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Silver Slumps To Biggest 3-Day Drop In Over A Year

Tyler Durden's picture


On the back of no news and no fundamental shifts in demand and supply, Silver has cliff-dived 7.5% in the last 3 days, its biggest drop in over a year, as the precious metal heads back towards unchanged on the year. We suspect that, just as with the NatGas story earlier this year (when it went bidless and was justified by endless chatter over what it meant, when in fact it was John Arnold unwinding his positions and closing shop), the moves we are seeing in not just precious metals but copper and across FX are liquidation-related (as we noted yesterday) as fundamentally facts remain the same, given central bank buying of gold into reserves and the Fed set to hit a $4 trillion balance sheet within the next year). Into the 2011 year-end we also saw dramatic 'liquidation-like' plunges in Silver (and gold) as it is very clear that whoever is 'selling' is entirely price-insensitive.

It's beginning to look a lot like H1 2012...


Silver broke below its 200DMA (red), and saw the biggest 3-day drop in over a year (lower pane)


yet another 2011 echo...




Chart: Bloomberg


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Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:35 | 3082641 ParkAveFlasher
ParkAveFlasher's picture

Still shiny.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:39 | 3082663 mick68
mick68's picture


Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:40 | 3082667 GetZeeGold
GetZeeGold's picture



Walk in when everyone is running out.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:46 | 3082702 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

The Bearing sweats this not.  I see a Precious Future for those with the physical, no worries.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:48 | 3082712 Stackers
Stackers's picture

and every sell off has happened exactly at the NYMEX open.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:52 | 3082733 trav777
trav777's picture

silverbugz getting absolutely BLOWTORCHED.

C'mon, this was a "can't miss buy" only 5 days ago!!!

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:58 | 3082754 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

LMFAO!!  Wake me when it's back down around $8 an ounce.  That's where my dollar cost average is.  Until then I will sleep fine.  And after that, I will still actually have plenty ofphysical purchasing power.  The monkey hammering is a prerequisite for the printing.  Who you gonna believe Trav? The MSM pushing paper promises that everything is okay or your own lying eyes?  You crack me up.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:07 | 3082817 trav777
trav777's picture

so you are saying "hold"?

Because anyone who was saying buy on Monday was a fool.

Silver is for people who are too low-class to afford gold, like people who fly coach.

You can tell you're a silverbug when your ZH adsenses are toyotas...they're trying to sell me a Bentley.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:09 | 3082831 Comay Mierda
Comay Mierda's picture

talk about anger management

do you masturbate to UFC fights?

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:28 | 3082930 ParkAveFlasher
ParkAveFlasher's picture

The ads I see have young girls posing in skimpy clothes.  Does that make Trav a fayggalach?

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:44 | 3083011 gmrpeabody
gmrpeabody's picture

I have it on good authority that Travs ads tend to be Cialis and other similar type products.

Although...., some of Travs rantings are very entertaining of late...


Thu, 12/20/2012 - 14:04 | 3083364 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

I bought 3 millions shares of Apple (using a bull-call spread) at $5 a share in 2002 and sold every share at the absolute top on 9/21/12, bitchez, just like RoboTrader.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 14:49 | 3083535 Athenian
Athenian's picture

If that were true, you wouldn't be on this site.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 14:50 | 3083548 strannick
strannick's picture



Not price insensitive. They want the lowest price possible


Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:36 | 3082971 Non Passaran
Non Passaran's picture

If he's doing it between the rounds, then it's OK.
Still, he's making a fool of himself with these comments.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 13:07 | 3083147 silverserfer
silverserfer's picture

dont hate on trav hes saving up his $ for his penis enlargement surgery.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 14:26 | 3083453 akak
akak's picture

Oh, so THAT is why he is always hatin' on black men!

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:10 | 3082834 fuu
fuu's picture

You see ads? You really are a moron.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:17 | 3082879 Pseudo Anonym
Pseudo Anonym's picture

yup, trav777 is so sophisticated that s/he doesnt know how to install adblock, noscript, etc.  i wouldnt be surprised if s/he was still using ms internet explorer for browsing.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:57 | 3083100 Oldballplayer
Oldballplayer's picture

He is.  I am tracking him.


Thu, 12/20/2012 - 15:17 | 3083682 trav777
trav777's picture

cool...because I'm giving you the finger right now

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 14:28 | 3083461 Midas
Midas's picture

But aren't you missing the Snorg girls?

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:25 | 3082906 dlmaniac
dlmaniac's picture

Trav, are you one of those freegold morons?

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:46 | 3083025 edb5s
edb5s's picture

I am assuming that you are just a troll, but nevertheless; you do realize that you can buy very small increments of gold, right?

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 13:10 | 3083157 devo
devo's picture

Dude, trolling is so 2003

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 13:23 | 3083205 jughead
jughead's picture

Silver is what you keep at home to buy groceries and hookers with when the SHTF. Gold is what you hide offshore so the government can't easily confiscate it...again.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 13:44 | 3083296 tradewithdave
tradewithdave's picture

I do admit it is convenient to hand over the establishment of your self-worth to Google Adsense.  It worked for Sartre... for Marx...  Assigning it to the Hegelian other is certainly less taxing than introspection.  Guess I should have never clicked on that "Either you like bacon or you're wrong" Snorg t-shirt ad. I really like the ocassional piece of bacon, but I'm also wrong a lot.  Now, I have no idea where to click next.  Is this how the ZH timeline ends?  No more clicking? 

Merry Christmas everybody!

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 14:46 | 3083523 Athenian
Athenian's picture

I've been buying silver for years. And I have two Bentleys and a Ferrari. All three with custom made solid silver kickboards.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 15:13 | 3083666 wsm4826
wsm4826's picture

FYI if you look a little closer your bentley adsense is actually a chrysler

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:08 | 3082822 Comay Mierda
Comay Mierda's picture

yep.  lots of buyers will be waiting at the gap fill from August 20th

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:40 | 3082995 Atlasshruggedme
Atlasshruggedme's picture

I went to the GAP, but they tried to sell me Clothes and a GAP Credit card, not silver. 

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:09 | 3082830 Spider
Spider's picture

Well the cost to produce/mine an ounce of silver is around $25 - once it hits that level you're really looking at a bargain and I dont think it will hit the negative cost level.  Real downside no more than 15%, while upside is easily in the 50% range (or more depending on global liquidity) so that sounds like a good deal to me!

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:44 | 3083016 pupton
pupton's picture

Does anyone else think this guy "LawsofPhysics" is a douchebag for putting his claim of an $8 cost basis in every fucking post?  Regardless of how valid any of his posts may be materially...douche.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 13:09 | 3083152 The Navigator
The Navigator's picture

every fucking post? ,,,,,, his claim of an $8 cost basis

1- I can't claim to read EVERY fucking article on ZH or catch EVERY fucking post that ANYONE posts, but EVERY covers a lot of territory.

2 - Some started when it was $4 and $5/oz - I was late jumping in, in 2007 at $10 & $12/oz - and even though I was buying still at $39/oz, my cost basis is somewhere between $18 & $20/oz. So some saw it (the need for physical metals) earlier than others.

Your ire is mis-directed perhaps?

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 15:50 | 3083824 pupton
pupton's picture

I have just happened to see three posts from him in the last couple of days.  3/3 had the same point.  Get it, you're a genious for buying low. 

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 19:16 | 3084478 Orly
Orly's picture

It is a psychological trick to assuage his fear of losing so much money.  It is an internal dialogue wherein he reinforces his desire to be correct in all things, but especially the idea that gold is going straight up, even when the charts are saying otherwise.

He has for the past week told how his dollar cost average of silver is eight dollars and his DCA of gold is 200 dollars...which means he was accumulating when he was seven years old.

I guess that's what makes him smarter than the rest of us.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 13:39 | 3083284 mayhem_korner
mayhem_korner's picture



No.  LOP is just using the claim to make a point.  All the movement in PMs is simply noise when one takes a longer view.  Anyone panicking about a smackdown to twenty something an oz of silver is playing a card game and does not share the motivation of a physical PM holder.  I continue to accumulate both g and s on a regular basis, and I really don't pay attention to the so-called "price".  Like LOP, my average cost of acquisition is no where near the current clearing "price", but if it did, I'd just add more to the pile.

What's your gripe, anyway?  It has the smell of envy, but I can't be sure.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 15:56 | 3083851 pupton
pupton's picture

I keep buying and adding to my stack, and I have no idea what my cost basis is.  Probably around $18 or $20 including coin premiums, but it is irrelevant to me, because that isn't why I buy in the first place.

The point of my "gripe" was just that is starts to seem tacky/douchesque that a guy has to keep announcing what a fantastic cost basis he has.  He is probably smarter and richer than me, and I have no quarrel with the content of his ideas, other than the fact that he keeps reminding us of his cost basis.  I guess it is a pet peeve of mine...people bragging, if that's what he's doing.  I don't know the fella well enough to know...

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:45 | 3083024 CPL
CPL's picture

You bastards are dogpiling kitco!!!  Now est time of delivery is 18 months as of today.  




I would really like to know.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 13:28 | 3083194 FEDbuster
FEDbuster's picture

APMEX would be a good place to start.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 19:05 | 3084448 auric1234
auric1234's picture

What does MSM stand for?


Thu, 12/20/2012 - 19:54 | 3084636 smiler03
smiler03's picture

Surprisingly the Urban Dictionary can be very useful for some ZH help: 

Fri, 12/21/2012 - 17:17 | 3088275 auric1234
auric1234's picture

Cool, thanks.


Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:59 | 3082758 The Shootist
The Shootist's picture

Silver's in a bubble. Everyone I know is talking about it and how they're all going to get rich off of it. Oh wait, I mean, I actually know of nobody interested in it who I haven't already given some schooling.  =/

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:09 | 3082828 trav777
trav777's picture

nah, the bubble already popped when the breathless silverbugz doomer goons were screaming to "buy with both fists" when the price was at $49

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:26 | 3082917 exi1ed0ne
exi1ed0ne's picture

I bought at $6 -$49, because the world was going to shit.  The only thing that has changed since that top is that we are in deeper shit then before - invalid price signals are all overe the boards, markets are overtly gamed with zero consequence, investments can be stolen and squandered by their trustees with no consequences or recourse for the investors, entire continents are overtly cooking the books to appear solvent, etc. etc.

I buy silver because trust is in serious deflation.  Too bad I have shitty luck with boats.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:43 | 3083013 SmallerGovNow2
SmallerGovNow2's picture

+ 1,000 up arrows...

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:40 | 3082993 toothpicker
toothpicker's picture

Wow. You're so smart.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 14:29 | 3083458 BailoutBandit
BailoutBandit's picture

If Trav is so rich, why does he care which direction silver goes?  Sounds like a desparate paper trader to me.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 16:49 | 3084049 laozi
laozi's picture

This is interesting. Most new trend goes through bubbles. Look at bitcoin, they had a bubble that popped at $32. Half year later the price was $2.5. Now it is $13.

Most trends have some bubbles on the way up. And I believe Silver is a trend.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:10 | 3082836 Pseudo Anonym
Pseudo Anonym's picture

maybe the paper

silverbugz getting absolutely BLOWTORCHED

but also, maybe the paper silver owners are getting rid of their paper promises and are heading into the coin shop to get the real deal.  i could imagine paper silver trading at much lower level yet no phyz available anywhere.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:14 | 3082859 SilverRhino
SilverRhino's picture

Let it drop.  I intend to liquidate in 2020 or some year like that. 


Thu, 12/20/2012 - 14:00 | 3083344 wee-weed up
wee-weed up's picture

My, aren't you optimistic! Methinks the country goes MadMax long before 2020.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 15:17 | 3083685 SilverRhino
SilverRhino's picture

I didn't say that was my only preparation.  Besides.  Silver ALWAYS emerges as a medium of trade during a currnecy crisis.  Kind of like Gold.  

Most of what I consider 'savings' is in the form of metals and materials never to be redeemed for US dollars again. 

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 14:32 | 3083479 Mugatu
Mugatu's picture

I just chuckle every time someone claims that a big drop in metals is "good for them so they can buy more".  Face up!  You do not buy an asset so you can watch the price go down!

I am a gold holder and intend to buy more, but I am waiting for this fall to conclude (which I think will be around $1500).  

Why am I waiting? Its because I want it to rise after I buy more - not fall.  

Everyone quit kidding yourself - when your asset is falling it is not good! 

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:34 | 3082966 Non Passaran
Non Passaran's picture

Nice try...
I didn't sell any and I plan to buy more.
What is your point, really?

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:53 | 3082734 USS Bernanke
USS Bernanke's picture

Mission Statement of the CFTC: Seen here in Plaque Form.

The mission of the CFTC is to protect market users and the public

from fraud, manipulation, and abusive practices

related to the sale of commodity futures and options,

and to foster open, competitive, and financially sound commodity futures and option markets.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:28 | 3082932 exi1ed0ne
exi1ed0ne's picture

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.  Stop it, your killing me!  Save that good humor for Friday man!

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:38 | 3082981 Nothing To See Here
Nothing To See Here's picture

I am sure that if PMs were bought in a consistent and orderly manner, they would jump on the issue and "protect the public". But now that the selling occurs with sudden massive sell orders outside of market hours when demand is low and a good price is unlikely to be obtained for such massive sells at these hours, it's all fine by them...

Yep. Government at its best.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 23:02 | 3085363 Temporalist
Temporalist's picture

I would like to store my PMs on your vessel USS (as it is certain to sink).

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:06 | 3082790 chiswickcat
chiswickcat's picture

May hit $26+ before a big move up. But relax, this was on the cards. Note this article is from the 14th. Dec


Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:47 | 3083041 CPL
CPL's picture

If someone could post where someone has physical that can be delivered FedEx next day that would be great.


Kitco and retailers don't have any to sell.   I would like to take advantage of the price drop.


But there is nothing to buy but paper IOU's through a brokerage account which is worthless.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 13:38 | 3083273 Vint Slugs
Vint Slugs's picture

Try Tulving.  They ship overnight via UPS.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 13:56 | 3083328 IMACOINNUT
IMACOINNUT's picture

Liberty Coin and Precious Metals -- is a great place to buy.  Though I don;t know about overnight delivery.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 13:58 | 3083338 Haole
Haole's picture

Aren't you in Canada?

Try these guys:

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 15:47 | 3083809 qqqqtrader
qqqqtrader's picture

been buying and selling here for years...

walk-in or shipped

Fri, 12/21/2012 - 03:47 | 3085997 chiswickcat
chiswickcat's picture

The sellers of phyz just stop selling when the price drops. They are waiting until the price rises before opening for biz again. Always happens. 

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 13:56 | 3083332 slaughterer
slaughterer's picture

Not sure silver is going to hit $28 this sell-off.   Really depends on the schedule and amount of future liquidation.  Whoever is selling is doing it in an incredibly stupid and/or forceful way.  When the volume shrinks further, these moves will be even more violent.  

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:36 | 3082644 tradewithdave
tradewithdave's picture

Maybe folks saw something in the water.  Oh, it was only another interview with the man who doesn't talk to anyone.  Andrew Maguire speaks.


Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:01 | 3082775 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

I read your post. You want to talk about real issues (ZIRP, debt, deficits, derivatives, etc...) and how they relate to gold, or just use ad hom attacks on those you disagree with?


Thu, 12/20/2012 - 16:23 | 3083970 tradewithdave
tradewithdave's picture

Technically speaking, attacking a CFTC commissioner's mullet is not ad hominem.  Hairstyles are fair game.  To translate the latin, you are not your hair. 

Otherwise, let's talk about accouting for in situ gold using a triple entry accounting model (ala bitcoin's blockchain) in the present value and how about the reversability of Gresham's law and Mises regression theorem for starters.  I could use the help. 

If my Snorg t-shirt bacon comment further up in the thread was the ad hom you were referring to, my apologies.  Bacon is business, not personal. 

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 18:09 | 3084275 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

This is the same guy who disables comments on his blog so people cant respond to his post that he links here at ZH.

Thats pitiful. 

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 19:20 | 3084491 Orly
Orly's picture

Well, we can agree on that.  That's pretty pathetic...

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 20:07 | 3084675 tradewithdave
tradewithdave's picture

I guess it's pathetic if you say so.  At least it's not ad hom (bacon withstanding).  Let's get back to Gresham or Mises.  Any ad hom on Gresham or maybe some non-ad hom... either way.  Comments are on. 

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:38 | 3082651 Xibalba
Xibalba's picture

a 'Not For Profit' seller...

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:51 | 3082723 USS Bernanke
USS Bernanke's picture

Timing is impeccable.  Right after the announcement of more QE.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 13:11 | 3083163 ThirdWorldDude
ThirdWorldDude's picture

...And right on time for a Xmas discount!

Just ordered 40 philharmonics. Almost the entire Vienna Symphonic Orchestra, so I can have my own New Years's Concert at home...  :)

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:51 | 3082726 AL_SWEARENGEN

Who are these cocksuckers fooling?  Smashing PM's at the close of the year AGAIN in a manner that only proves that it's these bought out bastards rigging the markets lower and not 'market forces.'   Nobody believes this crap anymore.  US mint (Geithner) suspends SAE's sales and the price slumps 15%,, Utter BULL SHIT.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 13:41 | 3083222 SWCroaker
SWCroaker's picture

Exactly right, but since you know that they know that you know, maybe they want you to re-think about what you know they know?

wuggga wugga.   

I'll restate: The message *isn't* please think this is normal.  The message is more likely "we can do this all day, every day, any day; go home go away or go broke."      No "fooling" is involved at this point; they're bragging, and since they own/operate/regulate the price setting market, they win.   Unless some viable out of their control breakage occurs, the beatings *will* continue.



Soz I buyz, and I holdz, and I waitz; me and my Preciousss.   I'm so Pavlovian conditioned at this point, that they only have to purse their lips and think about whistling, and I trudge to behind the woodshed for my beating.   But I won't cough it up, not one measly physical ounce.  Not due to faith in markets, or regulators, or some purported awakening by the masses.  I'm a big believer in physics.  What is "there" *must* equal what goes in minus what comes out minus what gets destroyed.   You can phony the reports, and move the price up and down, but conservation of matter will not be denied, in the end.

....   would be nice if the end showed up soon, but if it doesn't I'll plan to have obstinante offspring celebrate on my behalf.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 17:27 | 3084151 Snidley Whipsnae
Snidley Whipsnae's picture

SWCroaker... I know how you feel and good on ya mate. At times like these I say to myself 'Mr Market always wins in the end'.

...and, I don't mean mr paper market.

Must get back to my seamanship class. I don't want to lose my last two silver coins in yet another boating misshap.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:38 | 3082656 stateside
stateside's picture

Why doesn't anyone sell stocks to liquidate and raise cash?  Why are only pm's liquidated?  Of course it's a rhetorical question as the answer is obvious to most here.



Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:45 | 3082704 ParkAveFlasher
ParkAveFlasher's picture

Because recovery is just around the corner!tm

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:02 | 3082784 lasvegaspersona
lasvegaspersona's picture


you got the memo

shale oil will save us!!! the USA will be the Saudi Arabia of shale oil and LNG

we are saved

except the government still has this 200 trillion unpayable under any scenario debt and even if we do have cheaper energy the economic mood will take years to figure out a way to use that energy efficiently. Come on...what? increase auto sales to the masses who are about to be taxed to death? I just have no imagination and see no way this works..

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:18 | 3082880 ParkAveFlasher
ParkAveFlasher's picture

1) shale oil

2) 3D printing

3) carbon nanotubes

4) facebook

5) iPhones

6) Dual PhD's in Econometrics & Llama Psychology

The saviors are many!  Step right up and get yer stocks!

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 17:35 | 3084168 Snidley Whipsnae
Snidley Whipsnae's picture

I have a question regarding shale oil exploration and extraction... What do we use for drinking water after most of the shale oil is extracted and all of our ground water is contaminated?

I don't know about other folks but I like a little water with my bourbon... well, actually just a few ice cubes.

And I don't believe that drinking water that is flammable is especially good for mammals.

See burning water coming from a kitchen spigot...

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 23:09 | 3085386 Temporalist
Temporalist's picture

When we substitute your own urine and tears for water, using hedonics created specifically for proper CPI calculation, there is no inflation and you will get the hydration you need.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:47 | 3082710 serog
serog's picture

Not obvious to me, I'm just a mechanic trying to protect my savings.  I could go for an explanation.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 23:16 | 3085401 Temporalist
Temporalist's picture

Serog the point is sarcasm.  Why must it be precious metals as the scapegoat day in day out, year in year out, as the asset that is sold.  It need not be, it most certainly shouldn't be, but always is. 

The theory being that the bad money (paper) is trying to drive out the incentive for the good money (precious metals) to make itself prettier.  It's like perfuming a pile of shit; if you don't bother to look you may think it's a rose.


See Polonius' comment below.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:01 | 3082777 agent default
agent default's picture

Because if you cause that kind of waterfall in the stock market particularly during thinly traded times you will be arrested, charged tried and convicted of market manipulation, overnight.  Or shot on the spot by the Feds for "resisting arrest".

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:38 | 3082657 Polonius
Polonius's picture


C'mon people.

Like he said, nobody, not even a margin clerk, dumps size onto a market the way it is consistently dumped on silver and gold comex "markets".  The CFTC is protecting JPM who is acting as agent for the BIS, Fed, Exch Stab Fund and all the central banks in effect doing their damndest to convince the public their paper currency is money good.  Central banks manipulate currencies every day but they announce such intentions.  With silver and gold, the nemesis currencies, they just manipulate and deny.  Only a fool still believes silver and gold comex prices represent a real market.  Tyler, it's about time...

You know what I mean.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:42 | 3082682 buzzsaw99
buzzsaw99's picture

it's a god damned conspiracy lulz lulz lulz [/sarc.]

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:02 | 3082780 Polonius
Polonius's picture

How is it a consipiracy?

It's right out in the open and there are thousands of pages of official documentation to prove it.  Do you think the London Gold Pool was a conspiracy?

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:05 | 3082801 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

You seem to understand corruption and fraud. What part of truth vs conspiracy are you missing?

What is you beef with real money (gold) vs counterfeit (FRN's)?


Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:17 | 3082870 buzzsaw99
buzzsaw99's picture

i understand markets, yes. i also understand that what we have now is not a market but a farce. i also understand that were this a real market with a well regulated currency prices would fluctuate both ways. people here on the other hand cry "fundamentals" when pms go up with levered buying and "conspiracy" when the margin calls come in. I find that amusing.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:21 | 3082893 ParkAveFlasher
ParkAveFlasher's picture

Fundamentals, BS99.

Put the left side of your ruler at Sept 11th, 2001.  Press it to the screen with your pointy finger.  Now rotate the the rest of the ruler until the squiggly lines rest on it.  You did it!  Fundamentals!

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:27 | 3082923 buzzsaw99
buzzsaw99's picture

agreud, 1980s redux coming up!

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:30 | 3082944 ParkAveFlasher
ParkAveFlasher's picture

I'll see you around $130/oz.  Oh that's right, I won't.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:27 | 3082929 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

Yes, but gold has gone up for 12 years in a row despite the "farce" you speak of. Some would call that a "bull market". 


Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:28 | 3082936 buzzsaw99
buzzsaw99's picture

and trees grow to the sky

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 13:02 | 3083125 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

WTF does that mean? LOL.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:39 | 3082659 tooriskytoinvest
tooriskytoinvest's picture
Silver Prices About To Explode: Chinese Demand For Silver Has Exploded, US NIC Report Extremely Positive For Gold And Silver, And JP Morgan Admits That “QE Will Offset Almost All Of Next Year’s Government Deficit”

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:39 | 3082660 Boston
Boston's picture

Year-end holiday clearance sale!

I just bought some more physical.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:40 | 3082669 mdtrader
mdtrader's picture

$110 away from the gold bull market being offically over!

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:41 | 3082679 duo
duo's picture

Exactly.  At a minimum gold has to return less than the SP500.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:50 | 3082718 ParkAveFlasher
ParkAveFlasher's picture

Secular bull market started at $250/oz, ya dummies.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:01 | 3082782 smlbizman
smlbizman's picture

you cannot buy the paper price anywhere ever...the lower spot goes the higher the premium....still 39+ oz on ebay....these smash downs are to send a message to the bigger players that have when they send out end of years they will be flat to negative...hoping clients cash in....

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:09 | 3082829 agent default
agent default's picture

Yes of course how could anybody be so blind.  Because we are in perfectly normal market conditions, it's not as if any lunatic is printing away by the truckload and doing his best to debase the currency.  You are right, bull/bear cycles make perfect sense in the dull stable monetary environment we live in.\sarc

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:27 | 3082900 TWSceptic
TWSceptic's picture

As long as idiots like you are not buying we're not even in bubble phase and I don't have to worry about the end of the bull market.


Any educated gold investor knows that a wall of worry and the occasional sale are to be expected and should be taken advantage of.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:29 | 3082937 Non Passaran
Non Passaran's picture

Yep, and how about that "officially"? LOL.
I'm going to divest all my PMs because the bull market is going to be @officially@ over. Got it!

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:40 | 3082671 Cdad
Cdad's picture

Cdad is a buyer today.  Deeply oversold readings everywhere, every instrument, every segment of the precious metals market.  Sharp reversal your face off style.

Sell some absurdly priced home builder stock against it.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:57 | 3082753 trav777
trav777's picture

dailies suggest that, but the context is overall an intermediate downtrend

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:53 | 3082910 nope-1004
nope-1004's picture

Brilliant analysis of the trend Trav, AFTER it has happened.  I hear the trend in FB from IPO is down.  I'm like you.... can see clearly into the past.


Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:26 | 3082913 Cdad
Cdad's picture

Well...the thing I have learned about chart analysis on silver is meaningless.  These severe price moves have to do with liquidation...and banks otherwise fighting what is one of the most positive supply/demand stories in the market today.  

So I leave to you the moving averages and the technical indicators in the area of silver.  As for me, and when something I believe in is being wildly discounted by criminal syndicate Wall Street bankers, I move to take advantage of the opportunity.

Good luck.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:36 | 3082973 Al Huxley
Al Huxley's picture

True, chart analysis is pretty much meaningless.  That said, buying when the RSI goes under 30 has been a pretty no-brain way to trade paper for metal at a pretty good exchange rate for the last 10 years or so.  So today looks like a pretty good time for a trip to the coin store.  I also really like the fact that the bears are out in full force, explaining how stupid it is to buy pms and how they've been right all along.  I'd really like to hear from Roubini to confirm that the bottom is in, but if the media can drag an 'I told you so' quote out of Buffet or Gartman or someone similar that would do as well.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 19:26 | 3084517 Orly
Orly's picture

Chart analysis is pretty much meaningless...except the RSI.  And the CCI! And Fibonacci.  But not, not the Irish.

Okay, and the Irish...


Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:43 | 3083015 Tuco Benedicto ...
Tuco Benedicto Pacifico Juan Maria Ramirez's picture

Recent declines in the metals markets have been caused by the 47.572-day cycle exponentially-smoothed RSI crossover ratio stochastic variable Bollinger-band flow-channel indicator reaching a second-derivative Fibonacci inflection point.



Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:59 | 3083108 Al Huxley
Al Huxley's picture

Actually, I prefer fundamental 'analysis'.  Tuesday's decline was caused by optimism over possible resolution of the 'fiscal cliff' and a move out of metals into 'risk-on' assets.  Today's decline is caused by pessimism over possible non-resolution of the 'fiscal cliff' and moves out of highly leveraged risk-on metals positions. 


Also, the forecast is for thundershowers in Biloxi this morning.  Metals always sell off aggressively on December 20th if it rains in Biloxi.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:41 | 3082681 AgShaman
AgShaman's picture

Napalm in the morning.....I know this smell

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:42 | 3082686 otto skorzeny
otto skorzeny's picture

wait til low 20s

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:47 | 3082705 Boston
Boston's picture

You don't know it will get there, so why not scale in on the way down.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:45 | 3082698 Dr. Engali
Dr. Engali's picture

Just counted my stacks and they are still there. I'm going to add more today.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:46 | 3082708 drink or die
drink or die's picture

I lost all of mine during a canoe trip last month, I guess I can get more now to replace it.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:03 | 3082788 kralizec
kralizec's picture

I bought more, now I need to schedule another boating trip...  ;)

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:45 | 3082700 eclectic syncretist
eclectic syncretist's picture

It's a good day to buy silver.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:46 | 3082706 Cdad
Cdad's picture

Yes it is.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:50 | 3082719 Karlus
Karlus's picture

If you think today is great, check back a week from now. It will be 15%+ off

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:20 | 3082889 Non Passaran
Non Passaran's picture

Okay genius, so you are selling today, correct?
Or just spewing nonsense, perhaps?

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 13:38 | 3083280 devo
devo's picture

Not really, where are the deals?

I can't find any.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:51 | 3082721 Mr. Hudson
Mr. Hudson's picture

Gold has also dropped like a rock. Silver follows gold. How can the Central Bankers manipulate gold when the whole world is drooling for more gold?

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:03 | 3082789 Polonius
Polonius's picture

By being immune from CFTC concentration limits on the comex, that's how.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:49 | 3083049 Winston Churchill
Winston Churchill's picture

Unregulated ,and unenforced naked shorting makes it easy.

They can push the price down, and not even pay margin calls.

Nice work if you can get it.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:51 | 3083058 Nothing To See Here
Nothing To See Here's picture

It's all about the comex yeah. The world may want gold, as long as they don't ask for delivery, the central banks have control over the price with their paper gold game.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:40 | 3082992 Al Huxley
Al Huxley's picture

Because it's only gold that you dig out of the ground that has a finite supply.  Luckily for the CBs, the majority of the buying community still accepts the paper version as a legitimate proxy for the real thing.  And the paper version is in infinite supply.  So it's really easy for the bullion banks to short 'gold' because they have an infinite supply of 'gold' while their momo-chasing counterparties have a limited supply of paper money to manage, so they eventually have to sell. 


Its just a matter of 2 sides playing a game, but only one side knows the rules.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 15:05 | 3083631 Banjo
Banjo's picture

They can manipulate gold by selling paper.

Of the tiny amount of investors who have gold think how many have some piece of paper promising to deliver. Ouchies :)

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:50 | 3082722 Vincent Vega
Vincent Vega's picture

Ho Ho Ho Merry Christmas to me!

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:54 | 3082739 docmac324
docmac324's picture

It is that time of year, to buy.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:56 | 3082744 JustObserving
JustObserving's picture

as it is very clear that whoever is 'selling' is entirely price-insensitive.

When you can print all the money you want, why should you care about price?  The Fed has already printed $2500 billion since 2008 and will print $3060 billion over the next 3 years at $85 billion a month.

Here is the breakdown so far which will be followed by the $85 billion a month printing for 3 years (minimum estimate to get unemployment down to 6.5%):

Since 2008, the Fed has engaged in three rounds of unconventional large-scale asset purchases, known as quantitative easing. In the first round, QE1, from November 2008 to March 2010, it bought $1.75 trillion in long-term Treasuries and other securities, the Richmond Fed said. In QE2, from November 2010 through June 2011, it bought $600 billion in long-term Treasuries. QE3 has been under way since September 2012, with the Fed buying $40 billion each month in mortgage-backed securities.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:57 | 3082748 savagegoose
savagegoose's picture

its like a lovley yellow and white xmas, and i dont mean pee on the snow. happy fucken santas birthday everyone. may your stockings be full of stackings.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:59 | 3082757 punxsutawney phil
punxsutawney phil's picture

nothing moves in a straight line (except spoos).  Gold repricing and going to trace lower to clean out the weak retail longs. 

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:00 | 3082765 Quinvarius
Quinvarius's picture

I had to lighten up on stocks in favor of metals today.  Stocks are just a sidebar to my hyperinfltion thesis.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:01 | 3082772 Al Capowned
Al Capowned's picture

I reckon it could go further yet, based on last years December pattern but either way i will be staggering purchases on the way down,.... Bichez!

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:01 | 3082773 Xue
Xue's picture

Central bankers want us to sell our PM and buy AMZN. 3100 P/E, yummy !

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:01 | 3082778 A. Magnus
A. Magnus's picture

Dammit! And I thought I bought at a good price when silver hit its 200 day moving average back on November 2nd! Is there a way to tell in advance when the scumfuckers plan a price beat down to assist my stacking endeavors?

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 13:45 | 3083304 Toolshed
Toolshed's picture

Don't sweat it man. Nowadays buying pm's is not an's INSURANCE!!!!

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 18:38 | 3084348 Jendrzejczyk
Jendrzejczyk's picture

They're ALWAYS planning a price smackdown.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:04 | 3082791 fuu
fuu's picture

A spoonful of Paulson helps the DCA go down, the DCA go down, the DCA go down.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:05 | 3082798 realtick
realtick's picture

By the end of 2012 TF Metals will no longer exist, except maybe as a prepper site:

"Well, what are ya gonna do? I suppose you can be angry with me and everyone else because I certainly don't know of anyone who saw this coming."


Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:13 | 3082854 fuu
fuu's picture


Link pimping, serious business.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:06 | 3082814 darteaus
darteaus's picture

Silver in the 20's!

Buy on momemtum stop.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 12:11 | 3082844 virgilcaine
virgilcaine's picture

Po mans gold better than rich man paper.

Do NOT follow this link or you will be banned from the site!