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The Gold, Silver Morning Smackdown Is Back

Tyler Durden's picture


Having had yesterday off, it appears the ubiquitous morning dump in precious metals is back in all its glory... but didn't Jim Bullard just tell us 'Fed policy will stay very easy for a long time'?



Charts: Bloomberg


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Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:34 | 3266651 JeremyWS
JeremyWS's picture

lots of hedge funds going bust then? or more manipulation?

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:36 | 3266658 nope-1004
nope-1004's picture

OI is still high, and going higher.  Have to try to get OI down, and the only tool COMEX has is futures price since they have no metal.


Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:37 | 3266668 EscapeKey
EscapeKey's picture

in the event the comex FTD, why would anyone want to do actual physical trading there again?

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:48 | 3266681 GetZeeGold
GetZeeGold's picture



Knew a guy who actually tried to take delivery about 10 years ago. It was like watching a retarded goat roping contest.


So I know how the Germans now feel.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:50 | 3266721 Pladizow
Pladizow's picture

Qusetion I recently asked of Sprott and their response:

Dear Participant,

Thank you for submitting your question to the Sprott Precious Metals Round Table Webcast. Our panel is pleased to provide the following response to your inquiry:

Your Questions:


Q - Why doesn't the Sprott organization force Comex delivery and end the charade?

Ans - They are bigger than we are.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:56 | 3266758 Shell Game
Shell Game's picture

And that is how Rogue Governments stay around much longer than anyone can imagine..

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:15 | 3266859 SafelyGraze
SafelyGraze's picture

"Naturally, those who make leveraged purchases do not get possession of their assets. Those are held as collateral to secure repayment of the loan. Some crooks have charged people for leveraged purchases without ever bothering to acquire the assets allegedly being held as collateral."

or, as we like to say in the bizness, some people-doing-God's-work


get back to work, ye servants of God!


Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:34 | 3266948 The Thunder Child
The Thunder Child's picture

Next coupe of days is THE BEST LAST CHANCE to exit the paper promises of Wall St. and enter the realm of physical silver and gold. All the signs are there, the fractures are begining to show and the big money is quietly exiting the stage. I highly advise people to cash out now, leave the table and return to hard assets otherwise your greed will bankrupt you.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:51 | 3267044 AllThatGlitters
AllThatGlitters's picture

If silver bounces here, we know today's "smash" is just a retest of Fed inspired selloff lows.

Live Spot Silver: <- Ready to Bounce?

Dealers still have plenty of inventory for less than $1.00 under spot:

Will all those bars and rounds disappear soon?

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 12:17 | 3267146 Threeggg
Threeggg's picture

It won't bounce until after the options expiry Monday and the delivery notice on Tuesday. Look for a bounce Tuesday night going into wednesday.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 12:38 | 3267198 AllThatGlitters
AllThatGlitters's picture

Cool. I always forget about the options.

Another way to know when it is going to bounce is when dealers start start showing lack of inventory and posting notices of delivery delays.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 12:54 | 3267259 flacon
flacon's picture

Yes, don't forget about Op Ex on Monday. I opened a small gold call position today and will add to it on Monday if there is further down side. I might open up a small silver call position today as well just in case this is the bottom here and now. 


One could also play the gold:silver ratio. Gold puts, silver calls.


Fri, 02/22/2013 - 13:06 | 3267298 flacon
flacon's picture

I just opened a small diagonal spread to be used until after Op Ex. 


SLV Mar 01 $28.00 puts (ITM)

SLV Mar 16 $28.00 calls (OTM)


2/3 Calls, 1/3 puts


Fri, 02/22/2013 - 17:16 | 3268147 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

Thanks for pouring gasoline on the fire.

With paper-trading fools, who needs legitimate markets?

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:06 | 3266821 Quinvarius
Quinvarius's picture

I guess that is why he goes right to miners and refiners.

I am pretty sure everything that is supposed to go into SLV is being counted in a JPM vault these days and papered up as a customer account.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:07 | 3266825 Canadian Dirtlump
Canadian Dirtlump's picture

I believe it was Sprott who mentioned something to the effect of the guy who breaks the silver market would have to "look under his car ever time he got in it for the rest of his life" or words to that effect.


He's right. You either play the game, shut your face, or get suicided. There is no reason that Gold and Silver should need a collapse to break out, but they will need one, because the sociopaths playing the music won't stop what they do otherwise.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:20 | 3266884 SilverMaples
SilverMaples's picture

Announcement! Comex silver contract delivery will now conveniently take place using our "special" drone transport system. Just provide your exact coordinates ...

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:25 | 3266900 Canadian Dirtlump
Canadian Dirtlump's picture

I read some blurb that people were being paid as much as a 25% premium to settle in cash. I have no idea if this is true, but TPTB obviously have an unlimited well from which to draw their ammunition to fuck us over.


Goddamn, it's early for a drink but hey, I'm a trooper.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 13:20 | 3267355 imbrbing
imbrbing's picture

Settle in cash, then go buy the real shit.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:44 | 3268010 cynicalskeptic
cynicalskeptic's picture

If prices are headed downward and everyone expects the trend to be DOWN, then why is the US Mint RAISING prices on silver and gold?

They upped the prices on silver a few months back - you now pay substantially more for a silver eagle proof and uncirc as well as 5oz ATB


but now they upped the cost on gold and platinum - the grid pricing based on London close is not HIGHER than it used to be


methinks the US Mint is expecting higher prices for the raw materials - that and they intend to stick it to consumers even more......

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:09 | 3266830 Diet Coke and F...
Diet Coke and Floozies's picture

Size does matter! She lied to me! :^O

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:37 | 3266670 HoofHearted
HoofHearted's picture

Lots of ZHers putting the truck in reverse and getting to the loading dock. The bad thing is that we can't find physical metal anywhere near the "spot price" for paper. That damned paper is so much easier to mine than is actual metal. 

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:43 | 3266690 eeaton
eeaton's picture

true, silver eagles about $3 over spot, more than 10%!! Bars about $1.25 over spot but they kill you when you want to sell.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:53 | 3266743 new game
new game's picture

if you must sell try bullion direct out of austin tx

they nucleo exchange with 1 percent fee, buyer/seller bid/sell match system

been using it for quite some time

physical only!

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:54 | 3266746 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

"...but they kill you when you want to sell."  Sell?  SELL?  Are you speculating with silver or stacking to store value?  If the former, you should be speculating with paper (not bullion) and skip the margins hit.  If the latter, then who really give a crap what the dealers are doing?  You can always be your own dealer if you need to sell for some reason of fiscal desperation.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:59 | 3266779 new game
new game's picture

prefer anonamous...

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:03 | 3266802 Svendblaaskaeg
Svendblaaskaeg's picture

At least you dont have to pay 25% VAT

how do You like them beans: (Denmark)

1 oz Eagle  Dkr. 161.00/253.00

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:25 | 3266902 Irelevant
Irelevant's picture

I said the same. However there appear to be on line dealers from Germany and Austria that sell without VAT.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:40 | 3266989 Svendblaaskaeg
Svendblaaskaeg's picture

Dunno any but Silberling in Germany and they ad 7% VAT

Estonia will deliver VAT free pre payed via bank transfer but I rather play it safe and pay the German 7% VAT


Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:49 | 3266713 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

Bingo.  The world is drowning in paper fucking promises, the greater the divergence between the paper market price (for all commodities) and the actual prices paid to take delivery, the closer we get to another world war.  Why?  simple, eventually, people won't be able to get the essential commodites they need for survival and when goods and services stop crossing borders, troops will.  Same as it ever was...

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:53 | 3266740 tip e. canoe
tip e. canoe's picture

O/T LoP -- curious as to your thoughts on this article:

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:04 | 3266806 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

Bloomberg is putting a positive spin on things.  Despite getting more for our wheat, corn, soybeans, and cotton.  Subsidies have been cut, the input costs are up (fertilizer, diesel, etc.) and to be honest, you don't make any money if you have no produce to sell.  These folks are planting more acerage in hopes that prices will hold, or not drop much more.  This isn't an easy business, but these folks know nothing else.  Farming is changing, everyone will pay more.  No way around it with 7+ billion mouths to feed and commerical farms so dependent the energy infrastructure (which is dealing with a collapsing EROEI).  Own idle land?  Put the appropriate fruit, nut, and hives on it now.  It's the easiest way to get a tax break in most states and make the land profitable.

Diversivication is the key.  We have moved into areas like pecans, walnuts, and honey.  Why?  For the most part, these trees and hives take care of themselves.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 12:11 | 3266854 tip e. canoe
tip e. canoe's picture

thanks man. 
smart move on your part.
agroforestery is the future.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 13:06 | 3267309 Room 101
Room 101's picture

Hives take care of themselves?  BWAAAAHAAHAAA!   We're seeing 40-60% overwinter mortality this year.  Depens on where you are of course, but been a horrible year.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 13:15 | 3267344 tip e. canoe
tip e. canoe's picture

that's not good.   any thoughts as to the cause?

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 13:37 | 3267400 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

Some of the simplest sayings are the most accurate. In this case, it's "location, location, location". The point is to have a business model that smoothes things out.  When one thing is up, another is down etc.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 15:12 | 3267697 Midas
Midas's picture

Things are getting so bad Hedgeless has been eating his pet rabbits.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:12 | 3266849 Bicycle Repairman
Bicycle Repairman's picture


Farm commodities are not like gold.  Anyone can plant corn.  Anyone.  I see little guys planting corn on small plots of land all over NE. 

Unless government ups ethanol content to 15% countrywide, the corn bubble is over.

Let's all head down to DC and get the government to make America energy independent.  15% ethanol or OPEC wins!!!!!


Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:32 | 3266935 Irelevant
Irelevant's picture

Have no worries, China will be happy to buy all that corn, they have all those pigs to feed.

Sat, 02/23/2013 - 11:07 | 3267029 Bicycle Repairman
Bicycle Repairman's picture

The price goes down anyway.  I wonder if any other countries can grow corn?

CORN is down 20% in 6 months.  The corn bubble has *popped*.

Keep this in mind when someone says "buy farmland".

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:46 | 3267015 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

Indeed.  Anyone can plant it.  It's another thing entirely to make a living planting, growing, harvesting, and selling it.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:49 | 3267038 Bicycle Repairman
Bicycle Repairman's picture

These guys make a living at something else.  Corn is their hobby.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:53 | 3267052 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

"Corn is their lobby" - fixed.  And for some reason that lobby just won't die.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 13:12 | 3267334 Acidtest Dummy
Acidtest Dummy's picture

Anyone who can afford to farm can afford to retire.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:55 | 3267064 Big Corked Boots
Big Corked Boots's picture

"Anyone can plant corn.  Anyone."

Yeah. Next you're going to say that it doesn't cost anything to grow stuff, you just plant the seed and wait. Just like some of the dumbass city slickers that come to my onfarm produce stand.

Newsflash for you: It takes a lot of skill to get a good crop. Corn *might* be easier but your small plots don't produce much yield.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 12:35 | 3267209 fuu
fuu's picture

Corn only costs $5 to dig out of the ground.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 12:40 | 3267217 Conax
Conax's picture

I greened you one because I have discussed farming with a few polished urbanites that think it means you feed the chickens, milk the cows, and all that other "old MacDonald had a farm" bullshit.  Farming is a science and making a living on a small plot (@ $15K an acre plus taxes) is a lot tougher than it seems.

Eeyi- eeyi- O.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 14:26 | 3267542 Bicycle Repairman
Bicycle Repairman's picture

Corn is a very simple commodity.  The price went up.  More supply appeared within a year.  Price goes down.

It's a commodity.  The barriers to entry are as low as they get.

The corn bubble is over.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:04 | 3266808 Spastica Rex
Spastica Rex's picture

It's so hard to throw a good big war these days.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:48 | 3266714 Rich V
Rich V's picture

I have good luck with Texas Precious Metals. They are about $2 over spot on Maple Leaves and best of all you can place a limit order with them for any PM the sell. Set your price and wait for it to lock in 24/7.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:03 | 3266807 Boston
Boston's picture

Same here. 


Great guys to work with. Lowest prices around (WAY better than APMEX) and the GTC limit order feature is very unique. I've had lots of orders filled at 2:00 in the morning on big dips. Without the limit orders, I would have paid more.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:34 | 3266947 Irelevant
Irelevant's picture

This is of great concern to the banks. If you can place orders for physical, at 2 am, in light trading, when they hammer the price, you are a threat to JPM and Co as you are locking out physical at the lowest price possible.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:47 | 3267017 4realmoney
4realmoney's picture

Texas Precious Metals is the best bullion dealer, bar none, and I have used all the big guys. They have low premiums, and they guarantee all their shipments go out in three business. No other dealer promises that, and I have waited three months to receive orders in the past from other dealers. is their website

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:58 | 3266769 Stoploss
Stoploss's picture

Buy pure 24k solid gold rings only, from pawn shops. (Paper price, and phys deliery at the same time.) Doesn't get any better than that.

I make my own bars and have them independently 3rd party certified with x ray, chemical testing.  Any NDT shop will do it if they have the method equipment on site.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:05 | 3266813 maskone909
maskone909's picture

whats your margin?

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 12:52 | 3267266 TriGuy
TriGuy's picture

Actually, COMEX stockpiles are the highest they've been in 16 years.

But we can go full retard if that's what you're in to.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:37 | 3266665 Dr. Richard Head
Dr. Richard Head's picture

Manipulation either way.  These are liquidations of paper gold and silver. The only reason one can see that it is paper being sold off is because we are talking an entire year's worth of production being dumped on the market in a matter of seconds.  So it may well be liquidation of paper gold and silver of hedge funds being caught long in equities and associated margin calls or it may be primary dealers selling off their naked shorts. 

Any way you slice it, they are fucking with the paper markets across the board.  Fuck them and the paper they rode in on.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:56 | 3267068 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

No "one"'controls a market. RISK MANAGEMENT is true for Banker and trader alike.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:52 | 3266735 rogeliokh
rogeliokh's picture

"Massive Global Gold Price Manipulation Exposed"

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:16 | 3266864 johnnymustardseed
johnnymustardseed's picture

FUCK JPM !!!! But they have no choice because they have no physical!

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:36 | 3266960 Irelevant
Irelevant's picture

Force Majeure -

They will just walk away.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 12:22 | 3267164 Lordflin
Lordflin's picture

These selloffs take place several times a week. Jim Sinclair believes this latest round will end sometime in March and likens it to the market in 1979, right before the metals made a massive upswing. On the other hand, as much as I respect Mr. Sinclair's opinion, and he may well be right, I am not nearly as sanguine. Because of massive dept the game is different this time.

However, to remain in the paper market, and I admit I maintain a small position mostly in miners and some paper silver, is akin to a death wish. I am reminded of an old wrestling move... Grab the opponents leg and prop it up on your thigh... Move him backwards to keep him off balance and force him to depend on you to remain standing... At the right moment drop your leg out from under and throw your weight on top of him... He comes down instantly... Last thing I am going to do is take what remains of my wealth and balance it atop of their paper while waiting for the timed collapse I know is coming... The timing I can't know, but perhaps Mr. Sinclair is right.

In any event, bullion is for stacking not trading... And if you have not taken possession you are a fool.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 14:04 | 3267487 The Juice
The Juice's picture

Has anybody looked at the GLD weekly lately? This isn't price manipulation, this is show's over chaps. Hedge Funds aren't trying to short this, they are bailing on bets that not only haven't paid off in the last 12 months but they are losing asset value.....and now down another 5% MTD, it's going to get ugly soon

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 21:39 | 3268908 philipat
philipat's picture

More, increasingly shameless, manipulation. The CFTC is in its FIFTH year of investigation of what else can see as obvious, so it can perhaps be concluded that the Regulator is something the cartel knows it doesn't have to worry about. And, of course, with the Fed supplying the moolah........................

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:36 | 3266657 q99x2
q99x2's picture

Call the solipismist. Have him wish it to the cornfield.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:37 | 3266661 EscapeKey
EscapeKey's picture

there is nothing suspicious about this.

and the fact that this NEVER happens to equities OR bonds is not suspicious either.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:47 | 3266706 Confundido
Confundido's picture

Correction: and the fact that this NEVER happens to equities OR bonds at 8:20am ET is not suspicious either.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 18:32 | 3268422 ClumsyBoatman
ClumsyBoatman's picture

Dear Sir,

Our investigation has revealed no evidence of manipulation. Case Closed.


Hulk Hogan

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:17 | 3266869 SmallerGovNow2
SmallerGovNow2's picture

psst, EscKey, your sarc switch is on....

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:37 | 3266662 ghengis86
ghengis86's picture

Bang it hard; need to pick up some more before my boating trip this weekend.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:36 | 3266663 VonManstein
VonManstein's picture

its bullish. Watch the miners break higher today

next week the metals are done to the downside.

Silver completing wave 6 of smaller consol ptrn within big C wave in the fashion of 2010. Expect more shaking down and wave 7 form a neckline to D bottom IHS then up to larger wave 7 and final low at point 8 in september.

Then we rip like never before

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:05 | 3266771 Shell Game
Shell Game's picture

Tomorrow a.m.'s trip to the coin shop is making me giddy, always does..  The blah-Wave up, then wazzacallit patterns.....not so much.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:02 | 3266789 gmrpeabody
gmrpeabody's picture

"Silver completing wave 6 of smaller consol ptrn within big C wave in the fashion of 2010. Expect more shaking down and wave 7 form a neckline to D bottom IHS then up to larger wave 7 and final low at point 8 in september."

What...? No chicken entrails?

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 12:04 | 3267095 Canadian Dirtlump
Canadian Dirtlump's picture

I had posted some of my analysis on silver doctors and to summarize..


I see a couple of reverse doji candles leading to a descending robotic egg fart flag football formation looking ready to close on a hunchback head and shoulders sipping on a cup and handle of maker's mark.

Combine that with a shfiftyleven sigma fibonacci retracement into the danger zone... and you have what I call the robertson effect building. What is the robertson effect? No fucking clue.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 14:28 | 3267549 imbrbing
imbrbing's picture

LOL, you forgot to facter in the death cross. All of a sudden it will make sense!

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:37 | 3266664 jcia
jcia's picture

Get it to 20 and ZH members will go ALL IN.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:39 | 3266677 HoofHearted
HoofHearted's picture

ZH members are trying to go all in, but nobody is supplying the actual physical metals near this price. Premiums are rising. 

Sat, 02/23/2013 - 06:14 | 3269523 e-recep
e-recep's picture

true that. i couldn't buy a shit last week coz i found the premium too high. fuck, i'm goin' in next week no matter what. this smells bad.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:38 | 3266673 AL_SWEARENGEN

Silver open interest is still holding strong above 150,000.  Someone is taking on jpm.  They cant shake the longs out this time for some reason, and the crazy cocksuckerz dont have the metal to deliver!

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:40 | 3266679 HoofHearted
HoofHearted's picture

I hope you are right. And I hope the longs stand for delivery. March could get VERRRRRY interesting...

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:58 | 3266777 Alpo for Granny
Alpo for Granny's picture

X2 but if that happens I think it will be pronounced "darivereey".

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:43 | 3266687 the not so migh...
the not so mighty maximiza's picture

Praise the lord!!!

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:50 | 3266718 EmmittFitzhume
EmmittFitzhume's picture

Fractional reserve precious metalling?  Maybe?

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:00 | 3266788 eclectic syncretist
eclectic syncretist's picture

They've cornered themselves!!!

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 12:31 | 3267196 Threeggg
Threeggg's picture

Looks like another MF Global coming up if this OI holds up.

Who's it gonna be ? any other .gov "buddies" that run commodity houses ?

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:38 | 3266674 Kaiser Sousa
Kaiser Sousa's picture

i knew i should have waited til today to lock for next week...

oh well....dollar cost averaging...

fucking phony paper price manipulating bitch ass banker....

more for me on the cheap you mother fuckers...

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:20 | 3266882 Seasmoke
Seasmoke's picture

I tried to tell you , but you got a little offended

Still it's all good.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 12:40 | 3267226 Kaiser Sousa
Kaiser Sousa's picture

dude what is with u...

i aleady told u that until its in triple digits the phony paper price on any given day doesnt matter to me and mine....temptation to try and guage price  and purchases in no way undermines my main accumulation strategy...which is JUST TO KEEP ON STACKING!!!!

ive been in this war from $9-$49 so what exactly do u think u've been tryin to tell me?????

until i look at my stash and say thats enough i'll be buying with all the Federal Reserve Worthless Notes that come my way...GET IT???????

now stay in ur lane and leave me n mine......


Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:42 | 3266685 mjorden
mjorden's picture

Bloomberg Government on twitter "President Obama has notified Congress of 100 US military troops now deployed in Niger".

and it starts ... I am just waiting until a drone stirke in the NA part of MENA kills a Chinese national ...

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:49 | 3266717 Tsar Pointless
Tsar Pointless's picture

I am just waiting until a drone stirke in the NA part of MENA kills a Chinese national ...

This is a certainty. And, I'm sure, part of the plan.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:45 | 3266692 TheCanimal
TheCanimal's picture
Gold's day in the sun is over: CIBC

We have to consider the possibility that they are right.  I have alot of gold and silver although i'm not selling.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:48 | 3266705 GetZeeGold
GetZeeGold's picture



Same thing they said a decade ago....same thing they'll say a decade from now.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:04 | 3266812 new game
new game's picture

president ordered troops in or p.o. gold?

same answer...

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 12:32 | 3267200 Threeggg
Threeggg's picture

He also ordered drone troops to niger to protect the public LOL

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:26 | 3266828 pods
pods's picture

What is the ancient Egyptian saying for "Gold is just a barbarous relic?"


Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:50 | 3267043 e_goldstein
e_goldstein's picture

ingot, beetle, topless crone staring left that suspiciously looks like Masters.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:52 | 3266729 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

Gold is a store of value, nothing more.  Wake me when it gets below $300 an ounce, this is the dollar-cost average of my holdings.

Something else to think about, what's the counter party risk to owning physical?  Are you worried that someday no-one will accept it in exchange for the fruits of their labor?  I certainly don't see that happening.   Humanity will once again re-learn the true meaning of value and risk.  WWII was the last time the world had a real lesson on this.  This time will be no different.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:12 | 3266846 Meat Hammer
Meat Hammer's picture

+1.  If you're still thinking about PMs in terms of value in Fed toilet paper you're staying in their matrix.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:54 | 3266747 Irelevant
Irelevant's picture

I have no idea what they smoke at the financial post, anyway, tell them to print CHEAP oil ASAP! As soon as they figure a way to print cheap oil and exchange it for dollars all will be well. Maybe the Unicorn can help!

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:45 | 3266693 TheCanimal
TheCanimal's picture
Gold's day in the sun is over: CIBC

We have to consider the possibility that they are right.  I have alot of gold and silver although i'm not selling.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:03 | 3266800 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

And yet these very same people (CIBC, HSBC, Scotia...) were predicting Au prices in the $1800's or more only a few months ago.  /Are you really going to start taking financial advice from banks now?/sarc.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 12:12 | 3267131 Rusty Trombone
Rusty Trombone's picture

Is this the same HSBC that is in bed with the fucking Mexicans ? - Another angle as to where mass physical purchases may be going. They need to hide the fucking money in a big way - get Phizz and bury it - you're talking billions in untraceable funds , that will surely reappear when the time is right. Hold what you got.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:05 | 3266817 fuu
fuu's picture

FTFA: "CIBC believes the Fed will pull back from quantitative easing late in 2013 and start to talk more about upcoming interest rate hikes in the second half of 2014. The economists noted that expectations for rate hikes in 2015 will push up bond yields, raising the opportunity cost of holding a bar of gold with a zero yield."

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 12:26 | 3267174 Al Huxley
Al Huxley's picture

If CIBC says they believe the Fed will pull back from QE, then they're either really fucking stupid, or they're lying.  Or both...

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:45 | 3266694 sudzee
sudzee's picture

Just about the highest negativity in PM's I've seen since gold dropped to 625 from 1000. Blood in the streets - yup, fiat in pocket - yup, coin shop got stock - yup.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:46 | 3266697 zapdude
zapdude's picture

We were all snowed in yesterday and the coin shop was closed. 

The roads are now clear and I'm buying today.

I can't fill up a truck, but I can fill my pockets with several oz.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:48 | 3266707 astoriajoe
astoriajoe's picture

ahh, feels like home..

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:48 | 3266712 eclectic syncretist
eclectic syncretist's picture

I want more today too.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:06 | 3266823 new game
new game's picture

starting to feel the bottom, kinda like walleye fishing...

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:50 | 3266722 Weisbrot
Weisbrot's picture

there is what we are told, and when we are told. when gold gets closer to the cost of mining, about $1100 that would seem to be a good time to buy.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:52 | 3266728 MFLTucson
MFLTucson's picture


I hope Russia and China shove it so far up JP Morgans ass they go bust!

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:52 | 3266730 wally_12
wally_12's picture

I went to the "Official" U.S. Mint distributor in our area, The Coin Gallery, and was told there is no currently no physical gold or silver available.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:51 | 3266731 maskone909
maskone909's picture

my boys at the coinshop ran out of gold. said nobody is panic selling yet. maybe @ 1500 oz they will. then its mine!!

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 15:42 | 3267790 Papasmurf
Papasmurf's picture

They were panic selling here two days ago.  My friend was snooping around in a busy LCS and the owner announced to folks standing there with items to sell "gold today is $1400".  

There were plenty of sellers, so this is a bottom.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:52 | 3266733 fractal trader
fractal trader's picture

XAUUSD long @ 1552.38, stoploss = 1530.00

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:57 | 3266765 Irelevant
Irelevant's picture

You must be some kind of masochist playing these crooked markets. Anyway, you are placing a bet, in a rigged casino, on a paper promise they will not honor.

Imagine you are now in a Minsk casino, you win all those chips, when you go to cash them the bouncer will beat the shit out of you and kick you out of the joint. Same here, only that the .gov owns the police, the justice system, the regulators and the casino. So you are playing a very dagerous game.

Paper gold will go to 0.

Physical gold, well that is another story.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:59 | 3266778 fractal trader
fractal trader's picture

I placed my bet anyway.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:55 | 3266749 oldschool
oldschool's picture

A question from the potentially unfounded speculation file: Is a large national government possibly driving down the price so it can accumulate a large quantity it is bound to deliver withn the next several years but currently cannot?

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:05 | 3266816 Irelevant
Irelevant's picture

That train has long left the station. I think most of the scrap metal and jewelry already went to the pawn shop and of to China. They need to present the world with a strong dollar, this is oil play. Beating gold also brings down the price of oil, being it temporarily.

However this is stupid, dumb and self defeating as the Chinese hold huge amount of US paper to exchange for oil.

I think we are at the last 2 minutes of the game.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:56 | 3266756 Quinvarius
Quinvarius's picture

I am full on bulltard in gold.  I recognize this pattern.  I saw it in stocks after QE 4 and 5.  I saw it in everything in 2009 when they announced QE1 then beat the market down.  The big GS led trading ring ass pound before lift off.  They want it all. 

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:03 | 3266805 Shell Game
Shell Game's picture

I'm such a full on bulltard on gold that I am HAPPY when the price goes up OR down. Really, I don't give a flying fuck what the paper maket makes gold LOOK like.  I know what it is

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:13 | 3266851 Seasmoke
Seasmoke's picture

As am I. Still you must admit , that you would rather pay 1500 than 1700 an ounce ?

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:17 | 3266868 Shell Game
Shell Game's picture

Readily. As stated above I am starting to feel slight giddiness at the prospect of my coin shop visit tomorrow a.m.  ;)

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 10:57 | 3266768 Catullus
Catullus's picture

It's obviously people getting margin called. And yes, the exchange should be raising margins right now. Anyone who has underwritten puts should be getting called and not hedging this out by writing calls. Instead, looking at the open positions, it looks like they're selling calls to raise cash to cover.

But that's the unintended consequence of lowering margins. Otherwise naked put sellers would have covered with either a physical purchase or closed the put positions.

Long Dramamine.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:06 | 3266819 Meat Hammer
Meat Hammer's picture

Oh shit, look at the price!  I need to go dump all of my PM's and get some USD!  Oops, silly me, I mean back up the truck and add to the stack, bitchez!

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:11 | 3266845 pods
pods's picture

Are they still monetizing 85 billion a month?

Have they printed up any more PHYSICAL gold?

Why worry?


Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:28 | 3267942 Papasmurf
Papasmurf's picture

With 3-d printing, they can make gold veneered tungsten bars.  You have to buy Chinese ink though.  The HP ink gets costly.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:18 | 3266870 Kina
Kina's picture

Cant say that I bother too much checking gold or silver prices anymore. What I have I am keeping no matter what until the shit hits the fan....


But heck, most countries printing fiat like confetti and still sinking into recession....think I am going to have all my wealth in fiat when we know something truly fcked awaits at some time in the future?

Like walking the desert without a water bottle, trusting in bernanke rain.


Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:30 | 3266925 Madcow
Madcow's picture

the Fed says it will tighten - 

Western governements realize that they must dramatically cut spending - and have indidcated that dramatic cuts will start immediatly - starting in 2013

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:33 | 3266940 NoWayJose
NoWayJose's picture

Thought my watch was broken yesterday.  No gold plunge to set it by...

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:38 | 3266978 Grand Supercycle
Grand Supercycle's picture

As mentioned many times...

When DOW / SP500 correction gathers momentum I expect:

UP ~ USD, various USDXXX currencies, VIX Index.


Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:43 | 3267003 astoriajoe
astoriajoe's picture

<<<SLV puts/SIVR Calls

<<<SLV puts/SLV Calls

Which straddle would you prefer if you had to pick one?

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:54 | 3267057 earnulf
earnulf's picture

That does seem to the be the key, no one wants to sell physical at the paper price.   Therefore either holders of physcial are holding buyers hostage, or the paper price is pure BS and not worth the paper it's printed on.

Possession is 9/10th of the law, and apparently, the value too!

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 11:59 | 3267080 cocoablini
cocoablini's picture

Gold price on COMEX is part of the global currency system- a knob to twiddle like dollars and euros and yen. There is no COMEX gold, its just an accountin line item like everything else. We are part of the biggest kabuki show in history- a total fiat system with fiat gold and fiat digital metals. Good fucking luck getting delivery. All these gold funds have gold spoken for 80x over and its just a way to inflate your nominal value in dollars. If you don't have it, it does not exist.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 12:20 | 3267154 TheCanimal
TheCanimal's picture

Does PHYS, PSLV, GTU and CEF own their metals as i've been led to believe?  Not that if i ever make money on them, they will be taxed at 90%.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 12:21 | 3267156 TheCanimal
TheCanimal's picture

Does PHYS, PSLV, GTU and CEF own their metals as i've been led to believe?  Not that if i ever make money on them, they will be taxed at 90%.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 12:26 | 3267118 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

For some perspective (from a geo-synchronous orbit)... There seem to be 2 PM camps:

A. Camp USA, where all CB's of indebted countries are toeing the line and playing Follow-the-fiat-leader (The Fed).  This camp is there to prop up the USD at any (financial, economic, military or human) cost.  This is still the camp of the ancient feudal masters and their progeny, but for some reason the peasants seem to think that they are 'free'.  This is all relative, as real 'freedom' has a much higher bar than they have become used to in recent years.

B. Camp BRIC is the league of un-indebted nations who prefer to keep the wealth they create by the sweat of their brow, and prefer to anchor their money in PM bullion. Some nations are trying to take the middle road (by playing with both sides) for strategic and tactical reasons, as they seek to avoid partaking in global military adventures and entanglements.  Perfectly understandable.

The two camps are at war.  The currency war is heating up, while both camps are out to grab the remaining key global resources.  Both can create all the fiat they want.  What they want is resources and the insatiable desire of same.  In spite of the rhetoric (pure posturing and PR), note that Camp USA is using its fiat and the military as a means to get at global resources.  They don't want to just "buy" resources on the open market (like everyone else).  They want to control or outright own them -- like good feudal lords that they are.  They think that China can be 'managed' or 'contained' (outgunned in S.Am., Africa and the ME).  They don't like not having leverage over their true arch-rival -- the Russians -- and the fact that the Russians are selling energy to the EU, while holding strategic and precious metals, nukes, etc.  This is bad for leverage, bad for business, and bad for globalist NWO ambitions.  They are the ambitions of the colonialists and empire builders that subsided from overt war for some decades, but never went away.  So they (Camp USA) are seeking to get at the Central Asian energies also, by chipping away one country at a time.  Yesterday it was Libya, today it's Syria (for pipeline path), tomorrow it's Iran.

The Takeaway?  1. Trust in the predictable laws of Nature and Human Nature.  2. Become more self-sufficient and form local and regional alliances.  3. Invest in what's "real", speculate (gamble) that which you can truly afford to lose.  4. Repeat 1-3 (keep stacking and preparing), and watch the show unfold.  Kirk out.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 12:11 | 3267130 Xibalba
Xibalba's picture

FED DAY!  Bonds UP, USD's UP, Stocks UP.... Metals DOWN

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 12:57 | 3267276 Sigep0612
Sigep0612's picture

I have totally underestimated the amount of time a concrete block can float in air.  The Bernak and his lemmings continue to perform magic that defies physics.  Frankly, the charade can go on indefinitely or until the Chinese say we want more of a return.  Gold, Silver, and Levi's with the capital E should be going through the roof.  The manipulation is astonishing.  Then again,  the headlines of USA today...55% of Americans agree with Obama's plan to resolve the debt situation.  WHAT????    Can I buy stock in Chinese sky laterns ?

Now this from Feb 16 "The Economist" magazine: "Suppose you had $100 in a savings account that paid an interest rate of 2% a year.  If you leave the money in the account, how much would you have accumulated after five years: more than $102, exactly $102, or less than $102 ?"   This question was in a survey.  Are your ready for this ?   "...only half of Americans aged over 50 gave the correct answer."   No lie.  This is an outrage.  And I sit here and wonder why the country is heading down the tubes?   Bartender...another Jack and Coke please!!!   


Fri, 02/22/2013 - 13:11 | 3267328 lakecity55
lakecity55's picture

I don't know about you guys, but it seems TPTB are really pushing hard.

"Get with the Program, Serfs!"

re: I had a call this a.m. from my brokerage offering "new products."

They are hurting for retail/self-managed accounts.

I declined, politely.

I will stay with my barbarous PM collection.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 13:28 | 3267376 devo
devo's picture

Need hard evidence or it's just conspiracy theory that nobody outside of GATA or ZH will take seriously. That's the reality of this.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 15:32 | 3267760 Random_Robert
Random_Robert's picture

Dealer premiums to spot rising on physical bars and coins?  check

Future prices being hammered into the dirt? check

Physical bullion only being offered on Ebay above Spot? check

CME reducing margins?  check

Open (long) interest rising in the Commercial category?  check

The conclusion is simple - the real "price" of Gold and Silver will be discovered at the exact same moment that the spot ticker finally touches zero.



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