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Stanley Druckenmiller: "We Have An Entitlement Problem" And One Day The Fed's Hamster Wheel Will Stop

Tyler Durden's picture




 

Two and a half years ago, George Soros' former partner Stanley Druckenmiller closed shop when he shut down his iconic Duquesne Management, after generating 30% average annual returns since 1986. Some time later he raised many red flags by being one of the first "establishment" types to expose the Fed's take over of the market when he said in a rare May 2011 interview that "It's not a free market. It's not a clean market.... The market isn't saying anything about the future. It's saying there's a phony buyer of $19 billion of Treasurys a week." This was in the context of the constantly declining interest rates on an ever exploding US debt load. And while back then total debt was a "manageable" $14.3 trillion, as of today it is some $2.3 trillion higher moments ago printing at a fresh record high of $16.6 trillion, not surprisingly the phony buyer is still here only now he is buying not $19 billion by over $20 billion in total debt each week. But just like it was the relentless rise in the US debt that forced him out of his privacy in the public scene back then, so it was also the US debt that was also the topic of his rare CNBC appearance today (where he fiercely poked at all those other TV chatterbox pundits when he said "money managers should manage money and not go on shows like this") in the aftermath of his recent WSJ Op-Ed. There, he once again said what everyone knows but is scared to admit: "we have an entitlement problem."

Druckenmiller's definition of the problem:

The media was more concerned about the fiscal cliff and what might happen to the economy over the three months than the big picture which is the debt which is going to swallow our kids in 15 or 20 years. They totally take a pass on entitlements which is the problem. And the president comes out and says i'm not going to do this on the back of seniors. Those seniors, that we put out in the article, are all taking out more than they put in, and it's guaranteed under the system today that all the kids are going to get less than they are putting in...  the reason we're here is I think we have time to deal with this issue. If we don't deal with it in the next four or five years, we'll wake up and interest rates will explode and the next generation will have a very, very tough time and it's so unfair.... In 1994 entitlements were 50% of federal outlays, up from 28% in 1960, but to my horror under the George Bush administration they went from 50% to 63%. Now at 67% of all federal outlays are entitlements. To put that in perspective, if you look at the actuaries out there, entitlements are scheduled to grow $700 billion in the next four years just due to change in entitlements. That's as the demographics kick in.

A quick primer on the unsustainable Bernanke math:

If you normalize interest rates, i'm not talking about a spike, just normalize where they were before QE and took them to 5.7% federal funding costs of the debt, that's $500 billion a year in interest expense that goes out door. We're having a heart attack over an $85 billion sequester when we can lose $500 billion just if you normalize. The way markets work if and when that were to happen, you don't normalize, you keep going because the market figures out that you now have a credit problem which is exactly what's happened in the foreign nations.

A reminder on the irrationality of bond markets:

The bond market is a funny thing. In Greece the bond market was perfectly fine until February of 2010. Not moving, not doing anything, and then in two weeks it was over.

The topic of the free Fed money's diminishing returns is well-known:

The market is fine because you've got all the free money in the federal reserve. But that can only last so long. Eventually the hamster can't move on the wheel anymore and the free money has less and less impact.

His solution: means testing:

Means-test people like me on social security. You realize I've done all right in life, okay? I'm going to start getting social security checks in five years. It's absurd. And i'll get the same social security checks that some people who have not done so well are. And the same thing with medicare. Raise the ages, as I pointed out earlier. When all this stuff was started, life expectancy was way below where it was now, and frankly probably the guesses on life expectancy where they are are too low. It's not that hard.

Finally, on political incentives to act, or rather not:

... Congress is not getting the market signal we talked about in the article so you can scream all you want about congress and the president being clowns, I can't think of any political system anywhere where they acted without interest rates going up. When did greece act? When the bond market blew up. When did Spain act? When the bond market blew up. What was Clinton's response to Rubin, "you mean the f'ing bond market is in control." Doing what they are doing the politicians have no incentive, but the market is a very fickle and violent thing. I don't think it's today, but we've got 3-year-old kids we've promised we'll get them through college and once college is done we'll get them a job. it's going to happen before those kids.

But of course, the merest suggestion of any of the above becoming policy and whoever is in charge screams bloody "austerity" knowing full well their political career is over the moment people's entitlements are cut.

And thus: back to square one.

The full clip follows below:

And for those who missed it, here is the WSJ op-ed from a week ago penned by Stanley Druckenmiller and former Fed governor and current Fed critic, Kevin Warsh:

Generational Theft Needs to Be Arrested

A Democrat, an independent and a Republican agree: Government spending levels are unsustainable

We come from different backgrounds, parties and pursuits but are bound by a common belief in the promise and purpose of America. After all, each of us has been the beneficiary of the choices made—and opportunities created—by previous generations of Americans.

One of us grew up poor in the South Bronx of the 1960s and went on to lead a children's antipoverty program in Harlem. Another grew up in a small town in South Jersey, and went on to be a leading money manager. The third grew up in a small suburb in upstate New York and found his way to serve in the government amid the financial crisis.

One of us is a Democrat; one, an independent; another, a Republican. Yet, together, we recognize several hard truths: Government spending levels are unsustainable. Higher taxes, however advisable or not, fail to come close to solving the problem. Discretionary spending must be reduced but without harming the safety net for our most vulnerable, or sacrificing future growth (e.g., research and education). Defense andhomeland security spending should not be immune to reductions. Most consequentially, the growth in spending on entitlement programs—Social Security, Medicaid and Medicare—must be curbed.

These truths are not born of some zeal for austerity or unkindness, but of arithmetic. The growing debt burden threatens to crush the next generation of Americans.

Coming out of the most recent elections, no consensus emerged either to reform the welfare state or to pay for it. And too many politicians appear unwilling to level with Americans about the challenges and choices confronting the United States. The failure to be forthright on fiscal policy is doing grievous harm to the country's long-term growth prospects. And the greatest casualties will be young Americans of all stripes who want—and need—an opportunity to succeed.

Three main infirmities plague Washington and constitute a clear and present danger to the prospects for the next generation.

First, the country's existing entitlement programs are not just unaffordable, they are also profoundly unfair to those who are taking their first steps in search of opportunity. Social Security is one example. According to Social Security actuaries, the generational theft runs deep. Young people now entering the workforce will actually lose 4.2% of their total lifetime wages because of their participation in Social Security. A typical third-grader will get back (in present value terms) only 75 cents for every dollar he contributes to Social Security over his lifetime. Meanwhile, many seniors with greater means nearing retirement age will pocket a handsome profit. Health-care spending through Medicare represents an even less equitable story.

The government has an obligation, of course, to support needy seniors. But this pension system is ripe for common-sense reforms, including changing eligibility ages and benefit structures for those with greater means, ridding the Social Security disability program of pervasive fraud, and removing disincentives for those who would rather work in their later years.

Powerful, vested interests portray reformers as avowed enemies of seniors. But, the status quo is, in fact, tantamount to saddling school-age children with more debt, weaker economic growth, and fewer opportunities for jobs and advancement.

Second, while many in Washington pay lip service to the long term, few act on it. The nation's debt clock garners far less attention than the "fiscal cliff" clock. Elected officials continue to allow the immediate to trump the important. Washington appears poised to forego fundamental reform at the altar of the expedient, yet again. This could have tragic consequences.

In successive administrations, the country has spent trillions in temporary tax credits and short-term "stimulus" to goose growth by the next election. What do we have to show for this spending surge? Modest growth, declining incomes and a level of national debt that undermine our long-term prospects.

The Federal Reserve's policies reinforce this short-term orientation. To offset weak economic conditions, the Fed's principal policy objectives appear to be twofold: suppress interest rates and raise stock prices. As a result Congress may be missing market signals and failing to see the costs of its spending addiction in time to undertake real reforms. Ultimately, economic fundamentals—not the promises of central banks—will determine the prices of stocks and bonds.

But the deeper failing is one of essential fairness. The benefits of rising stock prices accrue to those who have already amassed wealth at the expense of those who are struggling to save. And failing to deal with runaway spending will burden the country's children with higher interest rates and a debt bomb that will come due in their lifetimes.

Third, too many politicians appear more eager to divide the spoils of electoral victory among their own than to increase the size of the economic pie for all. The grab-bag of special tax favors under the guise of the recent fiscal-cliff deal is only the latest example.

Crony capitalism and corporate welfare aren't just expenses we cannot afford. They are an anathema to economic growth. They deny opportunities to aspiring people and companies who seek to better their lot. They ration opportunity based on things other than merit and hard work. They further ensure that poor children—who already are disadvantaged by failing schools, inadequate health care and little access to necessary resources—will never get the chance to break the cycle of generational poverty through education.

Some individual Americans are surely better off than they were many years ago. The more probing question is whether America is better off. That can only be true if the hopes and aspirations of the next generation are achievable.

The country must find the courage, conviction and compassion to fix what ails it. The opportunity to advance real reform is still possible. But failure to reform the entitlement culture, reaffirm long-run objectives, and re-establish a common purpose will mean a dimming of opportunities for American children today and for future generations. And a great nation will have ceded more than its greatness, but its goodness.

 

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Thu, 02/21/2013 - 19:07 | 3265134 Stoploss
Stoploss's picture

LOL!!

 

NO SHIT..

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 19:18 | 3265183 Zap Powerz
Zap Powerz's picture

It is my hope that one day we live in a world where the people reject the idea of someone else being responsible for them and their well being.  It is my hope we progress as a species to the point where acceptance of charity, help, welfare, entitlements etc will be flatly rejected by humans because it (assistance) is considered dishonest, shameful, embarrassing and wrong.

What a wonderful world it will be when everyone takes care of themselves and their loved ones and the expectation that someone else will do it no longer exists.  In that world, politicians will not be able to steal from some to give to others in exchange for votes because all would see that for what it is: theft.

I know I wont live in that world, but maybe my great grands kids will.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 19:27 | 3265213 knukles
knukles's picture

And the CNBS talking heads call him a nattering nay-bob of negativism, say thank you very fucking much and with an apology of sorts, return to the program before the ever so rude, technical interruption.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 19:31 | 3265227 BKbroiler
BKbroiler's picture

Like most self employed business owners, I pay double social security.  I've been doing so for 10 years and will probably do so for another 20.  When I finally get out of the game, you damn right I feel ENTITLED to that money back.  Social security shouldn't be called an entitlement.  Food Stamps, unemployement, disability, fine, but not SS, that's my bread.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 19:46 | 3265279 11b40
11b40's picture

Amen...me too, double taxed for myself plus my employess for 35 years.

Anytime you hear anyone calling Social Security an "entitlement", jump up and start screaming.  Call them out on it and make the explain to all in earshot how they can say that.  How is anything you paid for an entitlement?  if in fact it is an "entitlement", then I want a refund.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 20:02 | 3265315 Encroaching Darkness
Encroaching Darkness's picture

i'm sorry, but the two of you are missing the point. Your money is gone, long gone, spent and not there anymore.

You were lied to. There is no account, investment pool, pot of gold or lockbox full of your contributions. It was all a lie; the money collected went into general revenues and was spent.

Spent on aircraft carriers, A-10 Warthog planes, bullets and bandages. Spent on national parks, roads and bridges; dams, railways and water / sewer projects. Or spent on waste, fraud, abuse, Solyndra, AIG bailouts; whatever you want to say, But it WAS spent.

The SS trust fund is full of IOUs from the Treasury; which cannot be redeemed by anyone else (that is, tax money must be used to repay them). We are currently deficit spending $1.3 Trillion a year; where would this tax money to repay them come from?

You have NO vested interest; no contract was created by your payments into the system. Congress can cut your benefits at any time, to ZERO if they want. The SCOTUS has already ruled on this. Flemming v. Nestor is the case, I believe.

You have no account, no investment, no recourse except the ballot box, jury box, cartridge box series.

Sorry.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 20:22 | 3265373 11b40
11b40's picture

Just watch and see.  If they can bail out the banks, they can bail out SS....and there is a reason that no politician really wants to be the one who screws with it.

You see, we have resources and we have priorities.  So long as politicians are doling out tax breaks and largess to the corporate welfare state, they know they better keep SS humming, too.  Otherwise, they won't be going back to DC after the next election.  It makes no differnce as to political party.  Once you reach the age of around 50, you tend to start paying a lot more attention to these things, and you become a more dedicated voter.  Even the Tea Partiers want to make sure no one messes with their SS & Medicare....and for good reason.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 20:41 | 3265424 negative rates
negative rates's picture

And say goodbye to $4gal  gas, and hello to $8/gal and the great beyond.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 21:00 | 3265461 donsluck
donsluck's picture

Ride your bike. Plant a garden.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 22:00 | 3265596 SafelyGraze
SafelyGraze's picture

OT but -- 

every time I load zh lately, JLHewitt keeps wanting to know if she can give me a damned massage

in your dreams, creepy old woman

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 22:54 | 3265751 Joe Davola
Joe Davola's picture

I ain't never busted no national bank, so maybe mister drunkenmiller can hep me cypher how many billionaires have to give up their 24k/year in ss to close that entitlement gap.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 23:32 | 3265857 Half_A_Billion_...
Half_A_Billion_Hollow_Points's picture

<-- Ok, time to reconsider and try to understand this thing  

<-- Raging mad with envy  

 

Bitcoin just flew past $30.  

It's happening.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 00:45 | 3266055 rfaze
rfaze's picture

Means testing aka wealth redistribution aka socialism........ never worked never will.

How can smart people be so dumb.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:28 | 3266631 Bicycle Repairman
Bicycle Repairman's picture

Fuck you, Stanley. 

That's our money and you don't give a shit about "the kids".  I know you'd like to loot SS, but it's not happening.  I keep waiting for shit like you to put up a politician with your viewpoint.  I'm ready to move on from discussions with pinheads to publicly eviscerating some politicians.

And in closing, fuck you, Stanley.

 

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 03:26 | 3266265 SqueekyFromm
SqueekyFromm's picture

Disable your javascript. That kind of stuff was driving me crazy when I came here on the Kindle Fire.

Squeeky Fromm

Girl Reporter

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 22:20 | 3265654 Cardinal Fang
Cardinal Fang's picture

Choose one, you can't do both in this crazy old world...

http://www.kgw.com/news/local/Fighting-to-save-their-Sequoia-191930631.html

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 08:09 | 3266398 new game
new game's picture

"it will help the kids connect with nature"

can't make this shit up - only from a brain deranged libtard.

 

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 22:33 | 3265696 sun tzu
sun tzu's picture

Sorry, but bikes don't get food and medicine to the grocery stores. Bikes can't get you from city to city. Bikes don't run farm equipment that plants and harvests food. Your little backyard garden won't feed your family.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 23:05 | 3265776 Payable on Death
Payable on Death's picture

"That's where the fairness is." [In last 5 seconds.] Interesting...

Co-opting the liberal word. I like it.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 00:06 | 3265974 AldousHuxley
AldousHuxley's picture

Don't worry...bank of england's hamster is still running

Napoleon's french bank's wheels are still running

 

US is making chinese hamsters run the chinese wheel.

 

 

capital and power centers always move.

Talk to the Jew who stayed behind and ask how well that turned out (Egypt, Germany, Italy, England, etc.)

 

Smart Rich Jews like that Facebook guy are always running away from USA to Asia namely Singapore.

Future is Asia. and the circle is complete.

 

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 07:52 | 3266385 new game
new game's picture

ah, minmalism- plus a zillion-beat um at their game and rules-now that the "way i like it"...

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:53 | 3267027 11b40
11b40's picture

Before $8/gal gas happens, why don't we try a few little adjustments in the futures market....like if you can't take possession, you can't buy contracts?

Take out the manipulation and gambling, and only allow those who have a true need to hedge a commodity buy the options.  Kick out the trading desks and banks who spend all day running prices up & down, skimming and ripping off all the rest of us on the basic necessities of life.  There are not many alternatives to basic commodities, now are there?  We spout off all the time about Wall Street, but too often forget about the whores in Chicago.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 20:49 | 3265438 HurricaneSeason
HurricaneSeason's picture

They don't screw with it because government worker pensions would be next. 3 times the monthly pension check with less than half the years served with smaller contributions if any. They were allowed to opt out of social security, put them back in and put their pensions in the social security trust fund and make them work at least 40 years and that problem is solved so we can get back to the military industrial complex et al.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 00:58 | 3266088 darkpool2
darkpool2's picture

What a bunch of crap. First if you have to think in terms of surviving on SS payments then count yourself in the LOSERS corner. Second, yes, SS will get bailed out......but with confetti money. ( so back to point 1 again) . When the chips are up in this game, your VOTE isnt going to count for anything. Not many options......working longer is a given, living far more modestly in retirement is another.....Not what you were promised????.....but surely you didnt really believe in the tooth fairy did you???

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 03:16 | 3266260 crazyjsmith
crazyjsmith's picture

It's 3 - 1 ratio of workers to recipients - we're not quite hitting reverse with this Ponzi - still have time as long as people stay (cough) employed -
But it does seem to be a mathematical certainty - could probably start a social security clock - like the debt clock

Pure Demographics - like fighting gravity

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 07:13 | 3266367 Sorynn
Sorynn's picture

Some bespectled liar once said that he could guarantee social security payments would be made, but that he could not guarantee their purchasing power.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 20:22 | 3265375 Oldwood
Oldwood's picture

Fine. Its all gone. What is left is called welfare, so call it what it is. Stop deducting from payroll and calling it social security. Raise taxes, eliminate SS as a line deduction, and call it welfare, paid out of general revenues. I've been paying into a fund for 45 years that is now capput! Lying asswipes robbed us blind. The least they can do is own up to it. But of course not. Never. They love and care for us and would never ever screw us over. Its all just a missunderstanding. Really...the checks in the mail. Bastards!

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 23:29 | 3265852 Yes_Questions
Yes_Questions's picture

 

 

You'll get your SS if we have to sell Alaska.

 

Oil, Caribou Barbie, Caribou and all.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 00:01 | 3265955 mt paul
mt paul's picture

eskimo barbie

would be homeless

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 04:08 | 3266292 hhabana2112
hhabana2112's picture

I agree with you. This fucking Jew and his goyim finance/business pals talk about raising social security age and you working longer so you die before you reap anything or a little of what you paid while the welfare bums reaped your hard work early in their lives or when they were born. How about the pensions for Presidents, congressmen, fed employees? What about them? What about their great health care benefits? I piss on Hannity, Rush and all those fuckers along with this guy saying I should have to give my social security payments (I'm 49 and curious to see if I make it and will I get anything). What about all the fuckers that immigrate to this country, never paid anything to social security or medicare and get put on it. Do they drain the system? Hell yes they do. The time for a revolution the likes of Che and Castro will come here too. When someone shits on you long enough and they are a dictator, so called democracy bullshitter or communist, people rise and purge. I hear/read how they they denigrate those guys from the Cuban revolution, but they were cleaning house setting up another system until the human corruption percolates and you start anew. Who supported Batista? Our fucking government, corporations and mafia. Rotten bastards all of them. That's why our Founding Fathers were leagues above the garbage we have in office and instilled the 2nd Amendment. Cleaning house, starting anew, and wait another 100 years to clean house again.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 20:41 | 3265422 Shizzmoney
Shizzmoney's picture

The money is gone. 

It's Full Tilt Poker all over again.

BTW, fuck people who hate on Social Security.  Sure, it's a flawed government construct that has been raped over and over again to fuel covert operations in Iran, Panama, Grenada, etc........but the idea of it was sound.  If it was run correctly, it wouldn't "bankrupt" the country - it would actually run a surplus. 

It was just the greedy assholes who came after it was created and that run our corporate government, who fucked it all up.

The money will be gone though in 10-15 years. 

That's the problem with "welfare" solutions like SS and Single Payer Healthcare: while noble in nature, man is too flawed to not keep his hands out of the cookie jar.  See: Adam and Eve. 

 

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 21:37 | 3265494 itstippy
itstippy's picture

"The money is gone.  It's already been spent.  The SS Trust Fund Treasuries are just worthless paper IOUs.  So sorry"

Phooey.  ALL money raised by selling Treasuries is gone.  That's the essence of Treasuries - to allow the Government to borrow money and spend it today with the promise of paying it back later.  Tell the other US Treasury holders that we're sorry but their money's already been spent.  See how that goes over.

Do you think a U.S. politician will be able to reneg on the SS Trust Fund Treasuries held by America's seniors, but make good on Treasuries held by the Chinese & Japanese?

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 21:44 | 3265557 gaoptimize
gaoptimize's picture

As much as any politician is too cowardly to do that by any overt act, that will be the effect of the coming bond-pocalypse and hyper-inflation.  Whether you think it is politically viable or not, I'd start preparing like it will happen.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 07:55 | 3266387 new game
new game's picture

eyeing the next pile of money (19.4) trillion-401(not a college class) is clearly centered in the crosshairs...

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 22:07 | 3265621 NoDebt
NoDebt's picture

"but the idea of it was sound."

No, it wasn't.  Look who you're wagging your finger at:  "It was just the greedy assholes who came after it was created and that run our corporate government, who fucked it all up."

It's a ponzi scheme run by politicians.  You expected a good outcome from this toxic mix of money and corruption?  It was DOOMED to failure. 

Like the Thanksgiving turkey left on the kitchen floor in front of the dog, it was only a matter of time before the inevitable happened and then everyone wants to blame the dog.  Go right ahead, if you feel the need.  Beat that dog unti it's dead, but the turkey is still gone and it was YOUR fault for putting it down on the floor in the first place.

 

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 04:07 | 3266288 Daily Bail
Daily Bail's picture

Two minutes of must see television.

David Stockman: 'U.S. Borrow $50,000 Per Second'
Thu, 02/21/2013 - 22:42 | 3265718 Spigot
Spigot's picture

Ayup. Already been spent by big SugarD. "Lock Box" is filled with US.GOV "Bonds" (IOUs for past spending).

IMO the most salient qutoe:

"The bond market is a funny thing. In Greece the bond market was perfectly fine until February of 2010. Not moving, not doing anything, and then in two weeks it was over."

Everything else he said was a mis-direction. First, there is no budget and has been none for the past 4 years. Second, he forgot the sum total Federal Expenditures, which would include the costs of wars, and many other "not on the budget" outlays. Third, He forgot to mention the $14 trillion of liquidity that the FED injected to save his ilks asses which allowed him to gracefully close his hedges, and become a nattering magpie, rather than one of a long list of bancrupted failures. Fourth, he fails to mention that US spending was increase by $1-2 trillion so that the economy would not cave in on his sorry ass. Fifth, forgets to mention that persistent inflation (generated by the FED) over the past 50 years has destroyed the ability of almost all working class citizens to SAVE. Sixth, forgot to mention that he and his cronies made gobs and gobs of money while running the largest real estate and credit con game the world has ever seen, thereby debt encumbering and financially submerging anyone who bought a home in the orgy of illusion prior to 2008.

But, yeah, other than THAT, it was a great interview...

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 01:30 | 3266120 slightlyskeptical
slightlyskeptical's picture

The solution is easy. Use the social security funds to finance the future primary housing market. Let social security fund itself instead of relying on future tax dollars. Make the loans recoursable against future social security benefits. Lets the banks continue in their role of origination and servicing. Problem solved. 

 

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 02:24 | 3266217 401K of Dooom
401K of Dooom's picture

Hey Shizzmoney?  How come the gubbermint can send out all dem checks?  Are they paying it with fairy gold? 

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 21:59 | 3265592 Omen IV
Omen IV's picture

'where would this tax money to repay them come from?'

From getting out of the war business - the DoD and CIA can be cut by $800 Billion which will balance the budget - the USA can make more friends and money by the re-establishment  of a Peace Corp than a war machine

SS and Medicare are not entitlements and subject to the whims of Peterson et al and his trolls  - there is plenty of money to fund especially if Pharma prices are cut to world levels and insurance cos as well

there is no problem -  just propaganda - Stanley and those like him take turns on the air and assigned a speaking point - by Peterson's machine - all lies like WMD's  - you are either a rube or a troll

there is no SS problem !

 

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 00:30 | 3266034 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

Give SS recipients a choice.

Either they get their SS check and that amount is deducted from the defense budget, or the DoD gets it for its budget.

 

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 22:25 | 3265666 Charles Wilson
Charles Wilson's picture

The other case in this Kabuki Play is Helvering vs. Davis.

Bless you, "Encroaching Darkness".

The SCOTUS ruled that SS is NOT an Insurance Plan as long as Congress can conceivably make the Law sound as if it  addressed the "General Welfare". As you state, as long as the funds are paid into the General Revenues, there is nothing else implied.  One Congress may not obligate any future Congress to spend Jack divided by Squat about anything.

Until the day some Congress actually guts some part of SS.  Then, other New!, Improved! Supreme Court rules will apply.

Into the Darkness, into the Abyss.

 

CW

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 23:07 | 3265779 FischerBlack
FischerBlack's picture

Encroching Darkness, welcome to the short list of people who I sense to be relatively sane. Everyone should read his comment, should re-read it, should internalize it, should broadcast it, should post it on billboards all over the country. It's perfectly utterly true.

SS payments are made in cash. The IOUs in the so-called trust fund are nonmarketable treasuries, which means they aren't convertible to cash at any price. They cannot be used to pay benefits. No, the cash to pay benefits must be borrowed or taxed.

I promise to pay myself $1 trillion dollars next month. I intend to keep that promise just as soon as I figure out where the fuck I'm going to get the cash to pay me.

Welcome to accounting fictions between agencies of the USG.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 23:22 | 3265825 sgorem
sgorem's picture

you're quite right, and the cartridge box will do just fine. "everybody's gotta die sometime, Red".....

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 04:44 | 3266315 boogerbently
boogerbently's picture

Ha, Ha, Ha

YOU don't get it.

Those IOU's WILL be repaid. If you (and your children) don't want to repay them, you better start figuring out where to get the $$$.

(I'd start with welfare, disability, food stamps....you DO realize welfare costs more than SS, Medicare OR defense???)

You could always defund the programs that were started with MY stolen SS surplus.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 07:48 | 3266383 new game
new game's picture

E.D.(nice handle-we know what comes out at nite!)plus so much, i am wordless for a number.

yup-each man and woman for themselves

prep up...

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 00:56 | 3266084 prains
prains's picture

BKbroiler

 

exactly it's an OLIGARCH problem first then once that's taken care of let's talk entitlements

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 02:20 | 3266212 401K of Dooom
401K of Dooom's picture

You were never entitled to that money!  You are the victim of a lie that was promoted by the Roosevelt administration to enable the passage of the Social Security Act!  That lie was promoted and spread by the liberal media back in the 1930's!  You are taking away money from my children!  I demand that you give it back!  Don't worry, I will not ask for the money that you took from me!  That was gone a long time ago.  Oh and just a side question.  Under the Social Security Act, how much money are you entitled to receive in total?  To help, let me ask this:   If you work for fourty-five years (from the age of twenty) and retire at the age of sixty five and live to the age of one thousand years.  Are you eligible to collect monthly paychecks from the government for nine hundred, thirty-five years?   Just asking.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 04:47 | 3266317 boogerbently
boogerbently's picture

Suck it up, whiner.

Better your children get screwed than me. It was MY money, you WILL repay it.

 

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 19:35 | 3265224 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

Massive kudos to ZH because for about a year and half I've been trying to remember the name of this guy, and recall information about his performance and (most importantly) the reason he closed his fund.

This guy was either the 2nd or 1st all time most successful money manager until he suddenly closed shop (not because of any financial/liquidity issues, but because he refused to participate in what he identified as a corrupt racketeering system).

I remember reading an article about him a while ago, and his central point was that you can't win over any long or even intermediate time frame in what had become absolutely rigged markets (something that the average sheeple are realizing now) and you're literally better off to do anything but touch anything equity market related with a 1000 foot pole (he made a point to his limited partners who were bewildered when he closed his fund - whom he had consistently made money for during a very long stretch - that he was an investor, not a gambler, and that he wouldn't gamble their money, since it was no longer possible to be an investor).

 

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 19:50 | 3265293 11b40
11b40's picture

That may well be the case, and good on him for it....but I did not notice too much specific criticism of the financial system in his article.  Some vague generalities, but nothing that suggest reform and punishment.  Except for little people, that is.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 21:05 | 3265471 john39
john39's picture

sure entitlements are part of the problem.... but how about the gargantuan military beast that is the United States taxpayer continues to feed year after year....  probably close to 1000 bases around the world...  no other country comes close.   all for the benefit of the people?  sure it is...    shut it all down.  fuck the bankers and their wars of conquest.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 22:11 | 3265629 NoDebt
NoDebt's picture

Europe has a tiny military budget compared to the US, yet they still ran their entitlement systems up on the rocks even faster than we did.

Drop military spending to zero, we still have a big problem.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 23:24 | 3265770 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

@TIS

~~~

YGFBKMe... On ZH ~ I used to have a lot of respect for you... It took awhile ~ But now I think you're just an average, run of the mill FOOL... I don't give a fuckng fuck about what you may think about francis_sawyer...

TOOL CITY BITCHEZ... [Sooner or later all armaments get beaten down into plowshares]... I guess that will be the francis_sawyer fate, sooner or later... Hopefully, the LATTER...

You're glorifying a fucking stooge who, himself was a SOROS stooge... That, essentially, makes YOU a stooge [as well as your 'green arrow army']...

TYLER(s)... PLEASE!?!... Bring back the MATH QUESTION...

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 00:14 | 3265970 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

Think whatever you wish.

I'm well aware of the allegations regarding Soros, and I have no idea as to how many of those as a % are true or not. But unless you know of the dynamics between Druckenmiller & Soros, with specificity, all you're doing is huffing & puffing about your own raw conjecture (there's nothing wrong with that, IMO, so long as you put a big disclaimer in front of your claims, along the lines of "I am Francis Sawyer, and despite not having any actual, direct evidence of what I am about to state, I believe it's possible that A-B-C based upon X-Y-Z).

For all I know, and certainly based on you history of comments, you loathe the guy based on the singular point that he's jewish (I, unlike you, do not believe that the entire spectrum of people of jewish ancestry are inherently bad, for the wide assortment of malicious traits you obsess upon when you're at your least logical; I know and have known many jews who are as well intentioned and charitable as the most honorable people of any other ethnicity or religion, and I do my best to judge people based on their individual character, rather than damning them immediately and in preconceived fashion in a "guilt by association" way that you seem to love to do.)

My praise of Druckenmiller was and is based on his statements as to why he closed shop, his claim that there isn't a market of any type in all the land that hasn't been reduced to a massively manipulated & rigged roach motel, & his macro opinion as to the hows/whys many western economies are already bankrupt, essentially.

Is he lying about those things he expresses? I don't know. Do you?

The simple fact remains that the guy OBJECTIVELY had the best performance of any large AUM fund manager for a massive stretch of years, consistently, and instead of staying in the game post-financial crisis and massive central bank rigging of markets, which he certainly could have done and should have done if he's some corrupt bastard who is tied in with the den of thieves (which would imply that he has access to and can leverage insider information), he called the Ponzi for what it was, returned all limited partner funds to his investors, and called the scam for what it is in a way that neatly dovetails with my own impressions.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 00:22 | 3266012 willwork4food
willwork4food's picture

Excellent comment sunshine, my sentiments exactly.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 01:53 | 3266142 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

 But unless you know of the dynamics between Druckenmiller & Soros, with specificity, all you're doing is huffing & puffing about your own raw conjecture

as well (& such)... YOU ARE... with your RAW underscore [until you fancy ALL OF US with your IN DEPTH carnal knowledge ~ Entertain us... PLEASE]... ZH'ers ~ please DON'T think that francis_sawyer knows anything... INSTEAD ~ Take it ON FAITH that TIS is within the INNER CIRCLE of the SOROS/DRUCKENMILLER conclave... [perhaps even sodomizes the same choirboy goats]...

I, unlike you, do not believe that the entire spectrum of people of jewish ancestry are inherently bad, for the wide assortment of malicious traits you obsess upon when you're at your least logical

Bully 4 u... chilly 4 me... Congrats on having achieved the quintessential KISS ASS status... [Note: You're not a KISS ASS if you do so out of soundness... Instead ~ you're a KISS ASS if you do so in an effort to circumscribe your own pretention of valor]...

Fuck Druckenmiller [He's part of the PROBLEM ~ NOT the SOLUTION]... Your sugary platitudes have ZERO value...

~~~

END THE FED [That's your avatar]... Which, purportedly has some TRUTH towards your motives...

THE FED is fucking jewish families dipshit!... Indulge me by proving to me how I'm WRONG [& otherwise my 'huffing & puffing' is therefore misguided]...

~~~

People... ZH'ers... IT'S FUCKING ON NOW BITCHEZ...

Tylers... You'd better kick my ass off this blog RIGHT FUCKING NOW [I implore you to do so, & in the process, make a quantum leap towards becoming run of the mill MSM]... Because I may have been joking before, but with this BULLSHIT, I'm not joking anymore...

 

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 01:56 | 3266176 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

It's a waste of time to even attempt to debate you because you're obviously in an unstable mental state, so this will be my last response to any of your tripe.

I do hope that you get well soon. Many formerly paranoid individuals consumed by the type of irrational, raging, blind hatred that you are clearly presently suffering under have recovered.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 02:35 | 3266192 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

Perfect... That's a CLASSIC 'loser' response... 'ATTACK THE INDIVIDUAL ~ NOT THE ARGUMENT'...

~~~

Notwithstanding ~ You are somewhat correct... I get the impression that you've 'opted out of' the possibility of future exchanges...

Congratulations on your valor!

END THE FED [Yeah bitchez ~ I 'really' mean it... No, SERIOUSLY... I DO!... I'm NOT a poser who just tries to be intellectual about a bunch of shit that I have marginal knowledge about... I may make 'kewl' comments now & then, & people may LIKE me, but mostly that's because I pretended to want a solution to problems INSTEAD of focusing on where the REAL problems lie]... The fact that I defend jews [AT ALL COSTS], especially the fact that jews are the major shareholders of THE FED should not concern anyone in the least...

Instead ~ you should mock francis_sawyer for even bringing the subject to mind...

~~~

THE ABOVE... TIS... Is your posture [unless you care to argue otherwise]... IMO ~ 'Legacy' counts for exactly SQUAT... [Especially if your 'LEGACY' consists of nothng more than a clarion call to END THE FED]... Hell ~ My guess is that one could live... EASILY... Another 20 years with that idea and be a FRIEND to many a dissident...

How far are you willing to go to make that a reality?... [or is it all 'huffing & puffing', as you mentioned before]?

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 04:44 | 3266307 The Navigator
The Navigator's picture

If you question the integrity of this former Soros partner, what think you of Jim Rogers?

Birds sometime fly together that are not similar in feather.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 22:24 | 3265672 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

now we're talking. this is what the interview SHOULD be about (these things are all very scripted in advance so...no "we're not going to talk about something real." he might be throwing his hat in the ring for Treasury Secretary here...who knows. But YOU fine sir "have summed up the simplicity of our age quite nicely.") and to answer your question...if there was a question in there...is simply put..."NOT EASY." in other words "it was more expensive to get OUT of Vietnam than it ever was getting into it." And unlike the Nam "this war is one we cannot nor will not ever leave from"...so it makes your point the ONLY valid point namely "to pay for the war IS THE WAR ITSELF." What this interview reveals is that our media (ironically enough major supporters of Israel ALL of course) "simply can't even bring up the reality" let alone "begin to have a debate on "how we fix this thing called...THE WAR." and these talking points simply put DID NOTHING. In short "you'd better begin...repeat and end with the word ECONOMY" because that is how Governments are financed and every war in HISTORY has been paid for. Devolving "Government" to the word "spending" simply gives lie to YOUR whole enterprise of "trying to finance the thing." In other words "businesses have a spending problem...but Governments have a problem WITH THE ECONOMY." Now i can go into great detail...and indeed have "in my own way" about how Government and the private sector "is in fact already solving this problem without even knowing it" (no thanks to the Kings of MBS, CDS, CDO's, RMBS, etc...etc) "but it's still not enough." And the reason which is obvious for the whole world to see "is because the problem is REALLY PHUCKING BIG!" (one of the ways i solve it is to "throw the entire State of Illinois under the bus" for example. Apologies to the State of Illinois of course...but this is how problem solving is in fact done on this level and scale.) I've had a lot of my ideas applied (President mentioned natural gas two State of the Union's ago...MBS purchases-sorry to say--are now being bought) but clearly "the plan to get the economy growing" say 12 percent considering the spending right?--clearly is not working. The President is a real good basketball player so the way i would put it is "you need to be the Lakers of the 80's here" and "be masters of the transition." In other words the President has the "set offense" pretty good: "Clyde Drexler is natural gas" so "you want to pass to him whenever possible." On the other hand "Kareem Abdul Jabbar is Big Oil" so "once he posts up you have to give him the ball." The key though is "you being Magic Johnson." no look passes (3d printing), jukin' the defender ("we're going to Syria" when you really meant Mali) "dishin'" (hey NATO...right at ya!) and most importantly "be ready for the put back" (WTF Wall Street supporters of Israel?) But the way the Lakers played...and WON...back then was IN TRANSITION. In other words "when you screwed up they scored." And that's how you pay for Governments...UP TEMPO AFTER THE STEAL. simply put "you gotta lighten the load" and economics does this by STRETCHING that dollar (and not just "raising taxes to get more of them.) this is your TRUE "force multiplier" (both for the Presidents AND the citizens) and mastering it at the the political level is THE hardest of tasks "because it means you have to have an understanding of banking, how to price a municipal bond, what mortgage insurance actually is"...in short IT'S BORING. But this is in fact the bread and butter of Wall Street AND Government...not at all what you see on television and the stock market. These "boring people" are interested in funding GOVERNMENTS more than anything because "that income stream can last centuries." so sure..."why do we even need bases when we have a war effort?" or better yet "why even have a war effort period and then we can get rid of the bases too"? EXCELLENT observations...and clearly "The Question" that Mr. Druckenmuller should have been addressing. In short "we have a WAR problem" not a spending one. If he is truly serious he will address THAT ahem "issue"...and no other. Most don't...indeed are incapable of doing so...and in the end "are just another Wall Streeter." If you want to be an Alexander Hamilton, a Salmon Chase, a JP Morgan, Henry Morgantheau of Hank Paulson "you don't simply look at Government and say it has a spending problem" cuz all your saying is "i'm in the business of making money and the only thing Government is good for is being in the way." To which i would say "and Government thanks itself for being that way" cuz they don't really give a rat's ass about money either now do they!

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 23:29 | 3265851 rhinoblitzing
rhinoblitzing's picture

I Downed you for no line breaks...

 

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 23:30 | 3265853 rhinoblitzing
rhinoblitzing's picture

And you type too much...

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 04:07 | 3266291 RSBriggs
RSBriggs's picture

tl;dr   Some of us seem to have a "paragraph" problem....

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 22:31 | 3265687 Freddie
Freddie's picture

Druckenmiller seems like a decent bloke. His ex-partner Soros needs to be pushed into a wood chipper.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 00:22 | 3266015 willwork4food
willwork4food's picture

Why ruin a perfectly good wood chipper?

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 00:18 | 3266006 Triple A
Triple A's picture

don't worry, according to Stan we still have 4 to 5 years to get our house in order. we will be fine.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 19:38 | 3265253 mrdenis
mrdenis's picture

And that day will be when  Atlas Shrugged 

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 22:31 | 3265685 Almost Solvent
Almost Solvent's picture

Zap Powerz, that world will have many fewer humans populating it. There are some idiots around here who are upset that the human herd must be culled without cheap oil. But it must, and it will either happen orderly or not. 

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 00:30 | 3266032 prains
prains's picture

UH UH! you have an OLIGARCH problem first

then an entitlement problem because that's the carrot the oligarchs have used to dumb the sheeeps

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 19:25 | 3265206 kliguy38
kliguy38's picture

I think that someone with a modicum of "moral authority" other than Mr. Bankster Druknfuk should make these decisions. After all it must be easy to say "means test" some schmuck that ran a small business and save 300K for retirement and can now live on his .025% rate of return "fixed investement". It shouldn't take too long for that 300K "nest egg" to go the way of the DODO bird. Or say maybe we can have some 75 y/o ZH truckers on the road pullin' those gas tankers for his escalade with his armed bodyguard. Watta fochin' schmuck. Buy more drones right Druknfuk?

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 19:34 | 3265237 ihedgemyhedges
ihedgemyhedges's picture

The only surprise in my book is that at the end Maria didn't say: "Ok Stan, what stocks should we be buying here????"

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 20:14 | 3265350 Freddie
Freddie's picture

ObamaPhone.   People voted for this and he also stole 2012 along with a lot of stolen Dem House and Senate seats.   Vote fraud Obama.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 22:02 | 3265603 tenpanhandle
tenpanhandle's picture

while checking out the Obama voter fraud link,  just a slight digression on my part, as is usual, and I end up on an article about Kate Middleton's royal pubic hair. I am now disgusted with myself as well as the bullshit system.

I have my own Obama vote bullshit anicdote.  In Reno Nevada, a battleground state, I personally saw a big foodbank truck handing out food on voter fraud day.  Truck was situated such that voting place was between free food and about 2000 low income apartments.  The streets and sidewalks were chock full of obviously no income women with multiple kids and pushing strollers carrying bags of goods.  Multiply this by the whole country and Obama's elected.

downvote me all you want but this makes me sick.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 23:01 | 3265760 NoDebt
NoDebt's picture

You're pikers.  I live near (definitely not IN) Philly.  Go read up about all the shenanigans that happened at polling places in that one-party town at election time.  Poll monitors were thrown out of the facilities by election officials.  Whole precincts that tallied votes 100% democratic- not one single vote for Republicans, Independents, Conservatives, no write-ins.  Zip. 

Chicago's got NOTHIN' on Philly.

So, no downvote from me.  Even though I laugh at the minor trifles you call corruption.  That's just an average Tuesday in Philly.  ;)

 

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 20:45 | 3265432 rhinoblitzing
rhinoblitzing's picture

Voter Fraud - Stuffing The Ballot Box  - for sure.

Several contests in Florida due to "Irregularities"

Like 140% of a precinct turnout against Allen West

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 22:11 | 3265632 brettd
brettd's picture

little late now, eh friends?

Winning counts.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 22:04 | 3265611 Taint Boil
Taint Boil's picture

 

 

…..to my horror under the George Bush administration they went from 50% to 63%….

That must be a typo .... ROFL

The Obama phone is an urban myth moron – Google it

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 22:41 | 3265713 Taint Boil
Taint Boil's picture

 

 

Better yet:

The Reagan Phone

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 01:19 | 3266104 Larry Dallas
Larry Dallas's picture

In said it before and I'll say it again: I find it incredible that most American's can't see that O is trying to sink and destroy this country as fast as he can.

I never thought the American populace was this stupid, but they are.

This whole healthcare and increase in taxes has not affected the rich, but is absolutely killing the poor. I had a waiter tell me last week he didn't understand why his paycheck took out an extra 2% from his paycheck because he voted for O. I mean its all been lies. To all.

Things today are so much different than 7 years ago and I don't trust the government at all. From 9/11, to CT shootings, to protecting yourself from a deranged gunman with scissors, we've lost our innocence and everything seems to be rolling in one direction.

I can't watch any TV. It's horrible. I don't find most of my fellow Americans interesting anymore, just poor, tattooed uneducated slobs who contribute nothing to society.

Was it PT Barnum that said "no one ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of most people"?

Complete loss of confidence seems to run rampant globally. And in a matter of time, just as fast, people will hopefully wake up.

But I'm not that hopeful. Only a civil war would settle this. It's that bad now. Democratic Capitalism is severely threatened.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 02:35 | 3266130 Taint Boil
Taint Boil's picture

 

 

 

The Obama Phone:

The Obama phone story is an urban myth. Once again the unsophisticated sheeple are fooled by the likes of Rush Limbaugh, Fox News, Drudge, etc, etc. Funny, Freddie never watches TV but somehow knows all about the “Obama Phone”. A two second Google search dismisses the story as bullshit and it was actually started under Reagan and Bush. 

I am not an Obama fan at all by the way.

There is a program started under George Bush was called SafeLink

And: 

The federal "Lifeline" program was created during the Reagan Administration. Lifeline is a federal program created by the Reagan era Federal Communications Commission (FCC) in 1984. The program was enhanced under Telecommunications Act of 1996, which was supported on a broadly bipartisan basis in Congress. The FCC’s Low Income Program of the Universal Service Fund, which is administered by the Universal Service Administrative Company (USAC), is designed to ensure that quality telecommunications services are available to low-income customers at just, reasonable, and affordable rates. Lifeline support reduces eligible low-income consumers' monthly charges for basic telephone service. 

Link

 

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 02:41 | 3266229 Buckaroo Banzai
Buckaroo Banzai's picture

You don't know the first fucking thing about the wired or wireless telephone system. There is a legitimate reason for subsidizing wired phone service-- it has to do with the economics of wired networks. There is no fucking excuse to subsidize wireless phone service.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 03:48 | 3266280 Taint Boil
Taint Boil's picture

 

 

…..There is no fucking excuse to subsidize wireless phone service. 

Ok, I agree 100%. But what does that have to do with the “Obama Phone”? Obama has nothing to do with giving free phones away. 

This is the part that is so hard for me to understand: 

It doesn’t matter if you love or hate Obama (I don’t like him). Ask this question to yourself “Does Obama give away free phones” the answer is no. If you hate him or love him, the answer is still no. 

If you like macaroni and cheese but I hate macaroni what am I to do? Should I ridicule you, down arrow you, insult you, etc, etc just because I don’t like an ingredient in a dish you like? When only you are stating a fact that macaroni and cheese contains …. [drum roll] macaroni. This is just a fact and it doesn’t matter my opinion because ……[second drum roll] macaroni and cheese has macaroni in it. 

Am I on the wrong website? Booze is kicking in and I have an early flight tomorrow, got to go. Remember folks - I like to throw gas on the fire and I like to play the Devil's advocate - keep that in mind

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:39 | 3266949 11b40
11b40's picture

There are a hand full of folks on here that simply do not like facts.  For them, facts are a terrible thing if they get in the way of their retoric.  Facts get down arrows on a regular basis.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 20:36 | 3265409 Groundhog Day
Groundhog Day's picture

its also a pension problem

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 22:22 | 3265664 willwork4food
willwork4food's picture

Especially Governemnt, Civil Service & Military pensions.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 22:38 | 3265707 LongSoupLine
LongSoupLine's picture

All that fucking interview with super shill Bartaromo did was fucking assure me that we are completely fucked as a nation.

 

Fuck you Maria you stupid fucking fake bitch.  Every fucking day she gets her fat fucking horseburger eating ass in front of that fucking camera and shreiks in her fucking yenta voice about how strong this fucking monkey shit market and recovery is.  Now she supports what these guys say?...fuck you bitch.  Go step in from of a fucking bus you fucking sellside dick swallowing whore.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 23:14 | 3265803 Its_the_economy...
Its_the_economy_stupid's picture

I'm speechless......heh,heh.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 02:57 | 3266246 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

I often get a laugh out of your comments [because ~ STRANGELY ~ they mirror my own views]...

~~~

But THIS was 'HEROIC'... I swear ~ it took me 5 minutes to get thru the comment because I was CRYING LAUGHING along the way...

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 23:33 | 3265860 sgorem
sgorem's picture

+! SOUPS ON!!! missed ya man, now by God we've got some real posts to read!

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 00:02 | 3265960 Edward Fiatski
Edward Fiatski's picture

Very nice. +1

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 03:00 | 3266248 willwork4food
willwork4food's picture

Nice, but I feel a sudden urge to go wash my eyes out with soap and call mom.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 22:52 | 3265741 bulldung
bulldung's picture

The most disgraceful entitlement is the congressional pension.Only term limits can fix this mess before crisis. Enough said

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 23:35 | 3265872 sgorem
sgorem's picture

the most disgraceful Entitlement is that these FUCKS get to breathe to stay alive. what a waste of O2..................

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 03:27 | 3266267 crazyjsmith
crazyjsmith's picture

Check out 7:22 in the clip

Nice little slip from friend of ex Fed Governor

"The federal reserve is a very powerful institution - and to some extent, by printing all of THEIR money - Pause - printing the money they are...."

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 19:09 | 3265143 Banksters
Banksters's picture

I'll shorten the article.

 

Modern finance and banking is based on the greater fool theory, fraud, and immunity from prosecution.   As one zerohedger said, things won't change until one of these bankers gets a bullet to the brain.   

 

 

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 19:40 | 3265250 11b40
11b40's picture

Exactly right.  

Not one word mentioned about how the country has been raped by the bankers & plundered by the war machine.

Nothing in there about the unbelievable differences in effective tax rates of hedge fund managers making a half $billion/yr and sheltering off shore.

Nothing about multi-nationals bleeding off our jobs and paying off Congress to look the other way as the manufacturing base gets dismantled and shipped out...while they come up with 'legal' schemes that allow them to book profits off shore and further escape taxes, screwing all of us a little more.

Nothing about massive manipulation of Oil and other commodities required by the general population for daily living.

Did you see anything about high frequency trading, skimming and sucking dollars away from everyone who does not have a monster computer located across the street from a stock exchange.

What, no mention of exploding health care costs in the for-profit sytem we have allowed to build upover the past 30-40 years?  What did happen to all those public hospitals we once had, anyway?  And what about the fact that Medicare delivers the most cost effective helath care in America (except mayvbe the VA, until all the war-torn vets started showing up)

....and I could go on, but just let me say "fuck you", kind sir, and the Social Security slaying horse you rode in on.

I posit that NOTHING can be fixed until huge gobs of corruption get puked up and the system is purged of the rotten bankster meat that is killing us from the inside.

This prick talking about fairness disgusting.  It is a joke, and the joke is on all the rest of us.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 20:05 | 3265329 dick cheneys ghost
dick cheneys ghost's picture

+1000

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 22:59 | 3265765 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

"Exactly right.  

Not one word mentioned about how the country has been raped by the bankers & plundered by the war machine."

It's funny how when the banks needed money suddenly a trillion dollars - no strings attached - appeared overnight. When Saddam H. appeared on the scene in league with Al Qeada and shoring up nuclear bombs there was a blank cheque. When the economy started to falter there was money to send out so Americans could go on a shopping splurge. At a time of two wars everyone got a big tax break.

And now everyone on TV is complaining about deficits.... but don't think about cutting a nickel from defense!

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 05:01 | 3266328 The Navigator
The Navigator's picture

"but don't think about cutting a nickel from defense" -  the Empire must live on.

AND because we haven't had a budget in 3-4 years, we have NO idea how much has been spent on what, we have a perfect road map for the future. WTF!!!

Hang 'em. Hang 'em All and high, the traitors that have destroyed our Republic.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 20:24 | 3265378 stormsailor
stormsailor's picture

no politician can ever mention cleaning up the corruption,  their slice of the pie might get smaller.  and no politician can ever talk about cutting entitlements,  particularly for those that are fraudulently collecting them,  i estimate 30%.

 

and no politician can ever say any non-pc words, nor have a logical or honest conversation about the myriad of problems we have allowed to accrue for the past 50 years.

 

and screw you for living responsibly, working hard, and saving,  here's you .01%, and a 1099 to pay taxes on it,

 

fuckers are pissing and moaning about sequester cutting 22 billion from the 1.3 trillion federal budget.  why dont they just watch dumb and dumber and blow each other.   it would make a lot more sense

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 23:49 | 3265914 Teamtc321
Teamtc321's picture

"fuckers are pissing and moaning about sequester cutting 22 billion from the 1.3 trillion federal budget.  why dont they just watch dumb and dumber and blow each other.   it would make a lot more sense"

 

I don't think they can blow while they have their heads shoved up each other's asses. I don't know but the pic on the shirt below is fitting, literally.

http://www.cafepress.com/washingtonbroke.655760805

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 23:18 | 3265815 Its_the_economy...
Its_the_economy_stupid's picture

11b40.

 

Keep talking. A voice in the wilderness.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 00:52 | 3266069 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

Health care costs went up BECAUSE of government.

Everything government touches turns to crap.  Ringo Starr

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 20:39 | 3265415 Groundhog Day
Groundhog Day's picture

a bullet isn't enough.  strip them of all thier assets and thier immediate family as well and makr them work for minimum wage for life.  that might scare em

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 21:39 | 3265544 Go Tribe
Go Tribe's picture

I often wonder how many politicians ands bankers would have to die before the rest capitulated. Not more than 10 I think.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 22:01 | 3265600 Omen IV
Omen IV's picture

1,000 would be better!

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 22:13 | 3265640 brettd
brettd's picture

Not true!

Elizabeth Warren is here to fight for us!

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 23:34 | 3265867 Cosimo de Medici
Cosimo de Medici's picture

While a "bullet to the brain" meme might win you a seat on the Zerohedge Parliament, it would merely help consolidate the power of the very people you wish to emasculate.  They'd pull together and lobby for some sort of protected status like a minority group.  It would be like going to Turd Ferguson's site and proclaiming I wipe my fatuga with gold leaf, or going to Friday prayer at the local mosque and facing Palmyra, NY instead of Mecca.

The absolute only way to send a message and put some fear of Bubba into the banking elite is to prosecute and send the guilty parties to Reamway State Peniteniary and hold un-chaperoned Prom Night after the All-You-Can-Eat Oyster Buffet Special.  Of course, that is unlikely to happen.  Oysters are too expensive now, since they all go to the Hamptons.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 23:38 | 3265878 sgorem
sgorem's picture

"some (pl) of these bansters get a bullet to their brains"

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 03:05 | 3266254 Joseph Jones
Joseph Jones's picture

Guillotine.  Clean meat off the skull.  Feed body to hungry pigs, especially if they are jew bankers. Sell skull on ebay to highest bidder. 

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 19:15 | 3265148 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

"Means-test people like me on social security. You realize I've done all right in life, okay? I'm going to start getting social security checks in five years. It's absurd. And i'll get the same social security checks that some people who have not done so well are"

I saw this live. Bartirma pointed out while casually laughing that young people don't expect to get social security, so just go ahead and cut it already. We don't need it she says.

That's fine you dumb twat, just don't make me pay into it. Do you understand that aspect you dumb fkin bitch?

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 19:15 | 3265175 AU5K
AU5K's picture

Whenever someone claims to know what you need, you can be sure its not in your best interest.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 19:16 | 3265177 AssFire
AssFire's picture

Bottomline...If you did all you were supposed to do in life and became successful- then it is ok to steal from you.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 19:17 | 3265182 RSBriggs
RSBriggs's picture

And give me back the $250,000+ that I've paid over the last 47 years and we'll call it even, OK?.  And yes, I retire in 5 years and am NOT a multi-millionairre and it's going to be damn hard to live on those SSN checks.... 

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 19:23 | 3265199 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

You will get your 250k back in benny bucks. Everyone loses here.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 19:35 | 3265239 knukles
knukles's picture

You have got to be fucking kidding me?  She really said that the youngin's don't expect it, so just toss the deal?  As if they've approved?

What arrogant elitist crap!

Probably made Mandy Bigtits break down and cry.
Well, life can't be too tough when married to a Steinberg, eh?

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 19:45 | 3265274 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

It was right before she said "we're coming off the lows" and right after she said "cash on the sidelines".

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 19:33 | 3265229 Buckaroo Banzai
Buckaroo Banzai's picture

Bingo. Means testing transforms a retirement plan (albeit a shittily managed one) into just another fucking welfare program.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 01:02 | 3266097 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

Everyone can see how well SSDI works.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 20:29 | 3265392 Oldwood
Oldwood's picture

Same for me as well. I wnat it back, inflation adjusted. And I don't want to pay capital gains on my house when anything more than I paid for it (fat chance) is opurely do to inflation deliberately created by the very same entity that has been fully responsible for wrecking the economy and taxing the crap out of me for every nickel and dime I have earned in 50 years of labor. Fucking thieves.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 19:35 | 3265219 McMolotov
McMolotov's picture

They can't let us opt out. If we do, there's absolutely no money coming in and the emperor goes full-frontal. It is by definition a Ponzi scheme. The first person to draw from Social Security paid $44 in Social Security taxes over three years of working and collected $20,993 in benefits.

Unsustainable from the beginning.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 20:12 | 3265344 FEDbuster
FEDbuster's picture

No one seems to appreciate that fact.  The one's collecting talk of the "trust fund" that is set aside to pay them.  I quit going to Tea Party events, because all the geezers there wanted to cut everything but their medicare and social security benefits.  Like Madoff investors, they don't realize that they got fucked. 

The current pre-boomers are sucking the whole thing dry drawing $100's of thousands on their medical care to get a few more months of TV watching in before they die.  I talk with these 70+ year old guys, and they truly don't give a fuck about anyone but themselves.  They all say "we paid in, we deserve it all". I personally know two guys who have all ready racked up over $500K in medicare bills in the past five years.

 

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 20:32 | 3265401 Oldwood
Oldwood's picture

And what about the trillion bucks in student loans about to get sucked up by the taxpayers? And what about the unemployment and disability checks going predominantly to the under 50 group?

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 20:49 | 3265443 FEDbuster
FEDbuster's picture

I am no fan of student loans or disability checks, but you better hope that some of that student loan money created some productive slaves to keep paying into the ponzi.  Right now it is a 2:1 ratio of workers paying in to support one person receiving.  Sometime in the next 10 years it goes to 1:1 ratio, so the boomers will be riding on the back of one of their kids.  The medicare spending is so out of control, it will BK the Country long before social security will.

The current "greatest" generation will be the last to get Cadillac medical benefits, the boomers will get free clinics at Walmart or have to dig into their own pockets to pay for their dialysis, bypasses, hip replacements, etc....  The broke ass seniors will have to live with old age conditions and die like people did for thousands of years before them did.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 00:44 | 3266052 Oldwood
Oldwood's picture

Don't get me wrong. I know the money's gone and i have had the same discussions with tea party seniors to the point that if we demand to be made whole on our "promises" we will likely be found dead in the ditch. There is no way they can pay for it. We all understand that significant changes are going to have to happen if any part of this "system" is to survive. I just want two things out of it. One, that politicians admit they fucked us and that whatever it evolves into is called what it is, welfare. Second is that the non boomers stop acting like we robbed them of something. We paid and paid big in most cases and will likely get nothing. Plus we have been funding their worthless liberal education that will be proven to be less than worthless in coming years when it is discovered that the primary thing they learned was how to demand more for doing less. I pay more in property taxes that go primarily to education than income taxes. Just a little respect is all.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 19:38 | 3265251 azzhatter
azzhatter's picture

Every time a CNBC pundit opens their pie hole, shits spews forth. Maria must be smarter than she sounds. Even thru osmosis she must have learned a few things over the past 20 years besides how to give a proper blowjob to a Citi banker

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 20:29 | 3265388 Dr. Engali
Dr. Engali's picture

Language Ray :-> Seriously you're going to have to turn that crap off. I turned it in this morning and I couldn't listen for five minutes; between Kernan pontificating and Quick cheerleading it about made me sick. I don't know what Sorkin was doing, maybe down on his knees servicing Buffet backstage.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 20:49 | 3265441 negative rates
negative rates's picture

And to think that the media and the insurance co.s are the only ones left with a positive cash flow, they have to talk it up or die trying. I mean these are the same guys that picked up the pieces of the Haines bottom. They can't even think about going back there.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 19:11 | 3265154 reader2010
reader2010's picture

The world does not reward honesty and independence, it rewards obedience and service. It’s a world of concentrated power, and those who have power are not going to reward people who question that power.

- Noam Chomsky

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 19:57 | 3265307 JustObserving
JustObserving's picture

Noam Chomsky kowtows to that power by supporting the official stories about the JFK assassination and 9/11.  He is as big a fraud as any.

http://abdielsroom.blogspot.com/search?updated-min=2007-01-01T00:00:00-0...

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 20:06 | 3265325 reader2010
reader2010's picture

The scepticism and cynicism [in modern society] about everything is so general, and I think it’s partly due to this thing I call ‘banalisation’, and it’s partly due to the refusal and the fear of dealing with complexity. Much easier to be a cynic than to deal with complexity. Better to say everything is bullshit than to try to look into enough things to know where you are.


- Rick Roderick (1949-2002), American philosopher

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 20:14 | 3265351 medium giraffe
medium giraffe's picture

Until you start digging into the complexity and discover that things are very much worse than just 'bullshit'.  Fucking boomer...

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 21:43 | 3265554 A Lunatic
A Lunatic's picture

That's a bunch of bullshit.........

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 02:57 | 3266245 Joseph Jones
Joseph Jones's picture

Wow!  A Jew (chomsky) who hides the fact that Mossad murdered JFK?  Like that's a shock? 

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 19:23 | 3265164 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

Druckenmiller... OMG this is tiresome [crickets]...

~~~

I'll wait for 'DIVINE WIND' to put Druckenmiller into perspective [because I'm clearly 'TOO SHALLOW' to have an opinion]...

Just another entry in an AMAZING mathematical, statistical, quantum anomoly... [Deputy of SOROS, no less ~ how quaint & thoroughly unexpected]...

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 19:26 | 3265211 kliguy38
kliguy38's picture

Yup....this one really pissed me off. The height of hipocrisy.....rip us off now rape whats left......

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 00:16 | 3265976 Cosimo de Medici
Cosimo de Medici's picture

You may not find his chosen career to be as socially useful as whatever it is you do, but the path Stan took was open to anyone, and he did it in that time when even his Prime Brokers were not bailed out.  Also, though a natural cynicism will make you believe otherwise, he didn't do it with the benefit of inside information (if you had been an investor in his fund and had a chance to follow his asset choices, long and short, over time, you would understand).  He had a facility for understanding markets and crowd psychology, or maybe just beat the odds performing at a six sigma-topping level.  Sure, it's easy for him to talk about the need for entitlement reform, but what is your alternative?

As for Soros, this fad of making him the devil incarnate, much of which can be attributed to Glenn Beck, is simply bizarre.  Even those who exaggerate Soros' culpability in WWII beyond what he admitted himself, I wonder how you all behaved when you were 9-14 years old, separated from your family, and the powers that be of your time were exterminating those of your ethnicity?  You were all paragons of virtue even at that tender age and under dramtically more favorable and comfortable circumstances?  Easy to step on someone when you never walked in his shoes.  Also, Soros has given away more than 20% of his fortune, quite often in ways that go unreported, and even most of the reported aid has been in areas such as internet freedom in the old USSR, trying to help the transition in the old Bloc as it moved from Communism to Capitalism, etc.  He gets condemned for his social views primarily, but how he is a more evil historical figure than Mao, Stalin or Hitler is something only the pathologically bitter can grasp.

People on this site are funny.  Everybody congratulates himself and praises his own genius when gold goes up $3 and silver up 10 cents (that's when the "paper price" matters), and boasts about his "average cost way below where the price is after a 40% drop from the $48 silver high---but APPL investors who have held from $700, but who might have bought at $30, are idiots), but gets all critical when someone else speculated far better over a longer period of time.  Oh, I forgot, you all are buying gold and silver to "bring down the system", not to make money.  Bullshit.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 02:55 | 3266242 Joseph Jones
Joseph Jones's picture

"...exterminating those of your ethnicity..."

The highest icon of western civilization: holocaustianity.

To use your word: Bullshit

Oh, if only someone could and would successfully exterminate their world philosophy. 

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 03:04 | 3266253 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

CdM

~~~

YGFBKMe...

I'm too tired right now... But YGFBKMe... I'll deal with you later...

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 04:18 | 3266299 hhabana2112
hhabana2112's picture

Oh fuck you, you Jewish cocksucker! Soros is a psycho and the best thing about Glenn Beck was to expose the crazy organizations he supports.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 08:47 | 3266429 Cosimo de Medici
Cosimo de Medici's picture

Shhhhhh!  If you keep your voice down, nobody will know you're a racist as well as a failure.  It's got to be tough enough on you as it is.  By the way, do you get recipes from Glenn Beck, too, or just all your "knowledge"?

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 19:15 | 3265168 nmewn
nmewn's picture

"I don't know why it is in this town, folks leave stuff until the last minute,"-Obama said, stepping off Air Force One, back in DC from $1,000 golf lessons and playing grab ass with Tiger Woods.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 19:17 | 3265181 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

nmewn you have said so many true things since I have been on here. But if there is one thing I absolutely know is true that you have said, is that those two guys played grab ass. Their caddies must have been dry heaving.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 20:36 | 3265245 AssFire
AssFire's picture

I disagree.

Clearly, Tiger likes white porn star type whores.

If Obama was doing the ass grabbing- I'm sure it was Reggies Love's ass.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 19:38 | 3265249 knukles
knukles's picture

Hey come on, guys!
Mooch is out west with the chillen' figurin' she don't want them around Tigger
Manoamano returns from Florida with Reggie Love

Go figure, fellahs

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 19:39 | 3265256 nmewn
nmewn's picture

My brother, everyone see's it and is just to afraid or too PC to say it.

What gets me is the blatant, in your face, hypocrisy. He sends his kids & wife off to wherever the hell and he comes here, to Fla. Double vacations. Double guard details. Double flights.

Then he's gonna talk shit about budget cuts? Or "man made global warming"? Or outright lie...since when did the federal government pay the salaries of local police & firefighters...his choice of words "first responders"?

Its absolute bullshit. No one calls him a liar.

He is.

Thu, 02/21/2013 - 19:49 | 3265289 Hulk
Hulk's picture

I believe somebody did call him a liar one time !!!

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