• Sprott Money
    05/06/2016 - 06:03
    The US, in its own decline, is showing this same self-destructive tendency. The worse things get, the greater the inclination of the citizenry to say, “Carry on, everything’s fine.”

Peter Schiff & Doug Casey On Gold, Investor Cluelessness, And The "Escape From America" Plan

Tyler Durden's picture




 

In just under 30 minutes, Peter Schiff and Doug Casey muse on many facets of the crumbling edifice of the status quo that is our current world.

From Gold's relatively imminent rise to $5,000 and beyond, to investor ignorance of reality, Casey & Schiff swing from discussions of the US as political entity going forward to 'escape from America' plans for personal and wealth assets, and the realization that the biggest casualty (of US indebtedness), aside from individual liberty, is the value of the dollar - as taxing the middle class is unpopular with both parties - leaving only one route for the government - the inflation tax. Owning gold, silver, and foreign assets is preferred and while the rest of the world is also printing, the US is likely to beat them all.

People "are clueless with respect to the true state of the global economy," with regard to inflation, fiat currencies, and specifically what will happen to the dollar. The conversation is wide-ranging and absolutely must-see as they remind market-watchers that "the whole thing is artificial," as you can't just keep printing money and monetizing debt without the dollar imploding with monetary policy descending (along with its trillion dollar coin) into 'Three Stooges' comedy.

The conversation weaves to some endgame discussions which bring Peter to discuss his father, who he sees as a political prisoner, and his views on the future...

"the biggest change that is coming to the global economy is a realignment of global living standards."

There is something here for everyone...


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Wed, 01/30/2013 - 23:45 | 3201329 Big Slick
Big Slick's picture

No.  The US is the only option.  2nd Amendment may be taking it on the chin, but nowhere else I'm aware of can you own the modern musket.  That's the dealbreaker for me in considering anywhere else. 

Wed, 01/30/2013 - 23:51 | 3201341 TotalCarp
TotalCarp's picture

I cant argue with that. You are a good man (i am taking a non pc assumption that you are in fact a male of the species). If that is your reasoning it is indeed 100% valid.

Most of the Amerikans i meet abroad tho whinge and complain about lack of little things they have grown accustomed to at home and hence cant imagine living abroad. Most of them dont realize that once the shit hits the fan those will be gone in an instant. 

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 01:30 | 3201599 aka Gil
aka Gil's picture

I'm glad that you and others are able to live well outside the USA. Unlike the ex-pat Amerikans you speak of, it sounds as though you possess a mindset that allows you to assimilate. Unfortunately for me, and speaking only for myself, that just won't work. Similar to the previous commenter, I have a 2nd Amendment mindset plus a lot of patience. I expect that the quality of living in this country, which is a rare gift that is taken for granted by most who live here, will take a hard turn for the worse sooner than later. A mess has been made, it will get worse, it will eventually be dealt with, after which we will get on with the pursuit of living more fulfilling lives without the want or need of a central planning authority.

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 09:19 | 3202019 TotalCarp
TotalCarp's picture

Thanks, Gil, the old US of A is a better place coz of people like you. I hope i am wrong and you will be proven right.. I left not because i dislike the place, but because i love the country for what it was created to be and cant stand watching the attrocities being done to the place.

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 11:56 | 3202538 Jethro
Jethro's picture

Gil, we will get to see how tyrannical the government becomes once it (truly) runs out of money.  The way I see it, we are 1 for 2 right now (win for the Revolutionary War, and a loss in the War of Northern Aggression).  I hope for a peacable solution, and would even welcome an amicable split, but have no faith that it will come to pass.  The good news is, the cultural conservatives (which tend to also be the fiscal conservatives) are generally better equipped to endure a crisis such as the one beginning to manifest.  However, the situation will be brutal and appalling.  It truly will be brother against brother, neighbor against neighbor once again.  Sad times lie ahead for us all I'm afraid.

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 16:34 | 3203791 Panafrican Funk...
Panafrican Funktron Robot's picture

Somehow I see life south of the Mason-Dixon being a tad better, though still extraordinarily shitty.  As one of my favorite song lyrics goes:

We're half awake, in a fake empire.

-The National

I think people have a vague understanding that something is terribly wrong, ergo our eagerness to lose ourselves in our portable telephones.  

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 01:24 | 3201586 JOYFUL
JOYFUL's picture

Preach it| Ain't just you duud!

There's a whole mess of us gringos what hopped the wire and cut outta Femaville for better parts...and a whole mess more who would like to, but get their heads turned around by the whole phony 'love it or leave it' diatribe.

NorteMerika...you leave cause you love it, and want to see your homeland returned to it's own peeple one day...but that day will be long time comin, and only after a brutal struggle between the sio-nazi usurpers and the pale riders who assembled themselves on the fringes of ZOG's empire to prepare for the long way back...

NorteMerika...you leave because the only way to avoid complicity in the crimes against humanity n nature perpetrated in your name is to resign the whole thing...not the passport bullshit, but the whole enchilada - phony talmudist values and empty consumerist zombie existence...resign from the fallen western lands to reconnect with the core of what made us a great peeple once pon a time. The talmudists want you holed up in some last redoubt perimeter where they can starve you out or drone you down like so much cattle. Don't fall for that phony paradigm...

Get yourselves an your kids outta the pot, take no heed of your fears of the foreign, for it's only in foreign lands now that you'll find a flavor of the forgotten values which we've lost sight of in only a few generations, under the whip of the cabbalist slavemasters. Find the way to a brighter day, afore the lights go out for good in Numenor!

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 03:03 | 3201705 gwar5
gwar5's picture

I agree. When I go away and return to Amerika it's a culture shock coming back and easier to see how much of a police state it's become. 

 

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 09:13 | 3201999 TotalCarp
TotalCarp's picture

Yes, i have the same impression. For years before i left i went for work and travel abroad to random corners and always had this uncomfortable unhappy feeling when i would fly back to US..

Thing is, i appreciate the guys like Gil above, who feel the need to stay. I feel i am lucky that i grew up with a mentality of whereever i set my tent for the nite, thats where my home is. Either way, i hope most here will have the luxury of choice before it all properly goes south.

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 11:43 | 3202485 Jethro
Jethro's picture

I've been extremely fortunate in my life.  Every day is a gift.  I got to live abroad in my youth when I was in the Marine Corps (Infantry and Embassy Duty), and you can inevitably find something good about any place on this beautiful planet.  I grew accustomed to having very little in the way of personal belongings.  Whatever fit inside my seabag was the almost the sum total of my possessions.  It is only when I returned, and became immersed in our culture that I began accumulating crap again.  Ultimately, these things are meaningless.  For almost all of my peers, their stuff owns them.  I need to simplify again.

Sadly, I won't be escaping anywhere when things "go south".  Why should I?  I took an oath, that I deem to be perpetually binding.  And, Like my ancestors a hundred and fifty years ago, I won't go looking for the fight, but instead let the fight come to me.  I hope that I live for the sake of my children, and the ones I love.  But if I don't, it's been a great life, and it will be a good day to die. 

Wed, 01/30/2013 - 23:57 | 3201356 2bit Hoarder
2bit Hoarder's picture

i lived in Thailand for 6 months ... if i had ""fuck you" money, i would go back and never return.

 

fricken paradise ... just gotta dodge the occasional tsunami. 

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 10:58 | 3202316 MeBizarro
MeBizarro's picture

Yeah for a small sliver of the population connected at the top (may 10%).  Rest struggle to make and upward mobility is basically unheard of unless you have the proper family and business connections. 

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 00:41 | 3201486 hawk nation
hawk nation's picture

My belief is if america collapses no place will be safe because the evil of all two bit dictators will be allowed to try to invade any country with resources 

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 06:00 | 3201816 jeff montanye
jeff montanye's picture

seems we (the u.s.) have the two bit dictators beaten in the last last half century like 24 to 4.  oh, but that's what kept them to single digits.  got it.  

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 09:17 | 3202009 TotalCarp
TotalCarp's picture

Hawk, do not confuse liberty and democracy. A non democratic government can give you more economic liberty (Singapore, HK) then the democracy that leads to dictatorship of the shepple (Venezuela)

Make no mistake democracy no longer is equal to liberty. Look at the US for gods sake.

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 00:36 | 3201472 Oldrepublic
Oldrepublic's picture

Hiroo Onoda was hiding out until March '74

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 01:12 | 3201563 Temporalist
Temporalist's picture

Perhaps he doesn't want his father to spend the rest of his life in prison without seeing his son. 

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 04:45 | 3201771 Harrison
Harrison's picture

His father is in federal prison because his father is a scam artist. Don't make it sound like some sort of political persecution over Peter's economic and political beliefs. Irwin Schiff was and is garbage of the lowest order and deserves to rot in prison right next to Madoff for all the pain he's caused. The only difference between those two (Irwin and Madoff) were the strategies they used to con people and the amounts of money they stole -- at least Madoff managed to do a brilliant job at scamming, Irwin just fucked thousands of fools out of a few dollars each.

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 06:17 | 3201835 malikai
malikai's picture

His pops is in prison on tax evasion convictions. He fought the IRS and got crushed by the Leviathon.

His father is a real "American Hero", if there is any such thing.

1. Learn to read. 2. Get lost.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irwin_Schiff

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 08:11 | 3201903 cabtrom
cabtrom's picture

Fuck you Harrison! War is coming,pick a side asshole!

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 10:45 | 3202279 TWSceptic
TWSceptic's picture

You're the stupidest person on this site, congrats!

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 09:09 | 3201991 Mi Naem
Mi Naem's picture

Schiff's stated hope and wish is for sufficient numbers of informed, prepared, and entrepreneurially inclined citizens to survive the coming collapse and help rebuild a country in which free citizens can prosper. 

Seems like a long shot, but I'm glad somebody still gives a st*t. 

Wed, 01/30/2013 - 23:19 | 3201210 economics9698
economics9698's picture

 

Black Swan about 8-10 months, gold $5,000 about 2014, 2015 at the latest.  Inflation is strange, some people are on top of it, some take months.  There will come a time, "crack-up boom" when all realize their money is worthless.  When that happens gold $5,000.

Schiff was off in his timing, people think Bernanke is keeping the market "up" but they have it 180 wrong, the Fed lost control of interest rates in 2008.  People should think of the Fed as not “propping up” the markets but piling cash onto the markets to his favorite banks (owners of the Fed) before the bubble bust.

In other words Bernanke knows the history of bubbles, 5 years, 6.6 max, and knows the bubble will bust, they always do.  He is playing dumb and propagating the "keep markets up" bull shit to the clueless politicians.  What he is doing is throwing as much cash as he can in the allotted time he has before the crash at his owners so that when the crash does occur the owners of the cash will be in a position to buy physical assets. 

Just like the Fed did in 1928 when the goosed the money supply one last time.

Same shit, different decade.

 

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 17:06 | 3203930 Panafrican Funk...
Panafrican Funktron Robot's picture

You are stating very accurate information, but I am personally agnostic regarding the nominal USD price of gold.  I think it's generally assumed that some explicit revaluation of the USD is probably coming in the near future, but that could go in either direction.  Maybe an old $1 becomes a new $100.  But, maybe an old $1 becomes a penny.  Gold could be $50/ounce.  Main thought here is that most real assets at this point are owned by either Fedgov or the TBTF.  If they were to suddenly make, say, mortgages, exorbitantly expensive and cause mass default, it would grealy reduce the quantity of citizen property owners.

The good news is that, in this scenario, even at $50, an ounce of gold is still going to be good for a year's worth of food for a family of 4.  There's a reason I've been buying 1/10th ounce increments, even though I can afford about an ounce a month.

Pity those buggers are so small they keep falling through sewer grates.  

Wed, 01/30/2013 - 22:45 | 3201161 Son of Loki
Son of Loki's picture

Anyone watch NPR on TV tonight? Some guest opined he does not understand why consumer confidence plunged since everythig is recovering 'so nicely' ...(to quote hs list) ...'retail, housing, and jobs....all recovering nicely'...he said.

 

Hard to believe the host didn't question this since a few minutes later, Judy Woodruff gets on and says how bad the economy is...worsening by the week....

 

Usually the reporting is not this bad on NPR. Clueless and crappy MSM misreporting to feed the Sheeples.

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 00:49 | 3201441 Oldrepublic
Oldrepublic's picture

Judy Woodruff is an old Nixon hack!

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 01:15 | 3201567 Freddie
Freddie's picture

She is libtard.  TV is for idiots who keep supporting The Matrix.  Nice job sheep.

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 17:13 | 3203961 Panafrican Funk...
Panafrican Funktron Robot's picture

Frontline and Bill Moyers general have the agenda of "the crony capitalist system is shit, here's why, ergo, we should have a socialist government", and while I disagree with their "ergo", they are useful in explaining the crony capitalist shit in easy to digest bits and pieces.  

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 00:00 | 3201357 Seer
Seer's picture

I don't hang out watching the clock.  And, I started my own party.

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 11:55 | 3202533 quadcap
quadcap's picture

Nice.   I started my own religion.  The Joyous Church of Loving Reason.  I have Muslim and Christian members, as well as some Jews and Hindus.   The atheists and the Taoists are already on board.   Y'all should start your own religions, it's a great conversation starter, to say nothing of how much fun the Jehova's Witnesses visits become when you have your own agenda.

 

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 00:51 | 3201511 AGuy
AGuy's picture

"Most still think that the dollar is still backed by gold or silver...so why buy it?"

No, they believe its backed by the US gov't. Note all those "cash for Gold" commericials. People rather spend ever nickel than save for their future. Also note that most of them bought into the housing bubble. Recall the gov't and talking heads telling the public to load up on debt to by housing, or take out home equity loans.

 

"because Americans are so damn stupid"

Yup!

Wed, 01/30/2013 - 22:11 | 3201073 lynnybee
lynnybee's picture

collapse already ! .... i have over 800 rolls of toilet paper stacked & 120 tubes of toothpaste that all expire next month !

Wed, 01/30/2013 - 22:17 | 3201090 otto skorzeny
otto skorzeny's picture

I've got enough tampons stockpiled to soak up the Red Sea

Wed, 01/30/2013 - 22:26 | 3201122 Toronto Kid
Toronto Kid's picture

Even if you glued them to your forehead in the middle of the apocalypse, you still won't get laid.

Wed, 01/30/2013 - 22:47 | 3201171 zorba THE GREEK
zorba THE GREEK's picture

Zorba has a 55 gal drum of vasoline, but that's a Greek thing.

Wed, 01/30/2013 - 22:59 | 3201177 Son of Loki
Son of Loki's picture

sorry, otto. Tampons are out due to Fuki sterilization of half the worlds females. Overies fried and dried up from radiation in the air, pesitcides in the food, antibiotics in the beef, GMO veggies and fruit, etc. (also no more PMS, however).

 

Diapers are "in" with 90% of the 'civilized' world ambling up over 75. ...and 'civilized' people hate pooping and peeing in their pants. Might also consider scooters, lift chairs, rolling walkers and wheelchair cushions. They will sell like hot cakes!

Go Long Diapers is the New Paradigm. I read GS has tons of the stuff (soft cotton diapers) stockpiled (in secret) around the world. They're so sneaky.

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 01:28 | 3201596 Freddie
Freddie's picture

LOL!  Can they be used in Molotov cocktails or just use an old sock?

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 05:25 | 3201803 Papasmurf
Papasmurf's picture

I've got enough tampons stockpiled to soak up the Red Sea

I hope you've got 55 gal drums of Midol to go with that.

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 06:05 | 3201821 jeff montanye
jeff montanye's picture

laughed til i coughed and i think of myself as a feminist.

Wed, 01/30/2013 - 22:13 | 3201074 Monedas
Monedas's picture

I'd like a debate:  Schiff and Casey  vs.  Obama and Bernanke !      A gagged Piers Morgan could monitor the debate .... with ear phones, in a straight jacket and locked in a sound proof booth !

Wed, 01/30/2013 - 22:14 | 3201085 otto skorzeny
otto skorzeny's picture

how could Obammy debate without a teleprompter and Shalom Bernank without Dimon's hand up his ass?

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 00:52 | 3201509 Oldrepublic
Oldrepublic's picture

If you tell a lot of lies you need a teleprompter, Schiff speaks without notes!

Wed, 01/30/2013 - 22:45 | 3201167 A Nanny Moose
A Nanny Moose's picture

I would settle for Bob Murphy vs. Kruggybear, for charity.

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 11:31 | 3202429 Jethro
Jethro's picture

Monedas, I get the impression that Piers Morgan is no stranger to a ball gag, and in fact might welcome it.

Wed, 01/30/2013 - 22:16 | 3201087 jplotinus
jplotinus's picture

Predictions of a world centering on gold, silver and guns is a defeatist fantasy. How many gun duels can one survive before encountering a faster drawing gunslinger?

Most ZH posters of the gun toting and the gold hoarding variety seem to harbor the illusion they can shoot and kill better than anyone else. In a pinch, are they likely to shoot first and straight while simultaneously eyeballing their gold stash?

Hey gunslingers, give it a rest and think through the consequences of your pet illusion.

Sheesh!

:-/

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 00:02 | 3201364 2bit Hoarder
2bit Hoarder's picture

damn .. so that USMC sniper training was a waste??!??!

i have a rock on the ground that says "past this point, you are in range" ... about half mile away from my lonely house.

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 05:10 | 3201790 Harrison
Harrison's picture

Yeah, you need SEAL training like me. I was in UBT Class 212, where we learned to jump out of B2s at altitude, man. I'll HALO in on top of you and chew your throat out before you can swing that rifle around.

(Damn, 880 yards? I'm only good out to 600. Sad panda here.)

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 06:08 | 3201825 jeff montanye
jeff montanye's picture

if it's science fiction is it even science anymore?

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 00:33 | 3201467 Karlus
Karlus's picture

Most important thing is not that I am a crack shot, but that I see you first.

If you are moving around, there is an excellent chance of that happening

Also, if I know the terrain and environment and you dont, its also a big advantage

Finally, practice practice practice. Its good for you and its good for the weapon. Better to find out your weapon jams on the range than zombie time

Thu, 01/31/2013 - 01:31 | 3201602 Freddie
Freddie's picture

+1

Most important thing is not that I am a crack shot, but that the zombies approaching me are probably high from smoking crack. 

 

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