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What A Difference For Jobs $1.2 Trillion In Debt Makes

Tyler Durden's picture


The media's ecstatic read through of today's Nonfarm payroll beat can barely end: after all, a print of 236,000 on expectations of 165K, why that has to be great. Well, it is. Until one looks to the number from February 2012, which happens to be 271,000.

And even the Keynesians will agree that February follows January, which in 2013 was a downward revised 119,000. January 2012? 311,000. Which in turn happened just as Europe was fixed again - after all who can forget the LTRO euphoria (and what happened after).

In other words, the first two months of 2012 saw a 582,000 increase in non-farm payrolls. In 2013: 355,000. But something else happened between February 29, 2012 and February 28, 2013... Oh yes, the US government issued some $1,198,397,883,967.30 in debt. Oh, and the Fed monetized about half of this amount, and virtually all of the Treasurys issued to the right of the ZIRP period (i.e., risky debt).

To summarize: $1.2 trillion in debt buys the US.... 61% of the jobs created a year ago. But at least the Dow Jones is at an all time high.

Who else can hardly contain their excitement at what the jobs number a year from today will reveal that yet another $1.2 trillion in debt will do to the US job market...


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Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:03 | 3312474 Sach Mahoney
Sach Mahoney's picture

Mainstream media will never report this or any other truth, so therefore its did not happen, nor will it happen.  

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:23 | 3312547 Boris Alatovkrap
Boris Alatovkrap's picture

But, but, but, you are increase chocolate rations!

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:26 | 3312558 old naughty
old naughty's picture

Trea-sec: "If you have to look at it that way..."

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:30 | 3312587 Boris Alatovkrap
Boris Alatovkrap's picture

Boris is like to see Bankster behind bar, see if everything is still look same to Bankster now!

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:59 | 3312676 SamAdams
SamAdams's picture

Tyler, such a pessimist.  Always killing my SSRI buzz with his sense and logic. 

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 14:23 | 3312773 Boris Alatovkrap
Boris Alatovkrap's picture

Suggest high proof vodka for alternative buzz. Also good for alternative fuel.

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 14:34 | 3312808 eatthebanksters
eatthebanksters's picture

QE to infinity...why not just print more and hand it to the government to pay off its debt?  Why not just print more and hand it out to those who figure that $60,000 a year from the government is as good as it gets.  The central bankers and politicians should be put against a wall and shot, with wads of cash!  They are building the biggest and laziest entitlment culture the world has ever seen...and all they wrroy about is covering up one lie after another.


Question for Mr. Bernanke:  Does a healthy economy need $85 billion of money pumped into it every month?  What measurable increase in economic conditions give you reason to believe the conditons for QE to stop will happen in out lifetimes?  Do you shop for your own groceries? Do you pump your own gas?  When you look in the mirror what do you see?

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 14:43 | 3312832 Zap Powerz
Zap Powerz's picture

Lemme splain sumpin 2 ya pal.

This isnt about fixing the economy.  This isnt about growth.  This isnt about creating jobs.  This isnt about "doing right by the folks".

This is about power and control (period).

You need to divorce yourself from the belief that people "in government" are good people there to do good things for the good of the country but are just kinda dumb and cant figure it out but their intentions are good so we should all keep supporting them.

Fuck them.  They are bad people doing bad things for bad reasons in order to hurt you, your family and the rest of your loved ones.  They hate you.  They would be happy if you died and are actually working toward that end.  They are your enemy.  I dont mean your figurative enemy either. I mean they are your enemy and they want you dead.  They want your children dead.  They think of you as a disease on their planet and you have to be wiped out.

Is that clear?

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 15:07 | 3312924 Boris Alatovkrap
Boris Alatovkrap's picture

... as vodka

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 15:25 | 3312973 economics9698
economics9698's picture

There most likely is one more monetary expansion before it implodes.  I think it is March 2013 to August 2013.

Yes that is right, this will be a short lived expansion, so get your finances in order and sell your shit to the Muppets.

It could be June/December, whatever it will be short lived, trust me.

Take advantage, dumb the house, stocks, and get into physical metals, farms, shit that will ride out inflation or deflation. 

These monetary expansions are like labor contractions, they get shorter and shorter as time moves forward.

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 16:59 | 3313244 Boris Alatovkrap
Boris Alatovkrap's picture

If cannot is afford PMs, Boris is to suggest Vodka and Bullets, maybe plasma, because it not is to end pretty.

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:26 | 3312562 McMolotov
McMolotov's picture

Victory Gin (or vodka, in your case) for everyone.

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:29 | 3312580 Boris Alatovkrap
Boris Alatovkrap's picture

Keep hands off Boris' vodka!

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 15:38 | 3313002 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

Is to Boris not vodka to share with comrades?

Running dog of capitalism hordes flask of vodka/MIG degreaser.

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 17:00 | 3313250 Boris Alatovkrap
Boris Alatovkrap's picture

Boris is to teach lesson of Soviet economy. Means of production is own by people. Means of destruction is own by government. But keep your FIJCKING mitts off Boris' vodka!

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:28 | 3312575 Boris Alatovkrap
Boris Alatovkrap's picture

Correction - we are less reduce chocolate rations, but same as increase, no!?

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 22:56 | 3314076 mkhs
mkhs's picture

No. We are in austerity regime.  There will be an increase, but it will be less than expected. Always, in the words of the great leader, forward (but not as much as was hoped or promised).

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 14:11 | 3312730 Seer
Seer's picture

BTW- that's imitation chocolate... hedonics, don't forget the real forces behind our markets...

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 14:20 | 3312755 markovchainey
markovchainey's picture's actually a fist full of crap, but hedonically adjusted it's Godiva.  Enjoy!

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 15:10 | 3312930 Boris Alatovkrap
Boris Alatovkrap's picture

Chocolate is not real!? Is contain titanium? Horsemeat? Escolar? Maybe this explain is why USA is subject of uncontrolled anal leakage (aka QE)?

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 14:56 | 3312886 Jack Burton
Jack Burton's picture

Increased Choco rations! Double plus good!

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:33 | 3312593 AbelCatalyst
AbelCatalyst's picture

$1.2 Trillion in 2013 IF we don't go into recession...  If we go into recession you can expect to continue the trend of increased debt and lower employment.  

Next Jan/Fed:  20K jobs and $2.2T more debt?  

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:43 | 3312643 Manthong
Manthong's picture

Sure.. they will just “do whatever it takes” to borrow their way to nominal prosperity.

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 14:13 | 3312737 Seer
Seer's picture

I really think that it must be pretty hard for all TPTB to carry this load.  I'm thinking that they've GOT to get the people involved!  Time for a Fed-eral Works Project, we get everyone to pitch in and operate the printing presses!  100% employment AND plenty of money- problems solved!

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:35 | 3312610 natronic
natronic's picture

Nothing to see here..........move along

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:36 | 3312613 RafterManFMJ
RafterManFMJ's picture

I won't tell you what to do, but I'm buying AAPL with my unemployment checks.

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 14:15 | 3312739 Seer
Seer's picture

So, YOU'RE the ONE who is keeping AAPL from completely collapsing?  I was hoping to have it drop more so that I could... NO!

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:59 | 3312675 Clayton Bigsby
Clayton Bigsby's picture

That's only $5,279,285.83 per job - Bullish!!!!

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 14:06 | 3312712 candyman
candyman's picture

Didn't you know that journalisim majors must pass the Dan Rather school of fact checking class in order to graduate.

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 14:06 | 3312715 masterinchancery
masterinchancery's picture

And actually, the debt added is much more, this only includes Treasury debt, not the burgeoning Agency debt.  And it didn't really buy anything, total wage income is still below 2007.

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 14:16 | 3312743 Seer
Seer's picture


Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:03 | 3312475 hugovanderbubble
hugovanderbubble's picture



Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:05 | 3312487 Shell Game
Shell Game's picture



But since I'm no longer in paper assets I will pull up my kilt at stocks, and go longer gold...

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:13 | 3312509 King_of_simpletons
King_of_simpletons's picture

Unemployment has to go down to 6.5% for the Feds to start raising rates soon. Once unemployment magically hits 6.5%, the feds will start raising rates again. They are in a hurry to accomplish this. We will start seeing the feds raise rates by the end of summer. Everyone is in a hurry to meet their target. The stock market is hurrying upward to withstand the plunge ones the Feds start raising rates, the BLS fudge is in a hurry to make unemployment go down to 6.5 %. Every damn fudge machinery is in overdrive to meet their targets. The illusion of order and reasoning has to be maintained

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:33 | 3312599 Boris Alatovkrap
Boris Alatovkrap's picture

Rates is never go down, not for Federal Reserve Discount Window. Nothing but is magic to make unemployment goes down in Keynesian Land, but bigger issue is to Duration Mismatch. Cannot is lend long, borrow short and stay solvent with increase in interest rate for primary dealer and too big to jail bank.

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:55 | 3312667 Peter Pan
Peter Pan's picture

You tell economy is like stuffed turkey with no thanksgiving?


Fri, 03/08/2013 - 14:23 | 3312771 Seer
Seer's picture

The economy IS a turkey.  It is WE who are stuffed.  And, thanksgiving has been canceled...  If you look around you'll see that it's Xmas that's coming, what, with all those Fatmans (1%-ers) out there running around...  Good cheer to all (whom are, or course, deemed acceptable).

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:33 | 3312600 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

The instant the fed raises rates, EVERYTHING blows up.

TINA told me so.

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:11 | 3312505 Confundido
Confundido's picture


Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:14 | 3312513 eclectic syncretist
eclectic syncretist's picture

Gonna sound like a broken record here but this is ongoing trend is interesting.

So far today

volume for jan 2014 SLV calls = 45,693

volume for jan 2014 SLV puts = 200

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:19 | 3312528 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

when it gets to about 2.3% on the 10yr you better step away.

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:41 | 3312634 AbelCatalyst
AbelCatalyst's picture

Agreed...  2.3% before it turns down along with stocks...  I would not be surprized to see the 10yr down near or below 1% by the end of the year... That's when we can finally short the bond market, the biggest bubble in the history of the world (although Japan needs to pop first so the world can see the horror of an imploding bond market).  Japan pops, people flee to safety in the US (yields head south), then they realize the US is in the same boat, panic accelerates...  Could be Europe first, but Japan is further down the road...  

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:23 | 3312543 From A West Tex...
From A West Texas Desk's picture

Honey!    Pack a couple of Extra-Bags.    We MIGHT be taking an Extended-Trip.



Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:03 | 3312476 chdwlch1
chdwlch1's picture

Need moar POMO...bitchez.

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:03 | 3312478 DOT
DOT's picture


Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:04 | 3312480 Jack Burton
Jack Burton's picture

I suppose Health Care and Education are making up most new jobs. As population rises, these two rise. And tax dollars pay for much of the spending in these two areas. So YES. 1.2 trillion can buy some jobs.


Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:23 | 3312544 ParkAveFlasher
ParkAveFlasher's picture

I suppose Health Care and Education are making up most new jobs. As population rises, these two rise.

I'm long the "crematorium/mortuary index" on that same logic. 

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 14:29 | 3312791 Seer
Seer's picture

"I'm long the "crematorium/mortuary index" on that same logic. "

Well, people ought to hurry up and die before all their pension money dries up and this isn't an option...  Nature, the top model in efficiency, says that composting is what we'll be seeing...

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:05 | 3312486 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

Thanks Tyler, not only was the last Feb jobs number big but the 10 year treasury was higher too. Same shit, different year. The only difference is equities are higher.

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:18 | 3312522 FoeHammer
FoeHammer's picture

Burn the economy to save the economy. Equity camouflage is weaksauce- We'll know for sure when enough natural observers look in the box, though.



Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:11 | 3312504 Peter Pan
Peter Pan's picture

These cortizone injections of debt into the spine of the US economy are going to eventually break its back instead of strengthening it.

A friend with a bad back was singing the praises of the cortizone injection 3 months ago but now is in trouble again.

Sooner or later they are going to figure out that pain is part of the healing process in that it makes you confront the problem rather than masking it.

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:24 | 3312546 McMolotov
McMolotov's picture

This all reminds me of drug addiction. We need twice as much debt each year to get the same results as the previous year. What could possibly go wrong?

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:38 | 3312619 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

No, they won't ever figure that out. They'll just continue killing people in order to collect a paycheck.

They aren't smart enough to do otherwise, as that would require them to admit their current failures.

As long as the AMA exists as a gatekeeper you'll see nothing but sickcare (as every producer likes encouraging demand).

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 14:32 | 3312802 Seer
Seer's picture

I believe that pain signals are there to tell us to STOP doing things that hurt in order to allow for healing!  But anyway, you're right about fighting what's natural...

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 14:38 | 3312824 Winston Churchill
Winston Churchill's picture

Like racehorses those shots will help for a while,but in the end the

knackers van will have to come earlier.

Bullish for mincemeat pies,Swedish meatballs and lassagna..

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:13 | 3312510 No More Bubbles
No More Bubbles's picture

But something else happened between February 29, 2012 and February 28, 2012.


You mean February 28, 2013!

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 14:34 | 3312810 Seer
Seer's picture

Perhaps it's fitting given that the numbers are all fucked up anyway.  And, really, I wouldn't be surprised if TPTB started fucking with calendars in order to make things appear better...

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:14 | 3312511 orangegeek
orangegeek's picture


Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:32 | 3312592 They Tried to S...
They Tried to Steal My Gold's picture

Fuckin Hilarious!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:26 | 3312552 q99x2
q99x2's picture

What is the relationship of the economy to fundamentals when banking fraud and financial services have driven the fundamentals for decades. Perhaps there never was much of a relationship to begin with

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 14:37 | 3312823 Seer
Seer's picture

Banking and finance have been attempts at hiding the fundamental economic flaw.  All was well when we could grow via actual wealth from extraction of natural resources; once rates of extraction couldn't meet our growth needs it was game over (game in decline).

So, banking and finance, and pretty much all else, are just symptoms of a fundamentally flawed system.  The puss was going to ooze no matter...

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:26 | 3312563 miker
miker's picture

1.2 Trillion in deficit spending = 25-30 MILLION jobs (est. 40k per job).  If the deficit were eliminated, we'd be in a worse depression than the Great One.  This is why Obama cannot stand for deficit reduction except for taxing the rich since the impact on them would not kill jobs.

The economy was suffering continuous and even accelerating structural decline as we hid the fact with massive debt funded spending.  Once the debt party ended, there was not enough economy to support existing cost structure. 

The guys running the ship (Clinton, Bush and now Obama and Greenspan and Bernanke) had to know this was going on.  Perhaps they couldn't stop it; not sure.  In any event, like all laws of nature, that which cannot be sustained will not.

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 14:44 | 3312838 Seer
Seer's picture

It's a deceptive game, one that all these "leaders" probably;y didn't quite grasp until they were strapped into their big (high) chairs.  Once there they are only allowed to operate the levers that are available.

You are correct in that they probably couldn't have stopped all of this.  The cancer predated them, it was built-in a LONG time ago.  Not until we get it that you cannot have perpetual growth on a finite planet will we be able to even consider embarking on any sustainable path.  I have ZERO expectations that this could happen because we've inoculated ourselves against questioning the growth-meme, AND, it would likely require some other form of resource allocation (in the face of stopping growth).

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:30 | 3312583 trevor15
trevor15's picture

How soon we forget...

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:34 | 3312605 Waterfallsparkles
Waterfallsparkles's picture

Just look at the total cost of those jobs.  Divide the amount of money printed and the amount of jobs. 

Could have used the Money Printed to directly hire twice the amount of people.

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:38 | 3312622 Peter Pan
Peter Pan's picture

That's true, but you could have instead paid twice as much to congress to stay home and out of people's lives and this would have cost a lot less and resulted in a lot more.

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 14:47 | 3312847 Seer
Seer's picture

One better: call it golden parachutes and retire them all PERMANENTLY (defrock them; and never have these seats occupied again)!

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:39 | 3312625 robertocarlos
robertocarlos's picture

We will be fine as long as each unit of credit money remains backed by an hour of voluntary future labour.

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:57 | 3312670 Peter Pan
Peter Pan's picture

SomehowI think that each unit of credit money will be backed by one hour of forced labour.

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 14:49 | 3312858 Seer
Seer's picture

Isn't this already the case?  Refuse to pay and someone with a gun ends up on your doorstop: and you end up making license plates for the rich fuckers' Hummers [whose ethanol fuel is subsidized by starving people]).

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:43 | 3312627 Waterfallsparkles
Waterfallsparkles's picture

Instead of printing Money and giving it to the Banker to Gamble with maybe they should use the Money to subsidize Businesses to hire workers. 

So, if you want to hire someone you would get 50% of their yearly salary as a subsidy for the 1st year.  25% the second year, etc.  This would make small businesses more profitable and they could spend on needed equipment, vehicles, etc.

This would help businesses, create jobs and turn the economy around very fast.  Everyone would want to hire someone.

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 14:55 | 3312880 Seer
Seer's picture

You can lead a horse to water...

This is only HALF the equation.  There has to be SALES coming out of those businesses.  People, being massively in debt as they are, will be applying this income toward paying down debt (in theory they'd be doing this- as they should because most is likely stuff from higher interest days anyway) and not toward paying for the widgets they're producing or the services they're performing.

Anyway... I once promoted the idea of cutting funding for roadway expansion and kicking back a good percentage of this to local businesses to hire local people.  The premise was to help shift away from the commuting meme.  As I have mentioned before, a small city where I used to live got all excited to fund a new transportation center where commuter rail would run to a larger nearby city.  Now days I wonder whether those in the small city are wondering why they have no job and still have to subsidize the commuter trains...

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:46 | 3312650 Clowns on Acid
Clowns on Acid's picture

President Johnson's Great Society was the start of race based arguments to run federal deficits.

The US Gov't has now run out opf money to c0ontinue the funding of cultural diversity and equal outcomes.

The US Fed Reserve is now printing money to take up the slack in the socio-economic shifts demanded by the left wing fascists.

Controlling interest rates, the US bond mafrket, and now the Equity market outright..... the Fed's job is to hold up the markets until the left wing facsists have an insurmountable advantage at the voting booths with Takers...or just a race based voting advantage.

Without the unprecedented, unconstitutional printing by the Fed Johnson's Great Society would have collapsed under its own socio-economic rot and inefficiency.

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 14:24 | 3312776 W74
W74's picture

I pay taxes so that other people can have free rent and food on the table.  I'm struggling to save the way that I used to save, but others are out purchasing Nikes and Spinner Rims using money that I worked for.

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 15:02 | 3312908 Seer
Seer's picture

Oh, goody!  We get to get back to blaming the colords!

I'm so tired of everyone bashing those great industrialists like Carnage, Rockefeller etc.  After all, they were only helping to create jobs for the little people (even the colords, the ungrateful lot, who just didn't appreciate the fact that they were only asked to be part of the BIGGER PLAN [of creating concentrated wealth in the hands of a few white men]).

Yeah, give ME 150 year head start on "competition" (while also using them) and then call it all equal!

Thanks for playing the clown, clown...

BTW - What part of "you cannot have perpetual growth on a finite planet" don't you fucking get?  All was fine as long as we were able to extract more and more shit out of the planet; now that we can no longer keep up it's the fault of bad governments (as though there's ever any good ones, unless, that is, you're one of TPTB) and the colords.

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:46 | 3312651 larz
larz's picture

is not end well Boris?

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:58 | 3312674 Peter Pan
Peter Pan's picture

Nothing well when no water in it.

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 15:03 | 3312912 Seer
Seer's picture

He's got hemorrhoids?

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 13:51 | 3312660 lolmao500
lolmao500's picture

Bernanke : so close!

Krugman : needs to spend MOAR!

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 14:02 | 3312694 Freewheelin Franklin
Freewheelin Franklin's picture

At this point Bernanke may as well  start dropping dollar bills from  his helicopter, literally.

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 14:22 | 3312764 W74
W74's picture

They should make it rain over places like Baltimore, Detroit and Memphis.  The money will end up as shoes, Spinner Rims, and in the panties of strippers at da club.  No bills, rents, carpayments or other debts will be paid off, but at least more than a few will die fighting over who gets what.  Anyone ever see Blackhawk Down?  Make it rain, make it rain, make it rain!!!

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 15:06 | 3312922 Seer
Seer's picture

That would only create an additional expense, one we really cannot afford.  No, one would have to say that his current method is pretty damn efficient.

Besides, all the helicopters are in use doing this (dropping pallet loads of money) over in the ME.

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 14:18 | 3312746 Fred Garvin
Fred Garvin's picture

Kind of off topic (still about debt)

How did I miss that Paul Krugman filed for bankruptcy? Was this covered on ZH? I guess my wife is right, I am spending too much time in the bunker.

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 14:30 | 3312793 SKY85hawk
SKY85hawk's picture

Will he keep the Condo?

Will other GREAT-ONES be going down, soon?


Fri, 03/08/2013 - 14:30 | 3312796 Muppet
Muppet's picture

Yeah, no.   This was satire that went viral.  Didnt happen.

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 14:37 | 3312821 Not My Real Name
Not My Real Name's picture

You didn't miss anything. That story is as real as the booming US economy.

It came from the Daily Currant, which is a satirical website. Just like

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 20:36 | 3313822 Joseph Jones
Joseph Jones's picture

Good chuckle, thanks!  (ny times)

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 14:22 | 3312765 Village Smithy
Village Smithy's picture

This will go on and equities will climb until the market puts a lid on government debt. As the situation exists now there is just no consequence to the printing/borrowing approach. No consequences equals no motivation to stop. I for one would like to see more discussion about what type of event or condition will finally start to put consequences back into the equation. The Chinese certainly have the ability but at this point their economy is too dependant on ours, they have no motivation to act. I cannot seriously consider that an end to this is anywhere in site until I can understand who or what will bring the discipline. Will it be by accident or by design? This is fight club, let's have at it.

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 15:20 | 3312957 Seer
Seer's picture

"As the situation exists now there is just no consequence to the printing/borrowing approach. No consequences equals no motivation to stop."

No, the consequences are there.

The scary part to ponder is that this is viewed as the least painful thing.  Anyone who is thinking that Armageddon is bunk (the notion of a big change, a great unveiling IS rational, the stories conjured through religious texts, however, are a bit slanted and flowery) is in for a surprise.

Those obviously made-up wars in the ME (excuses for them) were clearly out of desperation.  As much as I'd like to call all the perpetrators dumb-fucks for doing this, I'm thinking that these actions were undertaken much like one intentionally running one's vehicle with failed brakes racing down a mountain road runs into the (high) side of the mountain in order to slow down, to keep from barreling even faster and shooting OVER the side of the mountain; problem is, we were running way to fast and we're rolling... gravity is in control now, only decision left is how to brace for the impact (hoping that it's not at the very BOTTOM of the mountain!).

"The Chinese certainly have the ability but at this point their economy is too dependant on ours"

The Chinese are WAY fucked because they committed to HIGH growth rates.

"I cannot seriously consider that an end to this is anywhere in site until I can understand who or what will bring the discipline."

The "who or what" comes in the form of Mother Nature.  When it is obvious that it is no longer possible for the earth to supply us with our growth demands is the WHEN.  And since energy is key it'll be the energy sector that one need look to to see the telltale signs: refer to my comments above about the ME wars.

"Men argue, nature acts." - Voltaire

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 16:09 | 3313088 Village Smithy
Village Smithy's picture

The Voltaire quote makes your point very well. I would only argue that the consequences of our addiction to oil, although very real, will be felt a little further in the future than the consequences of this addiction to Quantitative Easing. Granted, when "...nature acts." it will make the economic consequences of excessive QE seem mild by comparison.

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 20:35 | 3313810 Joseph Jones
Joseph Jones's picture

Seer wrote: "... Anyone who is thinking that Armageddon is bunk (the notion of a big change, a great unveiling IS rational, the stories conjured through religious texts, however, are a bit slanted and flowery) is in for a surprise...."

John the Beloved penned Revelation about three years prior to Rome destroying the Hebrew/Ioudious last Temple (no more temple will ever exist).  This marked the permanent end of the Mosaic/Levitical era and the final fulfillment of the Abrahamic covenant in Christ. 

The so-called "Armeggedon" of Revelation is already done and complete, exactly as promised by Christ and every single NT auuthor.  So-called Armeggedon was God's final judgement on un-repentent "Israel."  See Josephus' "War of the Jews" and read this Hebrew historian's parallels with Revelation. 

James Stewart Russell earned his Master's degree at age 18.  His epic book "The Parousia" penned in 1875 AD is still unsurpassed in his explanation of Revelation, proving quite emphatically that Jesus already returned (a "spiritual" coming) and is not coming again.  Also, my friend Brian Martin's book has a quote from a highly respected late-19th C author that so-called "futurism" (belief in a still future coming of Christ) was almost non-existent just a mere 140 years ago. 

You'll never guess who turned the corner and started the wholesale re-writing of Scriptural history starting the early 20th C.

It's interesting that even C.S. Lewis agrees with me that Jesus and every NT author promised Jesus' return in the 1st C. AD.  If you disagree: do you think your reading comprehension exceeds that of C.S. Lewis?  

C.S. Lewis' problem arises in his conclusion: Lewis says that Jesus and the NT authors lied when they promised Jesus' return in the 1st C.   

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 14:28 | 3312786 Sach Mahoney
Sach Mahoney's picture


Record 89,304,000 Americans 'Not in Labor Force' -- 296,000 Fewer Employed Since January  Record


Fri, 03/08/2013 - 14:30 | 3312794 adr
adr's picture

and all these jobs added contain the seasonal adjustments too. Take that away and what do you get?

It's not like they added a couple million jobs to the numbers that never existed. I mean if the government did that the media would definitely call them out on it. The government making up data to support a presidential agenda IS A HUGE STORY.

I mean if a story like that came along journalists would be all over it.

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 15:22 | 3312966 Seer
Seer's picture

"The government making up data to support a presidential agenda IS A HUGE STORY."

And that "presidential agenda" would be what, exactly?

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 23:05 | 3314096 mkhs
mkhs's picture

More to the point, a journalist would be what, exactly?

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 14:49 | 3312848 Bingfa
Bingfa's picture

Record 89,304,000 Americans not in labor force....

296,000 fewer employed since January

Put a bow tie on a pig all they want, It's still a depression

Edit....Sorry, I just noticed it was already posted.

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 15:01 | 3312904 1eyedman
1eyedman's picture

...not in labor force....   what is that in terms of total population %?

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 15:24 | 3312971 Seer
Seer's picture

Ah!  And this is the REAL metric which ought to be used.

Just like I say with regards to "prices," one needs to concentrate on "affordability" (obviously this is a bit non-specific, but it suggests a comparative rather than some one-dimensional number given as "price").

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 16:06 | 3313074 Bingfa
Bingfa's picture

What the market will bear ? Or until the masses take up arms and start burning infrastructure......

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 16:04 | 3313070 Westcoastliberal
Westcoastliberal's picture

Let's see if I have this right; we borrowed $1.2 Trillion and the result is only 61% of the jobs?  Makes you wonder where we would be had the Fed not doled out the $1.2.  In fact I challenge any economist to design a parallel model of the economy/market w/o the Fed's "contributions".  I don't think it's possible.

Which means (if I'm right) no one at this point can determine what reality truly is.  Scary, huh?

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 16:10 | 3313090 Stuck on Zero
Stuck on Zero's picture

Yeah.  But Nancy Pelosi says that debt doesn't matter.


Fri, 03/08/2013 - 16:31 | 3313149 mt paul
mt paul's picture

the debt says

nancy pelosi

doesn't mater

Fri, 03/08/2013 - 20:12 | 3313762 Joseph Jones
Joseph Jones's picture

My figures below in the ballpark:


2012 USSA jobs gained: 1.8M

2012 USSA deficit: $1.3T

2012 each job cost $722k in debt + later interest


Obunghole and his minions in full fear monger mode:

Sequester cut to deficit: $85B

Sequester results in potential jobs lost (they say): 750k

Each job valued above @ $11.3M


Any readers making $11.3M out there?  Only a public school product swallows the 15.7x difference above.   

Lie, much, O'feces? 


Mon, 03/11/2013 - 14:53 | 3320011 Tombstone
Tombstone's picture

Keynesians need to go back to Keynesia and hid under a rock. 

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