to be bad at math entertainment obsessed "Americans" no good except soldiers to kill others or government jobs

 

Think about it....America sucks for middle class....good for underclass and upper 0.1%.

 

Underclass: cheap stuff, cheap food, plenty of government/military jobs

Top 0.1%: bernanke/greenspan put to keep the wall st. ponzi going, don't need jobs, low capital gains taxes, import whatever they want

Middle class: expensive good education, outsourcing, foreign labor import at every job category, most taxed, most overworked, most exploited, expensive quality stuff, expensive quality food, lack of private sector professional jobs

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 14:39 | 2820673 dark pools of soros
dark pools of soros's picture

only health care type stuff won't get outsourced but they have to find the rich clientel or survive the insurance redtape and still make a profit

 

that's why half of all groupons are for massage therapy.. they just trying to get anyone to pony up since insurance doesn't pay for that..  and things like chiropractors, the insurance money they get is pretty crap

so prostitution and drug dealing will soar as less and less honest working folk exist

Sun, 09/23/2012 - 02:28 | 2821536 ceedub
ceedub's picture

How is drug dealing or prostitution not honest work?

Providing a service that is obviously wanted seems like a good way to survive to me.

Sun, 09/23/2012 - 04:44 | 2821618 AldousHuxley
AldousHuxley's picture

Intuitive Surgical, Inc. (Intuitive) designs, manufactures and markets da Vinci Surgical Systems and related instruments and accessories. A da Vinci Surgical System consists of a surgeon’s console, a patient-side cart and a vision system. The da Vinci Surgical System translates a surgeon’s natural hand movements, which are performed on instrument controls at a console, into corresponding micro-movements of instruments positioned inside the patient through small incisions, or ports. The da Vinci Surgical System is designed to provide its operating surgeon with intuitive control, range of motion, fine tissue manipulation capability and three dimensional (3-D), high-definition (HD) vision while simultaneously allowing them to work through the small ports of minimally invasive surgery (MIS).

ISRG surged from <$100/share few years ago to $500+ now

 

surgery robotics will make healthcare outsourcable.

 

 

Sun, 09/23/2012 - 05:37 | 2821651 Parrotile
Parrotile's picture

Minimally invasive surgery = lower "on Table" costs, and faster / less costly recovery times.

Since in essence all surgical procedures can be reduced to programmable algorithms (sorry to all you Surgeons out there, but remind me, how do you "learn" the trade again??) inevitably we WILL have automated / autonomous systems that can "do the job" as well as any human surgeon, and will be able to "do the job" reliably, and safely, 24/7 if necessary.

Before we get deluged by the obvious now "but people are all subtly (and sometimes not so subtly) anatomically different" rants, this is where fuzzy logic comes in - and machines are really quite good at "recognising" unusual configurations and adapting to them right now.

The argument now is that machines can't YET develop innovative procedures, or can they? There's plenty of evidence all over the "Net of "dumb machines" being not that dumb at all, and just how many "Surgical innovations" are simply minor tweaks?

Whether we like it or not truly robotic, autonomous control surgery WILL happen, and the advantages will be significant especially from the Patient's viewpoint.

This presumes that we don't start WW3 in 2013 of course; in such a scenario all bets are off.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 14:19 | 2820614 NorthenSoul
NorthenSoul's picture

To those who gave a minus to LMAO post,

Sorry but Obama Administration has the LOWEST number of financial crime prosecutions since at least 1990; it is a fact, period, end of discussion. And that, at a time where fraud is more pervasive than ever, unless you are stupid enough to believe the CRA and Fannie did all that by themselves.

http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2011/11/bank-fraud-prosecution-continues-to...

BTW, it's very hard to get a prosecution when the Head of Criminal Division of the DOJ in person REFUSE to prosecute corporations AND SAY SO PUBLICLY:

http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2012/09/marcy-wheeler-lanny-breuer-admits...

The remedy is so simple: a iron clad constitutional Amendment stripping corporations of their fraudulent "personhood" status (Do corporations go to Hell? Can they be executed for murder? Res ipsa loquitur) and strictly publicly financed elections.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 14:45 | 2820686 chunga
chunga's picture

No matter who "wins" the fake election; the downward trend of prosecutions will likely remain the same.

Although people often bemoan political apathy as if it were a grave social ill, it seems to me that this is just as it should be. Why should essentially powerless people want to engage in a humiliating farce designed to demonstrate the legitimacy of those who wield the power? In Soviet-era Russia, intelligent people did their best to ignore the Communists: paying attention to them, whether through criticism or praise, would only serve to give them comfort and encouragement, making them feel as if they mattered. Why should Americans want to act any differently with regard to the Republicans and the Democrats? For love of donkeys and elephants?

Orlov, Dmitry (2011-05-31). Reinventing Collapse

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 16:03 | 2820816 toady
toady's picture

That's a good one. Couldn't agree more!

Sometimes I think the never-ending election cycle is a construct to keep the public interested, or at least confused and infighting.

It doesn't matter who wins, the next day the losers will start obstructing and the winners will start campaigning for reelection.

The only thing worse is when one group has majorities across the board. That's when the spending REALLY gets crazy!

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 18:12 | 2820997 blunderdog
blunderdog's picture

Perhaps you misunderstand the reason for the downvotes.

OBVIOUSLY this administration hasn't been making any real effort to prosecute financial fraud, but do you really want to encourage mindless spambots to shit links to false tabloid journalsim all over these threads?

Jeebus, I come to ZH to get AWAY from the idiocy of the mainstream press.  Why do people insist on dragging that garbage into the pages here, rather than just having a *conversation*?

Sun, 09/23/2012 - 13:43 | 2822342 Questan1913
Questan1913's picture

Blunderdog

 

Their intent is very clear..to disrupt the comments section by preventing any meaningful discussion of this blogs articles.  They are employed to do so. That you and so many others can not see this is really quite amazing.  That you respond to these comments as if they were legitimate is rather sad. 

Sun, 09/23/2012 - 13:57 | 2822378 blunderdog
blunderdog's picture

You may be right.  It could be a conspiracy kinda thing.

He may also just be an idiot who is trying to do his best to prevent Obama's re-election. 

In either case: if shining a bit of light on the process results in effective exile here, at least he'll have to go create another account, and generally, the "2 weeks old and counting" commenters are ignored.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 14:43 | 2820682 Azannoth
Azannoth's picture

"..Yes, those 47-ers may have poverty as their common denominator, but a third or more of them will be voting their .. prejudice" correct on that 1 but 180° wrong on which way this prejudice goes

It all about demographics and social-strata, everybody who is a taker will vote Mr. Hope&Change and all the (tax)payers will site at home or vote for Mr. Smooth-Talker(/sarc) guess who has the numbers

Mitt didn't have enough votes to pull this off in the 1st place, now he alienated another 10% of the electorate, it's game over for him

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 13:49 | 2820545 NorthenSoul
NorthenSoul's picture

"A far more accurate, if unsavory, saying would be: Americans vote their prejudices."

Combine that with the fact that 45% of potential voters never bother to do so and it cannot come as a surprise that "this sucker is going down" to borrow a famous say from President GW Bush.

I guess that inflamed prejudices is a great motivator to go to the voting booth!

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 13:52 | 2820552 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

Yeah... Fine... Ben Tanosborn... (whoever the fuck you are)...

& you are CLEARLY "voting [WITH YOUR] prejudices"... Here... FUCK OFF...

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 13:52 | 2820554 williambanzai7
williambanzai7's picture

That five point election schematic seams about right.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 13:54 | 2820563 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

More of 'american' fabled past: usual bit, globalization.

Living wages? A by product of 'american' economics.

It holds little in the way 'americans' imply with the last four decades on the several hundreds years old process of globalization.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 13:57 | 2820570 akak
akak's picture

SHUT THE FUCK UP

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 14:34 | 2820659 PiratePawpaw
PiratePawpaw's picture

More Concise than your usual comments to our little ChiCom friend. I was expecting something like:

"More from AnAnons fabled lightning powered rickshaw.....holding little in the way of reality or logic..."

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 14:45 | 2820670 akak
akak's picture

I hadn't had my morning coffee yet.

Now, after having consumptionalized and blobbed-up my daily ration of caffeine, my mood is much better (in a US Citizenismistic kind of way), and I feel ready to go out into the world to continue my crusade to farm the poor, extort the weak, and impose my 'American economics' upon the less fortunate.

(Or was it "extort the poor and farm the weak"?  It can be difficult to keep it all straight --- so much US Citizenism to employ, so little time.  But that of course is where the magical lightning-powered time-traveling flying rickshaw of Benjamin Franklin inventionism of American fabled past comes in handy.)

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 17:17 | 2820926 PiratePawpaw
PiratePawpaw's picture

Much better. My faith in US Citizenism is restored. :)

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 14:04 | 2820576 RSBriggs
RSBriggs's picture

What a fucking bozo.   How about doing us all a favor and crawling back under whatever fucking rock it was you were hiding under for the last few days, AnAnynmous?

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 14:03 | 2820577 PiratePawpaw
PiratePawpaw's picture

And this, kids, is why you shouldnt do drugs.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 14:03 | 2820578 insanelysane
insanelysane's picture

Get a life.  Over the past 4 decades the country technology has changed yet the number of college students going for technology oriented degrees has declined.  Why because Americans a majority of Americans are lazy.  We are poring more money into education per student than any other country on the planet and we have some of the dumbest people around.  Yet they want a living wage?  

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 14:25 | 2820630 NorthenSoul
NorthenSoul's picture

"Why because Americans a majority of Americans are lazy."

 

I would recommend you blow your your own brain, but that is a physical impossibility.

 

Do you know how much a new graduate in electrical engineering can earn in the US? Barely 30K!

Do you know how much a new graduate in Security Analysis and IT can earn in the US? Over 100K!

 

Do you know why? Ask the fuckers in DC who are pouring hundreds of billions into the Nazional Sekurity Industrial Complex while letting our productive innovation capacity to go to India, China and the likes.

 

Lazy? No! They're getting SHAFTED by idiots and greddy mofos.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 14:43 | 2820680 AmCockerSpaniel
AmCockerSpaniel's picture

You for got to count the number of lawyers to engineers. Just more fallout from "Free Trade job loss".

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 15:07 | 2820736 insanelysane
insanelysane's picture

I think you should probably meant to spell soul as sole but whatever.  I have a degree in Engineering and my wife has a degree in Medical Science.  We are in the 1%.  Not by trying but by the fact that people will pay for our skills.  

The people getting shafted are getting shafted because they are too lazy to stop the shafting.

Not sure if you meant it but you a proving the idiot Romney correct in claiming you and everybody else are victims of shafting.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 16:12 | 2820828 toady
toady's picture

You have a degree? Must have bought all your term papers ...

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 17:11 | 2820919 IrritableBowels
IrritableBowels's picture

...and you probably meant 'pouring' and not 'poring', DUMBASS.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 14:31 | 2820639 Jack Burton
Jack Burton's picture

insanelysane, Yes, you have hit on an important point. While America pours unbelievable amounts of money into college educations, the results of this are pathetic. I see all the time new familes arrive in the Twin Cities metro area. WHy are they coming? Because the high tech companies in the area need highly skilled workers and engineers. But, the Twin Cities have a number of world class universities, a huge number of high schoolers attend college and get degrees. A large number of them can't find good jobs. I personally know sveral females with degrees whose only job now is as servers at restaurants and pubs.

So America spends all this money to educate waitresses and must import people from Indaia to staff the high tech companies. How come we ask?

Well, Hell, we ALL know. The American kids don't want to do the hard work in college of studying math, science and all the engineering fields. Sure, Law and Medicine remain popular, and that is where a lot of money can be made. But only a few are cut out for that, most of the science and technology reamins to much work for American kids.

So, I see the families from India move in and settle in to the high tech jobs and engineering jobs and make good here. While all these American kids with useless easy degrees in say Mass Communications remain unemployable except in reatail and food service.

No excuses, American kids KNOW there are good paying jobs in Tech, they are just too lazy to study the hard fields. College is one big booze, sex and drugs party for 4 - 5 years. If you stayed up late working on Mathematics, you would miss the party!

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 16:29 | 2820854 Totentänzerlied
Totentänzerlied's picture

Your entire post is a load of specious crap. It obviously has not occurred to you that perhaps the problem is economic and moreover this it is a structural problem, surprise surprise. No, it must be the people (whom you feel the need to denigrate for no specified or justified reason) themselves - white man's burden, noble savage, right? 

"The American kids don't want to do the hard work in college of studying math, science and all the engineering fields."

Right because all American kids, being from a populace the average IQ of which is 100, are obviously capable of such, they're just too damn lazy. So are Africans, of whom the smallest percentage by continent population are employed in the technical/knowledge professions, lazy or just stupid? Oops, I guess using bullshit arguments cherry-picked to fit your prejudicial theory doesn't always work out so well!

Cultural differences in child-rearing and academic discipline are secondary to actual measured intelligence which is secondary to the economic reality of a degenerate and decrepit labor market.

"While America pours unbelievable amounts of money into college educations" this should tell you something, but you failed to get the message. The education market's pricing mechanism has been murdered and dumped in a lake, cost does not reflect utility value, supply no longer has any relation to demand both of which no longer have any rational connection to the labor market.

If college has turned into one big party (leaving aside what I can only describe, generously, as the naively optimistic view that it ever was not), it is because the general composition of student populations has been so debased; college admission's role as a filter by which to separate the intellectual wheat from the working-class chaff (let's be honest about it) has been eliminated, much to the delight of the salaried employees of the colleges. You cannot have it both ways - within this thoroughly corrupt education "system": either colleges are allowed to be selective and exclude capable individuals on dubious grounds of prejudice, or they are made to be unselective and the quality and calibre of the institution is -must be - swiftly degraded by/for the admission of incapable individuals. This, we are told by colleges, academicians, and politicians, represents the total set of practiable ways by which the elder generation(s) may impart non-industrial knowledge to the next generation.

Lately a few lonely voices began - and it seems recently to have beccome fashionable - to admit that the university experience's primary and major mechanism of value-creation [for students] is ... the formation of extended social networks with which favors thereby to enable the currying of personal favors. Well, if you remove the meritocratic basis for admissions, you are left with a glorified social club wherein competition is in fact for the attention - and blessing/favor - of the few at the upper extremity of the system's social hierarchy - the gatekeepers of the academic and professional worlds. 

Circa 5 million years after our divergence from the common ancestral Hominid line, our most important social structures have hardly surpassed in equity or rational justification those of our modern Hominin cousins.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 17:52 | 2820973 toady
toady's picture

Not trying to take away from your points just adding a point ... Tech isn't for everyone. Only a few are cut out for tech too.

In depth problem solving skill are key. The ability to go through tens of thousands of characters to find a capitol letter or comma isn't easy. I was one of a select few who had the sixth sense to do this quickly in a system down, high pressure situation.

Still I couldn't keep up with constantly change software and hardware. And if you think you're going to make good money you better count on 7x24 oncall. I can't remember how many college boys thought they were going to work 9 to 5 doing excel macros. They never last I think the 7x24 call-out ruined weekends, constantly taking calls on vacation, just complete devotion required, is what drove me out in the end. It's not for everyone.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 13:58 | 2820571 insanelysane
insanelysane's picture

I have no idea what point the writer is trying to make.  The 47% video isn't significant because people in the top 10 or 15% of the 47% don't think they are in the 47%.  And I don't believe that many of the people outside of the 47% think they are in the group.  So I think that he only insulted about 30% of the population and since only 50% of the entire population votes you are looking at insulting 15% of the voting population.

I do agree with the writer on one thing, with 300 million people in this country, having to choose between these 2 ass clowns is just a pity.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 14:39 | 2820574 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

great... every single day on ZH it is acknowledged that the 2 party system inevitably produces 2 assclowns...

So as far as assclowns are concerned, we don't need a 3RD telling us all what we already know (hence my comment above)... Here's his 'party'...

~~~

http://www.gp.org/index.php

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 14:11 | 2820595 blunderdog
blunderdog's picture

He said insulting the 47% won't COST Romney any votes.

That's probably true.  It could potentially motivate a few more 47%ers to go vote AGAINST him, but even that's really unlikely.

Take home message: chatter over the Romney video is all bullshit.  Surprise surprise surprise.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 14:25 | 2820626 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

That's probably TRUE???????

Ummm...

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/presenting-president-inflation

Do you really think that the amplitude of the wavy lines on the graphs in that link were because people 'ALL OF A SUDDEN' got religion on inflation expectations?

~~~

This author is clearly a douche masquerading as an apoligist, but trying to keep the Romney/Netanyahu ticket alive... I'm calling BULLSHIT (but I welcome debate from any 'geniuses' who see it differently)...

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 15:09 | 2820744 blunderdog
blunderdog's picture

    Do you really think that the amplitude of the wavy lines on the graphs in that link were because people 'ALL OF A SUDDEN' got religion on inflation expectations?

I see no relevance of those charts, to be honest.  The way the handicappers are *betting* on an upcoming event doesn't DETERMINE the outcome.

Do you think the election is guaranteed to be the result predicted by folks at places like HuffPo and the WSJ?  You trust CNN and CNBC and Fox MORE than you trust some basic common sense about how political elections go?

Shit, TWO YEARS AGO I predicted Romney takes the nomination and Obama wins the election.  Lemme tell you, some "suprise" video from some caterer somewhere had nothing to do with MY prediction.

The media *wants* there to be big excitement about this election.  They WANT it to be close, and they WANT the "odds" to shift dramatically in the coming weeks.

But don't let 'em fool ya.  The media has never had any interest in honesty.  This is basically a done deal.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 16:40 | 2820876 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

Whatever...

Yeah ~ I guess overnight everyone decided that even though they'd had enough with O'Bummer, that now they were changing their minds... Look ~ as stated above, I don't give a shit about this author (in terms of being CAPTAIN OBVIOUS & stating that the 2 party system in America is a bunch of BS ~ like everyone does here every single day)...

What I do care about is some idiot who, instead, thinks the solution to Middle East peace is that there aren't enough 'Green Party' candidates...

http://www.greenpapers.net/?p=289

Yeah right... GLOBAL WARMING (lol) is going to get solved when te Israelis & Palestinians can come together by going green... WTF?

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 17:00 | 2820903 blunderdog
blunderdog's picture

I have no idea what your point is anymore, but there's some stuff I can think up that's even more confused and irrelevant.

For DAMN sure the inventor of the QWERTY keyboard was just a useful idiot for Obama-Care implementation--if it hadn't been decades of carpal-tunnel resulting from the Internet revolution, S. Vietnam would still be a happy US Protectorate, and we'd all be enjoying holidays there instead of bitching about the high price of gasoline.

"Whatever" is right.

(PS: Who's Justine?  Was that a high-school project of hers?)

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 17:27 | 2820933 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

You're just a few clicks mouse clicks away from [connecting the unconnectable dots] but still haven't figured it out yet... Here ~ I'll give you a head start...

http://www.tanosborn.com/

Enough crap there to have you going 'WTF?' all the way thru the next dozen election cycles...

 

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 14:38 | 2820671 PiratePawpaw
PiratePawpaw's picture

Most of the 47%ers I see take their gubmt disability checks on the 1st and 3rd straight to the beer store. I doubt many of them will be sober enough on the 6th to vote one way or the other.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 15:11 | 2820748 blunderdog
blunderdog's picture

Well, aside from all the 47%ers who are retired folks, yeah, pretty much.

Those old folks sure do like to vote, tho.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 16:01 | 2820812 PiratePawpaw
PiratePawpaw's picture

True, but I wasnt really thinking of retirees.

I was thinking of the 47% being those recieving SSI checks, and most of the ones I've seen arent old enough and havent worked an actual above the table job to retire from.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 18:00 | 2820982 alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

If you don't count retirees...then it's no longer 47% now is it?

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 18:52 | 2821038 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

Looks that way.  Let's get some clarification on that here:

http://www.mybudget360.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/pay-income-tax-dat...

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 14:11 | 2820598 Cugel
Cugel's picture

Excellent point, though I'd argue the number is higher than 10-15%. Reframing your take as justly earned make-good pay for some injustice or unfairness seems to be an integral part of moocher psychology.

Nitpick: the 50% modifier scales from general population to voting population -- it won't automatically rescale the relative weights of subgroups within that population. So by your math, it's still 30% of voters.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 14:21 | 2820620 MiltonFriedmans...
MiltonFriedmansNightmare's picture

The 15% who were insulted are to oblivious to know.

 

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 14:04 | 2820580 Atlantis Consigliore
Atlantis Consigliore's picture

Cmon Clinton do the Follieri Cha Cha Cha.... i did not default that golf ball, listem to me! 

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 14:10 | 2820593 syntaxterror
syntaxterror's picture

Romney paid MORE taxes than OVER 150 million people COMBINED, but that's still not enough for Obamunists.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 14:13 | 2820604 blunderdog
blunderdog's picture

That's not even *close* to true, unless you maintain that FICA isn't "taxes." 

Better bullshit, please.  At least make an effort for your soundbites to correspond with reality.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 14:31 | 2820651 laomei
laomei's picture

And sales tax isn't taxes

And gasoline tax isn't taxes

And property tax isn't taxes (even if you're renting, that cost is figured in)

And sin taxes are not taxes

 

And moving on to the taxes that help the rich get richer....

Don't forget the financial taxes that banks levy on poor people to keep them poor.

How about the poor who have no access to banks anymore because they fail to have minimum balances? Check cashing, payment cards... yep, all that's a tax too.

How about the credit tax too?  Sorry, you're not a millionare? Enjoy that 60% interest credit card and sub-prime loan rates.

Welfare, EBT, TANF... yep, all that's admined by the banks, who suck huge profit from them.

 

Romney has never earned an honest days pay in his entire life.  Not one single day.  And his "charity" is all just dumping money to the mormons, who turn right back around and dump it (and more) into his campaign coffers.  How the hell does that count as charity?

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 15:05 | 2820679 TWSceptic
TWSceptic's picture

"Romney has never earned an honest days pay in his entire life."

 

Not sure how you came to that conclusion. This is more true for Obama, who never worked a day in his life nor ran a single business in his life. His only job so far has been a paid bureacrat, ruining the country. Even if you dislike Romney (and I dislike him almost as much as Obama) you have to see reality for what it is: Romney is a business man. He provides people with jobs. When a company looks bad he takes the capital out and looks for a more efficient use. That is how capitalism works. It doesn't make him a good president, but it does mean he adds more value to the country than Obama ever has.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 15:06 | 2820735 tickhound
tickhound's picture

More 'value', who gives a flying fuck... So Romney is better adjusted to this profoundly sick society LOL

They're both dildos and nothing will change.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 15:14 | 2820751 alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

He tends to often find more efficient use for that companies "capital" in his personal off-shore account.

That "capital" was also often referred to by some of the employees of those companies as their "pensions" or "retirement accounts" which they contributed their own persona "capital" into over years of working their "non-tax-paying" jobs which often included the highly overcompensated task of "manufacturing" products which we have now learned could be done in a more "capital efficient" manner by people working for slave wages and without pensions in third world nations all across the globe.

The goal of Capitalism is the acquisition of "capital". And the workers must never be allowed to get in the way of that acquisition by siphoning off "capital" in the form of wages from their true destination: The Capitalists pockets.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 16:55 | 2820899 carambar
carambar's picture

Sorry but Romney is not a "real" business man. He is a financial engineering hack. All he does is buy companies , slash their cost like mad to raise the cash flow available.

 Make tha company pay the private equity firm a big dividend that is pay with debt, then load them with debt (high leverage) as much as possible (supported by the artificially raised cash flow)

then dump the company asap to a buyer or on the equity market.

Then we have companies that will go bankrupt or will have to restructure even more is the economy slows down.

This is not business but typical Wall Street financial engineering. Do not add one once of value to the community.

 

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 17:43 | 2820961 alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

You just described what Romney (and many others here obviously) consider the "productive" class of "job creators".

It's insane.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 18:12 | 2820996 laomei
laomei's picture

Think of all the jobs he created at Goldman Sachs to assemble that tax return though. Odd, I don't seem to understand how he can get away with "Various" as a definition of foreign taxes he paid both as a percent and as the country paid to.  And I also don't seem to recall seeing his FBAR disclosure.  Gotta love "blind trusts" though.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 15:00 | 2820714 CrashisOptimistic
CrashisOptimistic's picture

Lots of those taxes you're quoting are state taxes.  The discussion is about Federal income tax.

 

As for Mormons, I'm not one, but they do fund rather a lot of "good works" .  To say nothing of some weird stuff that has to qualify as societally uplifting, specifically archaeology research.

Scope this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LDS_Humanitarian_Services

Example: 

Wheelchair Distribution is another program of the LDS Church crucial to helping those in need. Studies estimate that only one percent of the disabled in the world have wheelchairs. For the rest, being without a wheelchair means for adults that they can not provide for themselves or their families, and for children it often means not being able to attend school. By providing wheelchairs to those in need, the LDS Church hopes to help people become more self-reliant which is an important tenant of LDS beliefs.[3]

 

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 17:46 | 2820968 Quantum Nucleonics
Quantum Nucleonics's picture

FICA ISN'T a tax.  It is a contribution to a public pension system.  It is supposed to be accounted for separately, but has been stolen.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 19:18 | 2821061 blunderdog
blunderdog's picture

I know, I know, money that the government takes out of my paycheck isn't a tax. 

"Tax" is subject to a pretty flexible definition with a lot of folks.  At least we know where you stand.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 22:39 | 2821266 RSBriggs
RSBriggs's picture

Not true, several years back a federal judge ruled that it is a TAX and nothing more.  People that pay into the system have "no absolutely no right" to expect any return.  The governments payment of "social security benefits" is completely "voluntary and optional".   This was used as one of the precedents for ruling that the Obamacare penalty is also a tax.

Sun, 09/23/2012 - 06:47 | 2821688 Kobe Beef
Kobe Beef's picture

You know, technically, the Federal Income Tax is also "voluntary".

Orwell would be proud, nothing means anything anymore. Guess it all depends on what the definition of "is" is.

The problem to this widespread Newspeak is that civilization is based on trust. When everybody is lying, there's no trust. Soon, there will be no civilization either.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 17:19 | 2820927 syntaxterror
syntaxterror's picture

Apologies, i meant income tax, not tax. FICA isnt federal income tax.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 14:11 | 2820597 A Lunatic
A Lunatic's picture

Here's what I find significant, and should serve as a stark reminder of why the status quo will never change; 47% are for Obastard and 47% are for Obramny for a combined total (give or take a percent) of 94% of the total voting population that still doesn't have a fucking clue about how this system really works. We're Doooooooomed..........

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 15:03 | 2820729 SeattleBruce
SeattleBruce's picture

"for a combined total (give or take a percent) of 94% of the total voting population that still doesn't have a fucking clue"

 

They may not have a clue, or many of them may feel they have no other choice.  And isn't it up to us to show folks another way?  That's probably going to start with a truly legit centrist, sound money 3rd party, imho.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 14:25 | 2820599 Azannoth
Azannoth's picture

Ii does not matter if Mitt said 5 or 50ty, he is a successful person(measured by personal wealth and family) that's why everybody loves to hate him(in today's USSA),

it does not matter what he said it's the he Mitt Romney said it, even if the said "I love banana flavored ice-cream" they would have said

well yeah? that means you hate all those who love chocolate flavored ice-cream!

 

The serfs have chosen their Messiah already, and like they say "There's no Country for Old Men" anymore

and a perfect quote of what this country has become

"..Talking about his father, George Romney, Mitt said that had he "been born of Mexican parents I'd have a better shot at winning this, but he was unfortunately born of Americans living in Mexico." When a rich, white guy wants to be a Mexican, even for a little while, then you know that this is truly no country for old, white men."

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 15:05 | 2820734 Vet4RonPaul
Vet4RonPaul's picture

That is not why I don't like him; I don't like him because he is a warmongering bail-out-the-banksters neocon chickenhawk coward.  

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 15:50 | 2820755 Azannoth
Azannoth's picture

Pick your poison, right?

Do you really believe Romney is what he say he is? He's a pragmatist, he's 100% support for Israel is 100% fake(and the joos know it)

He's warmongering and posturing, is so ostentatious it puts Paris Hilton to shame, how real do you think it is?

He wants to become President and he's trying to hard, he'll say and do anything and in that he overdid it(not like he had much of a chance to begin with)

Do I like him, do I think he's a standup guy? Fak no! Would I vote for him if I was an American(the pragmatist in me says yes),

simply because I don't think he could(even if he wanted to) fak up as bad as the Kenyan will with 1 hand up his own ass the 2nd hand up Michele's ass and a joos dick in his mouth

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 22:53 | 2821274 Bear
Bear's picture

Watch it ... "Banana flavored ice cream" = "vanilla flavored ice cream" = a right-wing racist dog-whistle in a "chocolate flavored ice cream" world 

 

Sun, 09/23/2012 - 06:55 | 2821692 Kobe Beef
Kobe Beef's picture

That's raaaacist. And your clever "banana" is a dog-whistle to represent the male sex organ. That's seeeexist. You must be a "naziwhowantstomassacresixmillionjews! plus a patriarchaloppressorwhowantstoviolatetherightsofwomeneverywhere!" I saw it on MSNBC.

sarc off. We love you Bear, somebody's got to speak straight.

whoops, I said straight. Not in this rainbow sherbert world.

Damn, this PC marxism is tricky.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 14:16 | 2820611 Escapeclaws
Escapeclaws's picture

Webster Tarpley's site tarpley.net is no longer accessible. Does anyone know about this?

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 15:14 | 2820750 blunderdog
blunderdog's picture

That site's always been a bit dodgy, actually.  Give it a day, it's probably just a dozing webmaster.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 15:24 | 2820768 WillyGroper
WillyGroper's picture

Never been there till now. No problem. You must be on a list & I just joined you. 

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 14:38 | 2820672 Nick the Greek
Nick the Greek's picture

The 47% just needs to borrow money from their parents. Right Mittens??

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 14:52 | 2820694 El_Puerco
El_Puerco's picture

It is safe to assume it was all planned...Mitt Romney speaking to a small group of wealthy contributors at a fundraiser wherein the Republican candidate reveals ...A camera just there;  Meet ten amazing hidden video cameras you would never guess. ...Nobody will ever find out there are being recorded with that. ...Wow!...Obama has to win!...Have a nice day.

 

RON PAUL!...  Hey, Where Are You??.....

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 15:00 | 2820719 alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

Romney is a corporation disguised as a person.

Like a corporation, his only commitment is to profit at all cost.

Like a corporation he possess no heart, no spine, no conscience, no soul, no brain.

The only thing that distinguishes him from a corporation is that he, unlike a corporation, wears magic underwear and believes that he will become king of his own planet after his death.

The fact that a person who wears magic underwear is being considered for president should be a 4 alarm warning in and of itself.

This is utter insanity.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 17:27 | 2820941 Totentänzerlied
Totentänzerlied's picture

The religious argument is bullshit. It carries no more weight than the asinine cries of "Obama's a Muslim!" The question is, so fucking what? I hold Muslims and Mormons (and all adherents to the Abrahamic Triumvirate of Cryptomonotheistic Death Cults) in low but entirely equal amounts of respect - very very very little.

If his professed religious affiliation was the only thing I could cite against him, Romney would be a saint of purest soul. Ditto Obama. That you apparently feel the need to resort to personal slander of a man with so many grievous and dangerous political beliefs suggests you can muster nothing of greater credence against him.

What's insane is the continued attention in any form being paid to political pageantry.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 18:07 | 2820955 alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

All religions are bullshit...including the ones you DIDN'T point out in your post.

My post wasn't the worst thing I could say about Romney...it was the best I could say about him.

and let's be honest...isn't the idea of "magic underwear" rather...comical? (to say the least)

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 23:27 | 2821318 Heyoka Bianco
Heyoka Bianco's picture

Cryptomonotheistic Death Cult? Aren't they opening for Turbonegro on the Sexual Harassment tour?

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 19:36 | 2821077 SeattleBruce
SeattleBruce's picture

"That is utter insanity."

Since you're talking insanity, let's not forget our sitting TOTUS, so utterly qualified 2 years into his 1st Senate term when he started his perma-campaign, who had authored no legislation, and whose records are completely shuttered and shrouded.  Oh, and did I mention he's a COMPLETE tool of TPTB. I know you wanted to be fair, and not leave him out of your diatribe.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 22:46 | 2821270 Bear
Bear's picture

All this because he has a record of accomplishment and string of personal successes ... When did we start denigrating success and applauding failure ... no one can right our listing ship but at least Romney is not trying to sink it

Sun, 09/23/2012 - 10:30 | 2821859 therearetoomany...
therearetoomanyidiots's picture

I agree with you.  

 

This election is between two people or more likley, two ideas:

Team Obama:  Let's sink the country

Team Romney: Let's at least try to not sink the country.

I'm thinking a 95% chance of certain death is better than a 100% of certain death.

We don't have Ron Paul to vote for -forget write-in - they won't count it, I know, it happened to me in 2008.  So, if you vote for anyone other than Romeny, you are choosing to consign us to certain loss of any liberty that remains. 

 

And don't respond and retort to say the bankers run everything blah blah blah, the jooze, the koochs, blah blah blah.  Just get your guns, you food and be prepared for the worst, hope for the best. 

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 15:02 | 2820722 Grand Supercycle
Grand Supercycle's picture

OVERDUE CORRECTION LOOMS:

Due to recent central bank intervention and short covering spikes, all these daily charts are extremely overextended & a significant correction is expected very soon:

SPX, DOW, NASDAQ, NZDUSD, GBPUSD, AUDUSD, COPPER, CRUDE, GOLD, SILVER. [USD strength will return]

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2012-12-24/market-analysis

http://trader618.com

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 15:02 | 2820726 Vet4RonPaul
Vet4RonPaul's picture

Lest we forget, both Romney and Obama are warmongering neocon chickenhawk bail-out-the-banksters cowards.  Now, with regard to Romney, isn't it really thrilling that a guy who's dad didn't serve in the military, who's five sons didn't serve in the military and who he himself didn't serve in the same military, is so damn eager and proud to want to start a war with Iran?  What a hero!  multiple generations of warmongering conscientious objectors  and Obama; is that really the best America could offer for president?!  We're fucked again; i'm voting for gary johnson.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 15:21 | 2820760 alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

There should be a ballot option for "None of the Above". If that gets the most votes, then there must be a new election with all new candidates.

If we do that often enough...we'll eventually get Ron Paul in office.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 15:16 | 2820754 Atomizer
Atomizer's picture

 

 

Good luck to some - Global Debt Facility 

Vaguely speaking, focus on the word  [Global Debt Facility]. It will take you into the future, you’ll figure out how to contend with the present chaos phase.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 15:40 | 2820764 earleflorida
earleflorida's picture

Eric Holder v. Alberto Gonzales... help me someone? --- moving on,...

'The Two Faces have I, Romney'

Mitt the Mormon?

Mitt the Faustian?

Simply said, Romney hung a rhetorical cord  of contention about Obama's neck. 'This Sanctimonious False Prophet of Changeless Hopium'? He's sequestered Barry into a air-tight Kafkaesque`situation where the Dem's, 'flock-of-sheeple' can smell the wolfish guardian's at their gated masters' abattoir pasture... grazing upon the freshly cut sinecure!

Bravo for Mitt!!!

So he subscribes to the 'Machiavellian Way' --- who the fuck that's successful in business today doesn't?

jmo.... Great read :-))

thankyou

Ps. a word to the wise by 'Eastwick's interpretation of Arabic and Persian Sayings': ___ "Kings are but guardians who the poor should keep, Though this world's goods wait on their diadem, Not for the shepherd's welfare are the sheep- The sheperd rather is for pasturing them."

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 15:43 | 2820793 Atomizer
Atomizer's picture

 

 

Truths & Half truths..

http://www.trilateral.org/download/file/Rubio_MYTHS_AND_THOSE%20RESPONSIBLE.pdf

 

You think you’re going to peel our onion, we have news for you.. go talk with the potato first.

/LOL

 

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 16:13 | 2820807 Hacksaw
Hacksaw's picture

My, my, the turds are certainly flying off bull shit mountain today. When I see all the effort to convince everyone how Mormon Mitt's telling the truth about how much the rich bastards value the rest of us isn't going to cost him votes, it makes me wonder. I wonder how much all the shills are costing the Koch crowd?

 

http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/wed-september-19-2012/chaos-on-bulls--...

http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/wed-september-19-2012/chaos-on-bulls--...

http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/wed-september-19-2012/chaos-on-bull--t...

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 20:31 | 2821148 syntaxterror
syntaxterror's picture

Awww, SSI check not in yet?

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 16:33 | 2820858 Venerability
Venerability's picture

Tyler,

Since many of you - very young - Fellas do not deign to speak to anybody other than each other, I don't think you realize just how damaging those comments by Governor Romney were.

Literally the entire population - especially Republicans - is now openly saying that the final nail in Romney's coffin may have been hammered in.

These were "character" comments writ large and what they truly do is put Mr. Romney in the exact same category - Blatant, Unapologetic Opportunist - that those of us in the non-Fringe GOP realize also applies to the likes of John Kerry and Al Gore. 

The situation with Bill Clinton is very different, because his character flaws are of a different kind. He isn't an Opportunist, he's a Megalomaniac - and a pretty darn good one.

Note that he is the main guest on Fareed Zakaria's show tomorrow morning, excerpts from which will probably dominate American and European Market matters next week.

Clinton's - and Gordon Brown's - and maybe George Soros's and Christine Lagarde's - vision now is focused on worldwide coordination of economic policy after a convincing Obama victory.

That depends on two things, which the real core GOP can - and should - have a real impact on:

Tying any worldwide stimulus to a worldwide - and much fairer - resources, especially energy, protocol - which in turn depends on a long-term weaker dollar and the semi-formal insitution of currency baskets against which commodity prices are measured. (Yes, tie that to a semi-formal Gold Standard if you wish.)

And secondly, getting China on board by offering her various Carrots, instead of just the never-ending barrage of Sticks we've been throwing her way for years now.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 16:49 | 2820890 blunderdog
blunderdog's picture

   Literally the entire population - especially Republicans - is now openly saying that the final nail in Romney's coffin may have been hammered in.

Anyone speaking for "the entire population" is either a liar or a fool.  Maybe both.  Although the Romney campaign never had any chance at all, if you believe the media.

World-wide stimulus?   "Fairer" resources protocols?  Heh.  Sorry...no, not possibly. 

The only folks who talk about "fairness" in geopolitics are the folks who've already lost.  Whether rightly or wrongly, neither the US nor the Eurozone are going to concede defeat any time soon.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 17:23 | 2820931 Venerability
Venerability's picture

That's an incredibly silly by-rote post, Poopsie.

The Koch Bots should at least have some adult human supervision before they spew out tripe in response to a serious and sensible post, whether or not it comes from someone they perceive as a political "enemy."

You "Strong Dollar" Nihilist Empire Builders have been "winning?" In what Alternate Universe?

You've been disruptive and destructive, Yes.

But you haven't been "winning" anywhere except in the diseased minds of Larry Kudlow and very few others.

Most humans - including most market participants both in the US and worldwide - have at least an inchoate understanding now that the Apex of Triumph for the "Strong Dollar" faction was the Great Crash of 2008.

That's put you fellas in the most extreme of the most  extreme minority.

You're not the "one percent." You're closer to the "one percent of one percent."

And note to BOTH the Obama-ites and my fellow Centrists and Big Tenters in the GOP: Isn't it about time we told new generations about the John Birch Society and what it stood for; why we hated it back then; and how the core of those funding extremist groups on the Supply Side are the heirs - both figuratively and literally - of the John Birch Society of the 50s and 60s?

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 18:07 | 2820990 blunderdog
blunderdog's picture

"By rote"?  "Koch brothers"?

Uh...no, asshole.  I'm a liberal.  I'm also an anti-authoritarian, and really don't care much for the "rule by financial hegemony" that the folks you refer to in your reponse are so keen on.

If you had something interesting to say, it should've shown up by now, but 80% of those two posts is just coy insult aimed at the other posters here.  Sure, maybe this isn't your crowd and all, but you might get a response if you spent a bit more time just saying whatever it is you think you want to say.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 21:33 | 2821200 Venerability
Venerability's picture

If you are a human - a Botmaster, not a Bot - I suspect you're not old enough yet to know whether you're a "liberal," a "conservative," a "Supply Sider," or a "Keynesian."

You are most probably a male in his late teens or early 20s, poorly educated, addicted to hacking, and quite possibly daytrading exclusively from the Short side.

If so, you are the Ideal Target for the Fringe Botnets both supposedly on the "Left" and on the "Right," although those administered by the Kochs have been far more effective than the old MoveOn.org Botnets for the past few years.

And not surprisingly, the Ideal Targets of the Fringe Botnets in the developed world are not all that dissimilar from the Ideal Targets of extremist - including terror - groups in the Middle East, Asia, Africa and elsewhere. 

 

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 22:41 | 2821268 Bear
Bear's picture

The whole Middle East is extremist (in our western world view) ... there are no moderate (i.e. secular) Muslims ... If they are true to their holy books they cannot be good Muslims and 'moderate' ... The Bush idea of Democratization is illogical since the Qur'an stipulates that rule by the people is demonic. Iraq and Afghanistan had elections to appease us while the 'elections' in other Muslim nations are accomplished to protect the dollar stream.   

Sun, 09/23/2012 - 07:12 | 2821701 Kobe Beef
Kobe Beef's picture

@vulnerability:

Wow, you must not have spent any amount of time reading comments posted here if you think Blunderdog is a bot, botmaster, or Koch Brothers' Plant.

Whether I agree with him or not, Blunderdog is an original ZH commentator.

And in your opinion, it seems we all need more Agenda 21, sustainable development, smart growth piracy coordinated by Clinton, Brown, the CFR, UN, and the global looter class. I think not, Philip Dru. So in this case, I agree with Blunderdog and the others who've downvoted your comments.

We know your ideology for what it truly is: Fabian.

Sun, 09/23/2012 - 23:27 | 2823384 Venerability
Venerability's picture

Everyone knows who I am and that I am a lifelong Centrist, Big Tent Republican in the Teddy Roosevelt-Nelson Rockefeller tradition. Extremists on both sides of the political spectrum tend to dislike me, but the vast majority who are Centrists - whether fellow GOP'ers, Dems, or Independents - tend to like my commentary very much.

I have established an Internet reputation over many years and have a journalistic reputation going back 30 years. So some silly little boys - without verifiable identities, yet! - are not going to hurt me.

Any Poster on ZH or anywhere else who does not link to a verifiable human identity - which can be checked out, say, by a private detective, if not more easily by one's lifelong achievements and reputation - should be assumed to be a bought-and-paid-for Script Bot unless proven otherwise.

ZH can go the more respectable routes of Seeking Alpha, Huffington Post, and various other interactive sites, where most Posters have verifiable human identities and where a variety of viewpoints and true debate are honored and respected - the two generally go together!

Or ZH can remain a one-note pure propaganda site, with virtually NO Posters with verifiable identities and anyone who doesn't tow the Koch Brothers' John Birch-Market Nihilist line being thumbed-down and insulted by rote.

That's been the Yahoo Finance pattern for decades now, after all - one reason almost everybody considers Yahoo Finance a joke.

I think ZH has a lot going for it, in terms of breaking news and bringing it into the market for everyone to see.

But those strengths are negated if the Comments streams continue to stifle varying viewpoints and those actual human Posters who are willing to go up against the Botnets in a serious way.

Sun, 09/23/2012 - 14:02 | 2822395 blunderdog
blunderdog's picture

Three long posts, and you haven't managed to express a single idea.

I'm thinking you're too old for the innerwebz, dear chap.  Time to go back to shouting at the kids on the lawn, eh?

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 21:17 | 2821183 Bear
Bear's picture

Just as in the President speech at the convention, your denigrations and straw man arguments are not logical as they impute to the 'other' side a bunch of talking points that Fabians have been using for a century. You insist that the distribution of wealth is not fair but the standards that you use as a measuring stick is your own. In 2008, Obama claimed that he wanted to unite America. However, it was not an amalgamation of views, approaches, and solutions ... he wanted to unite us under his philosophical umbrella of distributive justice.

Utopia is not possible since equality of outcomes cannot be achieved. America is great because we have liberty not because we have equality.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 21:22 | 2821187 Bear
Bear's picture

Getting on-board?

They are already a central-planned Communist society with complete equality for all of it's citizens. They have worked very hard for 64 years to create the 'perfect' society under socialism. Your espoused views would indicate that is exactly what you wish for all of us. 

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 17:11 | 2820918 dolph9
dolph9's picture

I have no great love of the "47%" but I fully admit that someday I might join them.

I am basically going to transition from hardworking American middle class patsy to gold/silver speculator to gold/silver spender and finally welfare bum over the next 20 years.

And if the welfare runs out by that point, well, that would be the least of my, or society's, concerns.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 17:44 | 2820963 Quantum Nucleonics
Quantum Nucleonics's picture

It's grossly inaccurate, even a bald-faced lie, to say that most Wall Street bankers are Republicans.  In fact, just the opposite, they are mostly Democrats!  Jon Corzine - Democrat, Jamie Dimond - Democrat, the tool that runs B of A - Democrat.  Nobody has gotten more money from Goldman Sachs than Obama.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 18:08 | 2820991 blunderdog
blunderdog's picture

derp derp.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 20:33 | 2821150 syntaxterror
syntaxterror's picture

We have a winner!

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 19:28 | 2821066 q99x2
q99x2's picture

Moochers, I resemble that comment and I'm damn proud of it. Look at all those fools that go to work to pay for me. I'm a king not a man. The government should have to pay me personally four more years for Romulan's comment just so I won't have to go out and get married again.

Democrat's are powerful enough to destroy the nation. And don't forget it.

King I say.

Sat, 09/22/2012 - 20:21 | 2821132 toomanyfakecons...
toomanyfakeconservatives's picture

If this level of governnment-sponsored lawlessness isn't justification for the coming MASS ARRESTS, I don't know what is... http://tinyurl.com/cd5cyjo/

Sun, 09/23/2012 - 02:07 | 2821426 Radical Marijuana
Radical Marijuana's picture

... the most believable, or least disliked, of the two lying candidates will become president of the United States of America…

TOO TRUE.

Romney appears to be the appointed loser.

...Somebody even worse than Obama ???

Since the USA has been on a doomsday spiral since 1913, with that on a long, but previously slower, exponential growth curve of money-as-debt as its fundamental system, every President has presided over things getting worse faster.

In my opinion, the last great President was Andrew Jackson, but he had to be miraculously lucky to survive the banksters' assassination attempts to achieve what he did.  Since then, every possibly good President has been bribed, intimidated, or assassinated, to stop them from doing anything but preside over the established systems automatically getting worse, faster. Indeed, the established systems have become so totally dominant that nobody else but the two leading puppets in the puppet show put on by the mass media have any reasonable chances.

Ever since Nixon, in 1971, totally abolished all connections of privatized fiat money to reality, and allowed pure fiat money based on nothing, and therefore, based on unlimited future debts, the total debts in the USA have followed a nearly perfect match to the mathematics of exponential growth. Therefore, each President has presided over his phase of doubling the debts.

By analogy, during the 21st Century, that has seen Bush 2 accelerate over the speed limit, to become, under Obama a ridiculously unsafe speed. After put-putting along building up debts, then, sometimes, even paying them off a little, in previous periods of American history, Bush 2 began accumulating debts at over 60 mph, then Obama came along and continued doing that at over 160 mph.

As long as the fundamental system stays the same, then the next President would have to keep doubling down. The next President will either have to keep doubling the total debts throughout the USA, or else the whole system will collapse into chaos.  Indeed, there is no doubt that that MUST happen, sooner or later, in one way or another. The ONLY way out is for some kind of intellectual Second American Revolution to change the fundamental financial system.

Right now, I would continue to predict Emperor Obama will prevail, and therefore, commit greater and greater treasons that we can now imagine. During my life time, I have watched in initial disbelief as I thought that the next President could not possibly be worse than the last one, and then, BAM! The next President turned out to be even worse than the last one. ... I now expect Emperor Obama to be the worst ever!  ... HOWEVER, there are no other choices actually possible within the established systems, since the apparently chosen loser, Romney, would be even worse than Obama (as hard as that is to imagine!)

Sun, 09/23/2012 - 07:23 | 2821709 Kobe Beef
Kobe Beef's picture

+1 Andrew Jackson. Let's clone him and turn him loose to rout the vipers again.

Sun, 09/23/2012 - 07:56 | 2821732 overmedicatedun...
overmedicatedundersexed's picture

except for the obuma and mitt bots, most posters agree things  are not right. well they are not. 60 yrs of nanny statism has led to what we see today, who wants to change that. those who still think gov spending on benefits lowers poverty well you obviously do not see the decimated detroits of america. those that see endless wars and police state growth, you have never rode an airline. or seen the no end wars up close.

lets hope zh has some info on how to live in this crony criminal world voting via diebold and scytl tell you the results seems childish.

Sun, 09/23/2012 - 09:41 | 2821814 nowhereman
nowhereman's picture

I agree with the sentiment.  "nanny statism has led to what we see today", BUT, we need to recognize that this does not just apply to the 47%ers.

The Corporate nanny state is far more expensive than the "entitlements" for the unemployed and the pensioner.  Government handouts to corporations (corporations are people too) far exceeds the costs of supporting those in need.

What with bank bailouts, subsides for farmers, subsides for big pharma, and speculators and investors, just to name a few.  Never mind the government sanctioned and protected monopolies in the media, internet and oil and gas and military weaponry.

Indeed, this is capitalism in name only.  There has never been a level playing field.  And "it's not what you know, but who you know" is on display day in and day out.

So, it is very important to be careful in choosing our words, lest we allow ourselves to be constrained by the oligarchs definition of the words we use.  Let's not allow them to define the problem.  They are the problem.

They don't want you to look too closely at their "entitlements" it's your "entitlements" that are the problem.

Sun, 09/23/2012 - 06:20 | 2821678 zippy_uk
zippy_uk's picture

As an outsider I call this presidential election as BOGUS. America has to come out of a financial crisis by picking one of two financial backed finance candidates. Should rename the contest as Chigaco finance guy vs hedge fund guy. Think that's a good choice ?

None of the issues discussed are relevant. The relevant issues are not discussed. In the western world we have global corporations, of which banks are a special sub set making excess profits. This indicates lack of completion from smaller companies.

These profits are being taken by gaming the tax system, special interest corporate welfare which helps cause deficit spending both trade and fiscal, gaming wage arbitration and finally additional laws and regulations which global corporates, especially banks LIKE despite what they say because it increases cost of entry to competitior businesses.

The political classes see these corporate lobbyists prior to donation time, both sides and think wow - these guys know about the economy.

What needs to happen is that the people need to explain to these politicos how it actually is and what actually needs to happen.

Sun, 09/23/2012 - 11:13 | 2821907 Disenchanted
Disenchanted's picture

 

 

 

Mitt Romney talking shit about those who take from govt. coffers...pot, kettle, black.

 

What Romney doesn't mention is that Steel Dynamics also received generous tax breaks and other subsidies provided by the state of Indiana and the residents of DeKalb County, where the company's first mill was built.

 

and:

 

Romney’s 'Crony Capitalism': Bain's Big Government Subsidies

 

FOAD Rmoney and take Oblahma with you...

 

edit...addendum:

 

 

Yet a look at Romney’s record at Bain shows not only Gordon Gekko-like business buccaneering, but also a willingness to embrace those very government checks and assurances he is now repudiating. Companies acquired and managed by Bain during Romney’s tenure showed no hesitation in taking taxpayer handouts in the form of state and local economic development subsidies.


A comparison of the 1999 Bain portfolio obtained by the Los Angeles Times to the information in the Subsidy Tracker database my colleagues and I at Good Jobs First created (as well as other sources), yields examples such as the following:

 

Steel Dynamics Inc. In 1994 this company, among whose financial backers at the time was Bain, got a $77 million subsidy package—including grants, property tax abatements, tax credits and reimbursement for training costs—for its steel mill in DeKalb County, Indiana (Fort Wayne Journal Gazette, June 23, 1994).

 

GS Industries. In 1996 American Iron Reduction LLC, a joint venture of GS Industries (which had been taken private by Bain in 1993) and Birmingham Steel, sought some $20 million in tax breaks in connection with its plan to build a plant in Louisiana’s St. James Parish (Baton Rouge Advocate, April 6, 1996). As the United Steelworkers union noted recently, GS Industries later applied for a federal loan guarantee, but before the deal could be implemented the company went bankrupt.

 

Sealy. A year after the 1997 buyout of this leading mattress company by Bain and other private equity firms, Sealy received $600,000 from state and local authorities in North Carolina to move its corporate offices, a research center and a manufacturing plant from Ohio (Greensboro News & Record, March 31, 1998). In 2004 Bain and its partners sold Sealy to another private equity group.

 

GT Bicycles. In 1997 GT, then owned by Bain and other investors, decided to move its manufacturing operations to an enterprise zone in Santa Ana, California. Being in the zone gave the company, which was later purchased by Schwinn, special tax credits relating to hiring and the purchase of equipment (Orange County Register, July 9, 1999).

 

Since Romney arranged to share in Bain’s profits after he left the firm in 1999, it is legitimate to look at cases of subsidy grabbing by Bain companies after that time. Some of these involved firms that had been acquired during Romney’s tenure but which didn’t get their subsidies until after he departed. For example:

 

Stream International. In 2000, this operator of call centers, then controlled by Bain, agreed to open a facility in Kalispell, Montana, but only if local officials provided $4 million in grants and tax breaks (The Missoulian, February 8, 2000). U.S. Senator Max Baucus also arranged for a $500,000 grant from the federal Economic Development Administration (AP, March 4, 2000). Later that year, Stream got Silver City, New Mexico to provide tax credits, subsidized training and subsidized rent for another call center (Albuquerque Tribune, July 12, 2000).

 

Alliance Laundry Systems. In 2000 this maker of washing machines, purchased by Bain in 1998, received a $560,000 grant from the state of Florida in connection with its plan to move a commercial laundry from Cincinnati. (Tallahassee Democrat, June 8, 2000). In 2004 the company received $1.25 million in assistance (including a low-cost loan of $1 million and a $250,000 grant) from the state of Wisconsin. Bain sold the company to a Canadian pension fund in 2005.

 

Romney’s ongoing profit participation also makes it legitimate to look at subsidies that have gone to companies acquired by Bain after Romney moved into public life:

 

Burger King Corporation.  In 2005—while owned by Bain, TPG and Goldman Sachs—Burger King let it be known that it was considering moving its headquarters from the Miami area to Houston. After local and state officials put together a $9 million subsidy package, the company agreed to stay in South Florida but move to a new building.  Two years later, Burger King dropped the idea of a new headquarters altogether and had to repay $3 million of the package (which came from a Quick Action Closing Fund grant) to the state as a result. Bain and its partners sold off their remaining interest in Burger King in 2010.

 

Quintiles Transnational Corp. When Bain and other private equity firms bought this pharmaceutical services company in 2007 they inherited a $25 million subsidy package that the company had negotiated with North Carolina officials in 2006. The package included an up-front $2 million grant from the One North Carolina Fund, a $2 million matching grant from Durham County, and the promise of up to $21.4 million over 12 years from a performance-based Job Development Investment Grant.

 

AMC Entertainment. After being promised more than $40 million in subsidies, this movie chain (bought in 2004 by Bain and other private equity firms) agreed to move its headquarters from downtown Kansas City, Missouri to a nearby suburb across the state line in Kansas. The deal was criticized as an egregious case of taxpayer-financed sprawl.

 

And finally, what about Staples, whose early backing by Bain is frequently cited by Romney as the best example of his business acumen? The chain has long been making use of economic development subsidies, including the period when Romney was still at Bain. In 1996, for example, it chose Hagerstown, Maryland as the site for a distribution center after getting a $4.2 million subsidy package (Baltimore Sun, April 16, 1996).

 

It’s quite possible that Romney’s recent anti-government comments, like much of what he says, are not meant to be taken too seriously. But as long as he is spouting free-market rhetoric, he needs to be reminded about the extent to which his ascent (and that of the rest of the 1% ) has been propelled by public money.

 

Re-posted from the Dirt Diggers Digest

Sun, 09/23/2012 - 11:45 | 2822001 boiltherich
boiltherich's picture

American voters have voted against their own economic interests more often than they have vote for them, look at the landslide of Raygun, the lower socioeconomic tiers knew he was not going to make life better for them, especially when they reelected him. I should know, I voted for him the first time, or should I say I voted against Carter who I deemed too incompetent to remain in office no matter how bad the alternative was, and being a Californian democrat I had a pretty good idea what Raygun would do to America, I still thought it would be better than what Carter had done.

But, in this election it is not about how people got into the situation they are in, it is about which candidate will do the best by you, or at least which will do the least harm to you. And that 47% number if we take it at face value all other things being equal, understand that Obama might not be the knight in shining armor delivering the change they had hoped for, but they know for a fact that if they vote for Romney they will be eating garbage off the local landfill before he is finished being a one term president. They will be sleeping there too. Well, at least those that survive the nuclear war he is likely to start since it is a Mormon belief that god wants the world to end in fire before we can come home to him.

But if Romney cannot by his own admission get 47% of the voters because that is the number that is entitled and rightly fears he will destroy their entitlement, which by the way serves as an acknowledgement that he will end all entitlement, I think he could have told the same audience that there are in fact others he cannot get. Ninety nine percent of gay and lesbian voters will not vote for him under any circumstances, and that is about another 3% of voters, people who in aggregate because they are higher on the economic scale and essentially do not have a whole lot of kids that qualify them for government benefits, so there is no crossover into that other 47%, know that Mittens will do any and everything he can to return them to the status of criminals leading secret lives in fear. How far he can get in that effort depends upon his ability to rig the judicial branch and pass laws in GOP dominated legislation, but much of the progress made by this subpopulation has been administrative and can be undone with the wave of an executive pen.

Then there is the population of African Americans that is not dependent upon the government for help, and contrary to popular belief at ZH that is another 8 or 9 million voting age people. Recent polling suggests that Romney's support in the African American population is ZERO. That is a naught, a goose egg. None, not one.

There are others but I think you get the point by now.

Either Romney and the GOP are utter failures at simple arithmetic or they have a deep seated need to be humiliated at the polls. They must be channeling Cervantes ghost by tilting at windmills so large that even don Quixote can see them clearly. The 47% they CANNOT by their own admission get, plus the 3% who are gay, lesbian, and their supporters, and we can stop there because that is 50% (at least) meaning he has to get all other votes just to tie. And I strongly suspect that he can't do that.

I will be watching the election returns as closely as any football fan watches a super bowl that his local team participates in, not because I have any doubts about the winner, but because I want to relish the depth of the beating the GOP will take that will shock that party so badly that they will after this election finally come to realize how marginal they have made themselves. They live in a bubble with blinders on their eyes, they cannot see what they have become. They do not understand that it is not about finding a winning candidate like Raygun was, but about finding winning ideas that all Americans can support and live with. And I hope the opposition sees this and understands it as well, because the fact that Obama wins does not mean he should or that the left is actually doing the right things. They also risk marginalization if they cannot get past viewing a win as a stamp of approval, look at Carter. He almost destroyed the party and was responsible for the election of the great white theft that has reigned 20 of the last 30 years.

 

Sun, 09/23/2012 - 14:08 | 2822411 blunderdog
blunderdog's picture

I don't think Romney can win the election either, but the one thing that I'm wondering about: what percentage of the youth vote that turned out for Obama in '08 is going to bother this year?

I socialize with freeks and artiste types, and the election is just not something anyone has any excitement about.  I don't know how many of these folks there ARE, but if a relevant number of voters who WOULD belong in the "Obama" camp don't bother, the results could be closer than people are currently expecting.

Sun, 09/23/2012 - 16:19 | 2822648 boiltherich
boiltherich's picture

bDog:  You might be right about lack of excitement and a lower turnout for the left compared to 2008, but the same holds for the right, Mittens is not exactly setting the GOP on fire with manic euphoria.  In fact every republican I have spoken with about this originally supported another GOP'er and thinks the party made a huge mistake in nominating Romney.  And I think there is grim determination on the left to make sure Romney is not elected.  I don't know anyone that was so ecstatic for Obama in '08 that still is, everyone feels thrown under the bus, too much was promised and not enough delivered, but there is genuine fear on the left of the spector of evil that Romney represents.  Nobody I know that voted for Obama thinks this does not matter.  They might not be thrilled but they are scared of what will happen if Mr. Magic Underpants wins.  Though they also seem to think it will be such a landslide that their personal vote will not be needed and that bothers me in a niggling nagging way. 

Sun, 09/23/2012 - 14:04 | 2822397 Audacity17
Audacity17's picture

Phobia is an irrational fear.  Nothing irrational about fearing savages.

 

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