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Guest Post: World's Biggest Gold Storage Company Dumps US Citizens

Tyler Durden's picture


Submitted by Simon Black of Sovereign Man blog,

ViaMat, a Swiss logistics company that has been safeguarding precious metals since 1945, is literally the gold standard in secure storage.

They have vaults from Switzerland to Hong Kong to Dubai, and they count among their clients some of the largest mining companies in the world. They know what they’re doing.

And now they’re dumping US citizens.

ViaMat does a great deal of business within the United States. As such, the company is heavily exposed to the insane US regulatory environment.

As an example, the 2010 Foreign Account Tax Compliance Act turned into more than 500 pages of regulation! The costs and risks associated with compliance simply became too much for ViaMat to bear.

This matter-of-fact letter from ViaMat management explains their decision:

“We are currently experiencing rapid and substantial changes in the general regulations within this business. The changes mainly relate to the tax structures and taxation systems of various countries. As a consequence of these changes VIA MAT INTERNATIONAL has taken the decision to stop offering this service at its vault [sic] outside of the US to private customers with potential US-tax liability.”


 RED ALERT: Worlds biggest gold storage company dumps US citizens


This is huge. I can’t possibly overstate the potential ramifications.

For one, the big gold depositories like Gold Money and Bullion Vault ALL use ViaMat as a primary secure storage provider. So it’s only a matter of time before ViaMat’s decision cascades across these other firms.

I have written extensively about this to subscribers of our premium service, Sovereign Man: Confidential; most gold storage firms are all essentially different varieties of the exact same product. They are retail marketing channels that ultimately use ViaMat to store their gold bars. If ViaMat has US exposure, THEY have US exposure. It’s the same risk.

Now, if you’re in the United States in particular, one of the most important (and cost effective) steps you can take in international diversification is to store precious metals overseas.

Gold remains the most effective ‘anti-currency’ out there, a bet against a corrupt financial system and debt-laden sovereign governments. But remember– governments have an unblemished track record of plundering their citizens’ wealth. So if you store your gold in the US, you might as well ask Barack Obama to keep it under his mattress.

If history is any guide, storing gold abroad is critical. And it’s one of those things that you won’t be worse off for doing.

The thing is, it’s equally critical to work with a service provider that has no US exposure.

There are very few options out there. Again, most of the big boys use ViaMat, which has heavy US exposure. Or Brinks, which is a US company.

For nearly a year, I’ve been encouraging our premium subscribers to store their gold with a Singapore-based company that has the most advanced, transparent operation on the planet.

They are 100% Singaporean, and their US regulatory exposure is effectively zero.

They’re also one of the only firms on the planet that actually tests the gold it sells (and stores) through three different methods, including X-ray and ultrasound. This way you know that your gold is, in fact, gold… and not tungsten.

Best of all, they’re launching a new service to receive your existing gold at their facilities in Singapore. So if you’ve just been shut out of ViaMat, or you want to transfer your gold from another facility that has heavy US exposure, these guys will be able to do it.

They are, without a doubt, the best solution out there. And Sovereign Man: Confidential members have received unprecedented discounts and exclusive access to new services offered by this firm.

Storing gold overseas makes sense no matter what happens. And it’s critical to choose a reputable partner with no US exposure. If you agree with this premise and are serious about taking action, I’d encourage you to get started right away with a premium membership. Get the actionable intelligence you need, all backed by our risk-free guarantee.


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Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:12 | 3267877 Buckaroo Banzai
Buckaroo Banzai's picture

Obligatory Simon Black hate comments in 3...2...1...

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:14 | 3267887 fuu
fuu's picture

Simon Black, international busker of mystery.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:24 | 3267905 ACP
ACP's picture

Shit, does this mean we'll have to hide our booty like in the old days...aka Yellowbearding...

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:48 | 3268028 Croesus
Croesus's picture

I will eat my gold.


Fri, 02/22/2013 - 18:09 | 3268347 Acidtest Dummy
Acidtest Dummy's picture

I hope it is not molten like your namesake's was.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 18:23 | 3268393 zaphod
zaphod's picture

Bullshit, burying your gold at least 10 feet underground in remote locations that only you know of, is the safest location.

Storing gold abroad can be safe you your own government goes broke, but is not safe if the local government goes broke.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 18:25 | 3268401 Boris Alatovkrap
Boris Alatovkrap's picture

Boris learn, after loose teeth and thin hair, Cesium and Iridium is also more safest store subterranean.


Sat, 02/23/2013 - 00:52 | 3269298 CIABS
CIABS's picture

I'm going to look into that Singapore company's services.  They sound really good.

Wait, I don't know their name.  How can I get their name?  What is the point of this article if he doesn't even tell us the name of the company he's recommending?

Sat, 02/23/2013 - 02:34 | 3269397 JOYFUL
JOYFUL's picture

umm, the point of the article is that after you read it, Simon's wallet will be a little fatter, and your's a little slimmer...

premium content baby! You gotta 'capitalize' on your knowledge base these days...jet settin ain't cheap!


Sat, 02/23/2013 - 07:22 | 3269569 jeff montanye
jeff montanye's picture

what's "sic" about "vault"?  should be vaults?  

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 18:42 | 3268448 sessinpo
sessinpo's picture

Isn't it ironic that someone makes money buy digging up a metal that you then bury?

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 21:47 | 3268929 Peter Pan
Peter Pan's picture

Isn't it also ironic that the nation whose currency after WWII became the reserve currency of the world is now virtually broke, an international bully and all by its own hand.

As for digging it up and burying it, that's not quite right. You skipped the processing bit.

The same goes with many other things of value. You come up with a formula but then you hide it from the world that would like to have it for free.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 21:13 | 3268855 Buck Johnson
Buck Johnson's picture

I know, there's a reason why they are doing this.  America wants to be able to get their citizen's money and gold at a moment notice.  They know that when this whole ponzi implodes people who have gotten their money out will simply drive over to Canada or Mexico and fly out and live out their life until things get better in the US.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 22:45 | 3269047 CPL
CPL's picture

You understand that border controls have been in effect for four years.  Nobody is leaving.


So are holders of ETN paper silver and gold feeling secure that they bought paper yet?  


Carry it.  

Own it.  

Understand it.

Sat, 02/23/2013 - 07:19 | 3269565 Wile-E-Coyote
Wile-E-Coyote's picture

Unless someone is watching you do it.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 18:22 | 3268396 Boris Alatovkrap
Boris Alatovkrap's picture

Boris gold is all in mouth. Smart, no? But soon tax collector is not only carry firearm, but also is carry pliers.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 20:16 | 3268731 krispkritter
krispkritter's picture

Then drink it ala Goldschlager and store it in your septic tank... ;)

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 21:50 | 3268938 Peter Pan
Peter Pan's picture

Boris better you keep mouth shut or pliers used for sure. If nothing found but still you are suspect then plier used on lower part of body to extract information for location of gold.

Sat, 02/23/2013 - 02:28 | 3269391 JOYFUL
JOYFUL's picture

Somebody else here got some chowin-down to do... and it a'int AU what's on the menu...

it was just short weeks ago that our resident armchair expert in international finance(c'mon down.....Mr TINKY!)provided us with his worthy insight...that this sort of thing COULD NEVER HAPPEN  @@>>!!


everything is tinky-dinky! Merikans can wander around the world in perfect confidence that they and there investments will be safe from sequestrations and interference on the part of nefarious negroids and assorted criminal cliques disquised as 'the authorities' ...

readers in search of gold-plated investment advice will want to peruse this little exchange ... and in particular ... 3205463...

in which the impossible events of the present moment are revealed to be 'imposible' ...and anyone predicting their plausible arrival in the near future is 'dreaming' ...a droolin cretin no doubt!!!...

Hey Mr Obama's world...dreams do come true...and they comin for you! cue:'s what's for dinner! (Donald Fagen - I.G.Y)

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 17:14 | 3268122 Svendblaaskaeg
Svendblaaskaeg's picture

Stagger, stagger, crawl, crawl, jump... one of my favorite movies

Group Madness - The Making Of Yellowbeard:

" Madness - The Making Of Yellowbeard"

"Pete and I was up in Klondike panning for wood - well we got up there and found this great vain of mahogany but later found out it was just fools-mahogany"

More LOL than you can shake a stick at..


Fri, 02/22/2013 - 17:48 | 3268288 Toolshed
Toolshed's picture

Hard to believe that such a hilarious movie with a star studded cast is so widely unknown.

Sat, 02/23/2013 - 05:42 | 3269514 krispkritter
krispkritter's picture

 "...never trust a woman or a government..." Words to live by...

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 17:14 | 3268144 Herodotus
Herodotus's picture

I store my gold in a facility on Oak Island

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 18:08 | 3268345 busternc333
busternc333's picture

Oak Island NC?  I'm right there with you!


Fri, 02/22/2013 - 18:34 | 3268423 AlaricBalth
AlaricBalth's picture

To: ViaMat International
From: AlaricBalth

To whom it may concern;

In response to your letter dated 17 February 2013, I hereby instruct you to deliver my gold to the following GPS coordinates.

(GPS) : N25 0.00407 W71 0.00071

Upon arrival at aforementioned location, it is my request that your staff proceed to jettison my gold holdings over the starboard side of your cargo ship and assure that each ingot sinks to the ocean bottom.

I understand that these instructions may seem unusual, however this is the mode in which I store all of my gold holdings. Your compliance with my instructions is greatly appreciated.


PS: Your discretion concerning this matter is vital.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 19:45 | 3268628 Jendrzejczyk
Jendrzejczyk's picture

+10 for best variant of canoe accident ever.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 20:48 | 3268810 AlaricBalth
AlaricBalth's picture

Thanks Jendrz----.......Uh

I would like to by a vowel Pat!

You know, with an ex-wife from Warsaw, you would think I could pronounce your name. :-)

All the best to you.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 22:29 | 3269001 Jendrzejczyk
Jendrzejczyk's picture

Been enjoying your posts lately, nice to have you around.

Proper pronunciation is in my obituary:

"He died after collapsing during a walk near his office in Washington," his wife, Janet, said. 

Truth: The officer that showed up the day "I" was killed told her somebody knocked me over the head in broad daylight.

my tiny agenda



Fri, 02/22/2013 - 18:21 | 3268388 Deacon Frost
Deacon Frost's picture

Oak Island Nova Scotia, Canada

I remember following this story as a child, the Oak Island Money Pit mystery.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 20:19 | 3268737 unrulian
unrulian's picture

 i live in NS and am presently digging on that island

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 17:27 | 3268186 SafelyGraze
SafelyGraze's picture

the big gold repositories in NY and KY dumped american-owned gold a long time ago


Fri, 02/22/2013 - 18:07 | 3268341 Panafrican Funk...
Panafrican Funktron Robot's picture

If only I knew how to swim, I could recover my gold.  I guess the bottom feeders are my repository.  

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:23 | 3267924 Stoploss
Stoploss's picture

Ahh. So expect the new version of 6102 mid year.

Got it.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:33 | 3267966 fourchan
fourchan's picture

if you dont hold it you dont own it. everything else is just nonsence.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 17:03 | 3268088 Dr. No
Dr. No's picture

"If history is any guide, storing gold abroad is critical"

If by abroad, he means my closet, then I agree.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 18:11 | 3268356 Shell Game
Shell Game's picture

My interpretation as well!

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 18:58 | 3268496 BoNeSxxx
BoNeSxxx's picture

I store mine in my wife's coochie... she never lets anyone near it - including me.  I can't think of a safer place.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 19:12 | 3268529 Pure Evil
Pure Evil's picture

Maybe if you started paying storage fees she'd open up the vault once in a while.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 20:53 | 3268821 nmewn
nmewn's picture

I know what you mean, I got one of those vaults too...I have to get my tongue just right, as I manipulate the knobs...sometimes I have to get into the weirdest positions, one knee down, both knees down, flat on my back, laying on top of it reaching way down there and still don't know if the combination is right for complete success until I grab the handle and give it a jerk ;-)

Sat, 02/23/2013 - 04:08 | 3269457 ebworthen
ebworthen's picture


Well, at least you have a vault to practice with nmewn.

Sat, 02/23/2013 - 10:18 | 3269682 nmewn
nmewn's picture

You can pick up good clean, barely used vaults almost anywhere, already broke in, reliable, known qualities...I'd be careful with the newer ones, they seem to have some shoddy workmanship as they passed through the factory.

They look great on the show room floor but you get em home and discover their tumblers are all scrambled up, makes them hard to decipher ;-)

Sat, 02/23/2013 - 05:27 | 3269508 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

Whose vault is it if it doesn't work out?  ;-)

Sat, 02/23/2013 - 10:11 | 3269678 nmewn
nmewn's picture

The vault stays with the owner, just like the things moving in & out of the vault remian attached to the owner.

Its a fair & agreeable arrangment ;-)

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 20:25 | 3268760 Theosebes Goodfellow
Theosebes Goodfellow's picture

Now that's what I call storing your gold in a broad!

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 17:14 | 3268142 FL_Conservative
FL_Conservative's picture

I'm sorry, officer.  What gold is it that you're looking for?  Can you describe it to me so maybe I will know what you mean?   I've never seen real gold before.



Sat, 02/23/2013 - 10:52 | 3269710 JamesBond
JamesBond's picture

Simon -

Maggot head bitchez



Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:17 | 3267899 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

The ability to store gold overseas is very much of a good thing if you can, AND if you go to that country, AND if you trust the people who have it.  Check, check, check.  Store SOME overseas, you might need it here (or in your own country).

If not, then everyone must find a secure place here in the USA to store it.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:30 | 3267952 strannick
strannick's picture

Check out the Sprott Asset Management Physical Metals Trusts in Canada....

Check out the miniscule premiums to NAV. In the past, the PSLV premium has been as high as 30%. Now its below 1%

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:37 | 3267988 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

Buy the dip or take delivery of your own.  The big warning I see is the drop in the paper price, spot price to deliver, not so much.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:57 | 3268047 Pegasus Muse
Pegasus Muse's picture

If Andrew Maguire is correct there was a massive off-take of physical with this latest CRIMEX Slam-Job.


Maguire - Stunning 225 Tons of Physical Gold Bought By CBs

Today whistleblower Andrew Maguire told King World News that Eastern central banks have taken a massive 225 tons out of the physical gold market on this recent takedown. This is the first in a series of interviews with Maguire lifting the curtain on what is going on behind the scenes in the ongoing gold and silver war which continues to rage.

Eric King: “Give me an idea of the amount of tonnage being purchased on this decline.”

Maguire: “If you look at the daily tonnage being drawn down, we’re (now) looking at 20 to 30 tons per day of real allocations in dollar and euro gold. Shanghai delivery volumes have been extremely large as well on a daily basis. That’s just what we see clearing here through London and Shanghai.... “There is a lot of direct purchasing also going on. What I’m going to say to you is that it’s certainly in the 100+ ton area (this week alone). And that’s real physical (gold).”

more here:

Mon, 02/25/2013 - 21:55 | 3276167 BigJim
BigJim's picture

I've stopped reading KWN. I couldn't stand the Hope but no Change.

Sat, 02/23/2013 - 06:32 | 3269536 e-recep
e-recep's picture

this means the fuckers cannot push the paper price any further. we are near the bottom somewhere. buy with both fists.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:35 | 3267978 TrumpXVI
TrumpXVI's picture

Yup. DoChen, I agree.

Also, you can run but you cannot hide.  The meltdown that's upon us will affect the entire world, every developed economy and developed economy wannabe.  This recommendation is akin to the "Bury your guns in a PVC tube" argument.  If it's time to bury your guns, it's time to USE them.  If it's time to hide your gold overseas, then it's time to work a whole lot harder to overthrow the stupid government you're living under right here.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:22 | 3267919 seek
seek's picture

Few of those comments are undeserved.

The reality of the world today is having any third party in your chain of physical possession is bad, bad news. If you can't stand on top the dirt your PMs are buried under, or in the boat they fell off of, with a rifle in hand, you don't own them.That's even less likely to happen in Singapore as it is in the US.

These regulatory changes are just legal bureaucratic icing on the already baked cake of asset forfeiture.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 19:55 | 3268662 FeralSerf
FeralSerf's picture

I wonder how much gold David Koresh was standing on when he left for the Happy Digging Grounds.  It doesn't look like it would have done him much good.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:53 | 3268053 GubbermintWorker
GubbermintWorker's picture

I'll take the bait. All my gold is safely in the bank of Mother Earth and out of sight of Mr. Obama. I'd bet that most people here who have gold, don't have the amounts that would warrant overseas storage and besides, if you don't hold it, you don't own it.


So, screw off Simon.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 17:26 | 3268182 OutLookingIn
OutLookingIn's picture


With security by;

Mr. Smith & Mr. Wesson with good help from Mr. Remington.

Also the two dogs Rufus & Killer. Got blood on their muzzles this morning and are chewing on a strange boot?  

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 20:24 | 3268750 unrulian
unrulian's picture

funny i woke up this morning next to a chick that smelled like a strange boot and i had blood on my muzzel

Sat, 02/23/2013 - 00:19 | 3269249 andrewp111
andrewp111's picture

And after you are dead, your heirs won't find the gold, and your gold becomes someone's treasure find a thousand years from now.

Sat, 02/23/2013 - 02:38 | 3269402 Things that go bump
Things that go bump's picture

Better that then the property of the US government. Besides, haven't you ever heard of a treasure map. They are easier now with GPS coordinates.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 17:04 | 3268093 Freddie
Freddie's picture

Thank people who voted Obummer.  There are some here on ZH too.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 19:07 | 3268523 Acet
Acet's picture

If you think the Repocrats and their tax-evading financial parasite of a would-be president are any less corrupt or would do anything different from the Drone-chilld-murdering Nobel-Peace-Prize-Winner the Demoblicans fielded, then I have this here bridge in New York i want to sell ya.


Fri, 02/22/2013 - 19:17 | 3268540 BoNeSxxx
BoNeSxxx's picture

He speaks the truth Freddie... every prez since Kennedy has been a card carrying member of the CFR.  The primary agenda hasn't changed since.  Monetery policy, the fed, and the MIC have been off limits and not questioned or debated by either party.

The parties are just two sides of the same coin and a distraction for the feeble minded and hard-of-thinking CNN crowd.

Sat, 02/23/2013 - 12:01 | 3269794 hoos bin pharteen
hoos bin pharteen's picture

Reagan was not a member of CFR.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:15 | 3267883 HamyWanger
HamyWanger's picture

This calls the end for greedy goldbugs storing away U.S. currency in foreign countries. 

Pretty nice. 

Money is meant to circulate. We CAN'T have a recovery if everybody keeps his earnings in a dead form ("gold"), in foreign countries, and without even paying taxes...

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:21 | 3267916 Confundido
Confundido's picture

I thought the counterfeiters at COMEX were already making gold circulate every morning at 8:20am....hmmm....what am I missing? Also...if gold is money, why would you pay tax on it?? Ohhh, I see. mean inflation tax...I get it.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:28 | 3267925 HamyWanger
HamyWanger's picture

" Also...if gold is money, why would you pay tax on it??"

Gold has never been money, it is a mix between a religious totem and a shiny metal. And also a great way for greedy nerds and redneck party-poopers to avoid participating to the global economic recovery. 

I am personally in favor of a total ban on gold ownership, like Roosevelt did in 1933. It DID WORK in ending the depression. 

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:29 | 3267945 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

Never go full retard.  Unless of course you believe that gold is not a safe store of value and no-one will ever accept it in exchange for the fruits of their labor.  I wonder if they will store gold for the Chinese?  Hhhmmmm....

If what you say is true, why would the asians seek to establish a gold-backed currency?  Again, never go full retard.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:31 | 3267955 HamyWanger
HamyWanger's picture

I reckon gold has value for some people and that's precisely what makes it so dangerous. 

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:35 | 3267968 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

By the way, if the average person's wage doesn't cover necessities, it is going to be pretty fucking hard to have any additional circulation now isn't it?

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 17:29 | 3268192 therover
therover's picture

Apparently your definition of 'some people' means about a billion or more.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:57 | 3268061 GubbermintWorker
GubbermintWorker's picture

LOL! That didn't help end the depression and was largely ignored by the public. .

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 17:03 | 3268094 No Euros please...
No Euros please we're British's picture

Hamywanger, I sure glad it worked in 1933, because no-one else did.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 18:10 | 3268351 masterinchancery
masterinchancery's picture

I am personally in favor of a total ban on letting retards like you vote.  "Gold has never been money"--only for 10,000 years or so.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 18:51 | 3268473 Agstacker
Agstacker's picture

WW2 ended the depression, so go enlist Hamy!  WW3 is just around the corner...

Sat, 02/23/2013 - 04:14 | 3269461 ebworthen
ebworthen's picture

HamyWanger - where you been?

That's the whole point of buying and physical posession of Gold and Silver; undermining the corrupt kleptoligarchy.

"Ban on gold ownership"; funny - will work as well as a ban on guns, liquor, drugs, and sex.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:24 | 3267931 RationalPrepper
RationalPrepper's picture

I suggest replacing the "g" in your name with a "k".  But thank you for telling us all what we should do with our money.  Must work at one of 3 places:  (1) The Fed, (2) The IRS, or (3) The Treasury.  If you could, please tell me what I should do with my time as well.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:30 | 3267951 Winston Churchill
Winston Churchill's picture

A new Nom  de plume for MDB ?

No, not enough wit in the post.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:50 | 3268037 fuu
fuu's picture

You weren't here for the Harry Wanger days.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 17:01 | 3268082 RationalPrepper
RationalPrepper's picture

Sounds like an annual festival in Berkley, CA...

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 17:24 | 3268171 F22
F22's picture

I could use a Harvey Wallbanger....

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 19:19 | 3268551 Pure Evil
Pure Evil's picture

Didn't Hamy first come out of the closet as the alternative to Harry Wanger?

By the way, nice set of lesbos F22.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:55 | 3268055 TraitorsHang
TraitorsHang's picture

If you aren't MDB's sock-puppet, I have to ask:
How is it that you found your way to ZeroHedge? I think you meant to be reading the Huffington Post or USA Today.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 17:07 | 3268112 Husk-Erzulie
Husk-Erzulie's picture

Hamy's Old Skool.  He just hasn't been very active for awhile.  I am pretty sure he pre dates MDB by a stretch.  :-)

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 17:07 | 3268108 A. Magnus
A. Magnus's picture

"Money is meant to circulate."

Tell that to all the Wall Street bankers whose sphincters you lather with this ignorant blather. Not ONE of those 'too big to fail' piece of shit banks is actually CIRCULATING their government welfare TARP bailouts they got at YOUR expense, but all you can think to do is blame gold bugs? Really?

Kindly shut the fuck up, sit in your dunce corner and let the ADULTS talk about the big, important things...

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 17:09 | 3268125 Hulk
Hulk's picture

Hamy, Hamy Wanger ??? Did you just get back or did I just wake up from a coma ???

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 17:34 | 3268215 Svendblaaskaeg
Svendblaaskaeg's picture

"We CAN'T get our fair share of YOUR hard earned savings if everybody keeps his earnings in a dead form ("gold"), in foreign countries, and without even paying taxes...

Fixed it for ya..


Fri, 02/22/2013 - 17:49 | 3268294 californiagirl
californiagirl's picture

HamyWanger, you are using the wrong flag as an avitar.

Sat, 02/23/2013 - 07:47 | 3269585 338
338's picture

This is why I'm about to turn my flag upside down.

Please go drink bleach, I will do whatever I want with my assets, that I earned with my abilitiy to produce, and if you think that my 'earnings' are for anyone but me to decide what to do with....


Maybe a small reading from John Locke would help.





Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:14 | 3267885 lolmao500
lolmao500's picture

This is big news...

FBI probe of defense tech allegedly leaked from NASA stonewalled, sources say

A four-year FBI investigation into the transfer of classified weapons technology to China and other countries from NASA’s Ames Research Center is being stonewalled by government officials, sources tell

The claims originate with several past and current NASA employees concerned with the systemic leak of highly sensitive information relating to missile defense systems, as well as what they call a troubled investigation into the leak.

The accusations stem from a reported violation of the International Traffic in Arms Regulation (ITAR), which governs the export of defense weaponry. In 2006, Ames adapted specialized rocket engines -- originally developed for the Pentagon missile defense “Kinetic Kill Vehicle” program -- for a moon lander prototype that ultimately became NASA’s Lunar Atmosphere and Dust Environment Explorer (LADEE). The robotic moon orbiter is set to launch on Aug. 12, 2013.

Information on guidance and terrain-mapping systems from the Tomahawk cruise missile and a radar from the F-35 were also shared, according to one report in Aviation Week.

The sources allege that Ames Center Director Simon P. “Pete” Worden and Will Marshall, a British citizen, shared that moon lander project - and the missile defense technology – with individuals from foreign countries including China, South Korea and Saudi Arabia.

The letters allege the FBI had uncovered the ITAR violations, and the U.S. attorney was prepared to issue indictments. But it says the case has been stalled for more than a year, agents in the case were reassigned, and the statute of limitations on the violations is already beginning to expire.

“It is our understanding that this illegal technology transfer may have involved classified Defense Department weapons system technology to foreign countries, including China, potentially with the tacit or direct approval of the center’s leadership,” the letters read.

Really bullish!

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:29 | 3267947 Not Too Important
Not Too Important's picture

Who would possibly downvote this? A traitor, that's who!

This whole thing is treason!

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 19:16 | 3268538 Acet
Acet's picture

This being FOX News, I bet the "Missile Technology" is about 50 years old and the "sharing" is actually publishing a Scientific Paper in a Research journal (which might possibly be read by citizens from said above mentioned lands - along with people for anywhere in the world because it's public). After all, these are the guys that went to court to defend their right to LIE in the news (and won).

Frankly, I wouldn't trust any of Murdoch's Propaganda Outlets to tell me the time of the day or the color of the sky, much less this kind of news: these guys would twist "Fireman Saves Child from Burning Building" into "Government Official Risks Child's Life" if it served their interests and they thought they could get away with it.


Fri, 02/22/2013 - 17:14 | 3268140 rhinoblitzing
rhinoblitzing's picture

NASA Director is - Who?

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 19:17 | 3268547 lakecity55
lakecity55's picture

either a commie or a mooselam.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:15 | 3267889 Toolshed
Toolshed's picture

"Storing gold overseas makes sense no matter what happens."

When did Simon become a EU politician? That is the most patently absurd statement I have ever seen him excrete. And that is saying a whole lot.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:39 | 3267994 Boondocker
Boondocker's picture

and why doesnt singapore have the same exposure?????

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:15 | 3267891 Political_Savage
Political_Savage's picture

Guest Post?

You mean paid advertisement, right?!

No free waffle iron, limited time offer? That would have really sold the deal.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:33 | 3267963 Winston Churchill
Winston Churchill's picture

Spiderman hand towels ?

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 17:06 | 3268105 No Euros please...
No Euros please we're British's picture

More like Spiderman flannel.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:16 | 3267892 GFKjunior
GFKjunior's picture

Good article except when he recommendation to store gold in Singapore. The US is not even close to the authoritarian police state of Singapore.(though we are trying hard to get there)

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:16 | 3267893 michael_engineer
michael_engineer's picture

When is ZH going to start featuring guest posts from Gail Tverberg?

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:17 | 3267894 Sellmoney
Sellmoney's picture

every retail gold dealer in the US (I.E GOLDLINE) is drooling over this article....numis anyone..

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:19 | 3267903 nobusiness
nobusiness's picture

What could possibly go wrong in Singapore???

Sat, 02/23/2013 - 06:38 | 3269540 e-recep
e-recep's picture

and who could have known it?

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:19 | 3267904 NoWayJose
NoWayJose's picture

Storing gold in a stack right at your fingertips is the best place for it.  The reason the US is after Via Mat is that the tax-collectors want to know what you own and how much their cut will be.  PMs are one of the only places where wealth can grow and yet not be tracked by Uncle Sam.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 17:07 | 3268113 slyhill
slyhill's picture

What are the other ones?

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:19 | 3267906 Bansters-in-my-...
Bansters-in-my- feces's picture

Fuck You HammyWanger.

Sat, 02/23/2013 - 02:42 | 3267915 CaptainSpaulding
CaptainSpaulding's picture


Oh well, i'll just invest in fine merlot and Cusano double connecticut cigars. I might as well enjoy life whilst i can


Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:22 | 3267923 Mad Max
Mad Max's picture

Jargle Blargle BLAAGGHHH  ***BUY MY NEWSLETTER***  jasdfskj snortle cough choke wheeze  ***I STAYED AT A HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS LAST NIGHT!!!***

The name is Black.  SIMON Black.  I have a license to chill.


With that out of the way, the news development is interesting, but the amount of selling going on here would be embarrassing even to QVC.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:35 | 3267976 CaptainSpaulding
CaptainSpaulding's picture

Have you noticed Apple is now on QVC? 

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 18:20 | 3268380 Mad Max
Mad Max's picture

Hadn't noticed, but it seems fitting.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:23 | 3267927 greggh99
greggh99's picture

What is the "(sic)" supposed to be for? I didn't see anything wrong preceding it.

Sat, 02/23/2013 - 01:52 | 3269362 greggh99
greggh99's picture

The only thing I could come up with for the "[sic]" is that the writer thinks that "its" should contain an apostrophe. It shouldn't. It's being used as a possessive pronoun, such as his, hers, yours, theirs, ours and its.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:26 | 3267935 MeMadMax
MeMadMax's picture

Shovel, Check.

Sturdy Box, Check.

6 pack of favorite beer, Check.

Random spot for hole in ground, Check.


Fri, 02/22/2013 - 18:40 | 3268440 ziggy59
ziggy59's picture

GPS coordinates...CHECK!

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:26 | 3267936 MeMadMax
MeMadMax's picture

Shovel, Check.

Sturdy Box, Check.

6 pack of favorite beer, Check.

Random spot for hole in ground, Check.


Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:26 | 3267937 Henry Hub
Henry Hub's picture

I went on a two day drunk last weekend and decided to bury my gold in the woods behind my house. Now that I've sobered up I can't remember exactly where...maybe if I have a few drinks.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:28 | 3267940 proLiberty
proLiberty's picture

40 acres and a shovel!


Fri, 02/22/2013 - 17:03 | 3268090 centerline
centerline's picture

Don't forget the bags upon bags of cheap ball bearings, shot or something else metal to scatter all over the place.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:28 | 3267941 SAT 800
SAT 800's picture is not having any problems storing "good delivery bars" in Zurich; this is propaganda, an advertisement for this assholes kickback arrangement with his Singapore buddies.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:29 | 3267944 Dr Paul Krugman
Dr Paul Krugman's picture

This is good news.  People should not be investing in gold, anyway.  Gold holds back money that could be invested in the economy.  Holding gold as an investments holds back growth.  Only institutional firms should be allowed to invest in gold.

Companies such as Apple, or Intel, who use gold in their computers for their machines, should be the only ones to invest in gold because it is part of their business.  Retail investors have no business investing in gold.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:42 | 3268007 McMolotov
McMolotov's picture

Statist fuckwads have no business telling the rest of us how to invest.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:44 | 3268011 Acidtest Dummy
Acidtest Dummy's picture

You admit that it is an investment though?

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:53 | 3268051 Dr Paul Krugman
Dr Paul Krugman's picture

An investment can be anything you put your money in, anything you buy.  A car is an investment although it depreciates straight off the lot.  If you need to get to work in a timely manner, and you have to get across town, you buy a car.  But very few people buy cars to improve and sell for more than they put into them.

So is gold an investment?  Sure.  Is it a good investment?  No.  A resounding no.

It doesn't grow like investing in a company can.  You don't get paid to hold it like a bond will do.  Gold is last on the list.  And this dead weight of an investment is pulling on the economy.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 17:04 | 3268096 Acidtest Dummy
Acidtest Dummy's picture

I don't think gold is an investment, I think it is wealth. Therefore, I de-vest dollars, (because they are always becoming less valuable) into Au, which I hope will protect my past labors value. Why should that be denied to me?

Sat, 02/23/2013 - 05:21 | 3269506 jmk
jmk's picture

Gold is money. The only form of real money that exists on the planet.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 17:13 | 3268135 McMolotov
McMolotov's picture

Gold is insurance against currency depreciation. All you're saying is that you don't think people should be able to insure themselves against the theft of the value of their savings.

This is no different than saying money spent on life insurance or health insurance is a dead weight that pulls on the economy, so those products shouldn't be available for people willing to purchase them. Why? Because you, Lord Krugman, know better than them how to spend their own money.

Of course, this flies in the face of the fact that you, Lord Krugman, also believe it's a worthy cause to have the government mandate the purchase of health insurance.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 17:40 | 3268224 Z'
Z''s picture

So what you seem to be saying here is money should be used only for consumables and items that have immediate depreciation.  Don't buy anything that lasts, really, because in doing so you are creating 'dead weight'.  Buy the cheapest, flimsiest, most wasteful items available... because as these items disintegrate, our economy 'appreciates' (growth).

No art, no heirlooms, nothing that lasts for you, the working wage slaves!  Only consumables for all!  No Beanie Babies for you kids!  No Barbie doll collections, Matchbox cars... Here is a lesson, kiddies, in 'collecting' you are 'hoarding' and you are denying the financiers, corporatists, statists their fair due!  Keep your money moving folks, the only option for saving is to trust the untrustworthy pillagers of society.  Otherwise, kiddies, you are 'dead weight' no matter how much you produce!

We can just start putting a cap on the life of any and all items, ensuring that future earnings will continue to be circulated and eliminating all 'dead weight'.  Why stop at gold?  Why not eliminate holding of any item?  Why not trash the world's resources on the cheapest garbage available and ensure people have to continue to buy buy buy to replace things?  Or make people rent everything... no ownership at all, that way the money produced by people's labor is circulated continuously, and nobody ever gets off the hamster wheel.  Especially after the muppeteers enact theft through inflation.

Take a good look at your own motivations Mr. Krugman.  All you really want is to keep your serfs working the line.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 21:49 | 3268936 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

Holy Shi'te Dr Krugman!  Wow, I got to upvote twice (I am now at home).

Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha!

A lot of people don't know! LOLOLOLOLOLOL........

Oh, and blog crozz-plugz, bitchez!

Sat, 02/23/2013 - 03:23 | 3269442 Things that go bump
Things that go bump's picture

My dear Dr. Krugman, never again will I put one dime into investing in that casino called the market, nor will I ever buy a bond. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me. I have had lengthy educational discussions with my children and grandchildren regarding this, as well as the futility of trying to save for old age using fiat, as it will be stolen through inflation, as the savings of my grandparents and parents were stolen, so that the sacrifices of a lifetime of thrift and self denial are rendered worthless.  I have strongly advised them to avoid the 401K trap and use the money they would have contributed there to buy real things that have real value.  I have advised them against allowing banks to hold any money beyond what is absolutely necessary for day to day living. I have told them to pay for everything with cash.  

Sat, 02/23/2013 - 04:21 | 3269463 ebworthen
ebworthen's picture


Oh Krugman, you kill me.

Investing in a company like Solyndra or Enron?  Buying bonds, like GM ones that are subsumed and made worthless?  How about those poor saps in Spain who were forced to convert their savings into shares in banks that were later declared worthless?


Oh sure, invest in the kleptoligarchy, you can trust Wall Street, just ask Corzine or Mozillo or AIG or Citi or any of the other crooks.

Pure as the driven snow!

Only thing I trust is in my hands, and people like you are desperate to maintain the somnolence of the sheeple because your income and life depend upon the LIES.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 20:36 | 3268642 Acidtest Dummy
Acidtest Dummy's picture

Dear Doctor Krugman,

By your definition playing the slots is investing!? I don't think it is, I think casinos are for losers. I think the sheeple would be wise to take whatever money they have left and leave the casino.


Fri, 02/22/2013 - 21:54 | 3268940 Z'
Z''s picture

It seems in Krugman's world, people who produce and then spend their earnings on gold represent 'dead weight', while people who produce nothing but spend fiat are 'stimulus'.  The money movement he desires is really all about the skim, enriching cronies all along the way.

Preaching to the choir, that's how you win a Nobel Prize.

Sat, 02/23/2013 - 16:15 | 3269139 Acidtest Dummy
Acidtest Dummy's picture

I like to think the best of people too, and give them the benefit of doubt. I'd like to think that the good Doctor has come to ZH to get feedback from Tyler's army; to harden his arguments in the heat of the fire. But lately, he just seems to be trolling, and worse he seems to be drunk while he trolls. How awful it must be to be his econ student at Princeton; to be paying to become more ignorant; to have your future determined by a drunken irrelevant half-wit troll.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:58 | 3268049 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

Krugman, you are so ODIOUS that I am going to have to plug my blog here...  I only upvoted you because of the excuse to plug my blog.  Ahh, anyone else interested (or offended) might want to check out another blog as well:

"The Mercenary Geologist Writes About Platinum"


Fri, 02/22/2013 - 17:04 | 3268087 jimmyjames
jimmyjames's picture

 Gold holds back money that could be invested in the economy. 


And of course mining for gold adds nothing to an economy?

The fact that 7000 tons of it trades weekly on the LBM alone-adds nothing to the economy?

But your right-it would be good news if they made it illegal-then watch your dollars vanish into the black market as the price of gold goes ballistic--

Ever read how alcohol prohibition worked so well in the shadows-for men in dark glasses and suits-

There is a growing economy there-just waiting for your asshole ideas to be realized-no government involvment ie: no government tax base-no economic benefit to those left outside-

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 17:13 | 3268137 jmcadg
jmcadg's picture

Ok, I've got no gold, I've spent all my money trying to get the economy going. I'm broke. I barely pay the bills. I'm on handouts.

What now Krugman? Dig a hole, fill it in? You utter fucktard. You go back to your McMansion and start wanking over the next Meteor arrival. Prick.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 17:39 | 3268238 slightlyskeptical
slightlyskeptical's picture

This is so wrong. For every person who buys gold there is also a seller. The dollars the seller recieves go elsewhere into the economy, which is a zero sum game for the most part.  I think gold is a bad investment but it sure doesn't hold back the economy.  It won't be long before everyone realizes it is really the debt based, fractional reserve monetary system and the futile efforts to fix it, that are holding us back. Every new dollar loaned into circulation carries interest and thus each dollar loaned into circulation has a net effect of destroying wealth. Zero sum is better than negative sum in my book.


Fri, 02/22/2013 - 17:46 | 3268277 Toolshed
Toolshed's picture

It's nice to know MDB is alive and well and performing admirably as Krugmans butt plug. I guess the rumors about his death were premature.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 18:39 | 3268435 DosZap
DosZap's picture

This is good news.  People should not be investing in gold, anyway.  Gold holds back money that could be invested in the economy.  Holding gold as an investments holds back growth.  Only institutional firms should be allowed to invest in gold.

Companies such as Apple, or Intel, who use gold in their computers for their machines, should be the only ones to invest in gold because it is part of their business.  Retail investors have no business investing in gold.

KRUGMAN, how lame is this?.

NOT investing in PM's?.As far as holding back growth, BS, WHO would be investing anywhere ELSE in the current state of affairs, and under this Regime?.(IF able)

You NEVER know if a Mack truck is going to broadside you!.(And past perfomance by same,as well as a harbinger of what is  to come are great indicator that is what exactly WILL come our way next).

Regular well off folks(not wealthy), and afarid to invest in anything because it does not pay jack.

Plus less than 1-2% of any Americans are holding PM's period.

You want investing to start?,get this nightmare back on track where business is not afraid to hire(not fire,cut back hours) due to all the egregious regulations that keep coming at us like a bat out of hell.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 18:47 | 3268459 Teamtc321
Teamtc321's picture

Mr. Krugman;

I have a thought for you to consider sir, if/when your master's stop investing in Gold, please come back and present proof they have done so. Then and only then, would I consider listening to your statist advice pointed to "Retail Investors" of having no business investing in Gold. 

Until then IMHO sir, please stick your advice up your ass. 


Fri, 02/22/2013 - 19:09 | 3268525 lakecity55
lakecity55's picture

You should be out breaking window glass, buddy. Get to it!

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:45 | 3267949 jjsilver
jjsilver's picture

there are more than three definitions of United States, there are two distinct us citizens. The IRS and Federal government only have jurisdiction over certain citizens, not all Americans.


he Three United States

“Citizenship for Dummies”

Two Political Jurisdictions:  "National" government v. "Federal/General" government"

Federal jurisdiction

As we will remember from our civics classes, the Constitution gave Congress exclusive, absolute jurisdiction over Federal territories, including Washington, D.C. The U.S. Supreme Court has ruled that Congress is not bound by the Constitution when legislating for these areas (see Hooven v. Evatt 324 U.S. 674). What many of us do not realize is that, by signing 1040 forms and Social Security applications, we unwittingly declare ourselves "Federal citizens" subject to the untrammeled authority of Congress. Since nobody told us this when we signed these documents, we may, at common law, legally rescind all such signatures on grounds of constructive fraud and non-disclosure of pertinent facts.

if you enter a plea in Federal Court, you are placing yourself under the jurisdiction of that court, whether you really belong there or not.

Because of the way "words of art" are defined in Title 26, anyone not living in Washington, D.C. or a Federal territory or enclave is a "foreign person" and a "non-immigrant, non-resident alien" for purposes of the Title. This does not mean that one was born in another country, or lives abroad. It means that one is not a "Federal citizen." After all, the states are "foreign" to one another and to the Federal government (see Black's Law Dictionary). That is why I filed a W-8 form with you. That is also why I filed a statement "In Lieu of W-4." The W-4 is the wrong form for non-Federal citizens, and the IRS will impose a $500 fine upon those who use it to claim EXEMPT status.

The 16th Amendment
Doubtless, you were also taught in your government-controlled schools that the 16th Amendment gave Congress the power to lay a direct, unapportioned tax upon compensation for labor. That is dead wrong. I am sorry to have to attack well-established belief systems, but the facts "are what they are." The U.S. Supreme Court has repeatedly ruled that the 16th Amendment conferred no such power. After all, the 16th Amendment did not specifically repeal the original taxing clauses of the Constitution, and the Constitution cannot contradict itself! Therefore, the Court has ruled that the Amendment was simply a "perfecting" amendment (see Brushaber v. Union Pacific Railroad Co. 240 U.S. 1). Further, the Court has also repeatedly ruled that compensation for labor in the 50 states is property upon which an "excise tax" cannot be imposed (see Eisner v. Macomber 252 U.S. 189).

Once again, none of these rulings apply within Federal territories. To repeat: the 26 USC (A) §1 graduated income tax is constitutional because it is limited to "Federal citizens" and "Federal areas" where Congress is not bound by the Constitution and may legislate as it pleases.

"State" vs. state
Just as there are two "United States," so there are two of every state. The Buck Act (incorporated in Title 4 USC) redefined "the States" as "words of art" to include (only) Federal enclaves within the 50 states, legally ceded by the state legislatures to the Government. So, when the Internal Revenue Code says that such-and-such a provision applies to "all the States," it is right! What most people don't realize is that this does not mean North Carolina, California, etc. -- it means "Federal enclaves within the 50 states."


Actually the safest long term investment is abolishing the private for profit central banks (Goldman, JPM, Rothschild, etc.)

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:39 | 3268001 A Lunatic
A Lunatic's picture

This is the perfect example of why it's so important to store your gold in the nether regions of South America......

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:46 | 3268021 centerline
centerline's picture

I read that wrong the first time.  Missed the South America part.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 17:00 | 3268074 A Lunatic
A Lunatic's picture

Very important that you DO NOT store gold in your personal nether regions............

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 17:05 | 3268099 centerline
centerline's picture

(note to self)  lol

You know it's bad day when you have to really think about that one.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 17:12 | 3268132 No Euros please...
No Euros please we're British's picture

Is that a double entendre? Are we talking Greek gold?

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 16:40 | 3268002 Joebloinvestor
Joebloinvestor's picture

Why would that be a better place to store your gold then a safe at home and a gun?


If the US government initiates a siezure, it won't matter where it is stored, only ones ability to fight them off.

Do NOT follow this link or you will be banned from the site!