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The 46 Million Foodstamp Man March - An Infographic
America has over 46 million people on Food Stamps. The food stamps program's real name is Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program (SNAP). The Food Stamp program is "hidden" from view through Electronic Benefit Transfer (EBT) Cards that work just as credit cards. This article visualizes the size of the program and the vast amounts of people participating.
Via Demonocracy
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The welfare nation. Sad really.
http://schiffblog.blogspot.ca/
46 million State dependents, sorry food stamps
is there no end to the genius of JP Morgan on how to make money out of others misery?
especially when it's the twin terror(ist)s of politics and banking wrecking the economy and creating the unemployment
Spain just puts out more dumpsters.
I want my obamafood!!
Food stamps provide the bread, the MSM provides the circuses.
And I, too. This sheweth that the Lord careth for the unwashed among us, who are learning the douth, goodness and highmindedness of fellowship, wherein there is no freedom, folkdom, work, thought or other such childish dreams. Blessed be the mains that be, and that merthly Lord's thane, Obama. No man ever lived that was more worthy of Nobels' meed. May we be good fellows and never think again.
For the longest time I thought things were not as bad as during the Carter years. Where were the soup lines?
But the EBT card has dispersed them all around us.
The collapse cannot happen soon enough. Then we have a chance at getting back on the right track.
The collapse IS happening. The only thing missing is a Foxsnooze/NY Times headline announcing "The End Came Last Night" to anybody who is paying the least bit of attention to what's going on around them.
IT'S TIME TO THINK AN UDDER WAY
Throughout History Life Has Been A Game Where We Milk Each Other For Money (The Promises For Production Of Others)
Now That Technology Can Sustainably Produce Efficiently, The World Is Running Out Of Reasons To Milk People
If There Is No Need To Milk Others For Production, People Can Start Milking Life For Higher Functioning
http://www.udderworld.com
Foodstamps for everyone....not just bankers and politicians milking the next generation dry
Your thesis is not bad, but do yourself a favor and upgrade the puns and campy presentation.
Little wonder WalMart just cut a large check to Barry's campaign. They like that government teat.
Now they don't have to pay healthcare either due to Barry's generosity.
they never did - where have you been? out campaigning?
Wally*Mart exists because of .gov benefits to their "crew members" - do some research, they've been utilising low wages and .gov services since the 90's, funneling the fiat UPwards to their incredibly wealthy family members. . .
edit: wow, only 4 downvotes? must've touched some nerves upthread, because surely you lads aren't defending the Wal*Mart now?
http://walmart1percent.org/top-reasons-the-walton-family-and-walmart-are...
An excerpt from the memo states:
Source: Wal-Mart Internal Memo [PDF File], via New York Times
http://www.walmartmovie.com/facts.php
Hey, the hand that gives is the hand that receives, right??
And on the "other side of the coin" there's the bankers cutting checks to Romney...
It's the fucking system!
This is just fucking sad...
Oh SNAP!
Trick'
or
Treat'
.
The trick is on us...the treats are for them.
Happy Samhain day - err Halloween.
.
Only the biggest pagan occult day of the year - that the masses dont question why, where, how or when...
- but rather just shut-up and participate in the charade...
Society demands you to participate - OR your! the nutball...
Brilliant - absolutely brilliant by the occult masters.
Around the eighth century or so, the Catholic Church decided to use November 1st as All Saints Day. This was actually a pretty smart move on their part – the local pagans were already celebrating that day anyway, so it made sense to use it as a church holiday. All Saints’ became the festival to honor any saint who didn’t already have a day of his or her own. The mass which was said on All Saints’ was called Allhallowmas – the mass of all those who are hallowed. The night before naturally became known as All Hallows Eve, and eventually morphed into what we call Halloween. (Wigington).
There, cleared that all up.
Yeah, those fucking Pagans are taking over everything! They're all over the place, trying to gain control of govt and all... Amazing how they have their supernatural being's name on coinage and national anthems... </sarc>>
I thought Christmas was the biggest pagan occult holiday of the year. I'm sure it still brings in more cash than Hallowe'en.
the best thing about the million man march is only 3 people miss work
larz
I hear that, why them lazy niggers just don't want to work.
I bet you want to string them up from the nearest tree like your kin used to.
no no. It's the enablers that we want. You don't make any headway cutting the tail. You have to get the head of the snake.
my kin from sweden foyle no stringin up there doesnt owes nobody nuttin - aint no hate there neither, fo mo yeas or go romney - no diff
Back to MSNBC there Chris...
Keep Obama in president you know...
Not that I'm a supporter of the current administration, but I doubt it will change much under Republican leadership since they would immediately be painted as starving the masses. That's why welfare reform was a slick willy thing, he wanted reelected and there was a republican congress to pass the bill.
Nothing will substantially change until private sector jobs are created by investment new businesses, which will not happen until regulatory barriers to entry are reduced, and neither is actually interested in reducing the regulatory burden. (213,645 pages and counting)
Urban Redneck
Regulatory burden?
Would you work for what they pay Chinese or Vietnamese labor?
Regulatory burden and wage scale are unrelated issues. Germany and Switzerland have significantly higher wages than the US and still maintain a strong manufacturing base.
Urban Redneck
So you want the social programs from Switzerland and Germany?
I agree brother, if you want high wages everyone should pay enough taxes to cover the social safety net for all.
Thank you for coming out for the few Socialists on ZH.
I myself am an Anarchist, but I don't use the Amercanized version of Libertarian.
The tax rates for job creators (who aren't in the .01%) are lower in both Switzerland and Germany then in the United States.
The higher wages for workers also don't necessarily translate into higher standards of living because of the differences in purchasing power.
But to a business owner- a dollar, euro, or franc of expenses is just that, and the OVERHEAD of doing business in the US is so bad that it more than outweighs the higher labor and energy costs in Europe.
Many here on ZH prefer the King James Version of Libertarian.
brilliant.
Lawrence Odonnell??
do you even know how low is fiscal pressure here in Switzerland?
i bet NO
Don't waste your time. The only thing Gully understands is ....Government is good and everything they do is for the benefit of the people. He can't grasp the fact that government might put up barriers to prevent small business from competing.
Bzzt! WRONG!
People cannot afford shit. No customers, no employees...
I'm not saying that there's no cost with regulations, just that you can remove ALL of them and we'd still be fucked (much like even if you curtailed ALL govt spending we'd still be horribly in debt). Also note that these costs typically benefit the large contributors who control most of the means of production, as it is They who are funding the lobbyists.
Bottom line: Mother Nature says that there's a limit to how much can be extracted out of the earth, human "regulations" or not.
you definition of "People" seems rather limited...
Most people in Africa really can't afford shit, in a way most Americans could never understand (yet). In spite of this new business are started all the time- the customers are not necessarily local, and the products and services are not usually luxury iCrap. Entrepreneurs start these businesses even though in many markets they have to borrow money at 10-20% APR for the debt component of their new ventures.
JD...before welfare reform----bank reform/Fed reform. first things first.
They are keeping the poor's stomach as full as they can out of sight, as quietly as possible, otherwise they would have had a revolution by now
Racer wrote:
EXACTLY!! IMO, this is the best damned comment in this thread of discussion. But for the food stamps, the food rioters and OWS would have already begun assassinating politicians, banksters, CEO's, and other members of the one percent.
-- Paul D. Bain
PaulBain@PObox.com
Bread and circuses, bitchez.
Printing money for basic necessities will not cause major inflation. However, monetizing trillions in unpayable debt WILL.
Don't forget the drugs, a full belly and comfortably numb - it's a way of life.
Caution on the use/understanding of "revolution"...
http://landdestroyer.blogspot.com/2011/02/real-revolution.html
This is the way forward.
http://au.news.yahoo.com/latest/a/-/latest/15182799/counterfeit-aussie-g...
So the average annual food stamp budget is $71B. What's that, a little less than two months of Fed MBS purchases so the bank CEOs can continue to live their lavish lifestyles?
After 1/1/13 it won't even be 1 month.
And still, giving other people's money away to poor people is just as bad as giving it to bankers, maybe even worse. It's just unfortunate that the government has allowed the large bad banks to get bigger and the small banks to go out of business.
Amazing that anyone can truly believe that "giving other people's money away to poor people is just as bad as giving it to bankers." Let me put it terms you can understand -- e.g., how it affects you. If poor people begin starving, they will become violent. Society will break down. It won't be fun to put the top down on the sports car and cruise around, because crime in the streets will be rampant. I won't bother to suggest that we all have a duty as human beings to help the needy, because I realize that won't appeal to you. But even if you focus on your own self-interest exclusively (something you no doubt are expert at), helping the poor helps you.
It doesn't matter to me whether the guy holding the gun is a Fed or a disenfranchised youth, taking my money at gunpoint is theft (well, robbery, actually).
The huge difference is that the Feds don't actually have to hold a real gun to steal your stuff because it's institutionalized. The disenfranchised youth is working as an independent agent and thereby has to use something that you believe to be a real gun.
You could say this is a clash of statism vs personal liberty.
Thank you.... Thank you for taking the time to look down upon all of us and explain simple morality as only you, the unselfish democrat can understand it. The rest of us sefish unwashed heathen have never ever heard of such concepts! We prefer to rape, pillage and take what we want so we can throw the excess into the trash because we... have never considered another soul. You idiot.
Take you false humanity (thinly disguised theft) and go collect donations in hollywood. We here understand that rewarding inactivity and punishing success only creates more poverty.
Take a look at human behavior from somwhere besides your high n mighty perch of superiority and maybe you will see: a fat cat with a bowl of milk will never need to get up from in front of the fireplace. Let a man get a little hungry and he will learn to grow some food.
Stupid Socialist
America has more people on food stamps than Canada has people.
<sarc>
Stop it with all the Canada jokes, please.
</sarc>
If the Canadians could vote in the US elections they would be welcome for food stamps as well.
Obama's from Chicago. Everyone is welcomed to vote in Chicago, even dead people.
Why is it that people who are nearly dead tend to vote Republican, while those who truly are dead tend to vote Democratic?
A little tidbit of information about MichO's "Healthy, Hunger Free Kids Act of 2010"
In the bill it stated "all state agencies must implement EBT systems by Oct. 1. 2020"
Guess which company administers half of the EBT programs in the country? JP Morgan
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/10/01/jp-morgan-s-food-stamp-empire.html
I don't care! All I want to know is whether I can bash this as "socialism "or "fascism!" </sarc> "Look! Over there, a distraction!"
thanks for that link paradism, well written information, including,
it's all about those lazy folks on seven dollars a day for free foods. . .
Recently our local grocery store, changed their price displays and receipts. When you checkout now, as the cashier rings up your purchases the register screen shows if the item qualifies for SNAP. Also your receipt now subtotals the SNAP eligible amount prior to the grand total. I live in a very upscale area, not what one would call the ghetto. Store has lots of amenities such as bakery, organic area, custom meat counter, upscale salad bar, ect.
I asked the cashier why the change, she said, "Miss, you just would not believe how many people shop here that use those cards. I think that Management did this, so there would not be anymore customers embarrassed or trying to argue with the cashiers."
Very freaking sad.
Sad that there are people who need foodstamps or sad that they are allowed to shop in your store? Nevermind, don't answer that. I know.
Seriously? I don't care where they shop. It is sad that people are reduced to this, and that many children are victims of their parent's poor choices. I believe there should be these types of programs to help people out as a temporary safety net, when bad things happen in life. However, I also believe there should be a stigma to it and accountability to receive this charity. I have been poor, and that experience has taught me that I don't want to ever be broke again, so throughout my adult life I have made sacrifices and choices to insure that I am never dependant on anyone else. I am not judging those people, I was just pointing out that local businesses in my area are catering to this need which remains well hidden from view.
You're assuming it's the fault of parents' poor choices? How about the fact that the entire economy is @#%#@^ed up because of central planning and the fact that we have an "economic calculation problem" as Ludwig von Mises would put it?
Okay, my mistake. I misread your comment.
"I have been poor, and that experience has taught me that I don't want to ever be broke again, so throughout my adult life I have made sacrifices and choices to insure that I am never dependant on anyone else."
"Poor" as defined by what?
And, "I don't want to be broke again" means? If you are truly not "dependant on anyone else" then that means you would have the means to obtain everything that you need w/o needing any currency.
As much as I'd like to be independent from things (esp the "System"), reality is is that I'm ill-suited to being a hermit/bushman/woodsman etc...
My wife and I were in the fish store recently and there were 2 guys in the line in front of us with these food vouchers / cards.
They were buying hundreds of dollars worth of crab, lobster tails etc.
For some reason their transaction hit a snag and they had to put some stuff back (I think the shrimp and cocktail sauce).
divedivedive
So you witnessed a couple of just returned veterans who could not find jobs buying healthy seafood.
Did you thank them for their service?
Did you compliment them for not purchasing junk food and eating healthy?
Speaking of veterans, we have a neighbor who was in the service about 30-40 years ago. Now he has a Phd, teaches at a local school, and has another business on the side.
One day I was comparing property taxes for the houses around us (all available on the web). This guy pays nothing. He has a lifetime exemption claiming he is a permanently disabled vet.
In the mean time I see the guy up on a ladder pressure washing his roof. I take a picture and show it to property appraisers office. They research it and say nothing they can do, he has a letter from a doctor.
A _lifetime_ exemption. He has a sailboat in the backyard !
divedivedive...we don't know why your neighbour was awarded a lifetime exemption, one thing we should all agree upon is that many vets have lived through and witnessed things the rest of us have been spared and that coming back to this world from combat lavishes little praise upon them or gratitude. my father served in WW11 and his years on the front have afforded me the luxury of peace.
My point has nothing to do with deserving veterans, or their families for that matter. Some of my family was in the service as well.
As for the guy I'm writing about there is a lot I'm not mentioning. Believe me - he is not deserving.
I wonder what the world would be like if we could reel in fraud.
Fraud and waste WILL diminish. Just a matter of time before Mother Nature demands it be so...
In theatre there is another phrase.
'All bleeding stops...'
Sorry, but I think we have to distinguish between those who defend our nation and those participate in acts of aggression against other countries, which is most of what our military does these days.
I recognize that members of our armed forces don't have a choice as to the duties they are assigned, but they do have the opportunity to see all the needless foreign military interventions that our armed forces have been ordered into prior to their enlistment.
In short, while some may have conducted themselves with valor in their service, I contest the concept that veterans are by definition, patriotic heroes. That's simply propaganda.
"In short, while some may have conducted themselves with valor in their service, I contest the concept that veterans are by definition, patriotic heroes."
Maybe if we just let the military vote on it...that should help tremendously ;-)
"...property appraisers office."?
What?
I live in a state which taxes real estate (I thought they all did). They appraise your house/land and send you an annual bill.
There are all sorts of exemptions which can be applied to your bill; homestead exemption, widower, religious, parapelegic (sp?),
All this taxing etc is handled by a county property appraiser.
Which reminds me. There is an exemption for 100% permanently disabled verteran wounded while in the service. That flavor gets you a lifetime exemption. Then there is another flavor where if you are seriously wounded they give you something like a 25% discount on your taxes.
See something, say something, huh? I can't believe you tried to rat this guy out because he can power wash his roof and work for a living after serving in the military. Asshole.
Here's some more for you. At the time I did a little research and while I haven't held onto the figures there were many (like in the low thousands) of these exemptions handed out. Masny of these exemptions were on houses with values in the millions, waterfront. Many of the houses were not even primary residences (they were being used as expensive rentals).
You take a few thousand properties and figure an annual exemption of anywhere from 5K to maybe 50K, times a lifetime (what maybe 20 - 30 years) and you are talking some serious money. And this exemption can be applied to multiple residences ! And it is being passed down inside trusts...
It's like the exemption for religious institutions. Those turn up in some interesting neighborhoods also.
I really can't get excited about your desire to fuck over your neighbor who served in the military, because he doesn't outwardly demonstrate a disability that you think is worthy of deferential tax treatment. Do you really have nothing better to do? I'll bet you have a "stay off my lawn" sign somewhere on your property, yes?
No. It's a For Sale sign.
If he teaches and has a side job, this is not disabled. Taxpayers are being sucked dry from all sides.
Not promoting "ratting," but one should understand the notion of opportunity cost and what it means- it means that there are likely children who are in need not getting because of things like this (if in fact FRAUD).
Those who were forced into military duty (aka "draft") is one thing, enlistees (such as I was) are another... I do believe that the former are "owed" while the "later" are not.
This is my last post on this topic.
I really wasn't targeting an individual (although he was the spark which peaked (piqued ?) my interest).
It's my free shit; AND I WANT IT NOW!
Signed---Heads of the Federal Reserve.
How could it be going down??? Unless that Fed report was...
GOD HELP US!!!!
Bread lines would be easier on the eye? Perhaps it'll drive the message home that this economy is not working for the 99%? Americans are not lazy. As soon as jobs are available, they are filled. During the boom years where people were laying bricks, setting tile, or putting up sheetrock for the greatest con in the history of man, were they lazy then? Were they lazy in steel mills or manufacuring plants? People don't have food on their tables, that's why we hand out food stamps. Solve the problem, don't keep hammering away at the people.
The fact that Wal-Mart only trades in the $70s despite getting all of this sweet 3rd party stimulus from the government really goes to show just how much fail exists down there in Bentonville.
Unless that's the ceiling....which if that's the case.....wow.
Hey, I just got on SNAP; I'm like, free food, now I can save some money from the inflation and taxes; puts that towards my golds and silvers.
people don't understand the game; it's us, the plebs, versus the asshole elites who're so fucking scared of even coming into contact with a nigga they'll do anything to stay bubble-fide.
so, us nigga, being small, worthless except for generating income for the assholes; have begun the revolution; we use the way, dao. like a million mosquitos, one by one, we draw our small amount of blood.
i get free medical care too.
des niggas will implode an go super nova, and niggas like us, low level niggas, will watch and enjoy the show.
i will definitely be smiling...
oh, and I recommend you lie cheat and steal from the government too. Why? cause it's all bullshit; a con... all your red-white-and blue can go suck ass... when you send poor stupid niggas to war, to die, so you can live high on the hog... obama. change, hope for the nigga... we stills gots hope
all of it is bullshit. propaganda to manipulate you and your behavior.
you're just a stupid nigga.
which i'm proud to be.
and one more thing for you fucking retards... i use my snap to buy shit like filet mignon; and buffalo, organic. i don't buy candies and snacks, or processed food.
I'm comin' over with the big fork, and my heavy duty bib already on me.
oh I am sooo bringin' my camera. . .
Umm, the Elites are buying farmland. EBT cards just ensure demand stays "up" because in the end, everyone is ON THE TAKE.
So you see my nigga, just another game "they" win. Transact in gold or barter and drink alot of water rather than eat and maybe you will have a shot.
Oh, and Janet says both behaviors are "suspicious".
the game will end. it's math. and you'll have millions of pissed off niggas.
I'm just say'n: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ju9yFA1S7K8
We already be millions of pissed off niggas. And not much good is going on what I can see.
2 months of QE is more than a whole year's worth of SNAP. OK, we know who the welfare queens are, the elite.
But really, I was in the grocery store line the other day, with a small budget, I was buying discount meat and vegitables, OK, they were at the edge of expiration. The food I was buying needed bad spots cut out and needed cooked that day, but I was able to get a good roast beef dinner together for $11 cash. Not too bad. Well the meat was a little stinky, but acceptable.
The family in front of me, used a SNAP card, and were buying an amazing amount of fresh meat, fresh dairy, and vegitables, plus all sorts of packaged foods. I was kinda jelous, but then I thought, well, that family deserves to have enough. The real question of the day is, "Do the elites have enough?"
It's not sustainable. Money from nothing will not be able to afford necessary essentials forever. They can cheat with the value of money temporarily but they cannot cheat on yield. The good stuff will not be sold for worthless fiat one certain day. Let alone for plastic card transactions.
"they cannot cheat on yield."
Exactly! Eventually physical reality trumps the virtual one...
Justin Timberlake - What Goes Around...Comes Around
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TOrnUquxtwA (9:22)
YOU deserve to have fresh food, if you work for a living and are not a SNAP participant. Can someone please tell me why the family on SNAP deserves better food than the working man?
They don't, but working is for fools.
Why work? So you can pay taxes that go to banks and foreign countries?
Why bust your ass so your money can be Corzined and bled out of you to benefit corporations that are bailed out?
The social and moral contract is broken, shattered, stomped, burned to ashes.
You can't blame people for not pushing a rock up a hill everyday only to have it roll to the bottom at night.
When bankers, corporations, politicians, and professional mandarins collect money sitting on their asses lying, skimming, getting their palms greased, bonuses for theft, manipulating rates, etc., etc. - a person would have to be quite the fool to not follow the "law of the land".
There is "Work" and then there is "work."
"work" is energy applied. "Work" is what you do for TPTB.
I find that "work" is necessary, while "Work" is not.
Indeed. Excellent point. Thumbs, my man.
Lots of tax free work in my back 40
Exactly.
Thanks.
We all deserve good food.
The working man should also be buying the fresh, decent stuff for his piehole. But I'm noticing where I shop that he ain't usually, he's buying canned soup, chips and beer. Maybe he knows better, maybe he doesn't, I dunno. But it hurts to watch it roll into the checkout line.
Meanwhile, since we also shop at the local restaurant supply for the big boxes of stuff, I see what the restaurant owners buy. Now there's some NIIIIIICE stuff. Healthy (mostly) and delicious. I know from experience because we occasionally eat at their restaurants.
There's good food out there and it's affordable. People just gotta take the time to cook it. And look up a recipe if they don't know how to cook it. There are lots of simple ways to cook good stuff fairly fast for those who will just 'google it.'
I mean, just type in "Stir Fry Recipe" in the search engine box and find one that says total time, 30 minutes.
Inventing cooking is what allowed the hairless ape to evolve the big brain that most of us don't use nearly enough. So let's start cooking and stop microwaving. It's good for your brain, and you can still get big and fat on really excellent food instead of crap.
Also, IT JUST TASTES BETTER.
jeez you guys can be rather hard of thinking sometimes - the "family" buying a large amount of food just MAY be shopping bi-weekly, and may be freezing their meats, etc. - if they're smart. they then are spending less on daily shopping, which was more what the original poster was doing - marked down foods, consumed immediately.
but really, this fixation on who gets what on their $50 a week SNAP benefit per adult - that's seven dollars a day for all food/drink, day in day out, every day. . . it's such a shame the divide 'n' rule shit works so well. . .
Just put an Apple logo on the foodstamp locations and then you have "GDP accretive" potential.
MSM will talk about of course how obesity is more of a concern than people receiving basic needs because Obamney will have us covered-- Heil Obamney!
Edit: Fucking sad and pathetic how this is even barely glanced at during the 2nd (read 3rd) party debate.
Just like child support was the new slavery (to quote Malcolm X), food stamps are the the new bread line.
Did Malcolm X refer to the government support program or the fact that dead beat nigga Dad's aren't paying for their kids?
Obama can add more voters by increasing those collecting foodstamps, free cell phones, section 8's, welfare and free education.
Yes which was his strategy all along. Which is why he will probably defeat Romney.
No matter who wins, I do believe this is the last election of the original America Republic. When the monetary system collapses between now and 2015, it'll be bad for a while, but then we can restore and rebuild the nation.
I have been saying the same thing. That this is the last election of America we knew (past tense on this part here).
Yeah, it's a great line to get people to continue to support the System... Been hearing this line for MANY years now...
When the Dems tell me how they'd like to "take back 'America'" I ask them: "to what era? the DixieCrat era?" Seems the same for the GOP-ers as well...
The "good old days" passed by when the US went from net oil exporter to net oil importer. All sorts of things happen when you move from the positive side of the ledger to the negative one: sanctimony seems to get tossed out the window...
Corporate *all caps* amrka has existed since before any of us were alive to witness it, and still folks want to pay tribute to a myth they were taught by rote in skool.
There was a program set up in mexico to try and get more on food stamps. Not a joke
NAFTA, the gift that keeps on giving...
Right. Those guys have it good, averaging $710 a month in income. Lets cut them off at the knees and see if we can decrease the surplus population. After all, 76% of these housholds include a child, an elderly person, or a disabled person. Those kids and a lot of disabled don't count as voters, and those expired worker units should just be put out of their misery.
I think probably half or more of the SNAP participation problem could be solved by financial education and a good old fashioned kick in the ass. You have to understand, having children, when you are financially unable to care for them, is a choice. A bad choice. You should have to live with that and all of the other shitty choices you make.
Case in point: former acquaintance that I've known since high school lost his ass selling new cars, after cash-for-clunkers expired. He spends probably $500/mo. on tobacco and alcohol products. He continues to make poor choices well into his 30s, so I terminated the relationship. Anyway, a rundown of his life:
*Refuses to get into a line of work that pays anything.
*Refuses to quit his addictions and stop spending $500/mo. on them.
*Is Section 8 and a SNAP participant.
*Fathered two children that he was never able to support.
*Wife refuses to work, though they are, literally, destitute.
*Has probably $200k in all manner of debt that will never be repaid.
And I know a young adult working his way through school, with Pell Grants and subsidized loans and doing his first two years at low cost community college, who works 24 a week part time who barely is able to pay his $500 rent in a shared house. He is lucky to get SNAP benefits which help him to get even the hope of a chance of achieving the bogus American Dream. SNAP requires full time students to work 20 hours to get benefits. Seems like a good incentive to me.
They give food stamps to basically any student who works 20 hrs/wk and asks for it. I know several dependents who collect over $150 a month whos parents pay their rent and school (and reported this information) so most of that 20hrs a week goes to the fucking around fund.
That's probably a better use of taxpayer money than a student loan for the same purpose that will never be repaid.
I did all of that without SNAP almost 20 years ago. It's a handout. Period.
You were lucky, 20 years ago, that tuition was still affordable. Have you looked at the cost of a college education lately? These kids need help from somewhere. If its food stamps to help you work your way through college without having to borrow from JP Morgan, I see it as a good use of tax dollars.
So kicking him in the ass didn't work?
I don't know... I don't want to get sued or thrown in jail, for "assault."
I know that your anecdotal assauges your guilt and all, but this kind of thinking worked in the PAST, it doesn't work TODAY. NO FUCKING JOBS!
Chart Of The Day: 55 And Under? No Job For You
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2012-10-24/chart-day-55-and-under-no-job-you
[One really needs to READ ZeroHedge to be INFORMED (yeah, I could stick my head out my window and proclaim everything is fine because I've got neighbors with $65,000 [used price, they're selling] horse trailers, but I realize that there's more than just my anecdotal-based life happening out there)]
"He spends probably $500/mo. on tobacco and alcohol products."
Meh, a mere teetotaler.
"Has probably $200k in all manner of debt that will never be repaid."
Does he have any assets that the state or bank knows about? If not, and he has assets that no one knows about, then he is on the right track because that is the "incentive" that is telegraphed these days by our TBTF banks as well as the state. I only have one more substantial asset to liquidate. Once that is accomplished, I will max out my credit cards and have a mysterious boating accident as seems to be so common these days. Then I am going Galt.
I appreciate your sense of nostalgic honesty Sir, but those days are gone now. And as ebworthen states, the amount of fiat spent on SNAP is negligible compared to what is spent on TBTF banks. That SNAP is the real problem is simply a red herring.
What is the incentive for grocery stores to compete when half of their sales are to people that don't give a shit what it cost. You want to talk monopolies? Start with the Federal Government and work your way down cause they have a hand in creating ALL of them.
You are apparently mistaken about the size of the benefits received by SNAP recipients. They are very aware of the cost of food:
"The average SNAP household has a gross monthly income of $731, net monthly income of $336, and countable resources of $333...The average monthly SNAP benefit per person is $130, or less than $1.50 per person, per meal."
http://feedingamerica.org/how-we-fight-hunger/programs-and-services/publ...
Those are the rules. But when you read the first hand witness accounts of what people are buying with the program, it seems to contradict the purpose of the program.
Incomes are likely underreported to be eligible to start with. Unfortunately the abusers are hurting the families that are honestly suffering and will get scrutinized further in order to qualify.
Greed and fraud, it's what is in our blood. FWIW I didn't junk you.
Wanna know what I think of "first hand witness" ANECDOTAL accounts? They are nothing more than propaganda. My anecdotal evidence, with a family member who works in a local grocery store that accepts SNAP payments, is that there is no difference between what people with SNAP cards buy and the rest.
Think about the greed and fraud in Wall Street and Washington and poor people taking advantage of an extra benefit is peanuts.
Snap = $71.8 Billion for year 2011
FED = $40 Billion PER MONTH to benefit banks.
EB, that is a great point and I plussed you for both mentions so far. However, I am no longer as altruistic as I once was and a thought occurred to me; what if there was a way to game the EBT cards so as to buy silver eagles or maples with them? That would be poetic justice in more ways than one.
Back in the day I worked at a quicki-mart type place.
This was when food stamps were like bills. People would tear out the smaller denominations. They would get a 89 cent loaf of bread with a $10 food stamp. I would give them change in cash. They would say, "Oh, I forgot something" and go get a $1 gallon of milk and a pack of smokes. I would watch them cross the street to the State liquor store to buy their pint of vodka.
People figure things out pretty fast. The SNAP cards can easily be used for food, and the other $100 of supplanted "income" in cash can be used to buy whatever.
Hard to blame people for gaming the system, when Wall Street has so obviously done the same to the tune of a 6-1 ratio in MBS purchases by the FED alone, not to mention all the other legerdemain.
You don't need an education or even a GED to figure these things out. I've seen it in the past in so many ways. The example set is the one followed. A lack of rule of law and ethics and morals at the top trickles down a whole lot faster than "capital" invested in "markets".
Here in the Commonwealth, there is fraud that takes EBT and turns it into cash. I think it would really suck to score on all of this fraud and get put into "custody" at just the time when the coin would actually be beneficial.
But then, I'm just a naive little piglet.
- Ned
ebworthen: so the situation that you report is that the corruption is at the top (clear to all) and that it is at the "bottom" (more later) that is also clear to all.
I'd guess the "at the bottom" is not the so-called "poor" but rather the poor bastards making close to the minimum, paying all of the regressive taxes and actually paying income tax. You know, the actual "middle class" that is truly getting hammered.
There seems to be a structural thingie goin' on. Let's see (I was a VERY young piglet at the time), maybe 1966. It was in "The Nation." a so-called magazine. It was "The Weight of the Poor: A Strategy to End Poverty."
The strategy as I describe it, is to "redistribute the wealth." I understand that in the current environment that the term "redistribute the wealth" was not used in the article. I understand that only Mitt Romney has recently used the term "redistribute the wealth", oh wait, no, he said "So little time, so much wealth to redistribute." I am sorry, my bad, that shouldn't have happened, it won't happen again.
Conclusion: both are right and it all is in the wrong direction.
- Ned
Yes, and the more the shrinking middle class is bent over, the more will be forced to choose to join the legerdemain at the top or the bottom.
Not a good recipe for a nation. When parasitism is the modus operandi those who try to be responsible and do the right thing feel more and more like pack mules.
If you can't be rewarded for being responsible and trying to save you are forced to go one way or the other, neither benficial to the common good.
I believe Walkure was referring to instances such as this and not merely using anecdotes.
http://articles.nydailynews.com/2012-06-28/news/32461243_1_ebt-food-stamp-electronic-benefit-transfer
Here is another example:
http://www.fraudoftheday.com/2012/01/12/snap-ebt-cards-used-to-buy-cocaine-and-alcohol/
Pretty sure those store owners got charged with Fraud. Here is what the USDA is doing about this small time fraud.
"USDA has cut “trafficking” — the sale of SNAP benefits for cash, which violates federal law — by three-quarters over the past 15 years. USDA has also permanently disqualified thousands of retail stores from the program for not following federal requirements. In fiscal year 2011, USDA convicted 179 retailers and recovered $26.5 million in fraudulent transactions. When cases of SNAP fraud are reported in the news, it is because the offenders have been caught, evidence that states and USDA are aggressively combating fraud.
In addition, SNAP now comes in the form of an electronic debit card –– like the ATM cards that most Americans carry in their wallets — which recipients can use in the supermarket checkout line only to purchase food. This has been a key tool to reduce trafficking. Sophisticated computer programs monitor SNAP transactions for patterns that may suggest abuse. Federal and state law enforcement agencies are then alerted and investigate. Retailers or SNAP recipients who defraud SNAP by trading their benefit cards for money or misrepresenting their circumstances face tough criminal penalties. "
If only the DOJ would go after banksters like Corzine with such effectiveness.
http://www.cbpp.org/cms/index.cfm?fa=view&id=3239
there is a difference between JPM's SNAP card, and say, unemployment benefits on USBank's ReliaCard - both banks profit, yes, but the SNAP cards can only be used for foodstuffs, no household things like toilet paper, etc. allowed. other electronic benefits allow for cash ATM, or whatever a debit card might get used for, so folks maybe should make the distinction along with their point.
good post pointing out how monitored the purchases are - folks who've been trained to use the individual store discount cards (Safeway, Albertsons, et al) rarely realise that ALL their purchases are parsed in great data banks, every little mouthful. . .
Hang ALL because SOME are guilty?
I'd be the last to argue for all of this distorted reality (wherein we admire the wealthy, whom are almost exclusively born into wealth, and demonize the poor), but logic is logic. In order to clean up this "fraud" there would have to be more regulation, "regulation," the very word that seems want to be removed from application toward "business" (oh, except when it comes to the nasty "banksters," as though only banking suffers from corruption).
That's a lot of future rioters!
I'll call your two snap cards and raise you my section 8 payment.
Foodstamps is just a FEMA portal. Nothing more, nothing less. Amerikano's.
So why then are there jobs that "Americans just won't do"? Why do we need illegals to work the fields and bring in a crop? Just askin'
It "pays" to be an illegal. The way things have gotten, you are born into a disadvantage in this country
They have found ways to skirt around the tax system with fake personal information in manufacturing jobs too. I can't say for fact, but have been around it.
and need a place to cash those paychecks? they have that too
They have their own little "Network"
What a bunch of xenophobic BS!
On one hand there are people spouting off how people in the US WON'T work, and then there's YOU stating that it's because they are "disadvantaged."
.My wife is an immigrant (as was my grandfather). She does not have the "entitlement" attitude that North Americans have. It is THIS -suffering from entitlement attitude*- that is the "disadvantage."
* Even those "working" folks who claim to be doing "god's work" suffer from this disease.
Many of the "illegals" (be sure to separate from "legals," which my wife is) were flushed out of Mexico thanks to shit like NAFTA (which benefited the big corporations immensely; first by allowing lands to be cleared for large-scale ag, then as cheap labor IN the U.S.).
Go to D.C. and describe what the lobbyists look like and who they are working for.
In a nutshell: Fuck this xenophobic BS.