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Treasury, Fed Kill Trollin' Dollar Coin

Tyler Durden's picture


And just like that the most surreal two weeks of sheer monetary idiocy is over, with the Treasury and the Fed both formally announcing the death of the trillion trollin' dollar platinum  coin idea, which was nothing but a cheap charlatan trick devised by page view-desperate media outlets to dumb down their already confused audience and distract from the fact that the US is, sadly, once again on the verge of bankruptcy.

As the WaPo reports:

The Treasury Department will not mint a trillion-dollar platinum coin to get around the debt ceiling. If they did, the Federal Reserve would not accept it.


That’s the bottom line of the statement that Anthony Coley, a spokesman for the Treasury Department, gave me today. “Neither the Treasury Department nor the Federal Reserve believes that the law can or should be used to facilitate the production of platinum coins for the purpose of avoiding an increase in the debt limit,” he said.

This is good news: at least the US monetary system will not devolve into an all out circus and parlor trick. For the time being at least. Because it is and always will be far easier to create empty, repoable "money" out of fungible electronic 1s and 0s, than an actual piece of metal.

It is even better news because one can now permanently filter out and ignore all destructive "opinions" originating from those vocal proponents of this monetary gimmick, some of whom even have awards not ironically named for the inventor of dynamite.

We won't even touch on what you need to know for the click-through and CPM loss this means for Series ZZ preferred round investors in slideshow-centric electronic media outlets located at the intersection of gossip and financial cluelessness.

Finally, and on a more serious note, this once again means that it will be once again up to the market to get the political left and right to come to a compromise, as was the case in the summer of 2011.


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Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:24 | 3147528 JackT
JackT's picture

Doesn't Russia Have a giant field of diamonds?

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:35 | 3147544 macholatte
macholatte's picture



 We aren't in an information age, we are in an entertainment age.
Tony Robbins


You look at someone like Beyonce singing 'Single Ladies,' when we all know she's married. Some of it is just for entertainment.
Katy Perry


Television is a medium of entertainment which permits millions of people to listen to the same joke at the same time, and yet remain lonesome.
T. S. Eliot


Multinational corporations do control. They control the politicians. They control the media. They control the pattern of consumption, entertainment, thinking. They're destroying the planet and laying the foundation for violent outbursts and racial division.
Jerry Brown


Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:44 | 3147555 Skateboarder
Skateboarder's picture

I'd say we're actually in the entitlement age. Everyone feels entitled as fuck because most everything comes so easy now. That only goes to first-worlders by the way.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:49 | 3147561 flacon
flacon's picture

"Finally, and on a more serious note, this once again means that it will be once again up to the market to get the political left and right to come to a compromise, as was the case in the summer of 2011."


Let's hope that it's unlike the pre-New Year's winter of 2012 where the markets pulled out all the stops to the up side and fooled a lot of people! 

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:05 | 3147576 AssFire
AssFire's picture

I'd say age of bathsalt..

When they aren't eating faces they are choking Rottweilers...NUDE!

Miami, of course. Story ends nicely due to gun ownership.

I'll leave it to others to easily conclude the attacker's race.

No mention if he had been hanging with McAffe earlier that morning...

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:20 | 3147614 Manthong
Manthong's picture

This is so simple to fix.

They just need to make one 12 kilogram coin and value it at $16 Trillion and deposit it at the Fed Eccles building in Washington, DC.

Oh.. the coin needs to be made out of Plutonium 239 and kept in an explosive casing that implodes the moment that the current debt ceiling is officially raised.

Problem solved.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:24 | 3147626 RSBriggs
RSBriggs's picture

And the coin wouldn't be all that large - 12 Kg of P239 is a sphere about the size of an American baseball...

Sun, 01/13/2013 - 04:56 | 3148494 TwoShortPlanks
TwoShortPlanks's picture

What the BIS and Basel III people just did was say to them, ‘Take your time, China.’

Remember, the BIS is the financial hub of the UN/IMF/WB (CFR/CoR/Trilateral/RIIA/Bilderberg etc) system. They want to pull-down the affluent West and transfer that wealth to the 2nd, 3rd & 4th World (not the 5th tho). The DotCom, Housing and Bond Bubbles set the scene and the GFC is the excuse to dilute.

 A $Trillion coin is a silly distraction.

 Keep your eye on the ball from now on; keep your eye on the BIS at all times people!

We are all witnessing the Holdren White Paper (Ecoscience 1977) come to fruition, and as the Club Of Rome's master plan gets shifted into top gear.

Gold is the wealth transfer medium of choice, that's why the CBs have leased it out and also why the East is buying it furiously.

Mon, 01/14/2013 - 00:53 | 3148952 Manthong
Manthong's picture

Oops.. I had a teeny typo.

I meant a 16 Kg coin ( $1T/Kg Pu239).

Although 12 Kg would probably work, a bit more of the problem area would be fixed with the additional 4 Kg.

Bastiat and Krugman would likely approve of this solution.


(But how much impact can a few trillion dollars or a paltry additional 4 Kg of Pu 239 have anyway?)  

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 21:41 | 3147944 a growing concern
a growing concern's picture

Only if Benny boy and Timmah and Lloyd and Jamie are holding hands around the coin singing kumbayah when it "goes off".  Otherwise, splendid idea.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:20 | 3147620 Snakeeyes
Snakeeyes's picture

It was a cheap ploy to bypass the Constitution and Congress by Statist a**holes. 

But they will resort to SOMETHING drachonian because of the already excessive debt.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:30 | 3147631 CompassionateFascist
CompassionateFascist's picture

IOTW, the Rothschild Int'l Bank, alias the "Federal Reserve", said..."Uh, no...never mind the Plat. You still owe the Family $5 Trillion and counting. You may, however, pay us in gold at the current spot. Too bad there's none in Ft. Knox. 'Cause we already stole it."

Sun, 01/13/2013 - 18:38 | 3149448 IrritableBowels
IrritableBowels's picture

I Own The World? 

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 22:41 | 3148037 Half_A_Billion_...
Half_A_Billion_Hollow_Points's picture



Thanks for the fun, assfire

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 21:45 | 3147949 edb5s
edb5s's picture

First three quotes were ok, but that last one is "part of the problem."  Multinational corporations are only the problem to the extent that the government has power over the economy.  With a government powerless against levying tarrifs, incentiving industries (and individual businesses), and providing for insurmountable barriers to entry for preferred sectors, there is no "power teat" to suck off of.  Absolution for said corporations this statement is not, but they are not to be blamed solely. 

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:03 | 3147594 Motorhead
Motorhead's picture

I think Russia has giant fields of all kinds of stuff.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 19:08 | 3147683 joego1
joego1's picture

And they can see Sarah's back yard too.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 21:56 | 3147959 A Nanny Moose
A Nanny Moose's picture

Of course The Palinator never saiid any such thing. This was propoganda wrapped in satire by the overwhelmingly liberal. yet obviously geographically challenged, Lorne Michaels goons at SNL

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 23:36 | 3148139 sun tzu
sun tzu's picture

Has Barack seen the 57 US states yet?

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 19:53 | 3147766 TBT or not TBT
TBT or not TBT's picture

Some have long trenches full of buried history you can't read about in the contemporaneous NYT reporting, because they covered for it.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 21:18 | 3147915 nmewn
nmewn's picture

Yes, they're not all excited to report on the outcomes, just the fervor of the moment...witness the career of NYT's reporter on the beat, the Pulitzer Prize winning (yawn)...Walter Duranty (Stalin apologist).

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:23 | 3147625 Banksters
Banksters's picture

Finance, so easy a child can do it.  


All ya gots to do is give your friends lots of money so they stay in business to buy peoples assets for pennies on the dollar.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 19:09 | 3147685 legorf
legorf's picture

hmmm the diamond market being close to a monopoly, you can certainly buy diamonds, now, try to sell them ... a whole different story.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 21:00 | 3147888 daxtonbrown
daxtonbrown's picture

Paging Paul Krugman to the $trillion Monopoly phone.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:24 | 3147529 icanhasbailout
icanhasbailout's picture

There's still Ron Paul's semi-sarcastic suggestion that the Fed simply rip up some portion of the T-bills it is holding. When I heard about this coin idea I immediately thought it was a stalking horse for that idea.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:04 | 3147596 Motorhead
Motorhead's picture

The Fed/Treasury will default in due time.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:23 | 3147624 HardlyZero
HardlyZero's picture

Weren't they supposed to default last time, last time, last time ... ?    This time is different ?

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:25 | 3147629 s2man
s2man's picture

I doubt it.  Default would hurt the bond holders, i.e. the banks.  They will monetize the debt, which will hurt us, the people.  I would prefer default.

My solution - Nationalize the Fed and burn the notes. ala Ron's ripping them up.  This would solve two problems: First, debt problem is solved.  Second, no one would loan us any more money, forcing the politicians to live within their means.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:36 | 3147644 aminorex
aminorex's picture

Monetization doesn't hurt people, it hurts dollars.  Monetization will occur because there is no other way to reduce the debt owed, and there is no other way to force haircuts down to a sustainable debt level, in the current system.  Half the debt has to be destroyed in order to avoid catastrophic release of systemic stresses.  


The great, indeed overwhelming, merit of the platinum coin approach is that it makes the facts clear to everyone.  That's why it is hated.  The chattering classes want to kick cans and sweep the facts under the rug.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 19:48 | 3147750 Nels
Nels's picture

Monetization doesn't hurt people, it hurts dollars.

That's a false choice.  It hurts both, every dollar directly, and most people in one way or another.   The precious few at the head of the chain get rich.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 22:08 | 3147979 FEDbuster
FEDbuster's picture

I am not at the "head of the chain", but I don't hold many FRNs either.  Some of us are stacking barbarous relics instead of paper IOUs.

Sun, 01/13/2013 - 00:30 | 3148240 Boris Alatovkrap
Boris Alatovkrap's picture

Barbie relic is over pricing - Boris is to hold Vodka and Ethylene Glycol.

Sun, 01/13/2013 - 04:49 | 3148491 OpenThePodBayDoorHAL
OpenThePodBayDoorHAL's picture

Best article I've read in five years. Sets the matter straight on the monetarists. Do not miss:


Sun, 01/13/2013 - 03:04 | 3148420 Sizzurp
Sizzurp's picture

This platinum coin idea was always going to be a nonstarter with the Fed.  They want to extract every bit of public wealth first before they allow some sort of platinum default. In the meantime, get ready to be taxed unmercilessly of all your' wealth and property before a default is allowed to happen. That way the banks will own everything of any value.


"If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around them will deprive the people of all property until their children wake up homeless on the continent their Fathers conquered."   Thomas Jefferson

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:25 | 3147530 buzzsaw99
buzzsaw99's picture

If congress did their job we wouldn't have a fed or any debt at all.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 19:12 | 3147686 aminorex
aminorex's picture

Your sentiment is laudable, but you neglect an important factor:  The job of congress is not to build, but to destroy.  You believed them when they claimed that they were working for you.  That was your fatal mistake.  

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 19:38 | 3147726 machineh
machineh's picture

If congress did their job, Obama and Holder would be impeached, indicted and facing capital charges.

Sun, 01/13/2013 - 01:12 | 3148301 cranky-old-geezer
cranky-old-geezer's picture



If congress did their job Sotero would have been disqualified.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 21:59 | 3147963 A Nanny Moose
A Nanny Moose's picture

buying votes, and paying off their buddies, at all costs, IS CONgress' job. Debasement is just the logical conclusion. The Fed is just the enabler.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:25 | 3147531 TheSilverJournal
TheSilverJournal's picture

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:30 | 3147535 lolmao500
lolmao500's picture

And guess what, most of the Obamabots idiots supported the idea.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:39 | 3147548 knukles
knukles's picture

(shrieking, crying uncontrollably... let down again by their own kind...)


(fucking idiots)

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:36 | 3147643 lolmao500
lolmao500's picture

Yep. Again and again they are being backstabbed by their lord and savior, yet they still believe in him...

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 22:02 | 3147971 Pure Evil
Pure Evil's picture

Well, you have to believe in something, no matter how many times your god craps on your head and pisses in your mouth.

Its all good.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 23:54 | 3148183 CH1
CH1's picture

And so it is: The state steals half their income and calls them moral defectives.

Yet, they bow down, obey without question, and destroy anyone who questions their masters/abusers.

It's a mad world indeed.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 20:29 | 3147839 taniquetil
taniquetil's picture

Say what? You tellin' me that us low-income folk, aftah votin' for Barack Obama, and gettin' ObamaFone, and ObamaFoodStamps, and ObamaHousing, ObamaUnemployment, we wain't gonna get no ObamaCoin?


I dunno. Must be Bush's Fault. Or Sandy's Fault. Who knows. Yesterday on CNBC someone was blaming the flu for the downtick in GDP forecast.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 21:04 | 3147893 knukles
knukles's picture

Any fucking excuse under the sun...
Even the most jaded are seeing through the propaganda of CNBS, et al

The there's Krugman
And the NYT

Sun, 01/13/2013 - 14:24 | 3149018 DosZap
DosZap's picture

And guess what, most of the Obamabots idiots supported the idea.

Yep, ANYthing to end around the other branches of Constitutional government,making the House basically Eunichs.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:31 | 3147537 nmewn
nmewn's picture

And just when Krugman had thrown his entire economic credibility behind it ;-)

You can't find over 617 million ounces of platinum just laying around anywhere? Its not like fairy dust and unicorns?


Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:34 | 3147542 THX 1178
THX 1178's picture

Its not like you can just create things out of thin air.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:45 | 3147557 traderjoe
traderjoe's picture

Like from fractional reserve lending - which the Fed admitted is how most of our money is created?

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 19:34 | 3147714 Griffin
Griffin's picture

I think it would have been a great idea to mint this trillion dollar coin.

It would have been a shining example of a hopless policy.

Later, when all this crap has blown sky high, it would have been a good idea to place that coin in the White House and put it into law that all future presidents start each working day by polishing that platinum until it lights up the office.

In the old norse Sagas Odin had a gold ring called Draupnir, this was something Loki got from Black elves and gave to Odin. That ring had magical powers so that every 9th day eight identical rings fell of it.

It sound a bit like the back bone of modern banking, the fractional reserve system.

Thats really all it is, just a few thousand year old Black elves magic, its amazing until you see trough it, then its just crap, like that coin idea.





Sat, 01/12/2013 - 20:08 | 3147796 espirit
espirit's picture

Ah Shucks, I was kind of looking forward to owning a few of them trillion dollah platinum coins.  Would have paid for them with Zimbabwe Bux.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 21:04 | 3147895 knukles
knukles's picture

Black elve magic it is. 

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:45 | 3147559 nmewn
nmewn's picture

And collect interest on it.

Sun, 01/13/2013 - 10:59 | 3148644 tip e. canoe
tip e. canoe's picture

compound interest

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:40 | 3147650 ISEEIT
ISEEIT's picture

Krugman.....The pied piper of morons. So many of these dolts were actually dead serious about the hairbrained bullshit. To make it that much more baffling, they claimed moral and intellectual highground from which to spout this idiocy (and a graet cover of MMT voodoo of course).

All they've got left now is 'stopping climate change'.........

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 20:03 | 3147783 knukles
knukles's picture

You can say that again.

Sun, 01/13/2013 - 00:35 | 3148248 Nikao7
Nikao7's picture

Krugman.....The pied piper of morons. So many of these dolts were actually dead serious about the hairbrained bullshit. To make it that much more baffling, they claimed moral and intellectual highground from which to spout this idiocy (and a graet cover of MMT voodoo of course).

All they've got left now is 'stopping climate change'.........

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:42 | 3147654 ISEEIT
ISEEIT's picture

Krugman.....The pied piper of morons. So many of these dolts were actually dead serious about the hairbrained bullshit. To make it that much more baffling, they claimed moral and intellectual highground from which to spout this idiocy (and a great cover of MMT voodoo of course).

All they've got left now is 'stopping climate change'.........

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 22:18 | 3147996 newdoobie
newdoobie's picture

+1 For sayin it again

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 22:01 | 3147968 A Nanny Moose
A Nanny Moose's picture

Perhaps they can back it with good intentions, and unicorn shit?

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:31 | 3147538 traderjoe
traderjoe's picture

I wonder why ZH has been so adamantly against this coin idea. Yes, it represents a default under our current monetary system. But our current monetary system is simply a scam against the people: privately created money (for free) loaned back to the sovereign at interest and with the collateral of your productive labor. Our current monetary system is one big parlor trick.

Default is and will be the only option. Austerity under the current system is a gift to the bankers.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:41 | 3147551 Al Huxley
Al Huxley's picture

I suspect that if you read the fine print you'll find that when the Fed buys debt from the Treasury, it's secured by the underlying assets of the country.  So I wouldn't get too excited about that default option - more likely they'll just lay claim to the underlying collateral.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:50 | 3147565 Republicae
Republicae's picture

I doubt that is in the fine print, but if a default did occur I think that Congress would immediately revoke the Federal Reserve Act and, as the Act provides, seize and liquidate all assets of the Federal Reserve. I think that is a far better idea when we reach the point of a functional rather than technical default, which this country has done in the past. The government defaulted on its obligations when FDR confiscated and stopped domestic gold exchange for the dollar, there was another default when silver was removed from circulation and then again when Nixon "closed the gold window" for the payment of foreign debts. All of those examples were defaults, all were handled with slight-of-hand tricks; I have no doubt that the next wave of defaults will be handled in a similar fashion unless the government decides that it is far less dangerous simply to inflate the debt away by repaying it in massively devalued currency. 

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:57 | 3147580 Raymond K Hessel
Raymond K Hessel's picture

That won't happen until gun confiscation happens first.

Not for any other reason but many people are hyper-sensitive to what the federal government is doing.  


Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:05 | 3147595 TheSilverJournal
TheSilverJournal's picture

There won't be a technical default. The Fed can and will print any amount of money necessary until the printing press is rendered worthless. Then the problem becomes the government being unable to borrow and a massive restructuring of the economy is forced.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:38 | 3147647 shovelhead
shovelhead's picture

Half right...

The printing press is still worth something.

What it prints will be worth paper scrap.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 22:00 | 3147759 Acidtest Dummy
Acidtest Dummy's picture

Yes it's magic, take two things that have intrinsic value - paper and ink - combine them into something worthless: a FRN.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:39 | 3147648 aminorex
aminorex's picture

The USG can always borrow, because the FRB can always lend.  That used to be a laughable contingency.  Today it is the dominant recurring fact.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 22:40 | 3148034 Zero Debt
Zero Debt's picture

Unless used in slogans, USG and FRB should not be treated as two separate entities.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 23:40 | 3148148 sun tzu
sun tzu's picture

That's what I told my finance professor in my MBA school about 5 years ago and he laughed. Now who's the fool?

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:00 | 3147589 Al Huxley
Al Huxley's picture

This is a nice idea, but it assumes that the govt would act against the Fed in the interest of the people.  Can you provide some other examples of where they've done this?

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 21:21 | 3147919 nmewn
nmewn's picture

Can't provide American examples...but world history is replete with them.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:58 | 3147673 Lazlo Toth
Lazlo Toth's picture

Its in the fine print.

Its more tricky than that though.

Its like playing chess with four people.

Its not that they are trying to actually default to the end.

They just need the leverage up to take the next steps.

Corporate law dicatates specific things in relation to corporations and by-laws.

The plot is kinda large.

Wish I could explain more.

But I think you can do your own research if you wanna know.

Its never the hand you think is going to be dealt.

And never trust that all parties at the table aren't in on the game.

As some of them always are.

Sun, 01/13/2013 - 11:03 | 3148650 tip e. canoe
tip e. canoe's picture

They just need the leverage up to take the next steps.

yup.   very interesting comment, thanks.

Sun, 01/13/2013 - 02:10 | 3148361 cranky-old-geezer
cranky-old-geezer's picture



Borrowing to pay interest is another type of technical default.

Govt is worried about avoiding cash flow default now. 

Not much to worry about long as Fed keeps printing and buying govt debt, which they can do forever.

USD collapse is the growing danger now. 

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:53 | 3147570 traderjoe
traderjoe's picture

I'd rather see the Fed try to collect on the 'full faith and credit' of the government than have the banks collect on the real assets of the people.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:54 | 3147571 traderjoe
traderjoe's picture


Sat, 01/12/2013 - 20:29 | 3147840 prains
prains's picture

double penetration is a bitch

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:43 | 3147552 a growing concern
a growing concern's picture

I can see what you mean.  Any attempt at austerity or trying to reign in the deficits only serves to make this banana republic of ours last just a little bit longer.  It does seem that the sooner we reset it, the greater the chance of us coming out alive on the other side.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:50 | 3147564 traderjoe
traderjoe's picture

Yes. And austerity will lead to defaults, which is when bankers collect their collateral.

While the Thomas Jefferson quote is not attributable to him, first by inflation then be deflation is how the bankers will end up with all of the real assets.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 23:42 | 3148155 sun tzu
sun tzu's picture

They might own the pieces of paper, but let's see them try to repo 100 million cars and houses.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 20:09 | 3147742 ISEEIT
ISEEIT's picture

Nothing personal and you do make a valid point in so far as the nature of our bankster/political slimeball enablers regarding the so called monetary system. My guess is that ZH enjoyed making such a mockery of the 'trillion dollar' coin farce because so many absent minded dolts actually latched onto it as being a viable new charade with which to continue playing political hot potato. The so called 'leader' preznit yo-momma and the other bankster puppets who rule strictly for the sake of power and similar narcissistic/sociopathic delights, will of course continue on by other more usual means. The fun in mocking this lunacy might be derived merely from astonishment at what utter morons Americans at large have become as well as perhaps some degree of twisted admiration for those in the leftist intelligentsia who shamelessly promote such obscenely perverse propaganda to the moronic masses of useful idiots content to cheer it on as so long as 'their' side appears to be winning the game.

I also suggest that true austerity would not at all be a gift to the banksters. True austerity would end both major political parties. True austerity would also end communism progressivism. For this reason it will not take place while Lincoln obama continues to serve as the joke in front of the curtain.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 22:52 | 3148058 csmith
csmith's picture

Easy to see why TY is so vocal on the coin. It was shilled at 1000 decibels by the assclowns at Business Insider, which is nipping at the heels of ZH in the click department.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:32 | 3147540 CrashisOptimistic
CrashisOptimistic's picture


If you add up all the GDP effects of the various fiscal events pending, and the probable effects of those about to execute (but not yet pending), the drag is 3+%.

Should all this happen, GDP will not remain positive this year.  

This is deflation.  Outright, pure, unquestioned deflation.  When you do not grow an economy, but population does, the share for each shrinks -- and that's deflation.

About all they can do is delay the upcoming cuts.  As was done in Aug 2011, they delayed them past the 2012 election year, but of course, that's not what they face now.  They dare not delay them in to 2014 because that's the congressional elections.  Odds politically are to do it now (though do not think of this in terms of "getting it over with", because these cuts are 10 yrs long.  These drag numbers are applied each year for 10 years.)

That is very long term deflation.

Sun, 01/13/2013 - 06:50 | 3148522 Woden
Woden's picture

CrashisOptimistic When you do not grow an economy, but population does, the share for each shrinks -- and that's deflation.

Sorry what? Increase the population -> shift out the demand curve. Goods become relatively scarcer...driving UP their nominal and real prices.

Deflation is a lowering of the general price level.

Something rather unlikely with a government addicted to money creation to fuel its spending.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:34 | 3147541 faustian bargain
faustian bargain's picture

BTW the economics prize is not an official Nobel Prize; it's a prize (begun in 1968) given by a bank 'in memory of' Alfred Nobel.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:36 | 3147545 knukles
knukles's picture

Betcha 100% of the Paltinum coin's melt value that Krugman never ever mentioned that to anybody, anytime, anyplace.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:01 | 3147591 faustian bargain
faustian bargain's picture

It's right there on for anyone to read, although (a) hardly anyone will read it nor take note of the difference, and (b) it appears the Nobel committee has no problem with downplaying the distinction. As to the family of Alfred Nobel, I've read they weren't too pleased at the addition of 'economic sciences' to the lineup.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:47 | 3147560 ziggy59
ziggy59's picture

Seems lately the Prizes won by these bozos were more likely from Alfred E. Neuman than Alfred Nobel.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 22:05 | 3147976 A Nanny Moose
A Nanny Moose's picture

...and economics prize named after an arms manufacturer, makes even less sense thann a "Peas" Prize

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 23:07 | 3148089 mkhs
mkhs's picture

You misspelt "piece."

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:34 | 3147543 knukles
knukles's picture

Indian giving killjoys
Now what's Paul Krugman gonna say? 
Will he shove a 4 lb cabbage up has rectum as an amends to mankind?
Will he simply apologize?
Has he enough Humility?
Will he write a scathing broadside about Timmah and Lew-lu's past relationship? 

Drama at the NYT
Earth shattering events in the Capitol.

Quick, everybody, into the carpool lanes!

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:44 | 3147556 ziggy59
ziggy59's picture

He's so clever, He should just jump out of his basement appartment...

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:52 | 3147567 knukles
knukles's picture

I thought he still lived with his mom?

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:00 | 3147587 negative rates
negative rates's picture

No, she turned into his renter and is now living on borrowed time.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 19:46 | 3147743 Hohum
Hohum's picture

"Indian giving?"  Who invented that term?  Custer?

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:38 | 3147547 Benjamin Glutton
Benjamin Glutton's picture

so we won't be depositing plutonium at the Fed?


what a disappointment.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:39 | 3147549 ShortTheUS
ShortTheUS's picture

I'm not sure this puts the issue to rest.

It's still a toss-up...


Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:48 | 3147562 blindman
blindman's picture

Penny drop landing on its side! ( from banking thiefs )
Jitterbug Boy - Tom Waits
Tom Waits – Kentucky Avenue

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:50 | 3147566 knukles
knukles's picture

And "If they did, the Federal Reserve would not accept it."

So, prima facie evidence that a person at Treasury actually asked someone with a modicum of common sense at the Fed whether they accept shit like slugs, wooden nickels and really suspicious, worse that Euros and Zimbabwe dollar, coins.



"Noooooooooooooooooooooooo fucking way!  Are you crazy?  We got serious credibility to protect, dickwad."

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 23:13 | 3148102 mkhs
mkhs's picture

Hey, even I won't accept a Susan Anthony dollar coin.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:53 | 3147569 MeelionDollerBogus
MeelionDollerBogus's picture

but come on guys, I'm SUPER CEREAL!

Trollion-Dollar Bogus coin!

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:53 | 3147572 muppet_master
muppet_master's picture

oh man !!

now the "mainstream media" is disappointed...what are they gonna tell their LOW INFO audience-as Rush Limbaugh has described them:  LOW INFORMATION AUDIENCE !!

i was hoping the QEorganizer would mint $2T and pay off the chinese their debt...and presto !! voila !! you know the chinese must be "disappointed" LOL !!!

ah chucks !! LOL !!!

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:56 | 3147575 muppet_master
muppet_master's picture

NOW !! congress must do its "job"

according to QEorganizer...and just hand him a BLANK CHECK !!! LOL !!

congress's job is to ALLOW the QEorganizer to RAPE and BANKRUPT the country with O-DEBT-BAMB-nomics !!

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:57 | 3147581 muppet_master
muppet_master's picture

and after US bankruptcy!!

after its all said & done...the "mainstream media" will blame congress for allowing the idiot QEorganizer to f up the country !!

Sun, 01/13/2013 - 06:54 | 3148529 blabam
blabam's picture

Rush Limbaugh's audience is the definition of "low information audience". It saddens me that people who read Zerohedge actualy still listen to that fat fuck. 

Sun, 01/13/2013 - 08:18 | 3148542 overmedicatedun...
overmedicatedundersexed's picture

so WAPO, in it's ultimate role as propagada king, has let the tax units know; the FED can tell congress and treasury what is money ,not the so called government of these here united states,, this has made the true power of the banks very clear, so clear, perhaps some states and elected office holders will wake up. there is a bulls eye now on the FED, this will not stand.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:54 | 3147573 Fish Gone Bad
Fish Gone Bad's picture

the US is, sadly, once again on the verge of bankruptcy.

The US has been bankrupt for a while now.  This is where people might be confused, they see that debt acts like money... until it doesn't.  Debt is the fucked-up-evil-twin of money.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:54 | 3147574 knukles
knukles's picture

PS  The other thing that is radically wrong is that a failure to pass an increase in the debt ceiling is not automatically an event of default.
End of Conversation.


Another fear based meme by TPTB and media propaganda mechanism to sway the public with falsehoods.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:57 | 3147579 debtor of last ...
debtor of last resort's picture

Watch how choosers become beggars. For mercy.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:58 | 3147582 F. Bastiat
F. Bastiat's picture

It is not the US that is on the verge of bankruptcy - it is the US Government.

That distinction is critical.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 17:59 | 3147583 Raymond K Hessel
Raymond K Hessel's picture

Default is our only escape from tax slavery.  Not platinum coins.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:17 | 3147599 muppet_master
muppet_master's picture

when the US of kenya

DEFAULTS...will this cause the EUR to go on a trajectory to 0.666? currently @ 1.335, hey spx TEMPORARY bottom was 666 under odummer on 3-2009

@ 0.666 they can easily devalue the currency by 50%, just like Belarus (read ZH article today) on that....which happened on

5-2011, gold @ $1450 then on its way to topping @ $1900 on 9-2011..

if EUR @ 0.666 = gold @ $300 = buy PHYSICAL like crazy !! on its way to $10k

gold @ $300 bc US will try to pay off debts trying to avoid major defaults and UNLOAD FT. KNOX ....major possibility you gold bugs !! i'm waiting for $300.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:33 | 3147641 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

$300 gold? The average cost to produce an ounce is now around $1200-1300.

Gold will never see sub $1000 again. It fact, it is severely underpriced at $1662. 

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:44 | 3147656 muppet_master
muppet_master's picture


NEVER say ALWAYS = extreme words...

i'm sure those bugs that were buying gold @ $800 in the 1970s right @ the TOP had the same thinking.....20 years later @ $250......when countries start unloading their gold in unison to pay off debt = $300 gold = me BUY !! all in-no margin!!

but will bet the entire farm on physical contracts (unlike the silver brothers from the 1970s), no stupid need to monitor its price daily or monthly...whether in martian or kenyan dollars...just turn off tv and enjoy life....unlike casino you do need to monitor daily...whether long or short.

having said that...its a nice day here in CA...logging off.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 19:29 | 3147707 Winston Churchill
Winston Churchill's picture


Production costs also fall in a deflationary collapse.

Gold is still a hedge in real terms then as well,but not quite as good as

in hyperinflation.

Only best way to hedge against both is 50% cash and 50% gold.I leaves out

silver as it will get hammered like copper did in the last depression.Just don't

see it holding up in a deflationary collapse anywhere near as well as gold.

The smart play will be to buy silver producers with gold at the bottom,as near

as can be judged.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 19:55 | 3147765 akak
akak's picture


Production costs also fall in a deflationary collapse.

When has a 'deflationary collapse' EVER been experienced under a fiat currency regime?  NEVER.

Every fiat currency collapse has been inflationary, as will be ours.  If you are waiting for some putative fiat currency deflation, you are in for a world of disappointment.

Honestly, I truly do not know where all this nonsensical deflationary blathering comes from, as NOTHING in monetary history supports it --- just the opposite in fact.  I have to presume it originates from historical cluelessness and/or disingenuous pro-Establishment propaganda maliciously designed to deflect attention and worry away from the TRUE danger, that of fiat currency debasement and/or collapse.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 20:03 | 3147782 shuckster
shuckster's picture

Deflation is necessary to punish borrowers and collect their assets. Monetization happens in order to pay down debts and save the borrowers. But since the lenders are the ones who print the money, they have nothing to gain by doing a massive print and getting their loans paid in devalued dollars. Their best bet is to cause temporary deflationary periods where large debts acrued during inflationary period are paid with deflated dollars. The Fed has nothing to gain by printing away the debt, however, it has everything to gain by deflating and collecting the entire national asset as payment

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 20:16 | 3147813 akak
akak's picture

Your theory is utterly unsupported by any historical evidence, and is in fact refuted by virtually all of monetary history.

Moreover, that same historical record demonstrates conclusively that regimes have almost countless times engaged in the very behavior from which you believe "they have nothing to gain".  Clearly, they DID have something to gain from currency debasement, or they would not have consistently resorted to exactly that in the attempt to print their way out of debt (as every government, through their central bank, is doing today).

Sun, 01/13/2013 - 02:19 | 3148373 Raymond K Hessel
Raymond K Hessel's picture

I think he's mixing assets with currency.  The currency is being deflated, ie it is worth lesst than it was.  Or else I'm too drunk to know what he's talking about. 

Sun, 01/13/2013 - 02:26 | 3148378 cranky-old-geezer
cranky-old-geezer's picture



Deflation is necessary to punish borrowers and collect their assets.

This is one of the dumbest comments I've seen on ZH.  You have no understanding of inflation, deflation, monetary theory, nothing.

You sound like that "biflation" idiot what's-his-name here.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:01 | 3147590 JOHNICON
JOHNICON's picture

Of course the Treasury and Fed did not want to do it.  It would have been government-created money not backed by debt.  It would not have been created by the banking system, so the pets of the banks (Fed & Treasury) refused to do it.  Why would they if it was not to the advantage of the banking system?

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:16 | 3147612 blindman
blindman's picture

if they had gone through with it it would have
been the conception of the fire breathing, two
headed incest child from hell and would have
worked to entertain and amuse all of the
registered muppets in the financial clown colony
formerly known as america.
some of the experts were up for the experiment
but cooler heads prevailed. they prefer the
seize the illegitimate assets and confiscation
route i guess? debt free money issued by the
sovereign is preferable, imo, but how to get there
from here will continue to be challenging and
require a crash and reset which will prove to be
unavoidable, and many may go to prison

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:36 | 3147645 s2man
s2man's picture

I have been asking, What's the difference between minting, printing or adding 0's to some electronic ledger? Its all created from thin air...

But you have answered my question, JOHN.  Heresy to cut the banks out of the deal.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 19:20 | 3147674 blindman
blindman's picture

...Wake ....Up: Babylon's Banksters Run This World
Posted by Josh at 7:55 PM

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:05 | 3147597 Seasmoke
Seasmoke's picture

Someone make sure Krugman does not jump in NYC

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:08 | 3147600 AldoHux_IV
AldoHux_IV's picture

"Finally, and on a more serious note, this once again means that it will be once again up to the market to get the political left and right to come to a compromise, as was the case in the summer of 2011."

As if this is any real solution? It's one arm telling the other to continue the ponzi. What a joke-- there's nothing serious nor logical about the current setup and if anything the real comedic aspect about this is what the fed considers worthy of accepting as "money".

Bottom line, more distractions and the ridiculous monetary fraud continues-- there will be plenty of other useless stuff for financial pundits to huff and puff about that redirects our nation's discussions from more serious issues: changing and reforming the system.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:16 | 3147613 Downtoolong
Downtoolong's picture

Because the current system of phony funny money creation is so much better....NOT!

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:19 | 3147618 news printer
news printer's picture
The euro crisis no one is talking about: France is in free fall

"The euro zone's second-largest economy is suffering more than any other member from a shocking deterioration in competitiveness. And it's doing nothing to stop it."

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 19:27 | 3147700 Everybodys All ...
Everybodys All American's picture

The miserables.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 19:31 | 3147709 cardis
cardis's picture

soon they will evoke 219-2 L'T

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:24 | 3147628 SilverFish
SilverFish's picture

These coins were our only hope.



Good night america.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 19:39 | 3147730 Bicycle Repairman
Bicycle Repairman's picture

Good night little Silverfish.  Mommy will be by to tuck you in.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 22:56 | 3148068 SilverFish
SilverFish's picture

Must have been a solar flare i'm not aware of, because it seems everyones sarcasm detectors are all fucked up.

Sun, 01/13/2013 - 11:01 | 3148647 blindman
blindman's picture

@ s,
well said,
we have tried nothing
and we are all out of ideas.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:25 | 3147630 whoknoz
whoknoz's picture

Hey that fuse under your desk actually lit?....

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:29 | 3147635 PUD
PUD's picture


Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:29 | 3147637 Atomizer
Atomizer's picture

[In future] Trillion-dollar Government Platinum Coin Ponzi scheme Masterminds Sentenced... Just look what happens to rebel terrorist who takes too much from the system’s GDP percentage. / LOL

Ponzi scheme mastermind sentenced|Ron Wilson was in federal court this afternoon.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:52 | 3147639 FreeMktFisherMN
FreeMktFisherMN's picture

 The U.S. is, sadly, bankrupt. 

Fixed it.

(the strike through font wasn't working)

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:39 | 3147649 TraderTimm
TraderTimm's picture

Shame, I would've liked to see them do it - if only to speed the dollar's demise. Now we have to put the movie back on slomo-destructo-vision, each frame an incremental horror for those already enlightened.


Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:42 | 3147653 DCon
DCon's picture

Weisenthal is looking for "coiners" to go drinking with tonight


Any NYC coiners, ping me.RT : I think 's going to need a stiff drink tonight.


Anyone, anyone?


Sat, 01/12/2013 - 18:46 | 3147660 AUD
AUD's picture

The Treasury Department will not mint a trillion-dollar platinum coin to get around the debt ceiling. If they did, the Federal Reserve would not accept it.

Why not? The Fed currently accepts all sorts of worthless shit, including IOU's from the Treasury Department.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 19:01 | 3147677 blindman
blindman's picture

the Japanese print to buy our treasuries for
gum's sake ! we wouldn't want that to stop.
would we?

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 21:32 | 3147935 blindman
blindman's picture

i heard they would not comment on a hypothetical? who
knows ? anyway. if they did accept it or were made to accept
it would they have to insure it and through whom and what
would that cost? and what if they lost it in say a boating
mishap? then what?

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 19:02 | 3147678 Atomizer
Atomizer's picture



The whole plan is to strategically kill off the US dollar. You’ll see the opposite unfold. Meanwhile, Electric Cars Must Make Noises Can Hear Under U.S. Rule 

That US ruling may ban rope and electric cars. The new electric car sound to alert pedestrians could end up as screams of desperation. /LOL


Try to keep up with the relentless propaganda efforts of MSM.

Sat, 01/12/2013 - 19:07 | 3147681 DCon
DCon's picture

reasonable! How are American kids who are off their head on Ritalin to be expected to look for cars before venturing onto the road? The car must screech to get through their drug riddled thoughts


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