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Guest Post: Obama Wins A Second Term: Now What?

Tyler Durden's picture


Submitted by Ron Holland via The Daily Bell,

I'm certainly glad the election is finally over. While I have loved politics my entire life, this presidential election has gone on for over three years, including the GOP primaries, and I've had my fill of meaningless slogans and counter-slogans, lies and counter-lies. I had to quit watching political news the last few weeks, as I thought I would become physically sick if I watched any more establishment political "experts" give their required opinions and propaganda bites.

The 2012 presidential election has been like a ballgame hyped and built up over three years. We are programed to cheer and act out our sheep-like roles in partisan politics when, like the game, unless we have money bet on the outcome the actual winner will have absolutely no impact on our lives.

This was destined to be a close, statistically tied election, as get out the vote efforts included repetitive harping on its life-changing importance and the evils of the opposition candidates and party. The bottom line is that voting percentages generate credibility for the failed American political system.

"There's not a dime's worth of difference between the Democrat and Republican parties." George Wallace, 1966 Alabama governor and presidential candidate.

Note it now takes 71 cents to equal the purchasing power of a dime in 1966 – if you believe the false inflation statistics out of Washington. Actually, I could buy a soft drink for a dime in 1966 whereas today it is closer to $1.50. Check house prices even with the pullback or college tuition if you want an accurate inflation estimate.

It is reasonable to expect from Obama's second term more of the same as the first four years. The two main US political parties promote nearly identical policies; nothing will change from earlier Bush and Clinton administration policies. Of course, there will be a burst of optimism from Democrats and the usual rallying cries for everybody to come together to meet the challenges of the moment. This is just the usual garbage fed to the voting public after every presidential election.

I hate to be the bearer of bad news but both presidents and the representatives we reelect to Congress only represent the powerful banking and economic interests that control the federal government and use it to further their power elite agenda. Real, productive citizens can only look to their government representatives to solve minor bureaucratic issues on lost checks, eligibility for this program or that or to listen only to their complaints and agenda.

In reality, the Senate and House of Representatives by necessity – except in the case of those few with actual philosophical convictions on the right or the left – only represent and govern based on the financial handouts and doors opened by powerful interests. This is the only way they can be reelected.

Why Romney Lost

Romney lost for two main reasons:

First, as he correctly noted during the campaign, 47 percent of American families are dependent on government handouts and they voted for what was in their own best interests. Democracy is mob rule and the 47 percent, although with the best of intentions, are still only a mob out to get what they can from others who have earned or produced the wealth in the private sector.

"There are 47 percent who are with [Obama], who are dependent upon government, who believe they are victims, who believe the government has a responsibility to care for them, who believe that they are entitled to health care, to food, to housing, to you name it." – Mitt Romney

Still, there is a positive outcome with this depressing statistic. First, many government employees and those on the dole understand the problems of bureaucracy far better than Americans in the private sector because they are caught in the government trap themselves. They often have the courage to even vote against their best interests because they see what it has done to them personally.

Every TSA agent and government employee in non-essential services outside of the armed forces, real police and fire protection and real teachers – not the hundreds of thousands of unionized, make-work employees who use the system – are simply parasites.

Second, the GOP leadership antagonized the 10 percent of the Republican Party electorate who supported Ron Paul for President. Of course, the establishment is still deathly scared of the Ron Paul movement and their harsh treatment and the subsequent blowback on November 6 guarantees any discussion here will be verboten and seldom mentioned for obvious reasons. While some voted for Romney, a few – as the returns show – voted third-party and many like me just sat home on election day disgusted at the entire political charade. Romney lost because he needed a majority of this 10 percent to win yet those controlling his campaign simply threw this voting block away because it threatened powerful central banking, neocon and moneyed interests supporting the GOP.

While Romney would have made a better president than Obama in at least his rhetoric, as he pays lip service to conservative Republican values, in reality his neocon controllers would probably have made him a disaster in foreign policy.

And so over the next four years the people will be provoked and buy more guns they will never have the courage to use to defend themselves against an all-powerful government. The GOP will raise more money using faux social issues and an agenda they never really have any interest in standing up for. Obama will be painted as an evil, Muslim-born in God-knows-where socialist when in actuality he has no more power than Romney would have had to restore the America we loved and respected.

The game will go on until the time is up for our nation. In the meantime, austerity measures will dramatically increase, benefits and promises will be lost by the poor and remaining middle class citizens who really need them and taxes will rise, as will the risk of gold and wealth confiscation. Obama will be blamed, just as Romney would have been blamed had he been elected president, for this is how our regulatory/debt democracy works today in the 21st century. A failed system of central bank control leading a failed economy, a failing currency and a controlled system totally divorced from control or limitation by the citizens of America.

The Solution is to Change the Political Structure

The solution is a return to a limited, decentralized confederation form of government like our first legitimate American government, the Articles of Confederation. One that is responsible to the people and ultimately controlled by the voters with the iron-clad political tools of initiative and referendum like exists in Switzerland today, where voters have the right to reject legislation and laws or enact laws outside the power of controlled legislative, judiciary and executive branches of government. Until we return to the Articles of Confederation, America and our liberties are doomed to extinction by the hidden control of international banking and economic elites.

After the election you can expect appeals from "so-called" conservatives or libertarians wanting your hard-earned money to support this or that cause. They will claim time is running out, the next election is the most important in your lifetime, etc. Time is not running out; it ran out long ago, and voting for either party or most candidates is just an exercise in futility supporting the corrupt system that rules over you. We are serfs and mere subjects to a system and few understand or even recognize the control over us.

If you want to be a free people again educate yourself on the Swiss system of government and work for a return to the government for which our patriot founding fathers risked their lives and property, the Articles of Confederation. Supporting anything less is just deceiving ourselves and screwing our posterity. We may deserve the kind of government we have allowed to take over our country but our posterity deserve better.

The GOP Ron Paul for President campaigns in 2008 and 2012 clearly showed how the controlled, two-party system in the United States will allow no real opposition to its approved candidates in either party. You can bet your worthless vote that new Republican Party rules at the 2012 GOP convention and at the state level in the future will control any viable opposition candidates. The only current outlets for alternative political action are in doomed-to-fail third-party activities that are little more than allowed but controlled political opposition.

To restore the original American Republic, we must change the controlled monopoly political system of government that controls and destroys internally or externally all opposition. New candidates or even attempts at party control accomplish little when the same powerful interests control the political structure. We must work to remove the system in place and restore the limited government of our founding fathers, for they had devised a system that would work well today with our ease of transportation and communication.

Remember, our children and grandchildren deserve a better, more prosperous world and nation than we have left them at this point. It is time we as a generation man up for liberty to redeem ourselves in the tear-filled eyes of future generations. The American people must work peacefully to restore the Articles of Confederation now or else suffer the permanent consequences of the fall of America.


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Wed, 11/07/2012 - 13:21 | 2956824 Spastica Rex
Spastica Rex's picture

Does anyone have pointers to statistics on voting participation this go-round?

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 13:31 | 2956886 Leopold B. Scotch
Leopold B. Scotch's picture

Solution?  The only opportunity those who believe in liberty will have is when this collapses.  It will be a fight.   Train your young'ns in the values of liberty.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 13:38 | 2956934 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

Well, hopefully backing Romney, Akin, et al., will usher in the end of Rand Paul's career.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:06 | 2957098 Lost My Shorts
Lost My Shorts's picture

It's unfortunate that ZH publishes so much of this right wing nonsense.  Romney lost because:

-- He is a greasy, unprincipled politician who will say anything to get elected.

-- Republicans say they believe in limited government, but in fact they push for absolute government control over women's bodies, which, believe it or not, many women don't like.  Republican "personhood" extremism is actually unpopular.  Forcing women to bear the children of rapists sounds Taliban-barbaric to a lot of people.

-- Romney never built anything (except a financial theft ring) or created any jobs.  The MO of private equity is to look for companies that pay middle class wages; buy them; bust the wages down to poverty level to improve cash flow; load up with debt; flip the company to greater fools before it goes bankrupt.  Read David Stockman's article on the Bain Capital record under Romney.  People understand that Romney is the reason the middle class is disappearing, not the solution.

-- Romney is more loyal to Bibi and Israel than the American people, and wants another expensive war in Bibi's service while denying Americans basic health care.

Amazing how many of the Fox News crowd can't figure out this obvious stuff.


Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:10 | 2957114 bobnoxy
bobnoxy's picture

Now that could be the most sensible post of the day!

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:44 | 2957265 Lost My Shorts
Lost My Shorts's picture

Ya, all the talk about divided America misses the fact that the Republicans themselves are deeply divided.  They have at least four factions -- libertarians, Christian jihadi / AIPAC, Pat Buchananites, and Wall Street.  They can't get together and compromise even among themselves.  How do they think they will unite America?

They don't want to win.  They want to complain and insult their countrymen.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:51 | 2957310 Flakmeister
Flakmeister's picture

I'll quibble.... replace Wall St. by Fossil Fuel interests.

Wall St. have definitely shown them selves to be far less dogmatic, surprisingly this is the first time in a while that they did not annoint the winner via their donations (Please correct me if I am wrong)....

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:14 | 2957418 Manthong
Manthong's picture

“Romney lost because…”

The (marginal) people that elected Obama cannot think things through to that degree.

What the Chicago machine could not get this time around with motor voter alone, they got with early voting.

Q E D.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:26 | 2957505 Flakmeister
Flakmeister's picture

Romney lost because the Republicans insult or denigrate anyone that isn't a white male...

Throw in a complete repudiation of science and you have a winner... not....

It is very simple....

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:59 | 2957657 InjuredThales
InjuredThales's picture

I would ask you to substantiate any of this, but the game you play is to make statements that are non-falsifiable.

Shameful tactic, but predictable...I suppose.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 16:20 | 2957699 steve from virginia
steve from virginia's picture


What utter bilge!


The Americans repudiated the entire Tea Party/Libertarian/Austrian/liquidationist line of economic thinking along with all of the associated 'candidates'. FAIL!


Where are the libertarians and Free-Marketeers helping out in NYC and NJ? Nowhere, their place is filled by Occupy of all people.


Climate change has become an issue after strenuous efforts by the petroleum and coal industries to submerge the issue. The public knows the tycoons are lying and the consequences are severe. Yesterday was rejection of denial politics. The next step is the public hunting the tycoons like rats ... looking for pounds of tycoon flesh.


The Pauls are cranks and the country is well rid of them along with their associated political ass-clowns: all are stooges of big business. The failures are the money-bags who tried (again) to buy the elections. FAIL.



Wed, 11/07/2012 - 16:23 | 2957713 Michaelwiseguy
Michaelwiseguy's picture

If I don't get a decent liberty candidate from the Republican party in 2016, I'm going to vote for Joe Biden in Revenge again, and make the R's losers again.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 16:32 | 2957746 12ToothAssassin
12ToothAssassin's picture

Great post up there Lost Shorts. Nailed it.


"Romney lost because:

-- He is a greasy, unprincipled politician who will say anything to get elected.

-- Republicans say they believe in limited government, but in fact they push for absolute government control over women's bodies, which, believe it or not, many women don't like.  Republican "personhood" extremism is actually unpopular.  Forcing women to bear the children of rapists sounds Taliban-barbaric to a lot of people.

-- Romney never built anything (except a financial theft ring) or created any jobs.  The MO of private equity is to look for companies that pay middle class wages; buy them; bust the wages down to poverty level to improve cash flow; load up with debt; flip the company to greater fools before it goes bankrupt.  Read David Stockman's article on the Bain Capital record under Romney.  People understand that Romney is the reason the middle class is disappearing, not the solution.

-- Romney is more loyal to Bibi and Israel than the American people, and wants another expensive war in Bibi's service while denying Americans basic health care.

Amazing how many of the Fox News crowd can't figure out this obvious stuff."

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 17:15 | 2958009 Buckaroo Banzai
Buckaroo Banzai's picture

I hereby dub this thread DOUCHEBAGS ON PARADE!

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:06 | 2957386 dbTX
dbTX's picture

Hey Lost My Shorts, I think what you've lost is what little mind you may have had a some point in the past.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 19:30 | 2958636 Cathartes Aura
Cathartes Aura's picture

argue your point, or realise you don't have one.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:21 | 2957154 whstlblwr
whstlblwr's picture

Don't forget drill, drill, drill and no climate change.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:29 | 2957206 Lost My Shorts
Lost My Shorts's picture

Actually, dril^3 and no climate change are winning positions, politically.  Note that Obama forgot all about climate change as soon as he was elected.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:42 | 2957253 whstlblwr
whstlblwr's picture

Obama likes oily money,too. But losing positions. Romney number one method to increase the economy was to drill in parks and build pipelines. Sorry BIG OIL, need better focus groups.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:46 | 2957267 CH1
CH1's picture

Obama won because half the country wants free shit and doesn't want to hear about reality.

(And for the brain-locked: I don't like Elephants either.)

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:47 | 2957276 whstlblwr
whstlblwr's picture

Obama won because it doesn't matter. Obama Romney are the same ticket and status quo scared about out of control social situation if Romney wins.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:53 | 2957305 CH1
CH1's picture

Obama Romney are the same ticket

Well, duh!

status quo scared about out of control social situation if Romney wins.

Nope, it was about parasites getting free shit. They don't give a second thought to "the social situation"... they ARE the social situation.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:11 | 2957413 Iwanttoknow
Iwanttoknow's picture

Right.I did not vote.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:08 | 2957399 venturen
venturen's picture

Obama won because he handed out $10 Trillion in printed money and he makes a good talkshow host. Unfortunately neither of these are going to stop the financial collaspe of the country. 

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:40 | 2957582 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

Obama won because he knew best how to please his master, the 'american' middle class.

The 'american' middle class got him on the job for the second time.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 16:28 | 2957729 TheFourthStooge-ing
TheFourthStooge-ing's picture

AnAnonymous said:

Obama won because he knew best how to please his master, the 'american' middle class.

ROR! You good making the wordings laughter judiciously!

Clearness of seeing humourously creative you the words in writing.

You might be on something, send a script to Hollywood.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 16:58 | 2957904 akak
akak's picture

Indeed, the nattering of Chinese Citizenism algebraic coconutism is the much mattering thing, the crustiest bit, the topping of their inability to self-indict, the upmost of the glaring hypocritizenism of Chinese Citizen projection of own faults and failings of they onto suchlike 'american' mythological scrapegoats.

Alas, alas, alas, alas, pentuple alas, making funningism and unjust blameplacing is the heart and soul of desperate Chinese Shitizenism and dishwashingism, the longtime standing base of authoritarian, abortion-loving, Tibet-raping Chinese communaughty spirit, which claims to aspire to travel the stars, but really glories in roadside buttsurfing, such as is recounted in official propaganda stories like as Mousy Dung's Long March of Roadside Defecation of Chinese fabled past.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:50 | 2957630 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

Obama didn't "win".   Romney (read: the Republican Party) lost.  They beat themselves.  As has been said here many times, Obama was just the lesser of the evils offered.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 17:21 | 2958047 Buckaroo Banzai
Buckaroo Banzai's picture

Actually, he was clearly the GREATER of the two evils, but that didn't stop me from not voting.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:29 | 2957522 Flakmeister
Flakmeister's picture

Actaully LMS, CC was dropped when the Waxman-Markey Bill was tabled in the Senate.... By that time, O knew that any and all political capital had to be put behined Romneycare....

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:21 | 2957158 knightowl77
knightowl77's picture

David Axlerod thanks you for being a well behaved sheep

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:27 | 2957186 Lost My Shorts
Lost My Shorts's picture

I am not a sheep.  I hate Obama, and sincerely wish the Republicans weren't such idiots and would lose their extremist positions and offer up a decent candidate.  If there had never been any such thing as the Tea Party, and they left it to the pros, the Repubs would have both the Senate and White House right now.  But they are too dumb to understand that.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:45 | 2957269 whstlblwr
whstlblwr's picture

Right, the Tea Party isn't about social conservatism, it's fiscal conservatism. Get it straight, blow hard. And all of us understand you were successful to co-opt the Tea Party and now you can blame them to try to redeem your failed party.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:50 | 2957297 bobnoxy
bobnoxy's picture

Wow, that could be the dumbest post of the day. How do Tea Partiers vote on social issues anyway? Pro Choice? How about gay marriage?

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:57 | 2957336 whstlblwr
whstlblwr's picture

You watch too much TV. Find out about origination of current movement before it was successfully hijacked by scared GOP.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:28 | 2957518 Bicycle Repairman
Bicycle Repairman's picture

Tea Partiers have got to take their "brand" back then.  They were 'had' a little too easily.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:37 | 2957560 blunderdog
blunderdog's picture

    Find out about origination of current movement...

It was a decent idea from one guy, but the folks who turned out (and turned it into a "party") never had a platform or anything.  They were just pissed off.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:00 | 2957355 Lost My Shorts
Lost My Shorts's picture

Tea Party is not coherent in any ideological sense.  Libertarians, American Taliban, and Christian jihadi all call themselves Tea Party.  What they have in common is rebellion against the party pros who sell out unpopular positions (like "personhood") to win elections.  The effective Tea Party MO is to set the ship on fire, then go down with it.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:09 | 2957406 odatruf
odatruf's picture

I accept that the Tea Party is not coherent in sense. Most of the "keep the government away from my Medicare" placard carrying, silly hat wearing fools are absurd. And most the ones who aren't absurd, are rent seeking GOPers looking to co-opt a movement.

All that said, they represent the only real hope I have that we won't slit our own wrists and smile doing so. If they can keep the intractable and unplacateable pressure on Speaker Boehner to not make some grand bargain with the Senate or Obama when the debt ceiling is reached and they force the nation to go through the managed bankruptcy that is required, then one day we will look back and build monuments to them.

For that, I am willing to accept the massive disruption, displacement and pain it will cause. And I have and will lose more than most.


Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:21 | 2957473 Flakmeister
Flakmeister's picture

Dick Armey as a front for the Kochs hijacked whatever well motivated protest there was...

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 16:51 | 2957863 Michaelwiseguy
Michaelwiseguy's picture

+ 1 for that Flak.

Shortly after the 2008 Ron Paul campaign, I went to confront Dick Army at a local Tea Party event in my neighborhood to protest their astro turffing the Ron Paul movement.

Fuck them scumbags.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:02 | 2957363 odatruf
odatruf's picture

LMS - it may be true that had the Tea Party never existed or had the GOP put up a firewall against them joining their party, they may be looking at electoral success today. It's impossible to know, but let's even agree that it would have happened that.

OK, now I ask: to what end? 

I think that all that would have been different with the pre-Tea Party GOP in power is the big government  priorities would be slightly different. We would still be riding uncontrolled increases in spending, we would still be sitting on a mountain of bills for past excesses, we would still be looking at an even great mountain of new bills to make good on current promises and we would increase the credit limit on our debt as a routine matter without any pause at all.  Spending on health care would still grow faster than growth of GDP, spending on the military would still dwarf the combined spending of most of the rest of the world, and the sacrifice of liberty in the name of security would still be wrapped neatly in flag soaked images and language of patriotism and duty.

And, the Fed would still be creating new fiat hand over fist in order to keep the mirage of low interest rates in place, at the expense of savers and anyone who must trade an increasing quantity of their labor for an inflation propelled basket of goods.

None. Of. It. Matters.

The. Truth. Will. Out.


Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:22 | 2957476 Lost My Shorts
Lost My Shorts's picture

I disagree.  There is a real problem with "my way or the highway" anti-establishment extremism.  You can't carry everything to the mountain top.  If you try to carry everything, you break down and don't make it.  Romney lost because his base required him to try to carry all their extremist baggage up the mountain, not to mention his own baggage.

The Republicans need to decide what they want to carry.  If they would leave personhood and Christian jihad and Bibi behind, they might make it up the mountain with fiscal responsibility.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:31 | 2957531 Bicycle Repairman
Bicycle Repairman's picture

The GOP needs to listen to the grass roots more and the money less.  Right now it's all about the money.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 16:02 | 2957667 Oldwood
Oldwood's picture

Really? Who the hell here isn't talking about money? I hope all of you contrarian assholes choke to death on the crap coming down the pipeline at you. Such idealists, only willing to accept the purity of vision that only the taliban could provide. Obama will proceed to suck the wealth out of the wealthly and when he is done he will turn to the rest of us, calmly proclaiming that it wasn't nearly enough, now its our turn. Divide and conquer baby! Thats what it is about. I can't exclaim loudly enough what a genuine demonstration of how totally fucked up this world is than reading the posts on this site. Jesus, just go out and buy the gas cans and start burning this shit down! That seems to be what everyone wants here. Any of you dumbasses got any kids you give a shit about? Or are you hoping for some new extended constitutional right to abortion, so those troublesome moochers can just be eliminated, even years after birth. Afterall, we wouldn't want our self pleasure to in anyway be inconvenienced by an "unwanted child". The self absorbtion here is just fantastic! Just wait until economic forces are in play to have the need for the "extremely late term abortion" when you turn 70 and they don't have the money to feed you. You can rationalize anything if you put your mind to it.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 17:12 | 2957995 Flakmeister
Flakmeister's picture


I guess Eisenhower was a redistributor of wealth...

BTW, Deadwood would be more fitting a handle...

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 17:20 | 2958044 Bicycle Repairman
Bicycle Repairman's picture

Dude, I think I may want to tear you another asshole, but in all that shit I can't find it.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 17:05 | 2957932 odatruf
odatruf's picture

LMS - I agree that if the GOP might make it up the mountain (succeed electorally) if they left the other shit behind and only or at least mostly focused on fiscal stewardship. That would be great for me.

But you are confusing the Tea Party with evangelicals and establishment GOPers. Yes, I recognize there is overlap and that they both have co-opted the movement, but I maintain that the core and insurgent TP stands for the fiscal matters first, liberty second and the other stuff a distant third.

So far, my way of the highway, as demonstrated by the debt ceiling stand, is the only position that produces results. Every prior bargain, deal, compromise and trade off has resulted in the spending restraint side of the deal being let off the hook.  Show me some action on the mandatory spending and say no to some special interests and then hold that line for a full budget cycle, and then we can talk about new dollars. Until then, I'll shoot the hostages myself. Metaphorically, of course.




Wed, 11/07/2012 - 18:29 | 2958403 Fred C Dobbs
Fred C Dobbs's picture

odaturf you seem to be the only thinking person on this thread.  I am wondeirng why I come to zerohedge anymore.  

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 19:18 | 2958581 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

Read "The Creature From Jekyll Island, a Second Look at the Federal System", 5th Ed., G. Edward Griffin, ISBN:  978-0-912986-45-6

US Govt spending cannot EVER be cut (until the Fed Reserve and fractional reserve banking is abolished)!

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:22 | 2957164 eclectic syncretist
eclectic syncretist's picture

"the 47 percent, although with the best of intentions, are still only a mob out to get what they can from others who have earned or produced the wealth in the private sector"

What does the author expect, the 47% to let the 1% be the sole benefactor of Ben's money printing.  I mean, since our currency is founded on imagination only, and printed at will by the Fed, where does this guy get off thinking "fairness" is even part of the game.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:48 | 2957284 CH1
CH1's picture

The 47% want to be pampered in their parasitism.

Bankers being scum doesn't make parasites noble.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:08 | 2957394 Lost My Shorts
Lost My Shorts's picture

Oh, and the other problem with Republicans is refusal to join the "reality-based community."  Like you, for example.  You have no idea who the 47% are, and yet you ramble on.

The biggest chunk of the 47% who don't pay income taxes are retired, and skew Republican !!!  Plenty are AWMs on oxycontin who voted for Romney.

What most people want is jobs with middle class incomes (which the Republican party has no intention to give them).  They are not parasites by choice, though if no jobs are to be had, plan B is just to survive.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:26 | 2957501 bobnoxy
bobnoxy's picture

And we know that incomes and jobs skew to those with higher levels of education. And since we also know that educational achievement is lower in red states, we can assume that the majority of people on unemploymment and food stamps are likely Republican voters. Which puts them in the 47% too.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:41 | 2957562 CH1
CH1's picture

and the other problem with Republicans... Like you, for example.

LOL... I'm a Republican??... I mean, really... LOL!!!!

One of these days, you knee-jerkers should look up something called The Fallacy of The Excluded Middle. Really.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:51 | 2957631 Lost My Shorts
Lost My Shorts's picture

OK, maybe you are not Republican, but you chant the 47% meme like a Republican and do not belong to the reality-based community, like most Republicans.  Before lecturing others on fallacies, maybe you should consider the unreality of your own statements.  Who are the 47% really?  How many people would really prefer to be parasites rather than have decent jobs, given the choice?  You have no idea and don't care.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 17:02 | 2957936 CH1
CH1's picture

How old are you, son?

You don't know a damn thing about me. I was deeply in touch with the dependent class decades ago... and not one or two.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:50 | 2957263 Count de Money
Count de Money's picture

The post above shows why Romney lost: The successful appeal of the Obama campaign to the low information voter, and specifically, those whose vote hinges on a single issue. These are the people that were successfully swayed by focus group tested bromides.

Example 1: "Tax breaks for companies that ship jobs overseas." I dare anyone to find anything in the IRS code that explicitly says this.

Example 2: "The policies that got us into this mess in the first place." I doubt any Obama voter could connect the dots between the Bush tax cuts and the 2008 meltdown. So, no need to explain how, just give them the conclusion and they'll buy it.

Example 3 (provided above): "... absolute government control over women's bodies, ..." I don't see how my not wanting to pay for some stranger's birth control is "absolute government control over women's bodies". But again, no need to explain how to these people.

There isn't a single Obama voter who voted for what Obama stands for. Not one. Instead, every one of them voted against what they were told the Republicans were for, whether it was true or not.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 16:27 | 2957371 geoffr
geoffr's picture

What a beautiful, beautiful post. You hit almost all my pet peeves.

Regarding 2). I actually challenged a thread on Facebook to causually link the wars and tax policy of Bush (regardless of your thoughts on those) and the housing bubble and subsequent bust. All I got was mockery or changing of the subject.

Regarding 3). I had a conversation with a liberal friend and she thinks that way. I'm not sure, but in her mind if you are an employer and actually take normal tax deductions you should do whatever the government tells you to do. The camel's nose under the tent if there ever was one. Although I tried to frame it in terms of freedom of association, no dice. My best guess is that since most health care comes through employers, they can't conceive of obtaining anything on their own. So telling someone I won't force an employer to buy something is equivalent to banning something in their minds.

It's like that scene in Shawshank where Morgan Friedman asks the grocery manager if he can take a piss.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:09 | 2957372 geoffr
geoffr's picture


Wed, 11/07/2012 - 19:24 | 2958610 Count de Money
Count de Money's picture

Brilliant riposte.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:09 | 2957387 bobnoxy
bobnoxy's picture

''Low information voter''? Didn't Bill Maher or Jon Stewart coin that phrase as to Republican voters who get their news and information mostly from Fox?

Other than that, the rest of your post was pretty garbled and made no sense. You could have had more time, you know?

As for example 1 there, when a manufacturer like Apple ships their manufacturing overseas, that's where they book their profits. Then those profits are parked offshore and they pay almost nothing in taxes, which seems to have everything to do with why they do that in the first place.

Corporate taxes are the lowest vs. total revenues than they've been in decades, and oddly, the deficits are through the roof. No correlation, I'm sure, right?

Remember the Bush era ''Jobs Creation Act of 2004''? As for your example #2.

That's when they gave massive tax breaks for companies to bring those profits back home, covered politically in how they'd use the money to create jobs. They didn't of course, and more proof of the policies that Bush used, like cutting taxes on those least likely to spend, that took us from a solid economy under Clinton to the worst economy since the Depression.

Not one net private sector job was created under Bush's two terms, a new record for failure.

While you were sleeping, of course.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:48 | 2957616 blunderdog
blunderdog's picture

    There isn't a single Obama voter who voted for what Obama stands for.

I think you're largely correct about the problem of the Repubs and the success of the Dems, but how could you say this?  Obama doesn't seem to "stand for" ANYTHING.

What do YOU think he stands for?

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 16:20 | 2957703 RichardP
RichardP's picture

What do YOU think he stands for?

Self-determination for other nations??

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 17:16 | 2958018 CH1
CH1's picture

Obama is the Patron Saint of Getting More Than You Deserve.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 17:33 | 2958131 blunderdog
blunderdog's picture

That may be, but it hasn't got anything to do with the Presidency.  It's not like he's the one giving away money--that's CONGRESS doing that. 

I suspect Medicare-D is going to blow up that system shortly.  It'll be interesting to see if anyone in the legislature stands up and makes a plea for sanity.

I doubt it.  They'll all just keep cashing paychecks until they start bouncing.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 19:23 | 2958604 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

"The purpose of a System is what it DOES."

-- "Have Fun at Work", ISBN 0-937063-05-3, by William L. Livingston, F.E.S. Books

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 19:46 | 2958673 Cathartes Aura
Cathartes Aura's picture

while yer Count'g de Money, you're missing out on important facts (though I realise you don't care),

Example 3 (provided above): "... absolute government control over women's bodies, ..." I don't see how my not wanting to pay for some stranger's birth control is "absolute government control over women's bodies". But again, no need to explain how to these people.

you could do a little re-search on the Sanctity of Life proposed Constitutional Amendment, which has been discussed in ZH threads for over a year, I should know, I've argued with many the fine points, and yet, wow, no one cares to know.

after years of keeping it on the agenda, Paul Ryan grabbed the baton, and will run with it, in a new improved version, how fuckin' surprising - and yet, wow, still no one here seems to know about this. . .

conclusion?  most of you don't care, even if you have daughters, and sons, you don't care enough about their future to even look into the proposal and apply any critical thinking to possible cultural outcomes.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:42 | 2957587 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

Five things the Republican Party must do - MarketWatch

By Rex Nutting, MarketWatch


WASHINGTON (MarketWatch) — Four years ago, the Republican Party set as its No. 1 goal the ruination of Barack Obama. Nothing was more important than making sure that Obama was not re-elected.

The party failed miserably in its task. Now it’s time for the Grand Old Party to take a cold hard look at itself.

If the Republicans couldn’t win this election — against a Democratic president who’s presided over such a pathetic economic recovery — you have to wonder when they’ll ever be successful.

It’s not that Republicans are bereft of good ideas, or attractive candidates. They have plenty of both. But there’s a kind of imbedded flaw at the center of the party that’s prevented it from achieving the kind of success that it feels entitled to.

The Republicans aren’t seeking my advice, and they aren’t likely to take it. But I’ll give it anyway.

Here are five things the Republican Party should do for its own sake and for the sake of the country it loves so well.

5) Stop talking about rape, abortion, gay marriage and other divisive social issues. For decades, these wedge issues were a magic amulet for the Republicans that helped them win close races.

But the American people have moved on. We’re more tolerant, and less likely to think that we should legislate our morality on our neighbors. Gay rights are more accepted every year, especially among the younger generations, who see nothing wrong with gays and lesbians caring for each other, or with serving their country in the military.

When an openly gay woman can be elected to the Senate from Wisconsin, you know times have changed.

The Republicans would now have a commanding majority in the Senate except for one thing: Too many of its candidates in 2010 and 2012 said what they really thought. You can’t get elected by spreading hate or apologizing for rapists.

4) Embrace the diversity of America. Ever since the election of 1966, the Republican Party has benefited from a “southern strategy” that used fear and thinly disguised racism to peel working-class whites away from the Democrats’ New Deal Coalition.

But the demographics are now going the other way as the nation becomes more diverse. Appealing only to white voters is no longer enough if you want to win national elections.

What would have happened if Mitt Romney and the Republican establishment had firmly rejected any racially tinged attacks against Obama? Instead of calling Obama un-American, a foreigner, a Kenyan, a Muslim, and a lazy “shuck-and-jiver,” what if the Republicans had just respectfully disagreed with his policies? Could Romney have gained a couple of extra percentage points in Florida, Colorado, Nevada, New Mexico, Virginia or Ohio? Probably.

3) Dump Grover Norquist. By agreeing with Norquist’s non-negotiable demand that taxes can never go up under any circumstance, the Republicans have painted themselves and our country into a very dark corner.

The Norquist pledge has done more damage to our country than anything else Washington has done. Without Norquist’s hold on the Republican Party, we’d still have our AAA credit rating. We’d be on our way to solving our long-term deficit problem the way almost every American wants it solved: Through negotiated compromise to reduce unnecessary spending, as well as modest tax increases to make sure the government has the revenue it needs to do what we ask it to do.

Every bipartisan debt plan we’ve ever had has included both spending cuts and tax increases.

President Obama will face a divided Congress, making the threat of that the U.S. will go over the fiscal cliff likely. University of Chicago economics professor Randall Kroszner discusses on Markets Hub. Plus, the re-election of Obama means he gets to nominate the next Federal Reserve Chief. Who might it be? Photo: AFP/GettyImages.

The only thing standing in the way of resolving the immediate crisis of the fiscal cliff — or the longer-term problem of unsustainable debt — is the Norquist pledge.

2) Stick to the small-government philosophy. The best thing the Republican Party has going for it is its skepticism of big government. The American people are torn between wanting a government that can help solve our collective problems and wanting a government that leaves us alone.

We need to have a strong voice that’s constantly reminding us that Americans don’t want Washington to intrude in every facet of our lives. We don’t want petty regulations, onerous taxes or the heavy hand of government. But we also know that the federal government does have a role in tackling problems that are too big for any person, any industry, or even any state to handle alone.

We want small government, but we also want our Social Security and our Medicare.

1) Accept Barack Obama as the legitimate president of all. He’s won two elections now, and it’s time to recognize that he’s our leader. No one expects the Republicans to kneel down to Obama, but we do expect that an enlightened country — even one that’s almost evenly divided between Republicans and Democrats — can find a way to move forward.

Obama ignited our hopes when, as a political unknown in 2004, he spoke movingly of his vision of a nation that wasn’t made up of blue states and red states but of united states. Obama hasn’t always lived up to that ideal, but then neither have the Republican leaders.

If you think that it’s impossible for Republicans and Democrats to ever work together to unite this divided nation, just recall that amazing scene of Obama and Republican Gov. Chris Christie joining in a common cause after Hurricane Sandy devastated the Eastern seaboard.

We won’t always have a hurricane to bring us together, but that’s OK. We have much bigger problems to deal with, and all of us — red and blue — need to be part of the solution.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:59 | 2957656 Flakmeister
Flakmeister's picture

Yeah, I'd say that pretty well sums it up....

Nice to see Norquist called out....

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 17:17 | 2958022 Thisson
Thisson's picture

The tax burden is already obscene.  It's crazy to raise taxes even higher.  Gov't is completely irresponsible in its spending.  It's a spending problem, not a revenue problem.  So no, I don't think Norquist is the problem and I do think GOP is right to dig its heels in.  Their real problem is that they have no credibility in actually reducing government, because when they were in control, they didn't make the changes they claim to stand for.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 16:22 | 2957708 RichardP
RichardP's picture

I heard that the Republicans' goal over the next four years is still to make certain that Obama is a one-term president.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 17:17 | 2958020 Spastica Rex
Spastica Rex's picture

These recommendations only make sense if you believe that national politics in the US is a struggle of ideology and that govenment has a desire to represent its constuents as a whole.

I just don't believe it anymore.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 17:22 | 2958060 vic and blood
vic and blood's picture


Some of those points are excellent...and some are a crock of shit. Chris Christie is a RINO who practically runs as a Democrat. He is a panderer and an all around disgusting man. Extremely poor example. Both of those creeps were campaigning, not "working together." "Amazing scene"!! You are a gullible sap. Now you are nauseating me.

Embrace diversity? Fine. But not through 10 million more amnesty Democrats. Demographics are killing us. The answer is to bring in many millions more?

In its entirety, your post certainly makes a good case for candidates to all run on a similiar platform. Some with the D and some with the R. If you can't beat them, join them. Your plan? Just be Republicans in name only. Good plan.

The original Tea Party showed how it was done. No religion. No social issues. That movement was immediately infiltrated, subverted, and perverted. Soon, a former mudshark, VP candidate, and Zionist neocon bimbo was presented as a Tea Party leader and pundit. A former Bush toady lunatic Zionist Bible thumper still leads the Tea Party caucus. Bush league bat boy, Sean Hannity, a Tea Partyer? How stupid must Hannity be to think WE are that stupid?

You pay lip service to smaller government. Will that include gutting Obamacare? Didn't think so.

Your "working together" is just doublespeak for let's just do the socialist thing. You are nothing but a glib Obamabot.

The neocon Republicans didn't just get a gift from God second chance rescue from the wilderness by the Tea Party, which they squandered, they got a miracle third chance with Ron Paul showing up with millions of idealistic and energetic young patriots, something the aging GOP desperately needed. We know how that went. 

The GOP is now truly a regional and rural party. In the future, about as relevant as the Whigs. The only hope for this country? Such a disastrous second term and total collapse that the Democrats are even more despised and discredited. Would I wish for such a thing? You better believe it. Your leader had a scorched earth policy. I hope you both reap what you have sown. Enjoy your victory.



Wed, 11/07/2012 - 17:27 | 2958093 Spastica Rex
Spastica Rex's picture

Wow - you really believe that something was at stake in this election?


Wed, 11/07/2012 - 17:54 | 2958229 vic and blood
vic and blood's picture


Even if the ONLY difference in the world would be higher hi-cap mag and ammo prices, can't I be cranky for a few days for that reason alone? I suspect other slight differences will emerge.


Wed, 11/07/2012 - 18:00 | 2958253 Spastica Rex
Spastica Rex's picture

Sure - I get it.

My football watching friends (well, former friends) react the same way when WSU loses to UW in the Apple Cup. It can last for many days. I think their lives are altered about as much, too.

I stopped watching football about 15 years ago.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 22:23 | 2959076 RichardP
RichardP's picture



Go Wenatchee!!

Sun, 11/11/2012 - 14:18 | 2970233 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

Vic, I didn't write the goddam article.  The statements aren't "mine".  Get a grip dude.

The article has some interesting concepts that cannot be discarded out of hand.  Your knee-jerk comments exhibit that.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 20:41 | 2958794 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

Items 3) & 2) are mutually exclusive.

"Dreams Come Due, Government and Economics as if Freedom Mattered", ISBN: 0-671-61159-3, by John Galt

The book is dated, but many of the things it talks about are still valid today.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 19:28 | 2958629 Cathartes Aura
Cathartes Aura's picture

you raise some great points Lost My Shorts, and until they sink in all the repetitive whining about "obamaphones" or whatever is the fave meme of the day to twit here will keep the minds occupied, and dissuade any real thought process from completing.

it's rather sad to see these kinds of posts at ZH. . . daily. . .

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 13:47 | 2956994's picture



Rand Paul certainly came out of this looking very bad as well. He fell in line behind the party masters, banking on some advantage to be gained through an endorsement of Romney. He ended up just looking politically unsavvy and unprincipled. There is little to be gained either, from playing ball with a Party that as inept as the GOP at this point.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 13:50 | 2956998 redpill
redpill's picture

Right because we certainly wouldn't want one of the few remotely liberty-minded Senators to stay in office.  Wait, what?

You need to get over it.  Yes he's working within the establishment to try to make things happen.  It's not my favorite either, but that's better than him not being there at all.

In case you didn't notice, the cause of liberty doesn't have a whole lot of advocates in our government.  I'll take what we can get.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 13:53 | 2957029 Flakmeister
Flakmeister's picture

This is Rand Paul you are talking about?

Just making sure....

Remind us of the effort he made to protect the liberty of medicare transfers versus the efforts he made elsewhere...

Ron Paul would be calling out his son if blood was not thicker than water...

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:40 | 2957243 DaveyJones
DaveyJones's picture

difference between father and son is one's a politician, one's not

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:55 | 2957647 blunderdog
blunderdog's picture

Rand didn't get his dad's brains, either, but dumb is better than evil.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 17:19 | 2958036 Spastica Rex
Spastica Rex's picture

dumb is better than evil

Dubious hypothesis.

I don't care anymore what someone's motivation is: what do they do?

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 17:36 | 2958153 blunderdog
blunderdog's picture

Who cares what some dude in Congress *does*?  There are only a handful of those guys who matter at all. 

Rand ain't one of 'em.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 17:45 | 2958192 Spastica Rex
Spastica Rex's picture

dumb < evil

Still don't see it.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 22:48 | 2959116 blunderdog
blunderdog's picture

Point taken.


EDIT: It occurs to me I do have a basis for my reasoning, so I'll share.  I believe "stupid" implies "less likely to achieve one's goals," and when it comes to politicians, any ADDITIONAL limit on their power to fuck things up is a fine thing.

"Evil" clearly has no effect on whether one's policies will be supported and/or enforced, and I suspect that the more intelligent the politician, the more likely to get an agenda carried out.  ANY additional exertion of political power onto the subjects at this point is bad.

In the absence of anyone with an agenda I could support, I'm perfectly happy to settle for "ineffectual."

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 23:45 | 2959335 Spastica Rex
Spastica Rex's picture

Yes - I'm not disagreeing with you on any important level. Sometimes I get stuck on logic, and sometimes I get crosswise with logic - as in this case, since stupidity can hardly be considered a "motivation."

+1 for you.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:08 | 2957397 geoffr
geoffr's picture

All the Rand Paul bashing showed me was that the Ron Paul folks have no hope of getting anyting done politically because they can't stomach dealing with anything impure or taking half a loaf when they can't even win much of anything at all during primaries, let alone the general.

Frankly, Rand should distance himself from these folks and continue what he's doing.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 16:27 | 2957728 Overfed
Overfed's picture

If Rand would  step away from the Party platform, he might have a chance to regain some respect. Until he does that, and does it consistently, he's just another Republican.

What with Ron Paul retiring this year, coupled with his advancing age, the hope for pro-liberty representation at the Federal level is sadly waning.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:44 | 2957262 aerojet
aerojet's picture

Yeah, Rand has been a real dud, quite frankly.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:55 | 2957331 LMAOLORI
LMAOLORI's picture



All that was ushered in was the NWO, world wide Communism get ready for the echo taxes, higher gas, electricity, food you will all share the pain while people like obama and the elites share the gain.

Obama May Levy Carbon Tax to Cut U.S. Deficit, HSBC Says


TOLOCZKO: Proposed carbon taxes set to spike energy costs


Obama's best friend at Goldman Sachs

Fitch Warns On 2013 U.S. Downgrade If Fiscal Cliff Not Avoided

Bill Black: Wall Street Urges Obama to Commit the Great Betrayal

Wall Street’s leading “false flag” group, the Third Way, has responded to the warnings that Robert Kuttner, AFL-CIO President Trumka, and I have made that if President Obama is re-elected our immediate task will be to prevent the Great Betrayal – the adoption of self-destructive austerity programs and the opening wedge of the effort to unravel the safety net (including Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid).

Read the Rest
Read more at 

Third Way Document Proves Democratic Party Supports Institutionalized Looting by Banks 

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:00 | 2957068 GOSPLAN HERO
GOSPLAN HERO's picture

This type of thinking is verboten in America's public schools.

... liberty, values, critical thinking, courage ... verboten topics!


Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:38 | 2957239 DaveyJones
DaveyJones's picture

...and train your youngins how to garden.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:51 | 2957303 AgShaman
AgShaman's picture

.....and reload their brass

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 13:39 | 2956943 zapdude
zapdude's picture

131 million voted in 2008

117 million voted in 2012

= 14 million fewer voters

I believe this is directly related to people's increasing refusal to play the game, since they can clearly see it is irredeemably corrupt.

We'll know when the whole corrupted system has finally collapsed when an election is held and nobody votes.  Actually, I think open civil war will come before that, but declining voter participation should be another indicator as to how close we are to civil war.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 13:45 | 2956977 buzzsaw99
buzzsaw99's picture

That is the number I got wrong earlier. Thank you.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 13:55 | 2957043 walküre
walküre's picture

As long as the GOP represents itself as exclusively white, male, country club or old money they shouldn't be surprised to keep losing.

That party exists in Germany as well and they get typically around 5% of the votes because that is how many voters can actually identify with that party.

The US needs more political parties to increase voter turnout and political participation. The GOP is a mockery.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:28 | 2957200 Urban Redneck
Urban Redneck's picture

It's impossible to accurately reflect the views of an entire electorate with only two parties (and their both guilty of the BS).


Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:55 | 2957314 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

Exactly.  That's why both parties campaign with one slate and govern with another.  And the notion that a 3rd party would have no influence is flat wrong.  All the major networks show the Senate/House seating chart with RED or BLUE members.   Imagine a 3rd color on those charts!   That party would be wined and dined to swing them to the larger red or blue sides.  They'd have outsized influence to advance their agenda.   What color should we assign this 3rd party?   I kinda like green but there is a Green Party already so that won't work.  Primary colors won't work. 

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:13 | 2957421 OpenThePodBayDoorHAL
OpenThePodBayDoorHAL's picture

Agree. I'm not a fan but here in Australia the Green Party has 5%, and gets to be the decider between the Repubs and Dems (or their equivalent). A real third party would be fantastic for America. I don't think it's Libertarianism, that's too wacked out. More like the Common Sense Party: stop US imperial adventures, restore basic civil liberties, close ridiculous corporate tax loopholes that let GE and Verizon and Microsoft and Mariott and Boeing pay little or no taxes, and prosecute blatant financial fraud, all the things Obama didn't do, those are my Big Four. Leave the Ayn Rand stuff out of it. People don't want to close the government, they want to shrink it.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:39 | 2957573 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

I appreciate your support, but you might want to take a look at Gary Johnson's platform.  He got my vote a week before our national election date.  Making a decision and voting early was easy.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:53 | 2957315 witness2012
witness2012's picture

We don't need more parties. We need people to march peacefully in the streets day after day to demand that the laws on the books get enforced. Until the corrupt politicians and bankers go to jail until people are held accountable for their actions there will be no turn around. Everyone now knows that the system is more corrupt than ancient Rome. But sadly everyone will continue to gripe on blogs and still pay their taxes and still go to work and just grin and bare it, that is until the complete collapse comes and then they will all be shocked as to how did we get to this point? Perhaps 4 years from now when Obama has so thoroughly destroyed the economy that the sheeple are feeling real pain they will take to the streets and demand accountability? By then it may be too late.

Sun, 11/11/2012 - 14:20 | 2970239 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

Okay!  A "Law Party".  I like it.  It could be orange.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 13:59 | 2957054 falak pema
falak pema's picture

re : civil war.

I don't see a political awareness in the american people to coalesce around a unified political platform for revolt and active dissension. The occupy WS has nothing in common with the tea party or the red neck deep south revolt. 

Do you see these different urban/rural/suburban cum cultural-ethnic patchworks finding a common ground to become a political force with a common platform?

I see the US  very far away from that awareness; it'll take time and pain. This generation is totally dis-organised and clueless. 

Guns and ammo don't mean anything else than anarchy and summary repression. The US administration is very good at that as its shown all over the globe.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:16 | 2957440 odatruf
odatruf's picture

I think the Occupy Movement and the Tea Party could have found common ground against the elite rent seeking class that moves between Wall Street and Washington.

Culturally, they are so unlike, however, that they could not see that they faced the same opponent.

Thu, 11/08/2012 - 15:26 | 2961558 kingslayer
kingslayer's picture

The Tea party is far to stupid to see their corporate overlords. The blame the gummint for everything.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 16:31 | 2957741 Overfed
Overfed's picture

The US has been very successfully Balkanized.

Divided and conquered.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:07 | 2957101 aint no fortuna...
aint no fortunate son's picture

I was one of the non-voters this year. I voted for Obama in 2008. Fool me once, shame on you... fool me twice, shame on me.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:24 | 2957174 Urban Redneck
Urban Redneck's picture

There's already over 118M counted, and w/o the NY/NJ clusterfuck (just by eyeballing the precint %s) there should be at least another million votes left to add to the total.

The drop will in turnout looks to roughly equal the drop between 1992 & 1996 when Bubba was up for relection.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:49 | 2957291 aerojet
aerojet's picture

Dunno what to tell you.  I didn't vote back in '08 either.  I can't remember the last time I did, but I think it was when I lived in NC and that complete asshole POS Edwards was running for Senator and I stood behind some women who were voting for him because he was cute.  I realized then how stupid it all is.  I'm still a serf, but my mind is somewhat more free, at least.  I'm looking at whether I could join the Lakota Sioux or maybe become some kind of Menonite or even Amish.  Anything to get outside of this rotten piece of shit political system but not have to abandon my homeland for foreign soil where I will just be a derided "expat" instead of a proud 12th generation American.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 17:41 | 2958173 vic and blood
vic and blood's picture

The Amish have a significant presence in the far Northwestern corner of Montana. You would like it there. About 40 miles away, at the top of the Idaho panhandle, the Mennonites are well established. I grew up there. Lovely climate and friendly residents. The Mennonites are wonderful people and they would be happy to have you. If you are single, you could wind up with a beautiful chaste bride and a large farm. The Mennonites can even drive automobiles, which makes their sect preferable to me.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 21:04 | 2958861 Cathartes Aura
Cathartes Aura's picture

of course, your "beautiful chaste bride" will expect you to give up lap dances & watching porn, etc.

somehow I doubt. . .

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:06 | 2957296 Ignatius J Reilly
Ignatius J Reilly's picture

= 14 million fewer voters

I believe this is directly related to people's increasing refusal to play the game, since they can clearly see it is irredeemably corrupt.


Oh if that were true, I'd have some hope.  But it isn't and you know it.


I wrote in Ron Paul.  Did you?

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:12 | 2957417 zapdude
zapdude's picture

I voted Gary Johnson, since he was on the ticket in KS and Ron Paul was no longer running for the Presidency.  I love RP, and I understand his reasons for staying with the GOP, but I'm revoking my GOP affiliation and probably will never vote in anything except local issues again. 

For example, our city successfully rejected flouridating our drinking water, for the THIRD time. I'll vote for things like that, but I will no longer play in DC's political whorehouse, as it is only a way to lose your soul and become blind to the truth.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:17 | 2957448 Mysteerious Roo...
Mysteerious Rooshian Vooman's picture



I wrote in Merlin Miller and Virginia Abernethy.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 16:37 | 2957779 fuu
fuu's picture

I did, I added a pi-rat as vice.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:10 | 2957407 ilovefreedom
ilovefreedom's picture

Exactly what I was just looking at myself.

So 14M fewer eligible voters voted. From 2008 to 2012 there were an additional 7M citizens who became eligible to vote, since participation is around 50% we'll say 3.5M of those were absent, so the delta is about 17M who opted out of the system.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 13:55 | 2957037 Manthong
Manthong's picture

One stat attested to by an ovbious rabid tea party tin foil hat stumped-tooth bearded Appalchian mountain man.


Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:02 | 2957082 Uncle Remus
Uncle Remus's picture

Let's leave beards out of this...

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:30 | 2957199 aint no fortuna...
aint no fortunate son's picture

I noticed that article. I have it on good authority that the Dems also imported several thousand extraterrestrials from Alpha Centauri to steal FL. Prob was, they fit right in with the native population so nobody could prove it, those sneaky fucks. If anybody knows anything about it, I'm paying big bernanke bucks for photos.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 16:05 | 2957679 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

Lotsa difference between what he reported and what black churches do on the Sunday before voting day?  Load 'em up and take "souls to the polls".   Moving a constituency to vote is not a new phenomenon.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 16:45 | 2957831 akak
akak's picture

Yes, being bearded obviously discredits anyone speaking over political matters (or anything else).

Could you possibly be more shallow and vacuous?

Sun, 11/11/2012 - 14:21 | 2970242 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

The guy was more articulate than most, for sure.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:31 | 2957178 krispkritter
krispkritter's picture

Not in answer  to your question but the largest exit poll I found. Pretty telling stats in age and race categories. Forgive the source, couldn't find the original(Edison).


Wed, 11/07/2012 - 15:04 | 2957375 LMAOLORI
LMAOLORI's picture



That Excutive Order for Amnesty obama issued sure paid off 

Record Latino vote key to Obama’s re-election

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 18:42 | 2958463 keesooi
keesooi's picture

According to Josh Lederman at Associated Press, 57.5% of eligible voters participated, so once again, the largest portion (42.5%) of voters excercised their right not to vote, and I was proud to be part of that group (Obama got 28.5%, or around 50% of the 57%), as I'm sure most of you here on ZH. 


Wed, 11/07/2012 - 13:22 | 2956825 hedgeless_horseman
hedgeless_horseman's picture



The Solution is to Change the Political Structure

Good luck with that, sir.

Sometimes, there are no good solutions, only good responses.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 13:23 | 2956832 Spastica Rex
Spastica Rex's picture

I think there is no solution; I think there are multiple potential solutions, and people need the liberty to figure them out for themselves in their own states and communities.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 13:41 | 2956950 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

Well, maybe after they've got a decade or two of experiencing enslavement for contrast.

Fourth Turning, and all that...

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:03 | 2957090 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

"figure them out for themselves in their own states and communities."


It will come to this either way.  Supply lines are very fucking real, and very fragile.


Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:21 | 2957159 Panafrican Funk...
Panafrican Funktron Robot's picture

Living close to source food, particularly source food that's near freshwater rivers/lakes = good idea.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:13 | 2957126 RSloane
RSloane's picture

As much as I would dearly love to agree with you, that time has come and gone. This is all about a huge central government slowly absorbing the roles once held by states and communities.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 18:05 | 2958267 Spastica Rex
Spastica Rex's picture

I was attempting to demur with "potential."

The only hope (sic) is that there really isn't enough energy to put together and maintain global systems of control. If there is, it's boots and faces from here on out.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 17:03 | 2957943 CH1
CH1's picture

In their own minds.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 13:43 | 2956954 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

It is rather obvious that there are clear ideological divides within the country. The call for a return to the Articles of Confederation is a good one, but it neglects the consequences of governmental capture by the elites and use of force, like the civil war.

The solution may be found in an indirect confrontation by separate states, choosing to reform the confederation amongst like minded states. The West Coast, The South/Midwest, the Rocky Mountain states and the Ohio Valley/Northeast. As each state withdrawls from federal cooperation, even IF TROOPS ARE SENT, the population acts in support on the face and eliminates the threat in secret. 

You cannot police the entire country. DC and NY might scream and shout, but they are powerless in the face of united confrontation. 

As the confederation proceeds, various areas can choose to provide support for each other. States can choose to operate according to their personal politics, ethics and economics. 

Central power always grows to tyranny. 

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 13:46 | 2956985 Caviar Emptor
Caviar Emptor's picture

I am very concerned about the fate of the angry white male and his tassled-loafer wearing yuppie brother. The political landscape was dominated by the AWM for the past 5 decades. Then all of a sudden the rug has been pulled out from under him as he increasingly rots in the suburbs. Will he go extinct? Or just fade into irrelevancy, all his passions forgotten 

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 13:58 | 2957056 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

Now that the AWM is a true minorty he can finally get some government benefits and go to college for free too.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:04 | 2957084 Real Estate Geek
Real Estate Geek's picture

Interesting play of the race card.  What's that called--the shoehorn? 

Not everything's about race.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:04 | 2957092 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

It is for TPTB as it makes repression and enslavement much easier.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:14 | 2957131 Lost My Shorts
Lost My Shorts's picture

Does the AWM really think that Romney will pay him a middle-class wage at Staples because he is W and M?  That's stupid.  Had Romney won, the AWM would have been punked by Romney as badly as progressives were punked by Obama.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 14:48 | 2957280 lakecity55
lakecity55's picture

As the economic situation deteriorates, more states will begin to assert their authority under the 10thA.


Wed, 11/07/2012 - 13:22 | 2956827 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture


Wed, 11/07/2012 - 13:22 | 2956828 Hangfire
Hangfire's picture

The two things that everybody is going to hear a lot of in the next 4 years are, $20 trillion, and Concierge Doctors.

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 13:26 | 2956843 hedgeless_horseman
hedgeless_horseman's picture



...and, "It's not my fault." 

Wed, 11/07/2012 - 13:33 | 2956898 Leopold B. Scotch
Leopold B. Scotch's picture

I expect to hear a lot of "if ___ R candidate does not deliver this time, then I'll finally vote for the guy who stands up fro liberty!"...  just like I've heard before all the other elections where people have compromised / sacrificed their children's liberty for a few shiny trinkets of slightly lower taxes, etc.

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