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The CEO Letter Heard Around The World "Vote Obama; Lose Your Job"

Tyler Durden's picture


NewsBusters reports on THE letter from David Siegel, the founder and CEO of real estate company Westgate Resorts on Monday threatened to fire some employees if Barack Obama is reelected and carries out his plan to raise taxes on the so-called rich. The following are highlights from an email message sent by Siegel to his staff that was obtained and verified as authentic by Gawker. "The economy doesn't currently pose a threat to your job. What does threaten your job however, is another 4 years of the same Presidential administration."


Subject: Message from David Siegel
Date:Mon, 08 Oct 2012 13:58:05 -0400 (EDT)
From: [David Siegel]
To: [All employees]

To All My Valued Employees,


As most of you know our company, Westgate Resorts, has continued to succeed in spite of a very dismal economy. There is no question that the economy has changed for the worse and we have not seen any improvement over the past four years. In spite of all of the challenges we have faced, the good news is this: The economy doesn't currently pose a threat to your job. What does threaten your job however, is another 4 years of the same Presidential administration. Of course, as your employer, I can't tell you whom to vote for, and I certainly wouldn't interfere with your right to vote for whomever you choose. In fact, I encourage you to vote for whomever you think will serve your interests the best. [...]


Now, the economy is falling apart and people like me who made all the right decisions and invested in themselves are being forced to bail out all the people who didn't. The people that overspent their paychecks suddenly feel entitled to the same luxuries that I earned and sacrificed 42 years of my life for. Yes, business ownership has its benefits, but the price I've paid is steep and not without wounds. Unfortunately, the costs of running a business have gotten out of control, and let me tell you why: We are being taxed to death and the government thinks we don't pay enough. We pay state taxes, federal taxes, property taxes, sales and use taxes, payroll taxes, workers compensation taxes and unemployment taxes. I even have to hire an entire department to manage all these taxes. The question I have is this: Who is really stimulating the economy? Is it the Government that wants to take money from those who have earned it and give it to those who have not, or is it people like me who built a company out of his garage and directly employs over 7000 people and hosts over 3 million people per year with a great vacation?


Obviously, our present government believes that taking my money is the right economic stimulus for this country. The fact is, if I deducted 50% of your paycheck you'd quit and you wouldn't work here. I mean, why should you? Who wants to get rewarded only 50% of their hard work? Well, that's what happens to me. [...]


Business is at the heart of America and always has been. To restart it, you must stimulate business, not kill it. However, the power brokers in Washington believe redistributing wealth is the essential driver of the American economic engine. Nothing could be further from the truth and this is the type of change they want.


So where am I going with all this? It's quite simple. If any new taxes are levied on me, or my company, as our current President plans, I will have no choice but to reduce the size of this company. Rather than grow this company I will be forced to cut back. This means fewer jobs, less benefits and certainly less opportunity for everyone.


So, when you make your decision to vote, ask yourself, which candidate understands the economics of business ownership and who doesn't? Whose policies will endanger your job? Answer those questions and you should know who might be the one capable of protecting and saving your job. While the media wants to tell you to believe the "1 percenters" are bad, I'm telling you they are not. They create most of the jobs. If you lose your job, it won't be at the hands of the "1%"; it will be at the hands of a political hurricane that swept through this country.


You see, I can no longer support a system that penalizes the productive and gives to the unproductive. My motivation to work and to provide jobs will be destroyed, and with it, so will your opportunities. If that happens, you can find me in the Caribbean sitting on the beach, under a palm tree, retired, and with no employees to worry about.

 Signed, your boss,

 David Siegel

For those unfamiliar with Siegel, he is the founder and CEO of Westgate Resorts, a real estate and timeshare company.

He and his wife were also the subject of the recent documentary "The Queen of Versailles" about their desire to build the largest home in America.

According to Gawker, they were worth over a billion dollars in 2007, but that could be less now as a result of the real estate bust.


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Wed, 10/10/2012 - 10:55 | 2874777 Long-John-Silver
Long-John-Silver's picture
The CEO Letter Heard Around The World "Vote Obama; Lose Your Job" and your country.
Wed, 10/10/2012 - 10:59 | 2874795 Dalago
Wed, 10/10/2012 - 11:15 | 2874874 SilverTree
SilverTree's picture

Have a career based in a bubble industry propped up by the FED >>>>loose thy job.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 11:42 | 2875005 Jack Burton
Jack Burton's picture

No shit SilverTree. This CEO rode a manipulated government supported Bubble Market with plenty on government intervention and support. Now he claims he is being badly used by government.

Well what is it? Either you liked what government support did for your business or you don't. There is little free market in housing it is all tax and Fed and government manipulated.

Yet this CEO talks like he is operating in Ayna Rand's world?

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 11:46 | 2875019 Dalago
Dalago's picture

This David Siegel guy is a Neocon.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 11:51 | 2875047 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

 "Vote Obama; Lose your Job"...

Hmmm ~ so I guess basically you're trading your job for a phone, and getting your gas & mortgage paid... Lemme think about this one...

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 12:21 | 2875150 kaiserhoff
kaiserhoff's picture

Why is Obammy like NASCAR?

Gimme a left, a left..., a left, left, left.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 12:23 | 2875160 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

Two wrongs don't make a right, (but 3 lefts do)...

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 12:47 | 2875199 MillionDollarBogus_
MillionDollarBogus_'s picture

Siegel's comment about laying on a Caribbean beach reminds me of this story;

A retired and very wealthy American mega-yacht owner was at the village pier on a remote Pacific island, when a small boat with just one fisherman docked.

Inside the small boat were several large yellowfin tuna. The American complimented the fisherman on the quality of his fish and asked how long it took to catch them.

The fisherman replied, "Only a little while."

The yacht owner asked, "Why didn't you stay out longer and catch more fish?"

The fisherman said, "With this I have more than enough to support my family's needs."

The yacht owner then asked, "But what do you do with the rest of your time?"

The fisherman said, "I sleep late, fish a little, play with my children, take siesta with my wife, Maria, stroll into the village each evening where I sip wine and play guitar with my amigos, I have a full and busy life."

The yacht owner scoffed, " I can help you. You should spend more time fishing; and with the proceeds, buy a bigger boat: With the proceeds from the bigger boat you could buy several boats. Eventually you would have a fleet of fishing boats. Instead of selling your catch to a middleman you would sell directly to the processor; eventually opening your own cannery. You would control the product, processing and distribution. You could leave this small coastal fishing village and move to Australia, then Los Angeles and eventually New York where you could run your ever-expanding enterprise."

The fisherman asked, "But, how long will this all take?"

The American replied, "15 to 20 years."

"But what then?" asked the fisherman.

The yacht owner laughed and said, "That's the best part. When the time is right you would sell your company stock to the public and become very rich, you would make millions."

"Millions?...Then what?"

The yacht owner said, "Then you would do what I did - retire, buy a huge power boat and go searching for the perfect piece of property on an idyllic, remote Pacific island, where you could sleep late, fish a little, play with your kids, take siesta with your wife, stroll to the village in the evenings where you could sip wine and play your guitar with your amigos."


Wed, 10/10/2012 - 12:54 | 2875267 downrodeo
downrodeo's picture

says it all

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 12:59 | 2875286 redpill
redpill's picture

While Siegel is obviously a completely classless baboon, the Feds don't deserve a single red cent of his money.  Letters like this are stupid though, not only is the messaging bad, but the stated threat sounds disengenuous and hollow.  This guy isn't going to shut his company down, even if he's had enough; he would sell it, and most of the employees would keep their jobs.  And whether you agree with him or not, who wants to work at a company where your dripping-rich CEO writes long whiney letters threatening your $12/hour job because he doesn't like the way national politics are playing out (who does, Dave?).  Despite stating otherwise, obviously this letter is intended to motivate his employees to vote a certain way.  In that context it is poorly executed.  He should have hired someone to write a letter that might actually sway peoples' opinions instead of just making him look like a rich a-hole.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 13:22 | 2875398 Popo
Popo's picture

Oh NOES.  Obama might lose that all-important CEO demographic!   If he doesn't watch out he'll lose .0001% of the vote.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 15:09 | 2875792 Pure Evil
Pure Evil's picture

You would think the vast majority of the folks would have figured this out since Obama's inauguration in 2008.

A vote for Obummer could result in the loss of your job.

Somebody's got to redistribute the taxpayers wealth to Wall Street banks.

Trillions for Wall Street, cell phones for sheeple.

That's fair, how much hope and change were you expecting?

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 15:12 | 2875811 redpill
redpill's picture

Unfortunately the "CEO demographic" is all-important when it comes to national politics in the US merely by the fact that politicians rely on big whale donors to fund their campaigns (both major national parties have plenty of examples of this).  In the end they would lose a lot of votes if they couldn't afford the mass marketing to convince the sheeple you are anything and everything to them.  The mob makes their "decisions" based upon trivial political propaganda and advertising, or maybe who looks better, or who "they'd rather have a beer with" instead of using their pea brains to consider the real world impact of the actual actions (not words) and policies of the people they are "voting" for.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 15:28 | 2875857 SeattleBruce
SeattleBruce's picture

"instead of using their pea brains" 

Not making ultimate excuses for the sheeple - but if people don't seize, aren't given opportunities, or indeed required to use their brains, they don't use them as much.  It's not that there's not capacity there, although that can be a problem at times, and I suppose like other muscles, if the brain's not used it atrophies, or it's killed off by boozing, drugs, et al.  But people have to extract themselves out of pea sized thinking.  That probably starts by turning off the TV and reading more.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 14:00 | 2875545 Larry Dallas
Larry Dallas's picture

I think the rub here is that this guy, as much as he is classless and his ego go to the point where he needed to have his own reality show... wait for it... made it himself.

He had the business and marketing acumen to sell timeshares. No different than a developer building SFHs in Gilbert AZ. He became wealthy becuse others found value in what he was doing.

Yes, he used borrowed money. So does the rest of the world. He's just smarter than the rest.

Since when did using debt or equity to build a business become a sin on ZH? WTF? This isn't HuffPo.

What really pisses me off (and the last thing I would expect to read on ZH) is that folks are judging him by saying he "didn't make anything tangible" or "didn't make anything of real value". Who the hell are they to judge? If its so easy, why aren't they doing it themselves? Not everyone wants to start a gold mining company.

If you've ever had your own businesses, you'll know its not all fun and games and fuck you, I did build them. I've made a bunch of money and I've lost a bunch of money. 

I know what its like to lay in a pool of my own sweat. No iBamaPhone either.

So my rule is: Don't talk to me about politics unless you've had to make a payroll. Just STFU because I don't care.

Junk me, I don't give a fuck.  Every decision you make in life is your own. And this guy Siegel is just really saying:  I'm tired of paying for everyone else who make repeated bad decisions during and after high school...


Wed, 10/10/2012 - 14:07 | 2875572 SilverTree
SilverTree's picture

I truly agree with everything you said but I junked you anyway. :-)

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 14:37 | 2875687 Panafrican Funk...
Panafrican Funktron Robot's picture

You are completely right (and why I upvoted you) in your statements, but, too fucking bad, dog eat dog works both ways, and vaginas like this dude seem to devolve to histrionics at the slightest suggestion that the winds might be turning against him, regardless of whether those winds are misguided or not.  

This is the base problem with our society in general, there is a massive lack of cognitive power devoted to the problem of "fairness".  I know that's a dirty word in conservative circles, and the liberal solution has been, as they say down south, a "hot mess", but when a society doesn't account for "fairness", it tends to be accounted for them.  Think Tanya Harding/Nancy Kerrigan here.  Knees tend to get taken out (as Brian Cushing recently discovered).  

This is why neither candidate is sufficient, because none of their owners are willing to give up some of their power in exchange for a better society.  What I mean by that is individuals of all income levels need to step the fuck away from the feed trough, realize they've been consuming heavily processed garbage, and find some other method of sustenence.  Our government is currently set up to encourage the bad behavior of both the "Obamaphone" useless eaters, and the "fat cat banker" useless eaters.  Voting for Romney or Obama would solve neither issue.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 15:02 | 2875782 cornflakesdisease
cornflakesdisease's picture

When we all work at McDonalds, how will America have a tax base?

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 15:16 | 2875825 potlatch
potlatch's picture

"dog eat dog works both ways"



so very, very true.  As I am sure he himself loves to say, "Life isn't fair."


Funny how the rich try to say when life is supposed to be fair, and when it is not.


Then the dogs are at the gate.  And there are a lot of them.

Thu, 10/11/2012 - 00:05 | 2876989 TruthDetector
TruthDetector's picture

you might (but probably don't) want to reconsider some very basic assumptions under which you operate.

Try reading the following (for starters)...


Thu, 10/11/2012 - 00:06 | 2876992 TruthDetector
TruthDetector's picture

you might (but probably don't) want to reconsider some very basic assumptions under which you operate.

Try reading the following (for starters)...


Wed, 10/10/2012 - 14:43 | 2875703 firstdivision
firstdivision's picture

wait for it... made it himself.

Pretty sure it was made with plenty of government help in the way of Fannie/Freddie and the bailout from the taxpayers, but you keep living in your misplaced logic.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 15:11 | 2875802 Larry Dallas
Larry Dallas's picture

I never heard of Fannie/Freddie buying timeshare paper, or any liquidity in the secondary timeshare market for timeshares as its usually the toothless and homeless families who buy these shares. So I'm not sure your logic make sense here.

Tell me I'm wrong. But your logic would be correctly placed if this were the CEO of DR Horton [insert any privately / publically traded homebuilder].

You forgot to mention that he provided jobs to those folks. And paid payroll taxes (we assume) for those folks. 

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 15:50 | 2875928 firstdivision
firstdivision's picture

He's also in the business of construction, which I would wager does include homes.

David's empire includes timeshare, real estate, construction, hotel and apartment management, travel services, telecommunications, citrus, insurance, transportation, retail, and much more.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 16:01 | 2875963 Whalley World
Whalley World's picture

Your understanding of Vacation Ownership is somewhat limited Amigo. I have owned "timeshare" for years, great resorts at reasonable prices.  The vacations  I have taken due to these properties were unbelievable.  Through one program I was able to stay at Fisherman's Resort in Playacar for a week for $150. (all in)

The posted nightly rate was $450.00, so, when it comes to timeshare, one of us is stupid.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 17:20 | 2876197 Rentier
Rentier's picture

you may got it for $150, but what did you pay in maintence dues that year?  Timeshares have no real value, just ask a bankruptcy court.  Knew someone that owned two timeshares and they had to file bankruptcy, when he went to court and told them about the two time shares the court told him not to bother listing them and they have no value.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 15:25 | 2875845 Gringo Viejo
Gringo Viejo's picture

No shortage of socialist trolls on the board. Don't like capitalism? THEN GET THE FUCK OUT OF MY COUNTRY YOU COMMUNIST COCKSUCKERS!

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 15:45 | 2875915 firstdivision
firstdivision's picture

Sure guy, I'm a socialst troll.  You're a fucking moron and obviously are quite new here, but keep thinking you're relevant chief.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 16:41 | 2876076 Gringo Viejo
Gringo Viejo's picture

You'll have to forgive my bluntness. I'm an old man, served in the Marines during Vet Nam (0311), and detest what has befallen America. As to my relevance, that remains to be seen in the days to come. But all things being equal, I would rather be walking in my primitive shoes than those of a new age, youngster as yourself. When faced with a situation (and you will be) where your continued physical survival is in question, you had better be able to use more than your mouth. In closing, note I do not give down arrows to anyone speaking their piece. I'm not to judge that which is relevant.....or not.

Thu, 10/11/2012 - 00:04 | 2876986 TruthDetector
TruthDetector's picture

you might (but probably don't) want to reconsider some very basic assumptions under which you operate.

Try reading the following (for starters)...


Wed, 10/10/2012 - 15:02 | 2875777 greensnacks
greensnacks's picture

Most federal revenues are funnelled to corporations, not lazy people and pbs.  Social welfare accounts for 12% of the budget and I'm all for making able people work to earn that 12%, but Obama phones aren't bankrupting this nation. Think about it - the government pays for the phones, but the carriers like AT&T, Verizon and Nokia, etc end up with money. So in a sense, the obama phone is just a program to launder federal tax dollars to corporations. Eliminate it! but don't blame poor people for abusing the system when the corporations end up with all the money.

It cost a lot provide security for the rest of the world. Perhaps we could make a bigger dent in our deficits if our NATO allies were made to pay their fare share in protecting the rest of the world, so we can reduce our out of control defense spending.



Wed, 10/10/2012 - 15:53 | 2875938 ActiveIngredient
ActiveIngredient's picture

The biggest problem with the Obamaphones and other social programs isn't their cost.  It's that they create a large and growing permanent underclass who are entirely dependent on government.   The politicians can then easily buy their votes (and by extension, their complicity in the status quo plunder by the oligarchs) with simple promises of more free stuff, or threats that the "other team" will take the goodies away.


Wed, 10/10/2012 - 22:53 | 2876866 Cathartes Aura
Cathartes Aura's picture

and the .gov can buy votes from those who want to "pay less taxes" through various loopholes & shelters.  and corporations, particularly war & death related corps, they all buy votes via lobbyists.

everyone votes for what they want, right?  and the "obamaphones" have been around through bush, etc. too - obama-name is just the current one.

but lets get real - what percentage of peoples actually do vote any more?  and who counts them?

Thu, 10/11/2012 - 01:24 | 2877062 ActiveIngredient
ActiveIngredient's picture

The politicians who dole out all those $$ to the corporations you describe are betraying the country.   But we can't boot them out of office as long as 100 million + people are dependent to at least some extent on various social programs, because these people now make voting decisions based on who will continue to give them more free stuff, instead of who will do the right thing for the country.  

And by the way....what is wrong with wanting to pay less taxes?  Who in their right mind would want to have half their earnings stolen by corrupt politicians who take our money and use it to reward their special interest supporters?



Wed, 10/10/2012 - 18:11 | 2876325 SeattleBruce
SeattleBruce's picture

12% on welfare?  You mean to tell me that the 22% that's spent on 'health care' and 22% on 'pensions' and the 6% on 'other' and 4% on education, doesn't include welfare and vote buying by the fed government?  Come on!

I agree with you about sharing the defense load with others in NATO, and generally ramping back this insane policeman superpower role we're in right now.  We definitely need to have that national conversation.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 15:22 | 2875839 Mad Mohel
Mad Mohel's picture

That guy is a first class cunt and crook of the highest order. There are thousands of complaints against the scams he is running. He even paid 5.4 million for pulling out his prick to an employee. Shut the fuck up and pay your taxes you crooked bastard.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 14:57 | 2875757 Ferrari
Ferrari's picture

"...the Feds don't deserve a single red cent of his money." Ok, but what's his position on Iran? I suspect he thinks we need to back Israel's play on Iran to preserve the American Way, but he doesn't want to pay for the useless agression? Naw, naw, naw. You want another useless war, you pay for it.

To say nothing of the fact that the hapless US taxpayer has been berry, berry, berry good to Mr. Siegel's chosen industry.

Thu, 10/11/2012 - 00:01 | 2876981 TruthDetector
TruthDetector's picture

you might (but probably don't) want to reconsider some very basic assumptions under which you operate.

Try reading the following (for starters)...


Wed, 10/10/2012 - 15:00 | 2875774 redd_green
redd_green's picture

HIS money?  And what banking system did "he" make all that money in?

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 23:59 | 2876977 TruthDetector
TruthDetector's picture

you might (but probably don't) want to reconsider some very basic assumptions under which you operate.

Try reading the following for starters...


Wed, 10/10/2012 - 13:01 | 2875296 Strider52
Strider52's picture

OOPS, for a minute there I thought MDB made a useful comment, until I read the name a bit closer.

My bad...back to your regular ZH...

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 12:03 | 2875087 john39
john39's picture

He is the epitome of what went wrong in the global economy....  his tacky, grotesque monstrous billion dollar barn that he is building but can't finish is the perfect symbol of the central bank manipulated fascist world economy.  his 'wealth' is based on junk real-estate deals before the crash...  ie, during the fed created bubble.  this letter is a total joke.  

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 12:19 | 2875142 Bicycle Repairman
Bicycle Repairman's picture

I wonder what Mr. Siegel would have thought about a Ron Paul Presidency.  Ron could have beaten Obama.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 13:32 | 2875428 MiltonFriedmans...
MiltonFriedmansNightmare's picture

"ron could have beaten Obama"

Yeah, or, he coulda been a Kennedy....

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 15:19 | 2875832 twh99
twh99's picture

Not likely.

I like what Ron stands for, but I always got the impression that he was just a wee bit crazy.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 12:28 | 2875178 Temporis
Temporis's picture

Wow his email sound almost like what Union Leaders comments/emails/letters say to union members...

Vote "D" or lose your job/healthcare/benifits.


Funny how MSM really does not give a shit when Unions do that...

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 13:00 | 2875294 midtowng
midtowng's picture

Are you kidding? The MSM is led by Fox News, and they hate unions.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 13:37 | 2875445 LMAOLORI
LMAOLORI's picture



Donations by Media Companies Tilt Heavily to Obama


All the major media companies, driven largely by their Hollywood film and television businesses, have made larger contributions to President Obama than to his rival, former Gov. Mitt Romney, according to the Center for Responsive Politics, a nonprofit, nonpartisan Washington-based research group that publishes the Open Secrets Web site.

The center’s numbers represent donations by a company’s PAC and any employees who listed that company as their employer.

Even companies whose news outlets are often perceived as having a conservative bias have given significantly more money to Mr. Obama. Rupert Murdoch’s News Corporation, for example, has contributed $58,825 to Mr. Obama’s campaign, compared with $2,750 to Mr. Romney

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 14:17 | 2875614 knukles
knukles's picture

Idyllic Island Quiz:

What Idyllic Island claiming to be Pro-Union recently suffered a walkout of unionized labor at it's Organ of the Pro-Union Propaganda Mechanism?


Manhattan and it's Soul of Wondrous Futures, The New York Times

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 14:57 | 2875759 kaiserhoff
kaiserhoff's picture

Thanks knuks, I missed that.  Couldn't happen to a more deserving scrum of motherfuckers.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 15:54 | 2875940 LMAOLORI
LMAOLORI's picture



Paul Krugman never responded the other day when I asked him if he walked out with the rest of the crew lol might have had something to do with how I linked crew to Bob Denver of Gilligans Island.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 15:26 | 2875848 midtowng
midtowng's picture

And if this donation number meant anything, then you are saying that Fox News is heavily biased in favor of Obama and against Romney. Is that what you are saying?

If so, say hello to me from Crazy Town.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 15:41 | 2875904 LMAOLORI
LMAOLORI's picture



Same should be true then for financial sector donations right?  lol I merely pointed out that anyone suggesting they really believe Fox is against obama is batshit crazy just like anyone who thought obama would bring the banksters that paid him off to justice.


Wed, 10/10/2012 - 19:34 | 2876461 midtowng
midtowng's picture

Then call me batshit crazy, because Fox is against Obama in every way possible.

If it makes you feel any better, I consider you batshit crazy to suggest that Fox is NOT against Obama.

The only thing we are agreeing on is that Obama is owned by the Wall Street bankers.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 18:20 | 2876340 SeattleBruce
SeattleBruce's picture

midtowng: "The MSM is led by Fox News"


Say what?  Fox News was launched in 1996 - I'm pretty sure that the rest of the sordid journalistic profession we call the MSM has been around just a wee bit longer than's dregs hold on - barely - as the blogosphere is creating a more personalized form of interacting with 'the news.'  Now if you mean ratings, OK, Fox is on top - but not if you add all the other stations that take the opposite tack than Fox.  If anything that MSM baloney is corporate BS - and it surely aint just Fox.  People that pound Fox remind me of people that hawk for the parties...aint gunna fly around here.

Give us the simple truth.  Zero Hedge.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 19:39 | 2876470 midtowng
midtowng's picture

Given the short-term outlook in the media, the amount of time being around means less than nothing.

Secondly, I don't believe that the other networks take an opposite tack of Fox. Only MSNBC seems to be opposite of Fox. The others want some middle-of-the-road between the two. And as Fox slowly drifts further to the right they drag the other networks along with them.

OTOH, I do agree that it is all corporate BS. Fox is just the most extreme example.

What I think is insane is all the people who think something so tightly controlled by corporations is going to be liberal in any way, shape, or form.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 12:29 | 2875188 toady
toady's picture

No shit. This is one of the guys behind the 'timeshare' boondoggle?

I have a few friends who would torture this dude if they could get their hands on him.

Millions of people must have stepped into his timeshare snare, only to be slowly fee'ed to death in a shithole that's falling apart with no hope to eacape because everyone is wise to that game now.

Its gotten so bad that I don't even talk to some of them anymore. One guy tries to sell me his timeshare in Orlando every time I see him. He's been trying to get rid of it for ten years now!

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 15:58 | 2875955 Ruffcut
Ruffcut's picture

If you bought a timeshare you are a total moron. Period. End of story.

My bro makes good cash and owns two and he is broke.

Can't fix stupid.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 12:33 | 2875204 walküre
walküre's picture

Re the monstrous barn  .. kinda like the humble dwellings of a certain self declared climate change prophet who also claims to have invented the internet.

Too funny if it wasn't so painfully stupid.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 13:25 | 2875402 OpenThePodBayDoorHAL
OpenThePodBayDoorHAL's picture

I think this is despicable and unprecedented. No matter what this SOB thinks about the current president (and I'm no fan) this is a disgusting stunt. If he wants to get political then let him give his millions to a SuperPAC.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 15:13 | 2875815 X.inf.capt
X.inf.capt's picture


wonder how much of his wealth came from goverment programs... be entitled....


Wed, 10/10/2012 - 13:37 | 2875451 ChubbNut
ChubbNut's picture

Nice PF icon.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 13:49 | 2875509 blunderdog
blunderdog's picture

You'd think if "people like [him] who made all the right decisions and invested in themselves" are having trouble, he'd be smart enough to realize there's a bit more going on than a bad President.

Just another moron who happened to get rich during decades of real-estate scamming.

A former boss of mine got rich during the '90s dotcom boom.  That convinced him he's a genius.  None of the companies he sold are still in business, and everything he's tried since 2001 has failed, but he's still certain he's a really insightful and creative businessguy.

Reality just doesn't impinge on some folks' consciousness.  This guy's letter is probably going to backfire, but it doesn't really matter, as no matter who wins this elections, it's going to get UGLY over the next four years.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 14:23 | 2875645 Meesohaawnee
Meesohaawnee's picture

a microcosm of this country. self centered ego maniac,entitled, dushbag. and what makes him look like a 2 year old is he actually believes theres a difference between the two? what an idiot in many ways

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 14:32 | 2875670 Roland99
Roland99's picture

Exactly!  Labor costs are pre-tax. He doesn't pay taxes on pre-tax income.  He pays taxes on PROFITS (which come after labor)

SO, if this thick-neck decides to fire people it's only because his company is doing poorly and cannot sustain the current staffing level.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 13:23 | 2875388 sgt_doom
sgt_doom's picture

This Siegel is exactly representative of Jewish-American business types pre-World War II, which was exactly why there was no overall love loss between them and everyone else at that time.

All the revisionism in the world can't change all the horrors and debacles conveniently forgotten where they were concerned.

Siegel, like Sheldon Adelson, is true to type, and why there wasn't a rush into WWII, nor much sympathy for Euro Jewry back then.

And why AIPAC, and that NetinYahoo over in Israel, should all STFU!!!

And stop their frigging Romney-like draft dodging, then wanting everyone else to fight their wars!

And let us never forget one of Obama's first administration appointments, Larry Summers who, as president at Harvard, was involved in the firing of the first Black-American woman to receive a PhD in mathematics at that university --- because she took issue with the investment strategy of Harvard's endowment fund (heavy into CDOs and other credit derivatives--- which cost them around $2 billion and forced them to discontinue free hot breakfasts and coffee for their students there --- boo hoo, mofos!).

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 13:33 | 2875430 ronaldawg
ronaldawg's picture

I think your tin hat just fell off - it's always those Jooooooooos!!!!!

Thu, 10/11/2012 - 13:43 | 2878106 FeralSerf
FeralSerf's picture

Yep, massively disproportionately so.  It was obvious to the the average German in the 1920s and 30s too.  That's the reason it was so easy for Hitler and his goons to take over with their propaganda and the reason so many innocent Jews (and others too) were killed.  It also didn't hurt the elites' program that the Soviet Union was being run by Zionist Jooze and were massacreing innocent Russian Christians.  The Nazi propaganda made sure the average German believed the same thing would happen to him and his family if the Jooze were permitted to remain in power economically.

History is repeating as we speak.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 15:06 | 2875794 cornflakesdisease
cornflakesdisease's picture

But in 1976, the lives of Mitt Romney and Benjamin Netanyahu intersected, briefly but indelibly, in the 16th-floor offices of the Boston Consulting Group, where both had been recruited as corporate advisers. At the most formative time of their careers, they sized each other up during the firm’s weekly brainstorming sessions, absorbing the same profoundly analytical view of the world.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 14:12 | 2875592 Omen IV
Omen IV's picture

This David Seigal guy is the definition of  a Fascist which makes sense given his background - no institutional memory - full circle in 80 years

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 15:43 | 2875909 LMAOLORI
LMAOLORI's picture



This is what Fascism looks like

Government + Business Partnership: Coming to an ISP near you

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 12:15 | 2875126 Gully Foyle
Gully Foyle's picture

Jack Burton

Dude a few months ago some whiny bitch had to close his oil company.

He blamed Obama and all the assholes here cried about how this guy built his business himself now it was going under.

Except everybody forgot aboput all those OIL SUBSIDIES!

Like the whiny fucker didn't take taxpayer money for his business to function.

Matter of fact about the time of his complaint some of the subsidies ran out.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 12:35 | 2875203 alangreedspank
alangreedspank's picture

There is almost no companies out there that haven't applied for tax breaks (which is what people call 'subsidies' when talking about the energy sector) or for subsidies.

The government subsidizes everything that moves so they can claim credit for every business success and when they plunder a business they can say "You didn't build that, records show you got 100,000$ from us 5 years ago!" and people like you can believe it.


Wed, 10/10/2012 - 12:36 | 2875206 walküre
walküre's picture

The US government is the single largest consumer of energy.

Does that count as subsidy or expense? Either way it benefits the group who is constantly nagging everyone to death over too much government spending.

When government stops spending, the lights go out in America.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 12:43 | 2875227 alangreedspank
alangreedspank's picture

It's a neutral transfer actually. Government takes from oil firm, gives back to oil firm when government worker fills up the tank. Of course in the process, government borrowed money and will ask oil firm to pay the interests on that loan in 5,10,30 years depending on the treasury that was sold.

When the government stops spending, we'll see pretty much the same as we saw after WW2. Hardly a lights out moment.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 12:48 | 2875250 pods
pods's picture

I would research our monetary system a bit before making that last statement.


Wed, 10/10/2012 - 13:19 | 2875381 Gully Foyle
Gully Foyle's picture


I would say there is no company existing which doesn't use tax breaks.

The ones who don't have poor tax representation.

That means they are fucking stupid and can not compete because the game is rigged.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 12:46 | 2875241 knightowl77
knightowl77's picture

Sad....He took taxpayer money is bullshit...he took deductions for his expenses in exploring and drilling...that was his subsidy...the same break EVERY business gets for their expenses....You and your lefty friends only want certain businesses to be able to deduct their expenses. Right now businesses only have to pay taxes on their NET profit, that is not a special break.....

You make it sound like when you take a legal deduction off your taxes you are stealing from the taxpayer. BS......

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 13:10 | 2875339 Gully Foyle
Gully Foyle's picture


What the fuck do you have against Left Handed people?

Sometimes I am disgusted at the levels of bias and discrimination posted here.

This is a new low.

Even lower that Ginger hate.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 13:19 | 2875384 knightowl77
knightowl77's picture

We all know from Heraldry; Left = Sinister

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 13:22 | 2875396 Gully Foyle
Gully Foyle's picture


Why would you take advice from someone named Harald?

Sounds like Eurotrash to me.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 14:20 | 2875629 Omen IV
Omen IV's picture

The subsidy is more explicit - Saudi Arabia et al. have better than 35% royalty on government owned mineral properties - the royalty in USA is less than 12.5% or a 60-75% subsidy - this has cost and will cost 10's of trillions !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

also give me the rationale for depletion allowance  - when cost of drillling and completion - capital cost - is already seperately depreciated?


Wed, 10/10/2012 - 17:08 | 2876156 Encroaching Darkness
Encroaching Darkness's picture

So you want the US government to raise the royalties on oil production to 35% or higher - just like that bastion of freedom, Saudi Arabia - to end a "subsidy"?

A) You are aware that Saudi Arabia has a vast social welfare system, right? That those royalties go towards keeping all the unemployed from rioting and causing trouble for the Saudi version of TPTB?

B) The US government already steals various amounts from every corporation, citizen and foreigner it can. Why would you want them to have more to waste, lose through fraud and abuse, bailout more Solyndras and similar? Do you have a lust for punishment?

C) Every asset resulting from productive activity (mining, manufacturing, farming, whatever) that is strip-mined out of the general economy by the government is a loss, and cannot be invested, reinvested in that firm that created it, or otherwise productively employed. Do you hate economic growth and activity?

Re: depletion allowance - until someone invents a cheap, easily-deployed energy source with petroleum energy-density, we need more oil Sometimes, you lose money just looking for it. Short story - Mukluk. I worked for Texaco for a while, long years ago. They and several others wanted to drill a structure called Mukluk, off the North Slope of Alaska, miles from anywhere. Geologists from several oil companies (including Exxon, Socal and others) all looked at the seismic data and said, "Yep - if it's anywhere, it's here. Cap rock over reservoir formation, obvious dome, good depth - let's drill". Several meters of icy Arctic water meant they had to build a small ISLAND - a gravel pile to keep the seasonal sea ice from shifting the drilling rig off-position, and everything had to be brought in from far away. They spent MILLIONS if not a few billion getting ready to drill - and afterwards learned that the cap rock had cracks, if any petroleum was ever there it bled out centuries ago, and all that money was lost for nothing. Depletion allowances attempt to account for the fact that the easy oil is all found, and every new field seem to be deeper, more remote and tougher to bring to market.

Not that any of that applies to the Bakken / Eagle Ford / Marcellus shale stuff - but it seems to deplete rather fast. Bottom line: oil is a risky business, no matter how you drill it.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 13:05 | 2875245 knightowl77
knightowl77's picture

edit ; Dbl Post

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 13:20 | 2875391 Gully Foyle
Gully Foyle's picture


Oh, so now that was a Doobie post.

Trying to weasel your way out of that bit of extremity elitism evinced by your Left handed hatred.

Now one cares how high you were Adolf.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 14:27 | 2875657 knightowl77
knightowl77's picture

Your BOLDNESS has blinded you

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 13:28 | 2875409 OpenThePodBayDoorHAL
OpenThePodBayDoorHAL's picture

Government gifts to the "struggling" oil & gas industries this year EXCEED welfare payments to the poor. There's class warfare for you.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 15:51 | 2875930 LMAOLORI
LMAOLORI's picture




Prove that instead of just spewing nonsense because that's not true payments to social programs dwarf all other spending including war. Something else the oil & gas industries pay alot of taxes unlike the poor.  Typical socialist bullshit how dare those evil companies make a profit.


‘Taxation Hero’: ExxonMobil has paid more than $1 trillion in taxes since 1999, which is 3x its profits over that period


Reality Check: Entitlement Spending Dwarfs Wars Since 2001

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 18:46 | 2876377 4 wheel drift
4 wheel drift's picture

what a shithead.......   'SUBSIDIES'








in order to tax (or steal) MONEY HAS TO BE PRODUCED....    WEALTH HAS TO BE PRODUCED......   "reasonable taxation" i suppose

is a reasonable "cost of doing business"....   the immoral WASTE THAT TODAY'S GOVERNMENTS HAS CREATED HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH reasonable taxation, GOVERNMENT WASTE MUST NOT BE FUNDED OR ENCOURAGED.






Wed, 10/10/2012 - 12:57 | 2875277 midtowng
midtowng's picture

This letter doesn´t impress me. You can find similar letters by wealthy Republicans before each and every presidential election.

Thu, 10/11/2012 - 00:09 | 2876998 TruthDetector
TruthDetector's picture

you might (but probably don't) want to reconsider some very basic assumptions under which you operate.

Try reading the following (for starters)...


Wed, 10/10/2012 - 13:28 | 2875412 shushup
shushup's picture

While what silvertree and burton both say are true - Siegel's point is also true. Darden restarants is changing all of their workers to part time and worse to avoid paying benefits and offset tax increases to pay for bamercare.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 14:02 | 2875549 DanP1966
DanP1966's picture

He is acting and sounding like a spoiled brat and that letter was about one of the most unprofessional, tacky things I have read.

The man is a drama queen.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 14:01 | 2875550 DanP1966
DanP1966's picture

He is acting and sounding like a spoiled brat and that letter was about one of the most unprofessional, tacky things I have read.

The man is a drama queen.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 14:47 | 2875715 Bunga Bunga
Bunga Bunga's picture

"people like me who made all the right decisions and invested in themselves are being forced to bail out all the people who didn't"

He always made right decisions? Really? No. Now he want's to blame it on Obama. He should rather thank Obama, that he is still in business.





Wed, 10/10/2012 - 14:52 | 2875739 roadlust
roadlust's picture

He might also be "upset" about this and having to pay almost a mill in fines for violating telemarketing laws.   It's so wonderful to live in a country that makes being sleazy one of the highest paid occupations!

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 15:44 | 2875897 Lore
Lore's picture

"This CEO rode a manipulated government supported Bubble Market with plenty on government intervention and support. Now he claims he is being badly used by government."

That explanation seems too narrow. The travel industry is highly vulnerable to vagaries of consumer confidence. The easy credit "wealth effect" no doubt contributed, but I submit that the chief support to a company like this was the weatlhy and heavily-targeted / destination-marketed Senior Senior (pre-"Boomer") demographic. Any entrepeneur with half a brain and a sensible business plan made good money in tourism back in the 1990s and early 2000s.  (I know; I did.)

Easy credit might have propped up this guy's revenue as the broader downturn took hold, but I submit that anything reliant upon travel and tourism is in a 25 year bear market, as the truly wealthy generation is gone, the Boomers are maxed out, and inheritance tax and credit tightening will destroy any hope for revival.

Let us never confuse ANY puppet leaders with bad policies created by bureaucrats and bankers behind the scenes.

Westgate corporate description:  ttp://

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 18:33 | 2876357 4 wheel drift
4 wheel drift's picture

manipulated government bubble market ?    well, but of course.....   BUT....


for years, while the government was not perfect, they were able to get out of the way enough to allow entrepreneurs to create wealth...

the government and their minnows, for the most part in the past, have been irrelevant nuisances...     arseholes who thought of themselves too damned important.... yet produced either waste, or jack-chit.

in the last 15 - 20 years has been a different story, and in the last 4 years, headed by an arrogant, ignorant, tyrant.....  (and being a lawyer, is not more than being an expert at lying, cheating and being a professional arsehole, no better than a street thug, particularly if one comes from chicago), hence all politicians and bureaucrats with the help of unions, particularly government based jobs unions.... turned into the free-chit army with the crippling mentality of "deserve" just because.... and so... whether operating form rand's world or not.....   this particular CEO, CAN create, (or not) jobs, or in this case....  withdraw from economic activity....  the result of  the uncertainty created by stupid kommie based policies.

very few people understand that the product of their OWN work BELONGS to them, not to the government, so for a politician to say.....    "candidate "x" will give back money to the rich by the tax "cut" he has crafted......    that is pure bullshit, because the government CANNOT "give back"  a goddamned thing, particularly money...  because (i) the money paid in taxes actually belongs to those who PRODUCE, and is extrated by the government; (ii) government produces only waste or jack chit; (iii) taxes is a penalty imposed by government to pay for the government services that politicians are charged with providing by popular vote....  they were not given the right to a blank check to STEAL (which is the proper term for money TAKEN from the people in excess of the services that government is supposed to provide and administer)...   the rest....  special provisions, bail-outs, foreign aide, wealfuckingfare, and the rest of the chit that these bastards create for the sole purpose to buy votes in their respective locales......   is THIEVERY.......   therefore, government cannot "give back"  it can only STOP STEALING.

hence......     there is NO OBLIGATION to pay said taxes. the problem is most of the populi are cowed into believing they have no power...  when they do....   stand up and demand not to pay more taxes until the thieves give a detail analysis of how the money given to them thus far has been administer.

These chitheads are OUR employees... OUR SERVANTS  not the glorified (by the MSM)  arse-kissers, kleptomaniacs, that they are and their own propaganda  wishes we would believe OTHERWISE...  although in the increasingly idiocrazy like environment under which we operate.... it seems most actually believe the chit they puke.....

atlas shrugged is what we are now living.......  a future tale (in 1957) that has come true.......    almost to the letter.....









Wed, 10/10/2012 - 12:19 | 2875141 Monedas
Monedas's picture

David Axelrod is blowing Obama's cum bubbles !

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 12:43 | 2875228 Dexter for President
Dexter for President's picture

SilverTree: Perhaps you can enlighten us as to how many jobs (and industries) will be safe from Obummers policies and taxes?????

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 13:26 | 2875406 SilverTree
SilverTree's picture


Wed, 10/10/2012 - 13:31 | 2875424 vast-dom
vast-dom's picture





Wed, 10/10/2012 - 13:43 | 2875475 ronaldawg
ronaldawg's picture

HE MEANS "DEMOCRATS DON'T VOTE" this year - you are too stupid....

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 14:58 | 2875764 Deo vindice
Deo vindice's picture

Silvertree said "Have a career based in a bubble industry propped up by the FED >>>>loose thy job."

I agreed with what you said.  I junked you for not knowing the difference between "lose" and "loose".

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 13:30 | 2875419 ronaldawg
ronaldawg's picture

The only Turkey we care about has gravy associated with it....

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 11:01 | 2874804 john39
john39's picture

yeah, because we all know that the romney puppet will make it all better.... 

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 11:03 | 2874818 MiltonFriedmans...
MiltonFriedmansNightmare's picture

If all he does is eliminate Obamacare, well, we've got that going for us, which is nice.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 11:08 | 2874844 SeverinSlade
SeverinSlade's picture

Except Mittens wants to keep certain parts of Obamacare that he likes, even if they are unconstitutional.

Ironic how Mittens created the very example that Obamacare was modeled after yet he now compaigns against it.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 11:13 | 2874870 Calmyourself
Calmyourself's picture

Ironic and an indictment of our educational system that you do not understand the difference between states as the laboratory of democracy and the Federal government..  Now his point of keeping certain sections of the abomination we could not agree more.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 11:19 | 2874894 kridkrid
kridkrid's picture

^^^ I love watching people hide from their cognitive dissonance.  Put it on TV and I would watch it over college football... and I love me some college football.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 11:35 | 2874969 SeverinSlade
SeverinSlade's picture

States are allowed to make up their own mind regarding health care so long as it doesn't infringe on Constititionally protected rights; that I do not argue against.  But the fact that Romney originally said he would repeal Obamacare in its entirety, only to change yet again and say he would keep "the provisions he likes" shows his true stance.

Romney supporting State rights...That's a good one.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 11:58 | 2875064 XitSam
XitSam's picture

And Romney is only half, or a third, of the equation.  His 'repeal and replace' would have to get through Congress, with every Congressman and lobbyist adding their special protections, set asides and monopoly clauses. 

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 13:46 | 2875488 ronaldawg
ronaldawg's picture

He is probably a dirty foreigner who has not had the benefit of our governmental union promoting educational system.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 14:56 | 2875755 roadlust
roadlust's picture

Yeah, "states rights" are the foundation of "democracy," like slavery.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 12:08 | 2875104 darteaus
darteaus's picture

Uhm, not the "very example".

He created Romneycare - a basic health care model.

He failed when he refused to foresee that Romneycare would be loaded down by every state politician with "esential" services until it is now just another bankrupt sinkhole.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 13:47 | 2875494 MiltonFriedmans...
MiltonFriedmansNightmare's picture

A man can dream, can't, if after all, he doesn't have his dreams, what has he got?

The devil you know vs. the devil you don't.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 11:09 | 2874845 GetZeeGold
GetZeeGold's picture



If all he does is eliminate Obamacare, well


Sweet.....and do you really think he could do any worse than Bam Bam?


If we could just figure out a way to get rid of Boenher.


Wed, 10/10/2012 - 12:05 | 2875095 Crabshacker
Crabshacker's picture

Hey....Call a doctor!! That Boenher (boneher?) Lasted more than 4 hours..

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 12:26 | 2875176 kaiserhoff
kaiserhoff's picture

There is no difference between the parties.  The whole world is a conspiracy, and their gonna get us one way or another.

                                                    Paranoid Schizophrenics Anonymous

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 16:20 | 2876021 MiltonFriedmans...
MiltonFriedmansNightmare's picture

In a word, no.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 12:22 | 2875153 Bicycle Repairman
Bicycle Repairman's picture

Romney (the creator of RomneyCare) is not eliminating or changing ObamaCare, so forget about that.  The thought is ridiculous.  Mitch McConnell has also said there's no going back.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 13:48 | 2875501 kaiserhoff
kaiserhoff's picture

It's not about going back.  It's about going down.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 14:24 | 2875648 Bicycle Repairman
Bicycle Repairman's picture

If Obama/RomneyCare goes down, it will not be because of anything done intentionally by Obama or Romney or any member of congress.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 12:31 | 2875193 Renewable Life
Renewable Life's picture

This prick Seigel is just another "elite king", no different then Jacky GE or Trump, and list coud go on for days!! Their just starting to show their true colors now!!!

Also, if you think Mittens is going to get rid of Obamacare, your just fucking dillusional!!! Mitty is taking orders from a higher power, and you don't know shit about it, unless your a "sealed and exalted" morman!! Don't know what that means.........of course you don't!!!! But here's a fucking news flash for ya, morman doctrine and history is ALL about collective thinking, redistributing wealth and resources for the good of all their followers, collective colonies like the one mittens father was connected too, shared sacrifice!!!

You brainwashed republicans are as sad as the brainwashed democrats, you think you know Mitt Romney, holy shit is this fucking going to be fun to watch, this will put the circus that was Bush and Obama to shame!!!

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 12:43 | 2875230 walküre
walküre's picture

Mormons are cultists. Freakish, exclusive and brainwashed.

Give Joe Smith the access codes to the world's largest nuclear arsenal. Fucking brilliant.

Thy Kingdom Come!

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 12:50 | 2875257 pods
pods's picture

I was talking with a girl at work whose father is a lifelong R. 

He talked about how the guy (Mittens) has some good ideas, but he cannot vote for a guy in a cult.


Wed, 10/10/2012 - 13:04 | 2875310 Liposuction
Liposuction's picture

It's too bad that her dad doesn't understand that values are not the same as theology.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 13:54 | 2875524 pods
pods's picture

To be honest, I could not give a damn what her dad thinks. He is just another captured mind in this system where we continually drift towards serfdom no matter who is in charge.


Wed, 10/10/2012 - 21:46 | 2876725 cjbosk
cjbosk's picture


"he is just another captured mind in this system where we continually drift towards serfdom, (I added a comma bro) no matter who is in charge."

And exactly how is it that you are different? 

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 14:09 | 2875577 walküre
walküre's picture

Where were his values when he crafted one LBO after another and left thousands without paycheques?

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 14:22 | 2875639 DOT
DOT's picture

In public view. Unlike our incumbent.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 11:17 | 2874885 kridkrid
kridkrid's picture

correct.  This is pure theater... and if not for this schmuck... who made his money through real estate, mind you... the most corrupt slice of government supported economic BULLSHIT our planned economy has to offer (outside of finance, but they do work hand in glove)... but if not for this narcissistic clown, there would be some other narcissistic clown yearning to take the spotlight and take on the president.  This guy is as big of a part of the problem as any of the politicians.  And like most politicians, he's not smart enough to recognize the hypocrisy in what he says.  He is programmed to be an idiot.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 11:27 | 2874931 aint no fortuna...
aint no fortunate son's picture

not just real estate - time shares.

that letter was nothing but blackmail

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 11:32 | 2874954 kridkrid
kridkrid's picture

Nice.  Fractional reserve vacation home ownership, built with fractional reserve pretend money.  Fuck this guy.  Fuck him.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 12:23 | 2875162 Harlequin001
Harlequin001's picture

yes, and the 7,000 or so jobs he creats. Fuck em all eh.

er now who's going to feed them all now then?

blackmail it may be, but it's fuckin spot on. Less tax, less government and if you don't want these jobs then go and create your own...

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 12:41 | 2875223 kridkrid
kridkrid's picture

Someone in some thread today wrote something to the effect of, "if you are working in an industry that is a gov't created bubble, you might want to consider a different line of work".

Let me ask you this... what should happen to postal employees?  Should the government keep selling debt to raise money to keep that thing floating?  Whose going to feed them?

I'm all for less taxes and less government.  In fact, I'm in favor of no taxes and no government.  The thing is... that asshole isn't.  Because that asshole has made his fortune in a gov't subsidized industry.  But the thing is... he doesn't even really care about what he said, only that what he said is putting him on a stage.  The guy allowed a film to made about him and his interest in building the largest home in america.  He is a psychopath.  Google the characteristics of psychopathic behavior.  Yes, fuck him.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 12:49 | 2875254 Dexter for President
Dexter for President's picture

Postal service (and any other gov't run service) should be shut down since they can not make money. A private business (fedex, ups, etc) has the correct business plan to make money and will replace those failed businesses. This is the free market model. Those that lost jobs can work for teh business that actually makes money instead of stealing more tax dollars from me.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 12:54 | 2875264 pods
pods's picture

Well to be fair, the maintaining of post offices IS specified in the constitution.

And they are one of the only areas that have to fully prefund retirement.  

Now mail delivery to your house is another issue, but post offices are one of the very few things the federal government does today that is actually delegated to it by the constitution (Article I, section 8).


Wed, 10/10/2012 - 12:58 | 2875282 Winston Churchill
Winston Churchill's picture

So pods.A lot of things are in the Constitution.

Get over it,there is no law now except that of the jungle.

Welcome to the Chiquita republic.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 13:18 | 2875379 GeezerGeek
GeezerGeek's picture

Actually, there are only a few things in the Constitution. As far as Article 1 Section 8, there are only a very limited number of areas in which Congress is supposed to involve the government. However, that pesky commerce clause has been used to justify all manner of government intrusion into what should be private business and private lives. Applying a strict constructionist view to Federal legislation would result in the repeal of probably 90% of what the Federal government does.

You are right, however, in stating that there is no law now, or more precisely, no Constitution except when convenient. The use of executive orders by Obama, the number of which far exceeds that of his predecessors, illustrates your point.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 14:04 | 2875556 pods
pods's picture

According the the national archives, Obama has not authorized an unusual amount of EOs.

He is merely keeping pace with Bush in the high 30's per year.  Carter was the most profligate, at around 80 per year (in recent history).


Wed, 10/10/2012 - 13:00 | 2875292 PiratePawpaw
PiratePawpaw's picture

And the postal service has not recieved A SINGLE PENNY from the fed govt since the reorganization in the late '70's.

It is ENTIRELY run on income from selling postage.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 13:48 | 2875499 LMAOLORI
LMAOLORI's picture



Not entirely true

The USPS does get some taxpayer support. Around $96 million is budgeted annually by Congress for the "Postal Service Fund." These funds are used to compensate USPS for postage-free mailing for all legally blind persons and for mail-in election ballots sent from US citizens living overseas. A portion of the funds also pays USPS for providing address information to state and local child support enforcement agencies.

In addition there's a possible bail out headed our way

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 15:25 | 2875843 surf0766
surf0766's picture

Complete bullshit.

Federal Financing Bank loans.


Wed, 10/10/2012 - 13:04 | 2875314 modest_proposal
modest_proposal's picture

UPS and FedEx are cream-skimming - they're delivering (very well - no doubt) on the highest-margin portion of the postal business. In the process, they've sucked the air out of the business for the Post Office. Parcel used to provide a much larger portion of the USPS business - and it seems USPS still sets the floor on the price in that market.

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 13:37 | 2875444 Harlequin001
Harlequin001's picture

Got it in one. Without govt funded businesses the only places receiving any mail would be inner cities and more lucrative routes. Outlying homesteads and farms would receive no service because it is not profitable. There is a place for govt run businesses. My gripe is that they pay too much for them, are arm twisted by unions into paying more for them when times are good yet there are never any cuts when times are bad. They are inefficient but there is a place for them in civilised society. It's all about the cost...

Wed, 10/10/2012 - 13:07 | 2875325 kridkrid
kridkrid's picture

But what about the hundreds of thousands of USPS employees?  Who is  going to feed them?  The question wasn't meant for you, rather the person to whom I was responding.  He took offense to my "fuck him" stance on the psychopath who wrote the letter to his employees... and used as his defense, the 7,000 employee who work for said douche bag.


Wed, 10/10/2012 - 13:42 | 2875454 Harlequin001
Harlequin001's picture

the 7,000 employees are not employed by the govt, and I didn't take offense...

The point is that these douche bags are the people who create jobs, even if they are in industries that you don't like or based on income types that you don't agree with. My point is this, piss these people off and they will take their capital elsewhere, and then who is going to feed you and them?

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