Tyler Durden's picture

We realize the subject matter is about as tangential to the core themes discussed here as possible, but since hypocrisy of this magnitude has to be seen to be believed, and traditionally was only possible when emanating from the Federal Reserve (did we say tangential?) we present: Liestrong... in his own words.

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Stackers's picture

Did anyone actually finally figure out what the meaning of "IS" is ?

TerminalDebt's picture

Depends on what you mean when you say IS

francis_sawyer's picture

Yes ~ I worked on it all night... They're the 'active ingredient components' of 'SHIT' 

Dick Buttkiss's picture

All I know is it rhymes with jizz.

TerminalDebt's picture

He thought they meant Hilary

EasterBunny's picture

I still think he's a legend

NoDebt's picture

I still think Pete Rose is a legend, but he ain't getting in the Hall of Fame.  Ever.

CrashisOptimistic's picture

No, he's not.  His pharmacist is a legend.  It was he that won those Tours.  He belongs in the Pharmacist Hall of Fame.

Ham-bone's picture

Lance's doctor was a well known Italian and eventually jailed for his misdeeds (he was caught doping up tons of other riders)...

MachoMan's picture

Complete nonsense.  Have you looked at his genetics?  1:1,000,000,000,000 heart...  you think this might give one a competitive advantage? 

This is what all of the anti-steriod folks do not understand: (1) drugs do not do the work for you...  they do not lift the weights...  swing the bat...  or pedal the bicycle; and (2) EVERYONE, at the very least, pushes the envelope...  taking substances that may not be banned atm, but stand substantial chance in the future....  if not blatantly taking substances against the rules.

At the end of the day, you're left with an impossible/apples to oranges comparison to former persons in the same sport...  but I think it's fair to say that lance beat the shit out of all his contemporaries...  deal with it.

trav777's picture

the doping cyclists do is somewhat frightening when you consider that they inject synthetic oxygen carriers, fluorocarbons and things like that which can prove fatal.  But, it rarely does prove fatal.

Armstrong was gifted but not so gifted as some others.  The difference was the efficiency and his entire team's commitment to the program.

Jan Ullrich had superior talent but spent his off-seasons partying and showed up overweight frequently.  Armstrong ensured that his team trained with him, that they researched the courses and rode them beforehand and that everyone was on the right kind of dope to give them maximum performance.

Hincapie should give his pretty little Tour trophy girl wife back because he wouldn't have her or any of the rest of his loot- none of them would, without Lance having made them get with the program that produced championships.

A Nanny Moose's picture

not only that, but Telekom was often busy supporting Erik Zabel on the flat stages, for the Green Jersey. This wore their team down when it came to to work in the mountains.

Blankenstein's picture

If he's 1:1,000,000,000,000 then the dope didn't need to dope.  

"EVERYONE, at the very least, pushes the envelope"

okay in sports, not okay in banking - okay, I'm beginning to see ......

trav777's picture

he wasn't 1:1B.  But he was really talented.  Not more talented than others who were his rivals.  Not by a long shot.

What Armstrong did was command a TEAM effectively and that included ensuring his teammates had MAXIMUM commitment to achieving victory, which means they dope too or find another team (they wouldn't last more than a year or two nondoped).

Pantani had hematocrit levels exceeding like 65 deep into the Tour; EVERYONE was on this stuff, nobody has been clean in cycling since cycling began.

MachoMan's picture

I don't mean his talent was one in a billion, I mean his heart, literally...  in size and efficiency...  (not figuratively)

This same doping issue goes for olympians as well...  virtually every sport...

Titus Flavius Caesar Vespasianus Augustus's picture

I don't know about cycling, but if it were say, mixed martial arts... I dare say you'd prefer not to face someone who was lifting like crazy, eating all the right stuff, and also taking roger clemens level steroids....


And as to baseball... getting to a ball a little faster, and with a little more bat speed and power does make a difference.  It's not going to hit a guy who can't hit into someone with a high .ops - but for the average bear with some existing power, yeah, it helps some.  I don't think any baseball guys think otherwise... and I don't think so many would have taken them if they didn't help you compete.

I have no doubt that triples get turned into homeruns due to the fake benefits of PEDs.

Especially in Yankees Stadium's right field, which is a fucking joke anyway.

MachoMan's picture

This is just like the war on drugs...  or the war on guns...  or anything else...

Here's a newsflash for folks...  EVERYONE TAKES PERFORMANCE ENHANCERS...  some are more effective than others, but everyone takes them...  In short, the fact that you outlaw something does not, in the slightest, stop anyone from taking them... 

Part of the benefit of performance enhancers is recovery time...  they don't necessary ensure that you perform better during the game, but they can help your body recover more quickly...  does a steriod give you better hand-eye coordination?  Moreso than caffeine?  Probably not...  but, what about a torn ACL/MCL?  Sometimes you can get those and in only a few months come back and dominate the league in rushing...  hmmm...

There are a whole bunch of tricks for mma guys...  epinephrine...  ammonia...  it never ends.

[PS, mma guys are tested...  although rarely caught]

Matt's picture

So you propose that all sports simply allow the use of performance enhancements, with no restrictions?

Or should we seperate all sports into two leagues, Pure Humans and Augments?

jcaz's picture

...And here's your sign.....

Always nice to see a breath of ignorance cross into this forum-  now go back to your "OJ Is Innocent" blog.....

trav777's picture

yeah, you're right, because all you have to do is inject yourself and you can win any sport in the world, which is why EVERYone does that.  You see regular joes all the time using juice and going out and winning Ironmans.

Think before you speak.  What made Armstrong remarkable was that he was THE ONLY GUY at the top of the peloton who DID NOT have a drug bust during this run.  ALL OF THE REST OF THEM had at least one ding. 

I have NO CLUE why anyone would act outraged or surprised...maybe I just have no sympathy for fools.

Even with EPO and test and the related boosters, the amount of work necessary to achieve what LA did is insane.  The REASON he was able to win 7 was not him, it was because he made sure his entire team was devoted sufficiently to the cause.  No half ass non-dopers on the squad.

Cycling is a team sport.  I have no clue why the Hincapies of the world would rat him out; they were absolutely nothing without him.  Floyd Landis is a rat and decided to rat everyone out because he couldn't take the punishment he had coming to him.  Michel Ferrari was certainly a gifted sports doctor but he wasn't doing anything everyone else wasn't doing too.

bobola's picture

Has been reported - when Armstrong was in a hospital very sick with cancer, so many years ago, he told a friend that he doped, and speculated that the stuff may have trigegred his cancer.

Of course he later denies he said that.

What doesn't make sense is that with his amazing physiology, why did he take anything in the first place..??

From 1992 to 1999, the year of his first Tour de France win, Armstrong was able to increase his muscle efficiency by 8 percent through hard and dedicated training. Coyle says Armstrong is the only human who has been shown to change his muscle efficiency.

"It was believed that muscle efficiency is something you're born with, that you can't change," Coyle said. "But we've documented that Armstrong has indeed changed it while training intensely."

By making his muscles 8 percent more efficient, Coyle said, "Armstrong is 8 percent more powerful on the Tour de France"—enough to get his competitors off his wheel.




francis_sawyer's picture

 "The REASON he was able to win 7 was not him, it was because he made sure his entire team was devoted sufficiently to the cause. No half ass non-dopers on the squad.

Cycling is a team sport. I have no clue why the Hincapies of the world would rat him out; they were absolutely nothing without him. Floyd Landis is a rat and decided to rat everyone out because he couldn't take the punishment he had coming to him. Michel Ferrari was certainly a gifted sports doctor but he wasn't doing anything everyone else wasn't doing too..."


Jesus flippin Christ...

Can't y'ALL see that this is the EXACT same scenario as JEWS with BANKING?...

trav777's picture

he wouldn't have been able to win without taking stuff.

Period.  Impossible.

Armstrong won because in his first year, his doping regime really stunned other riders; he was asininedly better than the rest of the field that first Tour he won.  They all caught up chemically.  After that, it was a matter of keeping his team a machine fueled by hard work and dope while other teams had their top stars on the A-grade gear programs.

That's how cycling was except on Lance's team.  On Lance's team, EVERYONE got with the doping program, everyone had crit levels done, everyone had a schedule of stuff to take, after the EPO tests, everyone knew to inject IV and had blood bags to pack with.  On lesser teams, the top few guys only.

Armstrong pulled out all the stops and made a lot of guys on his team a lot of motherfkin money...and guess what, NOBODY DIED.  Hincapie married a trophy girl, got lots of money, endorsements, all of them did.  They all profited.

If you think Marco Pantani took a crit level in the 60s out of the alps naturally then you're delusional.  These things are physiologically impossible.

akak's picture

But if EVERYONE on his team was in on the doping, then that constitutes a "conspiracy theory", right?  And we know that those are automatically and inherently impossible, right?

European American's picture

"I still think he's a legend"


He is, right up there with Capone, Stalin and the mutant mulatto.


He'd ruthlessly slit your throat for another yellow jersey.

RichardENixon's picture

Well I don't know about anyone else but that certainly convinced me!

Shizzmoney's picture

Nike commericial:

Ad: "What are you on?"

LA: "What am I on?  My bike, working my ass off 6 hours a day!"


TerminalDebt's picture

MyBike (tm) is the new wonder-drug

like McDonalds All-Beef (tm)

blu's picture

Sort of like when Congress cuts TheFunding (TM) leaving you wondering what the fuck it was they did. Serve up a pizza?

Oh and this reminds me of an actual name of a sleezy bar in my old neighborhood: The Office ("Yeah honey sorry but I'm late at TheOffice (TM) tonight")


Almost Solvent's picture

The Office is a great name for a bar.

There was a bar called The Library near my undergrad. Easy to tell anyone you were at the library or on your way there for hours at a time.

shovelhead's picture

Best litigator bar, 'The Honest Lawyer'.

The sign had a headless suit holding a briefcase.

FrankDrakman's picture

Have one of those in Toronto, but it's called "My Office", as in "Yes, honey, I'm in my office"..

SWCroaker's picture

Amazing the focus on Armstrong, Bonds, Clemens.

Energy better spent on tearing down peeps like them than Corzine, Chilton, Dimon, Blankfien, Masters, Bernanke, Holder, etc.   Right? 


Magician: "Watch my hand, peeps, watch my hand!"

Disenchanted's picture



If they want to investigate an aspect of sports, start looking into why the tax powers of the State(s) are used to fund professional sports arenas. I call bullshit.

gmrpeabody's picture

But they aren't fair game....

blu's picture

I'm trying to figure out how real prosecutions of actual criminals would work inside the whole "bread and circuses" fluff thing and I'm just not seeing it.

Shizzmoney's picture

They should allow steroids in sports, anyways.  It would make cycling more interesting.

Matt's picture

Unlimited Mods. You got guys chopping off their own legs to replace them with cybernetics. Guys ripping out their own hearts to replace them with turbine pumps. People dying all over the race course from organ failures. Would certainly make it alot more dramatic.

j-dub's picture

"It's not a lie, if you believe it."


-George Patrick Costanza

Tsunami Wave's picture

**Jerry reciprocating, by giving a confused, glaring look back at George**

Zombie Investor's picture

For the most part I don't give a rip up about athletes using drugs.  Having said that, screw Lance Armstrong.  How many times did this guy flat out lie?  I'm guessing hundreds of times.  Even that I might be able overlook, but he tore apart and demonized anyone that told the truth about his doping.  

Zombie Investor's picture

Oh yeah, then he goes on Oprah for absolution.  What a coward.

August's picture

Lance only cheated and lied in order to receive the money, fame and respect he thought he deserved. 

So he's just a regular, post-modern kind of guy... an American Icon, perhaps, in the parlance of our times.  Either that, or just another whore.

Mercury's picture

Bike racers are weenies anyway. They claim pedestrian rules of the road when it's convenient, they claim automobile rules of the road when it's convenient...and then (when they're not yelling at anyone) they point to where they want to go and think that makes everything OK.

fuu's picture

Fuck you Lance.

francis_sawyer's picture

& the horse you rode in on... [oh wait]!