This page has been archived and commenting is disabled.

It's 8:40 Am, Do You Know Where Your "Sell Gold" Order Is?

Tyler Durden's picture


It's that time of day again. For no good reason (aside from arguably a stronger EUR as BIS fills its boots) - and with stocks up - Gold and Silver have once again been Baumgartnered this morning down to three-week lows (and Gold under $1700 again - breaking below its 100DMA for the first time since 8/16).



The last time Gold fell this fast in 7 days, it bounced quite notably...


and if you needed a reason for why gold is plunging - see here - as 10Y goes 'special - and gold and Treasuries move tick for tick in a liquidation rotation...


Chart: Bloomberg


- advertisements -

Comment viewing options

Select your preferred way to display the comments and click "Save settings" to activate your changes.
Tue, 12/04/2012 - 09:59 | 3032133 RacerX
RacerX's picture

those guys have been hammering at SLV 32 for a while.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:02 | 3032146 GetZeeGold
GetZeeGold's picture



Thank goodness those guys getting paid by the day from OWS finally have some new work.


I'm selling what again?

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:06 | 3032174 RacerX
RacerX's picture

these raids are getting more frequent and blatent. If there was a big trader trying to lighten their book--I can't see a reason for dumping right at 8:30 EST. I'm sure our regulators are on it. 

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:29 | 3032268 Beam Me Up Scotty
Beam Me Up Scotty's picture

They will get right on it after Peter North finishes blowing his load.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 11:55 | 3032524 Papasmurf
Papasmurf's picture

Victoria Paris double top?

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:33 | 3032281 Againstthelie
Againstthelie's picture

I see this as a strong indication that on 12.12.12 Ben will come as Santa. Therefore they are manipulating the PMs down, otherwise these would easily reach 1800/35 and then the ATHs and indicating to the sheeple, that the King is naked...

If the FED would do nothing now, they would trick the sheeple into going long now and then smash them.

Just don't believe in the old myth of free markets any longer, understand what the intention of the manipulation is and use it to your advantage. It's great, thanks Ben and Mario!


Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:38 | 3032297 Karlus
Karlus's picture

The contrarian would look at this and say, Ben has whispered to his bank buddies that he is putting QE4 on ice for now, and they are selling their Au....


You can look at it both ways.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:40 | 3032308 MeanReversion
MeanReversion's picture

There WILL be more bond buying as Operation Twist is expiring and unemployment is still high.  The only question remaining is whether it will be sterilised or unsterilised.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 11:11 | 3032400 Big Slick
Big Slick's picture

I bet against my favorite NFL team when they play on Sunday... that way I'm happy with either outcome.

While I think that drops in gold price such as these are anomalies, you need to consider why you are long gold.

IF it is as a hedge against a massive currency crisis, then a drop in gold might indicate lower risk of that crisis occuring - WHICH IS A GOOD THING.  This also highlights what your position should be as a % of your total book and your appetite for downside risk on gold. 

If the crisis is averted and we get back on track (mind you I think the likelihood of this outcome is LOW) then you lose 10-20% of your wealth and have some nice yellow metal to look at now and then.  You are sitting on 90-80% of nominal holdings and we are back to fat dumb and happy.

But if the crisis DOES occur, and you were patient enough to ride out these swings (and believe me you ain't seen nothing yet - Bernie has a lot of ammo) and buy on dips, and gold goes to $10k, then you are the genius you thought you were (as long as you are holidng physical and the lead to protect it)

Hold the line!


Tue, 12/04/2012 - 11:45 | 3032489 Panafrican Funk...
Panafrican Funktron Robot's picture

I get the feeling that everything is going to be a pretty boring (treasuries mostly flat, stocks also generally treading water, commodities takedown) in the run-up to Dec. 21st, which happens to be options expiration, and the predicted end of the world.  However, assuming we're all still alive and well, the 26th - 28th I think are going to be drastic selloffs in both stocks and treasuries, and drastic runups in commodities, esp. gold/silver.  I could be totally wrong there, but just thinking through the last time we had a legislative crisis of this type.  Regardless, happy for the discount on gold stacking as I prepare for my holiday giving.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 14:46 | 3033114 FEDbuster
FEDbuster's picture

My pre-64 quarters are for when the guy raising chickens down the street wants a "real" quarter for a chicken and a dozen eggs.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 15:19 | 3033219 Big Slick
Big Slick's picture

You mean he won't make change for a $10,000 coin??

I agree with you whole-heartedly.  'Junk silver' will be key.  Even a Silver Eagle will be unmanageable at $150/coin. 

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 16:24 | 3033391 dmger14
dmger14's picture

Got me some of that too.  Seems QE4 will be announced at the Dec. 12th FOMC, and with Chris Martenson posting an article specifically about this dip being gold manipulation (first article specifically pointing the finger so blatantly at manipulation), I bought some gold today.  Gotta figure the PMs will reflect QE4 before Dec. 12.  That;s the plan anyway.  If I am wrong, I am diversified and can sleep, though I'd be out about six figures if your proverbial 20% loss proves true.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 17:13 | 3033540 Gift Whores
Gift Whores's picture

I buy gold (physical) because I have a harder time (psychological thing) spending it in that form.

When the monetary system as we know it ends, having physical gold on hand will be an added benefit.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 11:26 | 3032441 Againstthelie
Againstthelie's picture

If you can tell me where the 45 bn. from OT2 for the long bond should come from, i could follow you...


Also it seems that JPM hasn't got Ben's memo: JPM wrote, that in 2013 already 90% of all new US debt will be monetized from the FED.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:48 | 3032334 insanelysane
insanelysane's picture

This is a setup for buying.  Someone is peppering the market with bunches of fake sell trades to drive price down and then come in and buy.  Regulators are "hard" at work on porn.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 11:28 | 3032449 Againstthelie
Againstthelie's picture

Bart Chilton is doing his best. Only four years from now we will have the result of his investigations! The Soviet regime was not that efficient!

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:07 | 3032183 JPM Hater001
JPM Hater001's picture

I have no idea what your selling.  I'm not selling.  Hey Doc E you selling?

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:33 | 3032282 Enslavethechild...
EnslavethechildrenforBen's picture


Tue, 12/04/2012 - 11:04 | 3032377 toady
toady's picture

I can get 2oz today if they can keep it below 17 for the next hour while I drive over to the coin shop.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 14:18 | 3033003 Strider52
Strider52's picture

Right now it's 1692. If i had a million $$ just waiting for a good idea, I'd load up on Phyzz right now. I think it's a safe bet we'll see $1800 before Jan 1.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 11:19 | 3032422 Stoploss
Stoploss's picture

Unbeknownst to me, after divorcing myself from the system, low and behold, i no longer have a "sell" button for gold, only three buy buttons. Thay are:

1. Buy Low

2. Buy lower

3. Buy lowest


Hey look, there is a "Buy Ammo" button right next to it!!!!

OK, gonna push that one, an see what happens.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 14:50 | 3033124 FEDbuster
FEDbuster's picture

Lots of ammo and hi-cap magazines before AWB2 next year.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 16:06 | 3033349 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

Amazing how the mood changes...  Just picked up a half ounce AGE, 10 Johnson Matthey 1 oz silver ingots, and ordered a Archangel Sparta Pistol Grip Conversion Stock for my Ruger Mini-14.   Ah... life is good!

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:00 | 3032135 resurger
resurger's picture

Someone is trying to match his book

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:00 | 3032136 achmachat
achmachat's picture

Dear readers who still have loads of cash to invest and don't really know what to do with said cash:

NOW is the time to get as much physical real precious metals as you can.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:08 | 3032189 JPM Hater001
JPM Hater001's picture

So was yesterday.

Every day is a good day...for silver.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:29 | 3032269 resurger
resurger's picture

Black Friday, every time it's red

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 14:50 | 3033130 FEDbuster
FEDbuster's picture

I only buy silver on days that end with "y".

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:51 | 3032345 Anasteus
Anasteus's picture

Santa has come...

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:00 | 3032139 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

Forrest Gump... "For no particular reason"...

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 11:46 | 3032493 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

BNN: just blamed the selling on "investor frustration".


Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:01 | 3032140 Dr. Engali
Dr. Engali's picture

I don't know where my sell gold order is ( I don't have one), but I know where my buy gold order is.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:02 | 3032144 gold-is-not-dead
gold-is-not-dead's picture

shopping spree

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:02 | 3032148 Bagbalm
Bagbalm's picture

If this thing isn't adjusted daily it gets out of hand.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:05 | 3032150 MeanReversion
MeanReversion's picture

You had stops triggered at the 1710 level overnight.  Gold appeared weak and you further selling this morning and then stops were blown at the 1700 level.  The sell-off was accompanied by selling in other risk assets so this was not like last week's drop which was independent of other asset classes.

Would expect weakness heading into non-farm payrolls.  If NFP disappoints, gold should react positively and to boot, you have the FOMC next week where they may announce more bond buying.

Less likely there conspiratorial selling in the past 24 hours and more likely that this is due to technicals.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:11 | 3032205 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

Reads like conspiratorial technicals to me.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:03 | 3032151 timbo_em
timbo_em's picture

PMs have to be pushed down before Benny B reveals QE4 double eternity.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:04 | 3032153 quasimodo
quasimodo's picture

Maybe it's just me, but it would appear that the more stories I am seeing in the MSM about the virtues of metals, the worse the price gets bitch slapped. 

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:06 | 3032170 aleph0
aleph0's picture

 WS are the Elite Socialists ... that is, until they run out of other people's money.


Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:04 | 3032155 Quintus
Quintus's picture

Gee.  Short covering before the announcement of QE4 next week?

Look at the short sellers wriggling on their hooks, desperately trying to avoid the inevitable consequences of infinite money printing.

Just ignore these blatant, desperate attempts by the manipulators to save themselves.  The only way out for them is when the Comex futures contracts for gold and silver are declared in default and cash settled.  These antics might put that day off a little longer, but will not prevent it.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:33 | 3032259 Everybodys All ...
Everybodys All American's picture

Bullard announced yesterday that he was for 25 bil / month monetizing rather than the 40-45 bil currently. That might be considered a contraction. Also, it looks to me like the fiscal cliff is going to happen as both sides figure they can't agree on anything different and lets be honest that is the best outcome politically for the president. Those forced spending cuts would mean that the Fed is not needed as much in the fiscal equation for the time being.

The out lier is the dollar but commodities are definitely weakening.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 11:02 | 3032370 MeanReversion
MeanReversion's picture

Bullard is not a voting member until January and the committee is still dominated by dovish members who would happily buy more than $25 billion.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 11:07 | 3032384 Everybodys All ...
Everybodys All American's picture

They are all dovish. The reality of their balance sheet predicament is starting to mount even on these morons. Why else would he make the statement of being in favor of less stimulus? I think you can tie the fiscal cliff outcome with their action. Bernanke has stated time and time again he has done alll he can do and it's time for Congress and the president to do their part. We shall see soon enough.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:04 | 3032157 VonManstein
VonManstein's picture

Silver extremely resilient. Unprecedented.

To me i see this as preparation some big US data will miss big Wed Thur and Friday


Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:06 | 3032176 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

VonManstein data misses ensure the fed continues QE forever. That would be bullish. Data hits would be bearish because it ensures the fed would have to stop QE sooner than anticipa........BWAHAHAHA sorry I could not get that last part out with a straight face.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:30 | 3032273 Boston
Boston's picture

Yes, but the sequence:

Data miss => silver falls due to its industrial use => Fed steps up its actions/rhetoric => silver rallies

So prepare to buy on any major 30 or even lower.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:05 | 3032159 SmallerGovNow2
SmallerGovNow2's picture

Backup the truck and BTFD...

Bought silver last time it went under $30 (at $28.58/oz).  Bring it so I can buy some more!!!!

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:15 | 3032220 azzhatter
azzhatter's picture

I'm still buying every week. The trivial changes from $28-$34 are meaningless in the big picture

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 11:08 | 3032387 fredquimby
fredquimby's picture

Hatzz off to that. I do the same. #BTFD

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 13:39 | 3032842 daccord
daccord's picture

Just Fucking Buy #JFB

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 11:06 | 3032381 Nozza
Nozza's picture

... Bitchez!

Wed, 12/05/2012 - 00:02 | 3033572 MeelionDollerBogus
MeelionDollerBogus's picture

I am Jack's complete lack of surprise.

Current scatterplot trend June to today is 17 x (gold/1274) 2.33  = silver +/- 55c (today +/- 25c)

inverse: 1274 x (silver/17)  1/2.33 = gold price +/- 12$


Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:04 | 3032162 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

I hate to say this but I could actually understand if the Einhorns etc. of the world are selling and locking in gains before this stupid cliff. But if that is true it just sets up for a massive rally soon.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:05 | 3032164 JonNadler
JonNadler's picture

who needs a clock in the office, when you have the Kitco ticker to tell you it's 8:30Am

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:11 | 3032202 GetZeeGold
GetZeeGold's picture



......and it's only about $1000 to the standing Kitco market call of $700/oz.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:14 | 3032215 ParkAveFlasher
ParkAveFlasher's picture

My Kitco clock goes from 8:29 straight to 8:31 with a nice smooth line in between.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 16:34 | 3033418 akak
akak's picture

And who needs a cuckoo clock in the office, when you have Jon Nadler to daily denigrate and poormouth gold, defend the paper gold Ponzi game, and insult his company's very own potential customers as "Radical Goldbug Extremists".

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:06 | 3032173 youngman
youngman's picture

For people who think we have a free and fair normal market...this shows you we do the real stuff....the paper chashers will lose in the end....

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:07 | 3032178 scatterbrains
scatterbrains's picture

Maybe gold is telegraphing that taxes are about to go up for everybody... not to mention the spending cuts.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:10 | 3032197 JPM Hater001
JPM Hater001's picture

Barbarous relics dont telegraph.


It scribes neatly in the granite mountains of time.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:07 | 3032179 SDRII
SDRII's picture

Why else would it be down...

swiss going to negative rates per the buiter advice back in his FT golden days

FOMC meeting DEC 12, have to set the table

Iran says captured US drone, again

Australia cutting rates, again,

Head of Bank Tokyo-Mitsubishi " admitted that the bank’s Y40tn ($485bn) holdings of Japanese government bonds were a major risk but said he was powerless to do much about it."

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:07 | 3032180 new game
new game's picture

JMFO, but this hammer down will continue.

don't underestimate manipulation.




b/4 the monkeys hammered to silence in the canopy...

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 16:14 | 3033360 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

"...this hammer down will continue."

Sweet talkin' man!  I don't think you'll hear a complaint here except for the paper traders -- and they get what they deserve.  Funny how the roll of silver eagles here on my desk weighs the same as it did last week, and the week/year before.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:07 | 3032185 Silver_K-9
Silver_K-9's picture

Stack Up the Smack Down!

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:08 | 3032187 davinci7_gis
davinci7_gis's picture

Wow..look at the one year chart for Gold (last December)...looks good to buy when it starts hitting $1605-$1580.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:21 | 3032249 Boston
Boston's picture

If gold doesn't hold 1600, there could be a lot of weak longs having an "oh sit moment". 

Of course, I'll be buying. And since I have no clue where the selling will stop, I'm simply buying down every 50 bucks, escalating my quantities as prices fall.

If this is a repeat of last December's holiday sale, then I'll be going on a shopping spree....again!

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:08 | 3032188 jay28elle
jay28elle's picture

Big boys just getting ready for the next ramp up 


Tue, 12/04/2012 - 16:16 | 3033367 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

An unanticipated factor is the tax selling brought on by the so-called fiscal cliff.  Some longs are certainly smart enough to calculate the new possible tax rates.  Just buy it back when finished -- and they shall.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:13 | 3032212 RealityCheque
RealityCheque's picture

I have no intention of ever selling, so why do the day charts piss me off so much!!

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:13 | 3032213 caimen garou
caimen garou's picture

just the typical smack down before bend us all over bernake  announces qe4, or is it qe5, can't keep track of it anymore.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:19 | 3032242 Kina
Kina's picture

Different day, same unregulated corruption. CFTC checking out more tranny porn and inflatable room mates.


Nevertheless a chance for China to dump more dollars for gold. In time the entire western gold holdings will travel east, and thus the treason of TPTB complete.


It is the obvious actions similar to today and recently that tells you that you must hold PMs. Their desperation on the gold and silver prices is the best indicator that this is what you should hold when the music stops.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 16:24 | 3033390 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

The U. S. Mint must, by law, produce gold and silver Eagles "to meet demand".  Don't think that a lot of the recent increase of coin sales isn't going off-shore.  It's reminiscent of the old 1970s run on the U. S. gold by European countries which prompted Nixon to put a stop to it.   Look for it coming soon!  Legislative changes to the Mint's mandate will be sneaked into a legislative Trojan Horse.  You'll be glad you've been buying all this time.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:20 | 3032245 rubearish10
rubearish10's picture

It's "The Cliff" stupid!

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:23 | 3032246 FunkyOldGeezer
FunkyOldGeezer's picture

Time for two prices for commodities. Real world and fantasy world.

In the real world, real buyers and sellers settling in physical commodities would arrive at a proper price, then the fantasy world traders could do what the heck they liked.

However, I still think China is behind most of the manipulation. THEY have the motive and the cash, USA only has a motive.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 11:22 | 3032429 Mr Pink
Mr Pink's picture

Im not sure I want to take delivery on those pork bellies I bought......on second thought.....its time for breakfast.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:21 | 3032248 kivod
kivod's picture

The metals were crushed in dec 2011 in order to print a low closing price for the year. It looks to me they are going for it one more time.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:22 | 3032250 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

"Crash The Morgue...short zee gold."

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 12:37 | 3032654 rqb1
rqb1's picture

crash the morgue, buy phy ag

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:23 | 3032251 kliguy38
kliguy38's picture


Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:23 | 3032253 realtick
realtick's picture

Anyone following Shithead Ferguson and TF Metals at this point needs to be institutionalized.


Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:29 | 3032270 Lost Wages
Lost Wages's picture

Stopped reading that site long ago when I saw how many comments they delete.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 11:07 | 3032383 oddjob
oddjob's picture

Taking advice from a person that refers to his readers as 'little pieces of shit' is probably not a good idea.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 17:30 | 3033584 akak
akak's picture

Wait .... are we still talking about Turd Ferguson, or Jon Nadler?

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 11:25 | 3032438 Mr Pink
Mr Pink's picture

Noone can predict the short term prices of PMs in a rigged market......except the scumbags rigging it...

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 17:22 | 3033562 MeelionDollerBogus
MeelionDollerBogus's picture


 Anyone can predict the rigged market because it is rigged. Without the repeating patterns of the rigging mymodels wouldn't work, but they do: short-term

long-term :

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 11:48 | 3032498 quasimodo
quasimodo's picture

So THAT is why he never shows up here.  I would give him some props for sticking his neck out on some gutsy calls, but at some point the fucking horse is dead already.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:24 | 3032256 Lost Wages
Lost Wages's picture

I assume this means stocks will be going down today as well. Needed a couple more up days so I can sell equities & rebalance.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:24 | 3032257 Iam Yue2
Iam Yue2's picture

Russia selling   .....?

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:28 | 3032263 GetZeeGold
GetZeeGold's picture


......dore bars to China.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:28 | 3032264 Quinvarius
Quinvarius's picture

It has been getting hit ever since Gartman said he was long gold last week.  Hopefully he told everyone to use stops and got them slaughtered again this AM so we can end another episode of the Gartman follies.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:36 | 3032292 Flaming Ferrari
Flaming Ferrari's picture

Yes of course it is all some wild conspiracy. Please.  The uncomfortable truth for GBugs is this price action does not look encouraging. QE Infinity gold rally is done. It now needs Ben "Buzz Lightyear" Bernanke to deliver QE Infinity and Beyond. Get ready.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:38 | 3032296 Cosimo de Medici
Cosimo de Medici's picture

Does a blow-off top require both price and participation, or is participation alone enough?  Also, can a tumble be a delayed reaction to a blow-off price top?

The bookstores are filled with books on PMs, the airwaves filled with advertisements for PM buying, and November saw record retail coin buying from the US Mint.  Certainly there is participation at the retail level.  Price, if a requirement for a top, might have come with $1900 and $48 seen a year ago.

All the very rational reasons for buying PMs are still there, but all were there in 1980, too.  Despite the near endless printing, the vast majority of the species still swears by fiat in all its 180 or so active forms worldwide.  Money has been described as many things, but I would say money is a democracy.  The majority vote for what constitutes "money", and they still vote heavily for the paper candidate.  That historically many voted for PMs is irrelevant, since only in Chicago do dead people vote.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:59 | 3032364 wisefool
wisefool's picture

My belief is that people are scared of losing it or having it stolen. PMs put great responsibility in the holder. fiat can be replaced. Even if it was not poor, I would not buy PMs. I could defend them, but I would not harm another person in that situation even if they were evil.

But for all the the sound money types who see value in PMs, these dips are the opportunities to load up the truck! IF TPTB is making PMs cheaper for you, don't look that gift horse in the mouth.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 11:09 | 3032397 Hubbs
Hubbs's picture

Good point. Or, as in a previous article, it really is a Mexican standoff. Everyone has a vested interest in the fiat mirage perpetuating, even the retirees and pensioneers. Better to have your fiat buying at least something rather than nothing at all.


Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:40 | 3032309 Kaiser Sousa
Kaiser Sousa's picture



thanks for the Silver sale again you mother fuckers....cant wait for my dealer to open...

we aint falling for the banana in the tailpipe u assholes.....

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:45 | 3032329 monopoly
monopoly's picture

Thank you for the gift. I just bought more gold and silver. Yes! Think about 17 Trillion in debt, look around you and tell me it is all going to be OK going forward. Good, now relax. 

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:50 | 3032344 Platinum_Investor
Platinum_Investor's picture

I've not been a believr of this manipulation talk.  But recently I've started to see that things do look odd.  If their is this manipulation isn't that illegal ?  

How can our government allow such a thing?

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 12:17 | 3032605 Bansters-in-my-...
Bansters-in-my- feces's picture

@ Platinum_Investor

If you have not heard of the ESF and what it can do,then go to the feds site and learn about it.

Very Very corrupt.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:58 | 3032361 monopoly
monopoly's picture

What government are you talking about. Amerika?

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 10:59 | 3032363 1eyedman
1eyedman's picture

yes, something/somebody is up to something.   eur/usd near highs, while pm/equities flag?  that hasnt been the recent tradition.  

smells like fed swap rollover, but too many sellers for the algos to deal with, hence the limp down....1320 by year end perhaps?

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 11:03 | 3032376 inzider84
inzider84's picture

Can someone please inform me how smackdowns like theese are made? How do they do this??

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 11:05 | 3032380 GetZeeGold
GetZeeGold's picture



You print money out of thin air.....then you short the metals. Works pretty good until it doesn't anymore.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 11:18 | 3032419 inzider84
inzider84's picture

Thanks for your reply.


So this smackdown, along with the one from a couple of days back, is the result of CBs expanding the money supply and flooding the market with liquidity?


How does that technically influence the Comex in a way that creates theese sudden plunges?


I'm really trying to understand this game, so excuse my ignorance :)

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 12:08 | 3032558's picture



November 28, 2012


More information about this morning’s huge gold selloff is starting to circulate. It seems less likely that this was a case of “fat fingers” accidentally selling a large stake.  London-based bullion dealer Sharps-Pixley reported that there was a single sell order of 7,800 gold futures contracts at 8:20am EST that amounted to 24 tons of gold. This act triggered massive selling to be triggered from computerized programs, with Reuters reporting that the equivalent of 35% of an average day’s trading was executed in approximately one minute.


Tue, 12/04/2012 - 11:05 | 3032379 Hubbs
Hubbs's picture

Relax. The price drop is merely reflecting the amount  of tungsten impurities that have crept into circulation.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 11:07 | 3032385 Caracalla
Caracalla's picture

I'm selling all of the PM (Silver) I bought last December.  There is a ceiling on PM price and the powers that be will never let the price get above that.  PMs are dead in the water for a long time.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 11:17 | 3032415 GetZeeGold
GetZeeGold's picture



If you really think that then follow the lemmings off the fiscal cliff.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 11:40 | 3032479 AgShaman
AgShaman's picture

I'll give you spot prices for what you wanna "let go"

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 13:43 | 3032857 viahj
viahj's picture

I'll give spot -1

see?  that's how NIRP works.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 16:30 | 3033419 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

Is that you Johnny Bravo (AKA MasterBates)?   Finally moved outta your mother's basement?  Congrats.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 16:37 | 3033438 akak
akak's picture

I don't know, Rocky --- his argument and analysis were very well reasoned and highly persuasive.

The end is nigh for gold!

Long live the immortal US dollar!

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 11:22 | 3032424 Mugatu
Mugatu's picture

I have been waiting for TPTB to execute their "every few years Short Raid" and it looks like it may have started.  Every few years you see a fairly large 15-20% drop in Gold and it gives all the long term buyers a new buying point.  I would not be surprised to see them eventually knock gold down lower than $1500.  I will then load up on Gold and watch it break $3000 by 2015.  Just sit back and wait for the panic selling to occur.  When we break $1500 and the meat puppets on CNBC start talking about the end of the Gold Bull Run, then buy Gold until your asshole is full. 

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 11:42 | 3032482 Confundido
Confundido's picture

That's wishful thinking. Please, can you tell me exactly why and how you expect gold to sell down to $1,500/oz?

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 13:03 | 3032729 Mugatu
Mugatu's picture

Since 2011, $1500 has served as the support for many bounces.  Check the monthly charts.  A true blood-letting occurs only after we break some long term support - which is at $1500.  Gold's run since 2009 has been vertical on the monthly charts and since it hit $1900 in 2011, it has hit the wall.  Over the last 3 years Gold has bounced 3 times off of the $1500 area and has been repelled 3 times when it gets over $1800 - sounds like a trading channel doesn't it?  Considering the monthly charts (you do look at those don't you?), Gold looks like it needs to bump off all the exhuberant longs to set up a new bull run.  To do that you need to break support at $1500 and scare all the weak longs to get off the Gold train.  A $1500 penetration would see panic selling and finally set up the next run.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 17:20 | 3033559 MeelionDollerBogus
MeelionDollerBogus's picture

At 1500 I'll be panic-buying, thank you

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 11:53 | 3032518 Quintus
Quintus's picture

You watched the price fall from $1,920 to $1,520 and you're still waiting??

Newsflash: the 20% drop you were waiting for has already happened. 

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 16:40 | 3033445 akak
akak's picture


Tue, 12/04/2012 - 17:20 | 3033556 MeelionDollerBogus
MeelionDollerBogus's picture

buy now but not so hard you can't also by at 1600/oz in the next 60 days

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 11:34 | 3032461 AgShaman
AgShaman's picture

"Up yer butt Jobu....Hey bartender, Jobu needs a refill"

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 11:45 | 3032492 dolph9
dolph9's picture

I don't know what's going on with gold.  Does anybody, really?

I would guestimate that somewhere between $5000 and $10000 per ounce is a fair price based on prevailing market conditions.  That's my medium term price target.

So right now, if gold was at $5000, I would be jittery.  But remember, that can change in the future.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 17:18 | 3033554 MeelionDollerBogus
MeelionDollerBogus's picture

I do, actually. Near-term projections, highly accurate:

and out to 2013 September, a little wider margin up/down :

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 11:47 | 3032494 Confundido
Confundido's picture

Gold shapes inflation expectations. There is no way in hell the powers that be will let them bring down the status quo without first putting a fight. That's all. They will lose it the day Tsys begin to be repudiated. Not one minute earlier.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 16:16 | 3033368 WhiteNight123129
WhiteNight123129's picture

In order to find out if treasuries are repudiated do not look at the price but at the amount purchased by the Fed, in other words at the amount of efforts the Fed has to make to mask the price. The more they purchase the more it means they have to put massive amount of lipstick on the pig to mask its true nature.


Tue, 12/04/2012 - 12:01 | 3032545 Bansters-in-my-...
Bansters-in-my- feces's picture

Let me start wih ....Fuck you Timmy Giethner. T U.S.A has a dirty little (not so little) fund called the Echange Stabilization Fund. This war chest is used by the Treasury Secretary(little weasel timmy) TO MANIPULATE gold and silver and stocks,and whatever else it wants to.

If you do not believe me go to the Federal Reserves(not federal at all) website and the Goverments (hijacked) website and read up on the ESF,that timmy gets to pass on to Benny cause Benny is timmts fiscal agent.(WHORE).


Fuck you's Traitors. .gov


Tue, 12/04/2012 - 12:04 | 3032548 Aurora Ex Machina
Aurora Ex Machina's picture

If his name was no longer synonymous with the all-American vacation, Deak emerged during the 1970s as a hero in an emergent libertarian gold-bug subculture. As Doomsday-obsessed gold hoarders built financial bomb shelters in the shadow of stagflation, Deak emerged as among the first proto-Libertarian gurus. A fawning profile in Reason magazine compared Deak to “Midas Mulligan or any other character ever conceived of by Ayn Rand.” A font of public lectures and provocative quotes for journalists, Deak drew admiration from fellow gold-circuit riders Ron Paul and Alan Greenspan. He corresponded with Friedrich Hayek. At one gold conference featuring George Will and Louis Rukeyser, the suave banker with the thick Transylvanian accent drew wild applause when he blamed inflation on “welfare” and declared, “I don’t see why the recipient of welfare should be able to vote, because obviously he can vote for more welfare.” Deak also embraced apartheid-era South Africa. “I love to deal with South Africa,” he once said. “Without the white population, the black people there would be in the same shape as west and east Africa.” The media was enthralled. Time tagged him “the James Bond of Money.” Merv Griffin interviewed him with barely concealed awe. Salon "Who really killed Nick Deak" 02:12:12


Watch out for wild-haired ladies in your foyers, there's certainly a lot of winks and nudges here...

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 12:17 | 3032601's picture



"To ascribe one’s virtues to one’s racial origin, is to confess that one has no knowledge of the process by which virtues are acquired and, most often, that one has failed to acquire them. The overwhelming majority of racists are men who have earned no sense of personal identity, who can claim no individual achievement or distinction, and who seek the illusion of a “tribal self-esteem” by alleging the inferiority of some other tribe. Observe the hysterical intensity of the Southern racists; observe also that racism is much more prevalent among the poor white trash than among their intellectual betters. Historically, racism has always risen or fallen with the rise or fall of collectivism. Collectivism holds that the individual has no rights, that his life and work belong to the group (to “society,” to the tribe, the state, the nation) and that the group may sacrifice him at its own whim to its own interests. The only way to implement a doctrine of that kind is by means of brute force—and statism has always been the political corollary of collectivism." -- Ayn Rand



     "Whenever destroyers appear among men, they start by destroying money, for money is men's protection and the base of a moral existence. Destroyers seize gold and leave to its owners a counterfeit pile of paper. This kills all objective standards and delivers men into the arbitrary power of an arbitrary setter of values. Gold was an objective value, an equivalent of wealth produced. Paper is a mortgage on wealth that does not exist, backed by a gun aimed at those who are expected to produce it. Paper is a check drawn by legal looters upon an account which is not theirs: upon the virtue of the victims. Watch for the day when it bounces, marked, 'Account overdrawn.'

 "When you have made evil the means of survival, do not expect men to remain good. Do not expect them to stay moral and lose their lives for the purpose of becoming the fodder of the immoral. Do not expect them to produce, when production is punished and looting rewarded. Do not ask, 'Who is destroying the world?' You are." -- Ayn Rand

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 12:41 | 3032640 Aurora Ex Machina
Aurora Ex Machina's picture

It was more a comment about how the (generally "left", although that is of course, an American "left") culture war is being framed / is shaping up, not more Rand bashing by myself (For the record: I have no problem with some of what she wrote, as long as it is taken in the spirit of any other quotation from a popular author, e.g. Twain. However, I find the Objectivist School to be beyond silly; let's hope this distinction is obvious).

Salon's conclusion is that it was enacted via "Argentinian mobsters[1]", fyi, ordered by perhaps Macaui triads; or S. American cartels, or perhaps the CIA. The instrument of the killing has a very eerie set of psychiatrists, let's just say.


Deak's gold coin. (And an interesting historical nugget that his company eventually turned into Goldline, Beck's little scam - historical so it can't be seized! pay x5 over spot! Ugh, preying on the low-information crowd, hardly edifying.)



[1] Let me remember if that's currently a hot topic as well...

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 12:40 | 3032666 Confundido
Confundido's picture

Other G7 central banks also have dirty little secrets, like leasing gold from their deposits at below market friends.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 12:19 | 3032610 blackscorpi
blackscorpi's picture

following this thread I really wonder why anyone cares about a 1-2% percent drop in gold price. just sit tight on your pile and wait. ultimately there is only one way gold price will go in this monetary system and the direction should be clear to anybody who understands how the price is being manipulated since the beginning of QE's all around the "civilized" world.


for all I care gold price could drop 20% overnight...wait...I'd really like that to happen, it would mean I can get 20% more oz for christmas for the same amount of toilet paper :D

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 14:42 | 3033097 Bastiat009
Bastiat009's picture

Except that gold has no other purpose than its price, or purchasing power, unlike say a house. If my house is worth less tomorrow that it is today, I don't care because my roof still protects me from the rain. But gold, its purchasing power is all I care about, so a 20% drop would make me 20% poorer and that is not someting I wish.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 17:17 | 3033549 MeelionDollerBogus
MeelionDollerBogus's picture

except teeth, satellite radiation shielding and electronics circuits, of course

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 12:34 | 3032649 Mesquite
Mesquite's picture

@ lower trend line...nice...good buy op..tnx whoever...

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 13:11 | 3032755 BudFox2012
BudFox2012's picture

It's all because of CNBC.  There is a Video up on today with the Headline "Gartman's Warning: Don't Buy Gold Coins".  Of course the video says nothing of the sort, and is only really advising small investors to watch out for paying too high a premium on gold coins purchased from coin shops, but that really never matters to an algo now does it.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 16:17 | 3033373 akak
akak's picture

Akak's Warning to Gartman:

"Lay off the Doughnuts and the ADD-Afflicted Flipflopping on Gold".

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 13:42 | 3032856 boeing747
boeing747's picture

Big investors are selling to take advantage of this year's 'low' capital gain tax and move money out of USSA. I just bought NUGT again. Platinum seems attractive too.

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 13:50 | 3032887 Bansters-in-my-...
Bansters-in-my- feces's picture

check out kitco silver lease rate chart....****

Been that way for awhile now.

They have been notified last week several times and still have done nothing.

Is something up in the silver lease rate markets....we should know about...?

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 14:30 | 3033054 Bastiat009
Bastiat009's picture

How low will QE3 take gold which is far lower from where it was last year?

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 15:05 | 3033171 Esculent 69
Esculent 69's picture

Could this not be an attempt to double smash metals before increasing the purchase of $85 billion mbs from $40 billion?  Is that not the next QE4? Why not smash them just before bernake the banking stooge says no further easing at this time just to have another sell off before the new purchases at the end of the year. Just in time to get reamed with all the new taxes in obamacare that will make a colonoscopy seem fun. 

double dipping is too much fun. 

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 16:14 | 3033345 WhiteNight123129
WhiteNight123129's picture

We need to strike back and short treasuries in retaliation.



If it takes 2.x of purchases flow to tighten the 10 years treasuries yield by 10 bps in a given period of time T, assuming PIMCO buys 1.x from the existing money supply and the Fed buys another 1.x with new money supply, we have 1.x coming from existing money supply and another 1.x coming from new money supply (the Fed) = 2.x of flow. So the overpaying of treasuries and the money made by PIMCO is a small fee for helping the flow in treasuries purchases without relying solely on Fed. In other words if PIMCO was not front running the Fed, more of the flow would have to come from the Fed.

Now shorting treasuries would neutralize the flow of purchases coming from PIMCO and other front running the Fed. That means that the shorting activity would neutralize the tightening coming from the front running crowd. This would put the burden of tightening the yield and the 2.x quantity of purchases purely from new money printing.

Buying Gold does not prevent shorting of paper Gold, but attacking the treasuries does because it forces the Fed to print even more money.

There might be another leg up in the treasuries market, but after that the game is up, shorting treasuries and long Gold will become too tempting. When the bull market ends on Treasuries, the ability to refrain Gold prices is over.


Tue, 12/04/2012 - 17:15 | 3033547 MeelionDollerBogus
MeelionDollerBogus's picture - no surprise for me - and it shouldn't be for you if you pay attention -

Tue, 12/04/2012 - 18:17 | 3033691 Duffminster
Duffminster's picture

Here is the real explanation from those who've been studying this kind of price action since gold was trading below $300:



Turk, Embry, Sinclair comment on gold and silver action

Dear Friend of GATA and Gold:

Interviewed today by King World News, GoldMoney founder and GATA consultant James Turk gives a rationale for governments and their agents to be pounding the monetary metals today.

Turk says: "The reason they are attempting to make gold and silver look weak here is because these monetary metals will provide the foundation when the monetary system is eventually re-constructed, and the price of gold and silver will be far higher than the numbers they are painting the tape with today. But before that day comes, they need to shake as many people out of these markets as possible so they are victims of the greatest wealth transfer in history, not beneficiaries."

An excerpt from Turk's interview is posted at the King World News blog here:

Also interviewed by King World News today, Sprott Asset Management's John Embry has similar observations: "How many times in the last 15 years have I seen the type of action we witnessed last week? You can set your watch by this type of action. We had big open interest and then they attack it. So down gold and silver go as they clean out the weak hands. The metals will rebuild themselves, and one of these times it won't happen that way. The physical market will overpower these paper players. It didn't happen this time, but at some point it will."

Embry's interview is posted at the King World News blog here:

And Jim Sinclair brushes off today's market action as a lot of propaganda:

CHRIS POWELL, Secretary/Treasurer
Gold Anti-Trust Action Committee Inc.

Do NOT follow this link or you will be banned from the site!