Montana GOP Rep.: "Pay Me In Gold Before Dollars Have No Value"

Tyler Durden's picture




 

Jerry O'Neil, six-term GOP state representative in Montana, has asked to receive his salary (which at $10.33 per hour is around $1800 per month) in gold or silver. The long-standing legislator was driven to this decision by his constituents' concerns about the nation's massive debt-load and fears of our country's collapse as "only so many dollars can be printed before they have no value." The long-time Ron Paul supporter, according to Time, cited Article 1, Section 10 of the US Constitution, which says, in part, that "No State shall... make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts." State administrators have denied his request and added that "a bill could be introduced to accomplish this result." O'Neil, like many other, believes "The Keynesian era of financing government with debt appears to be close to its demise."

 

From O'Neil's Letter (via HuffPo):

It is very likely the bottom will fall out from under the U.S. dollar. Only so many dollars can be printed before they have no value. The Keynesian era of financing government with debt appears to be close to its demise.

 

If and when that happens, how can we in the Montana Legislature protect our constituents? -- The only answer I can come up with is to honor my oath to the U.S. Constitution and request that your debt to me be paid in gold and silver coins that will still have value when the U.S. dollar is reduced to junk status. I therefore request my legislative pay to be in gold and silver coins that are unadulterated with base metals.

 

Via Time:

A GOP state representative in Montana who asked to receive his salary in gold and silver coins has been rebuffed by the state’s Office of Legislative Services. Rep. Jerry O’Neil, who hails from the small town of Columbia Falls in the northwest corner of the state, sent a letter earlier this month requesting that his salary from here on in be paid in coins.

 

Given the state of the U.S. economy and the massive national debt, O’Neil reportedly worried that America’s paper currency could be on the brink of collapse. “Only so many dollars can be printed before they have no value,” he explained to the local Daily Inter Lake newspaper. According to USA Today, O’Neil is a longtime supporter of Ron Paul, the former Texas congressman and perennial presidential candidate who advocates a return to the gold standard.

 

However, it was O’Neil’s constituents who led him to consider requesting his salary in coins.  O’Neil has never before raised the subject of how he should be paid during his six terms as state representative for Montana’s Flathead Valley. “My constituents, when I went door to door, one of the things they were interested in was the $17 trillion national debt,” he explained to the Huffington Post. “Some of my constituents said we would not have this problem if we had currency backed by gold.”

 

Making his case to the Daily Inter Lake, O’Neil cited Article I, Section 10 of the U.S. Constution, which says, in part, that “No State shall… make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts.”

 

“How can we in the Montana Legislature protect our constituents?” O’Neil asked in his letter to the Office of Legislative Services.

 

...

 

Montana state legislators are paid $10.33 per hour while the legislature is in session; O’Neil estimated his salary to be about $1,800 a month, close to the market value of one 2012 American Eagle One Ounce Gold Proof Coin, according to Politico.

 

Sheryl Olson, the deputy director of the Montana Department of Administration, told the Huffington Post that state employees are paid either by a state warrant of payment (basically, a check) or via direct deposit. To her knowledge, O’Neil is the only government worker to have requested payment in gold coin, she said.

 

Montana legislative attorney Jaret Coles responded to O’Neil’s letter last week, informing him that neither the U.S. Constitution nor Montana state law requires an agency to pay its debts with gold and silver, according to the Flathead Beacon. Coles explained in his letter that if a member of the legislature wishes to be paid in gold or silver “a bill could be introduced to accomplish this result,” reports Politico.

 

O’Neil has decided not to follow through on this advice and is looking into other options.

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Sun, 11/25/2012 - 14:26 | 3009961 Money Squid
Money Squid's picture

What was the name of that retard that kept posting "$5 to dig it out..." ?  Its been so long I forgets

Sun, 11/25/2012 - 14:41 | 3009985 Lednbrass
Lednbrass's picture

That was either Johnny Bravo or (I think it was the same guy under a second name) Math Man.

Sun, 11/25/2012 - 15:27 | 3010073 dogbreath
dogbreath's picture

Aaahhhh............the good old days

Sun, 11/25/2012 - 21:10 | 3010512 Money Squid
Money Squid's picture

Yes, it was math man stating the $5 dig out. Johny Bravo was the super wallstreet trader working his way through college claiming he was paying his tuition by trading.  ol times eh....

Sun, 11/25/2012 - 08:31 | 3009550 Freewheelin Franklin
Freewheelin Franklin's picture

Fiat can be traced over these here interwebz because you have to go through an intermediary, like a bank. Paypal now sends out 1099s. But, some people feel it is their civic duty to pay taxes.

Sun, 11/25/2012 - 01:46 | 3009404 knukles
knukles's picture

Ya'll should run around nude to attract attention to yourself, too

You're not important enough to worry the gubamint if you're posting here.  Wake the fuck up.

Paranoia can be debilitating

Sun, 11/25/2012 - 08:25 | 3009548 Freewheelin Franklin
Freewheelin Franklin's picture

What makes you think I'm not using Tor to post here? What makes you think I'm even doing anything wrong?

 

You don't get it, do you? Everybody should be using encryption. It makes it more difficult for the government to keep track.

 

I think you are the one that needs to wake the fuck up. Maybe you will when they really start censoring the internet, and wish that you had learned basic encryption.

 

Complacency can be debilitating.

Sun, 11/25/2012 - 22:44 | 3010619 Dr. Sandi
Dr. Sandi's picture

Does your owner know you're posting stuff here too?

I love the freedom of roaming around the web and creating all kinds of crazy personalities on a bunch of sites.

You'd think the dumb bitch would turn me off when she goes to bed. But nooooo.

Sun, 11/25/2012 - 13:02 | 3009809 Money Squid
Money Squid's picture

Hanz and Franz destroy bitcoin

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-FaQNPCqG58

Sat, 11/24/2012 - 22:32 | 3009261 Michaelwiseguy
Michaelwiseguy's picture

Sun, 11/25/2012 - 14:47 | 3009999 lakecity55
lakecity55's picture

They probably already have the GPS specs for the Drone Strike. 

"Wow, Jim, did u see that? Bill's house just....vaporized!"

"I'll bet he was a fuckin' hoarder! Let's hurry to the mosk; O-Phone I is going to speak!"

Sat, 11/24/2012 - 22:10 | 3009230 Freewheelin Franklin
Freewheelin Franklin's picture

"It's not the spiraling debt, it's all these crazy gold bugs undermining the value of the dollar"

I'll actually buy that. What they fail to understand is, if the dollar had any real value, "goldbugs" couldn't undermine it. But they really don't have to worry. They have Gresham's Law on their side......right?

Sat, 11/24/2012 - 23:04 | 3009296 HungryPorkChop
HungryPorkChop's picture

China probably bought more gold in the last month than all of these gold bugs combined have purchased in the past five years.  Now please keep watching the cards in my left hand.

Sun, 11/25/2012 - 00:39 | 3009374 AgShaman
AgShaman's picture

As a holder of precious metals....

You already meet the criteria for a DT

#10 on the list....though I don't know how credible the info. It's the calendar event.

According to this list....you all have been "their definition" for a year now

http://www.activistpost.com/2011/12/10-ridiculous-things-that-make-you.html

Sun, 11/25/2012 - 09:44 | 3009595 northerngirl
northerngirl's picture

I use the response from the left as a, "Truth - O- Meter", the louder the out cry the closer to the truth of the matter.  I only wish more American's would understand the simplicity of gold vs. fiat.   

Sun, 11/25/2012 - 13:30 | 3009857 SaveTheBales
SaveTheBales's picture

.

Sun, 11/25/2012 - 14:44 | 3009988 lakecity55
lakecity55's picture

That is probably the exact excuse O-Phone I (praise Allah) will use.

 

In a way, I'm kinda happy all of my PMs were stolen last night.

Sun, 11/25/2012 - 13:50 | 3009896 Neo1
Neo1's picture

The Income Tax succinctly described is an irrecusable obligation.

However, if anyone else accepts this private credit and uses it to purchase goods and services, the user voluntarily incurs the obligation requiring him to make a return of income whereby a portion of the income is collected by the IRS and delivered to the Federal Reserve banksters. Actually the federal income tax imparts two separate obligations: the obligation to file a return and the obligation to abide by the Internal Revenue Code. The obligation to make a return of income for using private credit is recognized in law as an irrecusable obligation, which according to 'Bouvier's Law Dictionary' (1914 ed.), is "a term used to indicate a certain class of contractual obligations recognized by the law which are imposed upon a person without his consent and without regard to any act of his own." This is distinguished from a recusable obligation which, according to Bouvier, arises from a voluntary act by which one incurs the obligation imposed by the operation of law. The voluntary use of private credit is the condition precedent which imposes the irrecusable obligation to file a tax return. If private credit is not used or rejected, then the operation of law which imposes the irrecusable obligation lies dormant and cannot apply.


A Banksters defeatism nightmare, Being forced to Return to Real Money=United States Note=Lawful Money, Use the Remedy within the Federal Reserve Act. 12USC411 refusal penalty 12USC501a http://savingtosuitorsclub.net/  Stop being a Slave!!!!!! This is Tax Free Money!!!!!!!!  www.stormthunder.com

You Can’t Handle The Truth-This Is All You Need To Know US citizen Slave

The Republic vs THE CORPORATION http://www.usavsus.info/

 

Sat, 11/24/2012 - 21:03 | 3009111 tooriskytoinvest
tooriskytoinvest's picture

NICK BARISHEFF & JIM RICKARDS & JIM WILLIE: GOLD TO DOUBLE, FED WON’T STOP PRINTING, DOLLAR TO END IN HYPERINFLATION AND COMPLETE COLLAPSE. A GLOBAL GOLD WAR IS IMMINENT AND INEVITABLE

http://investmentwatchblog.com/nick-barisheff-jim-rickards-jim-willie-gold-to-double-fed-wont-stop-printing-dollar-to-end-in-hyperinflation-and-complete-collapse-a-global-gold-war-is-imminent-and-inevitable/

Sat, 11/24/2012 - 21:05 | 3009117 JustPrintMoreDuh
JustPrintMoreDuh's picture

Dispatch a drone to deal with this extremist!

Sat, 11/24/2012 - 21:06 | 3009118 A Lunatic
A Lunatic's picture

This is old news.

Sat, 11/24/2012 - 21:41 | 3009177 earleflorida
earleflorida's picture

perhaps... but a message of substance resurrected in a timely fashion can enhance a prophets assiduous discourse 'to-right-a-wrong'!   

Sat, 11/24/2012 - 21:10 | 3009130 RagnarDanneskjold
RagnarDanneskjold's picture

I will accept payment in dollars, euros, yen, francs, etc. so long as there's a market to convert currency. You can have dollars direct deposited into a gold account, for example.

I want to spend fiat. I have to convert one way or the other. 

I can see the case for asking to be paid in gold, for example 2 ounces per month. However, unless you work for a gold mine, (and assuming your employer agreed) they will pay you in fiat and adjust the payment based on the gold price at that time.

Instead of asking to be paid in gold, he ought to work on abolishing taxes on gold transactions.

Sat, 11/24/2012 - 22:02 | 3009214 Antifaschistische
Antifaschistische's picture

Ragnard, this is where we lose. By the time we convert, we've lost. What would work is fixing your comp for the next 5 years in gold. Then when your buddies are taking their checks to buy 10 grams of gold, you'll be getting paid in 1 oz coins.

Of course, you can (and should be) doing this already in your portfolio with futures or some other financial instrument.

Sat, 11/24/2012 - 21:12 | 3009132 Aziz
Aziz's picture

All you have to do is fuck, and 9 months later you're getting the big bucks.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NzspsovNvII

Sat, 11/24/2012 - 23:05 | 3009300 ACP
ACP's picture

Good satirical video - you can see an interview of her on the channel. She seemed very reluctant to say anything negative about welfare recipients outright, but stated, "Who would want to work in America? This is what the taxpayers are paying for."

Sat, 11/24/2012 - 21:15 | 3009138 Deo vindice
Deo vindice's picture

This is more a political statement than a need. He can take his fiat money and walk down to his local coin shop and get the gold, but this way he draws attention to the issue. Regardless, I say good for him.

Sat, 11/24/2012 - 22:14 | 3009235 TN Jed
TN Jed's picture

Whether he knows it or not, it's actually bigger than that.  "Income tax" is really a usage fee of private credit which we know as Federal Reserve Notes.  You are opted in and volunteered to pay tax when you accept FRNs not because you earned a certain amount but because you used them.  This is how it can be Constitutional because you volunteered to use private credit.  If you never accept private credit then you don't owe their private fees.  Being paid in gold or silver, minted by the US Mint and being PUBLIC CREDIT, would exempt you from paying Fed Res PRIVATE CREDIT fees. So, good luck with that.

"Legal tender for all debts public or private" takes on a new meaning when you understand US Mint coins and US dollars are public credit and FRN are private credit. 

Sat, 11/24/2012 - 22:58 | 3009291 sessinpo
sessinpo's picture

You are correct. Nothing is said about the pork barrel spending each of these Congress people utilize. In other words, the actions of utilizing and encouraging pork spending creates a dependency of States on the Federal Government.

 

As for TN Jed, nothing is exempt from Federal Reserve fees and taxation except those transactions that are kept strictly private and unknown to the FRB. For example, even if this Congressman was paid in gold, he would then have to convert it back to dollars for daily use of common goods such as food, bills, etc. Until you can conduct your daily life without having to convert to dollars, you will always be subjected to the FRB whether public or private. Yes, even public because FRN has either an inflationary or deflationary effect on currency which includes minted coins that are used public.

I had the rare opportunity to do a transaction without such fees. I had a local auto shop (friend of mine) do my front brakes and oil change in exchange for me making him a bait container for catfishing. But even in this example, we were still effected as I utilized US dollars to acquire the supplies to make the bait container and my friend had to utilize dollars for the oil and brake pads.

 

Things aren't always so clear and easy. The Federal Reserve has its tentacles so deep that even in a barter situation, they are there.

Sat, 11/24/2012 - 23:11 | 3009311 TN Jed
TN Jed's picture

You are correct that use of private credit may be inevitable anyway.  However, you should be able to direct your bank to open your account such that all monies deposited are credited as "non-negotiable Federal Reserve Notes" or public credit.  This makes the FR remove that amount from the Federal debt and credit it to the Public debt ledger.  It would actually lower the Federal debt level.  I think we both agree they don't want this to happen as contraction is death for them.

I'm not pretending this is a viable out, but it is/was the only way income tax can be Constitutional and yet a voluntary self-assessment at the same time. 

Sat, 11/24/2012 - 21:17 | 3009144 Seize Mars
Seize Mars's picture

Why the fuck are we supposed to legislate what is already in the fucking Constitution?

Sat, 11/24/2012 - 21:54 | 3009199 earleflorida
earleflorida's picture

what constitution?

the one the supreme's agree is outdated... as in the magna carta long live'd past its usefulness...

i'm assumming our 'nwo' neo-zeitgeist movement have had a 'post-jekyll[and hyde?]-island' manuscript ready to dust off as i pen this sad epitaph of our framers worst nightmare?

Sat, 11/24/2012 - 21:59 | 3009211 Enslavethechild...
EnslavethechildrenforBen's picture

Why are the criminals allowed to legislate?  Why don't the Marines arrest them all?

Sat, 11/24/2012 - 21:26 | 3009154 bullionbaron
bullionbaron's picture

Would be even nicer to get paid in Gold/Silver at face value and pay tax to this effect as well...

 

http://www.bullionbaron.com/

Sat, 11/24/2012 - 21:31 | 3009162 hairball48
hairball48's picture

I met Jerry at a political gathering in Kalispell before the election. He won't remember me. I live in a different district. I saw the newspaper article a while back when his request was made public. Made me smile :)

Sat, 11/24/2012 - 21:39 | 3009174 jtlien
jtlien's picture

When I was younger I used to go to the library and pull down books on the Constituion just so I could read the incredible twists and turns the authors would take when they got to the part about explaining Article 1 Section 10.   It was a tribute the sophistry of the lawyer/politician class.

Sat, 11/24/2012 - 21:43 | 3009180 Tedster
Tedster's picture

Well he's not exactly cleaning up on his $1800 a month slary doing the People's work at the Statehouse. Maybe he gcets mileage and per diem.

Heck, I bet this guy has to - get this - have a real job outside his legislative duties, as God intended. The problem with schemes like this, they are likely to say OK, pal here ya go. And then turn right around and demand gold in return for his property tax payments, business license, speeding tickets, etc. In fact, in the dim vestiges of my history reading, it seems to me the Fed used to demand payment "in specie" as it was then known, for land in particular, during the Homestead Act days, when Greenbacks were pretty "popular" going the other way. Jefferson had the tables turned on his notes payable, and helped him die broke, too..

Uh-oh... Quick! How much is $17 Trillion in gold anyway?

Sat, 11/24/2012 - 21:44 | 3009181 nmewn
nmewn's picture

Full faith with zero encumbrances...bitchez.

Sat, 11/24/2012 - 21:47 | 3009186 ebworthen
ebworthen's picture

Payment in gold and silver?

Why next he'll be expecting them to honor his right to property and habeus corpus!

Dangerous subversive who obviously needs to attend the "sexual harrasment/are you a terrorist?" workshop!

(/sarc)

Sat, 11/24/2012 - 21:57 | 3009204 hairball48
hairball48's picture

Hehehehe...we're(the non sheeples) all buying gold and silver out here.

I remember when I was vacationing out here in Montana with my family. I was a kid of 9 in 1957. I was fascinated that US Silver Dollars were still  quite common in circulation. I collected coins as a kid like many of my age did. We rarely ever saw a silver dollar in a cash register "back east" where I lived at the time.

Sat, 11/24/2012 - 21:51 | 3009195 Hulk
Hulk's picture

No counter party risk Bitchez !!! (unless you be foolish enough to own the ETF, or not have it in hand)

Sat, 11/24/2012 - 21:58 | 3009206 Tedster
Tedster's picture

Montana banks were still paying out silver dollars at face long after the arbs were falling all over themselves back east to get them for a quick flip to the collectors, the supply dried up, and silver certs were redeemed in silver shot. They have a long and storied history with mining, and are a tough people. Or were, like many places the locals get extirpated out of their habitat, so to speak. Ask the Indians. Hm.

Sat, 11/24/2012 - 22:08 | 3009226 hairball48
hairball48's picture

The "tough people" aren't all gone yet. I'm a recent Montana resident--10 years.

It's fascinating to listen to old timers who are 3rd, 4th, 5th generation Montanans....especially those who grew up on farms and ranches on the East side of MT where the winters are just incredibly harsh. Or mining areas like Butte. Butte has not only harsh winters at ~6000ft but the people are of that old tough mining stock. A fellow I know who played HS football said going to Butte to play in the winter was like going to war in Siberia LOL. Lots of tough folks still around. I admire them. Darwinism took care of most of the candy-ass pussies out here. However...

Montana has been invaded by too many candy-asses from other places, notably Kalifornia. They might be welcome if they would leave all their socialist laws, rules, and regulations wherever they came from....but they don't. So fuck em.

Sat, 11/24/2012 - 22:18 | 3009244 Zer0head
Zer0head's picture

those Californians fleeing the San Andreas unaware of the great Jellystone Caldera

Sat, 11/24/2012 - 22:52 | 3009283 ACP
ACP's picture

Well, when the "Great Winter" finally sets in, a Batman quote comes to mind:

"I won't kill you, but I don't have to save you."

Sun, 11/25/2012 - 01:31 | 3009409 knukles
knukles's picture

Talkin' about Montana and land owners, (some would say pinko) Ted Turner and his ex (some would say VC sympathizer) Jane Fonda own most of the state after the Feds.

Sun, 11/25/2012 - 10:01 | 3009607 IrritableBowels
IrritableBowels's picture

If you want to experience an Arctic-type winter, travel no farther than the Hi-Line.  Cut Bank to Plentywood.  -60F causes the snot to freeze in your nose in seconds.

Four women are driving across the country together, each one from a different state: Idaho, Montana, Nebraska, and California.  Shortly after the trip begins, the woman from Idaho pulls potatoes from her bag and throws them out the window.  "What are you doing?" asks the Nebraskan.  "We have so many of these things in Idaho, I'm sick of looking at them."  A moment later, the gal from Nebraska pulls ears of corn from her bag and tosses them from the window.  "What are you doing?" asks the gal from Montana.  "We have so many of these things in Nebraska, I'm sick of looking at them."  Inspired, the Montana opens the door and kicks the Californian out. 

Have a good one.

 

 

Sun, 11/25/2012 - 13:23 | 3009845 hairball48
hairball48's picture

ROFLAMO!!!

Sat, 11/24/2012 - 22:49 | 3009278 Never One Roach
Never One Roach's picture

He probably doesn't know that,  "you can't eat Gold."

 

 

 

Sat, 11/24/2012 - 22:51 | 3009281 augustus caesar
augustus caesar's picture

So he gets roughly one, 1 oz. gold coin per month.

Not a bad deal.

If it were me I'd want it presented in a little velvet sack on payday.

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