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Some Advice To Americans: Don't Be Engaged In Combat On American Soil
It seems 13 hours of open discussion on the Constitutional rights of the President to be judge, jury, and executioner aroused further response from the Attorney General.
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but
...except on days of the week that end with the letter "y".
Sit down Jr. and eat your peas.
Does marriage count?*
*Joke, baby, it is just a joke. I'll get back to work now.
Only if it's that "special" time of month...
or right before, or right after, or if you did something, or didn't do something...
so the former american, now in the form of a grease spot, has been "DEEMED" to have been engaged in combat... Therefore a legal action...
this letter to RAND means nothing...
And you have so many avenues of recourse once you are a smoldering crater.
Let's just assume the little puke kills a couple of non-combatants anyways..., that is in his character.
So then, Mr. Holder, will you go after him?
I didn't think so...
don't invest your 401k into treasury bonds? enemy combatant.
Define "combat."
It all depends on what the definition of the word "is" is.
You can't have habeus without a corpus or two.
Holy shit, Holder. You are a real asshole. And a liar. And...well, ZH's turn to tell us what Holder is.
What is the DOJ's definition of "Combat" exaclty?
Paintball, fistfights, hunting, insulting the His Royal Highness the President, etc, etc, etc.
So does this mean Rand will be doing this again next president?
Sounds sorta silly to me.
WHAT?!
There's a RIGHT to Rebellion you fucks!!
"when a long train of abuses and usurpation's, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security." - Declaration of Independence
If you do get "droned" the official investigation will claim your smoldering house is the result of a "gas leak" or you "cooked meth." The MSM will repeat it faithfully.
Remember this gem: Two dead as mystery explosion rips through Indianapolis neighborhood
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2231312/Two-die-huge-explosion-l...
Let's not forget cops can now give the order to "burn the motherfucker down".
How many people died from drones in america?
Most young Americans die from suicide.
http://www.cdc.gov/injury/wisqars/images/LCD/10LCID_All_Deaths_By_Age_Gr...
How many young Americans die from wars abroad?
It is a right to take ones life. What is more basic than the right to your own life?
suicide is a right like poverty is a right.....
who the hell wants to? they are forced to by the environment with lack of parenting/leadership especially at young age.
Suicide was first made illegal in ancient Rome, because it was seen as a means of escaping taxation.
By these words, it isn't a right, it's an obigation.
@ ACP: Closed fist or does open hand count?
This is why we need another hearing, damnit.
How does Holder and Obama define combat? Anyone whose opinion they do not like.
1st step: Have Congress do what they do best; draft a very broad, fairly ambiguous, poorly worded statute.
2nd step: Wait until a legal challenge is "ripe" (i.e. a potentially quite harmless and innocent person has already been vaporized by a drone) and is granted cert (if the "droned" person's estate gets incredibly lucky) before the SCOTUS.
3rd step: Claim that sloppily written statute passes "strict scrutiny" test and also throw in a "governmental immunity" murmur in passing (because of the soon-to-follow civil suit based in tort).
4th step: The SCOTUS issues a unanimous opinion siding with the U.S. Government based on the rapidly evolving UnitarianPOTUS-Dictator-In-Chief-Without-Any-Checks-Or-Balances theory of governmental exercise of power.
5th step: Get summary judgment on the civil suit filed by the estate of the Droned Decedent.
I'm just kidding. They'll never codify this or put it into writing, even, because it'sso much easier to circumvent the Constitution, with less headaches (as minimal as they might be), by JUST DOING IT.
What does 'engaged in combat' mean?
If I am arguing with my wife about some unimportant thing, does that qualify me to take a missle up my ass?
"Engaged in combat" = carrying a firearm.
Drones being built to detect weapons.
So, if I read that correctly, the door is open for the President to use a drone that is not weaponized to kill an American on US soil. Glad we got that clarified.
+100 Nailed it.
So; Who controls the drowns, North or South? How about a nuke and/or chemical/ bio armed drown? Or dare I say; No drowns over America?
@TruthInSunshine: They have to assume everyone is trained as a Shaolin monk, so either closed or open handed.
That's DUMBfucks!
There, fixed it.
You are a fucken idiot.with no concept of real life so why don,t you just go back to your stupid fucking computer game and stop wasting the time of intelligent people!
Barracky is the first POTUS who wants to use drones, with weapons over non military air space. If the next POTUS is intent on this same kind of NEO CON behavior then he/she will be asked.
Do you support Barrack Hussein Obama flying drones over shools? What about the children? What about women, minorities and the gay lesbian transgender citizens rights to assemble without fear if some dipshit like BUSH had this power?
If BUSH had tried this how would you feel?
unemployment rate is 8% and Rand Paul is focusing on hypothetical death from drones?
most Americans have plenty of freedom and security except FINANCIAL SECURITY.
Drones Americans need to focus are from financial terrorists selling debt drones for everything you need to survive: transportation, housing, education, healthcare.
Actually the definition is "anyone providing materials support to the enemy". That can mean contributing to the wrong charity...or writing the wrong kind of blog post...
LOVE the Avatar PodBayDoor! Excellent!
and yours? Who's that?
Or being the child of an ALLEGED terrorirst.
Interesting how everyone forgot that the precedent for assassinating Americans ON American soil was established not by that moron Bush but by Bill Clinton.
In 1993, twenty years ago this April with events in Waco, TX....
Mayanah Schneider Answers Senator Rand Paul
good link, maybe a bit more from it will encourage reading,
been pointing at / to the private mercenary forces employed by .gov as they grow in numbers, embedded within the populace for policing, etc. - this trend will only continue, of course. . .
keep asking for definitions, because they matter, and they CHANGE over time, just as .gov does. . . incremental creepage of force, stealthily applied, militarised state is what amrkns live within. boiling point breached for that pot that's been on the back burner all your lives.
"combat"? that would be defined as any thoughtcrime against the State. the State is Them vs. You.
know this.
johngaltfla said:
While that's not entirely accurate, I will concede that Clinton established the precedent for assassinating Americans ON American soil and televising it live.
We can take the time traveling flying rickshaw back to Kent State University in early May 1970 to see how Dick Nixon dealt with dirty, smelly hippies (as well as students walking to class to take their final exams). Yet Nixon wasn't breaking any new ground.
Let's go back a little further, this time to 1932, as Attorney General William Mitchell and Army Chief of Staff General Douglas MacArthur show us how the Hoover administration deals with dirty, smelly, .......umm, war veterans and their families.
It sure is a Good Thing® that American schools, films, television, and other media/pop culture provide a thoroughly indoctrinating veneer of history. If American armed forces ever learned how often American war veterans were put in their place by armed force, they might not be quite so willing to continue the tradition.
Nixon sent the Nationol Gaurd to Kent State? I thought National Guard troops were called to action by the leaders of the state?
You think Jim Rhodes sent in the National Guard without first getting a wink and a nod from Nixon?
Who as it that had the police beat up people at the DNC convention in Chicago? Which evil republican is responisble for that?
Still wearing the Democrat/Republican blinders at this stage of the game?
Why do you even bother reading this site? You're wasting valuable television viewing time.
There may be little or no difference between Democrats and Republicans, but there are worlds of difference between conservatives and liberals. Conservatives believe people should be free, and government should be small. Leftists believe in the freedom of the State to do whatever it pleases, and are responsible for the ruin of perhaps a few hundred nations, and the deaths of about 1/4 billion people in the 20th Century alone... and they are continuing mostly unopposed well into the 21st century while people keep saying, "there's no difference between Democrats and Republicans".
It's just that Neocon/Libtard Partisans on either side of the aisle deserve to be put down. It only a fool who attacks/defends either side. A politico is either following the consitution, or not. Ron Paul was one of the few. Let's see, there are others, though. Their names sort of escape me at the moment . . .
and of course, there was the Philadelphia bombing of row houses in 1985, killing 6 adults, 5 children,
'course, they were black, and it was easier to think of them as trrrrrrsts way back. . . then.
for anyone unconvinced as to where this is all headed, there is history, if one is able to see it.
Some of the things that will put you on the "combatant" list are:
* has 7 days of food in the fridge
* pays for things with cash
* owns a gun
* owns gold
* posts on Zerohedge
... just to name a few...
how about : * have job and pay taxes
* watches Nascar or Fox News
* have American flag sticker on car window
Define combat....
Not taking your sensitivity training classes.
combat: includes but is not limited to being on the receiving end of a drone attack...
The presumption of combativeness as a consequence of being droned in one's anus!
Viva la Logic de Circuitousness!
Are you a combatant, if you don't have a weapon?
As Holder would presumably claim, "yes, because combativeness is a state of mind and/or intent."
Are you a combatant, if you don't have a weapon?
If you post rude comments on ZH your goose is cooked and you along with it! Drones to infinity..........
I believe skeet shooting is a form of combat.
Sure. Military aged males are combatants because they are capable of combat. Anywhere between 12-65 or so. Or anyone that looks like a military aged male from a drone camera high in the sky. And anyone standing near them. Or anyone identified by a secret government algorithm as a "node" in a terrorist "network." Or just, whoever.
Define weaponized drone. Is that an Obama supporter with a Biden shotgun?
Combat: Opposing Obama or McCain.
Combat is what they decide it is, mere moments after they hellfire you into a smoking crater.
That is all.
Nice they way Holder words it, 'It has come to my attention that you have now asked an additional question..'
Is it me or does he barely disguise his arrogance and irritation at being asked a question from the foothills of Mt. Olympus?
Fucking aristocrat, gun-running, Constitution-shredding traitor..
Hey MoFo!!!!
You post on ZeroHedge and call me an asshole!!!! You be a combatant.
Special drone Buckwheats for you. Bitch.
I'm genuinely curious as to how Holder would define "combat" in relation to this issue, with precise specificity.
com·bat (km-bt, kmbt)
v. com·bat·ed or com·bat·ted, com·bat·ing or com·bat·ting, com·bats v.tr.1. To oppose in battle; fight against. 2. To oppose vigorously; struggle against. See Synonyms at oppose.
v.intr.
My guess is that Obama and Holder mean (1.) anybody who fights against the interests of the government but under exceptional circumstances may include (2.) anybody who OPPOSES or threatens what the official policy of the government of the day is...
Next up: define "engaged"
Followed shortly by definition requests for "in," "on," "American," "Soil."
Which, will require definitions of all of the words used to define the previous ones.
Man, I should've been a lawyer. Infinite recursion is a fuckin' cash cow!
I think Congress, Obama and Jr. Dick Holder will clear all this up shortly with a new secret bill that allows the President to unilaterally remove citizenship from those on the 'Kill List'...
What if I shoot at the drones with the weapons that YOU YOURSELF provided me?... Does that put my 'no KILL' status in jeopardy?
Call this a hunch but I doubt very seriously that you qualify for 'No Kill' status...
Halloween is off, kids. Holder's response was NOT comforting.
Put the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtle costumes away.
"Call this a hunch but I doubt very seriously that you qualify for 'No Kill' status..."
~~~
I wear my yarmulke embroidered with "Don't drone me bro" at all times... If only to give me a false sense of security... [FASHIONWISE ~ I've received mixed signals from the 'chicks' though... Half think I'm rich and want to snort lines of coke off my hard dick... The other half are weary that I might actually be an embarassing cheapskate date]...
piratical
The Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles are still OK... the Teenage Mujahideen Ninja Turtles on the other hand?... not so much...
What about The Teenage Mutant Weather Underground Nicki Minaj Tortoises?
Toast as soon as Obama leaves office...
I had the filibuster on for 4 hours last night. Sometimes Rand would say "Does the President have the right to kill Americans on American soil?" and I supported his questioning... but occasionally some other Congressman would say "non-combatant Americans" and occasionally even Rand would say it, and it was obvious where the wiggle room was for DickHolder and Obitch.
anything will be justified with Language.
doublespeak.
Rand's question was always about Gov't. right to kill, detain, whatever *without due process,* as "guaranteed by the Constitution."
Holder rephrased the question, then answered it -- 11th hour to boot, sneaky like.
We're dealing with cunts here. Neither earnestness nor credence should be credited them.
We're dealing with terrorists here. As another already observed, Americans have tacitly had war declared on them today (on US today).
I really can't counter fellow-ZHer ekm's timetable (cf. this morning's Gas post), that we're down to *weeks,* not months now.
.
Akak,
+1 for you just for remembering it. I will never forget it. Watching that on TV was like,WTF.
i didn't have sex
with that drone ...
Fuck you Holder, you sociopathic amoral cock sucking douchemonkey skinflute busker.
[edit] you are the moustache-toting sum turd output of every God-forsaken socio-pseudo-economic-academic movement of the last two guilty generations that has mired our economy in obtuse language. You are the perfect example of every high-speaking thug and moocher Ayn Rand ever described for the public consumption. You are the high priest of the American subculture that worships the abuser who usurps office. You are everything that needs to be purged in this country. You are a gutless wonder.
Epic rant.
Skinflute busker... LOL!
agreed , although i have no clue what a 'busker' is !
"Define "combat."
Under the NDAA, the entire country is a battle ground now and all are unwitting players. If you are defending yourself, you are an enemy combatant/insurgent/seditious American who has to be eliminated for believing in such notions as freedom, and a constitution.
Boom! (Last sound most unknowing Americans will ever hear)
Even the flight attendant union has filed a complaint with the TSA over the proposed relaxation of carry-on rules.
They no longer see the passengers as customers, but as terrorists and enemies.
The country is at war with itself and it does not see it.
You see it, DollarMenu. You and I.
Wed, 08/15/2012 - 15:39 | ParkAveFlasherCivil War.
...8/15/12 ParkAveFlasher ... Lunatic, Fringe Conspiracy Theorist, Non-Violent Augurer, self-proclaimed ZHer
fuck the "hag bag" flight attendants [at the RISK of sounding 'pro-TSA']...
~~~
If they're not 70+ year old wrinkly HAG BAGS [with seniority], they're fucking FAG BAGS... The 'brut' smelling aftershave, reeking of 'Lavoris' frat boy fraternity of the banking conclave has NOTHING on these fucking nazi, smelly ass fucking fucks...
Do us all a favor & on your next Trans-Continental, pop a fucking airlock [in the hope that the decompression is strong enough to suck your fat asses out of the porthole & you don't spoil the trip by landing in farmer John's cornfield...
define "define"
.
I was wondering when someone was going to get to that. (Thank you, DoneThis2Long.)
There is a subtlety to the word "define" which can often be elusive. In its most common usage, "define" is the act of reciting the meaning of a word or phrase. In this particular circumstance, though, I believe it is important to bear in mind a less common (but equally valid) usage, where "define" is the act of establishing the meaning of a word or phrase.
Does anyone really have any doubt as to the way the word is used by the Attorney General of Vichy DC?
Those of you asking for the words combat and combatant to be defined can rest assured that they will indeed be defined. In fact, they will be defined repeatedly, almost continually.
The meaning of meaning - it's what keeps a legal* system in business.
*Remember kids, it is possible to have a legal system while lacking a justice system.
"Remember kids, it is possible to have a legal system while lacking a justice system."
Beeng-O!!!
Question: Mr. Holder, please define "combat".
Answer: I know it when I drone it.
Lemme see here. If you're a terrorist then you're a combatant, rught? And you're a terrorist if "they" accuse you of such, right? So utilizing simple Syllogistic logic, your sweet little ass can be droned any fucking time they so choose.
Just like scooped up and without a trial as an accused terrorist, sent off to... etc., etc., etc.
Nothing new but the drone...
What is even more troubling is that both the question and the answer to the question are from individuals that are ultimately paid by the same entity.
1. Domestic drones will not carry weapons, but they will be used for SIGINT, such as Stingray
https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2013/02/secretive-stingray-surveillance-tool-becomes-more-pervasive-questions-over-its
Stringray spoofs a celltower, and pings everyones cellphone. Put it in a drone and you have an incredible SIGNINT tool.
2. Take the battery out of your cellphone, or wrap it in aluminum foil if you want to remain anonymous.
I think this proves that Holder is sincere
Dear dick Holder,
Please define "combat".
Regards,
RP
We've seen this trick before... wording is too vague... and this administration is Too Big To Prosecute (TBTP) just like the banks...
Who would be prosecuting the Executive Branch?
Congress?
Supreme Court?
They are all corrupt.
"Executive Branch"
Henceforth be known as Execution Branch as well.
eventually it's gonna be up to US , the people , to 'prosecute' , whatever way is necessary . . . . .
all "administrations" are Too Big To Prosecute, they are employed to work for the NationState.
you are not the NationState. it is not You.
now the definition of "combat" becomes more clear?
I.e. What does "engaged in combat mean"? Who or what gets to arbitrarily define it? Because it is a total arbitrary .
So the prez is the "deemer"?. Can he delegate deeming authority to Kerry? Or maybe just anyone who shows initiatve to do his own deeming?.
Is the gov no longer doing asssassinations? Just deemings?
This is the stuff of kings and yearnings to breathe free. [h/t to Emma Lazarus, back when deemers were called tyrants]
Now where did I leave that stinger missile ..........
What about VISUAL combat? I fear for WB7.
So it looks like Beavis told Butthead write Senator Paul a letter.
http://collider.com/wp-content/uploads/beavis_butt-head_image_washington...
Barry Hussein O’Blamer and Eric "Dick" Holder
That wasn’t so hard, was it, boyz?
good thing he's not on American soil. Stay away from the US Embassy, Bill.
Combat will be defined by a panel of 3 judges, on a case by case basis.
Remember, they not real judges, neither elected nor appointed by an elected official, they are three government employees.
Owing their jobs to recess apppointment.
We can all rest asssured that holocaust questioners will fit the enemy combatant definition.
And something tells me "whitey" has been in combat since this country was founded with the sinful stain of slavery upon it.
.
...posthumously.
Obamacare death panels are authorized to terminate sick seniors via drone strikes.
The new way of American assassination against dissidents, if not urgent enough for a staged shooting or fake 'suicide', may be the inducement of massive cancer like just killed Hugo Chávez
This is how they may kill many readers of ZeroHedge over the next few years
CIA and Mossad have been working on how to induce cancer since the 1960s ... reports are that Mossad helped refine the technique to just spray it, they don't need to poke you with an injection
Consider 7 Latin American leaders, all guilty of 'moving in the wrong direction' away from the US (even tho only mildly critical in some cases), and all with cancer recently ... statistically quite non-likely:
Hugo Chávez of Venezuela - pelvic cancer
Cristina Fernandez de Kirchner of Argentina - thyroid cancer
Lula Da Silva of Brazil - throat cancer
Dilma Rousseff of Brazil - axillar lymphoma
Fernando Lugo of Paraguay - lymphatic cancer
Juan Manuel Santos of Colombia - prostate cancer
Fidel Castro of Cuba - cancer as well apparently (likely but not certain or acknowledged)
Says the Magician, have you looked in the other hand?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kSSyC3p9K5s
This guy has been taking measurements down in South America for a while now. His readings indicate there is more afoot than most think. Ask, how many other people besides the possibly assassinated leaders have died of say, slow, or even rapidly onset radiation poisoning?
Michael Rivero was just now speaking about how there was polonium found on Arafat's clothing. He has on several occasion on his daily radio station spoken his thoughts around the assassination of Arafat.
http://republicbroadcasting.org/index.php?cmd=home
Everybody knows!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yG5e1oaen-M&feature=related
Thanks, I'll sleep well tonight because of that.
"spray" eh. . .
that's not been mentioned before. . . ^^
hi hello
Perhaps a religious attachment to a failed faith such as "socialism" causes the body to kill iteself. It must be hard to justify how making everyone equal always results in greater inequality except for the leaders who brought it to the people.
Socialism causes cancer.
Speech is a weapon.
Banzai calls his stuff "visual combat." He'd better watch his back.
Tho William Banzai in person, is wisely hanging out in the place Jim Willie says is the safest place to store your gold in the world -
Hong Kong
Which says 'f-ck you' to USA tax authorities and investigators, which cannot be assured in Switzerland or Singapore
Not on American soil??? Be careful, WB...
r.i.p. frank zappa.
will someone please help with this hunt?.... (and please don't tell me google is my friend) not too long before 9/11 and the tin foil hat was starting to grow out of my head, i read online an article by the harvard law review that was suggesting that corporate satirists (think yes men, mcdonalds meat farm photgrapher/photoshoppers, keiser, banksy any occupier in a guy falks mask) should be labeled terrorists .... i shit you not. after 9/11, the article was gone. i've looked evrywhere in the way back machine. if anyone can help me find it i would be most greatful.
at the risk of repeating myself- "the greatest generation overcame the great depression and fascism"......
BUT THEY DIDN'T HAVE TO DO IT AT THE SAME TIME ON THE HOMEFRONT !!!
Sincerley,
Eric Holder
At least he is sincere about it. Better than "Yours fucking truly!"
Question is: "What is he sincere about? That he is Eric Holder?"
In the past, I have finished "Dear Fuck You" (business) letters, with a "Sincerelly (up) yours" ..... One went to an attorney, who at least had the decency to reply and appologize for what I was balling him out for.
Schwarzenegger says it best:
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/10/28/acrostic_arnie/
Oh, you beat me to it...
well, at least fucking the truth would have been a more accurate sign off
"Now SHUT THE FUCK UP Rand!"
-The Honorable Harry Reid
- The Horrible Hairy Reid.
Define combat
NDAA.
This is your brain on full alert.
http://info.publicintelligence.net/USArmy-InternmentResettlement.pdf
This is your brain in a detention camp about to be executed.
Define combat
If you believe in America, and the Const, BOR's, and Amendments, aand are a member of 50% of the population who do.
......For the purposes of all forms of Drone warfare.....What would an "American engaged in combat on American soil" be defined as?....
Answer that one Fucker!!
That is BS!!!, Paul asked him 2-3 times for an exact YES or NO to this question, and he ducked it every time until he finally had to recant, and give PAUL the answer to the direct question.
Rand emphasized due process under the Constitution.
Holder recast the question, sans mention of due process, then answered it.
Already history is being -- has been -- altered. No one remembers (or admits remembering) anymore. And if no one remembers a thing, did it even happen in the first place?
Remember, or recall, Rand was talking to *Brennan,* not the President's lawyer Holder.
.
Anyone who doubts that rank Fascism is now openly displayed every day here in the US is hopelessly in denial, and will eventually be all-too-happy to turn in their guns or other contraband for a rickety cot at the local FEMA camp so they can get their daily ration of nourishing Soylent Green.
A zombie, in other words.
This is the most corrupt Administration I have ever witnessed, and believe me that’s saying something, on a scale 1-10 these fucks are 666..
Hey idiots here who voted for O or Dems or watch TV or Hollywood shit and support this - F you.
Yeha the Repubs are shit but at least they have Ron and Rand Paul. McCain and Graham-nesty are as bad or worse than O.
I was with you Freddie till "McCain and Graham-nesty are as bad or worse than O."
Nothing we have seen matches these fuckers imo.
What about an M16 rifle instead of a drone, would this be then ok?
So suspiscion of being engaged in combat (not a conviction) is still grounds for assassination? Got ya Holder.
They can just say "oopsie" after they've droned you into a pile of ashes and they're covered legally.
Of course. Just as it is grounds for anything else they decide to do to you.
My dad was a career cop, and then he was a cop trainer, probably 26 years all in all. One day before he retired he told me "stay away from cops." I think he had already seen the handwriting on the wall.
My father is a police officer as well. He can't stand how militarized they've become; he just sees as increased work and hassle.
Thing is, he's a GOP nuts who can't stand OWS. What he, and the other cops don't realize, is that OWS was tryign to give them a warnign BEOFRE the storm hits....because once this financial system crashes......the cops are going to be put in a VERY precarious situation.
They will either protect the bankers, or they will step aside when millions riot.
The local police in some of the larger urban arenas are going to be crushed. There is simply no way around it. I feel sorry for the guys, but when they could have said something to keep DHS out of their shorts they didn't, and instead took the easy "war on terror" grants and let themselves become goons for the Fascists.
History will not be kind.