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Guest Post: Martial Arts For Survivalists

Tyler Durden's picture





 

Submitted by Brandon Smith of Alt-Market blog,

Physical strength, endurance, flexibility, adaptability, and mental discipline are all attributes of a true survivor.  Unfortunately, they are also attributes that are often neglected by the average survivalist.  The popular assumption is that if you have sizable food storage and can shoot straight, you are ready to rock-and-roll.  Reality has some harsh lessons for those with this mindset.  The first and most important weapon in any prepper’s arsenal is his own body; strong, healthy, and well taken care of.  If a person’s body is left to decay, no amount of gear is going to save them in the middle of a crisis situation…

Hand-to-hand combat training is sometimes treated with cynicism amongst preppers who have spent all their lives enraptured in the world of firearms.  The common retort is “Why use my hands when I have my Glock…?”  Indeed.  Why should we?  Perhaps because one day we may not have a weapon in our possession during a dangerous circumstance.  Should a survivalist simply give up because he loses his gun or he runs out of ammunition?  I think not.

The concept of survival in the midst of collapse and calamity is not necessarily dependent on having all the right tools at all the right times.  Sometimes, you have to improvise, and the only tools you can always count on are your hands, and your (hopefully well oiled and attuned) brain.  Martial Arts training hones and refines these assets to perfection, and also teaches the mind to deal with the stresses and fears associated with combat.  In fact, 95% of success in martial arts revolves around learning to accept the idea of someone trying to kill you, so that you can move past the terror of the scenario and deal with it calmly and logically.  Adrenaline, tunnel vision, and unchecked emotion are the true enemies in any fight.  We defeat ourselves long before our assailants ever touch us.

Another concept within martial arts that I find fascinating is the philosophy of Bushido, which is often mistaken as a brand of Eastern religion.  Instead, it is a kind of warrior’s code; a way of dealing with adversity in one’s life.  Struggling with obstacles whether self created, or created by others, requires balance and the ability to take control of the problem and apply one’s own terms instead of the terms other people try to set for you.  It is about leading the battle, instead of being led, while staying true to your conscience.  In the end, we should feel no need to prove anything to anyone but ourselves.  Traditional martial arts still contain elements of Bushido within their methodology, and I believe such practitioners are some of the few people left in the world who operate on a legitimate warrior’s code; something we desperately need in our culture today.

I have studied multiple forms of martial arts for over 26 years, and have found many methods that would work well for the worst survival situations, and plenty that would be utterly useless.  When I started my training classes for Liberty Movement individuals and families in Northwest Montana, my idea was to combine all the strategies that I felt were intuitive, easy to learn, and quick to utilize.  My goal was to help students to become physically capable of self defense within a very short period of time, without running slapdash over important factors like mental strength and intelligent application.  I feel that the program has done very well so far.  The following is a list of styles that I use in my curriculum...                      

Shotokan Karate: Shotokan is a Japanese martial art using movements derived from defense methods common in Okinawa and streamlined for easier application.  At first glance, Shotokan seems stiff and impractical, but this is not the case.  Shotokan training is extremely intense, and the sparring matches can be brutal.  Deep stances and sharp strikes train the body to hold ground even against a larger opponent.  Shotokan practitioners can take physical damage unlike any other style I have seen beyond perhaps Thai Kickboxing.  As the student advances, the stiffness disappears, and their strikes become coldly logical and precise, almost like a killer robot…….no….seriously.  Shotokan is a perfect foundation art for beginners in self defense.  If they can handle this style, they can handle anything…

Thai Kickboxing: Thai is world famous for its fast devastating steamroller type strikes and the ability of its practitioners to take a hit and keep on going.  For a crisis situation, it is imperative that the survivalist be capable of absorbing and moving past the pain of a fight.  In the street, it may be a matter of life and death, or it may be a drunken adolescent brawl.  In a SHTF scenario, it will ALWAYS be a matter of life and death.  There is no such thing as a hand to hand fighter who can avoid every attack and come out unscathed.  Plan on getting hit.  With the heavy arm to leg blocks of Thai Kickboxing that act as a kind of self made brick wall, along with devastating leg sweeps and knee breaks, this artform is perfect for the dangerous possibilities of collapse.

Western Boxing: It’s not an Eastern martial art, but Western boxing teaches incredible punching power.  Eastern martial arts focus on speed in order to inflict damage, but the bottom line is that Western boxers hit harder because they assert more body weight behind their punches; I have seen it, I have felt it, and I have dealt it.  Of course, it is more important to learn speed and timing before learning to hit hard.  The most powerful punches in the world are useless if all they do is sweep the air.  Western boxing is an incomplete fighting system, but a fantastic addition to the survival martial artist’s repertoire.

Jiu Jitsu: Jiu Jitsu is a grappling martial art from Japan, though you wouldn’t know it by the way the Brazilians have commercialized and franchised it.  Jiu Jitsu is indeed the flavor of the decade for self defense, and though I feel it has been way overhyped, it is an incredibly effective style for ground situations.  That said, let’s be clear; Jiu Jitsu is actually a very limited fighting style, especially when you’re not in a cage and you are confronted with more than one attacker.  Survivalists should learn grappling techniques so that they know how to defend against takedowns and return to their feet.  In a real combat situation, you NEVER try to go to the ground on purpose.  Multiple opponents will decimate you within seconds while you are trying to put a choke hold on the guy in front of you.  Add a knife into the picture, and purposely jumping into close quarters with the intent to “grapple” will be a death sentence.  Successful fighters will always combine Jiu Jitsu with other artforms in order to round out their abilities. 

Hapkido: Hapkido in my view is the perfect antithesis to Jiu Jitsu and any other grappling art for that matter.  It should be at the top of every survivalist’s list of fighting methods.  Hapkido focuses on joint locks, joint breaks, using centrifugal force, pressure points, eye gouges, throat attacks, etc.  Generally, it is very difficult for someone to grapple with you if you break their fingers, wrists, hyperextend their knee caps, or crush their wind pipe.  One twisted wrist could put a dedicated grappler or wrestler completely out of commission, which is why you never see these methods used in the UFC.  The fights would be over quickly, and the sport's flavor would be lost.  Knowing how to counter grappling using grappling is fine, but knowing how to utterly disable a grappler is better.  As a survivalist, it is important to learn both.

Eskrima / Kali: Filipino in origin, Eskrima and Kali revolve around stick and knife training, and some of the deadliest blade wielding martial artists on Earth are known to originate from these styles.  The point of practicing the Filipino arts is not only to learn to attack with edged weapons, but also to defend against them.  Knowing how armed assailants, trained and untrained, will move to harm you gives you a distinct edge.  Understanding the motion of a knife strike allows the defender to create or close distance effectively, while timing arm and wrist locks to reduce cuts and control the knife hand before serious damage to your body is done.        

Taekwondo: A Korean style, Taekwondo has received a bad rap over the past few years as an “ineffective” martial art, but usually this criticism comes from people who have never actually practiced it.  Like Jiu Jitsu, it is a style limited to a very particular range of attacks and scenarios.  Taekwondo focuses on kicks to the extreme.  Sport Taekwondo is not a practical measure of the style’s use, and this is where its tainted reputation comes from.  The truth is, Taekwondo has the fastest and in many cases the most devastating kicks in the world.  The use of kicks depends on the mastery of the fighter.  If he is fast, and precise, then his strikes will make his opponents feel like they’ve just been hit by an oversized utility van.  If he is slow, and unfocused, he will be tackled to the ground like a rag doll and pummeled in an embarrassing manner.  That said, one well placed kick can crush ribs, crack skulls, and knock an opponent into dreamland before he ever knew what hit him.

Jeet Kune Do: Created by the venerable Bruce Lee, Jeet Kune Do’s philosophy is to adopt what works, and set the rest aside.  It is essentially a combination of the short range tactics of Wing Chun combined with the long range tactics of Japanese and Korean styles.  Jeet Kune Do’s goal is to be a truly complete martial art, and so far, it has proven itself in this regard.  If you can only practice one style of self defense, this should be it.  Some people attribute the adaptation methodology in self defense to MMA, but really, it was Bruce Lee that pioneered the idea of studying multiple styles and modernizing martial arts.  Because of his efforts, the offensive and defensive capabilities of Jeet Kune Do are astounding, and perfect for the survivalist delving into the world of hand-to-hand.

Ninjitsu: When I was a kid back in the 80’s, the ninja was the greatest thing since sliced bread.  I think the allure of it was its simple mythology; if you could learn martial arts, and get your hands on a black mask, you could be a superhero.  No need for radioactive spiders or genetic mutation.  You were a man - in a mask - with badass fists of fury, and that’s it.  Of course, the portrayal of ninjitsu has become so cartoonish that people today scarcely believe it is an actual martial art.  In fact, it is, and a very deadly one.  The brilliance of ninjitsu really dwells in its “think outside the box” mentality.  There is a sort of cleverness and unpredictability to it that makes it so dangerous.  Ninja’s in feudal Japan were assassins, but they were also the guerilla fighters of their age.  The combat methods of ninjitsu revolve around surprise, and misdirection, which are factors that always work in the survivalist’s favor.

There is no way around it.  The Martial Arts make a survivalist better at his job, which is to thrive in the very worst possible conditions.  It’s not just about fighting; it is also about developing a fighting spirit.  Beyond the utility of self defense, as survivalists we must strengthen our inner world as much as our outer shells.  It takes time, and patience, and a willingness to struggle.  Any person who masters a martial art has not only shown a dedication to his own physical prowess, but he has also proven he has a mental toughness that will carry him through any catastrophe.  That kind of toughness is a rare commodity in America today, and when found, should be greatly valued and encouraged, especially by the Liberty Movement.

 


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Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:02 | Link to Comment unrulian
unrulian's picture

i'll stick with guns

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:05 | Link to Comment ACP
ACP's picture

Judo for CQ.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:19 | Link to Comment Bleeding Fart
Bleeding Fart's picture

Survival is not just about an individual's strength or resources. That's a fallacy of people from comfortable,  industrialised countries.

Survival has always been about existing within communities and negotiating/working together against outside forces. Family, friends, and modern day 'tribes' will all be necessary for survival.

The bullet, beans, and bullion blockheads don't get that it isn't just about themselves. No one can survive on their own, or even within a small group. It really does take a village.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:20 | Link to Comment Hugh G Rection
Hugh G Rection's picture

What if your small group shoots the villagers?

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:30 | Link to Comment Bleeding Fart
Bleeding Fart's picture

lol.

What I'm talking about is that in an actual survival situation where people couldn't depend on the gov't,  well organised communities would survive the best.

An individual or small group would just not be able to efficiently produce calories/maintain defense in an a given area over the long term.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:39 | Link to Comment Hugh G Rection
Hugh G Rection's picture

Oh, I got ya.

They better be prepared to face the roaming marauders though..

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:46 | Link to Comment Stackers
Stackers's picture

I'll just use the flying crane kick on em. No defense.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:56 | Link to Comment yabyum
yabyum's picture

Flying crane vs 10 gauge 3" mag double ought in the thorax???? I would rather co-op with you and buy you a cold beer.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:02 | Link to Comment economics9698
economics9698's picture

What he is saying is 100% correct.  You think you are a hard ass until someone challenges you.  Knowing how to kill with your bare hands is essential in street combat.  You must be in at least “adequate” shape.  That means upper body workouts at least three times a week and 45 minute lower body cardio at least three times a week,

I have been in hundreds of confrontations and most people panic.  Very few stay calm and even fewer know how to defuse the situation or end it quickly.  By ending it quickly knocking someone the fuck out fast.

You Zhers better be packing come November 6th, the 85 IQ crowd will be looking for some payback against whitey.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:12 | Link to Comment Thomas
Thomas's picture

3rd Dan (3rd degree blackbelt) in Taekwondo, motherfuckers! For the record, however, I am out of shape, currently unable to fight my way out of a daycare facility without some help.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:46 | Link to Comment tsx500
tsx500's picture

i'm 5th degree tae-bo .... whaddya think about that  ?!

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:54 | Link to Comment economics9698
economics9698's picture

Stay in shape or be prepared to get your ass knocked the fuck out.

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 05:27 | Link to Comment Harlequin001
Harlequin001's picture

and whatever you do, don't get old...

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 11:56 | Link to Comment 710x
710x's picture

Survival is about being in active denial that regardless of what happens you're gonna die eventually.  Focus on living life rather than surviving it.

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 02:09 | Link to Comment Chariots of the Feds
Chariots of the Feds's picture

Kukkiwon?

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 09:46 | Link to Comment Metalredneck
Metalredneck's picture

Shodan in Ryusei Karate.  Learning every day.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:02 | Link to Comment JoeSexPack
JoeSexPack's picture

Wrestling & boxing are among the most commonly successful UFC arts. Brazilian JJ is another.

 

Years ago these debates went forever, but are now settled in the octagon.

 

Thankfully.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:59 | Link to Comment MachoMan
MachoMan's picture

I still think it's hilarious that the gracie family thinks it invented submission wrestling...  it's actually a simple derivative of greco-roman/olympic wrestling (there used to be submissions btw)...  that was offshored to japan...  and eventually to brazil...  it's also the same reason why a catch wrestler (more pure derivative of wrestling) decimated the gracie family...

It's also strange to think that the UFC started as a shameless and staged promotional attempt by the family...  it certainly succeeded, but I'm happy it actually evolved into a sport.

Don't get me wrong, bjj has its place...  but let's call it like it is.

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 03:15 | Link to Comment Atlas Shrieked
Atlas Shrieked's picture

You make it sound like BJJ is worthless.  Fact is, almost every MMA fighter has incorporated BJJ into his repertoire--because it works.  Olympic wrestlers are the best in the world, but until they learn BJJ, their submissions are limited--because the sport disallows it.  And BJJ extends beyond the Gracie family--some of the best MMA fighters train under Cesar Gracie, possibly the worst of the clan, as he started much later than his relatives, and received his black belt much later also.

Because a skinny Royce could beat guys much bigger and stronger, only prove the art's merit.  Helio did the same 80 years ago.  Now that everybody trains in it, the game has been elevated, and physical advantages have emerged.  But for the average person with limited athleticism, strength, speed, and agility, BJJ is a good foundation.

Having said that, Rickson Gracie, the best of his generation, would even admit that when encountered with an attacker with a knife, the best defense is to run, because you have to assume the attacker knows what he's doing.  All else being equal, the knife wins every time (with acknowledgement that all things are not always equal).

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 07:40 | Link to Comment I am a Man I am...
I am a Man I am Forty's picture

Rickson is full of himself and needs to get in a ring/cage more often to back up what he says.  His dad even called bullshit on him.  Jon Bones Jones, Anderson Silva, and Georges St. Pierre would whip him.  He probably couldn't take BJ Penn.  

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 10:00 | Link to Comment MachoMan
MachoMan's picture

BJJ is not worthless...  the issue is that people (including the gracies) conveniently discard its heritage.  The simple fact is that they did not create it.  The vast majority of its maneuvers are simply the direct descendants of catch wrestling, a dead art (due in large part to the secretive and "club" nature of its practitioners)...  which was a direct descendant of "real" greek wrestling (it's only been a couple of centuries that there are holds barred).  By virtue of the fact that there are few real catch wrestlers left alive, the lie can be perpetrated.

The simple fact is that BJJ is more about sport submissions and primarily directed towards sport grappling.  This is why it is more directed at the MMA practitioner...  not necessarily because it is the premiere fighting style.

I have one word for you though...  sakuraba.  Look up his fight record (opponents) and trainer and then go from there.

BJJ works...  for sure...  but it also primarily only works against tired opponents or opponents that have not been trained in submissions.  You do not win fights on your back from the guard...  sorry.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:56 | Link to Comment Manthong
Manthong's picture

I suggest a daily workout  that includes performing 10 reps of the 16 count manual of arms..

with an M82A1.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 22:12 | Link to Comment Harbanger
Harbanger's picture

No defense when I'm holding your leg and squeezing your nuts.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:29 | Link to Comment Hulk
Hulk's picture

As long as you are a woman, that is perfectly legal !

and tons of fun !!!

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 08:18 | Link to Comment Metalredneck
Metalredneck's picture

You better be fast.  If you telegraph that one, anybody with any talent will pluck you out of the air.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 22:00 | Link to Comment Harbanger
Harbanger's picture

Sand bags, barbed wire and traps will build you a quick fortress to keep all marauders at bay.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 22:10 | Link to Comment Hugh G Rection
Hugh G Rection's picture

Don't forget to shit on the punji sticks, so if they hobble away they can die of infection.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 22:49 | Link to Comment JoeSexPack
JoeSexPack's picture

File bullets to get rusty, for tetnus & septicemia.

 

Fill hollow points with cyanide...or feces.

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 00:38 | Link to Comment delacroix
delacroix's picture

mercury

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 15:07 | Link to Comment unrulian
unrulian's picture

lead doesnt rust, i think you caught something playing with your shit

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 03:04 | Link to Comment Atlas Shrieked
Atlas Shrieked's picture

You're naively aassuming social order is maintained in the event of economic collapse--good luck with that.  Greece and Spain are precursors--and mild ones at that.  I generally agree with this article--even when equipped with a firearm, an onrushing attacker within a 30 foot radius with a knife wins almost every time,  A master in the filipino sticks and knife arts can kill you 12 times--in 1 second.  Think two attacks on each carotid, wrist, and ankle.

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 03:17 | Link to Comment Ghordius
Ghordius's picture

Greece and Spain? Don't see why they should be considered valid examples for your argument. Perhaps you are misreading the fundamentally different (from the US) way protesters/demonstrators and the police behave, here in europe.

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 03:53 | Link to Comment Atlas Shrieked
Atlas Shrieked's picture

I'm not comparing HOW Greeks and Spaniards riot and protest vs. how Americans would.  What I'm saying is when an economy collapes, people take it to the streets.  I'm not even sure what would finally cause Americans to really take it to the streets--the Occupy movement gave some hints.  But I don't think it would get really ugly until they start confiscating or nationalizing retirement funds and and pensions.  Or worse, if hyperinflation kicks in and shelves are emptied.

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 08:09 | Link to Comment dolly madison
dolly madison's picture

No one can survive on their own, or even within a small group. It really does take a village.

 

I think saying no one here is a stretch.  History shows us that some can do it, like the mountain men in the old west.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:35 | Link to Comment CPL
CPL's picture

Yeah you are missing Judo.  Using an opponents strength against them, locks, flips, pins, takedowns, nerve shots, damage mitigation, rolls, tumbles fits well with Kendo and Bo training.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:39 | Link to Comment Gully Foyle
Gully Foyle's picture

CPL

Silat.

Aikido

And Systema looks very interesting.


Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:45 | Link to Comment Harbanger
Harbanger's picture

MCMAP training is all I'll ever need.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 22:07 | Link to Comment Tijuana Donkey Show
Tijuana Donkey Show's picture

Uh, Krav Maga? Only the deadliest martial art, period. Works with guns, knives, and everything inbetween. These are all good, but only Krav is battle tested by the IDF everyday. Ask any major law/military/bodyguard, and they will tell you Krav. It blends it all in, cardio, hand to hand, and gun/knife excapes. The reason there is not competitiion Krav is that it's just to rough if you throw it at full power. 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Krav_Maga

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xhKjpdWyYMc

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 22:15 | Link to Comment vast-dom
vast-dom's picture

i doubt it re: krav. there is not a single UFC fighter implementing it with any success, and that's for a reason. and please don't tell me there are no guns and knives in UFC and that's why krav isn't used or that it's just toO rough. 

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 22:27 | Link to Comment jonjon831983
jonjon831983's picture

Krav or whatever other combat system, don't bother comparing UFC fights to real life fighting.  Participants may be true martial artists, but they are fighting in a specific "safe" scenario.

 

In the "cage" you have:

 

A referee to stop the fight if something goes wrong

1 v 1 only

Specific rules of engagement like you can't tear a guy's balls off or gouge eyes or bite their nose off

A coach on hand to give tips on what to do next

Breaks between rounds for water and strategy talk.

 

Real fights do not have those... you go in and get out with minimal damage to yourself and maximum to the other (s).

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 22:32 | Link to Comment fnord88
fnord88's picture

ALmost everything i learned in Krav is against the rules in UFC. Throat strikes, groin strikes and eye gouging.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 22:39 | Link to Comment alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

"Throat strikes, groin strikes and eye gouging" are what you do when you CAN'T fight!

It sounds like womens self defense against a rapist. The only thing you're missing is "vomiting on them to deter an erection".

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 22:47 | Link to Comment jonjon831983
jonjon831983's picture

alien-IQ, you're confusing sport with life and death fighting.

The one who doesn't add these to their repetoire and can't get over the squeamish nature of this will likely lose... and lose big.

 

For sparring with a friend or a competition of course you wouldn't pull something dirty like that.

For fighting somebody attacking you suddenly say in the darkness, and you have nowhere to run, you do what you have to do to GTFO alive.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:05 | Link to Comment Calmyourself
Calmyourself's picture

Alien here has never been in a "fight" Oh sure his sister and him have swung some pillows until someone got a bloody nose and Mom stepped in..  A real fight; any thing you can get your hands on is a weapon ANY hurt you can inflict thats a real fight princess..   Real men bite and kick and gouge and do anything to win.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:12 | Link to Comment alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

yep. that's it. of course. you got me. i'm exposed. oh the shame.

my sheltered privileged life laid bare for all to see.

i just want to scratch your eyes out now and call my lawyer to sue you for mental anguish.

LOL!!!! you fuckin dunce.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:25 | Link to Comment Flagit
Flagit's picture

actually dude, you are comming across as quite the douche. about the time you are spitting teeth, you will gladly bite with whatever you have left.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:41 | Link to Comment Calmyourself
Calmyourself's picture

"Throat strikes, groin strikes and eye gouging" are what you do when you CAN'T fight!"

Yeah, you would last like ten seconds, you best buy a gun and never leave home without it.. Methinks thou dost protest too much, say hi to your sis, she really bloomed...

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:44 | Link to Comment alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

yep...you got me again. damn. i'm gonna cry now.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:52 | Link to Comment Calmyourself
Calmyourself's picture

Are you 12?  I better leave you alone you sound like you may just cry, I'm sorry.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:06 | Link to Comment alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

No. I am not confusing one with the other. You are. You seem to be under the delusional impression that because a man can fight with rules that keep him from killing someone makes him incapable of killing someone when those rules are removed.

It's fine and dandy that they have told you to kick someone in the balls and try to scratch out their eyes, that plan is gonna work just great, until you get punched in the face, have your arm broken and get choked to death by someone who actually knows how to fight.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:21 | Link to Comment fnord88
fnord88's picture

ever been punched in the head in a proper fight? In my experience, when your adrenaline is up, is doesnt hurt as much as you might expect. Plus lots of little bones in the hands which break real easy, which is why no martial art uses closed fists. Someone takes a big swing at you and you drop your head to catch in on your skull.....well the skull is orders of magnitude stronger than any of the bones in the hand.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:24 | Link to Comment alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

this conversation is futile.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:26 | Link to Comment fnord88
fnord88's picture

in the real world you don't get to tap out.....

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:22 | Link to Comment Clashfan
Clashfan's picture

Whatever. Where are the tough guy heros or tactics that are going to save us all from this?

http://www.infowars.com/ground-under-fukushima-unit-4-sinking-structure-...

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:58 | Link to Comment Calmyourself
Calmyourself's picture

That is a macro concern but a fairly stupid non sequitar..

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 02:23 | Link to Comment Clashfan
Clashfan's picture

Stupid? You mean non sequitur, right?

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 10:35 | Link to Comment Calmyourself
Calmyourself's picture

Grammar nazis: when you have nothing there is always spelling to pull your confused nuts out of the fire..  No one called you stupid but after this, perhaps you should don the mantle..

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:26 | Link to Comment Flagit
Flagit's picture

i stand corrected, you are comming across as a douche, because you are.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 22:53 | Link to Comment Overfed
Overfed's picture

If you are fighting fair, your tactics suck.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:19 | Link to Comment alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

no. you are missing the point. the kind of thing they are talking about is not "learning to fight", it's what you do if you CAN'T.

There's a difference. A BIG FUCKING DIFFERENCE. That kind of bullshit will work just fine on women and children, the typical IDF challenge. But try that shit with someone who knows how to handle themselves and you are in for a very humbling and painful experience.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:28 | Link to Comment Flagit
Flagit's picture

its a last resort shithead, not the first line of defense.

and your choke wont mean shit with my teeth buried 2 inched in your arm.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:42 | Link to Comment alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

if you believe that...then you have no fucking clue as to how to choke somebody.

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 00:52 | Link to Comment UGrev
UGrev's picture

WIN!! I've never been bitten while executing a proper choke. 

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:46 | Link to Comment Calmyourself
Calmyourself's picture

Ole Alien here gives himself away up top, internet tough guys.  He does not understand some us know the accepted methods and are just as happy to stick a ballpoint pen in your eye while breaking your thumb.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:34 | Link to Comment fnord88
fnord88's picture

all i can go on is my own experience, and having done MMA and Krav, in the real world, Krav is much more useful. MMA certainly didnt teach me any knife, stick or gun defence. 

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:50 | Link to Comment alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

you are free to make that claim...but it is simply not credible.

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 00:11 | Link to Comment fnord88
fnord88's picture

i'm not saying Krav is better against a skilled opponent. If you have ever gone up against somebody who is good at Thai kickbocking, they are fucking unstoppable. I'm saying Krav is more useful. 100 hrs Krav training is better than 100 hours of Thai, in most situations. Most situations you are not fighting somebody with any skills, because most people with skills dont go around starting fights; a) because they are, in my experience, usually not macho wankers, and b) if you actually hurt somebody you get in a shit load of trouble with the law, even if they started it ( in Australia anyways, not sure about the US).

You haven't said where you get your info from alien? Have you done any? Like i said, all my opinions are based on my experience, feel free believe whatever you want to believe. 

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 01:29 | Link to Comment Boondocker
Boondocker's picture

the object is to win.  i have done all of those and more to make sure i went home.   the is no such thing as a fair fight.

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 10:36 | Link to Comment fattail
fattail's picture

i like the us army training manual for hand to hand combat.  good basic foundation and has been through the proving ground of real combat.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 22:32 | Link to Comment alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

If you don;t think MMA fighters are capable of being far more lethal outside the ring than they are inside the ring, then you are just batshit crazy.

Those "rules" and "safe" environment is the ONLY thing that keeps it from being a fight to the death.

Those guys are fucking terrifying.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 22:48 | Link to Comment fnord88
fnord88's picture

fighting with rules and a safe environment conditions you. If you never have to defend yourself from somebody taking both your balls and squeezing till they are crushed, then you wont think about it in a real fight. BJJ is useless for this reason, either their eyes or thier balls are almost always within range of one of your hands.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 22:59 | Link to Comment JoeSexPack
JoeSexPack's picture

Krav fighters have never competed that way either, or they'd lose eyes, balls & fingers.

 

Krav was designed to build confidence in Israeli soldiers, who carry machine guns.

 

Got that? They never use Krav, because they shoot first.

 

But, the Zionist media brainwashing has suspended reality for most Krav wanna-be's.

 

Go take it to an anything-goes MMA event, like in the early days of UFC, & see what happens.

 

Never was a Krav champ.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:12 | Link to Comment fnord88
fnord88's picture

Bullshit. Throat strikes and eye gouging have been against the rules in UFC since inception. For good reason, it is not that hard to kill somebody with by crushing their trachea.

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 12:32 | Link to Comment Overfed
Overfed's picture

In the early days of UFC, the only thing not allowed was biting and eye-gouging. Groin shots were allowed, as were throat strikes. The only reason one ever got killed is that these guys know what they're doing when it comes to defending themselves and having a ref to stop the fight if one man were rendered helpless. The new rules came along so that they could be sanctioned to hold events in the US.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:27 | Link to Comment vast-dom
vast-dom's picture

precisely AlienIQ -- that's why not one UFC fighter of any stature fucks around with Kra. on the other hand, the Russian fight style of Samba, which blends several styles together and also teaches LETHAL strikes (which btw are as easy to pull off as your average strike, which means if you know how to strike well you can do a quick disabling chop wherever) was employed by some rather successful MMA fighters. 

in the end it really doesn't matter which style you practise in everyday life -- the key is to maintain reflexes and muscle memory and be in shape -- when someone moves at you fast you instinctively move and strike/deflect/kill/etc.

the nice thing about modern MMA training is that it incorporates many styles so comparing is futile -- you run up against a decent MMA fighter and you are in all sorts of trouble and fast.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:40 | Link to Comment alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

That's what some of these guys can't (or refuse) to accept. Krav is a shortcut for those who do NOT now how to defend themselves. But it is useless against someone who can defend themselves.

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 00:02 | Link to Comment MachoMan
MachoMan's picture

Bingo.

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 03:28 | Link to Comment Atlas Shrieked
Atlas Shrieked's picture

Agreed.  What some of you are not accounting for is that a few Krav schools have BJJ instructors, either as guests or permanent.

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 06:07 | Link to Comment Urban Redneck
Urban Redneck's picture

The experience of getting your ass kicked by some old geezer who doesn't even break a sweat in the process is a valuable reminder of humility.

However, even when I am fat and out of both shape and practice, 90% of potential opponents aren't concerning because of the foundation and experience.

When talking of "survival" scenarios generally, there is definitely a point of diminishing return on investment of time, especially compared to the opportunity costs of forgone knowledge and experience in fields other than hand to hand combat (medicine, machining, agronomy, or even firearms and small group infantry tactics).

Balance is key to survival, individually and collectively.

The sharpest knife in my drawer and most precise high powered rifle in my arsenal both have very legitimate uses, but they are rarely employed.

But if all you have is a hammer...

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:37 | Link to Comment Flagit
Flagit's picture

you could not be more correct. i just dont understand why you have such a problem with basic defense tactics. my guess is 60-70% of the population cannot fight. the average person can run 2 blocks before they are out of breath. even fewer know HOW to throw a punch without breaking your hand.

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 00:12 | Link to Comment alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

While what you say may be in large part correct, it is simply not the case in the environment I grew up in. I've seen a lot of violence. I've been on the receiving end, I've been on the giving end. I want no part of either any more.

All this Krav bullshit being spouted is just that: Bullshit. It's what we (where I grew up) taught our little sisters to do in a bad situation. It works just fine when it's coming from a girl that catches you off guard, but that shit just don't fly when you are face to face and man to man with someone with designs on fucking you up.

I have no plans to stick around any place that requires me to get primitive again. If I see that coming, I'd just leave. All this posturing here is just that: Posturing. Most people talking tough have never been clocked for real. I've been knocked out twice. It sucks. And I've had someone elses blood on my hands...that socks also...perhaps more than being knocked out.

Anybody talking about violence and saying "bring it on" is one of two things: A sociopath or a liar.

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 01:00 | Link to Comment UGrev
UGrev's picture

I'm thinking the "bullshit" part is probably becuase you've seen bullshit practioners. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5hXjr_7bSdg&feature=relmfu

I haven't studied Krav physically. I have researched it, and I've found it interesting, but nothing new to the world of someone who's studied several different styles over 20 + years and has a good toolset for handling himself in controlled and uncontrolled env's. 

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 15:09 | Link to Comment unrulian
unrulian's picture

yes an octagon is safe...you'd last about 2 seconds against a ufc fighter in a back alley you moron

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 01:15 | Link to Comment MrTouchdown
MrTouchdown's picture

I practice Krav Maga. We can't spar with each other without special equipment because the techniques we use cause too much damage to too sensitive of places. For example, I can fracture your hip with a groin kick. It's one of the most basic moves we do - and I can end an entire fight with it. I don't care how tough you are, after I've exploded your testicles and fractured your hip, you aren't going to be able to fight anymore. 

 

In the UFC, what happens when someone gets tagged in the groin? They stop the fight for a few minutes to let him recover. These are very tough men, and even they need a moment to recover after just one hit.

 

Now, with that in mind - the first groin kick (of many) is just a common opening for Krav Maga. It 'softens' the target up before we do the other things we do, like break fingers, hands, arms, nose, jaw, orbital sockets, spine at the base of the skull, ribs, and the back of the skull. A UFC fighter would leave you unable to see or eat solid food. A Krav Maga practitioner would leave you either dead, or never able to walk again.

 

Add to that the consideration that we also train to go up against people weilding long arms, pistols, knives, clubs, whatever. And also fighting multiple people at once. Multiple ARMED people. We also train on how to properly use long arms, pistols, knives etc. So after I've destroyed attacker A and taken his weapon, I can use it on all of his buddies too.

 

Just because Krav Maga isn't suited for sport doesn't mean it isn't something worthwhile for a survivalist to consider.

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 03:39 | Link to Comment Atlas Shrieked
Atlas Shrieked's picture

of course Krav is useful and practical for the average person in self-defense.

But in the early UFC days, there were top Krav guys who competed and did well, but they didn't win championships because while a kick in the groin is lethally effective, good luck on pulling it off against someone who knows what he is doing.  You are wrong on the early days of the UFC:; kicks and punches to the groin were absolutely allowed.

ANY martial is going to be effective over nothing, but sone are more effective than others, and under different circumstances.

At the end of the day, the art is less important than the man or woman.  From my biased perspective, between Muy thai, BJJ, and one of the fiipino knife martial arts, a person would do well in self-defense.  I enjoyed judo the most and dabbled in other arts, but the three above and the ability to shoot straight are as good as it gets.

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 08:22 | Link to Comment I am a Man I am...
I am a Man I am Forty's picture

Moti got whooped up on by wrestlers in the UFC.  Things are more difficult when you don't hand someone your arm or stand there still with your legs spread.  Your fighting technique should still be solid even if you can't grab a finger and break it, strike someone's throat, or gouge eyes.

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 08:21 | Link to Comment Metalredneck
Metalredneck's picture

UFC is a game for money.  Nobody punches the throat or uses real pressure points.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 22:26 | Link to Comment alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

Krav Maga summarized:

1) Kick them in the balls when they ain't looking.

2) Take their wallet.

3) Run.

That's the Israeli idea of self defense. So fuckin classy.

 

Battle tested every day by the IDF? Yes...against Palestinian women and children. Not really much of a challenge is that?

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:25 | Link to Comment Hugh G Rection
Hugh G Rection's picture

The dirty Zionist pigs also teach a lot of biting techniques... that is, when they aren't dropping white phosphorous on civilians, running over activists with bulldozers, and center punching 5 year old children with .308 rounds paid for by the American tax payer.

 

Have I mentioned how much Israel needs to go fuck itself?  For any Zio filth that may happen to glance at this, please listen to former director of studies at the US Army war college, Dr. Alan Sabrosky..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kVKGRB3cygg

 

For anyone that hasn't heard about Mossad involvement in the 9/11 attacks, please read the FBI report "Dancing Israelis", listen to the NYPD transmission of the 2 Israelis getting arrested after fleeing a truck on King St. near the towers, which subsequently exploded.  Look for tv reports from 9/11 about the 2 other Israelis arrested near the GW bridge with yet another van loaded with explosives.

 

In my Country there is problem...

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 03:21 | Link to Comment Atlas Shrieked
Atlas Shrieked's picture

any martial art is better than nothing, and judo is certainly more fun, but it is a sport version of jujitsu, and watered down in terms of lethal capability.  The masters certainly know the lethal aspect of it.  BJJ is again even more adaptable to streetfighting.  Speaking of JKD, Richard Bustillo and Dan Inosanto, both Bruce Lee disciples, are now black belts in BJJ also.  Why?  Because their students were getting their asses kicked by the Gracies, so they incorporated BJJ into JKD.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 22:14 | Link to Comment vast-dom
vast-dom's picture

guns and training. 

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:08 | Link to Comment Jam Akin
Jam Akin's picture

Agreed, practice the art of Chi-Ching.  Staying in decent shape is important also.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:40 | Link to Comment juangrande
juangrande's picture

You mean Chi-Quong? Or is Chi-ching the sound of buying your defense?

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 00:16 | Link to Comment Jam Akin
Jam Akin's picture

Chi-ching is the sound of the action on a quality semi-auto firearm.

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 01:20 | Link to Comment Simon Endean
Simon Endean's picture

"Judo for CQ."

 

Nah, go with LINE.  When the USMC abandons a fighting style for being "too lethal," it's worth knowing.

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 09:47 | Link to Comment Jethro
Jethro's picture

That was replaced with MCMAP.  While LINE was fun, it was also a bit retarded.  A couple if the joint locks are from Daito Ryu Aiki-Jiu-jitsu/Hapkido.  Marines would rather blow shit up/shoot people than to tie up with them.  I'm qualifying my statement as a prior 0351 and MSG (Embassy Guard).

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 08:48 | Link to Comment sessinpo
sessinpo's picture

I agree. My approach as is this. Cooperative assitance with those that accept help and will help. Guns for long and short distances. And I've taken judo for face to face combat.

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 09:42 | Link to Comment Jethro
Jethro's picture

Agree with ACP.  Find a good judo school.  It's generally relatively inexpensive, and you learn how to take falls (which will benefit you for the rest of your life).  Judo can also be fairly gruelling.  And, to my knowledge, no other style of martial art comes anywhere close to it's efficiency in transitioning from standing to ground.  Wrestling comes close, but very few people are proficient with leg picks, and you can prevent single and double leg takedowns with slower opponents with jabs/uppercuts.

If you go to any martial arts school and see a kid below 15 or 16 with a black belt....run out the door.  It's a Bullshido academy, and they pay for belts.  You won't see any judo schools with young kids as black belts.  It's bad to not know how to defend yourself, but it's worse to promote a false sense of achievement/self-secutity.

Judo and Brazialian Jiu-jitsu are two sides of the same coin.  Jigaro Kano compiled several forms of jiu-jitsu from all over Japan and weeded out was inefficient.  This was done through sparring, open matches and challenges.  The early version of judo had a significant amount of newaza (ground technique), and Kosen Judo kept it while sport judo gradually went to mostly stand-up.  Jigiro Kano sent his best students around the world to fight all challengers, and one of them went to Brasil.  The judo in Brasil went the opposite direction and eventually developed into Brazialian Jiu-jitsu.

My background was Judo for a couple of years as a kid, then Choy Li Fut, (LINE in the USMC---almost ashamed to admit that one), then Diato Ryu Aiki-jujitsu, escrima, a little JKD Concepts and now BJJ and boxing.  What I've found out over the years roughly validates what the author states.  If you don't train to fight, really fight....then the martial arts school has minimal utility.  Half of your class should be spent sparring, every time.  Not point sparring.   Real sparring.

I've been rolling with a training knife in BJJ pratice every now and then, and it is as if grappling was made for knife use.  It doesn't matter what position you're in, there are targets everywhere, and if you can deploy your blade, it's over for your opponent.  You'd just have to tie them up until they bleed out.  And, if there are multiple opponents and you do go to the ground (and you have a knife), you aren't necessarily at a huge disadvantage if you can target debilitating areas on your primary opponent, and then engage the next.  Also, many standing joint locks just simply don't work on the ground because there is a lack of position/leverage....I tried desperately to use them when I first started BJJ.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:05 | Link to Comment Hugh G Rection
Hugh G Rection's picture

Yea, waste of time

In a survival situation you're not going to want to get close to anyone unfamiliar... unless she's offering a half and half for a silver fractional.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:11 | Link to Comment ACP
ACP's picture

Ammunition weighs a hell of a lot, unless you have an "unlimited ammo" cheat code...

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:14 | Link to Comment Hugh G Rection
Hugh G Rection's picture

My tac vest holds 15 loaded AR mags, and 6 loaded Glock 32rd mags for my 17L.  It's humping the silver that will be a bitch.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:18 | Link to Comment HD
HD's picture

Honest question -

  Would you really trust your life to a AR-15? I don't own one, but the few I shot down through years would jam easily and often.

I trust my 870 99-9%...

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:24 | Link to Comment Hugh G Rection
Hugh G Rection's picture

I would.  I have had AR's with really tight tolerances that don't cycle well when dirty.  Sold them off and only left with an SP1 that never fails to feed.

Shotguns are great, but shit past 40 yards.  If it's the wild west I don't want to get closer than 200 yards with anyone.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:37 | Link to Comment HD
HD's picture

I had the same experience with 9mm. Ran through a few before falling in love with my Xdm. Thousands of rounds and not once has it jammed.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:43 | Link to Comment Hugh G Rection
Hugh G Rection's picture

If anyone hasn't bought a pistol yet, XDMs are a great choice.

I love my XDM 9 and .45.  They are both ridiculously accurate and mag capacity is great (19 for the 9, 13 for the .45).  The only drawback I found was the trigger reset is a little longer than i'm used to.

 

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:55 | Link to Comment HD
HD's picture

"If anyone hasn't bought a pistol yet, XDMs are a great choice."

Agree 100%. Anyone new to firearms will be instantly spoiled.

I keep looking for an excuse to get a 5 inch .45 - I don't "need" it - and in a home invasion situation I know I would grab the 870, but one of these days I gonna break the piggy bank and get one.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 22:13 | Link to Comment Hugh G Rection
Hugh G Rection's picture

I thought it was all hype until I took my first Springfield XDM to the range.

 

$700 with factory nites, plus the hard case with all the extra goodies.  Don't want to sound like an infomercial but ya, great guns!

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 10:24 | Link to Comment Chaos_Theory
Chaos_Theory's picture

Just bought an XDM 40 compact during a weekend sale (20% off).  Nice gun.  I like the ease of field stripping.

RE 870s...doesn't a rifled slug barrel push the range beyond 50m?  I've popped targets with nothing but a holographic sight and a slug barrel at 100 with 6-inch groups (not great, but big ass holes).

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:42 | Link to Comment Money Squid
Money Squid's picture

"Shotguns are great, but shit past 40 yards."    Slugz !

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:45 | Link to Comment Hugh G Rection
Hugh G Rection's picture

Good luck with those slugs at distance against someone proned out sending bursts of .223.

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 01:13 | Link to Comment Money Squid
Money Squid's picture

spay and pray is desperation or retardation. If you do not know your weapon, what it is capable of, and are not prepared, no amount of 223 is going to help. There are many type of slugs, loads, shell sizes, barrels and gun types. I once thought a shotty was only for close range, that was because I did not know what I was talking about either. Then I met some folks that had real experiece. If you think distance is critical then why are you wasting time with a 223? There's a reason the Army brought the M14 out of storage for Afghanistan. Look into it.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:59 | Link to Comment americanspirit
americanspirit's picture

Hi Huge - actually the closer the better. 10 yards is perfect. I can rack and fire my 870 fast enough to deal with just about any number of assholes coming at me, and as far as I'm concerned, let them come. Of course I also have a few other weapons but I think the 870 will do just fine. BTW I have quite a few pre-planned firing positions figured out depending on the direction(s) of the attackers. Ammo at all these positions - weaterproofed and accessible. I don't want to kill them at a distance - I want to see the gore.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 22:17 | Link to Comment Hugh G Rection
Hugh G Rection's picture

Ya, i was saying you don't want to be at distance with a shotgun.  In close you can't beat a shotgun.

 

Sounds like you're talking about home defense.. make sure to bottleneck them someplace with linoleum or tile floors.  The mrs. won't like the gore so much.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 22:13 | Link to Comment 1100-TACTICAL-12
1100-TACTICAL-12's picture

SKS & 40 cal hi point cheap & effective.. If you make it through round 1 there will be plenty of high dollar hardware layin around....

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 22:29 | Link to Comment centerline
centerline's picture

Thanks my poor-man plan!

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 22:52 | Link to Comment TSA gropee
TSA gropee's picture

The only thing cheap firearms like Hi Point, Jiminez and the rest are good for is when it comes time for confiscation. "Here swat guy, please take my contribution to the confiscation. My prized Hi Point and long barreled 870."... sarc/off

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:40 | Link to Comment Flagit
Flagit's picture

yea, but whut you got for drones?:

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:34 | Link to Comment ACP
ACP's picture

Keep it clean and use plastic magazines. The metal ones are for shit because they deform.

Edit: And I totally agree with the above comment. Don't get close to anyone. Not just to avoid confrontation, but to avoid disease. If you're spotted, leave "presents."

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:38 | Link to Comment DanDaley
DanDaley's picture

Like my drill instructor said, you clean your rifle and you clean the hairy parts of your body...in that order. 

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:46 | Link to Comment TSA gropee
TSA gropee's picture

Plenty of reliability upgrades and now self defense ammo for the AR platform make it the choice for all around defense and offense. Heavy duty charging handle, nickel boron coated bolt carrier group/hammer and on and on. There's a reason so many law enforcement use them. Yeah, use cheap or steel ammo and it's probably going to jam.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 22:05 | Link to Comment CoolBeans
CoolBeans's picture

Thus far, no trouble here.  Well, before that boating accident where we lost all of 'em.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 22:56 | Link to Comment Overfed
Overfed's picture

I trust my AR. Works all the time. I do have an AK for backup, just in case. But I'm far, far more effective with the AR.

Well, that was all before the boating accident, now I'm defenseless.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:18 | Link to Comment aerojet
aerojet's picture

I have fired tens of thousands of rounds out of AR-15s.  The only stoppages I have had were once because I failed to full-lenght resize some brass I reloaded, and once because of some really crappy magazines.  The carbines are less reliable than an 18" or 20"--the shorter gas tube and shorter buffer are the reason.  A 20" heavy barrel AR with the original gas system (no fancy pistons or anything) is a very damn reliable semi-auto rifle.  The only thing more reliable is a bolt action.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:27 | Link to Comment ACP
ACP's picture

Very true.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:06 | Link to Comment JPM Hater001
JPM Hater001's picture

Silly.  What happens if they get in before you reach the gun.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:11 | Link to Comment Hugh G Rection
Hugh G Rection's picture

Edged weapons.

jab, grab, stab.

If you cant get your knife, chop throat, gouge eyes, and/or twist balls.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:23 | Link to Comment A Lunatic
A Lunatic's picture

If you cant get your knife, chop throat, gouge eyes, and/or twist balls.

 

Not your own.............

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:43 | Link to Comment Gully Foyle
Gully Foyle's picture

Hugh G Rection

Break the opponents foundation.

Seal the vein, seal the breath.

Use what is near, what is at hand.

Everyone trains for a weapon and they tend to become confused without that weapon.

Walk around your house and pick shit at random, no matter how nonthreatening.

Learn to use those.

In the end a weapon is only an extension of the body which is an extension of the mind.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:44 | Link to Comment Flagit
Flagit's picture

haha, watch bas ruttens bar fighting techniques video!!!

"take this napkin, fold like so, now you have a KNIFE!!"

Thu, 10/18/2012 - 00:28 | Link to Comment Demologos
Demologos's picture

Our house rule when buying something non-essential is that it should also be useful for thowing at a burgler, as in heavy and/or sharp.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:00 | Link to Comment Jugdish
Jugdish's picture

Yes. And do not forget to also shit yourself during ground attacks. Shitting self also works during DUI checks and/or DHS checkpoints that will soon be common. Nobody wants to deal with an individual who has shit himself.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:17 | Link to Comment Hugh G Rection
Hugh G Rection's picture

Unless they have a doo doo fetish, then things will get real interesting!

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:16 | Link to Comment mjollnir
mjollnir's picture

Get a simuniton or airsoft pistol and see how easy it is to be disarmed by someone or have someone get the jump on you before you can draw. Look up shivworks training or any other force on force class on youtube. You need to integrate hand to hand, ground fighting, and shooting skills and be able to perform under stress. It's not easy.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:44 | Link to Comment Gully Foyle
Gully Foyle's picture

mjollnir

Groundfighting ties you up controlling an opponent.

Aikido and Bagua throw the opponent away, as will good Tai Chi.


Wed, 10/17/2012 - 22:08 | Link to Comment mjollnir
mjollnir's picture

Yes, however since most fights go to the ground you statistically may find yourself there. I'd prefer not to be there but all it took was being taken down by a larger opponent and being stuck there with a forearm in my neck to realize I had better at least learn the fundamentals of ground fighting. Add a knife or a pistol to that situation and it's bad news unless you know how to use bicep or wrist ties on them to keep them from shooting/stabbing you or taking your gun.

Someone looking to kill/hurt you isn't interested in getting into a battle of martial arts skills. They won't assume a stance and slowly approach you as though you're sparring or make their intentions known ahead of time. They'll use deception, distract you with words, or set you up with an accomplice. Before you know it you can end up on the ground with your bell rung by a bottle or pipe.

I used to be one of those "I don't want to be rolling around with someone on asphalt" guys. I figured 15+ years of karate, good situational awareness, and being good with a pistol would be just fine. That all went out the window when I put on the full pads went at it full force in street clothes on the hard ground. Every once in a while people should train in a non consensual and competitive manner where your training partner doesn't hold back or let you perform whatever it is you're trying to do. 

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 22:50 | Link to Comment seataka
seataka's picture

Skydiving (until it no longer scares you to be a dead man unless you do something, with 12 seconds before impact at 150 mph) helps with 'able to perform under stress'

 

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 23:10 | Link to Comment mjollnir
mjollnir's picture

That would do it!

People completely underestimate the physiological effects of the stress of combat on the body when things are for real and someone is really trying to take you out. Tunnel vision, auditory exclusion, adrenaline and cortisol levels spike, and fight or flight kicks in. Some people freeze, hands shake, and others might even shit themselves.

You revert to the level of your mental and physical training. I prefer simple real world techniques that can be performed under stress and save the complicated moves and metaphysical bullshit for the dojo.

 

 

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:19 | Link to Comment Shizzmoney
Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:20 | Link to Comment A Lunatic
A Lunatic's picture

I'll stick to kicking someone's ass at 200 yards.............

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:29 | Link to Comment Hugh G Rection
Hugh G Rection's picture

Someone on here once suggested wearing a haz mat suit.. forget who.

Brilliant way to keep people at a distance.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:46 | Link to Comment Money Squid
Money Squid's picture

"Someone on here once suggested wearing a haz mat suit.. forget who."

You mean a biohazard suit with a giant biohazard symbol on it. Also, rub some dark mud on the butt side so it looks like you took a load in it. That will keep everyone away who does not know what the biohazard warning symbol means.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 22:02 | Link to Comment CoolBeans
CoolBeans's picture

I just pictured that and cranked up as I tried to explain to my family why tears were rolling down my face.  Hysterical mind picture.  Thanks for that.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:29 | Link to Comment black calx
black calx's picture

My new fighting technique is unstoppable.

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:35 | Link to Comment SilverRhino
SilverRhino's picture

Stress is not additive it is multiplicative.   

Being healthy takes away one stress source as a possible problem.  Admittedly I am not a perfect specimen of fitness [working on that actually] but guns alone aren't going to save you.   

 

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:09 | Link to Comment fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

is this simon black's alter ego?

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:10 | Link to Comment Reptil
Reptil's picture

couldn't hurt ;-)

 

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:10 | Link to Comment tuttisaluti
tuttisaluti's picture

I carry always a bunch of small dollar bills which I can trow at them....maybe I have to switch to gold bar's   :-)

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:14 | Link to Comment The Shootist
The Shootist's picture

I'll cling to my god, guns, and gold.

"I've got a shotgun, a rifle, and a 4 wheel drive -a country boy can survive!"

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 22:19 | Link to Comment alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

guns and god...no really, I see no contradiction there....

sigh.....

Wed, 10/17/2012 - 21:15 | Link to Comment HD
HD's picture

Years ago, I once sat through a 45 minute Tai Chi class...

So, if I'm ever attacked in slow motion, in a well lit room full of blue mats - I may have a chance to kick some serious ass.

You all have been warned.

Do NOT follow this link or you will be banned from the site!