Stanley Druckenmiller: "We Have An Entitlement Problem" And One Day The Fed's Hamster Wheel Will Stop

Tyler Durden's picture

Two and a half years ago, George Soros' former partner Stanley Druckenmiller closed shop when he shut down his iconic Duquesne Management, after generating 30% average annual returns since 1986. Some time later he raised many red flags by being one of the first "establishment" types to expose the Fed's take over of the market when he said in a rare May 2011 interview that "It's not a free market. It's not a clean market.... The market isn't saying anything about the future. It's saying there's a phony buyer of $19 billion of Treasurys a week." This was in the context of the constantly declining interest rates on an ever exploding US debt load. And while back then total debt was a "manageable" $14.3 trillion, as of today it is some $2.3 trillion higher moments ago printing at a fresh record high of $16.6 trillion, not surprisingly the phony buyer is still here only now he is buying not $19 billion by over $20 billion in total debt each week. But just like it was the relentless rise in the US debt that forced him out of his privacy in the public scene back then, so it was also the US debt that was also the topic of his rare CNBC appearance today (where he fiercely poked at all those other TV chatterbox pundits when he said "money managers should manage money and not go on shows like this") in the aftermath of his recent WSJ Op-Ed. There, he once again said what everyone knows but is scared to admit: "we have an entitlement problem."

Druckenmiller's definition of the problem:

The media was more concerned about the fiscal cliff and what might happen to the economy over the three months than the big picture which is the debt which is going to swallow our kids in 15 or 20 years. They totally take a pass on entitlements which is the problem. And the president comes out and says i'm not going to do this on the back of seniors. Those seniors, that we put out in the article, are all taking out more than they put in, and it's guaranteed under the system today that all the kids are going to get less than they are putting in...  the reason we're here is I think we have time to deal with this issue. If we don't deal with it in the next four or five years, we'll wake up and interest rates will explode and the next generation will have a very, very tough time and it's so unfair.... In 1994 entitlements were 50% of federal outlays, up from 28% in 1960, but to my horror under the George Bush administration they went from 50% to 63%. Now at 67% of all federal outlays are entitlements. To put that in perspective, if you look at the actuaries out there, entitlements are scheduled to grow $700 billion in the next four years just due to change in entitlements. That's as the demographics kick in.

A quick primer on the unsustainable Bernanke math:

If you normalize interest rates, i'm not talking about a spike, just normalize where they were before QE and took them to 5.7% federal funding costs of the debt, that's $500 billion a year in interest expense that goes out door. We're having a heart attack over an $85 billion sequester when we can lose $500 billion just if you normalize. The way markets work if and when that were to happen, you don't normalize, you keep going because the market figures out that you now have a credit problem which is exactly what's happened in the foreign nations.

A reminder on the irrationality of bond markets:

The bond market is a funny thing. In Greece the bond market was perfectly fine until February of 2010. Not moving, not doing anything, and then in two weeks it was over.

The topic of the free Fed money's diminishing returns is well-known:

The market is fine because you've got all the free money in the federal reserve. But that can only last so long. Eventually the hamster can't move on the wheel anymore and the free money has less and less impact.

His solution: means testing:

Means-test people like me on social security. You realize I've done all right in life, okay? I'm going to start getting social security checks in five years. It's absurd. And i'll get the same social security checks that some people who have not done so well are. And the same thing with medicare. Raise the ages, as I pointed out earlier. When all this stuff was started, life expectancy was way below where it was now, and frankly probably the guesses on life expectancy where they are are too low. It's not that hard.

Finally, on political incentives to act, or rather not:

... Congress is not getting the market signal we talked about in the article so you can scream all you want about congress and the president being clowns, I can't think of any political system anywhere where they acted without interest rates going up. When did greece act? When the bond market blew up. When did Spain act? When the bond market blew up. What was Clinton's response to Rubin, "you mean the f'ing bond market is in control." Doing what they are doing the politicians have no incentive, but the market is a very fickle and violent thing. I don't think it's today, but we've got 3-year-old kids we've promised we'll get them through college and once college is done we'll get them a job. it's going to happen before those kids.

But of course, the merest suggestion of any of the above becoming policy and whoever is in charge screams bloody "austerity" knowing full well their political career is over the moment people's entitlements are cut.

And thus: back to square one.

The full clip follows below:

And for those who missed it, here is the WSJ op-ed from a week ago penned by Stanley Druckenmiller and former Fed governor and current Fed critic, Kevin Warsh:

Generational Theft Needs to Be Arrested

A Democrat, an independent and a Republican agree: Government spending levels are unsustainable

We come from different backgrounds, parties and pursuits but are bound by a common belief in the promise and purpose of America. After all, each of us has been the beneficiary of the choices made—and opportunities created—by previous generations of Americans.

One of us grew up poor in the South Bronx of the 1960s and went on to lead a children's antipoverty program in Harlem. Another grew up in a small town in South Jersey, and went on to be a leading money manager. The third grew up in a small suburb in upstate New York and found his way to serve in the government amid the financial crisis.

One of us is a Democrat; one, an independent; another, a Republican. Yet, together, we recognize several hard truths: Government spending levels are unsustainable. Higher taxes, however advisable or not, fail to come close to solving the problem. Discretionary spending must be reduced but without harming the safety net for our most vulnerable, or sacrificing future growth (e.g., research and education). Defense andhomeland security spending should not be immune to reductions. Most consequentially, the growth in spending on entitlement programs—Social Security, Medicaid and Medicare—must be curbed.

These truths are not born of some zeal for austerity or unkindness, but of arithmetic. The growing debt burden threatens to crush the next generation of Americans.

Coming out of the most recent elections, no consensus emerged either to reform the welfare state or to pay for it. And too many politicians appear unwilling to level with Americans about the challenges and choices confronting the United States. The failure to be forthright on fiscal policy is doing grievous harm to the country's long-term growth prospects. And the greatest casualties will be young Americans of all stripes who want—and need—an opportunity to succeed.

Three main infirmities plague Washington and constitute a clear and present danger to the prospects for the next generation.

First, the country's existing entitlement programs are not just unaffordable, they are also profoundly unfair to those who are taking their first steps in search of opportunity. Social Security is one example. According to Social Security actuaries, the generational theft runs deep. Young people now entering the workforce will actually lose 4.2% of their total lifetime wages because of their participation in Social Security. A typical third-grader will get back (in present value terms) only 75 cents for every dollar he contributes to Social Security over his lifetime. Meanwhile, many seniors with greater means nearing retirement age will pocket a handsome profit. Health-care spending through Medicare represents an even less equitable story.

The government has an obligation, of course, to support needy seniors. But this pension system is ripe for common-sense reforms, including changing eligibility ages and benefit structures for those with greater means, ridding the Social Security disability program of pervasive fraud, and removing disincentives for those who would rather work in their later years.

Powerful, vested interests portray reformers as avowed enemies of seniors. But, the status quo is, in fact, tantamount to saddling school-age children with more debt, weaker economic growth, and fewer opportunities for jobs and advancement.

Second, while many in Washington pay lip service to the long term, few act on it. The nation's debt clock garners far less attention than the "fiscal cliff" clock. Elected officials continue to allow the immediate to trump the important. Washington appears poised to forego fundamental reform at the altar of the expedient, yet again. This could have tragic consequences.

In successive administrations, the country has spent trillions in temporary tax credits and short-term "stimulus" to goose growth by the next election. What do we have to show for this spending surge? Modest growth, declining incomes and a level of national debt that undermine our long-term prospects.

The Federal Reserve's policies reinforce this short-term orientation. To offset weak economic conditions, the Fed's principal policy objectives appear to be twofold: suppress interest rates and raise stock prices. As a result Congress may be missing market signals and failing to see the costs of its spending addiction in time to undertake real reforms. Ultimately, economic fundamentals—not the promises of central banks—will determine the prices of stocks and bonds.

But the deeper failing is one of essential fairness. The benefits of rising stock prices accrue to those who have already amassed wealth at the expense of those who are struggling to save. And failing to deal with runaway spending will burden the country's children with higher interest rates and a debt bomb that will come due in their lifetimes.

Third, too many politicians appear more eager to divide the spoils of electoral victory among their own than to increase the size of the economic pie for all. The grab-bag of special tax favors under the guise of the recent fiscal-cliff deal is only the latest example.

Crony capitalism and corporate welfare aren't just expenses we cannot afford. They are an anathema to economic growth. They deny opportunities to aspiring people and companies who seek to better their lot. They ration opportunity based on things other than merit and hard work. They further ensure that poor children—who already are disadvantaged by failing schools, inadequate health care and little access to necessary resources—will never get the chance to break the cycle of generational poverty through education.

Some individual Americans are surely better off than they were many years ago. The more probing question is whether America is better off. That can only be true if the hopes and aspirations of the next generation are achievable.

The country must find the courage, conviction and compassion to fix what ails it. The opportunity to advance real reform is still possible. But failure to reform the entitlement culture, reaffirm long-run objectives, and re-establish a common purpose will mean a dimming of opportunities for American children today and for future generations. And a great nation will have ceded more than its greatness, but its goodness.

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MrPalladium's picture

Why is it that these characters only talk about taking entitlements away from seniors, and never mention taking them away from welfare queens.

Racial politics pure and simple.

Grandma and grandpa are going to have to move in with the kids, and the younger generation of whites is going to be hugely pissed off when they realize the impact of this.

The food stamps, the aid to dependent children, the refundable tax credit, the section 8 housing allowance, the free medicaid, the disability benefits, the unemployment benefits amount to much more than the average Social Security benefit.

This is going to get ugly.

Zap Powerz's picture

Dont forget all the corporate welfare too.  End that also.  End all forms of public assistence.  It wrecking the human race.  Welfare is a powerfully destructive force and should be rejected by all humans.

nmewn's picture

Exactly right.

Everyone thinks we (I) wish to protect business. I don't. They should stand or fall on their own merits. At the same time you can see the logic of...if government imposes on a refinery (for example) to re-tool in order to produce/blend ethanol from corn, there is a cost to industry to do it...they have been damaged (monetarily) by government policy.

What I'm saying is, government can be like the bull in the china shop while also acting as the insurer for damages done and does it alot. I'm not even sure they know they do just "feels right" to most of them.

Does anyone really think "bankers" & strip mall shysters wanted to write and hold money losing subprime loans? Of course they didn't or they would have been doing exactly that for centuries.

Government forced both those examples...thats why no BIG FISH have gone to jail or ever will.

It was government policy.

Government policy is now to hold up the Keystone Pipeline, who benefits, monetarily, that we can see and observe their reaction? Warren Buffet and his railroad holdings.

Oldwood's picture

See how easy the truth is and how no one gives a shit because it's not want they WANT to believe. When you can convince people that the truth will set them free they run to prison. SO damn tired of the stupidity, but I appreciate what you are saying. IF it could only make a difference.

nmewn's picture

It won't make a difference...its easier to live the lie.

Anusocracy's picture

It's not a lie if it's confirmation bias.

It's pre-wired truth.

tip e. canoe's picture

of course that depends upon what your definition of "is" is.

tip e. canoe's picture

superbly written amigo.
you scratch my back, i'll scratch yours.
we'll both get rich and fuck everyone else.
that's how they roll.

nmewn's picture

It is how they roll tip.

They seem convinced that simply trotting out strawmen "YOU'RE all gonna die" if you don't allow drones orbiting your porch and traffic cams on every corner or "these draconian TWO PERCENT CUTS IN GOVERNMENT GROWTH will plunge us into recession" will work again.

Judging by the past, they may just might...but I have faith in Yamamoto's prescience of us, if I didn't, I wouldn't be here ;-)

brettd's picture

but what will it take to awake that giant?

rhinoblitzing's picture

It's the other way around... More likely It's the kids that are/will be moving in with Granmdma and Grandpa. The seniors have multiple pensions, Medicare, Social Security, and if they were smart they paid off thier home and are debt free....

It's the working (prior) middle class paying $4.50 a gallon to get to thier part time $10.50 an hour - seasonal- job, looking at throwing in the towel. 

So how do you trade it?


MrPalladium's picture

There is no question that the generational movement will be in both directions. In some cases the kids will be moving into the over large house of the parents.

However, the Boskin commission adjustments to the CPI mean that Social Security benefits lag far behind the true cost of living. In another 10 years the spread between CPI and Shadowstats will cut the purchasing power of SS benefits in half.

In the mean time, the younger middle class will be saddled with ever rising payments for buying the votes of the welfare queens.

It will be interesting to see if we have a debt jubilee and a reset before the obvious social tensions from this explode in widespread violence.

dogbreath's picture

"This is going to get ugly."   is what they said in so many words.  They also said we still have a bit of time.   Means testing for SS is the least harmful cut which might buy a bit of breathing room.  All those who complain that they paid into it and are therefore entitled to it  are wrong..    As someone said above the money is gone and you have a claim on nothing.  Just get it through your heads that  you  will get nothing eventually and that time is fast approaching.  Getting wealthy seniors to prove they need SS is not an injustice. 


Oldwood's picture

How about we surrender our claim to social security if we get to sell our property that we worked for thirty years to pay for without capital gains. Its not that its worth more anyway, just the money we paid for it with is worth less. Its the least that they could do.

dogbreath's picture


I am 50 and dont expect to collect from the system.  I want nothing from the system if possible, but I wish I had more real friends. 

Those guys are right because when the bond market goes down your house will be worth a fraction of what it might be worth today.  If interest rates go up to 5.7% I am guessing your house is worth half of its present value.  Druckenmiller tried to hint at the cost of just equalizing the interest rates  not seeing them do a Volker at 22%.   So you  are worring about losing SS.  You are going to lose alot more than that.  Thats why the gold bugs here are saying buy gold and some farm land and try to preserve the value of what you  have worked for.  The rest  of that stuff is gone.

If and when the global bond market pops and the currency crisis becomes real, most people on this planet have nothing.  It will get ugly and you are worried that you paid into SS or don't want to pay capital gains.   Where were you in 80-82.  This time its global.  

You got to deduct the interest on your mortgage for your house so the depreciation of the currency has been paid forward.  This stuff is meaningless.

 protect yourself those you give a rats ass about.   get used to it now that SS and the other entitlements are good as gone

Oldwood's picture

Currently I am where most people are and have little to worry about in terms of gain on my home. My assumption is that as things decline the governments response will to print wildly causing significant inflation. Thats when i worry. Also because they will be starving for revenues I wouldn't be the least surprised if they changed the allowances for capital gains on principle mortgages as well. It probably matters little anyway because as you suggest we will be totally screwed in at least several other ways by then. Gold holds little promise in the long run simply because they have proven that they can outlaw or tax it to irrelevancy. Land is an immobil, unhideable tax magnet. I currently live on fifty acres fifteen miles from the center of a major metro center and they are taxing the life out of me. I'm living in my own delusion because I don't want to sell but know its going to eat my ass. I'm 60 with a small business trying to slide off a cliff as well, plying in my mind if i should risk even more of my shrinking savings into it. I mean at 60 and the prospect of no SS and no job and 28k/yr in prop taxes wonder what in hell do I do? I'm bonused with a wife ten years my junior who is a realtor and is convinced this is just another reccession and all we have to do is wait it out. Like many here I feel like I'm the only one seeing this looming disaster and if i say much more about it the guys in the white jackets will show up to take me away. I do know I have it good compared to a lot of people but that just means I have more to lose. Those with less to risk can be dangerous as well. Just feeling a little torn up right now feeling like I may well lose everything and then have to listen to Obama telling me everything is getting better and oh by the way, I should be paying my fair share. In the end, just another "rich" whiner I suppose. 

dogbreath's picture


Thats brutal.  How does fifty acres of farmland get valued so high to have to pay 28K in taxes.  Where I live undeveloped land seems to be undertaxed.  colusion of developers and shityhall, so run down properties in prime locations never get redeveloped and some prime land sits vacant forever.  we haven't had to squeeze the property tax lemon yet I guess.

Time to make a spread sheet and make several calculations based on varing degrees of optimism and pessimism looking forward and make a decisive strategic decision.   You are stuck between the hammer of property tax and the anvil of capitol gains.   When interest rates go up your land will deline in value and in a collapse it will be hard to sell.

I would also challenge the tax assessment because its not speculative land. 

Anusocracy's picture

Not one fucking peep about the trillion dollar security state scam?

Not one fucking peep about government pensions three times the size they should be for jobs that shouldn't even exist?

Or welfare for illegals? Or thousands of other things that shouldn't be funded?

Just SSI?


yogibear's picture

He's 100% right.

Bernanke and the Fed keep printing and the US government keeps spending until the bond market blows and interest rates go up!

Bernanke, Evans, Dudley and Yellen, keep printing and enabling spending by buying debt until a currency crisis occurs and intrest rates go ballistic!

When it blows up it will be historic!!!!! 

Keep buying the US treasuries with printed money. Loose the reseve currency status and US dollars from the rest of the wold come flooding in.




rhinoblitzing's picture

Frikin Elitist's...

"His Solution - ... means testing... raise retirement age..."

Right..... Where are those jobs that a 70 year old will be able to have and hold...


Phoenix_Rising's picture

What this whole stinkin thing has turned into is so pathetic.....

Too much money in too few hands

zerotohero's picture

The system is corrupt and it allows for TPTB to continue stuffing their pockets with gross amounts of money while smiling at the camera saying everythings fine don't worry we have everything under control. The curtain that hides the great and powerful Oz will one day be pulled aside (or torched) to reveal the putrid scum that have been shitting on the sheeples for what seems like an eternity.

cherry picker's picture

He isn't saying anything we all didn't know years ago.  The bail outs just made it worse, so did George W and Obama's war policies.

As broke as the system is, Washington is throwing money around like no tomorrow and Obama flies to play gulf in a 747 which is not cheap to operate.  It is a good thing they are printing money to pay for all this shit as my wallet is empty and if I make more coin, they aren't getting any of it.

razorthin's picture

Let the financial system collapse, as it is destined to, and seniors will have a strong dollar with which to buy deflated goods.  Problem solved.  Fukk the banks.  Communities will survive.  And fukk the government and its debt.

q99x2's picture

We have a FED problem and one day the entitlement hamster will imprison the banksters and re-distribute their stolen wealth.

Kalevi's picture

    "we have an entitlement problem."

Completely agree.

Stop giving free money to the bankster and through them to MIC.

A Lunatic's picture

Okay, I get it, but is Obama gonna pay my mogage or not????

israhole's picture

Another Jew now critical of the Jew World Order that has benefitted him and Jew Soros for too long.  He'll get to the bottom of it!

Dr. Engali's picture

I'm all for entitlement reform. Let's start with the welfare queen bankers , then the corporate beggars, and the thieving politicians. After we do all of that we can talk about raping the poor.

fonzannoon's picture

Exactly. That is exactly the correct order.

I love how a bunch of 55 year old say "this is not going to be my generation's problem". Yup. They will be dead in 30 years and this will all break down in 31 years, Holy deluded.

Debeachesand Jerseyshores's picture

A breath of fresh air that will be ignored until the US Economy hits the preverbial WALL!!!!!

Slightly Insane's picture

Move a bit closer, I'm wispering .  ..... whatever the FED purchases ..... well guess what ..... it's WORTH  ..... LESS!


shhhhhhhh!   Don't tell anyone else but zh'r's


(For you Contrarians .... what they are not buying ...... has  ...... value ...... and merit)

ebworthen's picture

If they cut entitlements and food stamps (SNAP) and welfare and Social Security and Medicare/Medicaid there will be mass civil disobedience, non-payment of taxes, and huge black markets - if not riots and collapse in major cities.  The only thing preventing this now is entitlements.

They are too far down the path to turn back. Productive employment has been off-shored, parasitic capitalist oligarchs have colluded with the plutocrats to rape the citizenry and bleed out their assets, especially the backbone of any society - the middle class.  There is no amount of spending cuts or taxation that will pay the debt and return stability.

They can keep printing money to float the markets, keep bailing out the banks, keep enrolling more and more into SS disability and food stamps until the debt is so big we default or the whole thing collapses in on itself and martial law is declared (or they start WWIII).

It will probably start with rates going up, massive inflation (biflation, stagflation worse than what we have now), and propaganda campaigns (quadruple what we have today) along the lines of:  "If only we do'X' it will all be O.K.".

Money printing and propaganda can go on for quite a while but the train has left the station, the horses are out of the barn.


Phoenix_Rising's picture

No turning back now

It's full throttle head-on into a brick wall

It would be political suicide to even try to fix anything

Almost Solvent's picture

There is nothing to fix anymore anyway, and more people are starting to wake up to that fact.

As history has proven, it's time for a paradigm shift, although there are those who want to keep the status quo as long as possible.

It's twilight for the cheap oil paradigm.

It'll be dark soon, and they mostly come at night... mostly.

Phoenix_Rising's picture

It's going to be a beauty to behold

watching these pig fukrs go down


Judge Crater's picture

Druckemmiller is proof that you can be an arrogant idiot and still get rich being a money manager on Wall Street. Steven Brill has an excellent long article in this week's TIME magazine that shows how hospitals use a "chargemaster" system that multiplies patient costs tenfold or more for patients not protected by Medicare. But if you expand Medicare to cover every hospital patient, there go the profits used to pay non-profit hospital honchos 7 and 8 figure salaries while the collection agencies used by medical-political complex to collect overdue hospital bills for under-insured patients are responsible for 60% of the individual bankruptcy court filings. The problem isn't entitlements; the problem are government sanctioned ripoffs everywhere, from hospitals to crooked bankruptcy court judges to endless wars that enrich politicians and insiders to a system of justice that locks poor people up for decades for relatively minor thefts while protecting insiders like Jamie Dimon and John Corzine from any criminal charges when they steal billions. Instead of Obamacare, Obama should remove the cap on earnings subject to Social Security. Then Obama should give every citizen with no medical insurance or bad medical insurance the option to join Medicare. Finally, Obama should legalize all narcotic drugs, which would cause all the lawyers and prosecutors and judges and cops who make a living off drug addicts to be forced to make a decision: find productive employment, file for disability or welfare benefits or commit suicide.

11b40's picture

Amen.  Glad to see it so clearly put

Oldwood's picture

So if you remove the cap for social security taxes, and you means test it, its just another tax right? ANd you realize for the self empoloyed you are talking about a 15.7% income tax on top of regular taxes. And you also realize that basically forcing us all into medicare. Do you know anyone who uses medicare? Do you think thats the best care available? I don't. But by taxing the crap out of everyone to fund your wet dream of indefinite life span we will be severely limited in our ability to save or pay for our own healthcare of choice. But I guess in a collective world, it is all about you. Thanks,

player333's picture

The Brill article made me sick to my stomach, each of the hospital spokespersons should be hanged for their obvious lying smugness.

Yes Government is the problem, from their involvement in Medicine(Medicare), Housing, and now fraud in the Obama Phone  giveaway, surprise, surprise.. Large Government takes on a life of its own and will suck up all resources-hence we have a "taxing problem".  As some one said here on ZH earlier, "there are black swans circling, it is just a matter of time before one crashes into the other or comes down of its own volution.It is time for "REAL Reveloution". 

Joseph Jones's picture

I'm just reading through these posts as fast as I can.  Yours was the first one I absolutely could not resist voting up, especially the last two words.


Dr. Engali's picture

Nice ... we are arguing over the scraps and the bankers are eating filet mignon.

Slightly Insane's picture

Actually this clown ... still has it wrong.  It ain't entitlements ..... we are wayyyyyyy past that stage.

Our problem is .... we are stupid  (well some of us anyway .... the ones that haven't left the system high and dry),

we allow a system which punishes creators and rewards the "taker".  The existance of politicians, lawyers, and bankers is ample proof that Prostitution is legal.  Anyone who is in prison is there because he or she operated outside the cartel's boundaries, and didn't have the wherewithall to throw a political contribution to a democrat.


It (as some ZH'rs have already alluded to) time for John Galt to make a showing.  Foks, (not the Million Dollar Whack Job - type assholes) - I'm done.  I'm going to slipstream from here on out .... if I can get a statist out of office on his ass .... I'll be behind the scenes .... These ass clowns have fucked our people up, it's time for payback in spades.

mumbo_jumbo's picture

entitlement problem???  WTF? we are talking about corporations....right? cause i all i know is i've paid (at the risk of jail time if i didn't) over $200K into SS and are you fucking saying i'm not "entitled" to get my fucking money back??


while corporate loopholes means most major corporations pay no fucking tax......FACEBOOK MUCH?

what the fucking fuck!!!

besnook's picture

and under his breath he is saying, "it's them fucking jew bag bankers preventing a real fix because there is too much money in .gov money."

notquantumdum's picture

I would still rather have the social security system that Chilean citizens and some of the counties in Texas have for their municipal workers:  private volutary accounts into a limited selection of investment options.  We wouldn't have the current entitlement debtbomb (or is it deathbomb) if we had done this years ago as was reportedly advocated by none other than FDR himself, as well as Clinton, Moynahan, Bush, and others.  I think FDR also said something about how demographics will eventually blow up the SS system if it is not later reformed.

How unbelievably f'ing ignorant are we, when measured collectively?

notquantumdum's picture

And . . . do the same things with health savings accounts for medicare.

brettd's picture

We r ignorant because the govt controls education!