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Ron Paul: "When They Came For The Raw Milk Drinkers…"
From Ron Paul
When They Came For The Raw Milk Drinkers…
While I oppose most gun control proposals, there is one group of Americans I do believe should be disarmed: federal agents. The use of force by federal agents to enforce unjust and unconstitutional laws is one of the major, albeit overlooked, threats to liberty. Too often Americans are victimized by government force simply for engaging in commercial transactions disproved of by Congress and the federal bureaucracy.
For example, the offices of Rawesome Foods in Venice, California, have been repeatedly raided by armed federal and state agents, and Rawesome’s founder, 65-year old James Stewart, has been imprisoned. What heinous crime justified this action? Rawesome sold unpasteurized (raw) milk and cheese to willing customers – in a state where raw milk is legal! You cannot even drink milk from a cow without a federal permit!
This is hardly the only case of federal agents using force against those who would dare meet consumer demand for raw milk. In 2011 armed agents of the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) raided the business of Pennsylvanian Amish farmer Dan Allgyer. Federal agents wasted a whole year and who knows how many millions of our tax dollars posing as customers in order to stop Allgyer from selling his raw milk to willing customers.
The use of force against individuals making choices not approved of by the political elite does not just stop with raw milk. The Natural News website has documented numerous accounts of federal persecution, including armed raids, of health food stores and alternative medical practitioners.
Federal bureaucrats are also using force to crack down on the makers of gold coins for fear that people may use these coins as an alternative to the Federal Reserve’s fiat currency. Bernard von NotHaus, the founder of Liberty Dollars, is currently awaiting sentencing on federal counterfeiting charges — even though Mr. von NotHaus took steps to ensure his coins where not used as “legal tender.”
Yet, the federal government was so concerned over the possibility that Mr. von NotHaus’s customers might use his coins in regular day-to-day commerce they actually labeled Mr. von NotHaus a “terrorist.”
These type of police state tactics used against, among others, raw milk producers, alternative health providers, and gold coin dealers is justified by the paternalistic attitude common in Washington, D.C. A member of Congress actually once told me that, “The people need these types of laws because they do not know what is good for them.” This mindset fuels the growth of the nanny state and inevitably leads to what C.S. Lewis said may be the worst from of tyranny “…a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims.”
All Americans, even if they do not believe it is a wise choice to drink raw milk or use gold coins, should be concerned about the use of force to limit our choices. This is because there is no limiting principle to the idea that the government force is justified if used “for our own good.” Today it is those who sell raw milk who are being victimized by government force, tomorrow it could be those who sell soda pop or Styrofoam cups. Therefore, all Americans should speak out against these injustices.
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Meanwhile, Jon Corzine steals $1.6 billion dollars of (allegedly) sacrosanct customer segregated funds, and remains a free man today. Just in case you needed any assistance understanding where the priorities of the federal government lie.
They're already coming for our soft drinks.
I'm getting so impatient for martial law to be enacted. Wait, didn't that just happen too?
Bloomberg is now going to ban delivery of 2 liter soda bottles with pizzas. Why does anyone still live in NYC?
http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/soda_ban_to_sap_your_4t5pEK0hvo3PoNZE...
Well... at least we still have flavor enhancer synthetic compounds courtesy of cells cloned from an aborted human fetus.
Ron Paul can be my president. You can keep the hope and change.
God bless Ron Paul
there are still some grocery stores that legally sell Raw Meat.
for crying out loud. that stuff can be tainted.
likewise raw eggs.
don't get me started about the raw vegetables.
Bloomberg just recently had his legal department draft and send a memo to the ObaMao Administration and U.S. Attorney General Eric Placeholder at the DOJ regarding the legality of drone strikes upon New York City Citizens who attempt to circumvent the 32 ounce maximum limit on soda size by purchasing multiple 32 ounce sodas.
Stop and Frisk!
COPS: Is that a soda? PUT YOUR HANDS WHERE I CAN SEE THEM!!!
College Student: no sir, it's just a lil whiskey sour.
COPS: Oh, ok. BEAT IT!!
Well if anyone wants to know where the spirit of Mussolini has settled, I can point them to a certain city that’s the rotten core of a certain despotic state.
117
Vote down! -1
Meanwhile, Jon Corzine steals $1.6 billion dollars of (allegedly) sacrosanct customer segregated funds, and remains a free man today.
No matter what you say,.....there's always that one guy. Jon....is that you?
And he took away the hard cider too, it stems from the declining health of the average US citizen, and the unsustainable health care situation this country finds it'self in. That's right, the cancer powder run amok over several decades.
I milk a Guernsey cow every day. She produces enough wholesome milk to raise a massive beef calf and share about ½ gallon to 1 gallon for my family a day. We drink the milk raw and make nearly 15 different milk products from this milk: butter, sour cream, ice cream, yogurt, etc. It’s real food and really delicious.
Prior to switching over, 2 of my 3 sons had asthma and Excema. I don’t remember the last asthma outbreak in my boys. The Excema has improved dramatically, too. We don’t need the inhalers or creams like we used to have prescribed to us.
I realize this experience is likely an outlier: but I am experiencing it first hand. I suggest that real food, raised in sanitary conditions, would cure many of the ills that modern Americans suffer today.
It’s illegal for me to sell raw milk in the state I currently live in. So, I don’t, despite having many good friends and neighbors ask about it. It would be a very helpful income, selling her milk, and would easily surpass her costs....but, I have no desire for armed agents descending upon my little farm. So, instead of selling her excess milk, we use it. Once my family takes the cream (the next morning), excess milk is fed to the chickens and will soon go to the two hogs we’ll be raising for bacon. Raw milk is also a fantastic fertilizer that helps adds nutrients, minerals and probiotics into the ground.
Our milk cow is the heart of my hobby farm and a massive step toward food independence.
Raising your own real food requires work, but from my perspective, it’s worth every ounce of sweat I’ve had to put into it. I started down this path because of a lifelong dream and was finally moved to action because of documentaries including Food Inc. Watch at your own risk....
Amen.
If raw milk is banned, only criminals and bureaucrats (but I repeat myself) will have raw milk.
A Canadian researcher accidentally discovered that feeding lab mice a protien powder made from raw milk arrested cancer in the mice. This was initially bad news because he was purposely giving the mice cancer for a different study. He realized that it was the powder that was curing them and deciced to start studying that. After about a year and a half of successes it suddenly stopped working. Took him two years and another accident to realize why. The powder he was receiveing started being homoginized causing the powder to become uneffective. Once he went back to a raw milk process the benefits returned.
Wish I could remember his name I would share it with you, its really an interesting story and I didn't do it justice paraphrasing it. He went on to find a multitude of benefits stemming from this concentrated raw milk process. Basically he found that raw milk protien is a precursor for Glutathion which is a powerful immune system booster.
Immediately provide your GPS coordinates to the Department of Homeland Security. They will need to drone your terrist cow. If you happen to be milking her when they strike, don't worry... the UN will be by later in the day to take out the rest of your family.
LOL. Unfortunately, the US practices the illegal (per Geneva Convention) double taps with drones. Ten minutes after the first strike, they send in a second to take out first responders. I'm sure if I wasn't milking her during the initial strike, I'd be wiped out during the second one while trying to clean up the mess.
Terrorist cow and crazy farmer eliminated. Mission Accomplished. No need for the UN to stop by.....
"raising your own real food requires work"
you mean it's not like modern finance?
this economy can't grow without growth hormones
and ironically, now that it's not,
all we hear is govt whore moans
Ironically, Raw milk could be produced with
a lower bacteria count than pasteurized by simply
pumping it through silver screens while cooling.
With grass fed cows and small herd size, this
isn't even necessary.
Pournelle's Iron Law of Bureaucracy states that...in any bureaucratic organization there will be two kinds of people, those who work to further the actual goals of the organization and those who work for the organization itself.
Examples in education would be teachers who work and sacrifice to teach children vs. union representative who work to protect any teacher including the most incompetent. The Iron Law states that in all cases, the second type of person will always gain control of the organization and will always write the rules under which the organization functions.
That's interesting. Pournelle warrants a look.
What a simple way of organizing and explaning what is seen over and over again within state organizations. Thanks.
I want to add some observations. The incompetent who rise to power then tend to be 'terrified' of everyone and anyone. Why because it is quite easy to spot and challenge an incompetent 'leader'. Hence these 'incompetents' then resort to all manner of totalitarian dictatorship type control/manipulation strategies to silence, demean, and outright get rid of anyone who has the audacity to 'challenge' them in "ANY WAY". Which means as long as the people en-masse don't stand up to 'anything' our 'terrified' leaders will not just continue but will accellerate their efforts. (Just as a disease in the body would do).
Interesting info on raw milk in relation to disease. I've maintained for decades now our toxic environment and toxic foods (as well as toxic social, political and economic structures) would lead to various forms of bizzare personal and societal diseases that would grow worse over time. GMO is the latest greatest threat. I also maintained as we moved back to healthy whole foods (and healthy societal, political, economic models) we would see amazing positive effects. Which may be personally as well as societally instructive observation.
As to Ron Paul. While I am sympathetic to his message, his withdrawl from the presidential race was an insult to everyone who supported him especially given his message is a form of hypocracy (why step up if your not going to follow through). It likely illustrates one thing. Given a choice of fighting the powerful entrenched forces of 'evil/destruction' and losing ones life and/or facing the loss of family - exactly what would you choose?
Which is exactly WHY we are getting no-where. No one person can take on the 'evil empire'. Its either all of us or none of us. Right now its basically 'none of us'. Those brave individuals who do perhaps have found peace with some number of their loved ones 6 feet under. The other basic problem is that there is no real plan for how to 'gut' or cut off the blood flow to the evil cancer taking over the body of society.
I keep coming back to a Edmund Burke quote,
“The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.”
I suppose two 16 oz. sodas won't set off the drone IR scan?
And what, now NYC is going to use paper cups and cut down more trees (no styrofoam)?
Does this mean I can have those cool square paper Chinese food containers with the metal handle back?
How about milk in glass quart jars that we recycle? Oh no, someone might get cut I suppose.
Talk about a downward trajectory of stupidity, lunacy, and tyrannical megalomaniacs.
the time has come>libtards vs freedom.
doj (source:nra) memo clear as your vision of future...
all else a distraction.
line is in sand
come and get your cannon (tx circa 1840 ish) :)
first shot to be fired soon...
it's not libtards vs. freedom. it's authoritarians of left and right and wherever against libertarians of all stripes (whether they know it or not). both parties and the unpartisan include both mindsets.
Liberty needs some rats on the inside, willingly or coerced, to know when raw milk raids, gun confiscation, etc is going to happen and where. Concord's North Bridge, Part II.
The most retarded thing one can do is try to intelligably use the word, "libtard," in a sentence.
/self-reference
i will chose my words more carefully-noted...
fascists vs freedom
Might be even rawer than you think.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=vo2S3Oqom5o
This shit is approved by the government. Whatever you do avoid McNugguts and any fish from China or Viet Nam.
Raw milk will kill you! Ron Paul should know that. Drink away! I survived brucellosis a disease caused by raw milk and can tell you it was very serious. I ended up in intensive care. I didn't intentionally drink raw milk , I had the misfortune on getting some milk product that was not properly pastuerized. So if you think it a great idea, I suggest a game of russian roulette too
You're missing the point. Free people should have the choice to drink or not drink raw milk. Many people drink raw milk with no bad effects. That you believe raw milk caused you health problems, is not enough reason for the government to use guns to prevent me from drinking what I want. Some people have extreme problems with gluten, should we ban bread? Thirty thousand people a year die in car accidents, should we ban cars?
You don't understand bacteria. People should not die because some asshole thinks it is alright to sell contaminated food. If you want no protection of food stuffs, move to Africa and enjoy your dysentery Using your rational let's get rid of all laws then and see where we end up. Fuck speed limits, they infringe on my rights, I want to drive on the otherside of the road, does that work for you too?
Sadly, you're confused. Stop trying to say what you think I want and then use that to attack me. I don't want the government saying what I am allowed to put in my body. That logically (and need I say, obviously) leaves open the private sector for whatever standards orginizations people desire.
Your driving/roads example really isn't applicable to the current situation, but is just as easily defeated.
Sadly you don't get it.....
Home > Foodborne Illness Outbreaks > 6 Raw Milk Outbreaks in 2012 – 152 Sickened, some seriously
6 Raw Milk Outbreaks in 2012 – 152 Sickened, some seriouslyPosted By Bill Marler on May 13, 2012
Campylobacter, E. coli and Cryptosporidium.
It has been a bad few months for raw milk hucksters and even worse for their customers.
Raw Dairy Outbreaks and Recalls from 1998 to the present:
119 total outbreaks
86 fluid milk: 18 cow, 4 goat, 64 unspecified milk type
27 cheese: 2 aged, 3 homemade, 17 Mexican-style queso fresco, 1 goat chevre, 1 curds, 3 unspecified
6 multiple raw dairy products (fluid milk, cheese, and/or colostrum)
2,147 total illnesses, 2 deaths
1,514 fluid milk-related illnesses, no deaths: 249 cow, 63 goat, 1,202 unspecified
576 cheese-related illnesses: 46 aged, 80 homemade, 324 Mexican-style queso fresco (2 deaths), 5 goat chevre, 63 curds, 58 unspecified cheese type
57 multiple raw dairy products-related illnesses (fluid milk, cheese, and/or colostrum)
Wow, seems like a lot of work for missing the point. Now listen carefully oh ye of little intelligence. Government is not my daddy, it is not my big brother, it should not be telling me with threats of violence what I can consume. Got it? Now go away.
the "funny" thing about any animal food product is that disease outbreak is more a function of modern "unnatural" crowding techniques than any other. Next danger comes from all the additional things we do to animals, the opposite of leaving them alone to their natural state. Cows should not eat corn or soy, they're meant to eat grass. Finally, like plants, probably worse, god knows what the effcts will be of modifiying their genetic structure
"I got brucellosis after drinking raw milk thus raw milk causes brucellosis!" Brucellosis is caused by a bacterium. It is pretty obvious that the previous poster's cow is not infected and thus having a single beloved cow free of infection is not a risk. If you get milk that is pooled from 100 cows some of which are going to keel over in the next week (that is from the grocery store), yes, by all means make sure it is pasturized. Just like if you are going to drink water from a muddy puddle, you should probably filter it. But raw milk does not cause brucellosis anymore than unfiltered water causes giardiasis.
Maybe his cow does not have brucellosis but it comes from cows. His cow for sure has E coli and when it shits and then lays down in it, the udders are contaminated. So any given sample of milk from that cow could kill you or not. You don't understand bacteria either!
I think tarsubil understands the concepts of freedom, and balancing risks with rewards, far better than you understand either.
http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/1164632-overview
it does come from cows (and other animals) but even the medical community sees that it is the direct result of modern crowded unhealthy conditions. And those conditions were created and worsened by the very people who lobby "for your health" (and their profit). Hence, keeping one cow in a natural grass setting is ironically, probably one of the the best preventions. Just the math tells me she is less likely to lie in her own shit. In the middle of California on a ranch of 100,000 where you threaten anyone who hosts Michael Pollan however...
http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/lanow/2009/10/california-agribusiness-pressures-school-to-nix-michael-pollan-speech.html
You have E. coli in your gut. It helps provide you with vit K. You are incorrect when you assume that since you are talking out of your rear, everyone else is too.
Please tell us where you contacted Brucella. I have isolated it a few times and EVERY time was from Mexico. I have never heard of a recent case in USA. The government requires Brucella vaccination. When the USDA inspected my husbands dairy in the late 70s they didn't have the paperwork on one cow. They tested the cow and found she had the antibody to Brucella. Because there was no way to determine that was from the vaccination or having an active infection, she was destroyed. With virtually no recompense as well As I remember. I understand your fear. As a microbiologist Brucella and Franciscella are the 2 bugs we truly fear. When isolated in the lab they are HIGHLY contagious and possibly deadly. Just read on Drudge about hunters getting "rabbit fever" . What they don't say is there is probably a few microbiologists who are afraid they may die. Yes, life in general is just damn scary!
Miffed;-)
Sorry... A RP presidency is Great for the country but Real really really bad for my primary investments....
Several million of the Chosen live there. They like this sort of thing. Especially when it is administered by one of their own. They are quite certain they know better than the rest of us.
The Chosen are becoming emboldened and stepping out of the shadows and onto the public stage- it is becoming a more overt takeover.
Yes, this is the case. KMac (Culture of Critique author, @ http://theoccidentalobserver.net) thinks it shows how confidant they are now. I believe it to be more a sign of desperation...cf. the sudden gun-grab. Once the Ponzi collapses, the Chosen know they will no longer be able buy consent - and shabbatz goyim - with debt.
...the people who cried wolf.
If and when the bullets start flying, the "chosen" will pray for the shelter of the shadows again.
ashkanazi vs shepherdic. kabbala vs conservative. be very very careful. the aspiring global puppet masters have intentionally wrapped themselves in the labels of completely innocent people. as the trains were loaded with those conspiring bakers, insidious tailors, tyrannical shoe makers, and evil mastermind children, the financiers who made it possible were laughing all the way to the bank.
amazing how I don't recall any banker types at nuremberg. the shell game worked before. count on them using it again.
Jewish people are for the most part guilty of supporting and benefiting from their psychopathic masters. Unfortunately gentile americans have been grafted into the jewish vine and are for the most part guilty of the same thing...in the world's eyes.
Since 2 Liter Soda Prohibition has been enacted in NY The Bonanos currently have the 2 liter pepsi market locked up... The bloods and crips are battling over Coke and Sprite.The FDA is changing its name to included this new form of contraband.. the Food, Cola and Drug adminsitration FCDA
Why would any libertarian complain about Bloomberg? He is a real life John Galt. He knows what is best for him (and you). His money proves his moral superiority to you and your views. That is timocracy. So there you go.
Real Martial Law isn't something that is enacted or declared by a civilian government. True Martial Law is something that is declared *by the military* when the civilian government and civilian law enforcement has become absent, ineffective, or overrun with villanous scum.
What you are picturing is some Frankenstein version of Martial Law that is somehow "enacted" by a civilian government that is still fully in control (such as hogwash NDAA and so forth). Real Martial Law (meaning declared by the military) would be a welcome change. It's certainly called for, so the the traitors in the civilian government can be purged and punished appropriately.
Yeah, enforcement and implementation farmed out to Haliburton and Blackwater. There's Agent Orange in your Koolaid, son.
That would be even more justification for the military to bring about real martial law. Mercenaries are expensive to maintain and they make easy targets when there is a rifle behind every blade of grass. Mercs don't stand a chance against the U.S. military, whether it's the ones in uniform or insurgent partiots.
partiots i like. it cuts so many ways.
I notice since the Marines were forced to take the bolts out of their rifles in order to be able to march in the presence of the President, the Navy add touts that the Navy will defend and uphold the Constitution. Wonder if Obama just turned the Navy into a bunch of Oath Keepers?
Haliburton and Blackwater are paid soldiers. They have insufficent numbers and their presence would not be tolerated. I expect that they would be running for the border after a bit.
PMR30, when 30 is enough...
LOL...........look at John Mcshitstain! That clown is exactly what's wrong with America. Why do bumblefuck Arizonans keep voting him into the Senate? I mean he basically took a big fat crap on hard working middle class Americans at his last town hall meeting. With a smile and a smirk and his goiter of a cheek and midget arms he basically said some 40+ year illegal is more important than natural born citizens.
I don't know about his old rich ass but I grew up in a middle class family and we cut our own goddamn grass, watched our own kids, I think we as Americans can damn well pick our own fucking fruit.
These politicians can basically sit there and tell us point blank they don't give a fuck about us and we just sit there like lemming asking where's the wall???????? LOL...Americans are some of the stupidest, most uninformed people on Earth.......and the rest of the world wants to fucking emulate us? Jesus H. Christ! WTF is wrong with them?
+10 rant.
I too, cannot believe the Republicrats talking about getting soft on immigration. DUH!
Oh yeah, get soft on immigration, bail out more corporations, give more handouts, raise taxes, and don't cut spending on wasteful governemnt programs. Then we'll have reasons to vote for you instead of Democrats who have the same damn platform! (???).
Big Ag. and the Churches are behind the Republicrats and the Demicans wanting the illegals to flood across the borders. Cheap labor in the fields, pliant/obedient bodies in the pews filling the coffers.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
When do you wake up and realize the two parties are the same. They are simply opposite sides of the same coin. The only way to fix the problem is to get rid of all of them.
I know that, which is what makes it so comical that they appeal to "voters" with the same platform, and these "voters" keep voting.
McCain was part of the Keating 5. Was that when he got "pwned"?
McCain's re-election, funded by his beer distribution queen, wife, cost him $26 million to keep his senate seat. The attack ads he had to run against his tea party backed opponent were constant. He bought the senior votes with "I won't cut your social security and medicare benefits like my opponent will" ads. That's why McCain is still there.
He is always talking amnesty for illegals, because he wants their votes, too.
He bought the senior votes with "I won't cut your social security and medicare benefits like my opponent will" ads.
McCain will sell anyone down the rat hole, except his masters.
> Why do bumblefuck Arizonans keep voting him into the Senate?
I junked ya for thinkin' that voting 'counts'. LOL ... voting.
And McShitstain led the charge against Party Poker. I live in AZ and I say to hell with that bastard.
Hmmm. One downvote on the 1st comment.. Its official.....That Fucker Corzine reads ZeroHedge ...
Too bad Corzine didn't steal gold coins. Then we would have had him.
Home > Foodborne Illness Outbreaks > 6 Raw Milk Outbreaks in 2012 – 152 Sickened, some seriously
6 Raw Milk Outbreaks in 2012 – 152 Sickened, some seriouslyPosted By Bill Marler on May 13, 2012
Campylobacter, E. coli and Cryptosporidium.
It has been a bad few months for raw milk hucksters and even worse for their customers.
Raw Dairy Outbreaks and Recalls from 1998 to the present:
119 total outbreaks
86 fluid milk: 18 cow, 4 goat, 64 unspecified milk type
27 cheese: 2 aged, 3 homemade, 17 Mexican-style queso fresco, 1 goat chevre, 1 curds, 3 unspecified
6 multiple raw dairy products (fluid milk, cheese, and/or colostrum)
2,147 total illnesses, 2 deaths
1,514 fluid milk-related illnesses, no deaths: 249 cow, 63 goat, 1,202 unspecified
576 cheese-related illnesses: 46 aged, 80 homemade, 324 Mexican-style queso fresco (2 deaths), 5 goat chevre, 63 curds, 58 unspecified cheese type
57 multiple raw dairy products-related illnesses (fluid milk, cheese, and/or colostrum)
.
you can't say that again
I think she was trying to tell us that she just had her period.
. CF LOL
I may be a dirty hoe Akak, but I am He, not she:)
Makes you think about what is in the milk that they want us to drink...?
Freedom is in the milk.
Lithium amongst others and kerocorzine
They want to add aspartame to 'flavored milk' to fight childhood obesity. It's for the children. They don't want to list it on the label, and need a new fda rule. Aspartame is an excito-toxin in humans, originally developed as a new ant poison. The FDA document shows they want it in whipped cream, evaporated milk, chocolate milk, nearly all milk products.
https://www.federalregister.gov/articles/2013/02/20/2013-03835/flavored-...
I have noticed for at least the last ten years that that fucking shit aspartame (which gives me, like so many others, near-migraine-level pounding headaches) is being pushed into more and more food products, ALL of which I categorically, and must, refuse to buy or consume. I swear, at least 90% of the "food" in the grocery store is instantly off my shopping radar, as I am increasingly pushed into buying basic ingredients only by my refusal to purchase or consume foods laden with aspartame, other artificial sweeteners, HFCS, hydrogenated and partially-hydrogenated oils, fucking ridiculously excessive levels of salt and sugar, and products made with refined white flour instead of whole grains.
Time to go vegetarian -- yay or neigh?
Yeah, if you can even find any non-GMO vegetables
Food is an ancient delivery system for bioweapons.
Sweetener compared to biochemical warfare agent
I find "Sucralose" in all kinds of things lately. The candy counter is LOADED with shit. Wonder what happens to children.
My "hay fever" went away after I laid off the chemical cheese powder on nacho-type chips and similar junk snacks. Pass it along, and maybe save somebody else a fortune in over-the-counter and prescription "allergy" products. EAT REAL FOOD AND YOU FEEL BETTER.
Some low level psychopaths seem to understand and use it to their advantage. I see a pattern among caregivers who resent the responsiblity of looking after a spouse that they don't love. They single out the worst junk chemical garbage and feed them a steady diet of it until something happens that gets the victim hospitalized. Once there, practical euthanasia is just a few needles and pill cups away. SLOW MURDER.
My grandparents talked about the wonderful taste of whole fresh milk.
You can't even go to a fucking gas station anymore and buy a piece of gum with plain fucking sugar????????? Everything has fucking sucralose this aspartame that. EVERYTHING!
Makes no sense to think that there are healthy things to eat at gas stations in the first place.
The FDA even did book burning for the sugar companies over this natural sugar http://www.margonaut.com/stevia.htm . Stevia is an interesting topic to Google regarding the FDA.
You can also grow your own stevia, and it's not even illegal (yet) to do so in the US.
BTW, I've found that the seeds are somewhat finicky to get to germinate. Fortunately live plants can be ordered.
More correct than would would ever believe. If big gov uses violent force to stop you from getting something seemingly innocuous, you can rest assured that there is something about the forbidden item that someone at the top does not want the masses to have/know. With raw milk, it's the tremendous health benefits... (but the gov wants healthy citizens, right?)
Louis Pasteur was FRENCH!
But yeah - I agree.
That's why he surrendered to bacteria.
but I hear the little bastards can be worse than nazis
then again, are there bad nazis and good nazis?
The medical industry looks more and more like a concerted effort to produce illness. There is a small (and growing) group of connected md doctors who sincerely want to help people, using Ecclesiastic Medical Counselor licensing for legal shelter.
Please if doctors REALLY wanted to help people they wouldn't even go into fucking medicine in the first place. Nutrition doesn't take 10+ years of medical education to figure out. My grandmother from Poland knew more about nutrition, eating, and food than a room full of doctors with Phd's in biochemistry. Atleast from a practical sense.
+1 Over there they call it 'babushka' (grandmother) medicine. I used it to cure my daughters stomach problems. She was recomended for stomach surgery by the US system.
Dr. Max Gerson
Seen as a heretic
Now held up by a world's nutrition expert: Colin Campbell (China Study)
And all Gerson did was fuse his european grandmother's wisdom and nature with medicine
Hippocrates agreed but modern medicine removed his license
Your tinfoil hat is interfering with your brain waves. OK, had to be said.
Raw milk has a long history of spreading listeria, brucellosis, and who knows what else. It's great for thinning the herd, especially the oldsters, since listeria is much more lethal to the elderly. Put raw milk in every supermarket, and all the problems of medicare and social security vanish !! Include raw milk in free school lunches, and the dream act will become much less controversial, since many fewer will survive. It's not a coincidence that human populations really took off after Pasteur and his commie marxtard martial law stalinist doctrine of pasteurization.
Problem is, all of these freedom-loving raw-milk drinkers will eventually show up at the hospital requring treatment for listeria, brucellosis, etc, and won't have the money to pay for it, and they will expect the taxpayer to cover it. That makes it the taxpayer's business. So many libertarians are into moral hazard -- let me take my own risks !! But you pay for the downside.
you miss the obvios point - choice.
using too much toilet paper-the shit police are watching
thinking too much-eat the food and take your meds
appears to be more than just profit
and then check into the medical sanitorium
now you are in our complete control
we made you sick and im here to help you die, but first i must bankrupt you-your last dime b/4 you die.
long shovels and pine boxes. long planned death via fasism...
You miss the obvious point -- if you make choices that impose a burden on the taxpayer, the taxpayer has a right to intervene and limit your choices.
It would be fine if raw milk drinkers had the dignity to quietly suffer and/or die at home when they contract listeria, brucellosis, etc. But they don't.
Nobody has the right to make a choice for me or you. You do not have the right to intervene in my decisions. Plus you are assuming that all people who drink raw milk are on some sort of government welfare health insurance. In the real world they actually have farmers and raw milk consumers with private health insurance paying their bills.
Of those privately insured drinkers of raw milk, how many have disclosed the fact to their insurers and agreed to pay higher premiums? (Hint: then answer rhymes with done.) Their extra health costs are therefore spread across the whole population, and when you impose costs on your neighbors, they damn well do have the right to make choices for you. It's just like smoking -- a personal choice that results in higher insurance premiums among other things.
I don't want to be a dick about it, but you have a very simplistic view of life in society. An endless number of your choices are constrained, and you are constantly constraining the choices of others. Say your next door neighbor wants to make some extra cash to fund his retirement in the Caymans by accepting toxic waste and dumping it in a pit in his back yard. Does he have the right to make that choice? Does nobody have the right to make that choice for him?
The right way to think about the issue is: when does society have a right to constrain choices? Not just for ideological reasons, of course. But when choices impose out-of-pocket costs on other people, that's case #1 where choice can reasonably be limited.
I would give Ron Paul personally a pass on the issue, because he famously said he would let people die on the sidewalk outside the hospital who lack health insurance. WWJD? WWRPD? Problem is, society is too soft hearted in general to to what Ron Paul would do.
then please explain hydrofracking.
People with money have the choice to frack anyone they want. Too bad we can't limit those choices.
and therein lies the rub. i personally do not deny that a healthy society is one that can balance individual freedom & liberty with collective responsibility. however, when the institutions that are entrusted to maintain that balance become corrupted to the core by selfish individuals who then in turn determine what is "good" for the remainder of the collective in order to further their own selfish interests at the expense of everyone else, then it is time to question any & all limits that are imposed on individuals by those institutions in the name of the "greater good" for the collective.
yes, there is always the danger of throwing the baby out with the bathwater, but it seems that we currently have a far ways to go down the scale before that danger is clear & present.
What extra health care costs do raw milk consumers face? Why should someone else's lifestyle affect my health insurance premiums (hint: you're adding a new topic to the debate, not resolving the current one)? Among the myriad regulations imposed on the health insurance industry, one is that I may not purchase insurance from an out of state provider. So, even accepting the few faulty premises you've started off with, it seems the phantom "extra" health care costs we can thank those raw milk drinkers are only "shared" by the population of their specific state.
And still accepting your faulty premises, there are specific risks and detrimental health effects borne by sitting in front of a computer for an extended period of time. Seeing as you typed so much here, and seeing as we all have no clue as to your typing speed, I'm going to have to ask that you limit your comments either in length or number so that I'm not faced with an additional out-of-pocket expense treating your blood clots or kidney stones or pancreatic cancer or diabetes or what have you. It's just not fair. And if you were to die from these laziness-induced medical conditions, who would we have to compare SWAT raids on dairy farmers with some mythical neighbor selling his 0.74 acre backyard as a toxic waste dump?? The two things are just so similar! Like when a cat does a somersault but then some sausage is made with sage for a little added flavor, you know?
And society is not soft-hearted. That's why so many people fight to have money stolen from faceless "others" to pay for the problems of some other faceless people. It's just too much fucking work to do anything yourself, am I right?
Paraphrasing a quote I read this weekend and am too lazy to dig up - sorry for the extra costs :( - "welfare and the like are not a measure of the compassion of a society, but rather the lack of it."
If you want to know the health risks of raw milk, don't take it from me. Go to wikipedia and look up listeria and brucellosis. Those were very common before the marxtard Pasteur showed up (and a long life was three score and ten, and people had six children so three would survive). Now those diseases are virtually unknown (even to you). Not a mere coincidence. Next to sewage treatment, pasteurization of commercial beverages is #2 on the list of public health low hanging fruit.
Honestly, why do you think the G-men do the gestapo thing over raw milk? Just because they are mean, or want to deny the wonders of raw milk to the sheeple? Nonsense. It's a very clear public health issue, and a lot of the expense of treating those totally preventable diseases does indeed end up on the public. If pasteurization is a plot against the people, why has lifespan nearly doubled and the human population nearly crushed the earth since Pasteur?
Perhaps you would prefer a comparison to motorcycle helmet laws. Same thing in principle -- you are not allowed to take a risk because the cost would fall on your neighbors.
But I do salute you for at least considering and arguing the point, rather than just calling me a something-tard. ZH needs more of that.
To be honest, I don't even want to drink raw milk. I just see SWAT swarming farmhouses and think, "that's not cool at all." Then you try to pass the consumption of raw milk off as a cost (if it even is a cost, I still haven't seen your numbers) we all must share (which we shouldn't, again, another topic). And now apparently it's an affront to Pasteur himself, although I say your singular focus on pasteurization is an affront to a metric ton of scientific pioneers as well as the entire Industrial Revolution in one fell swoop regarding the increase in life expectancy. Same with infant mortality. Things like not being run over by horses and carts, not starving, not sleeping with parasites and rodents were the big ones. Milk, raw or not, when they could get it, was worth the risk to put it lightly.
You're honest in support of gestapo tactics against dairy farmers, but what happens when keyboard time is subject to a limit based on certain criteria? Sounds silly, right? Twenty years ago what would you have thought of the suggestion that we'd all be subject to a tax penalty if we didn't buy a health insurance plan that met minimum government coverages and standards? We've already passed silly and then some.
Chump, you are the man!
And to Lostmyshorts (who has clearly lost his mind, as well as his morality, as well as any semblance of what liberty is and should be), I might add that the decrease in the prevalence of brucellosis and listeria has MUCH more to do with the rise of refrigeration, and the very concept of food hygiene, both of which were largely lacking prior to Pasteur. The process of pasteurization is almost certainly the least part of the cause for the decline of the diseases you mentioned.
PS: I hear that bubonic plague is still endemic in the US Southwest. I suggest, based on your "logic", that a surcharge be placed on all travelers and residents in those areas based on that threat.
They want to prevent expenses from landing on the public? Not a good idea to use as part of your arguement. Helmet laws? Generally helmets prevent sudden death, which is cheap for the public, and expensive for insurers.
then explain aspartame or flouride or GMOs or high-fructose corn syrup or about a dozen other legal substances that pose long-term public health problems.
by the way, the overwhelming expenses that the "taxpayer" is paying for is for the military-industrial-complex and subsidies in form of compound interest to issue a currency that could be printed interest-free. does the "taxpayer" have any say to intervene and limit those choices?
i thought not.
Does the taxpayer have the right to opt out and stop paying taxes?
Lost your mind when you lost your shorts, Mr. Shorts? Can you provide a short history of all these imagined diseases or are you just pulling your information out of thin air?
The reason I ask is because I personally and millions of others grew up drinking non-Pasteurized milk and we didn't get sick.
The diseases occured when milk production went into mass production mode and proper care wasn't taken from extraction to market. The problem wasn't the product, instead it was the producers.
> Your tinfoil hat is interfering with your brain waves.
GFY
... had to be said.
Lost my shorts, you are correct raw milk DID have history spreading disease but you forget or are not aware why. During the the 1880s when cities such as Chicago we rapidly growing, cows were brought into city and were kept in horrible, unsanitary conditions. Actually quite like the conditions most cows in CAFOS are living in today. Pasturization made the milk safe to drink . However, it also made milk a dead product and a dangerous one at that because if a pathogen contaminated the milk after pasteurization it could grow unchecked. Raw milk from CAFOs would be a dangerous product. Please understand I would never advocate drinking it. You have been sold a lot of bad information by the scaremongers in the MSM. Do a little investigation and you may see some merits to our arguments.
Miffed;-)
"Makes you think about what is in the milk that they want us to drink...?"
Que sound of Jaws music in the background.:
http://notmilk.com/
Estrogen. Gay fish everywhere. Less reproduction due to lack of desire or sterilization. Early sexual development in females leads to early menopause or ovarian failure, feminization in boys. My ex was a cattle/dairy man. Growth hormone. Antibiotics. They receive shots the day they are born, testosterone to the bull calves, faster to market. less consumption with muscle mass to get to the 120 lb mark for transport to feedlot, and then to 1200 (or whatever) to slaughter. It's a race man. Race to the end.
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2007/05/070521-sex-fish.html
I am convinced mentally ill people are running the show.
"
Answers from our experts to important scientific questions Bioscience >Q: What are the effects of estrogen on fish sex ratios and reproductive behavior? Specifically, I am interested in the problem of extra estrogen being added to rivers near industrialized cities from birth control pills.
A: There are many chemicals in our environment that can mimic the natural estrogen that animals make to regulate their sexual development and reproductive systems. These include detergent additives, synthetic estrogens found in birth control pills and estrogen replacement therapy drugs, plastics additives, some pesticides, and livestock hormones. Many of these are common household materials, and they end up in our wastewater and sewage. Sewage treatment plants also receive natural human estrogen that is excreted. Conventional water and sewage treatment doesn?t remove them efficiently, and so they end up being discharged into our rivers and other surface waters. Livestock hormones can leach from large animal operations directly into surface waters. Estrogen and estrogen mimics have been measured in sewage treatment plant effluent and in their receiving waters throughout the industrialized world."
How often does total state power lead to the slaughter of citizens?
Raw milk? Like straight out of the cow's udder? Ewwwwww...... gross!
I want mine pasteurized and homogenized and pumped full of Dow chemicals, please!
If you don't agree with me you should be like..... arrested or something. That's just WRONG.
(Have you ever HAD real milk, stright from a cow? Or Ice Cream made from it? It's really REALLY good. You won't eat a half gallon of it either.... stuff is RICH. You KNOW you don't need piles of it to get your fill.)
I have drunk milk virtually every day of my life, and for the last six years mostly raw milk (goat in this case), and I can assure you that the difference between it and the homogenized, pasteurized, antibiotic-laden, hormone-laced storebought product is analogous to the difference between night and day, not only in raw milk's superior appearance and flavor but more importantly in its beneficial effects on digestion. It is virtually an entirely different product altogether.
Which is why you can Buy crack, heroin or meth in any town in American, but raw milk is as rare as hens teeth.
Shows the gubbermint's priorities!
If they make it illegal it will only take a year, at most 2 years, and more people will be drinking raw milk than did before they invented pasteurization. lmao
The authorities have been alerted. Drones are being dispatched. You are now on the no-fly list and the Utah data center is reviewing your calls and emails from the past few years.
As soon as the Feds shoot a couple of innocent old ladies in a pickup truck they think are you - they'll be right over.
When raw milk is outlawed, only outlaws will drink raw milk.
Can you imagine drinking a 32-oz gulp-size raw milk in public in downtown NYC...
Nanny Bloomberg would have a hissy fit and then a hernia before suffering a fatal heart attack!
(Any volunteers to drink one to help get rid of the disgusting holier-than-thou dis-honor?)
I double dog dare you to drink 32 oz o raw milk.the richness of raw milk will stop you after about a couple of glasses. That's the thing about real food, you will DEFINITELY feel the "stop". Fake food says eat forever. Funny that.
Miffed;-)
Excellent point MM!
Your every post is a kernel of wisdom.
fake food says eat forever cause the body signals it's not getting any "nutrition." When I eat a sald of twenty different greens and carrots from the garden with nuts and berries, the body feels a definite satisfaction that I can not get eating store bought stuff.
agree with akak - good posts
Throw infants and newborns in jail! Strip them away from their mothers tits! Protect the innocent children from big bad Raw Milk!
Mr miffed and I had an interesting experience on the first day at our sheep ranch in NZ. The farmer welcomed us with open arms and showed us to our cabin. We opened the frig and saw a large pitcher of milk obviously raw. We looked incredulously at him. He said defensively " it's not old I milked the cow today!" we said its not that it's just shocking to us you would give us raw milk. He just stared questionly at us. We had to explain he was dealing in a banned lethal substance in the US. He looked askance at us again and said " the more I meet you Americans the most I just don't understand you". We just had to laugh.
Last night we heard a lot of noise in the trees and wondered what was going on. This morning we explained it to our host. " Oh dear,, I forgot to tell you about the opposums. They are very destructive to the trees and fight among themselves at night" he brings us a gun with a scope and laser on it " Okay, if they keep you up tonight shoot them. If you are not sure which tree there in call my opposum dog down and he'll help you locate the tree" I will never forget the look mr miffed had on his face holding that gun looking at me in disbelief. It was the " ok I'm ready to renounce my citIzenship now" look. I don't have the heart to tell him we're over 50 and they won't take us.
Miffed:-)
Another key to Raw Milk is to make sure the dairy you buy from has their cows on a
grass fed only diet. Cows (ruminants) are not designed to eat corn, plus most corn is GMO now.
That goes for beef also. Grass fed Beef is superior in every way to Corn fed (feed lot) animals.
More expensive becuase it takes over 2yrs to get animal to market weight. Corn packs on the fat
and the unhealty yellow fat. Grass fed cows are lean and the fat is white, very similar to Venison.
Plus the cheapest way to feed a grass fed cow is pasture....healthier than stand in on concrete and shit all day/
Agreed! - you never forget that wonderfull flavor of warm raw milk...and home made butter on home made bread..
i mix grass fed burger with venison 50/50 - best burger ever, get 6 patties on real buns from the coop.
whats for diner? slow death for most americans-and ignorance is no excuse...
lucky we all got o care
now we can take your money for another slow, but faster death
got you last dime.
next up: death benifit; call it cradle to death via corporation profit motive.
make sure you vote:two heads one body.
My father was a vet and also has a PhD in infectious diseases. He grew up on a working farm and has a lot of experience with dairy cows. My wife was thinking about getting into the raw milk thing and I asked him about it and he said it was risky and he wouldn't drink it FWIW . I've never had raw milk. I think I'd drink a glass just to see what it tasted like. You only live once. I would be more comfortable if it were my cows so I could know that the process was sanitary.
"I think I'd drink a glass just to see what it tasted like. You only live once."
Wow! You're really living on the edge.
I bet he even sneaks raw cookie dough from time to time to snack on late at night, too, the daredevil!
Tried raw horse milk as a kid when one of our horses gave birth. Meh, would not try again, kinda 'watery' if I remember.
I can't wait to have kids so I can milk my wife. "Honey, can I borrow your boobies for a sec? My lucky charms need some milk......"
We don't have a cow. We have a bull.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EyrcnlLo9nY
Uh, we only go to the local dairy that has been inspected thoroughly, never had a complaint against them, and sells more raw milk than anyone else in the state. If you pick a dirty area, you get what you deserve. And it's worth every penny of the $7 a gallon we pay.
yes and my uncle worked for the water company and said that I should'nt drink well water that I should hook up to city water. 25 years on the well and still has never made me sick! thats what relatives are for, right?
So your father has a Phd? So what! HE sounds like a fucking moron! I've been drinking raw milk for 10+ years and have never gotten sick once and my overall health is better for it. If the animals are raised, fed and cared for how they should be there is very little risk of pathogenic bacteria entering the milk etc. Your dad probably grew up on a dairy farm where the cows sat around in their own shit all day and were fed corn and other grain.
You're such a classy guy. You wrote the important point: IF the animals are raised, fed and cared for...blah blah blah. If they're not then you can get seriously ill. You have to remember, a lot of people buy raw milk from farms they've never been to and have no idea about the quality and safety issues. I never said he grew up on a dairy farm. Learn reading comprehension prick. That's why I also wrote FWIW; if you don't like what I wrote, then move on. Keep spewing your tough guy BS from the safety of your internet anonymity.
When my Mom would cook dinner back in the 70's I'd sneak raw hamburger meat, just loved it. Soon as she got it out to make spaghetti or hamburgers or the like. I volunteered to help.
Had to make sure she couldn't see me. I'd pinch some and smoosh it back into shape. Mmmmm.
Didn't get sick once; farmers must have been doing something right.
I'd drink raw milk if it was my cow or goat, and it would be my choice.
Why can't we let people make choices anymore? Eh?
DON'T do that today. The chances you'd get EHEC or ecoli 157:h7 are extremely high. I ate raw hamburger like you did as a kid as well. I'd sooner drink Drano today. We live in a very dark time today my friend. Unless you raise it in known conditions it's not worth your life. Sad but true.
Miffed;-)
double post
I'm not a vet and I don't have a Ph.D. but I grew up on a farm and there is no substitute for raw milk. I used to drink gallons of it and never sick from drinking milk, in fact, less time sick than most people ever are. I refuse to drink the garbage they put on store shelves these days and I guarantee that the chances of getting sick from store bought milk are higher than getting sick from your own cow. Of course, you have to practice decent hygiene, but surely we have all been taught to wash our hands so wash the cows teats as well and you will be good to go.
Wouldn't it be nice if someone ran on these three goals:
1. Make lobyists illegal
2. 4 year term limits
3. Flat tax
How else can we get rid of this bullshit?
Wouldn't it be nicer if every once in awhile, instead of children or geriatric newsies getting shot, these wackdoos would find a politician and scream out "Sic Semper Tyrannis" or some such shit right before wasting them?
That would be nicer and more effective. And then suicide-by-fire-by-cop to avoid a trial.