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America's Fattest Are Getting Fattest-er Faster
In the ten years to 2010, the severely obese (Americans who are 100lbs or more overweight) increased about 70%. A new study from RAND Corporation (via ScienceDaily) found that "the proportion of people at the high end of the weight scale continues to increase faster than any other group of obese people, despite increased public attention on the risks of obesity."
Up from 3.9% to 6.6% (or more than 15 million people) of our population is now morbidly obese. The prevalence of severe obesity was about 50 percent higher among women than among men, and about twice as high among blacks when compared to Hispanics or whites. Increases in obesity were also fastest in the younger cohorts - under 40.
"The proportion of people at the high end of the weight scale continues to increase faster than any other group of obese people, despite increased public attention on the risks of obesity," said Roland Sturm, lead author of the report and a senior economist at RAND, a nonprofit research organization. "But for the first time in the past 20 years there is evidence the trend is slowing."
The study suggests that clinically severe obesity, instead of being a rare pathological condition among genetically vulnerable individuals, is an integral part of the population's weight distribution. As the whole population becomes heavier, the extreme category -- the severely obese -- increases the fastest.
To be classified as severely obese, a person must have a body mass index (a ratio of weight to height) of 40 or higher -- roughly 100 pounds or more overweight for an average adult man. The typical severely obese man weighs 300 pounds at a height of 5 feet 10 inches tall, while the typical severely obese woman weighs 250 pounds at a height of 5 feet 4 inches.
People with a BMI of 25 to 29 are considered overweight, while a BMI of 30 or more classifies a person as being obese. For a 5-foot-10 inch male, a BMI of 30 translates into being 35 pounds too heavy.
Or, for those confused:
On the bright side, as we noted here, the faster we get fatter, the sooner we die, and the lower the deficit (via entitlements) will be. Perhaps the way out of this fiscal mess is indeed to eat ourselves to an early death? Maybe all those looking to regulate what we eat and drink may actually be doing our economy more harm than good in the long-run.
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at least hes eating a salad
That's what I always say: You got your meats, vegetables, fruit, grains and dairy all in one meal. What couldn't be healthier?!
Ya need some cheap beer to wash that down with.
PBR, bitchez.
So there's the beef.
Wall-E
Just waitin for bone density to drop to zed, wheelchairs from the Gubmint, and a JUMBO iPad to keep you entertained......
I think I see some Tungsten in that beef
I think that's Obamaphone-lady.
poor = stupid = fat
AMERICANS!
But how many of you have problems with regulating those who can't regulate themselves? IT IS OK TO SAY YOU CAN'T HAVE A SODA BECAUSE YOU CAN'T HANDLE THE RESPONSIBILITY.
put them in a box labeled "USAID" and throw them to the starving kids in Africa.
Soylent Green from the colonies.
When Medicaid and Medicare go bankrupt, these people are all going to die anyway, so who cares if they want the physique of Jabba the Hut?
let 'em eat what they want, and while we are at it, MANDITORY cigarette smoking
reduces appetite, and, bonus, life expectancy
yes we can fix this entitlement problem
hey hey hey.
Photoshopped.
Don't see any chicken in that burger..
Needs some turducken. Wrapped in bacon and deep-fried.
Then deep fry the whole burger for good measure.
Forgot the waffles
eat your peas
eat your peas
All we are saying is give peas a chance.
Visualize Whirled Peas
Under the new "Obama Bill for Hope for Obese Americans" the governmentis is giving 1,000 shares of AAPL and a NEW Ipad to all Americans with a BMI of 25 or over.
How's that possible when so many people are living off food stamps?
Not enough EBT being spent on gambling, liquor and titty bars?
When you say gambling you must be referring to state sponsored lotteries which are nothing but regressive taxes that impact the poor the hardest. In many outlets in Florida tickets can be purchased with EBT cards, which enables the states to collect federal money through a back door channel. High frequency lotto players tend to be poor and uneducated, hoping to catch lightning in a bottle and strike it rich. It gives them false hope in a hopeless situation and many use their EBT cards to roll the dice.
Quite a scam the states have going!
All very true and well put, but I have one question. Can you point to any government program that isn't a scam?
It's ok if you guzzle jäger mister after ever meal
Nope!!!
I've heard in Japan, when your relative dies, you don't report the death just yet. Let the entitlement checks keep coming a little longer.
I heard in America, when you relative dies, you don't report the death just yet....to make sure any debt obligations don't have your name on it.
I heard in America, when your relative dies, they vote for democrats.
I heard in China, when someone offends the sensibilities of the state (apparently by not sharing the spoils of commerce, gained legally or not) they get shot in the head...and a bill sent to the family of the recently dearly departed for the price of the bullet.
I always wondered what would happen to the family if they refused to pay...I'm weird like that ;-)
i heard in isreal you can get a nice chinese kidney for 15,000 $
see also- "yo mama so zionist"
I heard in America when your brain dies, you post on Zerohedge under the name Gully Foyle.
and then you breath in your own fart>> caggelectomy's are free in cuba
if the family does not pay this counts as "offending the sensibilities of the state". for which...
No one twists their arms to blow that money on gambling that sounds like something obama said he thinks people need to be told what to do from cradle to grave. Then he wants our money to do it and the people who make real money from it is the Banks. That's our money they are throwing away. There are plenty of poor people who work hard but get food stamps because their income is too low that don't do that there should be no excuses for those who do.
JP Morgan’s Food Stamp Empire
obama
"Poor people "need help with basic skills, how to shop, how to show up for work on time, how to wear the right clothes, how to act appropriately in an office."
pssh, it's Ben's fiat, you didn't print that. . .
Which Is why I hope they always allow EBT gambling. We tax payers get at least some of the wasted money back!
Oh yes there is but they will be cracking down on that.
New welfare restrictions target booze, tattoos
snip
Taking aim at what they call an abuse of the taxpayers' money, a growing number of states are blocking welfare recipients from spending their benefits on booze, cigarettes, lottery tickets, casino gambling, tattoos and strippers.
Hey look at the bright side if the food supplier's fill the food with poison and fattening crap it helps kill off the old people so they don't have to pay them social security that is owed to them. That should make some of the posters here happy judging from the comments I've seen on the site they are outraged by the banks but have no problem when it comes to stiffing grandma and grandpa.
Study: Baby Boomers’ Health Very Poor, Getting Worse
It's the shit they eat. They buy a bunch of empty calorie high fat crap.
Carbs and sugars, lots of GMO corn, etc.
It is even worse than sugar.
1. High Fructose Corn Syrup - Industrial Sweetner in fake maple syrup, milk shakes and cold drinks
2. Canola Oil - Industiral oil of rapeseed converted to human use
3. Mechanically seprated beef and pink slime glotaed with antibiotics.
The food itseld is half the equation.
1. In stomach there is a resident fungus called Candidasis which is fed these things including carbs, wheat, yeast, acidity and sugars.
2. Fungus blooms in the stomach, starts drilling into blood stream.
3. Fungus and particles from leaky gut moves into blood stream toward organs and causes inflammation. Immune system also starts attacking healthy cells.
4. Organ failure results in death by diabetes, heart attack, stroke, cancer.
Why it isn't cured? The whole modern medical science is based on pathogens come from outside not inside.
Reason for dying from AIDS is systemic candidasis in patient. Only then modern science begin to acknowledge but then it is too late.
you mean this shit? http://shiftfrequency.com/comprehensive-list-of-gmo-products/#more-15820
easy natural treatment for candida albicans.
Take a spoon of NaHCO3 (sodium bicarbonate) a day with some water and two weeks later together with a sugar free and less acidic diet you get rid of the problem.
Lost wages is right....not the fat big boy....the sugar et. al.
Fat is really the preferred method of energy for your body.
Sugar is NOT!!! AND IM TALKING ABOUT ADM......CORN SYRUP PROCESSORS.....
CORN SYRUP IS 13x....13X SWEETER THAN SUGAR!!!!
Talk about leverage!!!!
Dr. Engali
And wrong.
We understand very little about how the body works. Modern medical science is about fifty years old.
There are enough bits and pieces of research to suggest the fears are just mindless.
First you get fat by taking more calories in than you burn.
Second there are three body types Ectomorphs Mesomorphs and Endomorphs.
Sheldon's "somatotypes" and their supposed associated physical traits can be summarized as follows:
Endomorph, endomorphic,[1] and endomorphism can refer to:
The body of the extreme endomorph is round and soft. The physique presents the illusion that much of the mass has been concentrated in the abdominal area. This may or may not be true. The arms and legs of the extreme endomorph are short in length and taper. This may give the appearance of stockiness. The hands and feet of the endomorph are comparatively small, and the upper arms and thighs are often more developed than the lower parts of the arms or legs. The body has a high waist.[2]
Third we have much more leisure time than ever before in History.
Fourth we have easy access to more food than ever before in History.
Now for some shit that NEVER gets mentioned.
http://www.cnn.com/2010/HEALTH/11/08/twinkie.diet.professor/index.html
Twinkie diet helps nutrition professor lose 27 poundsHis body mass index went from 28.8, considered overweight, to 24.9, which is normal. He now weighs 174 pounds.
But you might expect other indicators of health would have suffered. Not so.
Haub's "bad" cholesterol, or LDL, dropped 20 percent and his "good" cholesterol, or HDL, increased by 20 percent. He reduced the level of triglycerides, which are a form of fat, by 39 percent.
"That's where the head scratching comes," Haub said. "What does that mean? Does that mean I'm healthier? Or does it mean how we define health from a biology standpoint, that we're missing something?"
http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2012-08-07/lifestyle/sns-rt-us-is-the...
Surprisingly, researchers found that overweight and obese people who get diagnosed with the blood sugar disorder tend to live longer than their leaner peers.
This so-called "obesity paradox" has been observed before in chronic diseases like heart and kidney failure, said Mercedes R. Carnethon of the Feinberg School of Medicine at Northwestern University in Chicago.
http://www.webmd.com/diet/news/20110816/study-obese-people-live-as-long-...
Study: Obese People Live as Long as Slimmer People Researchers Say Healthy Lifestyle May Be as Important as Body Weight Obese people who are otherwise healthy live as long as normal-weight people, new research from Canada suggests.Some obese but healthy people actually are less likely to die of heart problems than normal-weight people who have some medical conditions, the researchers found.
"You shouldn't just look at body weight alone," says researcher Jennifer Kuk, PhD, assistant professor of kinesiology and health science at York University in Toronto.
"A healthy lifestyle, including being physically active and eating a healthy diet, is probably more important than your body weight and focusing on weight loss, if you are otherwise healthy," she tells WebMD.
https://www.nytimes.com/2012/09/18/health/research/more-data-suggests-fi...
In ‘Obesity Paradox,’ Thinner May Mean SickerIn study after study, overweight and moderately obese patients with certain chronic diseases often live longer and fare better than normal-weight patients with the same ailments. The accumulation of evidence is inspiring some experts to re-examine long-held assumptions about the association between body fat and disease.
http://www.foxbusiness.com/personal-finance/2010/08/25/good-fat-overweig...
If obesity is so bad, why do fat heart patients survive longer than their normal-weight counterparts?
Although obesity has been linked to a variety of health problems, such as hypertension, diabetes mellitus, renal disease, stroke and heart disease, a growing body of research is finding that obese people with those diseases actually live longer than normal-weight patients who are similarly afflicted
pure bs. the processed gmo crap sold to the poor is not food, its poison.
john39
Science is always bullshit right?
Like how that GMO tumor study was manipulated for the most horrendous effect, but that part never was mentioned.
Pull your head out of your ass and do the research I have.
You know about the Harvard Cholesterol study?
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-2145877/No-good-heart-Good-cho...
n a challenge to conventional wisdom, a team from Harvard Medical school found no direct link between raising good cholesterol levels - or HDL - with a lower risk of a heart attack.
The study published in the medical journal The Lancet compared heart-attack risk among people who inherited known genetic variants that gave them higher HDL levels.
This should mean they had a lower risk of coronary disease. However, the study of more than 50,000 people found no such link.
http://njms2.umdnj.edu/hwmedweb/archives/CholMortality_archive.htm
An article from the well-respected Honolulu Heart Program published in the journal The Lancet in August 2001 has some extraordinarily interesting data.
They studied 3,741 men who were 51 to 73 years of age when the first blood cholesterol level was obtained for this analysis. Another was taken twenty years later (in 1991 to 1993) and deaths determined over the next five years.
The men were divided into four groups according to blood cholesterol levels ranging from less than 170 milligrams to more than 210 milligrams. Those below 170 milligrams had the highest death rates. Those over 210 milligrams had a significantly lower death rate than those with the lowest cholesterol levels, but a bit higher than the group with the lowest death rate, those with cholesterol levels of about 190 to 210 milligrams.
The greatest death rate was found in those whose cholesterol levels were lowest at both the 1971 and 1991 examinations.
The authors note "the earlier patients start to have lower cholesterol concentrations, the greater the risk of death. We have been unable to explain our results. These data cast doubt on the scientific justification for lowering cholesterol to very low concentrations (less than 180 milligrams) in elderly people".
http://anthonycolpo.com/saturated-fat-is-not-associated-with-cardiovascu...
A couple of weeks back I shared with readers a WHO and FAO-sanctioned review showing that saturated fat and total fat intake were not associated with cardiovascular disease. Hot on the heels of that report comes a similar paper, appearing in the American Journal of Clinical Nutrition, also concluding that saturated fat shows no association with heart disease or stroke.
Researchers from Harvard Univerity and the Children’s Hospital Oakland Research Institute pooled the data from twenty-one prospective epidemiologic studies examining the association of dietary saturated fat with coronary heart disease (CHD), stroke, and cardiovascular disease (CVD; CHD inclusive of stroke) risk.
During 5–23 years’ follow-up of 347,747 subjects, 11,006 developed CHD or stroke. Intake of saturated fat was not associated with an increased risk of CHD, stroke, or CVD. The pooled relative risk estimates that compared extreme quantiles of saturated fat intake were 1.07 for CHD, 0.81 for stroke, and 1.00 for CVD. In other words, those who ate the highest amounts of saturated fat had no greater risk of CVD than those who ate the lowest. Consideration of age, sex, and study quality did not change the results[6].
Those of you tempted to dismiss these findings as the work of pro-meat/dairy/egg industry shills or fringe-dwelling skeptics should note that one of the authors, Dr. Ronald Krauss, has worked at the National Heart, Lung, and Blood Institute (NHLBI), has been a Senior Advisor to the National Cholesterol Education Program (NCEP), and is actively involved with the American Heart Association (AHA), having served as Chairman of the Nutrition Committee. He is founder and Chair of the AHA Council on Nutrition, Physical Activity, and Metabolism. The NHLBI, NCEP and AHA have all been key players in gaining global acceptance for the pseudo-scientific absurdity that constitutes the lipid hypothesis of heart disease.
Swedish Farmers Live Longer on Dairy Fat and Veggies
Last year, a study published in the International Journal of Environmental Research and Public Health reported on CHD mortality and morbidity among 1,752 Swedish rural males. During 12-years’ follow-up, 88 died during follow-up, 335 were hospitalized or died due to CVD and 138 were hospitalized or died due to CHD.
When the dietary records of the men were analyzed, the crude unadjusted data showed that consumption of cream and full-fat milk and daily consumption of fruit and vegetables were associated with a lower risk of CHD. When the data was adjusted for confounding factors the only statistically significant dietary factor associated with reduced CHD was the combination of daily fruit and vegetable intake and high dairy fat consumption (relative risk = 0.39). Choosing wholemeal bread or eating fish at least twice a week showed no association with CHD. Farmers developed less coronary heart disease than non-farmers[7].
Japanese with High Cholesterol Live Longer
The Japanese have long been cited in support of the lipid hypothesis, but there is an abundance of research involving Japanese participants showing this hypothesis is in fact complete nonsense. The latest of such studies appeared in the Journal of Lipid Nutrition[8].
Japanese citizens over the age of 40 qualify for free annual health check-ups. The Fukui Study was based on data collected by the Public Health Center of Fukui from such check ups between 1986 and 1990 of residents of Fukui City in Japan. Researchers stratified 22,971 participants into groups according to their cholesterol levels.
Compared with those in the 240-259 mg/dl category, those in the 160-169 mg/dl (both sexes) and the 140-159 mg/dl (women) groups suffered significantly higher all-cause mortality.
Next, the researchers conducted a meta-analysis of five large Japanese studies (including the Fukui Study) with a combined total of over 170,000 subjects to examine cholesterol levels and all-cause mortality.
Participants with cholesterol levels between 160-199 mg/dL were chosen as the reference group. The meta-analysis revealed that the relative risk in the <160 mg/dL group was significantly higher than in the reference group [RR = 1.71], and that the relative risks in the 200-239 mg/dL and >240 mg/dL groups were significantly lower than in the reference group [RRs of 0.83 and 0.78, respectively].
A low carb high fat diet helps my diabetes. I can eat as much meat - cheese - nuts - veggies that are green basically.
your research is a joke. all fats are not equal. natural fats like from raw milk are healthy. junk processed fats like mass produced corporate dairy are not healthy. so these types of studies are all but meaningless because the do not differentiate. as for gmo, eat up monsatan shill. and tell your corporate master to quit fighting gmo labeling. people should have the right to know what they are eating.
Uh, how about the real risk factor that causes all of this heart disease? Sugars and high frutose corn syrup. HFCS is lethal to humans, and people hate to hear that their sweets are killing them. Look at these three charts, and wonder about where the issue is. Cough, sugar lobby, cough.
HFCS in the US of A
http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=File:Usda_sweeteners.svg&page=1
Obesity in the US of A
http://www.data360.org/dsg.aspx?Data_Set_Group_Id=196
Diabeties
http://www.cdc.gov/diabetes/statistics/prev/national/figbyage.htm
*Winner* Absolutely true.
All beer drinkers here, watch this as you ponder man-boobs...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KTDacbPt270
Enjoy.
ori
You're aiming at the WRONG TARGET: cholesterol is a BYPRODUCT of your metabolism -> if you base your research on a DERIVATIVE that isn't clearly understood, how do you think you can get accurate results (I didnt check your articles, maybe some are remotely accurate)?
I'll read you again when your present research on omega-3/6 fatty acids, and body IMBALANCE in omega 3:6 ratio.
Do you know where all these fatty acids go? THEY COMPOSE YOUR CELLULAR WALL and therefore, any imbalance impacts the cell ability to let anything pass trough. THAT'S AN INDICATOR FOR INFLAMATION -> obesity, diabetes, cancer, etc.
hay hay hay.
You're a fat shit? Aren't you?
JimRogers
Me and my fat biker buddies want to know your address, maybe we could come over for salad and chat about attitude.
BYOB, bitchez........
BYO potato salad, lol.
He's obviously done a hell of a lot of reasearch to justify his fat ass, so that should count for something.
If you spend more time exercising than eating, you will be fit. I eat whatever the hell I want, never had a problem.
rub my belly , shine my tiny horn,s or shove a knife up my ass. up to you .
LOL, someone resembles that remark.
Me thinks you doth protest too much. Perhaps you are a bit chubby and are overly sensitive? Why not just be comfortable in your own skin and accept the consequences good or bad? Oh and you may be interested in reading Good calories Bad Calories by Gary Taubes. He truly dispels the "calorie in calorie out" theory through 100 years of obesity research which I really had fallen for myself. Very technical read but fascinating. Someone here recommended it and I am very grateful. Find some peace. Life now is stressful enough without compounding it.
Miffed:-)
No time to read this, got to get in my motorized wheel chair, take the elevator to my black GM SUV and pick up the Chinese I ordered with my OBAMA PHONE.....next time I am having them deliver, this is too much effort
That's the fucking truth. These fat fucks are all going for SSI (Social Security) disability payments. Their knees give out from trying to hoist the weight. They are TOO fat to work (or get to work), so they get full government disability benefits (health care, food stamps, disability, section 8 housing, obamaphones, etc....) I am almost to the point of saying something to them when I see them in their motorized, oversized "Rascals" trying to reach shit at the grocery store.
My late father had a cab company, and had one of these lard asses dispatching for him. She broke every chair he bought for her (even the one's rated for 600 lbs). Finally he had a friend cut a 55 gal. steel barrel in half, weld some inner cross supports and steel dolly wheels on them and topped it off with a round dog bed for a cushion. She sat on the "barrel" chair until she was eventually fired for not showing up to work (always sick). First she collected unemployment, then transitioned to disability when that ran out. Plus she had managed to push out a half dozen kids which she got welfare payments for. This was over ten years ago.
The gene pool needs a shock treatment.
Obamney 2012, Hasten the Collapse
mmm, yummy, another ZH two-minute-hate thread - incoming choc rations next!
we're all so special.
You can't riot from a Rascal, so keep em fat and dumb. My question is who and how was someone fucking the 600 lb beast?
Her thin ex-husband, who continued to knock her up after they divorced. She might not of topped out at 600 lbs. (everyone guessed she was in the 400-500 range), she just broke the chairs "rated" to 600 lbs. She didn't mind sitting on the barrel chair, it worked rather well for her.
You may have hit upon the crux of the problem. If I had to sit on a " barrel chair" at work I would be truly mortified. That would be a defining moment and would focus getting back into shape because I care about myself and family. I guess that sort of thing just doesn't faze people today. It amazing to see people get their limbs amputated from diabetes and they keep coming back through the ER with 500+ glucoses. I guess having one hand for the remote is all that matters. Truly sad.
Miffed:-)
The cheapest food generally has the highet fat and/or sugar (or their wonderful lab conceived counterparts), and the least amount of nutrition for the calories. You don't see a lot of people on food stamps in the organic aisle for a reason. And the shitier food tastes good, so there's that.
Ok...because no one else will broach the subject...I will ;-)
Why is it that we (collectively) are constantly bombarded with the "we can't allow people to starve" rhetoric...but the ones who pay for the food (meaning us) have no say in what they consume?
It's a good point. It would be ironic if they put a program through to get them high quality organic food and taxed me to the point where I was eating hot pockets 3 meals a day to pay for it.
Hot pocket directions:
Remove wrapper.
Microwave for 2 minutes.
Throw against back of toilet.
pods
+ 1 God I love Zero Hedge
God I love Zero Hedge
Me too
4 McRib's and a 40 ozbe sure to catch the burp @ 8:00 - jfc
That made me laugh so hard, I popped out my hernia! It's like watching the GOVT spend money....
Holy shit.
His eyes, they're so puffy and surrounded by fat. It's astonishing.
Living like yer dyin' FTW!
i cunt get past 2:15 and i'm still tearing up laughing....you guy's are the best!
That's 8:15 of my life shot down the tubes only to see how screwed up we are.
Good God, I've got that "Proud to be an Amerikkan" song stuck in my head now.
Thats too much work and wastes energy
just flush a five down the toilet...
saves toilet paper and reduces wear and tear on the old sphincter.
reduces inflation too, both kinds.
Finally, it increases the velocity of the BM Money supply...
That was pretty funny and sad at the same time because it would be true. So let''s keep that little idea to ourselves.
I think thats what the plan was...but the thing with all central planning is...lol.
I think it is simply ignorance and crony capitalism at its best.
1.Launch Obama Care and get everyone paying into the system.
2. No increased cost to sick, broken down, smokers or other risky behavior. Everybody pays the same amount
and all entitled to as much resources to be kept alive.
3. Insurance companies get millions more clients and profits.
4. Drug companies get more people getting meds that previously couldn't afford any for increased profits.
5. Factory food companies profiting as more people succumb to eating larger portions of unhealthy food.
6. Medical facilities and medical device manufacturers find an increasing need to satisfy.
Sounds like a good jobs program to me with the top tier execs. getting more percs. Who cares? It is just stupid poor
or uneducated people suffering major illnesses that keep all the above groups humming.
On top of all that we get a bigger bureaucracy to oversee the whole thing. All this at a time when we need to have
more people employed.
It is our Government and Industry doing God's work, kinda like Corzine, Dimon, Bernanke, The POTUS etc.
7. Crisis event happens, and most cannot make it out, or starve instead of eating greens. Burn dead fat people for whale oil.
it really helps to think corporate feedlot model. . . peeps standing around ankle deep in their shit, fed corporate fud all their lives, never really leave the fenced reality, pharma tags on their ears, shot up with drugs, then in the last few weeks - KORNtm, and if the KORN's too pricey or didn't make the drought cut - stale candy!! anything to get that GMO'd precursor to HFCS fattening. . .
peeps are just there for subsidy & profit all round - they don't have real lives, right?
Ohhhh shit nmewn.... Have you been drinking, looking for a fight? ;->
Per usual ;-)
There's a really simple answer for this.
The foodstamps program is PRIMARILY intended to support the American food-production industry, and the highest-profit items are the ones that contain the least nutrition and are the most likely to cause obesity.
If SNAP was really about helping individuals who *literally* cannot afford to eat properly, it'd be FAR cheaper to deliver wholesome food to people. But that sort of thing went out in the '70s. Try to do it again today and grocery chains and Kraft will quickly point out how harmful to their business it is.
(On an unrelated note, the freedom to eat whatever you want is something only a big-statist would want government to take away from "the people." You sometimes act like you understand this, but hey, you're a flaming hypocrite.)
Raw foods (stuff you actually have to cook) is about five times more expensive than the prepackaged shit you can buy in the freezer section. The advent of the microwave has done more harm than good when it comes to healthy eating.......
(On an unrelated note, the freedom to eat whatever you want is something only a big-statist would want government to take away from "the people." You sometimes act like you understand this, but hey, you're a flaming hypocrite.)
Actually no...asshole.
A statist says, I will take from nmewn and give to you. I will allow you the freedom to eat whatever you decide to eat (just like him) with the money he has earned by the sweat of his brow. However, you do not have to sweat.
Just vote for me.
THAT is what a statist says douchebag...have a big gulp...on me ;-)
The freedom to eat what you want needs to be accompanied with a health insurance policy tied to that individuals health.
To my way of thinking, the freedom to eat or drink what you want should be tied to ones ability to pay for it (firstly) and the ability to pay for those decisions/indiscretions (secondly).
I am not my brothers keeper. He is his own man.
I don't tell him how to live his life, just as he does not tell me. I would say the same thing to the idiot who got drunk and crashed his car and then came to me whining to compensate him for his loss & stupidity.
Its not my problem...he made a choice...thats freedom and it has a price, whether we choose to acknowledge it or not.
The easiest solution to food stamps (EBT) is making ten basic items free for everyone. Government rice, beans, oatmeal, cooking oil, etc... Anyone can go get a box containing one weeks supply of basic food (that you have to prepare). No income limits, no value to anyone (can't sell for booze/drugs), can only be used to eat and keep a person alive. That solution has been around for decades, but no politician would ever propose or adopt it.
There are a couple issues that come up when you start thinking about implementing this, but this is generally the right idea.
Sourcing and moving the products should be handled as locally as possible, or you end up with the same "large scale" corruption from a company like Kraft that you'd encounter with any other multi-billion dollar government contract. Local administration requires a brueaucracy, but distributing the authority ensures the inevitable rip-offs are relatively small.
A major problem is that many constituents would oppose the idea of government being directly involved in ANYTHING like "feeding people" because it threatens a current source of revenue. This would be the big food companies (Quaker, Wesson, etc) and the grocery chains.
None of this is insurmountable, but it's worth mentioning because EVEN when the solution to a given problem is "simple," it's helpful to understand what obstacles are going to exist to implementing it. (Personally, I'm of the opinion that the entire chain should be handled by what amount to employee-owned non-profits, because I'd rather be done with government in the first place.)
A democratic government is usually forced to do absolutely everything it can do except the right thing.
Obama/Romney Cairo is the Federal Reserve of healthcare. Obey.
History proves that if you don't feed the poor (whether they are poor by choice or because they can't help it), they will take by force eventually. So-called "statists" of my variety believe that an organized system of elected government that includes a social safety net is superior to a system that would rely on the kindness of strangers such as yourself. You are an idealist (ideologue). I am a pragmatist.
History also proves that it is often, if not usually, the economic distortions, market interventions, and attempted central planning of statists such as yourself that result in the poor not being able to feed themselves in the first place.
Platitudes. Name the society on earth that had a pure free market and fed/clothed/gave health care to its poor. Ever. In all of human history.
You ideologues simultaneously observe (correctly) that most people are sheep who don't pay attention and want daddy government to help them, but then you expect those same people to exist in your utopion libertarian society and make do. Think about it.
Idiotic strawman argument. Nobody said anything about "pure" anything.
The fact is that there has been a radically wide spread or spectrum of relative freedom within societies, and those on the most free end of the spectrum, particularly post-Industrial Revolution, have consistently suffered less hunger, starvation and famine than those on the least free end of the scale. Why did the USSR have a consistent problem feeding its own people rather than the USA, despite 20th century USA being a "mixed economy" and not "pure" free market? Oh yeah, those unlucky 70+ straight years of Russian "bad weather".
You really are a terrible debater, not to mention a dishonest and malicious sack of shit.
Strawman .. like suggesting that I advocate the Soviet system. Next.
Classic strawman, as I never said nor suggested any such thing.
Tell me, are you TRULY this stupid, or are you just playing some elaborate game with us here?
Either way, you are simple a fool.
"History proves that if you don't feed the poor (whether they are poor by choice or because they can't help it), they will take by force eventually."
You permit thievery...I do not.
I'm not scared by those who are poor who have done nothing to deserve their circumstance. I was poor, unlike you (possibly) I know they (like me) don't want to remain poor forever.
Poor by choice is another matter entirely isn't it?
And what openings does "the poor by choice" give to statists? This is where people like me are at. What gives plantation owners the right (and how can anyone not see it) to keep people poor by offering "goodies" for a vote?
"You permit thievery...I do not."
Thievery exists whether I or you permit it or not. That simple concept escapes you.
The crucial point, however, is that you condone and actually advocate the institutionalization of coercion and thievery as an organizing basis for society (i.e., statism) --- mnewn and myself do not.
"The crucial point, however, is that you condone and actually advocate the institutionalization of coercion as an organizing basis for society (i.e., statism)"
Its like talking to a brainwashed AnAnus wall of Chi-Com bullshit sometimes.
They will never debate this salient point...because it cuts to the very heart of their reality.
I debate reality. You debate the desirability of unicorn world.
No, you do not, LetThemEatShit.
You can only debate strawman arguments of your own creation. You are a lying, dishonest, disingenuous person, who consistently attempts to use sophistry, misdirection, red herrings and assorted other fallacious means to avoid confronting issues on which you are flat-out wrong, and on which you have been discredited time after time in this forum, only to come back again and again like herpes warts or statist oppression.
Wow. After that brilliant retort, I see how wrong I've been.
I love watching statists desperately try to avoid crashing face-first into the walls of their ugly mental paradigms when confronted with that single statement.
I love watching libertarians fall upon their own sword of unicornism.
You defend and advocate thievery and the institutionalization of coercion as an organizing basis of society.
I can level no worse insult, nor condemnation, at you than that.
At least you admit your shortcomings. Bravo for that.
When are you going to flat-out admit that you defend and advocate the institutionalization of coercion as a fundamental organizing basis of society?
When are you going to admit that you are a simple-minded pleab who can't argue himself out of a cardboard box unless Ayn showed the way first?
"Thievery exists whether I or you permit it or not."
You don't stop a thief when you see one? What do you do...call a cop?...lol.
Fuckin pussy.
And now with the name calling. If you can't answer my point, just say so. It would make you less of a pussy.
It's not thieving when the government does it.
/s
Poor and obese doesn't compute. Degenerate and obese is more like it. Is that worth defending though? Obesity and "Here comes Honey Boo Boo" is America's 21st century footprint. The country is in the crapper. Stick a fork in it, 'Mericans are truly DONE like DINNER. Just hope that the Chinese won't turn into cannibals.
Actually, no, hypocrite.
Desiring state power to regulate dietary choice is IN ITSELF a demand for massive government intervention that isn't desirable REGARDLESS of the source of the individual's food.
This is the realization that's so important: ANYTHING done to give government power/control over SOME selected group's autonomy will eventually be applied to OTHER groups.
You might think you can prevent it--the proper set of rules will eliminate the corruption and intellectual laziness that results in bad law being applied with no judgement. But that never seems to WORK. Remember: the Constitution is what got us HERE.
The state already intervenes in our dietary choices through the corn subsidy, end that and then let's see what happens when .gov butts out for a minute, maybe that would work on its own.
Sure, but the real point is that any given individual "fix" is a waste of time. What needs to really change before any specific problem is addressed is people's attitude about the ROLE government should be playing in our lives.
Anyone who makes a case for why government needs to intercede here or there needs to understand the implications of that intercession being applied in completely unrelated areas later.
indeed, JPM makes fiat-points off every SNAP card, and it is used to keep "supermarkets" and other mainstream corporate fud-providers in business, aka propping up the dying.
as someone who volunteers at local food pantry distributors of stuff the supermarkets can't offload at the checkout, it's very interesting to see just what isn't selling any more, despite discounting. also noticing a comeback of that ole 70's standby of "Basics" label, just a facelift ("Simply") and a colour change from blue print to green.
it's more appealing to glean field/orchard foods & re-distribute - believe it or not, there's never enough of these foods for the demand, whereas the corporate crap often ends up tossed. . .
Cathartes Aura said:
If providing people with food was the only thing SNAP accomplished, it would be promptly defunded with overwhelming bipartisan support.
In US 'american" citizenism, corporate corruption is all a part of the US 'american" middle class.
In US 'american" citizenism, the middle class is the king class.
In US 'american" citizenism, voting is a middle class thing.
In US 'american" citizenism, consumption of world is designed to feed US 'american' middle class.
US 'american" citizenism is all about farming the poor and extorting the weak.
In US 'american" citizenism, monolizing of the speaching means is just part of US 'american' blobbing-up.
US 'american' middle class citizens are unable to self-indict.
Now wait, where was I?
akak said:
I believe you were at:
'Americanism' is a ghost built on a bubble of nothing. Blobbing up can not be surrendered.
Bloomy's got your back...
Because unfortunately, we'd also have to go over and cook it for them, since most people don't have a clue how to make decent meals for themselves.
Maybe if somebody came up with a healthy, nutritionally balanced product that tasted good, could be microwaved in minutes and came in an appealing yellow box with the name 'Food' on the front, we could actually start seeing the pounds melt away all across the chubby face of America.
Something comparable already exists. Zappa used to refer to it as "confinement loaf."
They serve it to the prison inhabitants who won't behave when you give them stuff like trays and flatware.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nutraloaf
LetThemEatRand
Organic is one of the greatest scams ever foisted on the hipsters, right up there with global warminng.
Watch Penn and Tellers organic episode of Bullshit.
Then read this
Nutritional value and tasteAccording to the UK's Food Standards Agency, "Consumers may choose to buy organic fruit, vegetables and meat because they believe them to be more nutritious than other food. However, the balance of current scientific evidence does not support this view."[49] A 12-month systematic review commissioned by the FSA in 2009 and conducted at the London School of Hygiene & Tropical Medicine based on 50 years' worth of collected evidence concluded that "there is no good evidence that consumption of organic food is beneficial to health in relation to nutrient content."[50] Other studies have found no proof that organic food offers greater nutritional values, more consumer safety or any distinguishable difference in taste.[3][8][51][52] A review of nutrition claims showed that organic food proponents are unreliable information sources which harm consumers, and that consumers are wasting their money if they buy organic food believing that it contains better nutrients.[53] Minor differences in ascorbic acid, protein concentration and several micronutrients have been identified between organic and conventional foods, but it doesn't appear that these have any impact on human health.[54][55]
A literature review published by the University of Bologna and the Research Institute of Organic Agriculture in Switzerland in 2009 concluded that in the scientific literature examined “there is broad agreement on two points: there is no proof that organic food is more nutritious or safer, and most studies that have compared the taste and organoleptic quality of organic and conventional foods report no consistent or significant differences between organic and conventional produce. Therefore, claiming that all organic food tastes different from all conventional food would not be correct. However, among the well-designed studies with respect to fruits and vegetables that have found differences, the vast majority favour organic produce.”[44]
As with vegetable produce, there is evidence that some organic fruit is drier than conventionally grown fruit.[5] Unless this factor is taken into account a higher content of a nutrient might be explained by a higher dry-matter (lower moisture) content. A slightly drier fruit may also have a more intense flavor due to the higher concentration of nutrients, and as a result may be preferred by the consumer. There is evidence that some organically grown fruits has a higher resistance to deterioration and better keeping quality, attributed to a lower moisture content.[5]
Although it is commonly claimed that organically grown food tastes better than conventionally grown food, reviews of the literature that looked at the sensory qualities of the two have not found convincing evidence that there are any significant differences.[4][3]
Psychological effects such as the “halo” effect which are related to the choice and consumption of organic food and which may be akin to religious experiences in some people are in addition important motivating factors in the purchase of organic food.[5] An example of the halo effect was demonstrated by Schuldt and Schwarz.[56] Their results showed that university students inferred that organic cookies were lower in calories and could be eaten more often than conventional cookies. This effect was observed even when the nutrition label conveyed an identical calorie content. The effect was more pronounced among participants who were strong supporters of organic production and had strong feelings about environmental issues. The perception that organic food is low-calorie food or health food appears to be quite common.[5]
It's about not eating all the GMO crap, nimrod, nor the insecticides.
Nimrod is a corporatist. That's all you need to know about him.
Food tends to have higher nutrient levels and the most flavor when it is picked ripe off the plant.
This usually means local grown, even if non organic food, will have a hgher nutrient density and better flavor than an organic item picked a week before ripeness.
Farmer's markets FTW.
pods
that's why it's time to go beyond organic
http://remineralize.org/
very interesting! diggin' into it now, thanks. . .
The waters will re-cover the earth in larger and larger swathes in increasingly short order.
Food growing has to go soil-less, above ground for a while.
Aqua-ponics seems the best answer for the moment on all accounts.
ori
ori, aquaponics is a great solution, but not the only solution. it would be wise to explore a diversity of approaches, including helping to restore the mineral balance in soils, rather than waiting for nature to do its thing.
http://www.carbon-negative.us/soil/DJansen.htm
although this will be energy intensive to accomplish on a large scale (through dredging & transporting sea minerals inland), the good news is that the process works best when it is done homeopathically, e.g. a little goes a long way.
on a garden scale, been experimenting with crushing & composting fish & lobster waste from my local japanese restaurant in order to make most efficient use of what's already around me.
sea salts are also great to include in the mix, especially if you can figure out how to desalinate them (think ORMES wet method).
Building a greenhouse here on the compound right now. We're doing Mel's Mix with a supplement of glacial rock dust, which just happens to occur around here in abundance if you just filter out the big rocks.
nice Dr.! consider yourself very fortunate to have such a "gold" mine all around you. tip : take those rocks that you filter out (smaller than fist size) and keep running them through a compost pile, so that the microcritters will slowly start breaking them down and adding them into the compost. you'll know it's working when you see little shiny specks in the finished compost. also, you can throw them into 5 gallon buckets (or 55 gallon if you have enough rocks) and run your irrigation through the buckets (like a valve) which will help to mineralize the water, especially if you're collecting rainwater which is, what Viktor Schauberger called, immature.
You don't have to go to the organic section to eat healthy or at least healthier. Instead of making a meal, people just stuff their face with high-calorie snack foods and crap. I've been in line behind plenty of EBT recipients with a cart full of soda pop, chips, packaged snake cakes, pre-packed foods, mac and cheese, etc. That shit ain't cheaper than buying a whole chicken and cutting it up, or a sack of potatoes. And you can buy a whole cart full of fresh veggies for relatively cheap still.
Anybody who will spend a little time preparing a meal from scratch can cut out a lot of salt, fat and excess carbs. It's just laziness plain and simple.
I've been behind the same shopping cart, but it was purchased by check. Lousy food habits are not the exclusive domain of the poor or even the stupid.
Some of my best friends will eat anything, as long as it hasn't been on the floor for more than 5 seconds.
Have you been to a farmers market lateky? Food stamps are used in large amounts. Not all food stamp users are obese.
+ truth!
and of course, not all "obese" are poor - check'd CONgress lately?
Dollar menu.
They take the EBT at McDonalds and the farmer's markets are paid to sell to them on the EBT
Fast Food Chains Getting Into the Food Stamp Act
Food stamps - known more formally as the USDA’s Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program - have been in use for grocery staples, such as bread and milk, since 1934, but now, for the first time, they can be used for fast food in four states across the country.
Seems to cost a lot more in cash and time to eat a decent diet. There are a lot of folks on stamps that just don't have skills, facility or time to eat right. I don't cook much, but I can afford to get pretty decent frozen stuff. I am also lucky that I accidentally developed the, only eat if you are really hungry habit. I have to remind myself to eat. A lot of folks are now brainwashed from birth that eating is fun, entertainment, exciting. Which it is, when it is done right and occasionally. Daily fuel is drudgery, but that's how it should be. Not neverending happy meals to the early grave.
Most people eat due to feeling "hungry", which is nothing more than your body starting to process all the waste from the last shitty meal.
It should be more proper to call it food addiction, as your body goes through negative physiological changes due to the behavior (eating shit) stopping.
pods
It's amazing how fast your body can reverse the process if you just have some discipline and willpower. I am about 5'9 and in January I weighed 192lbs. I woke up one day and just stopped eating bread. Pasta, bagels etc. gone. I bought a juicer and a shitload of vegetables and kept meals to fish and chicken. Small portions. I lost 25lbs in 2 months. I still go out and have a bunch of beers and wings with friends every so often and I feel like total shit the next day. Complete reversal.
Same here!!!!!! No bread, pasta, rice, starch, sugar. Bleah! Lost 10 lbs in a month.
Big bowl of mixed veggies for lunch; don't even feel hungry for dinner.
The dark side is that I can't hold my liquor anymore. I know it's because of all the awesome fat food that was absorbing it.