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Guest Post: How Stupid Is The American Public?

Tyler Durden's picture




 

Via Monty Pelerin's World,

The cruelest law of all is the minimum wage. It is the most basic law of economics: if the price rises on a good (ceteris paribus, of course), then less of it will be purchased. Labor is no exception. When you raise the price (i.e., the minimum wage in this case), less labor at the low end of the skill scale will be employed. For a thorough discussion, see here.

In a time when our economy is struggling and teenage unemployment is through the roof (especially minorities), raising the minimum wage is the worst thing that can be done. This price control hurts the most vulnerable in society and those most in need of jobs. Yet the political class knows they can depend upon the ignorance and stupidity of the voting public. By appearing to be compassionate, they gain favor and votes. This move is not compassionate, it is harmful and destructive. There is nothing more harmful to low-skilled workers than raising the minimum wage. If it benefits politicians they don’t care what havoc and destruction they impose so long as enough of the people can be fooled.

The reality is that  Government schooling produced this situation of zero to low skills. Now government rides to the rescue by making laws that make it illegal for their damaged output to be hired. No employer will hire an employee that costs him money. Unless the employee has a reasonable chance of contributing more than he costs, he has no hope of escaping unemployment. Unskilled workers are capable of doing productive work, but not at a beginning wage set too high by politicians looking out only for themselves.  If the minimum wage is so good, why not raise it to $20.00 per hour or $50.00? Wouldn’t that erase poverty?

The answer is an emphatic no! The higher the minimum wage the more poverty and unemployment results. This “feel-good” legislation will raise unemployment. Sadly, it will also destroy lives. It effectively makes it a crime to higher willing workers with low skills. These are people who deserve better than what they received from government schools. Entering the workforce at any wage would provide the work habits and skills that would enable them to quickly go beyond their entry levels. These low-skilled workers are no different than MBAs who enter at lower wages than they will earn after training and gaining experience.

The tragedy of the minimum wage is that it ruins lives. It condemns many to a lifetime of unemployment, welfare and living a life equivalent to a ward of the state. These “compassionate” politicians don’t care how much damage they do so long as you are too ignorant to see through their scheme. They want your vote. So long as you are ignorant enough to believe they are doing compassionate and generous things, they will continue to destroy lives.

This survey from Rasmussen is confirmation of the appalling economic ignorance of the American public.

 

54% Favor Raising Minimum Wage to $9 An Hour

 

Most voters don’t think the minimum wage is enough to live on and support President Obama’s proposal to raise it from $7.25 an hour to $9 an hour. They’re more narrowly divided, however, when asked if hiking the minimum wage will be good for the economy. Read More

With every passing day, the American public makes H. L. Mencken appear to have been more of a genius than he possibly was. His evaluations of the public were merciless. Here are but a couple of his pronouncements:

Democracy is a pathetic belief in the collective wisdom of individual ignorance.

 

Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard.

Mencken must be chuckling from his grave at the situation we allowed our criminal class politicians to impose on us. Even he probably could not have imagined how dumbed-down the government has made recent generations. Make no mistake, it is government and its policies responsible. Despite all the blather about education, our criminal class is quite content with having stupid constituents. An educated public would have ridden these crooks out of town on a rail.

 

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Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:15 | 3264225 kato
kato's picture

you qualify for the Churchill expression "I thought the miners were the most ignorant people I ever met, until I met the mine owners" as a mine owner.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:20 | 3264249 DJ Happy Ending
DJ Happy Ending's picture

Rum, sodomy & the lash, bitchez.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:22 | 3264260 Pladizow
Pladizow's picture

"How Stupid Is The American Public?"

All comments will be understatements!

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:23 | 3264270 EnglishMajor
EnglishMajor's picture

If KFC ain't hiring, guess I'll go back to college.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:26 | 3264283 Say What Again
Say What Again's picture

I'd love to comment, but I'm late for an interview at 7-11

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:33 | 3264309 kaiserhoff
kaiserhoff's picture

Here's an idea.  Enforce the law of the land.

$10,000 dollar fine for each offense of knowingly hiring an illegal alien.

Cures many problems.  We could even include a bounty system.  Go, Mrs. Dog, Go.

God, what an ugly Bitch.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:39 | 3264345 Pladizow
Pladizow's picture

The peoples problems differ from those of the government machine, that is the problem.

The government needs bodies to tax and the "American" birth rate isnt cutting it!

Also need open borders for an American Union and NWO.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 17:10 | 3264780 Umh
Umh's picture

How come it's mostly the rich and the poor who have large families?

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 20:19 | 3265367 TwoShortPlanks
TwoShortPlanks's picture

"How Stupid Is The American Public?".....hahahahaha....how long have I got and how truthful would you like me to be?

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 20:53 | 3265450 icanhasbailout
icanhasbailout's picture

PEAK STUPIDITY IS A MYTH

Sun, 02/24/2013 - 01:54 | 3271063 mkkby
mkkby's picture

If the minimum wage is so good, why not raise it to $20.00 per hour or $50.00? Wouldn’t that erase poverty?

This author is the stupid one.  Eliminate the min wage and watch lobbyists bring in swarms of immigrants willing to work for a plate of beans.  There needs to be a balance.  When there are millions unemployed, management has all the power.  All those desperate people would drive wages to zero -- you've all seen this result of globalization, right?  A reasonable min wage gives workers AT LEAST SOMETHING. 

Also, we need to enforce the law and make it extremely expensive to hire illegals.  Large fines and personal liabilty for officers/directors.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 00:28 | 3266028 Edmon Plume
Edmon Plume's picture

The American Birth rate implies there aren't enough pregnancies.  Simply put, the US is reaping the result of sowing abortion.  Japan legalized abortion post WWII and their population balance has cratered.  Europe is in the same boat, hence france importing millions of muslims.

It would seem that "advanced" societies will ultimately lose out to the barbarians.  You've come a long way, baby.

The muzzies won't have to fire a shot.  And they know it.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:40 | 3264348 Xibalba
Xibalba's picture

If you think 50% of America is stupid, just look at the other half and they all seems smart.  

idiocracy

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:45 | 3264374 fourchan
fourchan's picture

they are all exactly this stupid, which should make us here feel justifably great.

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Jr7McLhZmyE

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 16:00 | 3264440 BLOTTO
BLOTTO's picture

Im not sure if its stupid as much as they are totally brainwashed...

.

?

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 16:05 | 3264486 augie
augie's picture

brainwashed to be stupid.

"An educated citizenry is a vital requisite for our survival as a free people."

 

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 16:19 | 3264567 Stackers
Stackers's picture

Mama always said, stupid is as stupid does

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 16:18 | 3264557 Kreditanstalt
Kreditanstalt's picture

@kaiserhoff: What's the difference between government price-fixing in the labor market via "minimum wages" and your suggestion to prop up the artificially-high wages of Americans actually working via artificial political border controls?  Not much I submit: you're both protectionists and anti-freedom.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 16:24 | 3264597 kaiserhoff
kaiserhoff's picture

I'm writing this from Florida, a state which is currently being over-run by illegals and out of control welfare breeding.

There are many reasons for borders.  One of those reasons is to prevent all of the drug, corruption, and ignorance problems of the third world from coming to live in your own home town.  That quickly destroys the value of anyone's "labor" or productivity, and makes rule of law a bad joke.  All in our President-for-life's plans.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 17:15 | 3264794 MachoMan
MachoMan's picture

Does free trade destroy the value of one's productivity or merely pull it from the arms of protectionism and isolation, thereby exposing it for its real value?

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 19:36 | 3265235 Alhazred
Alhazred's picture

If we didnt live in a welfare state, i would agree with you that we should not stop the labor market across boarders.

In a perfect world we would have a free market in labor and no welfare.

 

Both restrictive immigration and welfare are problems we need to address but the order in which they are addressed is very important.

Unless we fix our welfare before we open our boarders, we will NEVER fix welfare.  The evils of democracy are well known, and it would be folly to suggest opening the boarders before we fix the issue of welfare.

 

Just because an open boarder is part of the solution, does NOT make it a wise first step.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:01 | 3267853 MachoMan
MachoMan's picture

You pretend as though we have a choice in the matter.  The political system is always beholden to the underlying economic system.  The underlying economic system is always beholden to self interest and other basic human emotions, capital going to where it's treated the best being a glaring example.

It's also disingenuous to claim that we actually fix anything...  instead, we run headfirst into resource constraints and production incentive problems and the economic system crashes, thereby necessitating political change.  Your cause and effect is backwards.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 23:36 | 3265875 barroter
barroter's picture

$50,000 fine for each count. Felonize it and mandatory prison time.

 

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:32 | 3264310 Kitler
Kitler's picture

Better hurry... there are going to to be more applicants now that they are going to have to pay big bucks.

Probably even a few lawyers and bankers

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 16:01 | 3264443 Hacked Economy
Hacked Economy's picture

My (young at the time) son was happy the last time there was a minimum wage increase here in CA.  The problem was...he was already making a little more than the minimum, so when the increase went into effect and his (recently hired) co-workers saw their paychecks go up to match, his own pay rate didn't move at all.

"Hey, that's not fair...I've been here twice as long as they have, and I didn't get a raise?"

Nope.  I used the experience as an object lesson to teach him about the reality of the minimum wage (ahem...I mean "living wage").

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 16:48 | 3264703 AlaricBalth
AlaricBalth's picture

In 1968 the minimum wage was approximately $1.50 an hour. However, if measured in 2012 dollars, the comparable wage would be $9.89 an hour.

A hike in the minimum wage would impact the food sector of the economy the most. Farm labor, fast food workers, grocery cashiers would all get pay raises, yet the additional income would be offset by additional food costs.

Another unintended consequence of raising the minimum wage would be a change in the denominator of the BLS unemployment equation. A 24% hike in wages would certainly attract more people to seek work. Those people would no longer be "not in the labor force" and the unemployment rate would go up.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 17:14 | 3264790 Umh
Umh's picture

You have to get a job and then be laid off to be counted as unemployed around here. It's been a few years, but they used to calculate unemployment benefits from the high 4 of the last 5 quarters. No workee no checkee.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 17:19 | 3264809 MachoMan
MachoMan's picture

The only way increases to the minimum wage would entice anyone to "attract people to seek more work" is if the minimum wage was raised high enough, and enough hours were available to work and the taxes on that labor low enough, to overtake the value of the benefits provided by the social safety net.  Don't recall the figure exactly, but $69,xxx or so...  you think raising the minimum wage to this is going to really be a game changer?  Bread and circuses.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 16:52 | 3264719 Zap Powerz
Zap Powerz's picture

We all make exactly what we are worth. Not one red cent more or one red cent less.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 17:16 | 3264796 Umh
Umh's picture

I agree with you sentiments, but check out the annual issue of Parade that talks about what people make around the US.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 17:21 | 3264815 MachoMan
MachoMan's picture

We make what we are able to receive or take, by hook or by crook.  What we are "worth" has nothing to do with it.  Otherwise, most public servants would have to pay into the system instead of receiving a paycheck.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 17:47 | 3264906 secret_sam
secret_sam's picture

It's that whole "price vs. value" distinction that eludes so many.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 17:36 | 3264874 Nikao7
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BULLSHIT

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:35 | 3264322 James_Cole
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"When you raise the price (i.e., the minimum wage in this case), less labor at the low end of the skill scale will be employed."

OK geniuses, show a historical correlation between countries with higher minimum wage / higher levels of unemployment...or shut the fuck up.

Even simpler, show any historical trend correlation between higher minimum wage (adjusted for inflation) & unemployment....or shut the fuck up.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:42 | 3264353 Pladizow
Pladizow's picture

What was the title of this article?

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:51 | 3264392 paterphysi
paterphysi's picture

title of the article should be "if you don't believe/think as I do, you are stupid"

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 16:01 | 3264448 pods
pods's picture

Even simpler (and you do not have to use government statistics to see it).

Say as an employer, you have $20K available to pay your two people that work for you. The minimum wage correlates to $10k each.

Now double the minimum wage to $20k.

How many people can you employ for that $20k?

pods

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 16:44 | 3264670 diesheepledie
diesheepledie's picture

Please don't use mathematics, logic, or objective reasoning on the sheep! It makes the meat tougher.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 17:22 | 3264818 Paul Bogdanich
Paul Bogdanich's picture

The Germans use a novel and more effective approach to the same problem.  Cap the maximum wage at 300 times the lowest wage paid at the same company to include the cleaning and other "contractors."  That simple step plus management greed keeps everyones wages up and in some semblance of proportion.  Same thing with abortion.  It has been known since Roman times that the most effective way to reduce unwanted or abandoned children is to punish the men involved in the preganacy and not the women.  Brings the illigetimate birth rate right down and in a big hurry as well.  So in essence all this stuff is just a smoke screen.         

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 18:02 | 3264959 Cathartes Aura
Cathartes Aura's picture

both solutions so obvious, so simple, so easy to understand, so necessary if one is trying to build a culture/society that actually works. . .

of course, if one is merely trying to farm human labour for profit, what you've pointed to is going in the opposite direction, and would never appeal.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 20:00 | 3265311 Sparkey
Sparkey's picture

Dear Cathartes Aura, IF one was to farm human labour for profit, he would keep them well fed healthy and happy, so they could perform the labour he made his profit on, the fact that our leaders no longer seem  to have that for a social goal speaks volumes for our diseased state, Let us use the Bee hive as a metaphor for society,truly which "Leaders" (It seems there may be more than a few),would not be better served as Queen Bee to a healthy and thriving Bee hive rather than a diseased one? A diseased hive will kill a lot of Bees that won't be available for work in the spring, no good for profits!

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 21:23 | 3265509 Al Huxley
Al Huxley's picture

Well, bad news for the worker bees is that the ruling class doesn't need them anymore, there's enough automation that now they're just deadweight and mouths to feed. 

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 22:22 | 3265660 Sparkey
Sparkey's picture

The Rulers may not be as sagacious and omnipotent as they tell themselfs they are,  actions speak lowder than words, ar'nt these the people who sent the jobs away and crashed the Banking system? Was that part of the plan?

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 21:40 | 3265546 Cathartes Aura
Cathartes Aura's picture

dear Sparkey, have you ever seen a cattle fed lot?  I have, and I've smelled it too.  animals knee-deep in their excrement, being fatten'd with GMO corn derivatives & stale candy, shot up with meds/antibiotics because their systems are poisoned.

"well fed" died with the "family farm" meme - the only "well" being "fed" is the infinite depths of need for profits. . . and once one completely, thoroughly *groks* the global story, and realises workers are being factory-farmed in *gasp* other fenced fields aka "nationstates" - then the realisation of just how far down the path of "fallow" this current farm really is.  cradle to grave, doctors/pharma, the amrkn "consumer" is on it's last legs - the plantations have moved elsewhere.  resource extraction will still continue, and some will be paid to do this, but the majority are not needed, certainly not ones needing to be paid more than slave wages.

of course, the winding down will continue to "take profits" - but it IS being wound down, no doubts - and other plantations/farms are being exploited, so much profits, so little time. . .

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 22:13 | 3265639 Sparkey
Sparkey's picture

Al and Cathartes, I do see your points and looking at the situation rationally whithout undue emotion, there probably far too many people on the Planet, yet,, if the thinning isn't done with the utmost care, panic will result, if chaos truly rules all bets are off, the outcome of chaos cannot be planned, all modern people need the modern world to survive so any popredux scheme, must have as one of it's goals, the unimpeded transmission forward of technology this is all going to take vision and leadership.

so much profits, so little time. . ." The road to oblivion, Almost everyone is still eating, why not focus on that, call that prosperity, our ancesters would have, and go forward from there, let's not sink anyfarther or we may get so low we will never get up again!

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 00:59 | 3266090 Cathartes Aura
Cathartes Aura's picture

well, looking at this situation rationally, and without undue emotion, the "thinning" is already taking place, even here in the land o' the free and formerly wealthy first-worlders. . . the "thinning" is happening through the tainted food supply, the massive use of experi-Mental pharma, soon to be normalised if "healthcare" becomes "mandatory" - though personally, I think amrka hits a speed bump and flips before it gets anywhere close to what is being discussed as plans. . .

the "thinning" is all around us, in the 45% of ex-military applying for disability, many citing the genocidal depleted uranium used on the "enemy" but somehow it "missed" and they're experiencing the symptoms that were supposed to be for the trrrsts. . .more "thinning" in the one in ten amrkns on anti-depressants, most of those combining different brain-meds, long term, and begin using at younger ages than ever.

the "thinning" will continue with the toxic fud-stuffs that people continue to eat, the fluoride and residual pharma in the municipal water supplies, the continual degrading of the very air we breathe.

you can call that prosperity if you like, but I can't.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 08:55 | 3266440 Sparkey
Sparkey's picture

I've never called it `Prosperity`Cathartes, my point is; it will be difficult to complete the agenda without becoming a victim yourself, like the DE shells poisoning the troops who fired them, all these other things will make the World unlivable for everyone including the people who thought it up and got it started, it has started and it will not stop until everything is consumed! including the people who delude themselves with their dreams of omnipotency!

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 15:46 | 3267811 Cathartes Aura
Cathartes Aura's picture

ah yes, I agree that it is difficult to remain pure/untouched in an environment designed to eliminate "excess" - but I'm sure there are ways to exempt certain peoples from the most dangerous intentions - don't eat the fud-substitutes, don't drink the pharma/fluoride laced waters, don't put oneself in "heroic" war games, etc.

but yes, inevitably all are touched by living. . . some have the means to exist longer, as always.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 20:30 | 3265394 diesheepledie
diesheepledie's picture

The Germans are awesome and efficient. I would investigate this ideas seriously if it involves controlling the greedy animals. As far as abortion goes we should force abortions on the unproductive class - i.e. housing project dwellers, and other statistically proven unproductive livestock.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 21:44 | 3265555 Cathartes Aura
Cathartes Aura's picture

lol, how does that square with the ole zygote personhood push?

you controllers need to get yer desires in order, a lot of mixed messages being sent of late. . .

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 16:50 | 3264708 Zap Powerz
Zap Powerz's picture

Oh, I know this wun!  Is the answer "tacos"?

Sun, 02/24/2013 - 02:12 | 3271079 mkkby
mkkby's picture

Pods, the math is obviously correct but it misses the point.  What is better for poor people, not how many are employed.

If there is no min wage, watch lobbyists bring in swarms of immigrants willing to work for a plate of beans.  If driving wages to zero is best, you can move to China or India and experience that first hand.

Globalization is precisely using free trade and wage arbitrage to turn everyone into a slave.  All that in the guise of capitalism and freedom.  Don't get suckered.  Free trade (including labor) only works when power is equalized.  Until then a reasonable min wage guarantees the worker AT LEAST SOMETHING.

Hey, as long as we're bashing min wage, let's allow small children to work.  And let's eliminate all worker safety rules.  They did it willingly, right?  That's freedom, right?

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 16:12 | 3264509 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

Comparisons like what you mentioned are useless unless wages are the only variable. Which is impossible.

As a thought experiment, what would US employment statistics look like if its minimum wage were $20/hour? $40/hour?

 

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 16:36 | 3264648 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

"Comparisons like what you mentioned are useless unless wages are the only variable. Which is impossible."

That IS his basic argument, raise the minimum wage and unemployment goes up, it's simple to the point of moronic. My basic counter was OK then show a correlation. 

The underlying argument is usually something along the lines of... increased minimum wage means increased input costs which means higher product costs which (i guess) means less sales, which then leads to job cuts and thus higher unemployment.

Of course looking ONLY at labour input costs paints a certain picture, but if one looks at a variety of factors + margins it's pretty obvious that for the largest employers of minimum wage workers their labour cost is a very small part of the overall product. 

Aapl employs slave labour via a Taiwanese company to assemble it's devices. In Q2 2012 they had a 46% margin, they could easily pay their workers a living wage and not have any noticeable affect to their margin. They don't because why would they? 

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 17:01 | 3264748 Kayman
Kayman's picture

James_Cole

If I understand you correctly, you countered your own agrument.  If the U.S. raises the U.S. minimum wage then AAPL will send more jobs overseas. Ergo, raise the minimum wage and raise the U.S. unemployment rate.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 17:25 | 3264832 MachoMan
MachoMan's picture

What jobs are left to offshore?  If America couldn't compete with the rest of the world @ $7/hour, thereby necessitating offshoring and ushering in a total service based economy, then how the fuck can we compete @ $9/hour?  I don't think an increase to the minimum wage would necessarily result in any additional offshoring.  At least not for apple...  Stopping work or firing people, sure...  but rehiring people in BFE china to do the work, doubtful.  What's left to offshore?

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 17:30 | 3264859 rwe2late
rwe2late's picture

 If wages were the only variable that mattered to employers...

(taxes, transportation costs, security, public health care, etc.)

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 17:44 | 3264900 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

"If I understand you correctly, you countered your own agrument.  If the U.S. raises the U.S. minimum wage then AAPL will send more jobs overseas. Ergo, raise the minimum wage and raise the U.S. unemployment rate."

Yep, you do not understand me correctly. AAPL has already sent all the jobs it can reasonably outsource to other countries. My point was AAPL could easily pay their workers in China a living wage (even by Chinese standards Foxconn is a very poor employer) without any impact on their margins.

Interestingly, Foxconn has been laying people off lately. Why? Demand. During the good times the employees are paid horrendously, subjected to abhorrent working conditions and forced to do heavy overtime. During the bad times they're laid off immediately. And AAPL's assembly workers in China are treated like kings compared to Wal-Marts garment manufacturers in Bangladesh.

Also on this subject, in the US 100 yrs ago - after slavery - working conditions (and wages) in various parts of America were not much different than in todays third world sweatshops - something important to remember, often forgotten.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 21:34 | 3265537 cynicalskeptic
cynicalskeptic's picture

The 6 WalMart heirs are worth more than 40% of all Americans - courtesy of minimal estate taxes.  Not like they did anything themselves to earn that money - luck of being a relative of Sam Walton.  Those 6 peopel made their money from WalMart where a marority of the employees are kept woprking less than full-time so WalMart doesn't have to pay them any benefots.  WalMart employees are collecting foodstamps and going without medical coverage while the owners of their company have more moeny than they can spend - literally.

How about companies simply sharing their profits with their workers on a SLIGHTLY more equitsble split?  

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 22:53 | 3265748 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

No one is preventing any employee of Walmart from buying shares of the company.

BTW, use yer spel cheker.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 17:44 | 3264896 Storm Bringer
Storm Bringer's picture

If you raise the minimum wage to $20 or $40 per hour then those that are making the minimum right now - that are not productive will be replaced by those that are.  Those replaced will go on unemployment and the UE will rise accordingly.  It will start to go down when they exhaust their benifits and go off the rolls.  

 

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 18:19 | 3265009 max2205
max2205's picture

Americans know a free lunch when they smell one.   

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:36 | 3264324 BKbroiler
BKbroiler's picture

can't have rampant inflation without minimum wage going up... 

conversly, no minimum wage would lower wages, lower wages would force deflation, which for 99% of us would be a good thing since we actually include food and fuel in our daily costs.  Give me massive deflation and high interest rates anyday, the money I save in the bank increases and my expenditures decrease, allowing me to build capital.  This is obviously the opposite of what banksters want, so who do you think gets their wish?

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:40 | 3264340 BKbroiler
BKbroiler's picture

that's also why this Bernanke "wealth effect" is such bullshit.  I really don't give a shit if my house goes down in value as long as the house itself doesn't shrink.  Having it increase in value doesn't make me feel any richer since the property tax will go up, as will the commercial rents in the neighoborhood, pushing up the prices of the goods they sell.   It doesn't take a Phd to figure it out.  

Sun, 02/24/2013 - 02:18 | 3271082 mkkby
mkkby's picture

Well, then you must love globalization.  Go to Mexico, India, China or Viet Nam.  Nice places, right?  There they have no min wage, no child labor laws, no worker safety regs.  Throngs of desperate people willing to do anything for a meal.  All those laws tip the power balance to workers A TINY LITTLE BIT.  Which is the only reason we don't live like sewer rats here too. 

Stop being suckered by the elite before you and your family/friends get ground down too.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:28 | 3264298 New England Patriot
New England Patriot's picture
Price floors: Making it illegal to be efficient since 1894.
Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:24 | 3264274 Say What Again
Say What Again's picture

I know what you mean.

I thought it was a trick question.

I hated taking those SATs!

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:52 | 3264398 RebelDevil
RebelDevil's picture

Everyone hates them.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 17:29 | 3264856 Umh
Umh's picture

Why? Most of life's task don't go away in an afternoon. The SATs are just a quick read on what people retained from all that bullshit they sat thru.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:44 | 3264365 tickhound
tickhound's picture

"All comments will be understatements!"

 

I'll take a shot.  A quarter of the population CAN'T READ.  This does NOT include the quarter that can BARELY read.  From here we get a clearer picture of an "average."  The average American is dumb.  Half are dumber than that.  - carlin sorta

Now realize that nearly ALL of them can vote.

A picture develops as to just how stupid and DANGEROUS the American Public is...

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 16:17 | 3264559 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

The problem isn't that they aren't smart enough.

It's that they aren't anarchists.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 17:54 | 3264928 tickhound
tickhound's picture

So people who can't read, are somehow bright enough to COMPREHEND a government solution?  Particularly one that places the onus on themselves?  That's stupid people genocide by suicide... And although it may sound appealing, even stupidity has a floor. 

 

   

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 13:26 | 3267372 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

There are no government solutions.

No government is the solution.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 17:44 | 3264898 sgt_doom
sgt_doom's picture

Well, if anyone believes Rockefeller's chief stooge, Peter G. Peterson, they sure are stoopid.

http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Portal:Fix_the_Debt

http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php/File:FixTheDebtFlat.png

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 23:41 | 3265892 monkeyboy
monkeyboy's picture

The world went full retard eons ago.

If one were to view life currently as it is, it would be an Orwellian Greek Comedy in the style of Idiocracy, which gets more bizzare by the day.

 

 

 

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:26 | 3264263 Jay Gould Esq.
Jay Gould Esq.'s picture

The Utopian schemes of levelling, and a community of goods, are as visionary and impracticable, as those which vest all property in the Crown, are arbitrary, despotic, and in our government unconstitutional. Now what property can the colonists be conceived to have, if their money may be granted away by others, without their consent ?

-- Samuel Adams. 1768.

Come full circle the times indeed.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:47 | 3264381 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

What property? As shown by history, the property stolen from the Indians.

'Americans', keeping to party as it was 1777.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:55 | 3264416 pods
pods's picture

Leave it to a Chinaman to lecture an Amerikan about stealing property.

LOL, you are on fire today!

pods

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 16:22 | 3264584 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

What concept of property did the Indians have?

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 17:35 | 3264870 Umh
Umh's picture

They weren't stupid just outnumbered.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 18:19 | 3265003 Cathartes Aura
Cathartes Aura's picture

isn't "property" a Crown thing?

How can you buy or sell the sky, the warmth of the land? The idea is strange to us.

[...] So, when the Great Chief in Washington sends word that he wishes to buy our land, he asks much of us. The Great Chief sends word he will reserve us a place so that we can live comfortably to ourselves. He will be our father and we will be his children.

ahhh, the old "god model" - Daddy above, children below - right there, working as inTENDed.

we're flock'd.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 23:09 | 3265790 nmewn
nmewn's picture

Do own a pet?

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 15:48 | 3266098 Cathartes Aura
Cathartes Aura's picture

no

 

edit to add a lol. . .

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 17:05 | 3264763 Kayman
Kayman's picture

I thought I smelled a Chicom. How are your handlers in the grey tower this morning. Isn't it a little bit early for you to be so frisky ?

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 16:00 | 3264433 davidsmith
davidsmith's picture

No they don't.  You are a clown.  We live in a world in which the oligarchs have taken over the political system and are now using it to loot the rest of the population.  Learn from the past, don't live in the past.  You are quite the little fascist puppy, aren't you?

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 16:27 | 3264614 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

So get rid of the governments.

If you are against that, then you are a cause of the problems.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:25 | 3264278 Stoploss
Stoploss's picture

Now the retard in chief wants to create an infrastructure  = bank =.

 

That is how stupid the American public is... 

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:25 | 3264279 OutLookingIn
OutLookingIn's picture

Stupid???

Not nessesarily so.

Overly ignorant maybe. But stupid?

Put the blame where it belongs. A corporate controlled MSM and the governmental propaganda.

You deserve whatever government you have. Until the light shines through. When? WTFK's!

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 16:01 | 3264442 Vlad Tepid
Vlad Tepid's picture

If we can call the German's "evil" for having been snookered by their totalitarian overlords, I think it's more than fair to call the American people "stupid" for having been snookered by theirs.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 23:35 | 3265871 mkhs
mkhs's picture

Reasonable.  However, two wrongs don't make a right. 

The Germans weren't evil.  Where ever did you get that idea?

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:23 | 3264265 Say What Again
Say What Again's picture

How about if we make the minimum wage at any given corporation be a function of the CEO's compensation.

You could say that everyone must make AT LEAST 1.5% of the CEO's total compensation from the previous year.

That might provide a little bit of "balance."

Yes I know -- Such an idea would never make it through congress, because it would dip into their campaign contributions.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:39 | 3264336 Monedas
Monedas's picture

Another brilliant "Socialist Savior" with a predictable brain storm (mental fart) panacea .... very few people have the raw intellect to appreciate the purity of Capitalism .... just me and a few others .... this Monty Pelerin seems to be in Monedas' exclusive club ! Cheers !

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:54 | 3264408 paterphysi
paterphysi's picture

Your post has to be snark, Monedas "the raw intellect to appreciate the purity of Capitalism." Really, no one can be that stupid to really mean such a thing.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 16:02 | 3264450 Say What Again
Say What Again's picture

Right - a "pure capitalist."

Just like Rush Limbow

The reality is that both political extremes are bad for society.  A labor union making unreasonable demands leads to the demise of the corporation.  But a greedy tyrant - like Rockefeller - leads to the demise of the society. What is needed is reasonable compromise from both sides that rewards hard work in an equitable fashion.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 17:03 | 3264747 Temporalist
Temporalist's picture

I up arrowed you because there is a happy medium that may come naturally and in the past, when people didn't have the ability to communicate en masse, workers could not unite nor speak out against their employers, nor alert the public to problems with their employers, nor find a lawyer to represent them so easily, they had few options and poor results so everytime today is compared to yesteryear there is a falsehood that I can't relate to.

 

Today people have far more power to have a cohesive voice against an employer that is unfair.  They have far better working conditions.  They sue much more frequently (to the point of driving some businesses to collapse from the result of one person sexually harrassing someone or verbally abusing someone or not being sensitive enough).  They can get health care (which I don't think should be linked to employers/employment exclusively but that is a different topic) and child care.  They have access to the media and can "expose" a company much more easily or socially network to find information about misdeeds by employers.

 

Unfortunately the hysterical hypocritical people whine and bitch and then vote the same politicians that make empty promises and do nothing into power all while declaring all this unfair but still shop at Walmart who get their products from China and keep their employees on part time work so they don't have to pay health benefits while paying minimum wage.

 

I agree there is a better way.  It is not by raising minimum wages, it is not by unions, it is not by supporting mega corporations and lobbyists and corrupt politicians nor banksters.  Participating in a corrupt system will not fix anything.  Pretending that the system, that the majority thinks sucks and is unfair, is not corrput is part of the probelm if not the main probelm.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 16:02 | 3264452 Vlad Tepid
Vlad Tepid's picture

Most Japanese companies have a rule like this - except the number is closer to 10%.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:37 | 3264318 Ignatius
Ignatius's picture

you qualify for the Churchill expression "I thought the miners were the most ignorant people I ever met, until I met the mine owners" as a mine owner."  -- Kato

Churchill is a genius at pithy statements that distract from real issues (non-sequitors).

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 17:14 | 3264792 Kayman
Kayman's picture

"Yes, my lady, it is true that I am drunk" says Churchill, "But I shall be sober in the morning. And you, madam, will continue to be_________"

I quess, "A gathering storm" while Hitler built up German might was a non sequitur for you.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 20:22 | 3265374 MisterMousePotato
MisterMousePotato's picture

ugly

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:41 | 3264350 FL_Conservative
FL_Conservative's picture

You're going to ask this question of the people who elected Obama twice and fall for the statist gameplan regularly?   It sucks being one of the few attempting to bail water out of the titanic.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:48 | 3264384 wee-weed up
wee-weed up's picture

Hint... it's gonna sink!

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 17:18 | 3264803 sgt_doom
sgt_doom's picture

Great comments, Kato, to yet another "Milty Friedman-like" diatribe.

Ten out of ten Ameritards polled still don't understand the underlying causes of the global economic meltdown.

For the answer, please see my comment (sgtdoom: The Act of Predation) under comments at this link:

http://www.thestranger.com/slog/archives/2013/02/20/morning-news-birthday-strippers-funeral-heroes-and-musical-bullies&view=comments

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 23:41 | 3265890 mkhs
mkhs's picture

If it is not important enough to post here, it is not worth reading.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 20:25 | 3265381 ricky2
ricky2's picture

ALL PROLETARIAT ARE TO MAKE SAME WAGE UNTIL MORALE IMPROVES!!!!!

USSA, bitchez

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:16 | 3264228 Henry Chinaski
Henry Chinaski's picture

A wage is the price of labor.  All the usual economic rules apply regarding price, supply and demand. 

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:17 | 3264230 Kaiser Sousa
Kaiser Sousa's picture

"how stupid is the american public.....?"

this obviously was meant to be rethorical....

stupids ass question.................

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:26 | 3264286 Ignatius
Ignatius's picture

The elites got the 'stupid' they wanted by conciously working torwards it.

Google: John Taylor Gatto's "The Ultimate History Lesson".

In the public system we are schooled, not educated (education sometimes being an accidental byproduct).

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:28 | 3264296 Chupacabra-322
Chupacabra-322's picture

How Stupid Is The American Public?

VERY.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:35 | 3264327 whotookmyalias
whotookmyalias's picture

We get what we deserve. The American experiment is in the process of committing suicide while people flock to those who tell them what they want to hear.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 16:04 | 3264466 Chupacabra-322
Chupacabra-322's picture

It's not exactly "our" fault.  The Social Engineers through the use of Psyche WarFare/PsyOp have made it a point to indocrinate minds decade after decade after decade after decade. 

 

Reporter Ron Suskind nailed it to the wall when he got Carl Rove to blurt this out.

 

“We’re an empire now and when we act, we create our own reality and while you’re studying that reality, judiciously, as you will, we’ll act again, creating another new realities, which you can study too.  And that’s how things will sort out.  We’re history’s actors, and you, all of you, will be left to just study what we do.”

 

-Carl Rove

 

 

Pure, unadulterated Evil. 

 

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 16:11 | 3264525 Ignatius
Ignatius's picture

“We’re an empire now and when we act, we create our own reality and while you’re studying that reality, judiciously, as you will, we’ll act again, creating another new realities, which you can study too.  And that’s how things will sort out.  We’re history’s actors, and you, all of you, will be left to just study what we do.” 

Always worth repeating.  Thanks.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 17:20 | 3264813 Chupacabra-322
Chupacabra-322's picture

PsycheWarfare/PsyOp is an art for two reasons.

1. The person under it doesn't realize they're under it and when confronted is in denial that they're under it.

2. Because it works.  And DARPA, RAND Corp., Pentagram/DOD and The Military Complex know that. 

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 17:27 | 3264846 Kayman
Kayman's picture

But Carl Rove can't dance !

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 17:32 | 3264862 Chupacabra-322
Chupacabra-322's picture

Maybe not, but he SURE likes to take it in the ass and gums. 

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:36 | 3264332 Temporalist
Temporalist's picture

"I never let my schooling interfere with my education." -Mark Twain

"God made the Idiot for practice, and then He made the School Board." -Mark Twain

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:41 | 3264352 kridkrid
kridkrid's picture

There is a pretty good interview with Gatto that you can find on the Interwebz... there were 5 or 6 one hour segments to it. I listened to it over the course of a few days. Public education as a way to 1) socialize childcare costs so women could more easily enter the workforce driving down the cost of labor 2) create a generation of factory workers. win and win for industrialists.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 18:36 | 3265053 Cathartes Aura
Cathartes Aura's picture

when one understands exactly how "women in the workforce" drive down the cost of labour, the situation begins to make sense.

hint:  substitute "illegals" etc. for "women" - always some One to blame. . .

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 17:27 | 3264847 sgt_doom
sgt_doom's picture

That's exact it, of course:  indoctrination of ignorance.

The subsidization of ignorance:  how many times over my life (and many other people the same) have I wondered why they hired this idiot or that incompetent or that moron.

Back in the 1970s, I was one of a group of thirty applicants who were tested during a day of interviews at the American Can Corporation (then one of the Fortune 500).

Ten of us aced their tests, while the other twenty scored quite high.  Some of exchanged phone numbers to compare who was hired.

Their people were real excited and promised they would be contacting us shortly.  Several weeks went by with no communication, so a bunch of us attempted to contact them and were all sloughed off --- no contact was possible.

Several more weeks go by, and a news release by the American Can Corporation states that due to not being able to find any qualified American workers, they were going to offshore thousands of jobs to a cheap labor market!

Again and again one hears the phony mantra that America "is competitive" yet how few of us are ever afforded the opportunity to compete?  Where's the competition in the hiring process --- never seen it, aced thousands of tests by this time, and know too many people in the same condition.

Back in the 1990s, I saved some money for a law firm in Seattle, Wa (Bogle and Gates, started by the granddaddy of that software copyist and pirate in Redmond, WA) with some nifty programs as a contractor and later, when a tech support position came open, I applied for it --- thinking my previous positive contact with them would provide an opening.

For some most strange reason they went with an inferior person, a lady embezzler who had been fired from two previous positions in San Francisco for embezzling, 'natch!

(She wasn't related to anyone at that firm -- I checked!)

Awhile later, the attorneys came in one monring and found their operational account empty --- guess who embezzled it all?

No more Bogle & Gates!

How many times I could relate similar stories --- it would require months to tell them all.

Where is this opportunity to compete?

Never seen it --- closest I've ever come to a meritocratic organization was the US military during the draft.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 17:41 | 3264890 Umh
Umh's picture

More than 1 person has been to smart to be hired or promoted:(

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 17:54 | 3264929 secret_sam
secret_sam's picture

   Where's the competition in the hiring process...?

It's the competition to be friendly with the folks running the hiring process.  It's always been about who you know, not what you can do.

Look at the early 'Merkin government.  Someone would win an election and give everyone in the family (and the favored members of the social circle) a nice gummit job.

It's our LEGACY.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 19:24 | 3265202 ersatzteil
ersatzteil's picture

I was always taught that who you know will help you get the job, but it's up to you to keep the job.

In today's State Department, you can literally buy an ambassador position at any number of popular destinations.

RT ran an article on who donated how much and what country they got.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 20:15 | 3265355 Ignatius
Ignatius's picture

Nice tale you tell there.

Off-shoring and contract H1B visas to drive down labor costs is and has been the mantra of our corporatist culture which is currently in control. Won't change till they're out.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 16:07 | 3264490 Kaiser Sousa
Kaiser Sousa's picture

hey shout out to the person who red arrowed me...

i suppose it was not because you dont know that most americans r dumb as rocks but perhaps becuase u were offended by the mispelling of rhetorical....

my bad, stupid ass american......

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 17:59 | 3264947 secret_sam
secret_sam's picture

You buttsore about the red arrows?

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:25 | 3266622 Kaiser Sousa
Kaiser Sousa's picture

buttsore?

interesting choice of words meant to insult...

u sound gay....not that there's anything wrong with that...

 

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:31 | 3266639 secret_sam
secret_sam's picture

No, but in any event, there's DEFINITELY something wrong with being a whiny little bitch.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:16 | 3264231 jomama
jomama's picture

obtuse beyond compare, bitchez.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:17 | 3264234 Schmuck Raker
Schmuck Raker's picture

IKR

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:17 | 3264236 Turin Turambar
Turin Turambar's picture

An educated public would've strung these crooks up with some rope and a forest of trees.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:17 | 3264237 exi1ed0ne
exi1ed0ne's picture

Same reason that a 5% raise with 3% inflation is always preferable then a 3% raise with 0% inflation.  I blame the public schools and lack of emphasys on critical thinking.  Participation trophies don't teach that.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 18:10 | 3264942 Umh
Umh's picture

Am I slow or are you in debt? Please explain this to me.

base inflate raise     increase
100  103    105        0.0194174757
100  100    103        0.03

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 18:44 | 3265080 exi1ed0ne
exi1ed0ne's picture

That was my point - people will take the 5% every time, even though it is not the better choice.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 21:43 | 3265549 Umh
Umh's picture

I thought I was losing it. All better now; drunk; not losing it. You were way to subtle for me.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 21:51 | 3265574 Umh
Umh's picture

So who decided to red flag my question?

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 09:41 | 3266497 exi1ed0ne
exi1ed0ne's picture

ZH is becoming more "mainstream" with all that entails.  Don't sweat it.  I once got a reddie for telling someone the % moisture to burn wood - pure lunacy.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 17:29 | 3264855 sgt_doom
sgt_doom's picture

Yet Peter Shiffless is frequently wrong.

No Say's Law, no economy . . . .

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:18 | 3264240 alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

Yes. Eliminate the minimum wage while unemployment is high. I'm sure corporations will happily pay people a fair living wage. They will also provide all employees with paid vacations and unicorns.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:26 | 3264282 exi1ed0ne
exi1ed0ne's picture

Corps will pay whatever the market will bear based on a given labor pool and (unfortunately) regulatory environment.  In times of increased labor supply it will be less, and in short supply high in theory.  How it really works is an artificial floor is placed so that marginal to low skilled jobs will never be created during increased labor supply, and HB-1 visas to utilize foriegn lower cost labor during short labor supply to put an artificial ceiling on the price.

 

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:42 | 3264354 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

"Corps will pay whatever the market will bear based on a given labor pool and (unfortunately) regulatory environment."

That's why they prefer using slave labour in countries where human rights are completely ignored. 

"HB-1 visas"

Big scam.

Doesn't anyone on here connect the dots between outsourcing of manufacturing industry + stepped up attack on organized labour domestically?? 

Half the people on here believe 9/11 was an inside job, but a broad attack on labour (with full gov support) having gone on since America's inception? Unthinkable!

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 17:36 | 3264867 sgt_doom
sgt_doom's picture

"Doesn't anyone on here connect the dots ''

Negative, James_Cole, as most of the commenters are incapable, like most Ameritards, of comprehending arithmetic, and aritmetical relationships.

Critical mass was reached in 1999, when America became a net importer of tech services, something most Ameritards still can't grasp (could be that indoctrinated ignorance & American Exceptionalism).

Most Americans don't or can't read, so they can't understand the latest Census Bureau data that says that one out of two Americans have no money.

Most Americans don't or can't read, so they can't understand the BLS study, published in late 2009, that stated that between July 1999 and July 2009, the American private sector essentially created NO NEW jobs in America --- although they offshored plenty and created plenty offshore.

Most Americans can't read all those GAO reports who have been explaining this, and other important financial/economic disparities over the past ten to twenty years.

Most Ameritards beging frothing at the mouth and go "glub...glub...glub" when you ask them if they've ever heard of the Trans-Pacific Partnership.

Arithmetic is sooooo haaaaarrrddd.....

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 18:29 | 3265035 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

I actually disagree with you about Americans in general, I think most Americans do know what's up but have been so successfully atomized and castrated that they have become disillusioned.

In 2012 57% of the population actually voted, often people point at that number and say it demonstrates the dumbing down of America but I see it a different way. To me it indicates that there's a large minority of people who see the vote as mostly an illusion. 

A lot of people may not know all the details, but they know what's going on locally. Where exactly are those stories aired though? Definitely not on CNN, MSNBC or FOX. 

As far as people on here, there's a highly selective application of logic & facts. It seems as long as something fits the worldview (libertarian conspiracy theorists) it gets a pass, the second it strays outside of that worldview it's immediately rejected. 

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:42 | 3264355 alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

The problem is that the definition of "what the market will bare" has changed dramatically since NAFTA. Now corporations have the option of shipping their jobs to third world nations and paying slave wages and they get the added benefit of being able to hide their profits from taxation.

To believe that corporations, having this option of off-shoring jobs, will voluntarily pay American workers a livable wage is equal to believing that government will restore liberties that they have "temporarily" suspended for the sake of "security".

You can't have a nation of "consumers" (which is what this country is) without wages that enable them to consume.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:55 | 3264413 exi1ed0ne
exi1ed0ne's picture

It's not NAFTA, although that greases the skids.  Having anything other than a TBTF, it is downright HOSTILE environment to any form of job creation.  Given the excessive raft of regulatory bullshit, your average small to mid sized company is getting the exrta ribbed burlap condom.  Any corp that can offshore is doing so in spades, and has been for a loooong time.  You can't have jobs without job creating industries.  Raise the cost of labor and you tip the pain of offshoring vs. the pain of staying equation in a not nice direction.  Make the min wage whatever you like, it makes no difference.  If it costs more to have the position then revenue generated, poof!  No position.

And for the record, we should be shooting for being a nation of creators and innovators, NOT consumption.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 16:08 | 3264502 alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

"And for the record, we should be shooting for being a nation of creators and innovators, NOT consumption."

I agree. The problem is that an environment has been created in which for us to do that people must compete with $1 per hour labor WHILE paying American sized costs of living. That is simply not doable. Meanwhile, this perpetual obfuscation of the real problems on behalf of corporations such as this article and the general tone here on ZH does not service the needs of the people or address the root of the problem. It becomes a bunch of idiotic finger pointing with the plebs blaming the other plebs. What you are seeing here is the successful execution of the divide and conquer strategy.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 16:37 | 3264658 exi1ed0ne
exi1ed0ne's picture

The solution to government created problems is not more government.  I thought that was aparent, but I guess not.  You see wage as the issue.  I see that as a symptom of a MUCH larger issue.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 17:23 | 3264824 alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

wages would not be an issue if people did not need money to live. unfortunately, they do so they are.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 09:46 | 3266502 exi1ed0ne
exi1ed0ne's picture

Fine - raise them to whatever the current definition of a "living wage" is.  I hope you enjoy your "prosperity" because that $$ comes from somewhere.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 17:38 | 3264880 sgt_doom
sgt_doom's picture

Oh, bullcrap, the same old Wall Street/USChamerofCommerce/Peterson Institute/CFR talking points --- stick it up your skankhole, dood!

 

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 15:27 | 3264295 TBT or not TBT
TBT or not TBT's picture

Well let's raise the minimum wage A LOT then.   That will fix it even better than if we raised it a moderate amount, or left it where it is, right?   

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