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Guest Post: The GOP Is Dying Because The Liberty Movement Is Thriving

Tyler Durden's picture


Submitted by Brandon Smith of Alt-Market blog,

To the point of causing intestinal convulsions, there has been no shortage of analysis on the elections of 2012.  Every no-name mop-head mainstream media hack with a niche audience has put in his or her two cents on the finale of perhaps the biggest non-event of the decade and almost every single one of them has been depressingly wrong or completely disingenuous - but perhaps this was to be expected.  The word “journalist” has today become synonymous with “whore”, simply because success in the field makes whoredom essential.  The job of news outlets is not to report on the facts, but to fashion an illusory world out of manure bricks and glossy paint, and this is exactly what they have done in their musing on the fate of the GOP.       

For any saucer-eyed skeptic who still believes that all disinformation is mere coincidence or personal bias rather than an engineered and coordinated conspiracy, I would like to point out the sudden, similar and simultaneous conclusions of MSM pundits in the wake of Barack Obama’s “victory” in November.  You would think that there would be hundreds if not thousands of conflicting ideas about what really happened this year, but instead, Americans are being presented with a chorus of identical viewpoints.

One meme that is being spread widely in the mainstream that I do actually agree with is that the Republican Party is “dying”.  Oh yes, this is undoubtedly true.  The GOP is on the fast track to the stew pot (or maybe another pot), but what the mainstream fails to mention is that this is something that alternative analysts in the Liberty Movement have been predicting for years, long before the name “Barack Obama” ever haunted the dreams of average Republicans, and this raises an important question; what did the alternative media see that the mainstream media missed?

The primary root of all the dysfunctional observations of the GOP is that most people today have no clue what conservatism is, and therefore, they have no idea how to diagnose problems in the Republican Party (an institution which is supposed to represent conservative values).  You don’t send a lawnmower repairman to examine a cancer ridden human being, you send a doctor who knows what a healthy body is supposed to look like.  You also don’t send a hardcore liberal or a Neo-Con flunky to comment on the failings of the GOP; you send a true conservative who knows how a healthy conservative organization is supposed to function.  And, the only people left in this country who actually understand what conservatism really is are Liberty Movement activists.

Ironically, those of us in the movement who have deeply considered the election aftermath have predominantly concluded that it is WE who have taken the mojo out of the GOP, and frankly, we’re happy to do so…       

The GOP is dying because it no longer supports or nurtures the progress of true and traditional conservative values or the people who hold them.  The GOP is fading into the bowels of political history because real conservatives are LEAVING it behind, and searching for other more legitimate avenues.  These are the cold hard facts which the establishment and those who aid in its dominance have tried to keep out of the mainstream limelight post election.  They have concocted a swarm of unsupported and absurd talking points which have been unleashed shotgun-style on the unsuspecting American populace.  Their goal?  To hide the fact that the Liberty Movement has gained enough momentum to bury the Neo-Con led GOP and even swing state contests at will, simply by not participating in the farce.

During the 2010 mid-term elections, there was a mass resurgence in conservative voting based almost entirely on Tea Party optimism.  Some might argue that the Tea Party was a sham, and I would have to agree…to a point.  The Tea Party didn’t start out that way (I know because I was involved during its inception).  In the beginning it was a legitimate force for reduced government power and spending, and increased protection for civil liberties revolving mainly around the campaign of Ron Paul.  That changed, though, when Neo-Con elites began weaseling their way into the club, gushing about how they loved freedom. 

What these vermin do not understand, though, is that it takes more than rhetoric to hold onto Liberty Movement voters; you also have to back your words with action, and this is exactly why some career Republicans were shown the door in 2012.  Not because the Democrats were a better choice, but because the Republicans had not lived up to the promises they made two years ago.  Neo-Con toadies would, of course, sneer at my observations, and tell a completely different story on why they are losers…    

Let’s take a look at just a few of the mainstream media and GOP leadership arguments and propaganda initiatives and why they are shameless fabrications meant to hide Liberty Movement influence…

Lie #1:  U.S. Demographics Are Changing And The GOP Platform Does Not Appeal To Minorities

The MSM and others are essentially suggesting that only white people will ever vote Republican, and by association, that only white people value conservatism and Constitutionalism.  They are also cleverly and subconsciously implanting the idea that most minorities will only ever vote for a socialist and statist candidate (like Obama) in the future, or, that they will vote based entirely on skin color.  That is to say, they are inferring that minority voters are predominantly narrow minded and stupid, and are also promoting a fabricated division based on race. 

To illustrate why the demographics argument is a lie, I would like to use the examples of Allen West and Denny Rehberg; both high value Republicans in state races who “unexpectedly” lost to the Democrats. 

Allen West, a black male candidate for the 22nd Congressional District of Florida, ran on a “Tea Party limited government platform” in 2010, and won by a margin of around 20,000 votes over Ron Klein, a white male Democrat.  In 2012, West ran against another white male Democrat, Patrick Murphy, in Florida’s 18th District and lost by 2000 votes.  Obviously, Florida’s vast population and myriad minority groups did NOT play the only part in West’s victory in 2010, or his loss in 2012.  If skin color was ever the primary issue, then he should have won easily in 2012, just as he did in 2010 according to those who make the “changing demographics” race based argument.  West’s opponents, Klein in 2010 and Murphy in 2012, had very similar and very standard Democratic Party policies, and neither man was overly interesting or influential.  West did not suddenly have to face down a Dem. powerhouse in 2012; just another boring-as-crackers lefty.

West ran two campaigns against almost identical opponents under almost identical social conditions, somehow winning one, and losing the other.  So, what happened?  What was different in 2012?  The fact is, the only thing different in 2012 was that this time around liberty based voters knew West was not a true conservative.  West was a fraud, and a statist, and the Liberty Movement cast him out by declining to vote for him.

Almost immediately after West’s victory in 2010, his limited government constitutionalist persona began to change.  He voted to strengthen pork programs which continue to pump fiat federal monies into local governments, generating massive national debt and making state officials beholden to federal control.  He voted yes to line-item veto authority for the President, bypassing the constitutionally delineated powers of Congress.  He supported CISPA (Cyber Intelligence Sharing And Protection Act) which would have given government incredible legal power to violate the privacy rights of ordinary Americans.  And last, but certainly worst, West not only voted for the NDAA despite its unconstitutional indefinite detainment provisions, he also worked to strike down initiatives to remove language in the NDAA that made it applicable to U.S. citizens.  To ice the cake, he openly admitted to serving on the Armed Forces Committee which reviewed the bill before it was even released, and later attempted to lie about what it actually did.   

Why would a supposed constitutionalist and conservative champion applaud the legislated rendition and indefinite imprisonment of American citizens without trial and without due process all on the mere accusation of “terrorism” by the President, and then pretend as if that power was not granted by the bill?  Because, he is a fake conservative and an establishment thug.

In my home state of Montana, Republican Denny Rehberg ran a highly anticipated race for Senate against incumbent Democrat John Tester.  Rehberg’s platform was just like Allan West’s; pro-Tea Party, limited government, thumbs up to the Constitution, and wrap up in the flag for good measure. 

Rehberg had won many of his U.S. Representative campaigns by a vast margin leading up to his decision to run for Senate (around 60% to his opponent’s 30%).  I can say that in a state like Montana, the idea of “changing demographics” affecting the election is laughable.  Montana is freaken’ white!  W-H-I-T-E!  Rehberg, a Republican “dreamboat candidate” complete with carefully groomed cowboy mustache was thought to be a sure win in this state.  By my personal observations seeing him at functions including a local Lincoln/Reagan dinner, I would say HE thought he was a sure win, to the point of ego-mania.

So in a predominantly white and predominantly conservative state, how did Rehberg lose?  Because elections have little to do with “demographics” or party, and everything to do with the integrity of the person running, especially where the Liberty Movement is concerned. 

Rehberg’s professed fuzzy feelings for freedom and limited government were undeniably false.  His consistent support for big government programs aside, he voted for and viciously defended the NDAA.  When approached by Stewart Rhodes of Oath Keepers at a Republican function about his vote for rendition and permanent detention without trial for American citizens, he side-stepped the question completely, and accused Rhodes (a veteran Army Paratrooper) of “not supporting the troops”.  Rehberg’s attitude did not go unnoticed by the Liberty Movement population in Montana, and like Conrad Burns, the Republican incumbent who had been unseated in 2006, he lost by a substantial margin of voters who instead backed a Libertarian third party candidate. 

The argument for “changing demographics” was certainly not applicable in either of these two incidences, along with numerous other state and local elections I do not have the space to mention.  It also does not take into account the millions of Americans who refrain from voting because they feel utterly unrepresented in the election process.  This lie is being pushed in order to hide the real change in America: a movement towards legitimacy and humility in government, rather than hubris and tyranny.     

Lie #2:  The GOP Does Not Appeal To Young Voters, Who Are Predominantly Liberal (Socialist)

I would still be considered a young voter, and so would many of my closest friends.  They and I had all but abandoned politics in disgust years ago when we discovered Ron Paul, one of the only representatives in Washington D.C. that we felt actually embodied the traditional constitutional methodology (original conservatism).  Not only had he received the highest amount of donations from the men and women of the U.S. military, he was also packing sold out speaking events on college campuses across the country while Obama and Romney were crawling on hands and knees throwing free tickets at elementary school children just to get a minor crowd.  The point is, Ron Paul, a true conservative, was energizing the youth vote and even bringing some Democrats over from the socialist dark side.

The idea that a young voter is predestined to embrace collectivist nanny government and sell their soul to the Democratic Party is a lie of epic proportions.  The GOP could have had them on board anytime they wanted; all they had to do was nominate Ron Paul as their presidential candidate.  Instead, they went with yet another Neo-Con ghoul whose rhetoric and record was nearly identical to Obama’s.  The GOP could have won, if they had actually wanted to win.  But then, it would have meant disrupting the false left right paradigm, and surely, the establishment can’t have that…

Lie #3:  The GOP Needs To Evolve With Our “Progressive” Times Instead Of Clinging To Traditional Conservative Principles

Ultimately, this lie is designed to infer that the Republican Party needs to take on a more collectivist attitude in order to appeal to the rising tide of a younger generation and our nation’s so-called “changing demographics”.  Hilariously, the lie is suggesting that the GOP do what they have in fact already done: go full socialist. 

The Republican Party has not “clung” to traditional conservative principles for a very long time.  Over the course of the past several decades it has become a haven for the minions of Leo Strauss, a statist and Platonian fascist whose job was to subvert the core of conservatism and warp it into a festering cesspool of elitism - much like the Democratic Party.  The GOP has failed because this elitism is now undeniably present, and the party has lost its ability to hide what it has become.

When a sad victim of academia tries to argue that the cause of our economic crisis is the “evil of the free market”, I always point out that he/she has actually never lived in a world where true free markets exist.  They have, for their entire lives, lived under a socialized and centralized economic system, and so, blaming “free markets” for their financial woes is like blaming Tasmanian Tigers for the death of their Chihuahua.  The same goes for conservatism.  When people wail against the crimes of George W. Bush and the possible return of a “conservative” presidency, I always point out that Bush was not a conservative, and that there hasn’t been a legitimately conservative GOP since before they were born.

The Republican Party has already delved into the realm of centralized despotism as much as the Democratic Party has.  Its only salvation now is to reverse course back towards limited government and freedom, not continue into federalized oblivion. 

Lie #4:  The Liberty Movement Had No Influence On The Elections Whatsoever

As I have shown, proponents of constitutional values have indeed swayed particular elections, at least at the state and local level.  Therefore, the assertion is meant to inject disinformation in pursuit of a particular end.  Strangely, I heard this argument all throughout the primaries and up until the week after Obama declared victory; the argument that our movement does not matter and will never gain tangible momentum.  And yet, all through the primaries up until the day before elections the Neo-Cons were either courting us with gifts, goodies, and offers of a “place at the table”, or attacking us viciously as “traitors to our own ideals” whose non-participation was akin to a “vote for the Antichrist (Obama)”. 

Now, my question is; if the Liberty Movement doesn’t matter, then why were GOP cronies so desperate to convince us to vote party line? 

Why did they feel the need to regurgitate the “lesser of to evils” argument over and over again?  Why did it matter to them if we voted for Romney, or voted third party, or didn’t vote at all?  If our influence is so miniscule, then why invite Liberty Movement representatives like Rand Paul or Sherriff Mac to cheerlead for the “guy who will drive the bus off the cliff slower”?  Why try in a grade school manner to shame us into setting aside our principles?  Why not simply ignore us and let us wallow in our own “obscurity”.

I see two possibilities…

First, that the Liberty Movement has grown strong enough to encompass a sizable mass of voting power, at least large enough to ensure that many GOP candidates will win or lose by a particular margin.  That margin may be thin and we may not yet be in a position to launch our own party, but without us, they know they are likely to fall short, and this problem is only going to grow as time passes.  They court us, or attack us, because they realize they cannot win despite us. 

Second, if you subscribe to the well documented idea that elections, at least at the federal level, are entirely staged (which I do), then you might ask yourself again why the GOP elite were grasping for the Liberty Movement to relinquish for the sake of defeating Obama.  If Obama and Romney are essentially the same monkey, the same exact errand boy for the same exact globalist puppeteers, then what the hell do they need our vote for?  Romney wins, and they get what they want.  Obama wins and they get what they want.  Unless…what they really wanted was our participation in the farce.

That’s right, perhaps the greater purpose of the endless lesser-of-two-evils charade was to see if the establishment could convince us to compromise our conscience and be drawn back into the game.  Maybe, just maybe, it was all a test, of you, of us, to discern how much of the Liberty Movement could be conned or swayed with moral relativism.  Perhaps the death rattle of the Republican industrial complex was due to the one thing that the media will never spotlight in a 60 minute primetime special; the fact that the majority of the burgeoning Liberty Movement refused to sell out, proving that the GOP is no longer effective at keeping us reigned in or co-opted.  The GOP is dying and we are thriving.  Whether or not the two are related, I leave for you to decide…


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Thu, 12/06/2012 - 14:50 | 3039945 ParkAveFlasher
ParkAveFlasher's picture

That goes for you, Boner.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 14:54 | 3039964 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

Liberty movements measured by voting power?


Thu, 12/06/2012 - 15:08 | 3040025 ParkAveFlasher
ParkAveFlasher's picture

Nice, NA.  Knock-down power is more like it.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 15:15 | 3040056 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

Sadly, I see that the Takers are now the majority party.  Liberty, at least for now, as no chance against the promoters of the Free Shit Empire.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 15:21 | 3040079 macholatte
macholatte's picture

Liberty, at least for now, as no chance against the promoters of the Free Shit Empire.


....... and don't forget about the unchallenged, however well documented, voter fraud of 2008 & 2012.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 15:26 | 3040097 Kitler
Kitler's picture

"If Obama and Romney are essentially the same monkey, the same exact errand boy for the same exact globalist puppeteers, then what the hell do they need our vote for?  Romney wins, and they get what they want.  Obama wins and they get what they want."

You are missing the point. It's all about a vicious competition to see who get's to become the errand boy.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 15:39 | 3040143 FEDbuster
FEDbuster's picture

Just read that Sen. Jim DeMint is quitting.  He was the defacto head of the "liberty movement" in the Senate.  He took the head job at the Heritage Foundation (big pay raise from the Senate).  I think the "pork movement" has taken hold of Washington D.C. now that we have passed the tipping point.  "Bring home the bacon" says Detroit councilwomen:

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 15:56 | 3040209 SWRichmond
SWRichmond's picture

If the GOP dies, that idiot Krauthammer will have to get a real job.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:22 | 3040320 Supernova Born
Supernova Born's picture

The Neocons' Dr. Strangelove.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:37 | 3040392 new game
new game's picture

ha fucking ha - was aligned with conserv/rupucklicaNts, but "ha fucking ha";

you be the same as the other taz "HA FUCKING HA" and spenders.

lies, fucking lies and more fuckling lies.

liberty lives in my mind, not sure it has a place in usa anymore,as this nation becoming over run by non-thinkers, lazy losers, and fat ass where-is-my-freebe thinking from cradle to birth TAKERS.  giver going bye bye with liberty.



Thu, 12/06/2012 - 18:05 | 3040678 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

"as this nation becoming over run by non-thinkers, lazy losers, and fat ass where-is-my-freebe thinking from cradle to birth TAKERS."

Completely expected after two centuries of importing sheeple infected with socialism.

The rest of the world is far more statist and those dregs washed up on our shores.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 21:51 | 3041341 dirtbagger
dirtbagger's picture

Anus - don't forget to mention those people of low moral values who belong to the Sodomite Party

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:05 | 3040503 Shell Game
Shell Game's picture

and don't forget about Mr. Kristol Meth.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 18:12 | 3040702 GeneH3
GeneH3's picture

Time to shrug.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:17 | 3040306 mkkby
mkkby's picture

The repugnant cats will un-die as soon as they find a christian who's electable enough to read a teleprompter.  It's as simple as that -- Romney a mormon couldn't excite the base.

Yes, both parties are now liberal IMF banker stooges.  That won't change until things get much, much worse.  I'm thinking, once the US "goes Greece" and the snap cards stop working.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 19:00 | 3040846 divide_by_zero
divide_by_zero's picture

Romney, a Progressive couldn't excite the base.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 19:49 | 3040986 Freddie
Freddie's picture

2012 was a setup by Rove/Bush/NWO.  Santorum was killing Romney.  Rove and the media pulled out all the stops including Drudge to stop Santorum.   I stopped watching TV a long time ago because they are all scum.

Santorum was destroying Romney in the Midwest, Central and SE.  Newt is aa CFR member with Bill Clinton.

I saw online in Ohio, MI and WI where Romney stole the election in the cities at the last minute.  Santorum won the whole state and at the last minute Romney found enough votes in the cities.

Fast forward to November and Obama does the same thing to Romney.  We were all played.  Romney/Rove knew vote theft cause they did it to Santorum.  The whole election was a farce.   In a real uncorrupt election, Santorum would have destroyed Obama in the Midwest, SE, S Central, Mid Atlantic, etc.

2008 and 2012 were rigged. I think the last honest elections were Reagan's.   In 2016 - we will probably get Jeb versus Hillary or Moochelle.  


Thu, 12/06/2012 - 20:13 | 3041060 Flakmeister
Flakmeister's picture

Freddie, what fraction of the day do you spend simply making shit up?

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 20:35 | 3041128 Old Poor Richard
Old Poor Richard's picture

"Romney Surprise" is documented.  They attempted to steal Ohio in the general election as they had successfully done in 2004, but something went wrong and the city votes didn't flip as intended.

Five minutes with google will find you the charts that prove vote flipping in Illinois, Wisconsin and Pennsylvania from Santorum to Romney and in Connecticuit and New Hampshire from Ron Paul to Romney.  That's simply when I quit looking, I'm sure there are many more states.  It's criminal activity performed by the criminal ruling class, so nobody cares and nobody is punished.

Votes flipped from Hillary to Obama in 2008, too.  Both parties participate in equal-opportunity vote fraud.


Thu, 12/06/2012 - 21:12 | 3041248 Flakmeister
Flakmeister's picture

Somehow I am not surprised that the people who lap this shit up also don't believe we landed on the moon, don't believe the planet is slowly frying and believe that the "Protocols of the Zionist Elders" is legit....

Hey, write a story for Rolling Stone or whatever forum you think is appropriate.... Fill your boots...

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 21:24 | 3041273 Disenchanted
Disenchanted's picture



Rick Santorum is Freddie's answer?


LOfuckingL! Anyone you see bloviating at the podium here is not a real or classic conservative. They are Statists who want your tax dollars to subsidize their false religious dogmas.


No thanks!

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 21:37 | 3041311 Flakmeister
Flakmeister's picture

Re: Freddie and Santorum, sad but true....

The truly scary thing is that Santorum struck around because he was the closest thing to an economic populist in the Primaries for the downtrodden Republican base that know they are getting the shaft...

He can take his Christian version of Sharia Law and shove it up his ass...

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 19:50 | 3040993 Phil Free
Phil Free's picture

"....... and don't forget about the unchallenged, however well documented, voter fraud of 2008 & 2012."


True that.  I find it interesting that I have seen NO ONE talking about this particular statistic -- Obama did not win A Single State that has Voter ID laws on the books.


Not a single state.  Coincidence, or more?  You be the judge.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 15:22 | 3040086 redpill
redpill's picture

Call it the 'tipping point', or 'peak liberty' - however you want to think of it, we have a deep valley of tyranny ahead of us until/unless enough people actually wake up and decide to care about this Constitutional Republic.  Not to be pessimistic but I'm not convinced that time will come in our lifetimes.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 15:27 | 3040105 ParkAveFlasher
ParkAveFlasher's picture

It was all down hill after the Whiskey Rebellion.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 15:55 | 3040204 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

Some whould say, since Shay's Rebellion.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:44 | 3040425 Supernova Born
Supernova Born's picture

Some would say it never actually began, except conceptually in a document that hasn't survived the test of time.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:37 | 3040593 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

We don't need a third party, we need a second party!  Since the two we have are the same party.

Liberty Party!  Where are contributions to be sent?  Keep me posted.  It'll be tough filling Dr. Paul's shoes.

Fri, 12/07/2012 - 09:38 | 3042176 StychoKiller
Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:31 | 3040364 bank guy in Brussels
bank guy in Brussels's picture

Ah yes whisky (Scottish, UK spelling) or whiskey (Irish, American spelling)

One of the oldest words of the English language, pre-dating the Anglo-Saxons, going back to Celtic, 'uisge beatha' the 'water of life'

A fine subject for rebellion ... always has been

The way they know who the oldest distillery in Scotland is - Haig's, the maker of Dimple / Pinch - is that in the 1600s Mr Haig was brought for a church court for the 'offence' of making whisky on a Sunday

America's early whisky rebellion was a sign of what some American Founding Fathers warned would eventually happen - a repressive, tyrannical American government

Inalienable Rights to whisky and to gunpowder, yes

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:09 | 3040271 HappyCamper
HappyCamper's picture

The time is imminent. The chess pieces are being put into position quickly.


The presidential "emergency powers", the Patriot act, all those "homeland security" preparations,  total data collection, the nationalization of the economy through endless bailouts, the national health takeover, the federal reserve now completely controlling the business cycles, and of course the right politicians in place and a willing population that only wants “free shit”.



Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:38 | 3040595 zapdude
zapdude's picture

+1.  Concise and irrefutable evidence of the unconcealed-yet-rarely-acknowledged police state we Americans are living in. 

The State's tyrannical grip will only tighten more on the Individual's liberty as the empire begins its collapse.

Prepare, train, harden your bunkers, and gird your loins, for we must survive the collapse in order to see the day we can rebuild.

For those who survive, I hope to see you at the bottom.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 18:05 | 3040679 JimBowie1958
JimBowie1958's picture

Totally agree and can only add that the Big Boys who spent all thatmoney, time and effort putting the chess peaces in place did NOT do it just for laughs and giggles.

You can damned well bet they plan to put those pieces to use and not too soon from now.

But Freedom and liberty will win, and the time it takes is reduced by waiting untill everyone that might act is so pissed off that they just cant restrain themselves any more and then we change the government for good from the inside.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 20:09 | 3041046 Freddie
Freddie's picture

Yes folks.  Turn off the TV and Hollywood and grow a pair like the Egyptians.   They do not have 6 million licensed hunters with probably .308 scoped rifles like NY state, WI, MI, PA, TX.  They do not have 2 million CCW's like FL, GA, and AL.  

The Egyptians have balls and their military backs them unlike the cowardly Pentagon and Joint Chiefs who chase Islmo poon like Betrayus with Ms. "Kelly" who is not a mick chick.


Thu, 12/06/2012 - 21:38 | 3041300 Disenchanted
Disenchanted's picture



Yes Paula Kranz Bonewell is an obvious 'Islmo'



Kranz Name Meaning German: from Middle High German kranz ‘garland’, ‘wreath’; a metonymic occupational name for a maker of chaplets and wreaths, a habitational name for someone who lived at a house distinguished by the sign of a garland, or a nickname for someone whose hair was tonsured.Dutch: variant spelling of Krans, cognate with 1.In some cases it may also be one of the several German spellings of the Slovenian habitational name Kranjec (also found as Krajnc or Kranjc), denoting someone from Kranjska province (Latin Carniola, German Krain), an old name for the historical central part of Slovenia. Jewish (Ashkenazic): ornamental name from German Kranz or Yiddish krants ‘wreath’, ‘garland’.


I see you're still stuck on stupid Freddie...


btw your Jill Kelley Mooslim:


Jill Kelley was born Gilberte Khawam in Beirut, Lebanon[2] on January 1, 1975. Kelley's family, which includes her identical twin sister, Natalie Khawam,[3] and a brother David Khawam,[4] are Lebanese-American Maronite Catholics

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 15:22 | 3040087 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

The most fundamental concepts necessarily part of the fabric of a free society, left unmolested, free to pursue life, liberty and happiness, didn't leave the Republican Party, the Republican Party left them.

Deep Capture OWNS both "different" parties.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 15:30 | 3040109 bobnoxy
bobnoxy's picture

''Sadly, I see that the Takers are now the majority party.''

Most of whom voted for Romney. 18 of the 25 poorest states measured by per capita income voted Romney's way. 20 of the 25 richest states voted for Obama. And 75% of federal tax revenue is generated by blue states. Lastly, the biggest rise in food stamp enrollments in the past few years voted for Romney too.

So, this whole premise about how people getting handouts voted for Obama is just pure, right wing horseshit, just like most of this article.

You can look at it based on educational achievement since we know that jobs and incomes are correlated with education. The least educated among us voted Republican.

The real moochers voted Republican! That should help kill that inane argument, I hope.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 15:35 | 3040136 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

Hi, Chris Matthews! Welcome to ZH!

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:00 | 3040230 economics9698
economics9698's picture

bobnoxy a modern day flat earther.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:32 | 3040585 El Viejo
El Viejo's picture

Like most he's half right. Takers from the top and takers en masse from the bottom. The limits are being reached. First it was Chrysler corp, then the auto industry, then an economic reset made it show up in certain states and now next stop may be the whole country. The hero of the democrats says "Ask not what your country can do for you. Ask what you can do for your country." and the democrats do exactly the opposite. The hero of the republicans says, "We need a kinder, gentler America." and then they cut benifits and send American jobs overseas. The rebuplicans started this greed fest and now the democrats are gonna finish it.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:21 | 3040319 Things that go bump
Things that go bump's picture

He merely points out that those people are too stupid, too ill-educated, and too easily lead to even know which side their bread is buttered on.  An interesting phenomenon.  

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:34 | 3040373 Ignatius
Ignatius's picture

Elites understand the use of leverage.

Divide the populace approximately in two (Dem/Reb) and they're easier for a minority to control.

This is why we get 24/7 of this bullshit Dem/Rep, Left/Right crap in MSM.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 15:53 | 3040198 redpill
redpill's picture

Right because the winner-take-all electoral college system means that everyone in a state suddenly shares the same characteristics once 51% of them vote for a single person.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 15:57 | 3040213 bobnoxy
bobnoxy's picture

The majority rules, right? You wingnuts are amazing in how you can screw the facts around until they tell you what you want to hear.

Some dimbulb on Fox was laughing at a viewer e-mail saying how much she liked Dick Morris. ''He's always wrong, but he makes me feel good''. Was that you?

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:03 | 3040243 economics9698
economics9698's picture

Ah Bob majority rule is a democracy and we were originally set up as a republic for the sole propose of avoiding majority rule.

Did you graduate high school?

Bob is like one of my student in college, clueless.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:01 | 3040491 11b40
11b40's picture

Maybe you teach economics, but not English.  Do you only have 1 student?

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:27 | 3040350 adhoc99
adhoc99's picture

Bobnoxious. What the hell are you talking about? Those are the 'poorest' states on average. And a majority vote is an aggregated statistic. It tells us nothing about voting patterns between 'takers' and 'producers' within those states generally within those states. Some basic math if you can understand it - Say a Red state is 50/50 takers-producers, vs. a Blue state that is 60-40. However, let's say the producers are more movitated (90% turnout vs. 70% turnout) and more uniform in their support (again let's say 90% vs. 70%) of Republicans in the Red state, and that for takers in both it's 90% Dem support and 40% turnout. Let's do math -

50*.9*.7+50*.1*.4 = 33.5 votes for Republicans, 50*.1*.7+50*.9*.4 = 21.5 votes for Dems.




You could obviously play with the math and reverse it to show that in the so-called rich Blue states, all it takes is a little more defection in the 'producer' community to the Dems and a little more depressed turnout relative to the taker community to switch a 'Producer state' to blue.

So producers in essence become the swing vote. I'm sure you're not going to find very many poor people on assistance voting Republican whether it's red or blue, north or south, east or west. This is a given voting block for the Dems, and that's the point of us producers bitching! So you have people in more developed socially liberal areas where slightly more of the producers vote Dem - almost assuredly mostly on social and environmental issues - and so we producers get screwed by the solidarity of the 47% (the conservatives have nothing to offer to win their votes), and the treachery of some portion of the 53%, as the politicians can come up with goodies to sell (supporting pet causes or industries, etc.), or the Republicans can fuck things up with stupid statements on rape and god and the like




Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:43 | 3040422 bobnoxy
bobnoxy's picture

I used the electoral results map for lack of anything better. How did blue and red states vote. You know, what actually happened.

I guess I could have winged it with some long, complicated argument that is based on nothing more than theoretical assumptions and conclusions that really means nothing, but you obviously beat me to it.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:50 | 3040438 economics9698
economics9698's picture

All this bull shit is such a waste.  If you are a moocher you vote Democrat.

Black voted 93% for Obama
Asians voted 72% for Obama
Latinos voted 71% for Obama
Jews voted 69% for Obama
Whites voted 59% for Romney

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:52 | 3040455 bobnoxy
bobnoxy's picture

What was the Redneck total? Anyone?

Judging by what you posted, it's obvious why Obama won. It looks like he swept the board except for whites. You forgot women. They went big for Obama too.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:58 | 3040478 Dr. Acula
Dr. Acula's picture

This information makes me proud to be white. Because of all the groups you listed, they are closest to voting 50/50 for Obama and Romney.

Flipping a coin is the only logical thing to do when choosing between two statist, socialist candidates that support socailized healthcare and fascist TARP bailouts.


Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:13 | 3040523 11b40
11b40's picture

So, Jews & Asians are moochers now?  And you teach college?  No wonder Amercan students are so clueless.

If you actually had a clue, you would know that the biggest suckers of the taxpayer teat sit in the board rooms of American banks and multi-national corporations.

Romney lost because he was a charlatan.  A dedicated liar with no core principles, willing to say anything to weasel his way into office.  He had multiple postions on every important subject.  Even his party did not like him.  Mr. Ectch-a-Sketch.  If he had not been running against a black man, he probably would not have gotten 40% of the vote.  But, given what the Republicans had to work with, it would have been largely the same outcome regardless.

Oh, that guy Allen WEst from FL....he lost because it quickly became obvious that he was a total whack job.  Really, a borderline mental case.  Got beat by a 29 year old kid.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 19:12 | 3040885 economics9698
economics9698's picture

Uh dude ever hear of this thing called the Federal Reserve?  Biggest tit sucker ever created.  Run by Jews last time I checked.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:28 | 3040354 e-recep
e-recep's picture

majority rule is mob rule.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 20:11 | 3041055 Freddie
Freddie's picture

You are a moron if you watch any TV.  If you think Fox is any different then you are even dumber than i thought.   Get lost idiot.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:02 | 3040238 Crtrvlt
Crtrvlt's picture

if you look at the county vote breakdown, the reddest counties are the largest recipients of welfare

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:14 | 3040534 11b40
11b40's picture

From seeing the down arrows, it looks like we have several folks today on a campaign against statistics.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:43 | 3040609 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

Yep.  And 64.7% of them fabricate their own statistical results.

Sorry, couldn't resist.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 15:56 | 3040208 acetinker
acetinker's picture

-right wing horseshit- LOLWUT?  Dearest Bob, not all, not even a vast majority of "moochers" are poor.  Many, are in fact, very well-to-do.

Ever hear of a little company called Goldman Sachs?  How about JPM or GM?  Biggest welfare queens of all, this lot.

So, you're wrong Bob, just plain wrong.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:00 | 3040227 bobnoxy
bobnoxy's picture

Actually, no. Didn't you hear about how much those big time moochers, and the oil companies, Wal-Mart heirs, Sheldon Adelson and the Chamber gave to Romney over Obama. It wasn't even close. You don't read much, do you?

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:03 | 3040246 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

Howdy again, Bob. acetinker is speaking of the KronyKomradeKapitalist types, like Warren "Let's Go & Fuck the Taxpayers Some More, amIright, Charlie Munger?" Buffet.

You're not from around here?

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:07 | 3040264 economics9698
economics9698's picture

Lmao, truth.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:05 | 3040260 economics9698
economics9698's picture

Obama top contributers:


University of California $1,648,685

Goldman Sachs $1,013,091

Harvard University $878,164

Microsoft Corp $852,167

Google Inc $814,540

JPMorgan Chase & Co $808,799

Citigroup Inc $736,771

Time Warner $624,618

Sidley Austin LLP $600,298

Stanford University $595,716

National Amusements Inc $563,798

WilmerHale LLP $550,668

Columbia University $547,852

Skadden, Arps et al $543,539

UBS AG $532,674

IBM Corp $532,372

General Electric $529,855

US Government $513,308

Morgan Stanley $512,232

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:15 | 3040297 bobnoxy
bobnoxy's picture

Top Romney;

Goldman Sachs $994,139 Bank of America $921,839 Morgan Stanley $827,255 JPMorgan Chase & Co $792,147 Credit Suisse Group $618,941 Wells Fargo $598,379 Deloitte LLP $554,552 Kirkland & Ellis $496,722 Citigroup Inc $465,063 Barclays $428,250 PricewaterhouseCoopers $421,085 UBS AG $400,390 HIG Capital $385,500 Blackstone Group $360,225 Ernst & Young $293,067 EMC Corp $288,440 General Electric $287,495 Elliott Management $281,925 Bain Capital $279,220 Rothman Institute $263,700


Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:26 | 3040328 economics9698
economics9698's picture


Sooooo Obamacare was to:

1. Help the poor.

2.  Legalize oligopoly health insurance providers and set up exchanges that will allow price fixing.

3.  Drive out medium and small health insurance competitors.

4.  Number 2 and 3.

Dodd-Frank was for:

1.  Help the poor.

2.  Allow the top 8 banks to gain market share.

3.  Drive out of smaller competitors with regulation and consolidate these banks into the larger banks.

4.  Number 2 and 3.

You need to read ZH more.  These people ARE Wall Street.


Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:27 | 3040344 OpenThePodBayDoorHAL
OpenThePodBayDoorHAL's picture

Top Newt Gingrich:

Total campaign warchest: $11m

Total amount from one screeching billionaire: $10M

So we almost had a candidate who was purchased by ONE GUY

This was the first Citizens United election, just wait until the next one

"Hi I'm the Secretary of State, brought to you by Carl's Junior" (Idiocracy)

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:52 | 3040459 Tall Tom
Tall Tom's picture

Which just goes to prove that both Obama and Romney were corporate sluts.


Exactly the point. That is why both the DNC and the GOP will slide into irrelevance. The Liberty Movement will prevail.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:15 | 3040533 Flakmeister
Flakmeister's picture

Do you mean the one bankrolled by the Kochs?

You ain't goona like their brand of liberty....

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 20:14 | 3041061 Freddie
Freddie's picture

John Corzine.  

You are a dope in thinking anything on TV is different.  And in think we had a real election in 2008 or 2012.  Go use your ObamaPhone.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:04 | 3040249 anarchitect
anarchitect's picture

It's not that simple. There are quite a few "poor" who understand that less meddling in the economic arena would benefit them, and many of them vote R because of the (generally naive) belief that Rs are significantly better at not meddling that way. Religion is also big in lots of poor states, which further explains their R vote.

And in the blue states, there are many more Takers than your shallow thinking admits. The poor are penny ante Takers. The big-time Takers are government employees, retired government employees on cushy pensions, and those in the private sector who depend for much of their income on government contracts or barriers to entry (banksters, military contractors, and the health care and education sectors, among others).

Your argument is just as inane as the one you sought to disprove.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:48 | 3040626 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

Let's not forget the pivot point:  The so-called moochers, when they discover that the free ride is over, will pivot from wielding a TV remote to waving about pitchforks and torches.   They are a versatile and agile group.  Talk about your useful idiots.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:08 | 3040273 LongBalls
LongBalls's picture

So, rich people vote for tryanny and poor people vote for economic freedom (albeit the perverted Republican kind)? Hmmm...interesting.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:23 | 3040557 Diogenes
Diogenes's picture

George W Bush said : There is nothing wrong with a dictatorship - as long as I'm the dictator.

If I was rich and powerful and the dictator was my buddy, I'd be in favor of tyranny. Since I am poor, obscure and powerless I fear it.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:12 | 3040287 PD Quig
PD Quig's picture

Romney said, "When I'm elected, I will put Americans back to work."


And 51% of Americans said, "F*ck that sh*t"

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:56 | 3040362 Things that go bump
Things that go bump's picture

Back to work at what?  In what manner would he put Americans back to work?  Was he planning on removing those incentives for his cronies to outsource our jobs overseas?  Perhaps he envisioned instituting something along the lines of the slave labor camps Bain set up in China and then bringing manufacturing back here.  They had to put up big fences to keep those girls from flinging themselves off the step landings in their desperation..  

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 18:16 | 3040717 Things that go bump
Things that go bump's picture

So, what is it?  Do you disagree with what I said?  Or do you simply not like that I pointed it out?  What do you want? Shall I hold up a mirror to reflect your own opinions back at you?  

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:22 | 3040555 11b40
11b40's picture

And 51% of Americans said, "F*ck that sh*t", you lying weasel!  You will just ship more jobs overseas and further line the pockets of your Wall St buds.

Fixed if for you.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:44 | 3040615 PD Quig
PD Quig's picture

Look, a Dem friend of mine sent me that quote in an email today. I just thought it was funny, not true. By the way: the guy has been on unemployment for over 80 weeks and is on food stamps despite living in tony Atherton, CA.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 20:20 | 3041082 Freddie
Freddie's picture

Atherton?   Chuck Schwab lives there.   There "ain't' no apartments or condos that I know of.  It is one of the most expensive zip codes in  the USA.   Only maybe Jupiter Island is higher.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:27 | 3040342 AllWorkedUp
AllWorkedUp's picture

Geesh when I read stuff like this it just confirms how forked we are.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:42 | 3040421 Tall Tom
Tall Tom's picture

You missed the message completely if you believe that it is about people getting handouts.

The major premise is that people who believe in Liberty REJECTED BOTH CANDIDATES as STATISTS and stayed home. That actually swung many races and is going to ultimately kill the GOP.


The left wing/right wing paradigm is no longer valid. Both the GOP and DNC represent the same ideology. Your hope that this argument dies is representative of your allegiance to a state that is hell bent on depriving you of Liberty. The Liberty Movement will just gain momentum over time and make the GOP and DNC irrelevant.


Perhaps you may want to consider Liberty. It is the ultimate experience. Give me Liberty or give me sweet Death. I would rather die on my feet than serve on my knees.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:00 | 3040487 GeorgeHayduke
GeorgeHayduke's picture

Gee bobnoxy, such inconvenient facts are never popular on this message board. They prefer their conservatism to remain in fact free La-Lal Land just like Faux news. Hence all the negative votes you got.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:14 | 3040493 vato poco
vato poco's picture

That article had a brilliant line which I had just planned on stealing, and using it every chance I get, and claiming it as my own, of course. But this is just too good to pass up. This one's for you, Chris "Gassy" Matthews, you and your myriad jocksniffers/sockpuppets: "The word 'journalist' has today become synonymous with 'whore' ..."

Take it all, you scummy little bitch. Your money's on the dresser.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:28 | 3040574 11b40
11b40's picture

The big money whore is Rush Limbaugh.  Hannity ain't far behind, and the whole Fox Noise channel has been exposed as just another bunch of media whores for the Republican Party.  Check out Ruppert Murdock's antics around the globe...especially England.  He is the poster child for media whoremongering.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 22:58 | 3041507 vato poco
vato poco's picture

So your keejerk, reflexive defense of Matthews' pathetic, pavlovian tendency to bend over and spread his butt cheeks for any democrat that might happen to walk by is, "Limbaugh!" "Fox news!!"

Yeah, OK, that'll be enough out of you, shitwit. Why don't you run along and go back to jerking off to MSNBC and CNBC?

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:39 | 3040602 P.T.Bull
P.T.Bull's picture

Most of us are seeing through the cover story and engaging on nuance, and you come in here and spout off the sheeple talking points and think that somehow you don't look like a clueless dolt for doing so.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:49 | 3040634 Dingleberry
Dingleberry's picture

who knew!!!! All those disenfranchised fuckers on food stamps voted for Romney!  Holy fuck!  Next thing you're going to tell me is that LA, CHicago and Detroit are all going repub!!  

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 15:51 | 3040188 zerozulu
zerozulu's picture

Time has ripe for a new political party in US, party of foodstampers.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:02 | 3040495 GeorgeHayduke
GeorgeHayduke's picture

If I'm not mistaken, many Red states have the highest numbers of food stamp folks. So, the switch from the GOP to the Food Stamp Party may not have much of an effect on current politics.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:15 | 3040537 Flakmeister
Flakmeister's picture

Don;t confuse those big picture thinkers with niggling little details like facts....

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 20:43 | 3041160 Mad Cow
Mad Cow's picture

Obviously you 2 met at the shill convention.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 21:30 | 3041291 Flakmeister
Flakmeister's picture

Relying on Fox news for facts typically results in posts like yours...

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 21:32 | 3041295 Mad Cow
Mad Cow's picture

Cackmeister! wrong again.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 21:45 | 3041326 Flakmeister
Flakmeister's picture

Care to look up the per capita rate of EBT transfers for Red and Blue states?
I'll check back later, 'kay?

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 19:41 | 3040967 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

Cargo Cult Party.

Instead of a plane landing, it's your SNAP Card getting refilled.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:09 | 3040277 AGuy
AGuy's picture

Agreed! Entitlements, Bailout are all that matter. People don't want freedom anymore they want handouts!

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:53 | 3040643 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

... and corporations are people. (I gag on the concept.) Or so the SCOTUS says.  You must include them in your group.

Corporate hand-outs are on par with any other category.   The cry for everyone to pay at least some tax should extend to every corporation paying some tax.  Pick your point of participation, 10 million in gross income, whatever.  It's just more balanced that way.  Are you listening GE?

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 22:37 | 3041466 TheFourthStooge-ing
TheFourthStooge-ing's picture


... and corporations are people. (I gag on the concept.) Or so the SCOTUS says.  You must include them in your group.

Bingo! They're also the biggest, laziest freeloaders. Oh, sure, they don't have EBT cards, but that's only because their monthly welfare benefits consist of shrink-wrapped pallets of $100 bills airdropped by C-130s.

Are you listening GE?

Nope, sorry, their legal department is busy writing the nation's tax laws.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:13 | 3040527 EscapingProgress
EscapingProgress's picture

The good news: Free Shit Empires are not sustainable.

The bad news: After Free Shit Empires collapse the Free Shit Army will always build a new Free Shit Empire if given enough time.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 18:08 | 3040686 CH1
CH1's picture

the Takers are now the majority party.  Liberty, at least for now, as no chance against the promoters of the Free Shit Empire.

We don't have to beat the Free Shit Empire. Just separate from it and start building something better.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 19:45 | 3040979 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

Bring back the Paulville concept.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:00 | 3040228 aerojet
aerojet's picture

I almost thing you're right about that--I stopped voting years ago.  I only await the spark of revolution now because everything else is bullshit.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:38 | 3040395 Bear
Bear's picture

Thanks for not voting Rip Van Winkle ... I wish you had stayed engaged, you might have been able to provide some leadership to the next generation. Washington, Franklin, Adams didn't wait for their Revolution.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:14 | 3040530 TheFourthStooge-ing
TheFourthStooge-ing's picture


Washington, Franklin, Adams didn't wait for their Revolution.

They also didn't wait for King George to set up a referendum allowing them to "vote" on whether they should remain subjects of the crown.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 18:08 | 3040691 CH1
CH1's picture

Exactly. Ditch the slave game and build better.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 15:15 | 3040057 FL_Conservative
FL_Conservative's picture

Can't wait for that putz to get his walking papers.  But there's a lot of others in that group too, in both houses.  Shame the country will never make it to the next election to get more of these turds "enema-d".

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:03 | 3040245 PD Quig
PD Quig's picture

Brandon Smith is a certifiable fucking idiot. I don't give a crap about the GOP, but let's take just a quick peek at the liberty-smashing that has gone on the past four years:

  1. The NSA is reading all our emails
  2. Our fucking president gets to make a list of terrorists (that includes American citizens) and kill them with drone missiles on his say-so alone
  3. The electronic health records of Obamacare will share your private information across the government
  4. We are now forced to purchase government-designed health care coverage
  5. The EPA forces homeowners to do what it dictates under threat of administrative fines that cannot be appealed
  6. The federal government overrides state's marijuana laws
  7. The TSA frisks us, takes x-ray photos of us, and imposes all manner of ridiculous, ineffective air travel regulations
  8. More and more police departments are SWATing up and no-knock raids on the wrong houses are not compensated
  9. Obama continues all Bush policies of warrantless wiretaps (now over 50,000 Americans have been subjected to this), illegal rendition of prisoners to places like Yemen, Saudi Arabia, military commissions are going and blowing, and I notice that Gitmo is still open
  10. We can no longer move money out of the country without the IRS giving us a tonsilectomy through our rectums.

I could go on, and on, but you get the point--unless, of course, you're Brandon fucking which case you are incapable of getting the point. This fucking government--both sides of the aisle--has turned the corner to fucking fascism. They do whatever they want to us and we have to bend over and take it.

Fuck them and fuck morons like the author of this dumb-assed piece.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:15 | 3040263 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

Agreed. This is why those that don't/can't understand that the false left-right paradigm "trap" is real will never be able to string together logical thought or action. They'll consistently think that by making an active choice, they somehow can alter the outcome, when either choice they make perpetuates it.

People need to accept that the sytem of "choice" is an illusion, offering marginal & symbolic differences at best, no matter how much sweat & toil they put into the current system.

There can be no real choice until the present system is no more.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:31 | 3040361 OpenThePodBayDoorHAL
OpenThePodBayDoorHAL's picture

Verizon just applied for a patent for a system that listens to your phone conversations and serves you ads based on the words you said. Should be no trouble getting that approved.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:40 | 3040405 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

Not only approved, but cleared for the CIA, FBI & NSA to access without any need for warrants, oversight or any other "due process/constitutional process" nonsense.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:42 | 3040612 11b40
11b40's picture

My Tea Party darling Congressman, Mick Mulvaney, thinks it's fine for you to get solicted on your cell phone.  Another fine example of Liberty, I suppose.


Bottom Line - Bill would permit robo-calls to your cell phone

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:50 | 3040439 FinalCollapse
FinalCollapse's picture

PD- I am not sure why you are so angry and insulting the author of this article. I agree with pretty much what the author wrote and also with your conclusions. You and Brandon Smith are tangent on many points. The insults are misplaced - save them for other assholes who deserve it. 

However, if you are GOP Romneybot - then I can understand your anger. Hey- karma is a bitch! Don't cheat on your own GOP Liberty minded people.

Long Live Ron Paul!

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:07 | 3040507 Tall Tom
Tall Tom's picture

PD Quig


I do not understand your antagonism toward Brandon Smith. I do not believe that he is buying into the faux Left/Right paradigm. In fact his article states that they are statists and of the same flavor...They are both fucking Socialists.


I believe that Mr. Smith pointed out that it was the outright FRAUD of the GOP to attract the Liberty vote has doomed them. He is HAPPY about their doom. He wrote that.


I do not think that you read the article carefully. He is NOT supporting the GOP at all.


In fact both you and Mr. Smith share many of the same attitudes with the exception of your antagonism toward him.


Fuck the Status Quo. Long live Liberty..

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:39 | 3040598 PD Quig
PD Quig's picture

Why the headline of the piece? Which party has brought us the health care debacle? Which party wants to tell you which light bulb you can buy? Which party wants to tell you what kind of foods you can eat, what kind of cars you can drive? I suppose my ire is directed at the misdirection here. The Dems are, and always have been, the party of the massive state>>limited liberty.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 18:00 | 3040662 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

Your partisan approach isn't working.  It's not subtle enough.  Try working on the delivery.

Both parties have their own "talking points" boogeymen.   Your selection of one party's is indelicate.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:08 | 3040509 SilverMoneyBags
SilverMoneyBags's picture

The guy who wrote this piece is AGREEING with you. He is saying the GOP will die out because neocons run the party and are witch hunting those from the liberty delegation. Fucking idiot.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:35 | 3040584 PD Quig
PD Quig's picture

So, why does Smith single out the GOP? I started voting Libertarian in 1992, but it is intellectually lazy and disingenuous that the vast majority of the opprobrium gets heaped on the GOP when the Dems are clearly as bad--and demonstrably worse stewards of liberty. Maybe because the GOP talks limited government but goes along with Dem statism? Don't know, but there is clearly one party that sees massive government as the solution to every single problem.

So why is it not the Dems that are going to die out? Because they are the party of The State?

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 21:02 | 3041219 Shell Game
Shell Game's picture

The reason Brandon is talking about the GOP is because of the fact that there is currently an intense civil war ongoing within the GOP.  The battle that has been building is now accelerating after the deception, cheating and force the GOP used against grassroots citizens this last election cycle.  Remember, the GOP loves Empire and you cannot have Empire and limited government at the same time. It's one of their biggest and most effective lies.

After GWB, the Dems promised an oath of silence to keep their guy in office.  Funny how principle goes out the window in the later stages of mob rule...  There is no civil war in the DNC, they sold out and have no desire to reform.  Nothing to see there.


Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:08 | 3040270 Stoploss
Stoploss's picture

As we patiently await the 'second' shot heard around the world.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 14:51 | 3039948 Robot Traders Mom
Robot Traders Mom's picture

Can i say "r3volution" or will I end up on too many more lists?

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 15:04 | 3040009 Josephus
Josephus's picture




Thu, 12/06/2012 - 15:22 | 3040088 traderjoe
traderjoe's picture

We are way beyond the event horizon.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:29 | 3040356 zerozulu
zerozulu's picture

Train has left the station and Ron Paul is not on it.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:08 | 3040511 SilverMoneyBags
SilverMoneyBags's picture

Rand Paul you piece of trash.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 15:40 | 3040148 Bear
Bear's picture

The Revolution and Death of the GOP is not a good thing.

The nation is in equilibrium with a 30-30, Dem/Rep balance. This balance as shown by the election results is really:

11% Black

8% Hispanic

13% Young Women

12% Old Boomer Liberals

4% Gays

30% Morons

16% Right Religionists

12% Neocons

2% Libertarians

18% Old White Men

13% Young White Men

3% Liberty Lovers

And of course the many overlaps.

So who are you going to recruit to your movement?

Liberty is the greatest 'luxury' available to man and I contend that it is available only to men who have overcome the daily struggle for survival and feel relatively secure in their environment, yet still required to work for a living. Liberty is strangled by those who have too much time on their hands spending it in conjuring up some socialist utopia or by going to Harvard.

If we don't unite and change the Republican Party from within, the coming collapse and our fragmentation will open the door for a fascist dictator who will squash the Liberty out of all of us.

I believe in Liberty and any movement that promotes it and its virtues ... but our history shows us that an armed rabble will be extinguished and lead us even further down the road of Tyranny. There is an historical chance of 1000 to 1, that a revolution of the enlightened will succeed. It may sound exciting, even heroic, to lead the charge of Liberty but the probably of us becoming George Washington as opposed to Madam deFarge is remote.

We have to make our case within the societal framework that is our Republic and the best way to do this is to reform the Republican Party from within.


Thu, 12/06/2012 - 15:43 | 3040158 Wakanda
Wakanda's picture


Liberty comes from the hearts of good people, which is most of us regardless of labels.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:21 | 3040316 Bear
Bear's picture


"I'm not afraid of lists or the fools who keep them. The Second American Revolution, unfolding now at kitchen tables, local bars, fishing holes, and hunting cabins near you."

Get off your ass, eating, drinking, fishing, and hunting and get engaged with the next generation, teaching them about Liberty, where it comes from, and what we are without it.

It takes real courage to put yourself out there when the next generation is living. They don't believe what we believe and taking the slurs and hits of ridicule ain't fun. 

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:22 | 3040554 Raymond K Hessel
Raymond K Hessel's picture

Bear is right.  I know someone, let's call him JB, who was arrested, processed, and fighting for his life in court on trumped up murder conspiracy charges.  The real perp was a douche who wanted to run the Young Republicans in NYS but JB had that job.

Why is that important enough to frame a guy for murder?  The chair of the Young Republicans gets one of about 3-5 seats at the table that is the NYS GOP. The leadership is also composed of the GOP leader in the NYS assembly and NYS senate, NYC city council, and if they are GOP, the NYC mayor and governor.

He went through hell and this guy was an intelligent, articulate, passionate conservative. The idea of this guy being in jail along with society's worst scum is just absolutely horrific.  JB was one of those guys that would NOT do well in prison, at all.  He'd be dead inside of a year.

When it was all said and done, the Justice Dept found out that they were used as tools in this jackass's political plot to become remove competition in a power grab.  They quickly dropped charges against JB and ass-raped the real perp and his PI who provided false evidence and testimony.  

At his acquittal party, he gave a speech where he promised to stay in the party at the shock of his family.  How could he go back knowing to what great lengths people would go for power?  

He said, "If the good people leave the party because of the evil people, then the party will be filled with nothing but evil people.  Who will we have to run against Democrats if the good people let that happen?"

While he won the battle, we obviously know what happened 20 years later. We lost the war.  

While I'm done with the GOP, I can't say that I'm not inspired by people like Dr. Paul.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:58 | 3040658 Wakanda
Wakanda's picture

If you fall for the labels and categories put on people different than you, then the terrorists have won.  Every human has a spiritual core from which successful transformations and revolutions unfold.  Putting aside our egos and living from that core, that heart is humanity's next step.  True liberty comes from within.

It is incorrect to assume that I am not engaged with the next generation.  The late teens and twentysomethings I hang with are ready to rock.  As remaining a sheeple becomes more painful and redonkulous, the kids change - much faster than old shits like me.

The Second American Revolution - the kids are allright.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 15:47 | 3040172 cossack55
cossack55's picture

At my age, the only movement that interests me involves my bowels.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:11 | 3040283 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

56 myself and hear ya cossack.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:03 | 3040242 aerojet
aerojet's picture

Yeah, but at least I'll die on my feet and not starving in some prison camp.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:24 | 3040330 Bear
Bear's picture

I may die in that prison camp, but I will still be preaching that what made us great is the rule of law and that it is our last and only salvation

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 20:01 | 3041024 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

Laws are made up, they can be useful or harmful.

Once you agree to let a select minority create them, your fate is sealed.


Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:35 | 3040377 AGuy
AGuy's picture

"If we don't unite and change the Republican Party from within, the coming collapse and our fragmentation will open the door for a fascist dictator who will squash the Liberty out of all of us."

Its very likely the GOP is finished, and we will move down to a single party gov't simalar to Japan which has been effectively ruled by one party for the past 60+ years. Bush W got in office on out doing the Democrats with the Bush Tax Cuts, the $300 tax give back and Prescription Drug converage. Unless the GOP is willing to up-one on the DNC, there is little to no chance of gaining control. Also consider the GOP didn't just lose the presidential bid, they also lost seats in the Senate and Congress. Its likely the GOP will lose more seats when the Mid-term elections occur. Any polticians that promotes fiscial responsiblity with big gov't spending cuts is going to get the boot. What remains will be the Weasels that choose office over morals, and only separate themselves from the DNC on minor and meanless issues.

Collapse of the Union is probably the best outcome since people would be able to vote with their feet (by moving out of anti-liberty havens). Currently we are already in a state of fascism, where gov't controls businesses (ie GM, Banks, etc) either by direct ownership or through regulation.

My biggest concern is that the collectivist use war to distract the public from the internal problems and to prop up the economy, which will lead to the next World War. If that happens civilization is finished. If the dollar was to collapse first, the Rug from the Federal gov't would be pulled out from under them, and a World war would probably be avoided, or at least on a scale that completely destroys civilization. Without the dollar the Federal gov't is powerless. It has no way to pay for the goods and services it needs to survive.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:51 | 3040452 zanez
zanez's picture

I woud bump 'Morons' to at least 50%.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:13 | 3040528 Tall Tom
Tall Tom's picture

The hope is NOT within the Republican Party.


I asked a wise sage, "If you have the Psychopaths leading the Idiots then where is the hope?"


He said, "Look in the mirror."


Good riddance to the GOP 

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 15:42 | 3040151 Wakanda
Wakanda's picture

I'm not afraid of lists or the fools who keep them.

The Second American Revolution, unfolding now at kitchen tables, local bars, fishing holes, and hunting cabins near you.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:16 | 3040303 Bear
Bear's picture

"The Second American Revolution, unfolding now at kitchen tables, local bars, fishing holes, and hunting cabins near you"

Sounds like an old, white man's Revolution ... the new amalgam does not eat in the kitchen, does not drink in local bars, does not fish and certainly does not hunt  ... they believe that food comes from DelTaco or Starbucks, drinking is passé, Xbox over fishing, and nobody would want to hurt those little critters.

Our challenge is not to lament over the passing of those things we love but to inspire work hard in teaching the next generation that if we are not smart, hard working, innovative, and liberty loving, we will lose everything ... we need to go to Starbucks and engage in dialog, stop fishing and go to the local college and engage, stop drinking and do the hard things to show the next generation what can be done by liberty lovers.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:24 | 3040562 harami
harami's picture

Amen to that.

Careful though, if you aren't rattling your sabre for revolution and promote peaceful resolutions you're likely to get the dreaded red arrow.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 14:52 | 3039951 falak pema
falak pema's picture

who leads the liberty movement of tomorrow?

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 15:05 | 3040011 Ignatius
Ignatius's picture

The ones that don't feel the need to look in your underwear.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 15:40 | 3040149 MrTouchdown
MrTouchdown's picture

Concepts don't need leaders. Why so fast to look for someone to be king? The whole point is that we don't need kings anymore. This is the 21st Century, not the 1st. Things have changed since then.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 15:57 | 3040173 falak pema
falak pema's picture

concepts need leaders to become POLITICAL programs on which people vote to exercise their democratic rigths.

Concepts don't make a country function; they make PEOPLE function and therefore they HAVE to involve, to be concrete, people's representation.

As Henry K very appropriately said : When I want to talk to Europe, whom do I telephone?

That's the question the concept of Europe has a problem addressing even today...

So if the Liberty movement is more than a concept, a political platform, it needs a leader!

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:04 | 3040252 aerojet
aerojet's picture

The Rothschilds, duh!  And you don't call them, *they* call you.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:15 | 3040290 falak pema
falak pema's picture

the Rs are NOT political, they pull strings. If you want people's governance u need brave, honest people. If you can't find them to stand in public then the nation state is dead. It doesn't exist in a political vacuum. 

Vacuum = neo feudalism or dictatorship; not liberty movement or hallucination. 

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 16:48 | 3040437 Nothing To See Here
Nothing To See Here's picture

You need to be educated into anarcho-capitalism... Murray Rothbard would be a good start.

When everyone is his own leader and respects the leadership boundaries of others under the terms of private property, then liberty exists.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 18:15 | 3040711 falak pema
falak pema's picture

end of nation state. Delusional.

Liberty without responsibility is dystopia. Taxation is the sign of civilization, cohesion, unity.

You want to go back to the american indian tribes. 

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:18 | 3040548 MrTouchdown
MrTouchdown's picture

You think politics can solve the mess we're in?!?! People that get elected aren't there to represent YOU, they're there to represent themselves. This sort if ignorance is exactly what got us B. Hussein Obummer and Mittens Romney as our choice of overlord this last time. Or that got Draghi and Barroso in the EU. And a premier in China. Take your pick - different titles, all the same agenda - themselves. I'd like to also remind you that the efficient functioning of the interactions between PEOPLE is the espoused goal of government.


Look, you've managed one step of "growing up", now you need to think about the second. The first was realizing you don't need mommy and daddy in order to get along with the people around you and to live. The next step is to realize you don't need mommy government or daddy police/military to get along with the people around you. It's a ruse we live in - the idea that without mommy government and daddy police we're going to all become chimpanzees and beat each other over the heads with rocks. It just won't happen. Sure, there are some dumb people out there that think the Chimp way is the way to go - but they're already doing that even WITH this control structure. 


Now, I can guess what you might think next - without daddy police and mommy government, we won't have any protection from bad people! -- Well guess what? You don't have any protection now. Corzine, JPMC and the new Deutsche Bank thing prove your money and property aren't safe, and I can gurantee that if someone mugs you or breaks into your house, the police will not be there in time to do a damn thing about it. You are alone, as you have always been.

Next, you will say "but what about foreign governments invading?" - and to that I present to you Afghanistan, a country full of illiterate peoples living in stone huts as they have for thousands of years - which has been besieged by the mightiest army the world has ever known, and is WINNING, even while losing every battle.

Liberty is a concept, and if embraced the need for governments, politics, leaders and so on disappears. Think of what you have suggested - in order to preserve our liberty we need to give up our liberty to a group of people... This is silly. It is better to have no overlords than to have a choice of overlord.

Thu, 12/06/2012 - 17:18 | 3040549 Tall Tom
Tall Tom's picture

What? You need a leader? How WEAK!!!


Lead yourself.

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