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Guest Post: Betray Us

Tyler Durden's picture


Submitted by John Aziz of Azizonomics,

A beautiful cartoon that exposes the absurdity of the Petraeus saga:

A radical idea: instead of carrying out assassinations based on secret kill lists, perhaps the Federal government could start obeying the Constitution, and start issuing arrest warrants or extradition requests for individuals suspected of criminal activity so that they can be tried by a court of law in front of a jury of their peers. We used to call this strange and antiquated notion due process.

The decision to use flying death robots — or as they are known in common speech “drones” — to indiscriminately assassinate terrorism suspects (and their families and neighbours) has already created a new swelling of anger against America in the nations where suspected terrorists have been targeted. As Obama himself recently put it, “there’s no country on earth that would tolerate missiles raining down on its citizens from outside its borders.” Presumably this includes Pakistan, and Yemen, and Libya and Somalia, and other nations where American drone missiles have rained down on citizens.

And one day, other nations  — like China, which is rapidly putting drones into the skies  — might choose to use flying death robots to assassinate their own suspected terrorists on American soil.  Would the American government have any grounds to complain?


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Tue, 11/20/2012 - 16:27 | 2999782 Der Wille Zur Macht
Der Wille Zur Macht's picture

Dronin' and Bonin'

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 16:39 | 2999800 Michaelwiseguy
Michaelwiseguy's picture

Dr. Steve Pechenik believes General Petreaus is a good man.

I hope Petraeus got the classified discs out in time and put them in good hands.


Flying Killer Drone Robots

I've been saying the main stream media is a major enemy of the American people for a while because they lie by omission. 

I don't believe they can brainwash a critical mass of people anymore because virtually nobody tunes into their news channels these days.

It used to be 20 million would watch CNN prime time, but that's down to about 500k now.

The Internet is the new anti-mind control mechanism reaching billions of people today.

As far as being told what to think by the MSM, that it was a "Terrorist Attack", I don't give a rat's ass. I already know terrorism is a gorilla tactic and you can't win a war against a tactic because it's just a thought idea.

I also know why the Libya attack probably happened and why other Muslim countries protests happened, the proven CIA Annex in Benghazi that used the anti-Muslim Youtube video as an excuse, but really it was because we're slaughtering thousands of innocent brown people, women and children with our flying killer drone robots.

The only question I have now is; What are the names of the people who did this attack on the CIA operatives in the State Department, so I can give the Libyan Freedom Fighters the congressional medal of honor, or was it the Mormon Mafia, read Mossad, so I can hang them for it.

Trying to Secure Libya's most delicious Light Sweet Crude Oil deposits for the Owners of the Planet's oil Conglomerate to Control is not a Virtue.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 16:39 | 2999834 Ignatius
Ignatius's picture

This is the time when things get really interesting.  The time when/if the BS fails.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 16:47 | 2999855 kaiserhoff
kaiserhoff's picture

WTF???  At a time when gays serve openly in the military, and have a monopoly on the editorial board of the Jew York Times, what in the cornbread hell is so kinky about a high status male fucking a broad? 

National security issues?  When POTUS couldn't possibly get a security clearance?   ROTFLMAO.

Get over it Dudes and Dudettes.  More fucking diversions.  That is all.  Bunga Bunga on...

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 17:15 | 2999927 economics9698
economics9698's picture

Stalin did the same thing with his top generals in Jewtopia USSR.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 17:23 | 2999948 knukles
knukles's picture

Kaiserhoff nails it...

"fucking diversions"

Nothing like a salacious sex scandal to focus the mind... away from anything else of importance.
Like the banksters keepin keepin on, lack of justice equally for all, money in politics, continued erosion of civil liberties, graft and corruption, incompetence, and a seeming purge of the military.

Penis envy time.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 17:42 | 3000018 TuesdayBen
TuesdayBen's picture

Methinks Gubmint made Petraeus head of CIA with awareness of affair so that he would be compliant, but had to dump him when Broadwell started blabbing, such as in her Univ of Denver speech, when she stated that CIA was holding prisoners in the Benghazi 'consulate'.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 19:44 | 3000350 TBT or not TBT
TBT or not TBT's picture

Obama was holding this over Petraeus in the months leading up to the election, to keep him quiet.   

Of course, after winning the election, the Democrats needed to go ahead and destroy Petraeus politically, because he had been presidentiable until then.

The faux-salaciousness (man had sex with woman, amazing stuff) is of course what the Oba-media focus on NOW, rather than covering the conscious choice to let U.S. embassy staff be killed, by an Al Quaida affliliate that acted inconveniently, under the gaze , no less, of an overhead drone transmitting back to the White House in real time.    

The battle went on for some seven hours while U.S. forces were available to respond in less than two hours, with devastating human directed spectre gunship air support, and/or support from the drone(say, to take out a mortar position, which the CIA ex-SEALs defending our ambassador had "painted" at certain times during the loong battle).

Why did the Obama team let the battle go on, then lie lie lie in orwellian style?    Well it was inconvenient for the public that Al Quaida was not in fact not so much on the run, anywhere but in Libya particularly, as had been trumpeted following the US military's finding and killing a pretty much inoperative OBL during Obama's watch.   That was an election plank.    Also, possibly, the CIA facility nearby may have been operating one of those prisons Obama and the Dems complained about so loudly back when they were out of the white house, back in the Cindy Sheehan days, the Betray-Us ad days.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 20:38 | 3000483 Michaelwiseguy
Michaelwiseguy's picture

I never see 1080p video of "The Base" Members they always speak of on the news. Everyone has a cell phone video cameras these days. I think The Base(Al Qaeda) doesn't really exist except in peoples imaginations. I see more video of flying saucers than I do of people from The Base.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 21:56 | 3000717 Enslavethechild...
EnslavethechildrenforBen's picture

Bankerticians are the only real Terrorist's that actually exist, even if you include the imaginary terrists in a parellell dimension

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 16:56 | 2999872 gmrpeabody
gmrpeabody's picture

"The Internet is the new anti-mind control mechanism reaching billions of people today".

Now THAT is funny!

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 17:21 | 2999902 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

TPTB are going to implement far more control over the internet, or try to. Even though there's a LOT of filler and distraction on the web, there are also far too many people getting far too many "truthy" answers to what TPTB would prefer stay "unknown knowns or known unknowns" (because TPTB dress those things up as too complex to understand, so "just let them take care of those aspects of commerce, warfare, etc.").

Factual information in easy to digest form, free of the massaging/manipulation/coloring by government, available to large numbers of people in widely accessible, convenient and a direct manner, is the most unsettling thing that those in power have ever had to contend with.

Factual information leads to realization.

Realization leads to conviction.

Conviction leads to principle.

Principle leads to motivation.

Motivation leads to organization.

Organization leads to opposition.

Opposition leads to interference with the status quo.

Interference with the status quo leads to breaching of the firewall.

Breaching of the firewall leads to neutering of those in power.

Neutering of those in power leads to revolution.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 18:03 | 3000083 Michaelwiseguy
Michaelwiseguy's picture

Neutering of those in power leads to revolution.

Neutering of those in power Is revolution.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 21:15 | 3000532 Radical Marijuana
Radical Marijuana's picture

"they lie by omission"

Indeed, that is the most important and the best way to be dishonest. However, that applies to us ALL. Power is always distributed. Power can be assembled and channelled. The crucial power is the power to rob, with the ultimate form of that being the power to murder. That is what the power of states is based on. That is what the power of those who control states is based on. "We the People" are supposed to direct that power. However, everyone who is a player in that system has mastered the ability to "lie by omission!"

The best liars believe their own lies. Consider that insight in light of the concept of lying by omission. As usual, we think about power in profoundly backwards ways. (Literally, our mathematical equations that we use to understand power had an arbitrary minus sign inserted in them, because the people developing those equations just liked it better that way.)

The real revolution would not be neutering the power of the elites. The real revolution would be the balancing of the power by more of the people taking back their own power, and using that! There is a well-developed social dance, which requires both those who do nothing, and those who act. 99% prefer to do nothing, while 1% direct the actual use of the power that depends on the work of the other 99% to support that, by doing nothing about it. The real revolution would have to be based on profound changes in the paradigm of militarism, and thus in the ideas about death controls. Without that, then we would have another stupid series of mistakes, where absurd wars would boomerang around to result in absurd revolutions. The REAL revolution would be intellectual. It would revolve the basic ideas about social power to result in reversing those!

The bigger problem is that the vast majority of people do not understand power and do not want to understand it. (Like I said, our current sciences that use the concept of power deliberately made and maintain a backwards paradigm regarding "power" because they wanted to do that.) The ability to lie by omission is profound. It is manifested by taking the biggest social lies almost completely for granted. Almost all of the ideas that various reactionary revolutionaries propose regarding the runaway triumphs of the current systems of organized lies are still the same old backwards lies as those they pretend to oppose.

Neutering of those in power Is NOT revolution. That is just another kind of backwards way of thinking about things. Power never ceases to exist. Power is always distributed. Revolution is about assembling and channelling social power in different ways. Primarily, that would manifest as the consciousness of more people being the consciousness that was the value creating element, which MADE MONEY. It is changing who MAKES THE MONEY that is the real revolution. That money supply should be based on the view that EVERYBODY has some consciousness, and therefore, EVERYBODY should participate in generating the money supply. Right now, power has been more and more concentrated in fewer and fewer hands, so that the source of our "money" is the privately controlled central banks. They did that because they were the best organized gangs of criminals, operating the covert death controls, which were able to take over the public death controls.

Again, the real revolution is to change the death controls. That is based on the view that EVERYBODY has the power to rob and to murder. That would be based on doing those things differently, which would be to go back to the basic idea that power is always distributed. What has happened is that the power to rob has been assembled and channelled into states, and those states were covertly controlled by the best organized gangs of criminals. The real revolution is for more people to understand that, and therefore, to participate more consciously in doing that! The basic reality is not changed, only the consciousness and perception of that basic reality is changed. The real revolution comes from paradigm shift, which reverse the ways we perceive, which then results in reversing the ways that we behave. However, the basic realities stay the same, even while they thus revolve around!

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 21:32 | 3000678 Terminus C
Terminus C's picture

The main issue that 'revolutionaries' face (anyone that wants to change the system - particularly in non-violent ways) is our assumption that the majority of the population would bother to read and research the necessary information and be able to filter the fiat from the gold.  Genpop is not intellectual, nor is it particularly motivated to seek the truth.  This is why sites like ZeroHedge are permitted to exist... they don't reach a wide enough audience to matter.  The story of the early days of Vladimir Putin's rule over Russia is illustrative of this... he allowed for freedom of the press.  He took that literally, any printed publication could say just about anything it wanted.  If you were a TV station on the other hand, you toed the government line or you were shut down.  Same is true for traditional Western democratic societies today.

We are the margin, and mostly irrelevant... welcome to your two minutes of hate.

Wed, 11/21/2012 - 00:45 | 3001167 Radical Marijuana
Radical Marijuana's picture


Terminus C,

"This is why sites like ZeroHedge are permitted to exist

... they don't reach a wide enough audience to matter."

The same is true of small political parties. There are enormous media corporations, that overwhelmingly dominate the "news" that most people get. Therefore, the elections are primarily puppet shows, put on by the mass media, which only the approved puppets are allowed to participate in. The rest are excluded, or at best misrepresented. Ron Paul's last campaign was one of the most extreme manifestations of that, so far.

The Internet allows the few that are interested to find out about alternatives. However, as long as the established systems can continue to fool enough of the people enough of the time, then that fringe who do their own research, and think for themselves, do not amount to enough to make much difference. Eventually, the Internet freedom might accumulate enough to make a difference. However, one expects that the established systems will find excuses to shut that down, before that happens.

Apart from the fact that the runaway insanities of the established systems are automatically getting worse, and threaten to start world war and impose martial law, from which there will be NO ESCAPE, it makes no practical sense to bother to learn about how bad things really are! In the context, I mostly feel like a wind-up toy soldier, still marching on, only because I got wound up before. There is certainly no reinforcement for bothering to attempt any political action against the banksters, and their buddies. People make lots of money, and get pensions, etc., from working for the plutocracy. Those who work against it have no rewards, and lots of punishment. The ONLY apparent motivation comes from understanding that the plutocracy is so totally insane that one could no longer accept working for it, instead of against it. However, that is merely more of a wound up tin soldier marching on just a few more minutes of hating the system!

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 16:52 | 2999873 walküre
walküre's picture

The cake is to try and tell people that he resigned due to an affair. Like anybody out there actually believes that. What is the point of propaganda when everyone openly admits that the story is fake?  The is not interested in restoring any sense of credibility after the controlled demoliton of WTC7, the lack of WMD in Iraq and other openly accepted lies of the

Their story is what's sold as fact. Based on their story billions of Dollars are created out of thin air and thousands are off to war, millions are out of work. That is the real purpose of propaganda. It is not necessary for propagandists to convince their people. It is only necessary to cover all your actions under the guise of the fabricated truth. Who will challenge them? Any real challenger will be eliminated at worst or ridiculed at best.

It is their story and they are sticking with it. You could say they are all pathological liars which is probably true for most of them. There is no cure or argument to change their views. I've personally dealt with a few myself. So what is the solution? Go with it? Consume copious amounts of drugs to relax and forget the pain of this ficticious reality we live in?

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 17:06 | 2999908 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

Blue pills for everybody!

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 17:18 | 2999934 tsx500
tsx500's picture

speaking of blue pills ....

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 21:49 | 3000732 Sedaeng
Sedaeng's picture

Dr. Stephen Pieczenik you mean?  :)


Wed, 11/21/2012 - 00:51 | 3001200 hungrydweller
hungrydweller's picture

He didn't get his classified dick out in time though.

Wed, 11/21/2012 - 09:47 | 3001636 post turtle saver
post turtle saver's picture

And here I've been using guerilla tactics all this time... I knew I was doing something wrong, gorilla tactics it is.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 16:32 | 2999802 Induced Coma
Induced Coma's picture

quick, someone create a diversion.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 16:39 | 2999833 Dawnofinsanity
Dawnofinsanity's picture

Anyone else wonder why Bardwell isn't painted as a harlet?  Given a hat with the big red A, she afterall was married with two kids, in other countries she would be stoned!  Does her role as a biographer mean that we already don't have a moral standard identified for her.  As biographies are like eulogies.... Everyone is a saint, after the fact!

Surely this couldn't be a diversion. 

As for the Droney, that's helarious!  

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 17:02 | 2999895 XitSam
XitSam's picture

As for countries that stone adulterous women, they are a bunch of backward, inbred, 7th century, microphallus, uneducated mongrels.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 17:42 | 3000024 Grinder74
Grinder74's picture

Who worship a lying, thieving, murdering, pillaging, raping pedophile.  You forgot the best part.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 17:45 | 3000031 john39
john39's picture

come on now, no one actually worships prince charles.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 18:07 | 3000092 MsCreant
MsCreant's picture

He meant Lloyd. Duhhh! ;-)

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 22:23 | 3000835 prains
prains's picture


Tue, 11/20/2012 - 18:16 | 3000123 A Lunatic
A Lunatic's picture

Leave Elmo out of it!

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 17:19 | 2999942 Bicycle Repairman
Bicycle Repairman's picture

"Anyone else wonder why Bardwell isn't painted as a harlet?"


Tue, 11/20/2012 - 18:02 | 3000078 Optimusprime
Optimusprime's picture

Wrong.  The double standard ( a reverse of the old double standard) is in fact glaring, and draws lots of comment from those who do not take their talking points from the media.



Tue, 11/20/2012 - 18:20 | 3000137 FeralSerf
FeralSerf's picture

Marriage vows to the majority on both coasts are nothing but a commercial contract anymore.  They are no more associated with morality than GM's contracts with their bondholders.

I personally don't give a shit who fucks her or who Petraeus fucks either for that matter, and it's time for the rest of the livestock to stop caring too.  It's none of their business.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 19:01 | 3000228 TrulyBelieving
TrulyBelieving's picture

It could be easily argued that you, feralserf, are a product of a society in deep moral decay.    Rather than just turning yourself over to your base nature, you should consider the merits of faithfulness, for it matters a lot who is faithful and who is not. Plus a situation like Petraes opens the door for blackmail, very unsettling if you would consider classified info the CIA head knows.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 20:50 | 3000540 FeralSerf
FeralSerf's picture

This universe, and our society as a subset thereof, is governed by cause and effect.

Faithfulness is a product of evolution.  Geese are faithful out of necessity.  Homo sapiens were likewise, but due to technology, they no longer need to exhibit this characteristic in order to survive.  The reasons for "faithfulness", i.e. promotion of one's own genetic code through his/her offspring, are no longer valid in first world economies where the state takes care of the young.   The offspring survive regardless of the faithfulness their parents.

The more the door for blackmail is opened and the more the CIA's theoretical owners (us) know about its operations, the better off society is.  Most classified information is secret from the voters and taxpayers, not some foreign power.  The CIA's real enemies are us.

I'm not married, so argue away.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 23:04 | 3000914 TrulyBelieving
TrulyBelieving's picture

So all is governed by cause and effect. It is utter nonsense to believe cause and effect can govern anything. Cause and effect are merely the consequense of action. It has no feeling, motive, breath, or care, it's just a consequence.  And of course your state education has taught you well about evolution. You being smart enough to just believe it without any evidence. Your words about technology making such things as faithfulness unnecessary, surely read right out of your schoolbook. (I wonder what other good attributes you have been taught to disdain.)  And your not married, ok, are you so foolish to argue only the married can be faithful?

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 21:35 | 3000675 philipat
philipat's picture

Let's imagine that Mexico used Drones to take out Drug Barons hiding out in, say, San Diego. Only a few innocent civilian neighbours get killed. Do you suppose that the population of the US might get somewaht irritated by said practise which might possibly translate into a dislike of the nation behind said practisies?

But I'm sure the Mexicans wouldn't understand why they were hated because they were just doing the right thing and, in any war (On drugs in this example) there is some collateral damage.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 21:38 | 3000700 Enslavethechild...
EnslavethechildrenforBen's picture

Drones against Meth Labs!

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 22:16 | 3000816 are we there yet
are we there yet's picture

Wow ... a 91 hit with 3 words.... what is the secret story?

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 16:30 | 2999786 SemperFord
SemperFord's picture

Hackers will eventually learn to play with them and hopefully dump the drones in the Ocean or Skynet will will use them against us...humans are weird indeed

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 16:38 | 2999828 cossack55
cossack55's picture

"Kill Decision" by Daniel Suarez

Great read on where all this drone shit ends up. Can you say "autonomous"?

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 19:03 | 3000252 ForTheWorld
ForTheWorld's picture

I had no idea he had another novel out. "Daemon" is the ultimate SkyNet novel, and a brilliant read.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 16:40 | 2999838 Joe Davola
Joe Davola's picture

We are close to eventually + 1yr, wonder how close drones fly to Iranian airspace now.

Wed, 11/21/2012 - 05:08 | 3001350 Shevva
Shevva's picture

Well Iran hacked one down and nicked it from you guys so I'd say close.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 17:07 | 2999915 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

Or the gov will claim they've been hacked once they've been caught in the wrong area.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 18:19 | 3000132 A Lunatic
A Lunatic's picture

This is how it will play. Guaranteed, and the Sheeples will eat that shit up, begging for protection, vengeance, and more ham sandwiches...............

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 16:29 | 2999787 Canadian Dirtlump
Canadian Dirtlump's picture

He will be remembered as a war hawk brilliant military strategist who implemented his masters' game plan perfectly -


losing 2 wars but making billions.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 16:29 | 2999788 Henry Hub
Henry Hub's picture

The United States is sowing the wind. Someday we will reap the whirlwind.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 16:30 | 2999792 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

Fall on the sword General... There will be some digital dollars waiting for you somewhere... Spend 'em fast...

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 16:31 | 2999795 Skateboarder
Skateboarder's picture

Due process is now drone process. Trial by missile, bitchez.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 16:42 | 2999842 Joe Davola
Joe Davola's picture

Kill 'em all and let (insert your name for the supreme being here) sort 'em out.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 17:39 | 3000004 exi1ed0ne
exi1ed0ne's picture


Tue, 11/20/2012 - 18:20 | 3000136 A Lunatic
A Lunatic's picture

I think the politically correct answer is Obama..............Now load my EBT rewards card.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 16:58 | 2999887 Dawnofinsanity
Dawnofinsanity's picture

Do you think a drone could get through the "Iron Dome"?  I guess we will never know

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 16:37 | 2999797 Michaelwiseguy
Michaelwiseguy's picture


Tue, 11/20/2012 - 16:31 | 2999799 Michaelwiseguy
Michaelwiseguy's picture


Tue, 11/20/2012 - 16:32 | 2999803 Shizzmoney
Shizzmoney's picture

If a drone dropped a load on Blankfein's or Jaime Dimon's house, would anyone care?

Bullish on fistpumps

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 16:32 | 2999804 blunderdog
blunderdog's picture

We need a flying death robot bubble to help restore the USian economy.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 16:33 | 2999806 Dr. Richard Head
Dr. Richard Head's picture

But when you are exceptional.......

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 16:38 | 2999827 Mad Mohel
Mad Mohel's picture

Fuckin A! Droney 2016!

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 16:39 | 2999831 FROZENOJFUTURES







Tue, 11/20/2012 - 17:09 | 2999918 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture


The cruise control for cool on the Internets.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 16:46 | 2999851 Yen Cross
Yen Cross's picture

 Drone the Penis!

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 17:09 | 2999920 PhattyBuoy
PhattyBuoy's picture

Did Petraeus get his drone "All In" ?

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 16:48 | 2999859 Bastiat009
Bastiat009's picture

In the US, war is acceptable, sex is not. Nothing new. Americans go crazy when they see a nipple through a blouse. Pathetic.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 16:49 | 2999863 Joe Davola
Joe Davola's picture

Link plz.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 17:12 | 2999923 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

I think he is essentially saying that 5 year olds can watch actors getting their brains blown out on the teeeveeee many times per day, but boobies must remain in their slings.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 17:17 | 2999930 Joe Davola
Joe Davola's picture

Same 5 y/o's probably playing CoD, just to get him used to 'pushing the button' when his time comes.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 17:17 | 2999932 notadouche
notadouche's picture

We did it the opposite.  No heads blown up but ok to see breasteses.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 17:09 | 2999917 notadouche
notadouche's picture

By "Americans" you mean 7 losers and one religious douche complaining then yes Americans do go crazy when they see a nipple through a blouse.  Unfortunately the bigger douche of politicians use those 8 people to justify some political stance that I know they don't believe in being how most of them are getting so much pussy on the side it'd make your head spin.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 17:55 | 3000052 TuesdayBen
TuesdayBen's picture


Clinton/lewinsky wasn't sex, it was POTUS lying under oath.
Petraeus/Broadwell wasn't sex, it was security compromised because she was blabbing. In the old days she'd probably have been offed, but so hard to get away with anything anymore due to technology.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 18:24 | 3000153 FeralSerf
FeralSerf's picture

Why weren't either of them charged with those crimes?

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 19:07 | 3000175 Urban Redneck
Urban Redneck's picture

Clinton got away with providing CIA stooge Paul Kagame with a MANPADS, creating genocide in Rawanda and then doing nothing to intervene in the genocide in Rawanda.  Then there was the whole GLB CFMA reach-around for the banking industry...  The Lewinsky BJ turned out to be a great diversion for the masses.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 21:26 | 3000652 Radical Marijuana
Radical Marijuana's picture

Yeah, notadouche, I noticed that hypocrisy as soon as I hit puberty. I would emphasize that the insane social taboos around money in America are an order of magnitude stronger than those around sex! Whatever insane contradictions with respect to sexual hypocrisy and double standards, etc., the same applies to the ways we think about money, only way more so!!!

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 16:51 | 2999868 Canucklehead
Canucklehead's picture

What have Pakistan, Yemen, Libya and Somalia ever done for us?

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 16:57 | 2999885 Tuco Benedicto ...
Tuco Benedicto Pacifico Juan Maria Ramirez's picture

"What have Pakistan, Yemen, Libya and Somalia ever done for us?"

No!  No!  No!

What have Pakistan, Yemen, Libya and Somalia ever done TO us?



Tue, 11/20/2012 - 17:32 | 2999982 Canucklehead
Canucklehead's picture

I appreciate India.  Why would Pakistan regress so badly, when compared to India?

Is there an office pool somewhere selling squares for the next Nobel prize winner from Yemen, Libya, or Somolia?  How long would you have to wait and how would you collect? 

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 18:06 | 3000090 vato poco
vato poco's picture

This will undoubtedly be red-arrowed to hell by the ever-watchful ZH Totenkopf, but fuck those idiots anyway. Once read something, years ago - so don't bother looking for a link - that said something to the effect of, "If you added up ALL the inventions patented by the citizens of Algeria, Libya, Tunisia, Sudan, Egypt, Syria, Jordan, Iraq, Iran, Albania, Pakistan, Nigeria, Bangladesh, Turkey, Morocco, Afghanistan, Uzbekistan, Turkmenistan, Kazakhstan, Tajikistan, Kyrgyzstan, Saudi Arabia, Yemen, the UAE, Kuwait, Qatar, Bahrain, Lebanon, Brunei, Somalia, and about a dozen other 'mostly islamic' countries over the last 50 YEARS"......IOW, pretty much the entire moslem world except for Indonesia and Malaysia....."All those countries in 50 YEARS haven't patented as many inventions as tiny little South Korea has in the last 5 years. And that's not even counting 'Gangnam Style'.

Ever wonder why that is, Mein Herren? Probably just coincidence, right?

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 18:58 | 3000202 GoinFawr
GoinFawr's picture

Hmmm, it seems you believe their lack of success has a lot to do with Godwin's Law. But surely the Lion's share of the list of nations you've compiled have not been negatively affected by Western interference and imperialism over the last century or so...  heaven forbid, everyone knows that's been naught but a boon to them backwards, forwards, sideways, and upside down; what with all the fair play, the installation of dictatorial but wholly benevolent regimes, altruistic drawing of borders for them, and everything else that comes with the glory of being a colony, Kermit.

So I guess it must just be coincidence, after all. Or perhaps you're suggesting that on the whole to you they represent some sort of, to borrow your insinuation, untermenschen? Ja?

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 19:03 | 3000250 overmedicatedun...
overmedicatedundersexed's picture

why is it that R Paul's wanting to close our over seas military bases is a bad idea?? somebody will use these drones to whip up real terrorism in the USA..oh we have TSA and HLS doing it every day to the prison state called America.

drones such a great symbol of a failing empire..while the prisoners of the USA still think we are free.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 20:32 | 3000464 vato poco
vato poco's picture

So surely Korea's decades-long occupation and (eventual) rape by the Imperial Japs and later, the Imperial Chicoms did not negatively affect *them*, either? How did you so dutifully mouth the platitudes you learned at teacher's knee back in school? "...what with all the fair play, the installation of a dictatorial but wholly benevolent regime, altruistic drawing of borders for them, and everything else that comes with the glory of being a colony"?? (One also can't help but notice how well HK did after the war, even as they suffered under the Jackboot of Western Interference and Imperialism and Colonialsim, but perhaps that's not PC to point out.)

Or does that pathetic "victims of imperialism!!! still suffering from psychic trauma!!!" excuse apply only to moslems? Ja?

Wed, 11/21/2012 - 00:33 | 3000892 GoinFawr
GoinFawr's picture

Heh, speaking of 'platitudes', you sure enjoy comparing apples to oranges; apparently every foreign occupation/act-of-war is exactly the same to you, past and present.

"Or does that pathetic "victims of imperialism!!! still suffering from psychic trauma!!!" excuse apply only to moslems? Ja?"

No, it sure doesn't. Kinda tough for them to 'just get over it already' while the game's still on though. ( I can't recall the last time Japan dropped a bomb on 'Chicoms', can you?)

But quit dodging the question: using a vast sweeping over generalisation your first post had a sparkling clear point regarding your opinion concerning the relative value to humanity of members of a specific religious group, a point that was as plain as the ass on your face, no? With the implication that anybody who disagrees with your egregiously false premise must be a Nazi? How is it you did not choke on that globus?

I mean at best you're some sort of garden variety narcissist if, regardless of what's been done to someone all their lives and regardless of what they've accomplished in the past, it's all about what they've done for you lately.


Wed, 11/21/2012 - 03:55 | 3001323 vato poco
vato poco's picture

Heh, the old internet dodge of "can't win argument on basis of facts, so accuse opponent of Strawman/Racism/Dodging the question, and then throw in a halfwit psychological diagnosis at the end." Well, I've seen *that* show before, so that's it for you.


Fri, 11/23/2012 - 02:16 | 3001806 GoinFawr
GoinFawr's picture

quit kidding yourself

Wed, 11/21/2012 - 07:31 | 3001430 BigJim
BigJim's picture

Don't you get it? If you don't hate Muslims you're an anti-semite.

Or something.

Fri, 11/23/2012 - 02:41 | 3005787 GoinFawr
GoinFawr's picture

All those countries in 50 YEARS haven't patented as many inventions as tiny little South Korea has in the last 5 years. And that's not even counting 'Gangnam Style'.

Ever wonder why that is, Mein Herren? Probably just coincidence, right?


 All I wanted for vaco topa to do was tell me 'why'...

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 19:04 | 3000257 Canucklehead
Canucklehead's picture

Well... I take a crack at it.

The Islam ideology basically believes the God of Abraham lies.

A fundamental precept of Islamic thought relates to the fact that Mohammed was told the truth by the God of Abraham while the God of Abraham lied to the other prophets.  For example, the 10 commandments don't apply as God was simply stringing Moses along.

If you believe that your God does not always tell the truth, how do you know that your independent thought is warranted, accepted, appreciated, valued?  If you stray too far from the Islam party line, off with your head.

It's pretty hard to push boundaries of science, art, thought, when your God may let some infidel think along those lines.  Is the God of Abraham playing with the infidel's mind?  Will the infidel lose their head?  It's best to listen to those who are too big to fail than to point out weaknesses in their approach.

Wed, 11/21/2012 - 04:27 | 3000725 Radical Marijuana
Radical Marijuana's picture

Consider the following, Canucklehead:

The history of Islam had a battle between those who believe what you say, and the others, who lost. 

I like the Sufis the most. However, the opposite kinds of people took over.

Consider what America would become if its craziest fundamentalists had been able to take over the government?

The history of Islam seems a little like that which can compare ancient Greece with Rome, where the Romans enslaved the Greeks.

The 14th century Arab scholar Ibn Khaldun is considered one of the greatest political theorists. ... British philosopher-anthropologist Ernest Gellner considered Ibn Khaldun's definition of government  "an institution which prevents injustice other than such as it commits itself" the best in the history of political theory. ... For Khaldun, government should be restrained to a minimum for, as a necessary evil, it is the constraint of men by other men.

THAT SOUNDS LIKE AN AMERICAN FOUNDING FATHER TO ME! Islam has its own "libertarians" who have lost almost as badly as American libertarians have lost!

Mutazilite philosophers, held a more Hellenic view,  reason above revelation, and as such are known to modern scholars as the first speculative theologians of Islam; they were supported by a secular aristocracy who sought freedom of action independent of Caliphates. By the late ancient period, however, the "traditionalist" Asharite view of Islam had in general triumphed. According to the Asharites, reason must be subordinate to the Quran and the Sunna.

If I had been born in an Islamic society, then my nature would have leaned to being more Mutazilite, than Asharite. Probably, the whole thing would have looked so bad to me, I would have hoped to join the Sufis.

The worst dudes keep on taking over in the short-term!

And, "our" worst dudes conspired to drive others worse!

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 19:43 | 3000347 blunderdog
blunderdog's picture

Near-universal poverty makes it tougher to file patent applications, but it's possible that there's a religious element.

What religion are South Koreans?  Is it the same as Chineses?

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 19:58 | 3000384 americanspirit
americanspirit's picture

Huge proportion of Christians actually. Missionaries have been more successful in SK than in any other country. Not sure how well that speaks for South Korean intellectual integrity, but there you have it.

Wed, 11/21/2012 - 01:17 | 3001226 merizobeach
merizobeach's picture

I don't have anything against the Korean people, but I have to laugh when another ten Korean Christian missionaries get beheaded in Afghanistan.  Poor arrogant dumbfucks couldn't concieve of keeping their offensive shit out of where it wasn't welcome.  Classic.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 21:37 | 3000693 Radical Marijuana
Radical Marijuana's picture

Well, vato poco, what you say may well be true about recent times. However, the Islamic world retained a lot of the sciences and mathematics that were all but lost in the dark ages in Europe. (Back when the USA did not exist whatsoever.)  Lots of mathematics and science were made or maintained by Islamic countries a long time ago, after those had been all but destroyed in Europe. A lot of scientific and mathematical terms had their source in Arabic ... and those often go back to India and Sanskit.

I would suggest that being able to patent inventions depends more on the total integrated culture, which makes it possible for some individuals to lead lives that makes that possible. There is NO reason to believe that the intelligent and creative individuals would not be able to succeed in science, IF the rest of their integrated culture enabled and allowe that.

So, vato poco, I certainly agree that it is NOT a coincidence, but rather correlated in complicated ways with many other cultural and historical factors.

As an aside, let us suppose that musical ability was correlated with mathematical ability. It may well be the case that there were large numbers of individuals living in Africa today who have the potential to become mathematical prodigies, and could become creative genius ... EXCEPT, they may never even get the chance to learn even any algebra, and the rest of their society would never support them doing mathematics.

It HELPS immensely to be a member of the general ruling classes, who benefit from robbing everyone else, in order to be able to have the leisure to go to school, and study, and be supported to do useless things, like basic science.

Wed, 11/21/2012 - 01:24 | 3001235 merizobeach
merizobeach's picture

"I must study politics and war that my sons may have liberty to study mathematics and philosophy. My sons ought to study mathematics and philosophy, geography, natural history, naval architecture, navigation, commerce, and agriculture, in order to give their children a right to study painting, poetry, music, architecture, statuary, tapestry, and porcelain." --John Adams

Wed, 11/21/2012 - 03:53 | 3001326 vato poco
vato poco's picture

An interesting theory, Radical Doobie. A people were *once* cultured and civilized, 1200 years or so ago, but now aren't - all of which is due to Western whateverism. And never, no *never*, any mention of the name Al-Wahhab. Quelle surprise. OK, then, does the reverse hold true? Does anyone ever blame the surge of halfwitted dole-fueled hooliganism, riots, and binge drinking in the UK on the long-ago party culture of the Saxons and Jutes? No? Why does your theory not apply there?

Wed, 11/21/2012 - 04:39 | 3001342 Radical Marijuana
Radical Marijuana's picture

Vato poco, I liked your phrase "Western whateverism!"

Of course, I would basically believe that the rise and fall of civilizations followed similar general patterns, although in differently, depending on conditions. I have no doubt that one could study the history of dole-fueled hooliganism, riots, and binge drinking in the UK on some line of both genetic and cultural factors interacting in complicated hybridizations over time. I have not bothered to do that.

We are kind of FORCED to pay more attention to the Middle East and Islam, due to the current situations. Otherwise, I would have probably continued to relatively ignore that.

With respect to English culture, and the possible genetic underpinings of that, one of the most interesting facts is that more than half of the men in England still have the same Y chromosome as the original Celts. Celtic culture was HUGE, for a long, long time, then almost totally submerged under Roman, and then Christianity, and then wave after wave of invaders, and then, later, especially the Normans, etc.! I imagine it was something a bit like what happened to native peoples everywhere, that were subjected to the European invasion.

It is practically impossible to imagine being conquered and forced to submerge your native culture, in order to survive. Some of the natives in North America can tell horror stories about their ancestors, and that surely had a lasting impact upon them. Therefore, I would not be surprised to discover that the lower class culture that you describe in England has historical roots in being screwed over by some earlier waves of invaders and conquers. ... But, I do not know, and probably would never bother to take the time to try to find out.

Wed, 11/21/2012 - 07:55 | 3001455 Ghordius
Ghordius's picture

with respect to English culture you are spot on regarding certain elements of celtic origin

the English drinking habits btw have their roots in the Norman invasions and it's curfews, by the way.  the Angli and Saxon villagers had to leave the pub (run by the publicani of the earlier Roman invasions that were famous in pushing wine and beer wars like the later Opium Wars) shortly before dark or else, this has left a strong impression in a people's psyche

compare with the first Elizabeth's church law regarding eating three times a week fish in order to triplicate the recruiting pool for the navy

Wed, 11/21/2012 - 20:24 | 3003612 Tompooz
Tompooz's picture

Civilizations rise and fall.

We have an Arab from Basra, happened to be a moslem too,  to thank for coming up with the scientific method.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 18:58 | 3000235 ali-ali-al-qomfri
ali-ali-al-qomfri's picture

What have Pakistan, Yemen, Libya and Somalia ever dRone for us?

How about field testing IR/Thermal targeting devices?

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 17:14 | 2999874 GoinFawr
GoinFawr's picture

RE: "there’s no country on earth that would tolerate missiles raining down on its citizens from outside its borders.”

Nonononono Aziz you've totally misapprehended this quote. Read properly it obviously means:

 'there is no country on earth that would tolerate missles raining down on its citizens, at least not the citizens that are from outside its borders.'

So raining down missles from inside their borders, like drones do, is entirely acceptable, except to the citizens that are from outside their borders.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 17:03 | 2999897 notadouche
notadouche's picture

Sequel to "All In" is to be titled "Balls Deep" which details Patreus leading his rock hard fighting unit probing the various caverns that reside inside Afghanistan.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 18:26 | 3000155 A Lunatic
A Lunatic's picture

Is that where they corner Yomamabincornholyo and pound out their final plans???

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 17:06 | 2999899 THE DORK OF CORK
THE DORK OF CORK's picture

Well the martians stopped shagging and look at them now............ possible traces of organic semen is good news.............



Tue, 11/20/2012 - 17:18 | 2999939 Mr Lennon Hendrix
Mr Lennon Hendrix's picture

Fucking humans.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 17:26 | 2999957 CharlesFilson
CharlesFilson's picture

I mostly agree with the point of this article. I have one quibble:

"Would the American government have any grounds to complain?"

If terrorists attacking China took up refuge in Montana, and the US claimed they aren't strong enough to control the yokels in Montana, then China could make a case for attacking them on their own. That the people working from within Pakistan are 'terrorists' is a fiction. They are gorillas. That the US is attacking the 'enemies of both the USA and Pakistan' is a fiction. Pakistan is conducting a Gorilla war with the USA and the USA is conducting an anti-Gorilla war back. Neither party wants to publically admit whats really going on, but it's not Drone strikes against suspected terrorists. 



Tue, 11/20/2012 - 17:36 | 2999994 Timmay
Timmay's picture

Decent quibble there. After all, the soldiers really ARE sitting on U.S. soil controlling robots over other sovereign nations. Don't need congressional war approval, "technically".

Can't wait until the US claims anyone who is in opposition to it is a "terrorist" as well.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 18:11 | 3000103 Optimusprime
Optimusprime's picture

Look, the word is "guerilla" ("little war").  A "gorilla" is a great ape.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 21:50 | 3000737 Terminus C
Terminus C's picture

fuck, I am still laughing...

They aren't terrorists, they are gorillas...



Wed, 11/21/2012 - 00:22 | 3001141 GoinFawr
GoinFawr's picture

Well I don't think they're so damn great.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 19:08 | 3000267 bilejones
bilejones's picture

The drivel from you fuckwits never ends, does it?


" US claimed they aren't strong enough to control the yokels in Montana"


The Taliban offered to extradite Bin Laden, et al, up production of any evidence that they had anything to do with 9/11, it was not presented because it doesn't exist.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 21:11 | 3000605 CharlieSDT
CharlieSDT's picture

It's guerillas, dude, not gorillas.  Your point would be stronger without the illiteracy.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 17:38 | 2999998 Grinder74
Grinder74's picture

"A radical idea: instead of carrying out assassinations based on secret kill lists, perhaps the Federal government could start obeying the Constitution, and start issuing arrest warrants or extradition requests for individuals suspected of criminal activity so that they can be tried by a court of law in front of a jury of their peers."

If they're not citizens, they have no peers and no right to "due process".  Now if U.S. citizens are actually on the kill list, then we have a problem Houston.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 17:40 | 3000013 Aziz
Aziz's picture

US citizens have been on kill list multiple times.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 17:50 | 3000041 exi1ed0ne
exi1ed0ne's picture

Last I read the document authorizing the US Government into existence, there is nothing in them which describes limitations on people.  The only limits in there are for the Government entity so created.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 19:46 | 3000353 blunderdog
blunderdog's picture

"Strict constructionist" has changed in meaning a great deal--it now apparently applies to activists like Scalia.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 18:16 | 3000122 Scalaris
Scalaris's picture

Outrageous; clearly that vagina was an unfortunate collateral damage.

A victim of a imprecise parameterized geometric alignment of the targeting vicinity.

Wed, 11/21/2012 - 20:28 | 3003619 Tompooz
Tompooz's picture

"...imprecise parameterized geometric alignment of the targeting vicinity."  Sometimes alse described as a "wardrobe- or zipper malfunction"

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 18:52 | 3000217 Miffed Microbio...
Miffed Microbiologist's picture

Silly boys! This whole thing is about getting/maintaining the women vote. What does the average suburban soccer mom care about foreign wars? But have a penis go in the wrong place to them is a serious crime. Just wait until the mind chips are implanted and you're monitored by the thought police. Forward to the brave new world!


Tue, 11/20/2012 - 19:06 | 3000251 bilejones
bilejones's picture


Separated at birth?


One of these women married a murderous killer, the stuff of nightmares
The other is Mrs Shrek

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 20:59 | 3000569 IllusionOfChoice
IllusionOfChoice's picture


Tue, 11/20/2012 - 19:02 | 3000247 geno-econ
geno-econ's picture

Most are missing the main point in the Petraeus scandel.     It is not about sex, many generals have had concubines and cheated on their wives even in the combat zone.  CNN really nailed it in exposing Jill Kelly who tried to use Petraeus connection to cash in by demanding a 2% payoff on a N. Korea business deal.  So the question is why are generals socializing in Florida with socialites and leaving themselves vulnerable to this kind of behavior. It constitutes gross misconduct by the military and should be fully investigated with new strict regulations.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 19:18 | 3000258 overmedicatedun...
overmedicatedundersexed's picture

hey geno econ why don't you investigate corzine while your at it?? and yes by all means more strict regulations for corzine and co that's the ticket..nuts.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 20:19 | 3000431 Sokhmate
Sokhmate's picture

The drone's got an expressive face.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 20:53 | 3000550 jomama
jomama's picture

TT - a man who voted for a lesser of two evils.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 21:20 | 3000632 orangegeek
orangegeek's picture

The US still runs the planet militarily. Hypocrisy and outright lies on the part of the US are irrelevant.

Make a choice folks. US? Or China? Or Europe? Or Russia?

Fuck the gotchas that happen along the way. I choose the US.

And if a few get wiped out in other parts of the world, so be it.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 22:01 | 3000765 Enslavethechild...
EnslavethechildrenforBen's picture

Why not choose peace?

Sat, 11/24/2012 - 12:25 | 3008437 Alpha Monkey
Alpha Monkey's picture

Well, at least you'll be understanding when others who think like you, make other choices and "wipe out" some people in your part of the world.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 23:40 | 3001034 benjamin_1114
benjamin_1114's picture

Let's be honest, we originally entered Libya because they wanted to settle oil contracts in a GOLD back Dinar.  We would never let anyone settle oil contracts in something that doesn't depreciate every time we hit Control+print. 

Wed, 11/21/2012 - 05:23 | 3001359 danepol
danepol's picture

The great mystery of the modern world: -Western liberals bleeding tears for fantical right wing Muslim medievalists who would maim and kill the former if only they could.  The leftards cry for Gaza controlled by anti-west, anti-semetic fundamentalists and criticise Israel for defending its civililians. Sickening, actually.

Wed, 11/21/2012 - 09:35 | 3001610 Random
Random's picture

I just want to express my deepest felt "Fuck you". Have a very nice day now.

Wed, 11/21/2012 - 07:00 | 3001407 Disenchanted
Disenchanted's picture




Petraeus signed his own political death warrant in 2010:


What Foxman and other Israel lobbyists understood correctly was that Petraeus was articulating a view that is increasingly common within the US establishment, but is an absolute taboo when it comes to stating it publicly: that US “interests” and Israeli “interests” are not identical, and that Israel might be a strategic burden, rather than an asset to the United States.


quote from:

When Former CIA Chief David Petraeus Enraged the Israel Lobby


Also interesting, the revolving door for top military brass into the world of defense contracting:

Strategic Manuevers:

Do NOT follow this link or you will be banned from the site!