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Here Comes The Student Loan Bailout

Tyler Durden's picture


2012 is the year the student loan bubble finally popped. While on one hand the relentlessly rising total Federal student debt crossed $956 billion as of September 30, and was growing at a pace that will have put it over $1 trillion by the end of 2012, the one data point confirming the size, severity and ultimately bursting of this latest debt bubble was the disclosure in late November by the Fed that the percentage of 90+ day delinquent loans soared from under 9% to 11% in one quarter.

Which is why we were not surprised to learn that the Federal government has now delivered yet another bailout program: this time focusing not on banks, or homeowners who bought McMansions and decided to not pay their mortgage, but on those millions of Americans, aged 18 to 80, that are drowning in student debt - debt, incidentally, which has been used to pay for drugs, motorcycles, games, tattoos, not to mention countless iProducts. Which also means that since there is no free lunch, all that will happen is that even more Federal Debt will be tacked on to replace discharged student debt loans, up to the total $1 trillion which will promptly soar far higher as more Americans take advantage of this latest government handout. But when the US will already have $22 trillion in debt this time in four years, who really is counting? After all, "it is only fair" that the taxpayer funded "free for all" bonanza must go on.

The latest debt bailout, not surprisingly is not titled "Yet another taxpayer funded bailout for those who bought things they can't afford on credit" as that would not be very politically prudent, especially for those politicians who still have taxpaying citizens as their voters. Instead, its name is the much more PC: "Pay as You Earn Repayment Plan." Alas, it really should be called the former, because what it does is it incentivizes Americans to borrow even more Federal student loans, well aware that there will now always be a cap on the associated monthly interest payment which will never leave a mark regardless what the full underlying loan notional is. It also provides for full debt discharge should the borrowers end up with cushy Federal jobs - because the one thing the US government needs afford is more debt-saddled government workers.

What is the "Pay as You Earn Repayment Plan"? The WSJ explains:

A new federal program should make it easier for some recent college graduates to keep their student-loan payments manageable.

The new option, known as the "Pay as You Earn Repayment Plan," lets eligible borrowers sharply lower their monthly loan payments and qualify for loan forgiveness quicker than they might otherwise.

"It's a very good safety net for students who borrow too much," says Mark Kantrowitz, publisher of the financial-aid site "If your debt exceeds your annual income, you will probably benefit."


Pay as You Earn, which took effect on Dec. 21, "is designed to help offset the effects of the recession for student borrowers most likely to take a hit in this tough job market," says Lauren Asher, president of the Institute for College Access and Success, which has pushed for the creation of income-based repayment plans.

Which in the New Normal, means everyone with a student loan will benefit. It also means, that courtesy of knowing this safety net is there, more and more people will take advantage of the government's latest generosity with other taxpayer's money.

What are the terms of this new bailout?

The new program comes at a time when rising student-loan balances—amid a still shaky job market—have weighed heavily on many families.


Typically, federal student loans must be repaid within 10 years. At current interest rates, that can work out to a monthly payment of roughly $300 for a borrower with $26,000 in debt.


Pay as You Earn, by contrast, limits student-loan payments to 10% of "discretionary income" as defined by government formulas. Borrowers who make regular payments could have the remaining unpaid amounts forgiven after 20 years.

So much for student debt being non-dischargeable: borrow hundreds of thousands, but make your monthly payment of a hundred or so bucks, and in 20 years you will be debt free, courtesy of US taxpayers. Actually, scratch that: one doesn't even have to make a payment!

In some cases, borrowers with low incomes could be required to make a zero-dollar payment and would still be considered current on their loan. Monthly payments can increase or decrease each year based on the borrower's income and family size.

For those who think getting full debt forgiveness in 20 years is far too long, why there's a loophole for that too: just go "work" for Uncle Sam:

Borrowers with public-service jobs may qualify for loan forgiveness after just 10 years.

As for eligibility "constraints":

To be eligible for the program, borrowers must have taken out their first federal student loan after Sept. 30, 2007, and received at least one federal student loan after Sept. 30, 2011. Borrowers also must meet eligibility cutoffs based on the size of their debt, their discretionary income and family size.


The U.S. Department of Education's Pay As You Earn calculator, available at, can help you determine if you qualify. Borrowers can apply for the program online or by contacting the loan servicer that collects their payments on behalf of the federal government.

In other words, virtually all people who were responsible for the diagonal take off in the Federal student loan total in the current depression are now eligible for what will eventually be full debt discharge.

So let's get this straight:

  1. go to some "everyone who applies is admitted" community college
  2. take on the biggest Federal loan one can get
  3. use the proceeds for everything besides the tuition (of course)
  4. be unable to find a job after graduation (naturally)
  5. plead poverty, accusing evil employers who don't hire those who majored in Foosball, and make "zero" payments while remaining in "compliance"
  6. get a job working for the government, wait ten years, and have the entire loan magically disappear.

And there it is: incentives for the common, and very much broke, man in the New Normal.

If there is anyone out there who thinks this will not result in a "charge it" feeding frenzy and that the Federal student loan total will not go absolutely parabolic going forward, please raise your hand.

Of course, what is not discussed, is who is on the other side of all those forgiven loans. And the answer, dear taxpaying US readers, is starting at you in the mirror. Because all the Federal government will do is transfer the unfunded obligation, which has already been used to satisfy the purchase of goods and services, from one individual to the whole group.

But when one is dealing with the government of a country that is no longer even fit to be defined as "banana", what is adding one more trillion between already insolvent counterparties.

Finally, yes, this means the Fed just tacked on one more year of QE to its $1 trillion/year in US debt monetization, which also means the Fed's balance sheet will now also be used for to fund student loan forgiveness, among so many other things.

Insolvent students of the world, unite!


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Sat, 01/05/2013 - 16:03 | 3125549 Uber Vandal
Uber Vandal's picture

Quite often, I find I am not sure if I woke up in the Twilight Zone or an episode of Sliders.....

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 16:07 | 3125556 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

I got my degree in my pajamas... [& after that I made money by being in 'Girls Gone Wild in Cancun' videos]...

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 16:20 | 3125584 ratso
ratso's picture

After GHWB and Congress made it impossible to clear student loans from one's debts in bankruptcy,  predatory educational institutiions and lenders have taken advantage of this involuntary servitude which now enslaves thousands of young people. 

Why should only corporations, municipalities  and the cleverly rich be able to file effective bankruptcies?


Sat, 01/05/2013 - 16:31 | 3125608 AldousHuxley
AldousHuxley's picture

because rich people want workers and society to take the burden of education cost and risk of specialization so that employable human resources are free for their disposal "at will".


privatize profits, socialize losses as well as costs

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 16:35 | 3125619 urwright
urwright's picture

What's the problem?  You actually think you understand the COST!

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 17:48 | 3125826 knukles
knukles's picture

This is all such horseshit.
All's needed is a small bag of the new fangled platinum coins that guy Krugman keeps talkin' about.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 18:11 | 3125867 A Lunatic
A Lunatic's picture

Indeed, only rather than platinum, I suggest we make the coin out of chocolate and then we eat the mother fucking thing. See, no more debt...............

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 19:20 | 3125983 derek_vineyard
derek_vineyard's picture

those who walked away from homes are now back in multitudes buying homes with federal loans  (only had to sit out of housing for 3 years)

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 20:31 | 3126120 boogerbently
boogerbently's picture

Call me crazy, but shouldn't we pay off the old debts we can't afford before adding to them?

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 20:37 | 3126135 AldousHuxley
AldousHuxley's picture

debt roll over

swap high interest with lower interest debt

allows idiot execs and banksters to continue the game little longer...

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 21:07 | 3126202 Vampyroteuthis ...
Vampyroteuthis infernalis's picture

I would rather have average folks get a bailout instead of just douche-bag banksters. Good luck qualifying for this!

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 22:09 | 3126296 Texas Ginslinger
Texas Ginslinger's picture

Tyler = Dudge

"..blah...blah...but on those millions of Americans, aged 18 to 80, that are drowning in student debt - debt, incidentally, which has been used to pay for drugs, motorcycles, games, tattoos, not to mention countless iProducts..."

Laughable that you compare Apple products to drugs.

Assuming that you use a pc, how often do you have to reimage the piece of shit..??


Sat, 01/05/2013 - 22:32 | 3126330 hungrydweller
hungrydweller's picture

Loser.  You actually think that including iGadgets was the intent of the post.  Eat your Cheetos and spunk somewhere else fuckweed.

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 09:54 | 3126791 GetZeeGold
GetZeeGold's picture




I'm thinking that Texas douche.....must be from around Austin. You really can't classify that place as Texas though.

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 14:24 | 3127270 knowless
knowless's picture

his comments used to be better, his stance that the cpi and other bls data weren't being grossly manipulated sort of shut him up after a while though.

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 22:12 | 3128438 3.7.77
3.7.77's picture

This is ginslinger not gunslinger

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 22:34 | 3126335 hungrydweller
hungrydweller's picture

Dudge?!!  What a drumass!

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 22:49 | 3126357 Doomer
Doomer's picture

They are comparable because they all have nothing to do with getting an education.

Now go pull your head out of your ass, and lay off the gin.

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 09:56 | 3126839 centerline
centerline's picture

Real asswipe statement TG.  Everyone here has noticed the iThings have become the centifugal bubble puppy of the last few years.

Apple products are excellent.  No doubt.  But are the epitome of rapant, hedonistic consumerism - with a typical following that sounds more paid marketing for Apple than anything else.  Hence, deserving to be listed as Tyler put it.

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 14:29 | 3127282 knowless
knowless's picture

they also market directly to college students through their schools with minor discounts, i'm assuming that they know full well that most of the people buying their products are doing so with student loans... soooo..

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 14:37 | 3127296 HardAssets
HardAssets's picture

Drugs ? 

Ever watch a teenager stare mindlessly at their various iGadgets ?  (The ones with all the nice tracking software). 

Back in the day, when I went to college, we spent our money on important things . . . like kegs of beer.

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 13:35 | 3127159 linrom
linrom's picture

For Christ sake, he is Pete Peterson.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 22:56 | 3126361 Doomer
Doomer's picture

You do realize the douche-bag bankers get the money, right?

It is always the same, some fools and the bankers that lent them money both get bailed out.

Not to mention supporting a vast higher education complex that is turning out graduates with fancy, expensive degrees with no prospects.

This is just infuriating.



Sun, 01/06/2013 - 11:14 | 3126917 847328_3527
847328_3527's picture

Doomer is correct! This 'student bailout' is nothing more then another bank bailout recharacterized as 'helping the poor students.'

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 13:43 | 3127170 jeff montanye
jeff montanye's picture

the old way of directly subsidizing public education through college was too inefficient: the bankers didn't get enough of the money.

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 11:33 | 3126939 centerline
centerline's picture

True.  But let's look at an even bigger picture...  the system MUST derive yield.  Or it dies.  It requires new debt to be created, and at an increasing pace.  Hence, the need for massive population growth.

Problem is that the system was terminal from it's birth - just like us.  It reached it's practical organic maximum potential (given various global constraints, resources, etc.) a little over a decade ago at least.  So, in order to sustain the system, TPTB needed to cram down more debt.  The answer on how to do this?  Bubbles.  A whole new paradigm of economic behavior.

This particular student loan debacle is simply the next big bubble.  Could be the last bubble.

All bubbles prey on human vices.  Usually greed.  This one is particularly evil because it leverages the average person's inability to reconcile and face reality.  It preys on fear.  No one wants to face a period of decline.  No one wants to find themselves unemployed and thinking thier profession is dead.  No one wants to think that thier kids will do worse than them in terms of standard of living as measured by what we call "normal."

And now, quite cleverly, this bubble most likely has been given new life.  Not just by can kicking on the payments - which surely will be backstopped via more monetization - but also by creating new incentive for additional debt.  The new motivation being a mix of greed, fear, and "playing the system."  But, as we all know... once J6P figures out how to play the system...

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 13:37 | 3127161 linrom
linrom's picture

Hello, Hypertiger

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 15:51 | 3127480 centerline
centerline's picture

lol.  That's certainly not me!  But thanks!

I have read some of HT stuff though.  Mostly the newer stuff over the last couple of years.  There are a few of us around here who are on a similar page...wavelength.  Not doomers by any means.  Just trying really hard to see the truth for whatever it is.

I read alot - and try to seek out all sorts of different theories about how our world really operates.  I then do my own best to keep an open mind and use each of those "frameworks" to see how well the facts seem to fit.  HT's framework tends to match up better than most others.  It is also "broad" enough to allow many more detailed explainations to work as compliments.

What I like most about HT though is his use of simple terms that are easy to discuss.


Sun, 01/06/2013 - 14:41 | 3127308 HardAssets
HardAssets's picture

THANK YOU for saying it !   The people in this country are do damned f*cking dumb that they'll buy any line of bull.  We're heading full speed into feudalistic socialism/fascism and the dopes will think its all about  'helping the people'.

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 01:43 | 3126599 WTFUD
WTFUD's picture

Ah [sigh] booger. . . the fact is there is no intention to pay off the debt. . . all the Johns & classical academics have done the fracking sums. . .only Plan Z remains ; to keep the Greastest ever Ponzi alive by feeding fresh blood until we are all zombies. . .just like in japan.
for ref type Olympus Ex CEO exposes or read his book. . . the hostility by the MSM towards him for daring to expose Zombie multinationals is testament to what else lurks out there in the shadows. . .best we dont know us mugs. . . for it's sure to be coming or more likely arrived in one of your own backyards. . .biggest laugh i get is the Myth constantly spoused on c flem bc. . . . . . regarding ALL THAT FIAT CASH RESTING ON THE SIDELINES. . .burning a hole in big business pockets. . .just awaiting fiscal cliff or new tax con or growth or War or pick your own or pick'n'mix. .

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 14:33 | 3127289 knowless
knowless's picture

eventually they will completely undermine family formation, classic attribute of a slave population: no family ties.

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 12:07 | 3126999 unrulian
unrulian's picture

I'll eat it....and I'll be back withyour interest in the morning

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 18:47 | 3125923 Bicycle Repairman
Bicycle Repairman's picture

Yes this adds to the debt.  But who's going to have to pay the debt?  The children.  So it's fair.


Sat, 01/05/2013 - 19:24 | 3125972 Michaelwiseguy
Michaelwiseguy's picture

Oh my poor dear Bicycle Repairman. It's 100% guaranteed, No one is ever going to pay back the national debt, it's just too much. Everybody knows that, even those with a sub-standard American education.


I figured out what the end game for the USA is;

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 20:35 | 3126078 Michaelwiseguy
Michaelwiseguy's picture

A followup to David Wilcock and Drake Interview;

A conversation with Heather Tucci-Jarraf, Trustee of The One People's Public Trust  
You have the Right to know

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 00:45 | 3126522 Ralph Spoilsport
Ralph Spoilsport's picture

David Wilcock and Drake Interview? Wilcock is a gullible twit as evidenced by believing in this fraud calling himself Drake. For instance, Wilcock bought into the embarassing debacle of Ben Fulford and Drake predicting that all the TBTF bankster crooks will be arrested and beaten senseless by all the martial artists in the world uniting and flying business class to the US to set things right for us. Didn't happen did it. Neither was the earth destroyed by the planet Nibiru as these idiots predicted.

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 00:54 | 3126549 knukles
knukles's picture

But they're right so far about our Reptilian Overlords remaining silent, invisible and hidden behind the scenes so no one can see or hear them and prove they really are in control!





sarc/ (As if necessary, then again some folks are gullible, ya' know?)


For sale, special offer, nictating membrane softener, eliminates that rapid give away blinking...

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 01:00 | 3126558 Ralph Spoilsport
Ralph Spoilsport's picture

Are there any more of these cool sunglasses left?

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 01:50 | 3126603 Michaelwiseguy
Michaelwiseguy's picture

Don't bore me with talk of reptilians. You have to truly understand the spiritual energy literally within you, where, why, and how it exists. You can only get a sense of it if you can sit through all 4.5 hours of this video.

(-Marko Rodin Lecture-) Vortex Based Mathematics

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 02:07 | 3126618 Ralph Spoilsport
Ralph Spoilsport's picture

Howya doin' with your chakras? The path to enlightenment is not without risk. Attempting to utilize vortex math to transfer ki for later use in the next bardo will fuck your shit right up.

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 02:54 | 3126651 Michaelwiseguy
Michaelwiseguy's picture

I'm learning how to use the power within me for defensive purposes. Everyone has the right to protect themselves and their own natural rights using this tool. I'm also exploring how to use it in a collective consciousness way to multiply the effectiveness of the energy against our enemies and those who wish to enslave us.  It seems to be working pretty well so far. Just learning about the power within you makes it easier for you to sleep at night and walk without fear. It's not a good idea to use the power in any way that may offend the Creator, unless you don't mind going to an eternal death when you die.

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 09:59 | 3126840 GetZeeGold
GetZeeGold's picture




Everyone has the right to protect themselves


Not according to Obama and Feinstein.

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 14:36 | 3127294 Michaelwiseguy
Michaelwiseguy's picture

That old slave master cunt Feinstein will be dead soon enough of old age and Obama is out of our lives in 4 years. 

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 21:20 | 3126219 Bicycle Repairman
Bicycle Repairman's picture

No, no no, the accursed babies boomers loaded all this debt on the children and grand children.  Now the children are loading debt on the children and grandchildren.


Sat, 01/05/2013 - 22:30 | 3126321 Michaelwiseguy
Michaelwiseguy's picture

Virtually all the baby boomers will be dead in 20 years.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 22:50 | 3126355 Bicycle Repairman
Bicycle Repairman's picture

Over the next 20 years the piling on of debt which began with the greatest generation will largely be done by Gens X & Y.  They'll change exactly nothing.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 23:30 | 3126398 Michaelwiseguy
Michaelwiseguy's picture

Nothing needs to be changed at this point. Every fiat currency fails without exception. The US currency will fail in a couple months to a couple years at most. It will be an absolutely spectacular event never seen before in history.

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 10:04 | 3126845 centerline
centerline's picture

Flawed concept of the mechanism of change.

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 00:46 | 3126534 conspicio
conspicio's picture

They'll be dead sooner than that under Obamacare (ah, but I joke...). And the debt laden youth of today (and those yet to be born, if they make it past the Planned Parenthood trip) will have little qualms voting the shit out of that "eldercare euthanasia/rationed care/death panel" crap in droves once the issue is framed in the sloganized 160 characters or less hashtagged hipster lingo they eat up like an 80s blow whore and spun across some youtube viral along with .com anything. Get the fuck outta the way and die already granny! You're sucking up MY air, now you old bag! #yourdebtisyourdeatholdhag

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 15:02 | 3127344 HardAssets
HardAssets's picture

"No, no no, the accursed babies boomers loaded all this debt on the children and grand children. Now the children are loading debt on the children and grandchildren."

You don't get it.

The value of peoples dollars have been reduced by 96% through bankster money printing. They raided the soc sec 'trust fund' that was supposed to be for retirement.

There was a great rip off of the material resources of the population to a very small group of banksters, corporate insiders, and their paid off government whores. 

And now they blame those who got the shaft for the debt & cry that we need 'austerity' ?   How dumb are people to buy that line ?

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 02:12 | 3126621 WTFUD
WTFUD's picture

sorry MwiseG for not reading your post before responding to mr. wakethefuckup ; promise not to make that mistake again.

Those further education colleges and universities public & private alike specialising in sheep dip courses as per TD's comments ( you know the ones financed by the ( taxpayer ) Gubberment; are they entitled to bailouts in much the sameness as GM, TBTF etc etc? If yes then could you maybe come up with a rough figure, including the unemployed ( real totals please ) as to what % or proportion of the population are subsidised ( in ) directly by the Gubba!; maybe a graph going forward also for good luck. cheers

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 11:57 | 3126983 DanP1966
DanP1966's picture

OR.....nobody will pay the debt at all.

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 14:57 | 3127334 HardAssets
HardAssets's picture

Screw the made-up-out-of-thin-air 'debt'.

Theyve had 100 years to undermine the value of our dollars and to steal from the taxpayers.

They owe us.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 16:55 | 3125666 chubbar
chubbar's picture

Just look where this is going though. Right now if someone gets a full ride scholarship in ROTC or a military college, they owe roughly 5-8 years back in the service depending on the program they go in on. They don't owe a dime after their initial commitment.

Doesn't this start to look a lot like that program? So someone (with shitty grades) can essentially pick some party college, fuck off the whole time and run up potentially 200K+ in loans living the life of reilly and in the end gets it forgiven in 10 years. Or, 20 years of no payments if he runs out, knocks up his girlfriend and gets a shitty job because he never studied or cared about getting a useful education. That model even starts to look like the generational welfare families we see in the ghetto, except these guys get to stick the gov't/FED with 200K right off the bat. Just fucking WOW! What kind of college professor jobs program is this? Fuck, I might even go back to college myself. Hell, the whole country would be signing up for that program.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 17:06 | 3125697 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

N N Taleb, in his new book Antifragile, takes aim at debt, bailouts and many other fragile systems.  The student debt problems is yet another of a long series of big government errors that have been allowed to go too long.  I continue to explore more ideas in Taleb's new book.  Bad ideas, like bad parts of any system, should be eliminated.


Sat, 01/05/2013 - 17:16 | 3125742 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

The last thing this is, is an error. It is absolutely purposeful. You just may not like the purpose.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 17:27 | 3125771 phyuckyiu
phyuckyiu's picture

"Once you’ve initially qualified for Pay As You Earn, you may continue to make payments under the plan even if you no longer have a partial financial hardship."

From the website. Being broke ftw.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 17:56 | 3125838 negative rates
negative rates's picture

The last I heard, sally hunts you down for principle and interest. So $7000 @7% for over say 30 years, is about $55,000 and you say you ain't got no money, and ain't got no job, but you want to retire back home nice and comfy. Support wild life, vote for a politician!  

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 19:33 | 3126011 phyuckyiu
phyuckyiu's picture

"Pay based on what you earn—Under Pay As You Earn, your monthly payment amount will be 10 percent of your discretionary income, will never be more than the amount you would be required to pay under the 10-year Standard Repayment Plan, and may be less than under other repayment plans."

From the horse's mouth. -Never- more than 10% of -DISCRETIONARY- income. I think i'm going to major in hydroponics at my local community college, you can retake these classes 3 times (it used to be more gasp) before they finally tell you to grow up, right? Man this is gonna be fun.

P.S. Feel free to garnish my Social Security i'll never see to get your money back.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 20:32 | 3126121 AldousHuxley
AldousHuxley's picture

get rid of H1B and half of college administrators and watch aMerican kids get jobs and cheaper education.

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 02:25 | 3126635 John_Coltrane
John_Coltrane's picture

Won't work.  Hard to replace a physical scientist or engineer with an accountant, lawyer, massage therapist, psychologist or fine arts major.  Americans are too lazy and/or stupid to major in the hard sciences where there are so many unfilled positions.  That's why the H1Bs are necessary.  Just look up the how few technical degrees are obtained by Americans now-a-days.

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 10:15 | 3126854 pods
pods's picture

H1Bs are necessary to fill the need for highly qualified, low paid workers.

Nothing more.  


Sun, 01/06/2013 - 17:58 | 3126967 loneranger
loneranger's picture



The foriegn student program for graduate programs has been subsidized by the US govt. for many, many years.  See the research from George Borjas :

Naturally, when the government subsidizes a program it creates a surplus of workers in a field and wages therefore go down.  While the insentive to obtain a gradute degree in math or science from someone in India or China is still great, it is not so great for US students.  The flood of graduate degrees in math and science has greatly depressed the average wage of the IT workers and made decent jobs in these fields very scarce.  

The H1B program should have been stopped years ago.  It is a subsidy for bloated universities and corporations that demand to fill seats and supply cheap labor at the cost of the US taxpayer and future generations.

These 'hard science' jobs are hardly that anyhow.  Very little of what one does in these jobs on a day to day has anything to do with even basic math and more to do with ass kissing and sucking up to those who hold the wallet.

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 13:42 | 3127167 linrom
linrom's picture

H1Bs are the reason why Americans don't study science and engineering. They figure that you must be a dumb twit to go into those fields.

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 15:25 | 3127400 Blankenstein
Blankenstein's picture

Baloney.  At least as far back as the 70s and 80s kids weren't interested in studying math and science in middle school and high school, let alone study it in college.  It wasn't cool enough, it was for nerds.  Instead most were wanting to be the cheerleaders or jocks and up-to-date on the current pop culture.  Then many who went to college wanted to be managers and stock brokers and earn the big bucks not giving a flip about learning and increasing their knowledge.  

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 17:52 | 3127752 loneranger
loneranger's picture

Not true.  These government sponsored programs go back to the 80's and possibly further back.  Wages in these fields have been surpressed for decades.

Get the government out of the way so that the market can determine what a fair wage is for engineering and science programs.  If engineers could make a decent living with job security then kids would line up for jobs requiring advanced degrees in math and science.

In fact, you made the point is well known that managers, stock brokers and others make far more money.

Until those with 'knowledge' are also rewarded financially for having that will (as they should) stay away from dead end careers...where you can be replaced by H1Bs and outsourced labor.  In fact the decision to replace those scientist and engineers is made BY THOSE WITH MANAGEMENT DEGREES.

We can not say anything about how lazy a generation is without first asking ourselves how their behavior was impacted by a government subsidized/manipulated market.


Sun, 01/06/2013 - 11:55 | 3126979 caconhma
caconhma's picture

The only question is: How long will this shit continue? How long will our Chinese friends continue funding our prosperity?

The country supporting parasites and and destroying its productive capacities is doomed. This becomes the Soviet Union II where people stop working. There is no reasong to do anything productive including getting real education!

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 22:30 | 3126320 duo
duo's picture

why can't I do "pay as you earn" for child support and alimony?

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 14:46 | 3127317 knowless
knowless's picture

because women are generally more supplicative to the state? men must be suppressed. (just in general, biological/uneducated scale) goverment needs to be the father/husband, the state will undermine and usurp, for it's benefit, all structures of authority.


divorce maintenance payments go to the state then from the state, they determine what comes in and what goes out, after they take their cut..

it's best to avoid a state "marriage license," also try to avoid whores.


just saying is all. tired of watching men broken by this shit.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 18:58 | 3125945 LeisureSmith
LeisureSmith's picture

Tranquilize Restless Angry Population Program or TRAPP for short.

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 09:15 | 3126799 chaartist
chaartist's picture

In a while they will use this leverage and give free homes and loan forgiveness to everyone wanted to die in foreign resource based invasions or against hungry home uprising coming soon without media coverage.


Sat, 01/05/2013 - 17:19 | 3125751 QQQBall
QQQBall's picture


Government Error is redundant

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 20:14 | 3126087 AldousHuxley
AldousHuxley's picture

government error = accidental correct answer?

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 16:05 | 3127514 HardAssets
HardAssets's picture

Yeah, that guy seems to actually think that its all a 'black swan' accident that these crashes happen.  What a load of crap.

Its like the 'investigations' after the Crash of 29.  They came up with all sorts of b.s. cycle theories and other excuses without looking at the priimary role of central banks. Their findiings weren't an 'accident' either.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 17:20 | 3125755 AldousHuxley
AldousHuxley's picture

debt = servitude.


now smart motivated youngsters (who usually starts social revolutions) are now in servitude of status quo via debt and only way to redeem themselves would be to work for the rich or die for the rich via military service.



Sat, 01/05/2013 - 17:26 | 3125770 ShrNfr
ShrNfr's picture

So don't sell yourself into servitude stupid.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 17:33 | 3125785 Cathartes Aura
Cathartes Aura's picture


servitude begins in the mind, and if one is willing to serve to get what they're told they "want/need" then that's what the nation will have, serve-ants.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 20:17 | 3126093 AldousHuxley
AldousHuxley's picture

well it is either student debt slavery or nothing since manufacturing got offshored and manual labor is done by illegals for shitty pay.


serve-ants can't free themselves. Another master has to rescue them. Lincoln's factory masters wanted blue collar workers, so he freed the agricultural serve-ants in the south from plantation masters.

Only way to win is have  a massive regime change.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 20:47 | 3126172 Cathartes Aura
Cathartes Aura's picture

I don't believe it's ever just "either/or" - there are so many ways to exist in the world, one merely needs to stop looking to the dominate system for answers, and get creative.

waiting for a "massive regime change" is like voting - it's the least you can do, just sitting back and moaning about the way things are, and relying on a system to provide for you, mentally and/or otherwise.


Sat, 01/05/2013 - 23:43 | 3126418 Mudduckk
Mudduckk's picture

I do manual labor Hux. Born and raised US citizen. Seven years of post hs ed. Two degrees. one BS and one MS. I do it because I like it. I get paid to do it because peeps like my service and I charge a reasonable price. So I have my own biz. its a stratiegic good fit. I cant be fired. the work is essential. the work cannot be offshored. and if in ten years time when my kids are grown enough to work and job market still sucks and the government is even further along in full retard mode, my kids will have a place to work.

its not hopeless as you make it. in fact i see others around making the same choice. not all gardeners are mexican. in fact ive seen a few all female crews. they do it cuz they like it. they be brown schewddy and filthy but still babealishious. if you want it bad enough, you do the work. man i want on that crew.

 save the regeime change bs and get a job. ya hippie!


ps btw did not down arrow u.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 19:03 | 3125951 Cugel
Cugel's picture

The trouble is that reckless borrowers bid up the cost of services to the point where they are unaffordable without reckless borrowing. Fair or not, a degree is a check box on a lot of HR lists.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 19:19 | 3125985 logically possible
logically possible's picture

I would consider it reckless lending that bids up the cost of services. Without reckless lenders, you would not have reckless borrowers. Looks just like the housing bubble and every other government subsidized program when you look at it that way.

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 10:05 | 3126846 TruthHunter
TruthHunter's picture

What's left out of this analysis, it the other side of the bubble.   The schools aren't interested in efficiency either.

The cost of education has been growing much faster than inflation.

The fact is the present educational model is obsolete. With modern technology, the cost can be a fraction

of what it is now.  

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 02:29 | 3126639 John_Coltrane
John_Coltrane's picture

But not just any old degree.  You need to know how to actually do something-especially problem solve.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 20:07 | 3126071 FoeHammer
FoeHammer's picture

Huffing Unicorn farts from Grade 1-12 in a public school setting doesn't allow for critical thinking. There are plently of folks that are/were effectively being brainwashed. You don't know any different as a fucking kid. Not to say the kids are blameless either...

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 20:36 | 3126131 AldousHuxley
AldousHuxley's picture

critical thinking happens AFTER college

when students start thinking about the bullshit 16 years of education they went through and can't get a job to pay the loan off, while foreigners get free college degrees by their native governments and get jobs in USA.



Sat, 01/05/2013 - 20:45 | 3126164 nmewn
nmewn's picture

"critical thinking happens AFTER college"

Are you fucking high right now?

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 17:35 | 3125789 August
August's picture

With zero knowledge of history or ethics, and plenty of gaming experience, America's collegians will prove to be optimal pilots for those 30,000 drones soon to be dominating the Homeland's airspace.

Lon Horiuchi was a fag.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 20:34 | 3126127 Salon
Salon's picture

No statute of limitations on crimes against humanity.

He shot and killed a woman holding a baby.

He saw her through his sniperscope. It was no accident.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 21:02 | 3126193 nmewn
nmewn's picture

Yes...there is no statute of limitations for murder.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 23:48 | 3126431 Freddie
Freddie's picture

Many Americans have not forgotten who Lon is.   Someday......

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 00:43 | 3126525 Ralph Spoilsport
Ralph Spoilsport's picture

Damn right. Someday.

“Pound-for-pound, component-for-component, dollar- for-dollar, you will not find a better rifle,” says the new spokesman for H-S Precision in Rapid City. His name is Lon Horiuchi, a government assassin who retired from the FBI in 2006. AFP called to ask him if this was also the weapon he used to blow away the face of Vicki Weaver at the remote area of Ruby Ridge in Idaho in 1992, but he did not return the calls.

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 01:55 | 3126607 August
August's picture

AFP called to ask him if this was also the weapon he used to blow away the face of Vicki Weaver at the remote area of Ruby Ridge in Idaho in 1992, but he did not return the calls.

Thanks for posting this information, which was news to me; apparently LH retired from the FBI in 2008 (very likely on disabilty due his own post-traumatic stress), and has moved into the private sector, selling sniper systems to the feds.

May a slow, humiliating and painful death find you, Lon.  Food poisoning, or whatever.


Sun, 01/06/2013 - 01:59 | 3126611 Edelweiss
Edelweiss's picture

  I remember watching events unfold in the news at Ruby Ridge, and Waco.  It still makes me angry.  The media, at the time, villified the Weavers' and Koresh's group.  If you remember the commentary in the MSM, you'll recall that the attitude was one of "they did it to themselves".  In both cases the govt was clearly the aggressor.  The way those situations were handled opened my eyes to the violence the state is willing to, and capable of directing at us. 

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 20:39 | 3128215 boogerbently
boogerbently's picture

So, Is David Koresh/Branch Davidians some sort of martyr/heroes, now?

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 01:40 | 3126596 Son of Loki
Son of Loki's picture

Raging Airplane Passenger Duct Taped to Seat



The pitfalls of apparently mixing alcohol and air travel were taken to a new level when an evidently intoxicated man was constrained to his seat with duct tape on an international flight.

Iceland Air said the man went on a rampage on a New Year's Eve flight from Reykjavik to New York, hitting, screaming at and spitting on other passengers.

Passengers took matter into their own hands, taping the man to his seat.

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 13:04 | 3127110 swmnguy
swmnguy's picture

Great.  Now the TSA will start taking away any tape I have in my carry-on.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 21:13 | 3126207 CheapBastard
CheapBastard's picture

EBT people rushing to go to school and max out their loans while living in their Section 8 housing.


It's a wonder life!

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 08:42 | 3126783 S5936
S5936's picture

You got it. Fuck this solid citizen bullshit !! I'm going back too. Need to dust off the bong first ... The new normal ... Yeah baby !!!

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 22:30 | 3126323 ToNYC
ToNYC's picture

You mean, socialize losers on the Plantation re-run, to pay all costs.

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 13:01 | 3127103 TrulyBelieving
TrulyBelieving's picture

The generalization that 'rich people' want workers and society to take the burden of education and risk is not only incorrect but exposes the social agenda of AH. Propagandist often will not deny the evil of a situation, but will simply redirect the blame to a class of people viewed as the enemy thereby protecting the real antagonist.

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 13:31 | 3127152 TrulyBelieving
TrulyBelieving's picture

double post

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 16:32 | 3125611 JPM Hater001
JPM Hater001's picture

I like how the bailout helped people who borrowed too much as opposed to those who lent.

The whole thing still fucking stinks.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 16:37 | 3125627 WestVillageIdiot
WestVillageIdiot's picture

And the guy that doesn't borrow gets a good, hard one in the ass, once again.


This is no different than all of the "homeowners" that took out 100% mortgages, or more, and now live free in "their homes".  The irresponsible prosper as the responsible get ass-raped.  But the whole point is to use government programs as slush funds to buy votes from preferred constituents. 

And on and on it goes.  Which part of his voting base will FauxBama bail out next?  If I were a golfer I would be wracking up as much debt as humanly possible.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 17:19 | 3125752 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

This should be a huge boon for the 529 plan business. By boon I mean THE END.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 18:24 | 3125888 lewy14
lewy14's picture

Also: a brand new class of employment for new graduates... a kind of extended internship which (a) pays almost nothing for some time (so qualifying the new employee for the "financial hardship" status which will cap his loan payment) and (b) provide the experience and credentialling which will provide a pathway into the elite.

In short, this bill will kill entry level salaries for all jobs - "good" jobs as well as "bad" jobs - because there will be a huge new pool of graduates who will take the tiny salary, and view it as a "feature", not a "bug". There will still be huge competition for these "good" jobs - especially in STEM (Science, Technology, Engineering and Math) as they will hold the promise of big $$ and power later...

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 20:19 | 3126103 AldousHuxley
AldousHuxley's picture

In Japan, there are workers at Toyota who has been "temp" employee status for 10 years.


In Europe, you don't get jobs unless you know someone and it is only a job at government agency doing shuffling paper.


only humane thing would be to decrease population as nature tend to curb overpopulations by depriving resources.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 23:48 | 3126433 strangeglove
strangeglove's picture

Can ya spare a match?

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 18:17 | 3125878 nmewn
nmewn's picture

"Borrowers with public-service jobs may qualify for loan forgiveness after just 10 years."

You see comrade! Your service to the Fatherland will be rewarded!

Fucking Forward!!!

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 19:24 | 3125997 cynicalskeptic
cynicalskeptic's picture

I'm wondering just how many government jobs will actually be available for these graduates.....  local gov is cutting back, laying off people.  The Feds may have been expanding their hiring but I wonder how much longer before we see serious cuts there.   If you can't GET a gov job the whole thing is moot.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 19:44 | 3126027 nmewn
nmewn's picture

Well, the "progressives" in our society wanted (or fell for the idea of) giant FDR-type public works projects...

(Putting on my national socialist central planner hat & grinning like a possum eatin poop while clamping a cigarette holder in my teeth) a third can be put to work toiling away in the fields to feed the other two thirds of the government labor force, another third working on all those decrepit roads & bridges that never seem to get fixed no matter how much money is thrown at cronies and the final third (unsuited by nature or circumstance) in the administration of it all shuffling papers around tracking it all.

Its what they wanted...I say give it to them in spades ;-)

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 21:58 | 3126173 oldman
oldman's picture

@nmewn and all

What they want was to give more to the banksters and more to the MIC to take over more of the planet-----the banks didn't take enough and the military couldn't have asked for more, so they were forced to borrow for diplomas--------------   

"After all, "it is only fair" that the taxpayer funded "free for all" bonanza must go on."

It is all the fault of the underclass who are mainly unemployed, underemployed, or working for slave wages that the US is so screwed up, right?

You dudes mak me want to vomit with your 'fear and loathing'--------------get a life!     om  


Sat, 01/05/2013 - 22:05 | 3126286 nmewn
nmewn's picture

What they want is exactly what I described, you (and others) being subservient little worker drones.

"There is, in fact, only one solution: the state, the government, the laws must not in any way concern themselves with schooling or education. Public funds must not be used for such purposes. The rearing and instruction of youth must be left entirely to parents and to private associations and institutions." - Mises

So now what has really been accomplished with this "progressive" Prussian model of indoctrination of our children to the state? Are we and our children more free or less free, overall?

You should turn your attention back through time to the era of Wilson, Morgan, Rockefeller and discover for yourself what "our" education really is and what it is used for.

I will no longer work for free in order to show you or anyone. My charity level has become completely & utterly exhausted. You are now, on your own, adrift.

And good luck.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 22:35 | 3126334 oldman
oldman's picture


Shirley, you are being sarcastic!

Who would ever ask a mises miser for anything?

I have no idea of why you think that anyone would ask you for anything---especially financial advice

Please do not respond to this---I will be in the bathroom all night vomiting

ZH has truly become Troll City but how can there be so many of you?     om

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 23:30 | 3126399 nmewn
nmewn's picture

"but how can there be so many of you?"

Haven't you heard? From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs and you need to puke.

My only expectation from you is that its in a toilet you purchased with your own labor and not a toilet I subsidized or is asked of my children to subsidize.

Are we clear?

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 23:49 | 3126429 oldman
oldman's picture


You are still being sarcastic

"Are we clear?"

Have a cup of tea, nmewn?   Please do----relax---you are beginning to unravel---to sound like a Dick Cheney or one of those other fascist bullies who are the role models for most trolls

Please, have a cup of tea, nmewn                    om

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 01:51 | 3126605 nmewn
nmewn's picture

I see you've crawled out of your vomitorium.

Thats very good, you'll find decent tea is not vomit inducing ;-)

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 10:14 | 3126853 mjcOH1
mjcOH1's picture

"I'm wondering just how many government jobs will actually be available for these graduates.....  local gov is cutting back, laying off people.  The Feds may have been expanding their hiring but I wonder how much longer before we see serious cuts there.   If you can't GET a gov job the whole thing is moot."

This may require a second trillion dollar coin....

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 10:18 | 3126858 centerline
centerline's picture

Offer something to the debate.  Geeze.  You just made yourself out to be the troll here oldman.  Fail.

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 11:08 | 3126908 nmewn
nmewn's picture

I found hs "mises miser" remark, well, revealing.

Ludwig von Mises (like most others of the Austrian persuasion) looked dispassionately at both socalism & capitalism and came to the conclusion (properly so) that socialism will always fail.

For this, oldman calls him a miser?, sure, whatevah.

"A man who chooses between drinking a glass of milk and a glass of a solution of potassium cyanide does not choose between two beverages; he chooses between life and death. A society that chooses between capitalism and socialism does not choose between two social systems; it chooses between social cooperation and the disintegration of society. Socialism is not an alternative to capitalism; it is an alternative to any system under which men can live as human beings." - Mises

Anyone who thinks the socialist state can be properly fine tuned to be the sole provider of good works hasn't reached the point of their life where the state will make the "miserly" decision of cutting off their health care based on nothing but their future life expectancy.

What can I say...he just doesn't get it.

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 00:17 | 3126486 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

 "What they want was to give more to the banksters and more to the MIC to take over more of the planet"


Last night I happened to watch FULL METAL JACKET on TV... The ending scene is where the plattoon is humping it thru the war torn land & all singing the "Mickey Mouse Club" song... "M-I-C... K-E-Y M-O-U-S-E"... It immediately dawned on me why Kubrick chose that song & that imagery...

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 08:48 | 3126789 S5936
S5936's picture

Can you say NDAA . They'll be assigned to the euthanize granny brigade.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 21:06 | 3126200 Overfed
Overfed's picture

I took out a 0% down ARM eight years ago on my place, had a credit score of 620. I paid my mortgage faithfully for four years (shoulda waited another couple), and refi'd with a conventional loan. Now my credit is 800, and I can't get another loan for shit. Go figger.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 21:22 | 3126222 Omen IV
Omen IV's picture

its not the credit score that is important its your  IQ - you need to fuck the banks and then you get more money - wake up!

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 23:24 | 3126390 Raymond Reason
Raymond Reason's picture

The irresponsible prosper as the responsible get ass-raped.

The country is run by parasites, who were raised by parasites from a long line of parasites, and don't possess the genetic ability to produce anything but more parasites, either through procreation, or enlistment.  Their business is stealing, and business is good. 

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 17:19 | 3125749 spinone
spinone's picture

It helps the bank who lent - they can't get blood from a stone anyway, so now this formalizes a tapayer funded bailout.

The FED is fighting deflation with both bazookas ablazing. The problem is that as an unintended consequence (?) failed organizations get put on life support, competinga nd draining resources from successful ones. This zombifies the economy (think GM vs Ford. If GM went under, then Ford wouldn't have to compete against them and could sell more Focii)

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 20:22 | 3126107 AldousHuxley
AldousHuxley's picture

it is all for the banks.


home owner bailouts = bailout for banks who made the loan

student loan bailouts = bailouts for banks who made the loan

government austerity/bailouts = bailouts for banks who made the loan


Instead of putting people in debt, then bailing them out, they should allow people to make purchases outright by increasing supply and lowering purchasing costs.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 23:52 | 3126116 nmewn
nmewn's picture

"Instead of putting people in debt, then bailing them out, they should allow people to make purchases outright by increasing supply and lowering purchasing costs."

Who is "they"?


No answer? Why is that?

Couldn't possibly be the same "they" who pushed people toward debt as an outlet for their desires in the first place could it? And how will this new monstrosity of central planning play itself out?

We gonna have the state implement price controls?...wage freezes?...wage rises?...mandate production increases at the point of a gun to drive prices down, at who's expense and who's labor and final glut?

Babe, really?

The only way out is debt repudiation or systemic collapse...gird your loins and keep your head out of the toilet because reality doesn't change...only your perception of its echo.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 20:34 | 3126128 boogerbently
boogerbently's picture

You're kidding, right?

This IS another bank bailout.

They don't care about students, just the institutions that are OWED this money.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 17:47 | 3125827 Laddie
Laddie's picture

Bill Clinton tightened the screws on student loan discharge and Joe Biden finished the suckers off with his Bankruptcy bill in 2007, he fronted for the credit card scammers while a Senator.

But you make a valid point, the banksters on the Upper Eastside of Manhattan got TRILLIONS, perhaps SEVEN TRILLION taxpayer dollars. Most of these students were just going what SOCIETY said to do, and why should their LIVES be ruined, forever? A dear friend of mine's son did what everybody says you should do and got loans and went to college to study engineering. Upon graduation he found that the firms were hiring Indians and other Asians for those engineering jobs. His father had been IT who was kicked out after he trained his Indian replacement. So since all the "favorites" of the regime have been getting "goodies" from We, the Suckers, why shouldn't some of our own get it? For goodness' sake.

SCREW THE BANKSTERS and their PUPPET in the Black House.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 18:42 | 3125914's picture


Most of these students were just going what SOCIETY said to do, and why should their LIVES be ruined, forever?


They should learn not to do the stupid things that government -- not society -- enables them to do. Someday they may end up doing what the government tells them to do and have their lives ruined in an exploded Humvee in some God forsaken place. There's no bailout for that.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 20:25 | 3126112 AldousHuxley
AldousHuxley's picture

it was part of central planning by neo-liberal economists.


1 export "dirty" manufacturing jobs to Chinese slaves

2 import illegal mexicans for "dirty" service and farm jobs in states

3 US Citizens get entertainment/sports jobs or cushy jobs after college education with high US salary


except business got around this by importing college grads for entry level jobs.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 20:32 | 3126123 nmewn
nmewn's picture

Sounds like we need a little LESS central planning.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 19:40 | 3126025 HurricaneSeason
HurricaneSeason's picture

The professors are the big winners.  If nobody has to pay, they can charge more and more.  Either the graduate gets a crappy job or no job or a good job (public sector) and doesn't have to pay.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 23:45 | 3126421 mercenaryomics
mercenaryomics's picture

Not the professors; while there are some professors now of bs courses and majors, many professors don't even get paid all that well. Schools don't value the quality of the education they produce anymore, so why bother paying good professors when your football team gets alumni dollars and new sheeple students with untapped federal loan coffers. 

The beneficiaries are these huge administrations, collegiate sports teams, and school bureaucracies, all of which have been exponentially expanding from funding by endless student loans. Increasing education's cost while watering down its value. 

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 02:14 | 3126623 HurricaneSeason
HurricaneSeason's picture

I imagine beer commercials and real estate investments are near the top of the priority list. Gotta have lots of marble and brass too.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 18:02 | 3125852 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

Tyler I humbly put this forth as the ZH National Anthem. Should suit us well going forward.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 18:44 | 3125916's picture

Don't do that.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 18:49 | 3125928 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

I give up Crockett. Had a blowout argument with a friend of mine last night over all this shit. I just don't care anymore. People are already brainwashed. What a mess.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 18:59 | 3125947's picture

A friend of mine has said some things lately that make me think he's starting to see the handwriting on the wall. It's encouraging but I fear time is short. On the other hand I'm tired of waiting for the other shoe to drop.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 20:17 | 3126096 FoeHammer
FoeHammer's picture

It's not too late guys. Others will catch on. They need real teachers and mentors though. I'm sure there are more than a handul of folks here at ZH who have the wisdom and ability to pass the message through even the thickest of skulls.


Just a handful of years ago I was a state AND religion loving neocon...I've come a long way but only with the help of truly knowledgeable folks. Lots of credit goes to them!

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 21:19 | 3126220's picture


In 2006 I was elected to a picayune seat on my local Democratic Committee which I resigned in 2008 so that I could register Republican and vote for Ron Paul in the PA primary. There are many paths to enlightenment, grasshopper.

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 12:31 | 3127040 Raymond Reason
Raymond Reason's picture

If you were a religion loving neocon, you were a protestant.  Good move, but don't throw out Christianity with Protestantism.  Most ZH people are smart guys, no doubt.  But IQ and wisdom are entirely different things. 

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 04:51 | 3126702 Frozen
Frozen's picture

It's over.

Doug Stanhope on population:

"Don't bring the product out before you build the shelves."

Sun, 01/06/2013 - 13:37 | 3127164 Jeepers Creepers
Jeepers Creepers's picture

If you make student debt dischargeable, you've essentially made college "free". 

So now janitors are getting money taken out of their paycheck so someone's little princess can get her 3rd Masters degree in Gender Studies?  Yea, that sounds fair.  If you start forgiving student loans, you're essentially going to have the entire United States becoming professional students.

If you want to make college affordable, get the government out of the equation to stop trying to make it affordable.  Same with housing.



Sun, 01/06/2013 - 16:06 | 3127512 Oracle of Kypseli
Oracle of Kypseli's picture

During the Vietnam war boys. will attend college to avoid the draft. Once the draft was abolished the colleges suffered greatly. That was most likely the beginning of the student loan campaign which is now way out of control.

My cousin finished medical school in Bucharest $3k per year. Think Grenada, South America etc. All you need is one year of language. If you can't learn the language in one year living in-country, you don't deserve a college degree.


Sat, 01/05/2013 - 16:25 | 3125593 HoofHearted
HoofHearted's picture

As a college prof, I say RAISE MY SALARY!!! Woohoo. We've got a lot of idiot students coming through, and we need to charge them higher tuition so that they can take advantage of this. 

(Needless to say, I'm being sarcastic. I bet only the administration will make any more money because of this bullshit.)

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 16:37 | 3125626 JPM Hater001
JPM Hater001's picture

I had lunch with my old Marketing Communcations professor who laid out 3 things:

1) His department was the only one with an effective internship and business project outreach program

2) His program was growing

3) The econ department could no be convinced to offer an econ class with actually useful items.

Of course neither of them had heard of Austrian Economics.


Sat, 01/05/2013 - 17:18 | 3125745 B2u
B2u's picture

I's sur reemembers alls the profissors i's hads.  theys gives me gud grades.  i's lookins for a grate jobs.

Sat, 01/05/2013 - 19:44 | 3126028 HurricaneSeason
HurricaneSeason's picture

Tri TSA and no pay debt.

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