Marc Faber & Jim Rogers On Our "Clueless, Ignorant, Dangerous" Leaders

Tyler Durden's picture




 

While the discussions between these two legends varied from Phat Phong nightlife to Dow 30,000, and from China bullishness to AAPL bearishness, it was the conversation about the actions of Bernanke, and more importantly our political leaders that summed up perfectly the dreadful reality in which we find ourselves. The punchline: "It is very dangerous to have ignorant people believing that they know something."


Rogers is bullish China long-term but buying Chinese stocks only selectively...

Faber sees under-the-surface weakness in US equities and while central banks could print us to Dow 30,000; gold and other commodities will be astronomical by then...

Faber is bearish AAPL, believes its a bubble - but too dangerous to short...

Both are uber-bearish central-bankers and politicians...

Marc Faber: "Both candidates are clueless and completely artificial..."

 

Jimmy Rogers: "It's worse than clueless, because they think they know what they're doing.. and so they are dangerous! If they were just clueless and looked out the window, we wouldn't have a problem, but they think they have the solution - but their solutions are what's making the situation worse..."

 

Marc Faber: "That is precisely the point. It is very dangerous to have ignorant people believing that they know something!"

Summed up perfectly, we believe.

 

Must watch - especially to hear the CNBC anchor squirming...

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Thu, 10/04/2012 - 18:15 | 2857553 lolmao500
lolmao500's picture

"It is very dangerous to have ignorant people believing that they know everything."

Fixed that for ya.

Thu, 10/04/2012 - 18:18 | 2857562 no taste
no taste's picture

How stupid are people who put Obama 2012 bumper stickers on their cars.  Why not go with the 2008 hopey, changey guy?

http://howstupidare.blogspot.com/2012/10/how-stupid-are-obama-2012-bumper.html

Thu, 10/04/2012 - 18:24 | 2857586 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

"It is very dangerous to have ignorant people believing that they know something."

Good statement to apply to most of the human race. Beginning with religion then science...

But the more dangerous people are those who know better but take advantage of people's ignorance - hello Obama & Romney. 

Thu, 10/04/2012 - 18:30 | 2857602 Mark Carney
Mark Carney's picture

LOL could not stop lauging listening to these two awesomeness destroy all presidential credibility and seeing these libtards in the background sweating, ADD'ing and pissing their pants...too good.

Thu, 10/04/2012 - 18:34 | 2857615 The Alarmist
The Alarmist's picture

I guess I could laugh too, if I had a couple billion or so and was comfortably ensconced in parts of the world that might muddle through best becuase they had not bought into the fantasy that more debt is a cure for too much debt.

Thu, 10/04/2012 - 19:13 | 2857748 Thomas
Thomas's picture

I love their faint praise.

Thu, 10/04/2012 - 20:11 | 2857889 economics9698
Thu, 10/04/2012 - 21:26 | 2858034 markmotive
markmotive's picture

Vs? I'm willing to bet that Marc and Jim agree on most points. Both have an Austrian point of view.

Marc Faber: The Great Depression all over again

http://www.planbeconomics.com/2012/04/22/marc-faber-the-great-depression...

Thu, 10/04/2012 - 21:28 | 2858041 Manthong
Manthong's picture

“It is dangerous to be right in matters where established men are wrong.”
-Voltaire

http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Voltaire

Thu, 10/04/2012 - 21:51 | 2858086 Bobbyrib
Bobbyrib's picture

I learned that at a young age. The Sheeple give criminals power, and the people smart enough to see through the BS suffer.

Thu, 10/04/2012 - 21:53 | 2858090 redpill
redpill's picture

I'd love to buy these two a few good bottles of wine and turn into a sponge for a couple hours while they chat.  I'd even pay for it in nickels if Kyle Bass would show up.

Thu, 10/04/2012 - 22:04 | 2858116 ratso
ratso's picture

Right - Jim Rogers and Marc Farber - you can't get more clueless than that.  

Thu, 10/04/2012 - 22:41 | 2858180 jwoop66
jwoop66's picture

Gotta agree. Yeah sure, smart guys no doubt, but I wouldn't give them any more credit than the candidates.   Ok , both are smarter than Obama, but Faber made one good call and he's been sayin' what everyone else has been saying since- (fiat crash etc.  - same as most zero hedge posts) and Rogers?   Good call on China two years ago.  Last I heard they're crashin harder than anyone else;   If they were ever on top at all!     Keep that china bull runnin' Jim.  Remember, the bigger they are, the harder they fall!  Ahem... jim...

Thu, 10/04/2012 - 23:05 | 2858228 AldousHuxley
AldousHuxley's picture

Marc Faber "I go to lower class discos"

 

 

Thu, 10/04/2012 - 23:10 | 2858234 AldousHuxley
AldousHuxley's picture

Marc Faber "The only one that had any clue...at the convention....was Client Eastwood. He is the only one who has an idea about the real world."

Thu, 10/04/2012 - 23:11 | 2858236 AldousHuxley
AldousHuxley's picture

Marc Faber "It is very dangerous to have ignorant people believing that they know something"

Thu, 10/04/2012 - 23:15 | 2858247 AldousHuxley
AldousHuxley's picture

It doesn't really matter whether you are ignorant, clueless, or dangerous to society....when you have the power.

 

What AMerica needs is division of power structures.

More population, more concentration of power at the top....this has to be offset otherwise you will have Yankees buying the best talent just to sit out the game and not play for other teams which eventually turns into a circus rather than competitive sport of baseball.

 

Wall st. has turned markets into a gambling hall  for the rich.

Fri, 10/05/2012 - 00:19 | 2858348 Catalonian Capi...
Catalonian Capitalist's picture

The people who make wars, the people who reduce their fellows to slavery, the people who kill and torture and tell lies in the name of their sacred causes, the really evil people in a word—these are never the publicans and the sinners. No, they're the virtuous, respectable men, who have the finest feelings, the best brains, the noblest ideals. -Aldous Huxley

Fri, 10/05/2012 - 06:58 | 2858654 MassDecep
MassDecep's picture

Reality = TPTB are absolutely NOT Clueless! These psychopaths know exactly what they are doing, and being in line with their psychopathic traits, are hell bent for the destruction of everyone's life, liberty and the pursuit of an IPAD.

Buy silver, gold, food, ammo, solar cells.    

Fri, 10/05/2012 - 00:07 | 2858340 trembo slice
trembo slice's picture

that'd be awesome, but I'm hoping they appreciate some good whiskey.

Fri, 10/05/2012 - 00:18 | 2858346 vamoose1
vamoose1's picture

kyle  would   keep  them   for  copper   content   coasters and   suggest   using  your  card   but    in  the  meantime  im   going   clubbing   with   marc   the   dirtier  the   better   and   he  knows  this   field   ....   that  was   a   little   bit  of  history....    neither  of   them  could  be   elected   dogcatcher   which,    come  to  think  of  it  is   kinda  the  point

Thu, 10/04/2012 - 21:55 | 2858095 SamuelMaverick
SamuelMaverick's picture

That is soooo true bobbyrib.. Well said

Fri, 10/05/2012 - 00:20 | 2858339 GoinFawr
GoinFawr's picture

No it isn't.

It should be: unscrupulous wealthy criminals bamboozle power from the sheeple, and those smart enough to see through it but retaining their decency become sheepdogs while the rest of the callous sociopaths sit back to enjoy the show as they jeer at the sheepdogs and pathetically dream of becoming wealthy unscrupulous criminals who can bamboozle power from the sheeple like the empty bags of wasted skin they idolize and are.

Fri, 10/05/2012 - 02:52 | 2858494 natty light
natty light's picture

Waiting for your avatar to blink...

Fri, 10/05/2012 - 08:05 | 2858724 Bobbyrib
Bobbyrib's picture

I never said it was fair for people smart enough to see through the BS to suffer, that is just the way the world works. The average sheep just wants to get through life and have a good work/life balance. If everyone wanted to be part of the elite we would have tons more political science majors and lawyers. People flocked to jobs on Wall St, because they paid more and the productive side of the economy died.

Thu, 10/04/2012 - 22:18 | 2858145 Cabreado
Cabreado's picture

That would implicate the "smart enough," would it not?

And I agree.

But then you must morph the argument towards the fundamental flaw -- the one where everyone watches out for his own ass.

The one where nobody's minding the store.

There are times when "oops" becomes a bit more profound.
We self-absorbed creatures just hit another one...

Fri, 10/05/2012 - 00:34 | 2858362 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

The mental abilities that drive the criminals in power - alpha-males - to rule over the masses are evolutionary adaptations that promote their survival.

Earlier humans, in a tribe of 100-150, derived a benefit from the coattail effect of the superior physical, or sometimes mental, abilities of the alpha-male. Like when a skilled warrior would lead lesser males in battle to steal women and other resources.

The problem we have today is that the alpha-males are hardly needed for survival or reproductive success of the people. In fact, they are now an outright detriment to the vast majority. Plainly, they are no longer needed.

Unfortunately, the masses are still wired to obey their leaders, even when it may cause them great harm. There is also a decided lack of time to evolve a different, less subservient, attitude towards our failed, useless leaders.

 

"An organism is a collection of problem solving devices - adaptations - that were shaped by natural selection over evolutionary time to promote, in some specific way, the survival of the genes that directed their construction."  Symons 2005

 

Fri, 10/05/2012 - 11:02 | 2859716 Thisson
Thisson's picture

I think you're overlooking the fact that they are still quite successful at stealing resources. 

Fri, 10/05/2012 - 12:59 | 2860096 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

Not at all.

They are successful at stealing resources because the majority of people still have brains wired to exist in an alpha-male social hierarchy and are incapable of thinking outside the box. Man's ability to change nature has outstripped nature's ability to change man.

Most people are as capable of divesting themselves of the alpha-male social hierarchy of government as ants are of divesting themselves of the ant colony.

Thu, 10/04/2012 - 21:44 | 2858071 TWSceptic
TWSceptic's picture

I assume regarding their specific investments, as was discussed in the video.

Fri, 10/05/2012 - 01:10 | 2858411 SafelyGraze
SafelyGraze's picture

you can't eat infinity

Fri, 10/05/2012 - 01:31 | 2858431 putaipan
putaipan's picture

yes you can. but you get the hella man-o-nash shits when your done.

 

i'd really rather hear sam keen/dr.hudson/and prosicutorblack discuss how we get the fuck outta here.

Fri, 10/05/2012 - 02:55 | 2858497 natty light
natty light's picture

Madness money theory

Thu, 10/04/2012 - 18:46 | 2857653 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

I think you mean their handlers. Candidates are vetted to insure ignorance (as well as protected from reality), because without ignorance there is no avenue for plausible deniability, but instead would be held responsible for the damage they do.

Thu, 10/04/2012 - 22:27 | 2858165 upWising
upWising's picture

The Times They Are a-Changin'   (Bob Dylan)

Come gather 'round people
Wherever you roam
And admit that the waters
Around you have grown
And accept it that soon
You'll be drenched to the bone
If your time to you
Is worth savin'
Then you better start swimmin'
Or you'll sink like a stone
For the times they are a-changin'.

Come writers and critics
Who prophesize with your pen
And keep your eyes wide
The chance won't come again
And don't speak too soon
For the wheel's still in spin
And there's no tellin' who
That it's namin'
For the loser now
Will be later to win
For the times they are a-changin'.

Come senators, congressmen
Please heed the call
Don't stand in the doorway
Don't block up the hall
For he that gets hurt
Will be he who has stalled
There's a battle outside
And it is ragin'
It'll soon shake your windows
And rattle your walls
For the times they are a-changin'.

Come mothers and fathers
Throughout the land
And don't criticize
What you can't understand
Your sons and your daughters
Are beyond your command
Your old road is
Rapidly agin'
Please get out of the new one
If you can't lend your hand
For the times they are a-changin'.

The line it is drawn
The curse it is cast
The slow one now
Will later be fast
As the present now
Will later be past
The order is
Rapidly fadin'
And the first one now
Will later be last
For the times they are a-changin'.

Thu, 10/04/2012 - 19:03 | 2857704 123dobryden
123dobryden's picture

Can you imagine any of them two on a journey to throw The ring to Mount rocky Doom ?

Thu, 10/04/2012 - 18:38 | 2857630 vast-dom
vast-dom's picture

Jim is correct about Real Estate if the QE pump levitates DOW to 20k. The RE stock under 1M would tank, even with investors increasing their purchases of bargains...

Thu, 10/04/2012 - 18:48 | 2857662 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

RE is dead regardless. The entire banking model of lending for profit is being replaced by politcal lending by various gov. agencies.

 

Thu, 10/04/2012 - 19:11 | 2857740 silverserfer
silverserfer's picture

every americam should be able to get 1 loan from the govt. at 0% interest. Not from a bank. Not from the Fed, from the government.

Thu, 10/04/2012 - 19:30 | 2857802 Whiner
Whiner's picture

Tally-HO, my good man! But I am sorry. That citizen's loan money already got spent on JPM's dividend and Jamie's bonus. Oh, plus recap funds and play money.

Fri, 10/05/2012 - 00:22 | 2858352 Better_late_tha...
Better_late_than_never's picture

And where exactly is the government going to get this money to loan you?

Fri, 10/05/2012 - 01:31 | 2858430 brettd
brettd's picture

One loan in a lifetime?

Or one per car/house/degree/addition?

If you don't pay back the loan, can the "govt" foreclose?

 

Thu, 10/04/2012 - 19:05 | 2857712 dexter bland
dexter bland's picture

How about "a little knowledge is a dangerous thing"?

In any case they are no where near as dangerous as the Fed whose power to redistribute wealth is unrestrained by having to answer to congress, the President, or the electorate.

 

 

Thu, 10/04/2012 - 19:57 | 2857858 DosZap
DosZap's picture

How about "a little knowledge is a dangerous thing"?

In any case they are no where near as dangerous as the Fed whose power to redistribute wealth is unrestrained by having to answer to congress, the President, or the electorate.

 

 

This could be easily remedied,if Congress had a lot more real people, and decided to take over the role of the Fed.

Just get a POTUS to sign off on it, and the Senate, and House to go along.

Viola', the Feds Dead.

Repeal the Act of 1913...............put the power back in the hands of the people whose job it was to BE all along.

A private cartel of corporate  bankers, should not control ANY soverigns money supply.

At least, I can see some brawls on passing Bennu Bux to anyone in the world that needs a bail out.

 

Excuse me, I just landed in Denver, and the 5000' alt change has me thinking I know something............LOL

Thu, 10/04/2012 - 22:00 | 2858101 elementary
elementary's picture

Both candidates are two heads of the same beast. I don't think of them as ignorant as opposed to who is the better actor. The goal is and has been for hundreds of years: world domination, a powerful, royal elite, billions enslaved and sacrifieced at will. Congress is no longer valid, only ceremonial - somewhat of a testing ground for those who will serve the cabal on this side of the world order. You don't get that far along in politics without relinquishing your soul for the cause.

Fri, 10/05/2012 - 00:49 | 2858390 tickhound
tickhound's picture

You don't get that far along in politics without relinquishing your soul for the cause.

I hear you, and I agree with you... But its the whole "cause" thing that we should be stumbling on. 

Where I sit, and what I see... We're all chasing the same skim.  These 'candidates' happen to be in a position to preserve it.

Thu, 10/04/2012 - 23:31 | 2857985 Alexandre Stavisky
Alexandre Stavisky's picture

Having just learned the board and movement of few pieces, one knows his own ignorance.  Strength and wisdom are knowing the absolute Grand Chess master and architect...and shadowing his moves and listening to the commands.  None has perfect foresight.  Wars, acts of God, arbitrary (seemingly) occurrences make masters slaves and vice versa.

Your riches taught me poverty,
 Myself a millionaire
 In little wealths, as youths do boast,
 Till, broad as Buenos Ayre,
 You drifted your dominions
 A different Peru,
 And I esteemed all poverty
 For life's estate, with you.

 Of mines, I little know, myself, But just the names of gems,
 The colors of the commonest,
 And scarce of diadems
 So much that, did I meet the queen
 Her glory I should know;
 But this must be a different wealth,
 To miss it, beggars so.

 I'm sure 't is India, all day,
 To those who look on you
 Without a stint, without a blame,
 Might I but be the Jew!
 I'm sure it is Golconda
 Beyond my power to deem,
 To have a smile for mine, each day,
 How better than a gem!

 At least, it solaces to know
 That there exists a gold
 Although I prove it just in time
 Its distance to behold;
 Its far, far treasure to surmise
 And estimate the pearl
 That slipped my simple fingers through
 While just a lad at school!


Numbing Bangkok frivolity,
rotting lepers in the road,
unseeing dancers without quality,
buying--selling souls for gold.

Wealth to convey pinched minds and grubby bodies over four score years.
Is that all there is?

We play at paste
 Till qualified for pearl;
 Then drop the paste
 And deem ourselves the fool.

 The shapes, though, were similar
 And our new hands
 Learned gem-tactics,
 Practicing sands.


I prefer happy fool to wise and compromised gentlemen of the darkest cloth.
Fri, 10/05/2012 - 00:00 | 2858334 AlphaWolfe
AlphaWolfe's picture

I <3 ZH --- Because of the like minded peps

Thu, 10/04/2012 - 23:26 | 2858268 All Risk No Reward
All Risk No Reward's picture

I have to disagree.

Faber and Rogers are running interference for a criminal who is systematically robbing society's wealth and transferring it to the the private interests that employ him.

He's not dumb, he's doing an incredibly good job of ripping off society for trillions.

Me thinks Faber and Rogers need to read a little Art of War.

“Pretend inferiority and encourage his arrogance.“
~Sun Tzu

No, if Bernanke was stupid, his bosses wouldn't be getting record bonuses of 1% of GDP even after criminally blowing the world's largest credit bubble and blowing the top off the economy and saturating society with unpayable debt.

Where is Faber and Rogers when it comes to pointing out the Fed criminally broke Section 2A of the Federal Reserve Act?

0-25 years, that's where.  Now, maybe they don't even know what Section 2A says...  but that would make them ignorant of an incredibly important regulation.

This is financial warfare, Bernanke knows EXACTLY what he's doing - and that bankrupting the republic in order to hand it over to a world government financed and controlled by the people who hired him...  the Money Power, the operators of Debt Money Tyranny...

Debt Money Tyranny money flow chart...

http://www.keepandshare.com/doc/4715145/debtmoneytyranny-5-pdf-57k?tr=77

Wake up America - this is a crime scene!

It's like some guy walks in your home, steals your wallet and Faber and Rogers show up and say the guy stole your wallet because he doesn't know anything.

 

Fri, 10/05/2012 - 11:06 | 2858298 Alexandre Stavisky
Alexandre Stavisky's picture

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