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Herbalife Analyst Day And Investor Meeting - Live Webast

Tyler Durden's picture





 

The market has completely forgotten about the cliff (i.e., sequester and other, if any, spending cuts), about the debt ceiling, about the drag on the economy from the payroll tax increase, about central bank currency warfare, and is now fully engrossed by the hedge fund war between Ackman (and possibly Chanos, certainly Tilson) vs Loeb (and possibly Icahn) over the valuation of Herbalife: $0 or $60. Which is why today's HLF "analyst day" investor presentation - whose sole purpose is to refute Ackman's 300+ page monster accusing HLF of being a pyramid scheme - may be the most discussed event by carbon-based traders.

Readers can follow along the live webcast here (registration required).

 


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Thu, 01/10/2013 - 10:10 | Link to Comment Seasmoke
Seasmoke's picture

Without a doubt going Zero.

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 10:23 | Link to Comment CPL
CPL's picture

Wait wait wait!

 

If you find five zeros.  And those zero find five zeros...your downline will be amazing and you'll be rolling in enough money to buy a loaf of bread in no time.

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 10:49 | Link to Comment hedgeless_horseman
hedgeless_horseman's picture

 

 

Not only is the company a pyramid scheme, the entire concept that debt slaves (or anyone) can achieve a better life by taking herbal supplements, or any other kind of pill, balm, or tonic, is a complete scam.  Although, over the centuries, it has been a profitable scam.

All the best scams are old scams.

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 10:49 | Link to Comment SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

Like Chief Dan George said, 'If it's so good....then YOU drink it!'

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 11:27 | Link to Comment RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

If this is what passes as "news" on Wall Street these days... we are in for a lot of difficulty.

Sure looks like diversionary tactics to me.

Here is some real news:

http://ca.news.yahoo.com/mf-global-judge-nixes-customer-groups-bid-depos...

A bankruptcy judge on Tuesday rejected a bid by former MF Global customers to depose the collapsed brokerage's former chief, Jon Corzine.

In a written ruling in U.S. Bankruptcy Court in Manhattan, Judge Martin Glenn said the Commodity Customer Coalition, which had sought permission to question Corzine and other former MF Global insiders, lacked standing because it is not a direct creditor in the case.

The coalition, a grassroots group led by Chicago-based commodities trader James Koutoulas, bills itself as representing the interests of thousands of traders whose accounts at MF Global were frozen when the company went under.

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 11:33 | Link to Comment Manthong
Manthong's picture

And in related news.. previously unknown vitamin filler processing plants and thousands of hectares of secret tulip fields in rural Heilongjian Province, China linked to unnamed natural supplement manufacturers in the west.

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 10:54 | Link to Comment 847328_3527
847328_3527's picture

I prefer that belt you wear around your waist at night ...."Lose weight while you sleep" the ad says. "It's that simple!"

 

 

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 11:18 | Link to Comment CPL
CPL's picture

Names that should be on HLF's board of directors.


  • Bernard Madoff.
  • Allen Stanford.
  • Patrick Bennett.
  • Nabil al-Boushi.
  • John McNamara
  • Dewey, Screwem and Howe

 

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 10:30 | Link to Comment SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

'Apple? Never heard of it before....what you'z got to buy now is this 'new hot thing' Herbalife! Yeah it's a pyramid scheme, thats what the country runs on now gotta BUY BUY BUY!'

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 10:36 | Link to Comment citrine
citrine's picture

When Herbalife came to Russia few decades ago, everybody was rather excited about it, and the opportunities the scheme had offered. Russians fell out of love with it within few years, and there were rumors that some Herbalife products represented health risks. Given that the revenues of Herbalife are primarily coming from other (third world?) countries, there is a good chance that they would continue generating profit.

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 11:10 | Link to Comment CPL
CPL's picture

They are ponzi scheme masked as a retailer.

Literally if you join Herbalife, or any ponzi scam like Amway, there is no way you could every make money to survive on.  The math of pyramid schemes always works against the best interests of the sucker.

 

I mean 'investor'...lol

 

It breaks down like this.

Sucker that 'invested' finds 6 suckers that 'invest'

6 suckers that 'invested' finds 36 suckers that 'invest'

36 suckers that 'invested' finds 216 suckers that 'invest'

216 suckers that 'invested' finds 1296 suckers that 'invest'

1296 suckers that 'invested' finds 7776 suckers that 'invest'

7776 suckers that 'invested' finds 46656 suckers that 'invest'

46656 suckers that 'invested' finds 279936 suckers that 'invest'

 

(I might add by this point you might..'might' make 200 a week in your pyramid, unless you own the pyramid, you aren't getting paid.)

279936 suckers that 'invested' finds 1679616 suckers that 'invest'

1679616 suckers that 'invested' finds 10,077,696 suckers that 'invest'

10,077,696 suckers that 'invested' finds 60,466,476 suckers that 'invest'

60,466,476 suckers that 'invested' finds 362,797,056 suckers that 'invest'

 

By this point in the pyramid you might be making a million...but you require the entire population of Canada and the USA to pay you.

 

See how this never works and why it always fails?  I'm using the 6 people system pushed by Herbalife as well btw.

This is the future of that company.  Ponzi.

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 10:54 | Link to Comment ball-and-chain
ball-and-chain's picture

Just another Ponzi in a long line of Ponzis.

It's going to zero.

More innocent people shall get raped.

Business as usual on the Street.

Thieves.

http://www.angrysinner.blogspot.kr/2013/01/yesterday-dragon-lady-served-beef-and_10.html

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 11:01 | Link to Comment spastic_colon
spastic_colon's picture

apparently not with the well connected short ban of this free market mantra of let's crush the shorts; especially when they are defending  a company with such attractive intrinsic value / sarc

 

You can always use a straw man headline with the word icahn in it

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 10:13 | Link to Comment youngman
youngman's picture

If they sing a happy song at the meeting...its a Pyramid scheme

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 10:19 | Link to Comment Super Marco
Super Marco's picture

Pissed myself at this comment.

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 10:24 | Link to Comment CPL
CPL's picture

Clapping seals.

 

And everyone of those wastes of skin can vote.

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 11:31 | Link to Comment RockyRacoon
Thu, 01/10/2013 - 11:41 | Link to Comment CPL
CPL's picture

Found another one with a similar model but they don't do anything but a paper scheme with a 9 to 1 currency split scheme with x5000 multipliers on it.

www.federalreserve.gov/

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 10:14 | Link to Comment youngman
youngman's picture

and if there is any fat people there...shows the product does not work....

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 10:16 | Link to Comment RSBriggs
RSBriggs's picture

Say what you want about where the price may be going, I piled into it at 25 after Tilson announced his short.  I'm currently sitting on an 80% gain with a 9% trailing stop set, and laughing all the way to the bank (and at all you stupid motherfuckers that just bitch about how it's impossible to make money in this market...)

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 10:18 | Link to Comment Seasmoke
Seasmoke's picture

Enjoy that $80. You deserve it.

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 10:24 | Link to Comment RSBriggs
RSBriggs's picture

$80 ???   HAHAHHAHA  Try $15/share * 2,000 shares..,   (Guess that's only 60%, not 80%)

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 10:47 | Link to Comment CPL
CPL's picture

Chart says the dead cat is about to finish carrying through it's arc after the first bounce.

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 10:34 | Link to Comment Capitalist
Capitalist's picture

Any reason you have a 9% trailing stop? Instead of placing your stop below a swing low or something?

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 10:46 | Link to Comment RSBriggs
RSBriggs's picture

Because I'm willing to take a 51% gain if the price retraces, and the trailing stop is managed by my broker whereas hard stops go "on the book". Algos don't know I've got a % stop set.  I find it funny (funny as in curious) how if you set hard stops, it seems like there always manages to be one tick down that takes them out if the spread is valuable enough.   

Sometimes, just for amusement, I'll set a hard stop on something and watch the algos start ticking the bid down to catch it, then pull the stop before they get down that far and watch things tick back up - hahaha, fooled you....

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 10:50 | Link to Comment SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

Bunch of MOMO chasing fucktards expecting 50% gains in days is now the market norm. Just degenerate gamblers.

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 11:01 | Link to Comment RSBriggs
RSBriggs's picture

I'm not EXPECTING it, I've made at least that much on it.  There's a difference between gambling and using someone who is always wrong as a contrarian indicator....

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 11:07 | Link to Comment RSBriggs
RSBriggs's picture

Worst case, it dropped from where Tilson announced his short and I'd have been out with a small loss.  Best case, Tilson was wrong as usual...  

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 13:31 | Link to Comment ultraticum
ultraticum's picture

What if you can't get out? 

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 10:51 | Link to Comment CPL
CPL's picture

You aren't the first person I've heard that from in the past year.  

It's like the banks that own the HFT's are feeding all the operational data to the ALGO's.

 

Good on you.  Keep the powder dry.

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 10:44 | Link to Comment CPL
CPL's picture

Atta boy.

 

Tighten up the stop loss though.  This conference doesn't instill any type of confidence that it'll hit 80 like another person pointed out.

The whole conference is the cherry picked trailer park trash hoping that merely being in the same room will add a couple of people to their downline.

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 10:55 | Link to Comment RSBriggs
RSBriggs's picture

I don't know what it will hit - it may have topped out already - but I'll just let the profits run until they stop.  I figure 9% is a large enough stop-space that some algo can't run the stops that much  on something this active, and it allows enough wiggle room for normal ups and downs - getting me out if things turn around suddenly, but keeping me in if the price continues creeping up.   

I doubt this will hit $80 - or even $68 - but if it doesn't retrace enough to take out the stop, I'll ride it up until it quits.....

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 11:48 | Link to Comment CPL
CPL's picture

You've got your safety in place, you've already made more than any savings account would offer and reviewing the stock, 9% I'm thinking is your best bet doing a bit more math on it and using past drops on this POS to make sure you aren't whacked at open.

Ten years ago a trailing SL of 9% would have seemed outrageous.  Today though all assets behave like an x3 etf, so good on you for holding the line and protecting yourself properly.  

It looks like the 'meeting' was a success.  Don't mind the detractors here.  Take that shit to bank and don't feel bad for making money on a piece of shit like this.  The opportunity was there and you took a measured and practiced response...and the risk.  And it has paid well (if you aren't lying through your teeth, this is the internet after all).  Good on you.  When the trade eventually closes, crack open a beer and go for a round of golf.

Fortune favors the bold.

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 10:25 | Link to Comment SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

Herbalife....does anyone actually BUY this shit? I've never seen an 'Herbalife' thing myself I have no idea what it is, other than some pyramid scheme thingy...and this is now the hottest thing in america? Someone stop this stupid ride I want off.

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 10:30 | Link to Comment azzhatter
azzhatter's picture

I haven't either but I also don't have an Iphone or Ipad so I'm out of touch

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 11:29 | Link to Comment Super Marco
Super Marco's picture

When I was younger my folks enrolled and bought Herbalife. Didn't make a cent themselves. Not sure about others.

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 11:39 | Link to Comment RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

That's how it works.  The guy up-line from your folks was the one who made the money.  Your folks' garage just piled up with purchased products -- which they were obligated to buy to maintain their "membership".

Buncha garbage.

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 10:29 | Link to Comment azzhatter
azzhatter's picture

Saw the president of HLF on Squawkbox this morning. That douchebag alone makes me think it's a zero. He fit in nicely with the regular squawk douchers

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 13:50 | Link to Comment Agent P
Agent P's picture

I saw it too...kept waiting for him to talk about pink hearts, red balloons, yellow moons, orange stars, purple horseshoes and blue diamonds.

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 10:35 | Link to Comment Smuckers
Smuckers's picture

Gotta scorch this snake-oil crap from the markets....

Getalife.

 

 

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 10:37 | Link to Comment dobermangang
dobermangang's picture

Don't know anything about HLF.  But Ackman is wrong on JCP.  IMO, that company is in a death spiral.

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 10:53 | Link to Comment Dr Benway
Dr Benway's picture

Just the perfect sign of the times we are in. A company with a scam product that at best does nothing, using pyramid scheme selling, targeting the obese and stupid, with a stock undergoing wild price swings battled over by hedge funds... Hilarious lol. This is the end point when HLF is the epitome of a company.

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 10:59 | Link to Comment Pedantic Rube
Pedantic Rube's picture

It's AA for fat people. I emplore you to go to the HLF center in Spanish Harlem. It's a bunch of fatties saying "Me llamo Paco y estoy gordo"

HLF goes to $60 and Ackman gets 25% redemption and blows up.

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 10:59 | Link to Comment 847328_3527
847328_3527's picture

Sounds fishy.

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 11:14 | Link to Comment Bahamas
Bahamas's picture

How can you possibly convince people to gobble down a slimy shake  instead of a juicy plate of good ol' lasagna? Snake oil would have been a better idea.

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 11:29 | Link to Comment orangegeek
orangegeek's picture

Some one call the boys at Muddy Waters - they seem awfully quiet - while they get their shorts in place of course.

 

Reminds me of eToys in 2000 - a $60 stock with no revenue.  At least HLF has sold something - I think.

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 12:02 | Link to Comment CPL
CPL's picture

HOly shit...I remember them.  Some uppity up in the US government swept the whole thing under the carpet while the world was tripping over losing a fortune on Nortel and the rest of the Telco's.

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 11:45 | Link to Comment ItchyBeard
ItchyBeard's picture

Never heard of Herbalife before this.

Does anyone here know about QNET? A friend has 'invested' in the program and wanted to sucker me in too, but I just asked him to fuck off.

Thu, 01/10/2013 - 12:03 | Link to Comment CPL
CPL's picture

All MLM's are scams, not one of them is legitimate.  All have the ponzi pyramid scheme math behind them and collapse as soon as they are unmasked.

Do NOT follow this link or you will be banned from the site!