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Guest Post: Bureaucratic Despotism

Tyler Durden's picture




 

Submitted by Bob Hoye via SafeHaven.com,

"A great civilization is not conquered from without, until it has destroyed itself from within. The essential causes of Rome's decline lay in her people, her morals, her class struggle, her failing trade, her bureaucratic despotism, her stifling taxes, her consuming wars."

- Will Durant, The Story Of Civilization III, Epilogue, 1944

A number of sources list this as a quote, but it is a synthesis of the Epilogue "Why Rome Fell". It is valid then as well as now. America as we know it won't collapse, but Americans have been unusually successful in dealing with "bureaucratic despotism". They will be successful again. Bankruptcy of another experiment in bureaucratic despotism will prompt a refreshing turn to reform of bullying politics.

The election was a big day for the implacable forces of big bureaucracy, main stream media and big unions. There is no change from before the election.


Hoye/Brown - originally published March 2009

Cartoon from 1934

 

This cartoon was published by the Chicago Tribune in 1934.

Look carefully at the plan of action in the lower left corner.

Remember the adage:

"Those who do not remember the past are doomed to repeat it."

Couldn't find it in my old Webster's dictionary so I Googled it and discovered it is a recently "coined" new word found on T-shirts on eBay:

 

Read this one over slowly and absorb the facts that are within this definition! I love this word and believe that it will become a recognized English word. Finally, a word to describe our current political situation...

* * * * *

"The king has erected a multitude of New Offices, and sent Swarms of Officers to harass our People and eat out their substance."

- U.S. Declaration of Independenc

 

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Wed, 11/28/2012 - 16:16 | 3018320 mrktwtch2
mrktwtch2's picture

will john galt ever show up??

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 16:19 | 3018329 Boris Alatovkrap
Boris Alatovkrap's picture

Who is John Galt?

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 16:33 | 3018373 redpill
Wed, 11/28/2012 - 16:38 | 3018393 drbill
drbill's picture

Without a doubt, one of the scariest movies ever made!

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 16:54 | 3018441 Pairadimes
Pairadimes's picture

Needs to be reclassified as a documentary, like Escape From New York.

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 18:22 | 3018691 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

Idiocracy will literally be mistaken for a documentary in about 20 years.

Idiocracy - YouTube

Idiocracy

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 19:02 | 3018798 Boris Alatovkrap
Boris Alatovkrap's picture

Is not documentary of current American Social-Capitalistic Regime!?

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 20:47 | 3019042 Dead Canary
Dead Canary's picture

Da!

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 16:37 | 3018390 CH1
CH1's picture

Who is John Galt?

John Galt is whoever gets off his ass and starts building something better.

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 17:16 | 3018503 Hugh_Jorgan
Hugh_Jorgan's picture

You clowns have all but destroyed this system, so I'm going over here to ignore you and start over without you...

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 17:46 | 3018592 Shell Game
Shell Game's picture

...says the Borg collectivist.

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 18:56 | 3018779 fiddy pence haf...
fiddy pence haff pound's picture

John Galt is the rich kid, who being rejected by the other kids for being an asshole, takes his toys

and runs and hides. He's been accustomed to have the government work for him.

 

Waiting for a Galt to take over absolves people of any blame for continuing to feed this stupid system.

You can do stuff, locally. The Days of Industry have given way to the Days of Vulture Capitalism.

The Dark Knight of the Vultures is Mitt Romney and he was one Rovian trick away from winning.

Don't think that the Democrats care about voter fraud. Anyway, rambling.

 

The long term no longer exists. Next quarter. Stock dividends. Stock price.

No investment. no R&D. no manufacturing.

and, we're not invited if there were, anyway.

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 16:38 | 3018394 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

@ Boris

+ 1  John Galt is in hiding.  I'll be joining him soon.

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 16:51 | 3018430 Chuck Yeager
Chuck Yeager's picture

John was never in hiding...he was waiting for Dagney so he could stop the engines of the world.  Sheesh, read the book already.

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 17:11 | 3018491 Titus Flavius C...
Titus Flavius Caesar Vespasianus Augustus's picture

the phallic animus of the intellectually flaccid, and an archetypal pseudo-hero for econ majors whose exposure to "philosophy" began and ended with Ayn "unfuckingbounded middle" Rand - who was right about the dangers of communism for the wrong reasons.

 

Also, Rome fell because of debased currency, Germans, an expansive, shiftless bureaucracy, a cooling climate, and the shift from rule of law, to rule of war.

Then again, it survived in the form of the Byzantine Empire for quite a while.

 

Maybe Philly can be the new Constantinople.

 

 

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 18:31 | 3018712 Imminent Crucible
Imminent Crucible's picture

Yes, Philly can be the new Constantinople....circa 1453, under the Ottoman Turks.  We're building Bridges To Byzantium.

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 18:38 | 3018735 Johnny Utah
Johnny Utah's picture

I am John Galt...the man who loves his life...

Check this quote taken from a lecture by Rufus Fears, Wisdom of History Set... Sums up all empires perfectly...I transcribed and saved this awhile ago. This was the saying the ancients used to warn the Romans.

"That empire brings with it dangerous perhaps fatal consequences. Ancients believed that there was an invariable Iron law of empire, that is to say, that a republic will rise to greatness, it will gain an empire, that Empire then will bring with it wealth and contact with foreigners and wealth and contact with foreigners will corrode civic virtue and ultimately destroy that constitution."

Thu, 11/29/2012 - 01:36 | 3019466 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

Successful societies fail because they attract people with a different concept of survival.

Such societies are productive, like a nice berry patch, and like the berry patch, they will be picked clean by the hunter-gatherer/liberals drawn to them. It's been happening since the settlement culture separated from the hunter-gatherer culture about ten thousand years ago and proved to be vastly more successful.

I live in Mid-Michigan and in my lifetime have seen the hunter-gatherer/liberals totally destroy Detroit, just like they are destroying California, the US, and Europe. Survival strategies that developed over perhaps millions of years in pre-technological tribal societies will not promote the survival of modern technological societies. Simply put, they offer solutions to different problems than those that exist in the modern world.

The freedom culture has the best solution: get everything the hell out of the way and let people be productive.

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 16:22 | 3018330 Michaelwiseguy
Michaelwiseguy's picture

Government Bullies: How Everyday Americans Are Being Harassed, Abused, and Imprisoned by the Feds [Hardcover] by Rand Paul

Government regulations are out of control. They dictate how much water goes into your commode, and how much water comes out of your showerhead. They determine how hot the water needs to be in your washing machine, and how many miles to the gallon your car must achieve. Since the Patriot Act, your banking records, your gun registration, and your phone bill are easily accessible by government snoops. Mothers are arrested for buying raw milk. Families are fined for selling bunny rabbits without a license. Home and property owners are strapped with obscene fines, entangled in costly legal messes, and sent to federal prison, all for moving dirt from one end of their land to another. Unelected bureaucrats, armed with arbitrary rules and no need to back them up, stonewall and attack American citizens at every turn. The damage can be overwhelmingly taxing---financially, emotionally and even physically.

And who is being held accountable? Government regulation and red tape run amok in Washington, and honest, tax-paying citizens are the victims of an administration's misuse and abuse of power. Now, Senator Rand Paul of Kentucky, takes an in-depth look at the legislation that is trampling the rights of ordinary citizens, strangling their ability to conduct private, everyday activities without egregious government interference. He highlights outrageous searches, seizures and arrests, and points to thousands of regulations that have been added to the books since Obama took office. Most importantly, he charts a direction out of this mess, and toward renewed freedom for all Americans.

These stories are of everyday Americans badgered and harassed by their own government---the very institution that is supposed to serve us all. This gross breach of our constitution is as frightening as it is real, and GOVERNMENT BULLIES is a call to action against it.

http://www.amazon.com/dp/1455522759#_

Thu, 11/29/2012 - 00:19 | 3019385 H E D G E H O G
H E D G E H O G's picture

I'd give you some more GREEN arrows Michael, but I'm stiffled. JUST WHO IS THE SERVANT HERE AND WHO IS THE MASTER?  THE FUCKING BULLSHITTING, BUNGLING, BUREAUCRATIC BASTARDS OF THE US GOVERNMENT OR THE TIRED, TREADWORN TAX PAYERS OF THIS COUNTRY?!!!!! There will be blood in the streets before it's all over.

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 16:16 | 3018321 vinayjha
vinayjha's picture

The biggest cartoon is Ben Bernanke. 

http://goo.gl/UZWdO

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 16:18 | 3018327 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

Fascism is back.  Long black markets.

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 16:38 | 3018396 CH1
CH1's picture

Long black markets.

THAT is the new opportunity, but the gutless need not apply.

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 17:23 | 3018516 Hugh_Jorgan
Hugh_Jorgan's picture

Barter.

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 17:31 | 3018552 Urban Redneck
Urban Redneck's picture

Barter is part of the black market, or are you one of those few who follow the law and pay income taxes on your barter transactions?

http://www.irs.gov/Businesses/Small-Businesses-&-Self-Employed/Bartering...

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 18:30 | 3018709 Zero Govt
Zero Govt's picture

don't care how to define it, Just Do It 

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 18:36 | 3018727 Imminent Crucible
Imminent Crucible's picture

Let's be clear about one thing: Any time black markets become necessary institutions, it is because the government's intervened, distorted, rigged "legitimate" markets have failed. The black market is then the real market.

See 'Soviet Union and G.Y.M. stores with nothing on the shelves'.

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 16:26 | 3018341 Cognitive Dissonance
Cognitive Dissonance's picture

Rome never fell. It just changed colors..............and will do (is doing) so again.

<How many of you can speak Mandarin cus it's all Greek to me?>

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 16:52 | 3018369 Michaelwiseguy
Michaelwiseguy's picture

I'm developing a new twist to the model they originally developed, to use against them.

We all take for granted the heavy hand of our government employees. This is what we do about it, by teaching those public employees to know their role;

We should have required "Presumption of Freedom, Presumption of Innocence of American Citizens Sensitivity Training", administered through human resource departments of all government agencies.

These classes will include the citing of law that backs up and reinforces the training topics covered in the lessons.

I'll have more on this subject as I develop my new realm of education for government employees.

I'm starting this New Entrepreneurial business today and invite you to participate and join me in this endeavor.

We can pass a law requiring public employee role teaching. Everyone who works for a fortune 500 company has to sit through the social engineering sensitivity training lessons. Lots of companies specialize in this field. They can add another course study to their specialties for public employees, especially for those who work in law enforcement. There's money to be made in this business.

There is a difference between public and private concerns.  Charter school employees come to mind.

The auto dealer and employees that service government owned equipment will not be required to have training. That sort of thing. I'm pretty frugal about what my property and income tax dollars are being spent on. The type of training courses can be tailored to each occupation. It's not rocket science, and it's money well spent, knowing I have respectful employees working for me.  Only people who are employed by governments through subcontractors that have direct contact physically with the public that employ them, will be required to have public interaction sensitivity training. If they have a problem with it, those private companies are perfectly free to conduct their business exclusively in the private sector as they see fit.

Preventing Harassment and Discrimination, Connecting With Respect
Developed as a practical and easy-to-implement workshop for organizations ready for a different kind of “diversity” training, Connecting with Respect represents the newest and most original approach to cultural excellence in decades.

Respectful Workplace

http://www.respectfulworkplace.com/training/?gclid=COS-qNnZ8LMCFQ3nnAodPx8Adw

 

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 16:25 | 3018344 kito
kito's picture

anybody else notice the usdebtclock.org federal spending and deficit numbers are rolling backwards??? it gives me a sudden surge of hope....just maybe it will continue, just maybe........................(and yes, the debt continues to climb, but allow me this one brief illusion).................

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 22:59 | 3019297 Sweet Chicken
Sweet Chicken's picture

Like staring at spokes of wheels spinning and creating the illusion the bicycle is moving backwards.

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 16:25 | 3018347 WarPony
WarPony's picture

No more free bread and circuses?  Note to self: incorporate Vatican.

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 16:27 | 3018353 Boilermaker
Boilermaker's picture

yea, yea, interesting piece.

Now, can we get back to banging the close on the SPX?  I'm saying 10 handles just for shits and gigs.

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 16:27 | 3018354 billwilson
billwilson's picture

Hmmm ... maybe a military industrial comples that generates wars and deficits forever. 

Hmmm ... maybe a health/pharma industrial complex that bankrupts citizens one by one.

Hmmm ... maybe a financial industrial complex that is sucking the host dry

Make no mistake it is the corporate welfare bums that are destroying the society

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 18:32 | 3018716 Zero Govt
Zero Govt's picture

Govt : absolute Heaven for the Parasite Class

Thu, 11/29/2012 - 01:39 | 3019468 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

Government is the sandbox of sociopaths.

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 16:27 | 3018355 TrumpXVI
TrumpXVI's picture

Sure, this is the great iconic tragedy told and retold in western literature; King Arthur/Camelot.  The story of the great and just realm, unconquerable from the outside, but that crumbles and falls due to rot from within.  

This has been the story since the beginning.  Human nature never changes.

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 16:30 | 3018360 lemonobrien
lemonobrien's picture

i call it a "cluster-fuck" but I'm plain ans simple.

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 18:34 | 3018718 Zero Govt
Zero Govt's picture

or "Govt" for short

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 16:38 | 3018395 MayIMommaDogFac...
MayIMommaDogFace2theBananaPatch's picture

Ineptocracy

Goddamn -- that just says it so nicely.

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 16:52 | 3018399 Mercury
Mercury's picture

"Ineptocracy" sounds like Frank Zappa's quip:

Rock journalism is people who can't write interviewing people who can't talk for people who can't read.

But really it's just democracy he's complaining about on this post which he probably can't get himself to admit in public since it's supposed to be a holy word and ideal but in reality it is, all by itself, a serious and mortal threat to "the 49%".

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 16:51 | 3018431 bankerbackbacon
bankerbackbacon's picture

serfs up

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 17:04 | 3018467 Defiant1968
Defiant1968's picture

But really it's just democracy he's complaining about on this post which he probably can't get himself to admit in public since it's supposed to be a holy word and ideal but in reality it is, all by itself, a serious and mortal threat to "the 49%".

 

Brilliant!

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 17:05 | 3018469 toomanyfakecons...
toomanyfakeconservatives's picture

The cartoon is a classic and the T-shirt is destined to be one.

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 17:13 | 3018498 prains
prains's picture

Wow the 99% are calling the shots??????
Who would have thought it possible thanks for clearing that up

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 17:23 | 3018522 BlackVoid
BlackVoid's picture

"America as we know it won't collapse,"

LOL. What a crap meaningless article.

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 17:27 | 3018536 Titus Flavius C...
Titus Flavius Caesar Vespasianus Augustus's picture

The vested, special interests currently manipulating the country into a potemkin-progressive fascist subsidiary of the largests international banks reminds me of something my old pal Marcus once said:

"A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murderer is less to fear. The traitor is the plague."

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 19:52 | 3018737 Zero Govt
Zero Govt's picture

Govt is the traitor, the traitor to the individual

Govt collectivises as "representing society" then thieves, lies and oppresses the individual

Govt fabricates a nation State, another 100% BS concept to suppress the individuals freedom

Govt is a fabrication, a bigger pile of shit producing nothing but shit you'll never meet in your life

3,000 years of shit ...time to end this dumb stinking joke

Stop Paying Tax ...give the sucker/s the boot once and for all time

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 17:29 | 3018546 randomdrift
randomdrift's picture

"All the great historians agree that, all of the great Western Civilizations fell due to the same <one particular unmentionalble people.>"  That quotation comes from history books and commentaries from the early twentieth century; the "great historians" included Gibbon and Toynbee; and the "great Western civilizations" were the Assyrian, Helenistic, and Roman Empires. 

The Roman Emporer Constantine also identified them as one of the leading causes of the decline of Rome and the Roman Empire. He concluded that the problems that they had caused were insurmountable. So, he founded a new Capitol, in Constantinople, rather than trying to reform Rome. He put a prohibition against their entering his new capitol, under pain of death. That prohibition remained in force for many centuries and Constantinople stood unconquored for many centuries after Rome fell. 

The problems they caused were the same as they are causing today.

 

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 18:54 | 3018774 ciao
ciao's picture

Gibbon spoke of Abrahamic intolerance and the soft centre.  You identify this with Judaism yet imply in your scketch that Chistianity and Islam somehow stand aside from it.  This sort of rhetoric is the sort of slapstick farce we expect of Americans.  Gibbon's attention was focused on the intolerant Christian sect.  The Romans had long supported religious autonomy in its empire.  Those that extinguished the flame of the Vestal Virgins brooked no religious dissent in any corner of the empire. 

Gibbon also  identified the tribunes and the ever softening core of the Empire. 

The incompatibility and inevitably degerative condition with the coupling of Lodge and Roosevelt's social Darwinism with the hardened warrior core for their American Empire overcame those that knew better like Reid by means of jingoism aided and abetted by Randolph Hearst.  Of coarse that was augmented by the raw greed and social Darwinist pre-existing frontier exceptionalism as applied to the tribes and the Mexicans.

Abrahamic intolerance and neo liberal philsophical is at the core of the American tradition.  It is framed in all the isms, and especially so in objectivism.   In Judaism and Christianity those philosophers (Maimonedes and Thomas Aquinas) that received the Aristotlonean translations and made a more tolerant philosophical tradition their own extinguished the degenerate pre-existing Neo_Platonism that had philsophically underwritten the intolerance of the likes of Ambrose and Augustine.   Maimonedes and Thomas/Magnus were indebted to Aristotlonean Islamic scholars like Avicenna and Averroes whose works and translations brought the restorative therapy of that tradition to life for them.  

What I am saying to you is that you should put your anti-semitism aside and read your history better than those childish jingoes that went before you in the American tradition if you wish to have any intellectual standing. 

The American Empire was always fatally philosophically flawed and survived by the missteps of others and the lack of proximity to them.  The 100 years of COIN in the Philippines gives the rub of how America has been unable to hold ground.  It can wreck but it can't build or maintain client sstates over anything beyond the medium term.  From the high point of 1960 it has all been downhill.  Intelligence led warfare has now become so patterned that even the useful idiots have learned how to game it. 

The reason for Obama's November 21, 2012  Presidential Memorandum -- National Insider Threat Policy and Minimum Standards for Executive Branch Insider Threat Programs is that Rome is replaying itself. 

The executive will give up their zionists and try on a pseudo Lucas Cornelius Sulla cut out that will seek to redeem everything except the degenerative intolerant condition that preordained the American Empire's demise.  

All American citizens can do as it plays out is to go long on ammo.

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 17:35 | 3018565 TSA gropee
TSA gropee's picture

It would certainly appear that history does indeed repeat itself. Can I shoot myself now?

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 18:41 | 3018741 Zero Govt
Zero Govt's picture

Nope, not before you take some parasites before you go

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 17:36 | 3018568 blunderdog
blunderdog's picture

Kinda dishonest to make claims of "civilization" collapsing when he's obviously talking about "empire."

The Roman "civilization" didn't go anywhere.  It became Europe.  "Rome" wasn't a civilization, it was an empire.

Empires collapse, but the people usually don't go away.

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 18:29 | 3018705 NidStyles
NidStyles's picture

Most people do not understand what the word Civilization actually means, much less what it means to be civil.

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 17:59 | 3018616 ArrestBobRubin
ArrestBobRubin's picture

Here's the Must Read of the day. How we WISH it was an "Ineptocracy" that poses the greatest peril to the American Republic.  As if the shit we're in is a result of "ineptitude." Or, due to haha, "International Socialism". That's a good one Bob Hoye. Keep the comedy coming.

Brzezinski: US must stop following Israel “like a stupid mule”

Here's a snippet to whet your appetite:

"....By denying any US “obligation” to “follow like a stupid mule whatever the Israelis do,” Brzezinski accurately implied that this is exactly what the US has been doing up until now. And by plaintively opining that “the United States has the right to have its own national security policy,” the former National Security Adviser underlined the fact that since the assassination of John F. Kennedy, who secretly went to war with Ben Gurion in a doomed effort to abort the Israeli nuclear weapons program, the US has not enjoyed that right.

Brzezinski’s assertion that the US is being led by the nose like a stupid mule by the Israelis is perhaps the most candid statement of its kind ever uttered in public by a high-level US strategist. Brzezinski’s remarks reflect the mainstreaming of the arguments presented by leading US political scientists Walt and Mearsheimer in their book The Israel Lobby.

Indeed, Brzezinski has gone much further than Walt and Mearsheimer, who couch their critique of the tail-wags-the-dog US-Israel relationship in extremely cautious language. By laying it out so explicitly, Brzezinski is in effect joining the ranks of such scholars as James Petras and Grant Smith, who leave Walt and Mearsheimer in the dust as they boldly and accurately describe the outrageous, destructive, and quite literally criminal Israeli domination of the US. (As Smith argues in Foreign Agents, the hundreds of thousands of members of the Zionist Power Configuration described by Petras are acting as unregistered agents of a foreign power; if the law were properly enforced, they would all be in prison.)..."  Contd

See what I mean by Must Read? If you want Real, not fluff, it's right there for you.

 

 

 

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 19:50 | 3018917 Joe A
Joe A's picture

Brzezinski is also one of the architects of US foreign policy which evolves around the US dominating Eurasia. He is member of CFR, trilateral commission and frequent invite to Bilderberg. Everything that this man says should be seen in that context. In the international world of (geo)politics, allies come and go.

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 18:07 | 3018657 Joe A
Joe A's picture

America is not Rome. Or is it?

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 20:46 | 3019037 randomdrift
randomdrift's picture

America is similar to Rome in many ways: America is multi-cultural, composed of many peoples, as was Rome, particularly during its latter years; America's level of morality appears worse, in some but not all ways than it was in Rome, (based on what Tacitus said about it during Nero's era  in his Annals of Rome); it has exported most of its productive industries, whereas, there were never many in Rome; most professions and skilled jobs in America are now licensed, as they were in Rome towards the end; the Roman economy was originally based on agriculture, in particular on wheat, as it was in America until recently; international trade made it difficult to make a living in Rome, as it does increasingly in America; international trade was accessible only to the wealthy in Rome and is principally conducted by the more affluent in America; those Romans who were not wealthy had little opportunity, except to join the army, as is increasingly becoming the case in Americca, today; veterans are given preference in hiring within America, today, and they were certainly honored in Rome if not given preferrence; that increasing makes America into a killing machine, as Rome was during their periods of expansion; but both America, today, and Rome towards it end has many young men who are/were not suitable for military duty; both America, today, and Rome during its last century are/were "Christian," although, the various denominations that bear that name differ widely; Rome was strongly anti-intellectual but today still only some segments of American society are; and towards its end the life-expectancy of a man in Rome was around twenty years, and the life-expectancy of a workingclass Mexican-American in the County in California where I grew up was 21 years, and people of that class, origin and ethnicity are now the majority in much of California, and much of the rest of America is now increasingly becoming like that. ---  Yes. America and Rome are very similar.    

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 18:17 | 3018685 woggie
woggie's picture

the beast is on the gobble
and all that matters is we're all headed for it's belly
http://youtu.be/ntmthFyaYzY

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 18:28 | 3018701 NidStyles
NidStyles's picture

People wonder why I'm an Anarchist.

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 19:56 | 3018745 Zero Govt
Zero Govt's picture

you're only an anarchist if you support Govt

the No.1 institution of murder, mayhem and socio-economic vandalism in history

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 19:02 | 3018799 fiddy pence haf...
fiddy pence haff pound's picture

I can't believe troll nuts are mentioning Galt.

He's the figment of the imagination of what Mark Ames calls

"a crazy Russian bag lady".

 

It's like waiting for your dad to solve your neighbourhood bully problems.

Stop dreaming.

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 19:36 | 3018887 The Alarmist
The Alarmist's picture

Yeah, but they have the police-state apparatus to make sure you pay them their due, so they don't seem to be so inept now, do they?

Wed, 11/28/2012 - 19:58 | 3018933 Zero Govt
Zero Govt's picture

did the Viet Kong and Taliban stand in the street waiting to be "collected" ?

...disappear off the Govt radar, you've no idea how dumb Big Govt is

Thu, 11/29/2012 - 00:28 | 3019390 H E D G E H O G
H E D G E H O G's picture

Looks like some sheep got shot in MadHatten today. Was it Sandy's fault, or was it a dispute on Black Wednesday over an I-fuck? just thinkin out loud.....................

Thu, 11/29/2012 - 04:37 | 3019672 ahb
ahb's picture

Ineptocracy my ass. Total governmental transfers and assumed liabilities related to U.S. financial institutions since 2008 exceed the entire history of all social welfare programs for all free world economies collectively since Bismarck (do the numbers, its true). The elite have milked the world nearly dry and now ZH trots out dumb fuck after dumb fuck guest posters to tell us it's the poor's fault for voting themselves money via Obama. Fucking idiots. The rich learned to vote themselves money by the bankload decades ago. Politicians stole $4 Trillion from the SSI trust fund and paid it to their crony military contractor paymasters and now SSI is being blamed for the current crisis? The problem isn't an ineptocracy, it's a greed machine so powerful and efficient that it will literally suck the life from the planet before it can be stopped. And you fucking dickheads are cheering it on. Nice job ZH.

Thu, 11/29/2012 - 06:05 | 3019744 smacker
smacker's picture

A fault line of democracy is that it produces governments which offer collectivist policies/solutions. Politicians get elected by moving towards the centre ground. Most Western political parties get elected because they offer policies/solutions which maximise the benefits and minimise the cost to the greatest number of people, the latter often being people who had no involvement in creating the problem which needs fixing. In practice, this collectivism means that some people get a free lunch or get rewarded for acting irresponsibly, whilst the solution costs are spread across society.

A so-called solution to the banking/economic crises is an example of this collectivist process in action. In the UK, people who over-borrowed to climb aboard the property gravytrain to cash-in on capital profit, just before prices tumbled, are now enjoying Zirp. The cost of this is being funded by savers/investors, because the political elites cannot face the prospect of people with mortgages handing in their keys and becoming homeless, then demanding social housing for themselves and their kids. It's wealth redistribution.

Thu, 11/29/2012 - 10:42 | 3020281 blunderdog
blunderdog's picture

"Society" is kind of a tradeoff.

Thu, 11/29/2012 - 11:50 | 3020537 smacker
smacker's picture

Or perhaps socializing debts & costs ...is the trade off.

But it's inconsistent for those who believe in individualism, who want to make their own way in life without having to fork out all the time to support those who've been selfish/greedy or taken wrong decisions but had their votes bought by the political elites and been promised largesse from the Treasury to pay for their mistakes.

This system is one that nobody voted for and nobody has a choice to opt out of it. If you refuse to take part by witholding your taxes, you end up in the slammer.

Thu, 11/29/2012 - 12:58 | 3020830 blunderdog
blunderdog's picture

If you want to live in a world where you have to "vote for" the system you prefer, you need central-planners with tremendous authority.  No thanks.

The trade-off has ALWAYS existed when people group together and share resources.  If you don't want to engage in basic human socialization, the USA is one of the best places in the world where you can find a way to avoid it.

Thu, 11/29/2012 - 16:35 | 3021754 smacker
smacker's picture

I can't find much to agree with there. Your phrase "The trade-off has ALWAYS existed when people group together and share resources" says it all, because -- although it accurately describes what we have -- many people do not want that model but have no choice. That was my point: the socialization of debts/costs have gone out of control.

In the UK we already have some socialization of motor car insurance and soon to be property insurance. The last socialist government wanted to introduce a new tax on all telephone subscribers to pay the cost of providing broadband to remote communities. It goes on and on...

A practical solution is to have a strong written constitution, not drafted by the political elites, which is enforced by an independent body, not appointed by the political elites. It would contain very a clear statement of the limited roles & responsibilities of government. And if it ain't on the list, it ain't their business.

Thu, 11/29/2012 - 18:01 | 3022008 blunderdog
blunderdog's picture

    A practical solution is to have a strong written constitution, not drafted by the political elites, which is enforced by an independent body, not appointed by the political elites.

That's what we did in the USA awhile back.  It got us this far.  The thing is: that "independent body" is just another group of "political elites."

The current battle is basically over--industry beat governments by the end of the 20th century.  You have plenty of control over ALL of your day-to-day freedoms if you have enough money to purchase the right services from the right providers.

Government's passe, but they haven't given up yet, and they'll keep fighting as long as anyone pays any attention to them.

Thu, 11/29/2012 - 19:30 | 3022240 smacker
smacker's picture

At its inception, America failed to devise an oversight mechanism for its constitution. The consequence has been that successive governments for a very l-o-n-g time have gotten away with trashing it, and your recourse is thru the (very expensive and stressful) judicial system where the supreme court are political appointees.

The independent body is obviously crucial and potentially open to brown envelopes and corruption...but nothing is perfect.

Suppose the oversight board was not politically appointed and every new law had to be signed off by them before it could become law?

Fri, 11/30/2012 - 15:12 | 3024487 blunderdog
blunderdog's picture

     Suppose the oversight board was not politically appointed and every new law had to be signed off by them before it could become law?

That would make the "oversight board" a VERY POWERFUL group of politicians.

Where would they come from?

Fri, 11/30/2012 - 19:44 | 3025437 smacker
smacker's picture

I have always been adamant they should not be politicians, not even has-been politicians. That would be like asking bank robbers to advise on bank security.

IMHO they should be chosen for their expertise in constitutional affairs and would probably be (elected?) academics. Dunno, but their role would be to study all proposed new laws for compliance with the constitution. Nothing is perfect but this would provide considerable protection against despotic politicians.

Thu, 11/29/2012 - 12:37 | 3020711 Fezter
Fezter's picture

The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money.
Alexis de Tocqueville

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